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Author Topic: URGENT: drop MTGOX class action lawyers! contact WSJ about their lies URGENT!  (Read 4720 times)
superduh (OP)
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April 29, 2014, 03:38:49 PM
Last edit: April 29, 2014, 06:58:40 PM by superduh
 #1

this is complete BULLSHIT.

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702304893404579530262159284736.

this is the second time WSJ is running fake, made up news about "creditor" support.

the SUNLOT plan DOES NOT have MAJORITY BACKER SUPPORT as the MAJORITY BACKERS were never consulted or AGREED TO ANYTHING.

the SUNLOT plan is awful in it's original and revised form. it should not be adopted by the creditors of MTGOX.

(deleted a bunch of stuff that made me sound like i was raging)

ok
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April 29, 2014, 03:57:56 PM
 #2

As many of us have probably found out over the years, it is the louder plaintiffs who get what they want.  In other words, the lawyers can agree to something and then they send it to all class members and the class memebrs can decide whether to stay in the class and get the reward or drop out.  Before something is approved by the court, at least in the US, the judge has to approve an award.  Any class members can go petition the court (usually you have to go in person) and tell them why it's a bad deal and ask the court to not allow the settlement.
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April 29, 2014, 04:37:39 PM
 #3

Investors and Creditors Unite in Push for Mt. Gox Revival

A group of Mt. Gox creditors have not given up on bold plans to revive the defunct bitcoin exchange. The creditors are already involved in two proposed class-action lawsuits against Mt. Gox and their lawyers claim to have reached a deal with US-based investors to prop up the exchange.

Details of the proposed settlement were filed with a District Court in Chicago on Monday. Under the proposed agreement the creditors would get a 16.5% stake in the ‘new’ Mt. Gox, while the investor group, Sunlot Holdings, would take over the company.

The lawyers are expected to present their case before a judge on Thursday, but hurdles remain.
More approval necessary

Since Mt. Gox is incorporated in Japan and Japanese authorities are overseeing the bankruptcy proceedings, they would also have to green light the proposed deal.

In addition, the proposal is coming from US and Canadian creditors involved in the proposed class actions and it is unclear whether other Mt. Gox creditors around the world would agree to it.

The hope is that the proposed deal would halt liquidation proceedings, which commenced last week. The whole process is expected to take several months and the first creditor meeting is scheduled for 23rd July, giving creditors ample time to put together their proposal and get the necessary support from fellow creditors, bankruptcy trustees and authorities.
....
...Sunlot Holdings also enjoys the support of Jed McCaleb, the original founder of Mt. Gox, as well as former Mt. Gox CMO Gonzague Gay-Bouchery. McCaleb already holds a 12% stake in the company, so he has a vested interest in putting Gox back on its feet.

Creditors also stand to gain from the proposed deal. Liquidation can be a very lengthy process and would also derail the proposed class action suits.
http://www.coindesk.com/investors-creditors-unite-push-mt-gox-revival


Clearly this favors North Americans and the people who used to run Gox.
Japan isn't that stupid...?


Keyser Soze
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April 29, 2014, 05:11:04 PM
 #4

Full WSJ Article
Quote
Mt. Gox Creditors, Investors Agree to Try to Revive Bitcoin Exchange
Deal Would Give Creditors a 16.5% Stake in the Future Company
By MICHAEL J. CASEY CONNECT
Updated April 29, 2014 12:10 a.m. ET
Lawyers for creditors involved in two proposed class-action lawsuits against Mt. Gox have reached an agreement to support a group of U.S. investors' bid to revive the bankrupt bitcoin exchange, an agreement that would give the creditors a 16.5% stake in the prospective future company.

The creditors' lawyers filed details of the settlement, which also involved Mt. Gox's former owner and its former chief marketing officer, with a District Court in Chicago on Monday.

At a separate hearing before the judge Thursday, they are expected to present their case for that agreement, which in addition to the equity stake includes prorated disbursements out of Tokyo-based Mt. Gox's holdings of 200,000 bitcoins and traditional currency. The terms would apply to all creditors worldwide, though it was signed on behalf of U.S. and Canadian members of the proposed class actions. If the U.S. court approves the plan, the investor group, Sunlot Holdings, would then seek approval of the Japanese court overseeing the bankruptcy.

The creditors and the buyout group hope their deal will halt the liquidation proceedings launched by Mt. Gox earlier this month, which was given the go-ahead last week by the Japanese court, naming lawyer Nobuaki Kobayashi as the bankruptcy trustee to oversee that process.

