This forum is full of future millionaires

[acs267]

10 mil is the new millionaire. Sad but true.

How is that sad? A millionaire is a individual or person whose net worth is over a million units in a chosen currency.

It's sad because being a millionaire was every American kid's dream a generation ago.
By the time we got there, its not even that much money anymore.

That's odd. With one million dollars, I can buy a average house were I live. And at least cover some living expenses for some time.

House - Average where I live is at least 125K-200K. 3-5 Bedroom, possibly 2 bathrooms. A few thousand sq ft, not over 6,000 sq ft  - mansion. Also possibly a few acres of land around it.

Food - Averagely spent on food is $175 a week, according to Google, or in that range. A year is about 52 weeks. $9,100 dollars a year, approximately.

Car - Not really fancy for a car. Thinking off the top of my head, let's say a Hummer. That costs about $10K, and $80 for gas every week where I live. $4,160 a year + $10K for car. For any repairs, let's say a extra $10K.

Clothes - Kind of preppy guy. Going to assume in the $400-$1,000 range. Various sites say $121-$200 range, though, so I'm going with the latter. $200 spent monthly, I guess. $2,400.

Utilities + Health + Leisure - I can't go without Internet, and housing is to take into mind. Plus cable, and other things. At least $665 monthly, which turns into $7,980 annually. Other services, such as my phone bill and such would probably be around $427 a month, $5,124.

Average Total - $213,764. Either I'm missing something, or a million dollars is now the ZWD compared to a dollar.

+1
was thinking the same, i lol'd every time i read someone crying that 1,000,000 USD is not enough for a good life... yes if you want a mansion and the latest's Ferrari its not enough, otherwise you have a good life in many places of the world.

Agreed. The thing that boggles me is that they've probably never had a million dollars in their life, but make the assumption it's not that much money 'anymore'. I myself have never held that much money, but have put a few nervous glances in that direction. But saying one million dollars isn't a lot is... Terrible.

[jonald_fyookball]

10 mil is the new millionaire. Sad but true.

How is that sad? A millionaire is a individual or person whose net worth is over a million units in a chosen currency.

It's sad because being a millionaire was every American kid's dream a generation ago.
By the time we got there, its not even that much money anymore.

That's odd. With one million dollars, I can buy a average house were I live. And at least cover some living expenses for some time.

House - Average where I live is at least 125K-200K. 3-5 Bedroom, possibly 2 bathrooms. A few thousand sq ft, not over 6,000 sq ft  - mansion. Also possibly a few acres of land around it.

Food - Averagely spent on food is $175 a week, according to Google, or in that range. A year is about 52 weeks. $9,100 dollars a year, approximately.

Car - Not really fancy for a car. Thinking off the top of my head, let's say a Hummer. That costs about $10K, and $80 for gas every week where I live. $4,160 a year + $10K for car. For any repairs, let's say a extra $10K.

Clothes - Kind of preppy guy. Going to assume in the $400-$1,000 range. Various sites say $121-$200 range, though, so I'm going with the latter. $200 spent monthly, I guess. $2,400.

Utilities + Health + Leisure - I can't go without Internet, and housing is to take into mind. Plus cable, and other things. At least $665 monthly, which turns into $7,980 annually. Other services, such as my phone bill and such would probably be around $427 a month, $5,124.

Average Total - $213,764. Either I'm missing something, or a million dollars is now the ZWD compared to a dollar.

its a good perspective.  still, where i live a house is more than that (at least the one my wife wants)....and college tuition for kids..yikes... it eats up lots of moolah quick. 

[acs267]

10 mil is the new millionaire. Sad but true.

How is that sad? A millionaire is a individual or person whose net worth is over a million units in a chosen currency.

It's sad because being a millionaire was every American kid's dream a generation ago.
By the time we got there, its not even that much money anymore.

That's odd. With one million dollars, I can buy a average house were I live. And at least cover some living expenses for some time.

House - Average where I live is at least 125K-200K. 3-5 Bedroom, possibly 2 bathrooms. A few thousand sq ft, not over 6,000 sq ft  - mansion. Also possibly a few acres of land around it.

Food - Averagely spent on food is $175 a week, according to Google, or in that range. A year is about 52 weeks. $9,100 dollars a year, approximately.

Car - Not really fancy for a car. Thinking off the top of my head, let's say a Hummer. That costs about $10K, and $80 for gas every week where I live. $4,160 a year + $10K for car. For any repairs, let's say a extra $10K.

Clothes - Kind of preppy guy. Going to assume in the $400-$1,000 range. Various sites say $121-$200 range, though, so I'm going with the latter. $200 spent monthly, I guess. $2,400.

