A good move or stupid idea?

[Y3shot]

.....

I don't know but I think you should check critically if this email is actually from Keystone HW. I've been on their media handles and their official site for a while now trying to find the same message contained here without success. I believe such important shift in operation should be on their verified media channels as well and their website, so I'll advise you to take it with a pinch of salt until they announce it themselves... Remember Don't trust, but verify

If you cannot backup your seeds, then your funds is gone when the hardware wallet ceases to exist/function and the keys aren't yours but theirs since you don't have access to them. #NOT YOUR KEYS NOT YOUR COINS.

I tried to do some research regarding the new development raised by the OP, but I couldn’t find anything on the pay of the Keystone hardware wallet. Apart from their own main page, I can't find any information about the Keystone HW mentioned by the OP. Since this is not a message from the wallet, there is no need to panic because any new development must be announced to users on their main page. Any information outside the platform of the wallet shouldn't be accepted.

It would be nice if the OP had stated how he got this information, as this would help navigate where such information is coming from and what the plan could be.

[Karl_3000]

It sounds like something that would turn them to a custodian instead.. 
If there is no seed phrase, prv keys or any other form of backups , then  the hardware wallet is your one and only hope.

It can not turn custodial, the option can be recovery through backup cards or stored online. The backup cards is good (but not better for me like seed phrase) but I do not like the online one. I have tried to find any information about this from Keystone but I was unable see any information online about it. OP should be careful of phishing attack.