The Sunlot consortium has repeatedly argued that liquidation would result in a much smaller recovery value for creditors than would its plan to revive the exchange and share trading profits with those former exchange customers. John Betts, Sunlot chief executive, has said the bid is aimed not only at improving the outcome for those creditors but also in sending a message that the "bitcoin community looks after its own."

According a news release from Sunlot, the consortium along with Jed McCaleb, who founded Mt. Gox, and former Mt. Gox chief marketing officer, Gonzague Gay-Bouchery, agreed under the deal to help the plaintiff creditors in their continued case against Mt. Gox's majority owner, Mark Karpelès, and his holding company, Tibanne Co. Ltd.

Mr. McCaleb sold a majority stake in Mt. Gox to Mr. Karpelès in 2011 but retained a 12% stake.

In an email, Mr. Karpelès said, "we provide our support to the sponsor chosen by the [Japanese] court and supervisor, whichever ends up being chosen. The court and the supervisor will be choosing the sponsor that will be most beneficial to the creditors."

Edelson Managing Partner Jay Edelson, the lawyer who represented the U.S. creditors covered by the proposed class action said, "Liquidation would have been a disaster for the U.S. class. It would have taken significant time, the assets would have been depleted, and the U.S. consumers would have gotten pennies on the dollar."

Negotiations between the creditors and the parties to the agreement were conducted under the oversight of Retired District Judge Wayne Andersen, of JAMS, who served as an independent mediator.

In addition to the lawyers for the U.S. and Canadian class-action creditors who directly approved the settlement, lawyers representing a separate international group were also engaged in the negotiations. The proposed class involved in the negotiations account for about 50,000 of the "digital wallets" from which coins are missing, out of a total 127,000, according to the Sunlot news release.

Mt. Gox, which once accounted for 80% of all bitcoin trading, filed for bankruptcy protection Feb. 28 and said hacking attacks and software glitches had caused it to lose 850,000 bitcoins, worth about $500 million at the time, including 750,000 belonging to customers. Since then, it announced that it had recovered 200,000 of those but the remaining 550,000 coins, now worth about $240 million, continue to be a controversial issue. Some believe that with a full audit of Mt. Gox's books and an investigation of the bitcoin network's universal ledger of transactions, it should be possible to trace those missing bitcoins.

The Sunlot consortium, which includes bitcoin entrepreneur Brock Pierce as well as venture capital investors Matthew Roszak and William Quigley, first entered into negotiations with Mr. Karpelès in February at a time when the embattled Mt. Gox had frozen customer accounts. The subsequent bankruptcy declaration stymied those talks but the group continued to lobby Mr. Karpelès, who eventually agreed to their buyout offer and sent a letter to the court supporting their proposal.

The move to liquidate signaled a charge of course for Mr. Karpelés and forced the group to launch a last-ditch campaign to keep their bid alive. This included setting up a website, savegox.com, where thousands of burned Mt. Gox customers were invited to voice their preference for the rehabilitation plan.

Write to Michael J. Casey at michael.j.casey@wsj.com
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April 29, 2014, 06:02:11 PM
 #5

Edelson email is mtgox@edelson.com

To paraphrase a scene from Jaws: We're goin' need a bigger bed!

http://www.savegox.com/press/Gox_Creditor_Settlement_Press_Release.pdf

Quote
For Sunlot:
Sallie Hofmeister
Sitrick and Company
310-788-2850
shofmeister@sitrick.com

http://sitrick.com/about

Quote
The team has orchestrated such high-profile campaigns as the withhold vote effort launched by Roy Disney against Michael Eisner, then the head of the Walt Disney Company, and the defense of Patricia Dunn, former chair of HP, who was indicted for allegedly spying on her board.

Enter Brock Pierce (pun intended).

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April 29, 2014, 06:21:39 PM
 #6

the SUNLOT plan is awful in it's original and revised form. it should not be adopted by the creditors of MTGOX.

Please, please explain why.

AFAIK, no one has been able to explain why Sunlot's plan is awful. All I see is statements like OP's above, never explaining WHY liquidation is preferrable.



FACT: There were hundreds of thousands of unnecessary deaths by December 2020 due to the censorship of all effective treatments (most notably ivermectin) in order to obtain EUA for experimental GT spike protein injections despite spike bioweaponization patents going back about a decade, and the manufacturers have 100% legal immunity despite long criminal histories.
superduh (OP)
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April 29, 2014, 06:57:12 PM
 #7

the SUNLOT plan is awful in it's original and revised form. it should not be adopted by the creditors of MTGOX.