Utilities + Health + Leisure - I can't go without Internet, and housing is to take into mind. Plus cable, and other things. At least $665 monthly, which turns into $7,980 annually. Other services, such as my phone bill and such would probably be around $427 a month, $5,124.

Average Total - $213,764. Either I'm missing something, or a million dollars is now the ZWD compared to a dollar.

its a good perspective.  still, where i live a house is more than that (at least the one my wife wants)....and college tuition for kids..yikes... it eats up lots of moolah quick. 

The reason why I didn't include college tuition is because it depends on what college you go to. For example, where I live we have Community, Private, and University. Same reason why I didn't mention a kid's boarding school tuition, or a private school's.

[TaunSew]

A million dollars wouldn't even buy me a house in my city, a 60 year old house full of mold & asbestos can be bought for the 'affordable' discounted price in the $1.2 million range.


I don't see how a million can last anyone, even if you moved to a third world country and lived like a Slumlord.

[acs267]

A million dollars wouldn't even buy me a house in my city, a 60 year old house full of mold & asbestos can be bought for the 'affordable' discounted price in the $1.2 million range.


I don't see how a million can last anyone, even if you moved to a third world country and lived like a Slumlord.

Really? Do you mind me asking what city you live in, and I'm assuming you're in a mega-city, or a more urbanized city?

Yes, a million dollars can't necessarily last everyone - but it'd be foolish to claim it isn't a lot of money.

[lphelps]

yeah but even if a BTC = $100,000 or more in USD, what exactly is the USD worth?? Mere fractions of a cent..

[acs267]

yeah but even if a BTC = $100,000 or more in USD, what exactly is the USD worth?? Mere fractions of a cent..

I've never thought about that is this argument. What if USD was indeed worth a little then? It's not exactly the highest currency now, with the GBP and Euro. And the price falls sometimes, not as rapidly as thought of, though. So it is possible that Bitcoin could be $100,000, but what if those USD are €90,000 or £80,000?

[jonald_fyookball]

A million dollars wouldn't even buy me a house in my city, a 60 year old house full of mold & asbestos can be bought for the 'affordable' discounted price in the $1.2 million range.


I don't see how a million can last anyone, even if you moved to a third world country and lived like a Slumlord.

Yeah exactly, that's why fiat sucks.

[BillyBobJoe]

anyone holding over 10 bitcoin today will probably have 1 million USD (in today's purchasing power) in 10-20 years.
most of the fiat pundits who mock bitcoin today will be eating their hat when the USD finally implodes.
be glad you are lucky enough to be here in this moment in time when bitcoin is first invented, it will be quite a story to tell...

HA. Jokes on you. A million dollars today is not what it used to be.

HA, ha. In 10 to 20 years a million dollars will be nothing.

Especially since the US dollar imploded as you say.

<shaking head>

[FastBluff]

Bitcoin just broke $650 again. So we are 99,350$ away lol

[TaunSew]

anyone holding over 10 bitcoin today will probably have 1 million USD (in today's purchasing power) in 10-20 years.
most of the fiat pundits who mock bitcoin today will be eating their hat when the USD finally implodes.
be glad you are lucky enough to be here in this moment in time when bitcoin is first invented, it will be quite a story to tell...

HA. Jokes on you. A million dollars today is not what it used to be.

HA, ha. In 10 to 20 years a million dollars will be nothing.

Especially since the US dollar imploded as you say.

<shaking head>

IIRC - I read a study which made the assertion that a million dollars today was only worth the equivalent of $70,000 during President Hoover's Great Depression.  A millionaire back then was actually rich rich.

Seems plausible when you factor in purchasing power parities.  A Coca Cola in a restaurant used to be .5 cents for a very long time, whereas today it costs maybe $1.0 to $2.0 at restaurant now (depending on where you live).

I've witnessed a great deal of inflation in my own lifetime and I'm far from being an old person, let alone middle aged.  At the rate $Fiat is going, a Coca Cola will probably cost $40 per drink in a restaurant by the time I am retirement age.  The concept of saving for a retirement is almost a joke, since any chump change you may save today won't be enough to cover future living expenses.    

Think about that when you hear about pensioners eating dog food - you might assumed some didn't save anything (which could be true for some) but more like most were robbed out of their savings through inflation.

[bryant.coleman]

Fine...In the USA "millionaire" has lost it's once lofty status since we have had a huge increase in paper "wealth" the last 20 or 30 years.
These days in America 1 Million Dollars is not nearly enough to be comfortable for very long.