[Bigjoe33]

~~~

I would be worried too for real, the main reason I prefer self custody is that I want to be in control of my own bitcoin and not depending on any company. If I can not recover my wallet or access my recovery seed, I have to think twice before trusting it, what happens if the company stops supporting the wallet or shuts down?
The convenience is good but I don’t think we should sacrifice control over our own money for it.

It's no worth it at all. It can't be trusted. A Bitcoiner should have control over his assets, been able to recover when necessary.

Though, if there is no official announcement on the site, then there might be a reason for us to think that something is fishy here. Maybe, there could be a compromise, or maybe, they are still text running it's suitable functionality before they give an official announcement. But if they actually changed it and didn't give any announcements, then it's another thing to worry about. Whichever way, one needs to verify the mail and tye information from there site, and if it's not showing signs of trust anymore, one can switch. Of course, there are other reputable ones that's offers the freedom of seed phrase use.

[knowngunman]

It would be nice if the OP had stated how he got this information, as this would help navigate where such information is coming from and what the plan could be.

I don't care to know how he got the information. All I care is to verify the authenticity of the information and this is what the Keystone has to say about it.



Op, try to verify every information before taking any action. Thank you for bringing it to public attention. Now you know who you are dealing with and it's good you shouldn't interact with them. If you already click on any link, don't interact further with them.

[KiaKia]

It's probably from a scammer, if you got this in your mail it means they have your email address already so be careful not to click on any link in that mail address, I have also text someone from keystone and they said it's not from them.

Normally I would verify first before saying anything but I understand, it's still good that you decided to post this on here as few members were able to take it to the team so all good still.

I am sure that very soon the sender of this mail will ask for your recovery seed since they have expiring date on the mail, people who don't verify will panic about it and do something stupid.

[KingsDen]

It would be nice if the OP had stated how he got this information, as this would help navigate where such information is coming from and what the plan could be.

I don't care to know how he got the information. All I care is to verify the authenticity of the information and this is what the Keystone has to say about it.



Op, try to verify every information before taking any action. Thank you for bringing it to public attention. Now you know who you are dealing with and it's good you shouldn't interact with them. If you already click on any link, don't interact further with them.

Interesting, I suspected as much... And also, the Keystone wallet has warned about handing out see phrase for any reason. As I said above, their next move would be to request for seed phrase with a weird reason being to synchronize it with the chip. And when you do so, your money is gone.

Thanks for verifying this information, because in this industry we don't trust, rather we verify.

[promise444c5]

It can not turn custodial, the option can be recovery through backup cards or stored online. The backup cards is good (but not better for me like seed phrase) but I do not like the online one.

It seems you’ve misunderstood what the backup cards are meant for. Their wallet packaging normally comes with x3 backup cards which are meant to write down your recovery seeds when you generate them.

They are planning on going seedless, which means the backup cards are useless and that explains why the mail included “no backup cards”.. Do you understand now?

When you mentioned online, either allowing the users to use their personal cloud backups or have a central server where every backup is shipped .. it doesn’t correlate with what they are trying to pass to their customers .

It’s either they are trying to be a custodian and handle the entire funds or they make your hardware your only backup(which fits more with what OP posted) Or it’s not from an official source..

[Renampun]

Today or maybe last night, the Keystone company decided to put an end to recovery seed control by the owners, here is the message I got from them.

It only took me a few seconds to verify this image and ask the AI ​​about it.. and it's most likely a hoax or phishing scheme.. The user above also confirmed that the message didn't come from their team.. So I'm curious where did you get the message? Was it from a blog or email? but it's important for us to verify first because nowadays it's harder to trust anything.

[Karl_3000]

It seems you’ve misunderstood what the backup cards are meant for. Their wallet packaging normally comes with x3 backup cards which are meant to write down your recovery seeds when you generate them.

They are planning on going seedless, which means the backup cards are useless and that explains why the mail included “no backup cards”.. Do you understand now?

No you did not understand what I am saying. There can be a wallet that is not having seed phrase and have a backup card, the card is not just a paper but it will contain the necessary information needed which can be used for backup and make use of scanning something on the card. But Keystone is not having something like this yet but it is very possible.

[Obim34]

It only took me a few seconds to verify this image and ask the AI ​​about it.. and it's most likely a hoax or phishing scheme.. The user above also confirmed that the message didn't come from their team.. So I'm curious where did you get the message? Was it from a blog or email? but it's important for us to verify first because nowadays it's harder to trust anything.

The reason we must always verify every news.

He mentioned it was sent to him, you don't register an email when creating a Keystone wallet, how is it possible they can directly send him an email, this should have been a first hint to know it was obviously a phishing attempt, as far there was no link to his email.

[laspol65]

I'm really not happy with what I just read this morning or maybe I should? You tell me.
I am using Keystone hardware wallet simply because it has the following features.
1. It's airgapped
2. It has a mechanism that can't be tampered.
3. Firmware can be tested and verified yourself after received from shipping.

Today or maybe last night, the Keystone company decided to put an end to recovery seed control by the owners, here is the message I got from them.



Tell me friends, how does a seedless architecture sounds to you?
Of all the things I've learnt in this forum I can't forget how important having access to my recovery seed really is.

It's something no one should play with.

This is definitely something to be concerned about, but you should check and see if it comes from the official Keystone Wallet webpage.
If this message is coming from the website, then you should definitely be concerned because you don't have your seed with you, so it's natural to be concerned. However, you definitely don't want to make a mistake that will cause you to lose your coins, so it's important to keep the seed carefully so that you can recover it even if your wallet is shut down.
 You will have the seed phrase as long as you have control over your coins, but if you don't have a seed phrase to control, it will just be a useless wallet and you won't have control over your coins. However, you should be careful about this.

[Yorubek]