Please, please explain why.

AFAIK, no one has been able to explain why Sunlot's plan is awful. All I see is statements like OP's above, never explaining WHY liquidation is preferrable.




1) they are buying mtgox for 1btc (token)
2) they lock up btc for a year
3) from what i understand they will USE CREDITOR FUNDS to investigate and pursue possible stolen coins.
4) they have no experience with running any exchange and would be not much better than Mark himself
5) 16.5% for being compensated for any and all unrecoverable assets of MtGox? (their expertise is worth 80%+ of equity!?!? for what)
6) no more debt to creditors in return for 16.5%!?!?
7) offer NO money or investment of their own into this venture

do i go on?

is it better than liquidation? hard to tell. but, much better offers can be made.

ok
DrApricot
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April 29, 2014, 07:15:09 PM
 #8

Quote
much better offers can be made

Actually, Sunlot's offer is not economically rational unless they have some kind of inside knowledge that the still missing 650,000 bitcoins are very likely to be soon recovered.

Jason Tyra covers that reviving Mt. Gox is not a good investment for Sunlot or anyone else in his excellent Bitcoin Magazine article posted earlier today,

Mt. Gox Shouldn’t Stay Down…Or Should It?
http://bitcoinmagazine.com/12675/mt-gox-shouldnt-stay/
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April 29, 2014, 07:19:55 PM
Last edit: April 29, 2014, 07:35:22 PM by Bit_Happy
 #9

the SUNLOT plan is awful in it's original and revised form. it should not be adopted by the creditors of MTGOX.

Please, please explain why.

AFAIK, no one has been able to explain why Sunlot's plan is awful. All I see is statements like OP's above, never explaining WHY liquidation is preferrable.




1) they are buying mtgox for 1btc (token)
2) they lock up btc for a year
3) from what i understand they will USE CREDITOR FUNDS to investigate and pursue possible stolen coins.
4) they have no experience with running any exchange and would be not much better than Mark himself
5) 16.5% for being compensated for any and all unrecoverable assets of MtGox? (their expertise is worth 80%+ of equity!?!? for what)
6) no more debt to creditors in return for 16.5%!?!?
7) offer NO money or investment of their own into this venture

do i go on?

is it better than liquidation? hard to tell. but, much better offers can be made.

8, & 9) Brock Pierce was part of a dot-com "company" that burned through $60 Million before going bankrupt. The parties were so wild that boys as young as 13 sued over charges of child rape.


Edit:
Brock Pierce claims to be innocent of the events at the parties, his partners were older and Brock was ~19 at the time.
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April 29, 2014, 07:22:14 PM
 #10

the SUNLOT plan is awful in it's original and revised form. it should not be adopted by the creditors of MTGOX.

Please, please explain why.

AFAIK, no one has been able to explain why Sunlot's plan is awful. All I see is statements like OP's above, never explaining WHY liquidation is preferrable.




1) they are buying mtgox for 1btc (token)
2) they lock up btc for a year
3) from what i understand they will USE CREDITOR FUNDS to investigate and pursue possible stolen coins.
4) they have no experience with running any exchange and would be not much better than Mark himself
5) 16.5% for being compensated for any and all unrecoverable assets of MtGox? (their expertise is worth 80%+ of equity!?!? for what)
6) no more debt to creditors in return for 16.5%!?!?
7) offer NO money or investment of their own into this venture

do i go on?

is it better than liquidation? hard to tell. but, much better offers can be made.

#4 may be incorrect.
btcusury
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April 29, 2014, 07:25:26 PM
 #11

1) they are buying mtgox for 1btc (token)

Good for them! Would YOU buy a company with negative net worth for more than a token?

Quote
2) they lock up btc for a year

The Tokyo District Court would ignore the missing BTC forever, and possibly sell the BTC for Yen. Which is worse?

Quote
3) from what i understand they will USE CREDITOR FUNDS to investigate and pursue possible stolen coins.

I haven't seen this, but even if so, most creditors would probably agree to use a fraction of their portion of the 200k to help find the remaining 650k. With liquidation the missing 650k is just ignored.

Quote
4) they have no experience with running any exchange and would be not much better than Mark himself

I don't think you believe that yourself. The combined experience of a group of entrepreneurs vs. a 26-year-old anime fan who codes a financial trading engine in PHP?

Quote
5) 16.5% for being compensated for any and all unrecoverable assets of MtGox? (their expertise is worth 80%+ of equity!?!? for what)

Not sure what you mean, care to clarify?