Having one million dollars with you don't guarantee you a comfortable lifestyle for more than 10 years, unless you invest the money wisely. Once you get rich, the government will try to take away your money, and give it to the lower income groups. The challenge is to maintain your wealth, by investing in wise schemes.  

[Taras]

I sure hope so, OP.

[jonald_fyookball]

Bitcoin just broke $650 again. So we are 99,350$ away lol

Nice. 650 you might was well round up to $1000.

That means it just has to 10x twice.

No freakin problem! 

[Beliathon]

anyone holding over 10 bitcoin today will probably have 1 million USD (in today's purchasing power) in 10-20 years.

3-5 years.

"The Internet's takeover of the global communication landscape was almost instant in historical terms: it only communicated 1% of the information flowing through two-way telecommunications networks in the year 1993, already 51% by 2000, and more than 97% of the telecommunicated information by 2007"

[jonald_fyookball]

anyone holding over 10 bitcoin today will probably have 1 million USD (in today's purchasing power) in 10-20 years.

3-5 years.

Beliathon, can you explain why/how bitcoin will get that big that fast? 10-20 years seems more realistic than 3-5 years for a price of $100,000 per coin.

[Beliathon]

anyone holding over 10 bitcoin today will probably have 1 million USD (in today's purchasing power) in 10-20 years.

3-5 years.

Beliathon, can you explain why/how bitcoin will get that big that fast?

Greed. Fiat is rapidly becoming worthless. Word travels fast in the information age.

[Light]

Massive adoption by nearly everyone in most major economies would bring the price of Bitcoin to 1 million USD and more. I don't say it will happen, but if it happens, this is the kind of figure we are looking at. Not 100K.

Strong inflation of the FIAT currencies which is happening right now and accelerating would also multiply the nominal value of Bitcoin over the years. If real inflation reaches more than 20%, which it will, we are looking more into 10 million USD per BTC in the best case scenario within 10-20 years.

But full adoption is not a certainty of course. However, even a 5% adoption can bring the value of bitcoin to 100 000 in the next few years.

100K and 1 mill are simply arbitrary values with no meaning without mathematics. I simply said 100K because OP was assuming that those with 10BTC or more would have at least 1 mill and I gave a scenario that I was fairly sure would suffice. I doubt anyone would be capable of actually estimating the value of Bitcoin given a specific number of people using it on a day to day basis. For all you and I know it could be 10 million.

I'd tend to disagree with that statement - it seems to be a bit exaggerated. Do you have any maths to actually suggest a USD$10million value in that timeframe?

[Beliathon]

This forum is full of future post-capitalists.

[MahaRamana]

Massive adoption by nearly everyone in most major economies would bring the price of Bitcoin to 1 million USD and more. I don't say it will happen, but if it happens, this is the kind of figure we are looking at. Not 100K.

Strong inflation of the FIAT currencies which is happening right now and accelerating would also multiply the nominal value of Bitcoin over the years. If real inflation reaches more than 20%, which it will, we are looking more into 10 million USD per BTC in the best case scenario within 10-20 years.

But full adoption is not a certainty of course. However, even a 5% adoption can bring the value of bitcoin to 100 000 in the next few years.

100K and 1 mill are simply arbitrary values with no meaning without mathematics. I simply said 100K because OP was assuming that those with 10BTC or more would have at least 1 mill and I gave a scenario that I was fairly sure would suffice. I doubt anyone would be capable of actually estimating the value of Bitcoin given a specific number of people using it on a day to day basis. For all you and I know it could be 10 million.

I'd tend to disagree with that statement - it seems to be a bit exaggerated. Do you have any maths to actually suggest a USD$10million value in that timeframe?

The math is quite simple.

The Gross Global Product is a bit more than 50 trillions USD today. Let's take pessimistic views and let's assume the Gross Global Product to remain constant in real terms. If we assume a 20% real rate of inflation over the next 10 years, it would be 300 trillions USD in 10 years (USD would be worth 6 times less in real terms).

If BTC reaches full adoption (which is of course a very optimistic idea - and what does it mean exactly?), we can take a very conservative approach and estimate that the market cap would need to be about 50% of the annual gross global product, so 150 trillions USD.

If we assume that the total number of BTC in existence in 10 years will be around 15 millions, we have a very simple calculation : 150 trillion / 15 million = 10 million USD.

Of course these 10 millions would be worth "only" 1.67 million USD in today's real purchasing power.

But in such an optimistic scenario, I believe that the figure of 50% of the global GDP market cap would be too low. Most people would be keeping their wealth in BTC as opposed to FIAT, treasuries and stocks due to the real inflation. So we are looking more into a market cap of 200% of global GDP which would be 600 trillions USD in 10 years or 40 million USD per BTC.