BFL Experience

[norgan]

I just wanted to share my recent experience with Butterfly Labs as I see they have copped a lot of negative feedback. I bought a BFL Single second hand in a non working condition and upon contacting BFL they were happy to repair the device under warranty. They even allowed me to pull it apart and send only the base board to save on shipping. It got sent back within 2 days of arriving at their office and they have been nothing but helpful.

[1715584201]

1715584201

[jimmothy]

I just wanted to share my recent experience with Butterfly Labs as I see they have copped a lot of negative feedback. I bought a BFL Single second hand in a non working condition and upon contacting BFL they were happy to repair the device under warranty. They even allowed me to pull it apart and send only the base board to save on shipping. It got sent back within 2 days of arriving at their office and they have been nothing but helpful.

Thanks for sharing.

Did you read the part where BFL stole millions of dollars and failed to deliver their under-specification hardware within even 8 months or give refunds?

I would rather pay a homeless man to slap myself in the face than order from bfl again.

[norgan]

I get that was a significant issue but to me, having only dealt with them on this one transaction, they have been amazing. Perhaps they meant well and tried to deliver but had issues and are now really trying to do the right thing.

[jimmothy]

I get that was a significant issue but to me, having only dealt with them on this one transaction, they have been amazing. Perhaps they meant well and tried to deliver but had issues and are now really trying to do the right thing.

You would think that. But we are now 6 months past the original shipping date for monarchs proving that yet again (3rd time so far) they lied about shipping dates.

[southerngentuk]

Well they got to find something to do with the staff that is left and all the components that aren't worth a dime now.

In reality they have given you there trash, but thumbs up that they paid the return postage ( I Hope )  

[Bicknellski]

How would you explain all the abusive behavior in these forums from Inaba, BFL_Josh towards those who were / are customers merely asking basic questions on shipping and problems with their units? All of the bans and post deletions from the BFL forums for similar questions and complaints? Also that BFL is trying to buy trust ratings in this forum to bolster their profile and sell more Monarchs?

It might be that your singular experience they are a great company to deal with but there is more than enough evidence to point to the fact they are one of the worst companies in Bitcoin at this time. The multiple lawsuits are just the tip of the iceberg and it is clear that Sonny V. has a probation officer that has read mounds of reports to the fact BFL has not been doing business very ethically. You don't get 2 more years probation without some just reasoning. Read the arstechnica article and some of the lawsuits and them come back and comment on that.

http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2014/04/digging-for-answers-the-strong-smell-of-fraud-from-one-bitcoin-miner-maker/

I might ask what did you purchase from BFL and when did you purchase it? And when did it arrive?

Nothing to hide?

One of the noteworthy revelations is that Butterfly Labs acquired a local Kansas-based Bitcoin mining pool, Eclipse Mining Consortium, for $100,000 in 2012. The pool's founder, Josh Zerlan, is now a vice president at BFL. (Zerlan publicly announced that he took a job with BFL in 2012, but he did not mention that he actually sold his company to BFL. Zerlan did not respond to a request for comment for this article.)

[norgan]

I bought a broken 30Gh/s unit locally here in Australia. It was clearly water damaged (maybe just for being outside) but I had bought it for $80 taking a punt that I may be able to fix it.
I was considering JTAG'ing it but then contacted BFL on a whim.

They replied overnight and stated that they'd fix it, even though I said I took it apart, bought it second hand and broken at that.
It's now back in Australia with return postage paid (I just paid to ship it there) and should have it in the next day or so (Aust. Post being stupid).

Full credit for BFL for standing behind their products and at the cost to me so far, that machine will surely be profitable before long. (yes I know, it's slow. but I am just having fun with it for now).

So bottom line, that would have to be the best customer service hands down that I have ever received. 

[jimmothy]

So bottom line, that would have to be the best customer service hands down that I have ever received

This is almost starting to sound shilly..

You don't see anything wrong with advocating/supporting a company which has openly scammed a majority of their customers and is facing many lawsuits along with over 1000 FTC complaints?

Sounds to me like "Even though bernie madoff stole billions of dollars, he seemed like a nice guy when I spoke with him. Would highly recommend doing business."

[arorts]

I bought a broken 30Gh/s unit locally here in Australia. It was clearly water damaged (maybe just for being outside) but I had bought it for $80 taking a punt that I may be able to fix it.
I was considering JTAG'ing it but then contacted BFL on a whim.