Quote
6) no more debt to creditors in return for 16.5%!?!?

That's not what I'm reading... They are saying customers will slowly be made whole from trading fees. Some people said this would take 30 years, but according to my own projection, more like 2-4 years.

Quote
7) offer NO money or investment of their own into this venture

See 1).

Quote
do i go on?

Please do, I'd love to see a good reason why rehabilitation is worse than liquidation.

Quote
is it better than liquidation? hard to tell. but, much better offers can be made.

Sure better offers can be made, but none is being made, and liquidation will proceed unless stopped in time.


Quote
much better offers can be made

Actually, Sunlot's offer is not economically rational unless they have some kind of inside knowledge that the still missing 650,000 bitcoins are very likely to be soon recovered.

That's exactly what I think. Although not necessarily inside knowledge -- it could be just an understanding of a high probability of finding the missing BTC. If you assume Karpeles is an incompetent idiot rather than a fraudster, you can take his IRC statement seriously that the BTC are "not technically lost, just temporarily unavailable".

Quote from: Bit_Happy
8, & 9) Brock Pierce was part of a dot-com "company" that burned through $60 Million before going bankrupt. The parties were so wild that boys as young as 13 sued over charges of child rape.

Any evidence of fraud? Or just an entrepreneur trying to ride the dot-com bubble?

FACT: There were hundreds of thousands of unnecessary deaths by December 2020 due to the censorship of all effective treatments (most notably ivermectin) in order to obtain EUA for experimental GT spike protein injections despite spike bioweaponization patents going back about a decade, and the manufacturers have 100% legal immunity despite long criminal histories.
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April 29, 2014, 07:28:19 PM
 #12

the SUNLOT plan is awful in it's original and revised form. it should not be adopted by the creditors of MTGOX.

Please, please explain why.

AFAIK, no one has been able to explain why Sunlot's plan is awful. All I see is statements like OP's above, never explaining WHY liquidation is preferrable.




1) they are buying mtgox for 1btc (token)
2) they lock up btc for a year
3) from what i understand they will USE CREDITOR FUNDS to investigate and pursue possible stolen coins.
4) they have no experience with running any exchange and would be not much better than Mark himself
5) 16.5% for being compensated for any and all unrecoverable assets of MtGox? (their expertise is worth 80%+ of equity!?!? for what)
6) no more debt to creditors in return for 16.5%!?!?
7) offer NO money or investment of their own into this venture

do i go on?

is it better than liquidation? hard to tell. but, much better offers can be made.

8, & 9) Brock Pierce was part of a dot-com "company" that burned through $60 Million before going bankrupt. The parties were so wild that boys as young as 13 sued over charges of child rape.

Of which has been in the news as of late.
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April 29, 2014, 07:30:55 PM
 #13


Quote from: Bit_Happy
8, & 9) Brock Pierce was part of a dot-com "company" that burned through $60 Million before going bankrupt. The parties were so wild that boys as young as 13 sued over charges of child rape.

Any evidence of fraud? Or just an entrepreneur trying to ride the dot-com bubble?


I'm honestly not sure how to define "fraud" when you are living in an expensive mansion (with two older partners) and inviting young boys to parties who show up because they are expecting to be movie stars.
The next morning they wake up with a hangover and an unusual pain in their ass.

Is that technically fraud?


Edit:
Brock Pierce claims to be innocent of the events at the parties, his partners were older and Brock was ~19 at the time.
superduh (OP)
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April 29, 2014, 07:32:24 PM
 #14

btcusury,
OKCOIN'S plan is much better

ok
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April 29, 2014, 07:33:00 PM
 #15

Quote
6) no more debt to creditors in return for 16.5%!?!?

That's not what I'm reading... They are saying customers will slowly be made whole from trading fees. Some people said this would take 30 years, but according to my own projection, more like 2-4 years.

If Mt Gox profited $1M a month and used all that profit toward paying off a $275M debt, you're looking at 275 months in paying off said dept in $. In BTC, if/when BTC rises, much longer it'll take.
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April 29, 2014, 07:35:23 PM
 #16


Quote from: Bit_Happy
8, & 9) Brock Pierce was part of a dot-com "company" that burned through $60 Million before going bankrupt. The parties were so wild that boys as young as 13 sued over charges of child rape.

Any evidence of fraud? Or just an entrepreneur trying to ride the dot-com bubble?


I'm honestly not sure how to define "fraud" when you are living in an expensive mansion (with two older partners) and inviting young boys to parties who show up because they are expecting to be movie stars.
The next morning they wake up with a hangover and an unusual pain in their ass.