To be honest, I have never used hardware of this name before, and I don't know if anyone has had this problem before. Whatever device you use - be it hardware, software, hot wallet or cold wallet, whatever wallet you use, it is very important to keep the seed phrase with you for security because the purpose is that if your device is ever lost or damaged, you can use this seed phrase to recover your assets. So in this situation, you should talk to the company of that hardware wallet and ask for a clear explanation.

[PostQuantumBTC]

This is definitely something to be concerned about, but you should check and see if it comes from the official Keystone Wallet webpage.

Keystone did not make any announcement regarding going to a wallet that will require no seed phrase. It is very possible that it is scammer that is targeting him.

If he is using Keystone and he got this kind of email, that means Keystone has let other parties known their customers information which is not something new to hardware wallet users.

To be honest, I have never used hardware of this name before, and I don't know if anyone has had this problem before.

It is not a problem, it is a transition, but it is a fake one which probably scammers are trying to use to scam him or hack his hardware wallet.

[gracreavix]

We should first know that method they have that is seedless. It might be it is still secured while keeping the independently ownership of your Bitcoin. We shouldn't just jump into conclusion. I do believe that whatever method is used, there is always some kind of risk you have to beat. But whatever made them make that move is not just over night decision. They may have accessed the whole situation and see that this method is kind of better.

Let's observe and see what actually is the form of security that they so want to do to their wallet.

[Hatchy]

It sounds like something that would turn them to a custodian instead.. 
If there is no seed phrase, prv keys or any other form of backups , then  the hardware wallet is your one and only hope.

The moment it get damaged or lost, your Bitcoin is gone forever.  I would guess they probably have plans on reviving damaged wallet..  if that’s the case, that won’t still  help if it gets stolen or lost by the owner.

There will still be private keys, the only difference is that you cannot extract them from the wallet. Depending on how the system works, the private keys remain securely stored inside the wallet's chip and cannot be accessed directly by the user. Honestly, I think this type of wallet could create more problems than it solves. Yes, they are trying to solve the problem of people losing their seed phrases, but does a seedless wallet really solve the problem? At the very least, there should be a way to recover the private keys if something goes wrong, but with the seedless wallets, that will not be possible.

Electronic devices can fail or get damaged for many reasons, and losing access to your wallet could be just as serious as losing your seed phrase. I think we are focusing too much on solving the problem of lost seed phrases while overlooking the bigger issue of how users can recover their funds when something goes wrong.

[Karl_3000]

It sounds like something that would turn them to a custodian instead.. 
If there is no seed phrase, prv keys or any other form of backups , then  the hardware wallet is your one and only hope.

The moment it get damaged or lost, your Bitcoin is gone forever.  I would guess they probably have plans on reviving damaged wallet..  if that’s the case, that won’t still  help if it gets stolen or lost by the owner.

There will still be private keys, the only difference is that you cannot extract them from the wallet. Depending on how the system works, the private keys remain securely stored inside the wallet's chip and cannot be accessed directly by the user. Honestly, I think this type of wallet could create more problems than it solves. Yes, they are trying to solve the problem of people losing their seed phrases, but does a seedless wallet really solve the problem? At the very least, there should be a way to recover the private keys if something goes wrong, but with the seedless wallets, that will not be possible.

Electronic devices can fail or get damaged for many reasons, and losing access to your wallet could be just as serious as losing your seed phrase. I think we are focusing too much on solving the problem of lost seed phrases while overlooking the bigger issue of how users can recover their funds when something goes wrong.

The only thing the seedless wallet can not solve is to have the seed phrase in your memory. If you see what I said last on my post, I said that it can have backup.

There will be a wallet on your device, you will be given up to three backup card which has the information needed for the wallet recovery. You can use any of the three cards for the recovery. All you will do is to get another device and scan the backup card.

I like seed phrase because I have just only seed phrase that is made up of 12 words and I memorized it which is my third backup after I have 2 paper backups. I have several wallets but they are of different keys through passphrase.

[ryzaadit]

I don't care to know how he got the information. All I care is to verify the authenticity of the information and this is what the Keystone has to say about it.

I guess this is my post question to their official X.



Yes, I have a verification question regarding these emails to verify the authenticity of the emails being received by OP. Cause, at the time I made my first post in this thread, I did some searching and due diligence for the information but couldn't find any. I think it is already clear for OP; you can close the thread. OP could share some information in this thread as the last post before locking the topic.


However, with these scam attempts, it leaves me with some questions. OP, did you really have a Keystone Hardware Wallet? If yes, how the one who tried phising you knowing you have Keystone Hardware Wallet. Leave me with 2 scenario:

• Keystone Hardware Wallet database for their customer is being leaked.
• Or you already leaked your self.

The phising knowing you own Keystone Hardware Wallet. Suggestion for OP, you already being on target list for Phissing/Malware/Sam with topic Keystone Hardware Wallet. Just my suggestion for you, for now never taking any information for wallet, hardware wallet from your emails.

[Luzin]

Today or maybe last night, the Keystone company decided to put an end to recovery seed control by the owners, here is the message I got from them.

It's funny why they removed the wallet option without a seed. How will it work if my keystone gets damaged? Is the image you sent official information from Keystone? You need to investigate this issue in detail. Indeed, without a seed it is less likely to be stolen, but what happens to the assets in your wallet if your keystone is damaged or lost? There are many considerations and detailed explanations that Keystone must provide if this is really their feature. It seems you should confirm with Keystone regarding recovery, and there might be a trial for testing before performing the migration. So far, I haven't used Keystone.

[Wiwo]

What I am interested in knowing is whether the seed phrase can be recovered on other wallets, devices, and apps that are blockchain-recognised.

I bet the whole thing will have to undergo some amendments to see how they could provide users with privacy and security of funds as a hardware wallet company.

[bitcoin-shark]

In my opinion, removing the passphrase entirely from a hardware wallet is not a good idea; it provides greater security for users and allows the account to be transferred or recovered from a damaged or lost device to another one.