They replied overnight and stated that they'd fix it, even though I said I took it apart, bought it second hand and broken at that.
It's now back in Australia with return postage paid (I just paid to ship it there) and should have it in the next day or so (Aust. Post being stupid).

Full credit for BFL for standing behind their products and at the cost to me so far, that machine will surely be profitable before long. (yes I know, it's slow. but I am just having fun with it for now).

So bottom line, that would have to be the best customer service hands down that I have ever received. 

Providing a warranty for an existing product that already has been built is absolutely no big deal.
Although you had a great experience and that's awesome, your case is no bigger  than a grain of salt in the sea of constant, severe and shocking failures and mess that BFL left behind.
So in the greater picture, no, the world will still remember BFL as the worst ASIC mining company ever in mankind history, including customer experience.

Just to put things in a bit of perspective ;-)

[Bicknellski]

Let me get this straight...

1. You didn't buy directly from BFL.
2. You bought a unit made by BFL that had failed due to "water damage" not something else like a straight up product failure.
3. You got an immediate reply for RMA and they repaired it / replaced it even though you admitted you were not the original purchaser? (That is counter to the 100's of RMA complaints of paid customers in hundreds of posts in multiple locations) What year and month was your RMA?
4. That tells you, ignoring all the other threads and complaints, they are a great company that stands behind their products?

I guess your experience proves you got exceptional service. What it doesn't prove is a pattern and given the 100's of complaints posted regarding RMA, slow email response times I might question the veracity of your statement without evidence. We have seen unfortunately a sustained pattern from BFL to use multiple accounts and paid people to promote BFL. How about we see some documentation of the RMA paperwork? Pictures of the unit and the water damage and then the replacement or repaired unit?

I hate that we can't actually trust someone but given the lengths that BFL goes to spread misinformation and promote itself as reputable player in the market you just can't accept things at face value.

I see you still have yet to respond to the questions I asked about the evidence against BFL, the rude and uncalled for behavior of Josh Zerlan here on these forums and BFL forums to customer queries? Hundreds of deleted posts and banned customers? I wonder why you want to avoid that discussion at all? That is typically what many paid promoters of BFL have done in the past. That doesn't really strike me as genuine. I am not trying to argue with you if you have the evidence and I am sure that on occasion BFL has done the right thing but given the evidence it is hard to believe you can't see all the negatives.

Check this thread to see what I mean:https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=344105.0

Here is a sample: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=324891.msg3481907#msg3481907

we have been getting reports for DOA jalla Bfl miners crapping out . Took BFL two weeks to answer the email then consumers shipped the jalla back and weeks later still waiting. Total time mining for consumer 2 weeks .Total wait time 7 months two weeks and yet to get a return miner.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EskGPF5EN4Q

[reactor]

I think someone just decided to start a new thread to get Bicknellski all fired up...

[Bicknellski]

My biggest question is what is the BFL plan going forward.  When they originally started selling, 5GH, 30GH, 60GH, and the whopper were all great offers for the money.

Now we're in a world of still current vaporware from KNC, Bitfury, a screwed up Avalon situation, and people itching for the new AM blades.  Every one of those products is offering a better (Hash x Timeframe x Price x Difficulty estimates) => value right now considering ordering a Jalapeno today may see it get to you in October/November.  

So while I'm pretty confident I'll get my 30GH/s unit (and had a very positive experience with BFL customer service after the week+ wait to hear back), I can't say it'll be more hash-valuable than my little farm of usbs right now (currently at 8HG).  And getting a Jalapeno at 5GH now is almost pointless, so are we going to hear about a next generation?  Are early customers going to see some form of discount on v2 hardware since when we paid the value was there and when most of us take ownership it won't be?  It's a long, tough situation, but like most other scenarios it is throwing money at a company with no guarantee of delivery.

I'd love to hear the BFL 2014 plan.

How are your Monarch orders everyone? BFL 2014 plan Reactor? Same as 2013 and 2012 late product and not hope in hell to ROI.

[norgan]

Bicknellski, I have not had any experience of that and I don't doubt it has happened. I am simply stating that I've not experienced it directly and in fact quite the opposite.

I would be happy to post photos of the damaged device and will ask if they mind if I include transcripts of the emails we have had.