Is that technically fraud?

Alright, any evidence of child abuse?

FACT: There were hundreds of thousands of unnecessary deaths by December 2020 due to the censorship of all effective treatments (most notably ivermectin) in order to obtain EUA for experimental GT spike protein injections despite spike bioweaponization patents going back about a decade, and the manufacturers have 100% legal immunity despite long criminal histories.
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April 29, 2014, 07:35:32 PM
 #17


Quote from: Bit_Happy
8, & 9) Brock Pierce was part of a dot-com "company" that burned through $60 Million before going bankrupt. The parties were so wild that boys as young as 13 sued over charges of child rape.

Any evidence of fraud? Or just an entrepreneur trying to ride the dot-com bubble?


I'm honestly not sure how to define "fraud" when you are living in an expensive mansion (with two older partners) and inviting young boys to parties who show up because they are expecting to be movie stars.
The next morning they wake up with a hangover and an unusual pain in their ass.

Is that technically fraud?

Long Dong Johnson and Skropenis may dub it simply as mining.
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April 29, 2014, 07:36:25 PM
 #18

Alright, any evidence of child abuse?


This forum has a search feature. Insert (no pun intended) Brock Pierce.
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April 29, 2014, 07:37:24 PM
 #19


Quote from: Bit_Happy
8, & 9) Brock Pierce was part of a dot-com "company" that burned through $60 Million before going bankrupt. The parties were so wild that boys as young as 13 sued over charges of child rape.

Any evidence of fraud? Or just an entrepreneur trying to ride the dot-com bubble?


I'm honestly not sure how to define "fraud" when you are living in an expensive mansion (with two older partners) and inviting young boys to parties who show up because they are expecting to be movie stars.
The next morning they wake up with a hangover and an unusual pain in their ass.

Is that technically fraud?

Alright, any evidence of child abuse?



alright, can we have a different thread regarding any sort of child abuse accusation etc.

ok
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April 29, 2014, 07:56:57 PM
 #20


Quote from: Bit_Happy
8, & 9) Brock Pierce was part of a dot-com "company" that burned through $60 Million before going bankrupt. The parties were so wild that boys as young as 13 sued over charges of child rape.

Any evidence of fraud? Or just an entrepreneur trying to ride the dot-com bubble?


I'm honestly not sure how to define "fraud" when you are living in an expensive mansion (with two older partners) and inviting young boys to parties who show up because they are expecting to be movie stars.
The next morning they wake up with a hangover and an unusual pain in their ass.

Is that technically fraud?

Alright, any evidence of child abuse?

According to http://archive.wired.com/gaming/virtualworlds/magazine/16-12/ff_ige_pierce:

Quote
DEN [Digital Entertainment Network, the dot-com company co-founded at age 17 by Brock Pierce] fell apart in 1999, when senior co-founder Marc Collins-Rector, 40 years old at the time, settled a lawsuit that accused him of sexually molesting a 13-year-old male employee. Other young men then filed similar suits against Collins-Rector, naming Pierce and 25-year-old DEN co-founder Chad Shackley as peripheral defendants. None of the three DEN founders could be located, and default judgments totaling $4.5 million were handed down.

Pierce says, he had no knowledge of the suits at the time, and when he finally showed up to contest them two years later, the judgments against him were dismissed.

So yeah, innocent until proven guilty, case dismissed, therefore innocent. Unless you know of other evidence?

Also, I might note, his moral character and sexual tendencies, particularly at age 17-19, doesn't say much about his honesty and trustworthiness at age 34. He doesn't strike me as someone stuck in the past:

Quote
On the drive back up to his house in the Laurel Canyon hills, he kept talking, telling me about his current list of projects, entrepreneurial and otherwise. He had just sold a casino in the Phillippines. There was an oil deal in Kazakhstan. He was doing philanthropic work with the Clinton Global Initiative. He was working with the family of the president of El Salvador to make some worthy documentary or another. His list was delivered with an almost manic urgency. If I were to presume to have the slightest idea what really goes on inside Brock Pierce's head, I might suggest he was trying to establish by sheer force of talk the irrelevance of anything in his past to all the things he's doing today.

FACT: There were hundreds of thousands of unnecessary deaths by December 2020 due to the censorship of all effective treatments (most notably ivermectin) in order to obtain EUA for experimental GT spike protein injections despite spike bioweaponization patents going back about a decade, and the manufacturers have 100% legal immunity despite long criminal histories.
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