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Author Topic: Bitcoinica charging interests (feb 13)  (Read 1817 times)
Transisto
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February 13, 2012, 06:48:45 PM
 #1

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Announcement: We have started paying out interest for currency account balances. We will only start settling "swaps" for BTC/USD positions after February 16, 2012 - 00:00:00 UTC.
https://www.bitcoinica.com/pages/interest

Does this rate (long / short) expected to change often ?

What is Dayly PIP ? APY ?

How am I affected having a 10 000$ long BTC position ?

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eldentyrell
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February 14, 2012, 05:04:41 AM
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I must be reading this wrong.  It sounds like they will pay you ~13% interest to store your USD with them (either with no position or else BTC short but you offset it with a long on MtGox).

That is about 10x above the risk-free rate, so there must be hidden risk here...

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February 14, 2012, 05:28:34 AM
 #3

I must be reading this wrong.  It sounds like they will pay you ~13% interest to store your USD with them (either with no position or else BTC short but you offset it with a long on MtGox).

That is about 10x above the risk-free rate, so there must be hidden risk here...
They are using it to fund their "No Reserve" habit.

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February 15, 2012, 11:02:29 PM
 #4

I must be reading this wrong.  It sounds like they will pay you ~13% interest to store your USD with them (either with no position or else BTC short but you offset it with a long on MtGox).

That is about 10x above the risk-free rate, so there must be hidden risk here...
They are using it to fund their "No Reserve" habit.

And WTF is their excuse for having spreads in the interest rates?  If the goal is to give people an incentive to store whichever kind of currency they're short of (USD right now), a zero-spread interest rate would achieve that.  Having the "buy USD" and "sell USD" rates be different is just pure greed.

The printing press heralded the end of the Dark Ages and made the Enlightenment possible, but it took another three centuries before any country managed to put freedom of the press beyond the reach of legislators.  So it may take a while before cryptocurrencies are free of the AML-NSA-KYC surveillance plague.
Transisto
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February 15, 2012, 11:05:39 PM
 #5

They shouldn't charge interest on existing positions.

  It look like they're breaching the contract mid term to me.
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February 15, 2012, 11:06:32 PM
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And WTF is their excuse for having spreads in the interest rates?  If the goal is to give people an incentive to store whichever kind of currency they're short of (USD right now), a zero-spread interest rate would achieve that.  Having the "buy USD" and "sell USD" rates be different is just pure greed.

Z doesn't need an excuse, he simply can do it.
We need some competition here.

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February 15, 2012, 11:21:05 PM
 #7

They shouldn't charge interest on pre-interest positions.

  It look like they're breaching the contract mid term to me.

They give you until the 16th to close your position without interest.  Also, what contract?  Any contract you think you have is assumed.

https://www.bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
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Transisto
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February 15, 2012, 11:57:36 PM
 #8

They shouldn't charge interest on pre-interest positions.

  It look like they're breaching the contract mid term to me.

They give you until the 16th to close your position without interest.  Also, what contract?  Any contract you think you have is assumed.
The previous terms were : You can keep this position for as long as you want unless it drop by x%, no interest,
The new term is : Lose on your position right now or lose anyway later with interests.

When I entered into this position their reserve was scarce so I agreed to pay this premium as part of the risk.

This is unethical weather there was an actual contract or not.
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February 16, 2012, 01:28:20 AM
 #9

This is unethical weather there was an actual contract or not.
This is the wild wild west. Everything is sold as-is without any warranty.  Sorry if you don't like the new system, but you are free to leave.
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February 16, 2012, 02:13:14 AM
 #10

This is unethical weather there was an actual contract or not.
This is the wild wild west. Everything is sold as-is without any warranty.  Sorry if you don't like the new system, but you are free to leave.
+1

https://www.bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
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Transisto
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February 16, 2012, 05:33:17 AM
 #11

This is unethical weather there was an actual contract or not.
This is the wild wild west. Everything is sold as-is without any warranty.  Sorry if you don't like the new system, but you are free to leave.

Wild west financial institution ?  ... I want my BTC back, all.
notme
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February 16, 2012, 05:44:57 AM
 #12

This is unethical weather there was an actual contract or not.
This is the wild wild west. Everything is sold as-is without any warranty.  Sorry if you don't like the new system, but you are free to leave.

Wild west financial institution ?  ... I want my BTC back, all.

https://www.bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
While no idea is perfect, some ideas are useful.
12jh3odyAAaR2XedPKZNCR4X4sebuotQzN
tonto
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February 20, 2012, 10:54:00 PM
 #13

Can someone dumb this down to the layperson? Smiley
 
I just deposited a small amount since I saw they paid interest.  Was I mistaken?  I don't plan on doing any trading, just wanted to have it sit there and collect interest. 
 
But I'll withdraw if I misunderstood this, or if I will end up being charged..

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Transisto
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February 20, 2012, 11:36:55 PM
 #14

I have no idea if it is even implemented yet,  I have not received a single email about it on any of my accounts.

As if it is mandatory to log into the website or read the forum to get informed that they've changed the rules.

I have looked everywhere I see no places when I can see interests being paid-out,  maybe if I had a round number of bitcoin I'd have noticed.
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February 21, 2012, 05:02:05 PM
 #15

Well I'll find out in approx 9-11 days... I calculated that's when I'll get .01 worth of interest.  Smiley


(er, assuming I'm using the correct formula for compound interest) Smiley



I totally had the wrong formula.  I'll find out in 4 months with my current deposit. Smiley

(can someone post a stupid formula that I can plug into Excel??)

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zhoutong
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February 21, 2012, 07:09:49 PM
 #16

Well I'll find out in approx 9-11 days... I calculated that's when I'll get .01 worth of interest.  Smiley


(er, assuming I'm using the correct formula for compound interest) Smiley



I totally had the wrong formula.  I'll find out in 4 months with my current deposit. Smiley

(can someone post a stupid formula that I can plug into Excel??)

There's no compound for unpaid interest. The current interest rate for Bitcoin deposit is 0.55. So if you have ฿1, you will be paid ฿0.000055 every day. Then it's going to take about 200 days to make the first 0.01.

If you have ฿100, you'll receive an interest payment approximately every 2 days based on current rate.

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February 21, 2012, 07:26:38 PM
 #17

ok, I get it now.  Thanks for the reply. Smiley

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