1. You didn't buy directly from BFL. - Nope
2. You bought a unit made by BFL that had failed due to "water damage" not something else like a straight up product failure. - yup, inspected myself, surprised the board wasn't completely screwed based on the look of it.
3. You got an immediate reply for RMA and they repaired it / replaced it even though you admitted you were not the original purchaser? (That is counter to the 100's of RMA complaints of paid customers in hundreds of posts in multiple locations) What year and month was your RMA? yup, this was only this month.
4. That tells you, ignoring all the other threads and complaints, they are a great company that stands behind their products? not ignoring anything, I just wanted to share a positive experience in amongst all this negativity.

I will take photos of the repaired board once I get it and post them side by side of how I received it.

I totally get your scepticism and appreciate the issues BFL have been experiencing/causing. I am pretty new to mining and learning a lot fast but I do know customer service having worked in the IT industry for almost 20 years now and this is one of the best experiences I've had. Not perfect mind you as they had put the wrong postal code on the package so it got a little lost but has been found now and should be with me after the long weekend.

More than happy to answer any and all other questions you may have. Feel free to message me direct if you wish to have a more frank discussion or want to verify my independence/Identity.

[xingqiaoyin]

Made me wonder
There are members right now complaining about bitmain bad RMA policies in antminer thread and goes as far as saying they have become worse than BFL 

Now...someone popped in here saying what a great RMA experience with BFL 

[gagalady]

They are nice when the deal isn't big for them.. But they are not so nice when the deal comes to more solid price.  It's just like getting feedbacks for doing "small" things and then scam on some big fish. It's just balancing good deal, good deal, bad deal, and other 5 good deals and so on..

[Inaba]

Let me clear up a few points here real quick:

• BFL stole nothing. Unless someone can provide some proof to the contrary, they are lying.
• BFL has scammed no one. Unless someone can provide proof to the contrary, they are lying. (Go on, ask for proof from the trolls claiming scams, you'll never get it.)
• BFL gave refund for over six months past the estimated shipping date. BFL only stopped giving refunds after shipping started. Anyone who tells you differently is lying.
• There was no promised shipping date for the Monarch line and in fact there were big bold text stating that it is a preorder and subject to delay. Anyone who tells you the Monarch is late and that BFL made promises on delivery time is lying.
• BFL has shipped over 50,000 products in the 65nm line. The failure rate is less than 1% (0.72%) not including power supplies.  If you include power supplies, that goes to 1.65%.  Far lower than industry average and a simply awesome (lack of) failure rate. Contrast to the other mining companies equipment, which has double digit failure rates and it's even better.  Anyone who tells you differently is lying.
• OP's experience is the norm. People rarely come to a forum to post when they have a positive experience, they usually come and post to complain. After 50,000 units shipped and you look at the complaints, that should tell you something.  Most people are not complaining, just a handful of disgruntled people and a whole lot of trolls who aren't even customers.
• The only people who get rude responses from me are people who initiate a conversation with rudeness or lies. Go on, ask one of the trolls to provide proof to the contrary, you won't find it.  The secret is being respectful and polite and you get the same in return.  Be an asshole and you get the same in return... funny how that works.

[markj113]

sitting back with the popcorn waiting for the onslaught to start 

[Xian01]

So bottom line, that would have to be the best customer service hands down that I have ever received.  

 I hope you can appreciate that a 10 post newbie making such an outrageously bizarre claim gives us pause.

 Your experience is not reflective of the experiences many people on these forums have had. I recommend you dig deeper into the history of this company before praising their customer service as "the best customer service hands down"; I can only deduce that you do not have much customer service experience dealing with other vendors, if you are rating this one so highly.

 Given the fact that there have been "thousands" of complaints (my own, included) as revealed in the most recent court documents, I would urge you to do more research.

 IMHO, you do yourself a disservice by publicly standing up for Butterfly Labs.

EDIT: For reference;

http://www.woodlaw.com/cases/butterfly-labs-and-bf-labs-inc-bitcoin-miners

http://www.scribd.com/doc/217190032/Butterfly-Labs-Production-of-Requested-Information-December-6-2013
http://www.scribd.com/doc/217190033/Defendant-s-Memorandum-in-Opposition-to-Show-Cause-and-Violation-Report-Sept-3-2013
http://www.scribd.com/doc/217190031/2014-01-28-USA-v-Vleisides-Transcript

THE COURT : "Now, there is a stench coming from Butterfly Labs. It's a strong smell. It's not enough to send you to prison today, because, to be quite honest with you, if it was, we'd be talking about 24 months in prison. It's not -- I think it's too close. I think Mr. Bourne did a very good job of testifying, and it assisted your defense greatly. But if I find out that there is this fraud word involved in this part, you know, Mr. Vleisides, as we say here at the courthouse, you need to get your toothbrush and get your things in order, because fraud will not be tolerated, you understand that? So I would work very hard to make these consumers happy consumers who you've dealt with."

[jimmothy]

Let me clear up nothing real quick:

• BFL stole nothing. Unless someone can provide some proof to the contrary, they are lying.

https://coinreport.net/butterfly-labs-civil-lawsuit/

• BFL has scammed no one. Unless someone can provide proof to the contrary, they are lying. (Go on, ask for proof from the trolls claiming scams, you'll never get it.)

Delivering non-advertised product 6+ months later than advertised date along with no refunds = scamming.

• There was no promised shipping date for the Monarch line and in fact there were big bold text stating that it is a preorder and subject to delay. Anyone who tells you the Monarch is late and that BFL made promises on delivery time is lying.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/deceit

• BFL has shipped over 50,000 products in the 65nm line. The failure rate is less than 1% (0.72%) not including power supplies.  If you include power supplies, that goes to 1.65%.  Far lower than industry average and a simply awesome (lack of) failure rate. Contrast to the other mining companies shittiest mining companies equipment, which has double digit failure rates and it's even better.  Anyone who tells you differently is lying.

FTFY

• OP's experience is the norm. People rarely come to a forum to post when they have a positive experience, they usually come and post to complain. After 50,000 units shipped and you look at the complaints, that should tell you something.  Most people are not complaining, just a handful of disgruntled people and a whole lot of trolls who aren't even customers.

People rarely come to post positive experience? What about spondoolies/asicminer/bitfury/bitmain/chinese miners/all the non-shit companies?

It is amazing that with only 50,000 units shipped you managed to rack up over 1,000 FTC/PP complaints. Must be some sort of record.

[Bicknellski]

Let me clear up nothing real quick:

• BFL stole nothing. Unless someone can provide some proof to the contrary, they are lying.

https://coinreport.net/butterfly-labs-civil-lawsuit/

• BFL has scammed no one. Unless someone can provide proof to the contrary, they are lying. (Go on, ask for proof from the trolls claiming scams, you'll never get it.)

Delivering non-advertised product 6+ months later than advertised date along with no refunds = scamming.

• There was no promised shipping date for the Monarch line and in fact there were big bold text stating that it is a preorder and subject to delay. Anyone who tells you the Monarch is late and that BFL made promises on delivery time is lying.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/deceit

• BFL has shipped over 50,000 products in the 65nm line. The failure rate is less than 1% (0.72%) not including power supplies.  If you include power supplies, that goes to 1.65%.  Far lower than industry average and a simply awesome (lack of) failure rate. Contrast to the other mining companies shittiest mining companies equipment, which has double digit failure rates and it's even better.  Anyone who tells you differently is lying.

FTFY

• OP's experience is the norm. People rarely come to a forum to post when they have a positive experience, they usually come and post to complain. After 50,000 units shipped and you look at the complaints, that should tell you something.  Most people are not complaining, just a handful of disgruntled people and a whole lot of trolls who aren't even customers.

People rarely come to post positive experience? What about spondoolies/asicminer/bitfury/bitmain/chinese miners/all the non-shit companies?

It is amazing that with only 50,000 units shipped you managed to rack up over 1,000 FTC/PP complaints. Must be some sort of record.

The truth certainly will not change what Inaba says he is morally and ethically bankrupt Jimmothy. Soon he will be selling out Sonny V. for his own freedom. The end is coming for BFL and old Joshy better get his own lawyer before he gets thrown under the bus.

And the OP can post his evidence here... he doesn't need to email me. Let the community decide whether his evidence passes muster. Again given the horrible treatment of customers that is well documented particularly the FTC complaints when BFL was NOT giving refunds when they were legally required to do so is something that the probation officer needs for Sonny V. needs to be made aware of. You can't ignore the reality. BFL are morally and ethically challenged and will do anything they can to keep this racket going for a long as they can. There will be plenty of evidence coming to light soon enough that will scatter the cockroaches.