Solution to poverty - Socialism or Capitalism?

[twiifm]

30 dollars a month a lot? how can you survive?

Prices are usually adapted to the different realities...

Not when economies are globally connected.  A Toyota car or a Samsung phone costs about the same regardless of the market.  

Let me see how much you require a Toyota or a Samsung to survive...
hmmm...
...
Got it!
0.00%

But like I said early, "poverty" has a very wide meaning.

Id like to see you live on $30 a month even in the poorest country and tell us if its fine because prices adapt.

Seems like you've never been to poor country before

You are the worst caricature of the privileged white male

[BCEmporium]

You like to assume a lot...
Prices of food, water and housing are adapted to each reality. A Toyota and Samsung are needless piles of junk we somehow are lured into value. Believing that a Toyota and a Samsung is needed and assuming I'm white makes you the caricature you are talking about.

And for the notice I'd been and lived on really poor countries... to see people that somehow were happy without a Toyota and a Samsung... and happier than many people I know with a Toyota or other brand and a Samsung or even iPhone.

[wasserman99]

30 dollars a month a lot? how can you survive?

Prices are usually adapted to the different realities...

Not when economies are globally connected.  A Toyota car or a Samsung phone costs about the same regardless of the market. 

The prices of the same goods are generally the same across economies, with some adjustments with different costs of labor, transportation, and the like. The reason people can survive on very little money in third world countries is because their standard of living is so low. Most people in third world countries do not have a car and those that do are generally decades old. Smart phones are several generations old and people will not use the latest and greatest models of phones. The quality of food is lower as well.

[BCEmporium]

The quality quantity of food is lower as well.

Fixed! You have excellent dishes for low budget on those countries with quality excelling all McDonalds and other junk food Westerns fill up with.

[twiifm]

You like to assume a lot...
Prices of food, water and housing are adapted to each reality. A Toyota and Samsung are needless piles of junk we somehow are lured into value. Believing that a Toyota and a Samsung is needed and assuming I'm white makes you the caricature you are talking about.

And for the notice I'd been and lived on really poor countries... to see people that somehow were happy without a Toyota and a Samsung... and happier than many people I know with a Toyota or other brand and a Samsung or even iPhone.

The point is prices dont adjust because of locality especially when producers are foreign

I didn't say people are happier if they own a phone or a car.  Im saying things like personal transportation and telephony can be a prerequisite to starting business.  Because the huge gap of cost between these things and the local wages these people have no choice but to sell their labor for cheap because barrier to entry is too high to start a business. 

Youre idea that $30 per month shouldnt be considered poverty if the median income is nonsense and ignores economic realties.  

[BCEmporium]

I never said 30 USD shouldn't be considered poverty... but on some regions can actually do the basic living with it.
I said poverty is relative and has a broad meaning. I see way too many people, outside the 3rd World mostly, complaint about poverty when the last thing a normal person would call them is "poor". Sort of "I can't buy a iPhone 6 so I'm poor" kind of mindset.

[twiifm]

I never said 30 USD shouldn't be considered poverty... but on some regions can actually do the basic living with it.
I said poverty is relative and has a broad meaning. I see way too many people, outside the 3rd World mostly, complaint about poverty when the last thing a normal person would call them is "poor". Sort of "I can't buy a iPhone 6 so I'm poor" kind of mindset.

Strawman about iphones

The official  poverty line is those who earn less than $1.25 a day.  .  regardless if people can get by on this they are considered poor

And no, most prices dont adapt only cost of labor.  If products are foreign the prices are same

[BCEmporium]

$1.25/day back in 1930 inside USofA would mean a good wage... nowadays under $10/day at US means you're damn poor, $5/day you're probably homeless. At Indonesia you won't be rich or anything near it, but at least you will be able to keep a life.
Set it against a fiat value is senseless!

Global market goods aren't essential, many can choose to opt them out without significant lifestyle loss, or no loss at all.
To keep this up, help on stop Monsanto. That can be a disaster, by removing differences within essential goods without level wages.

[Bonam]

Hey everyone. In today's developed world where we have glasses that can access the internet and robots that can think on their own, it is a shame that there are still people in parts of the world living under 1$ a day.
What can governments do to end poverty in their countries? Is a solution possible under capitalism? Or did Karl Marx had the right idea with his recommendation of a socialist government?

Capitalism creates wealth. Socialism redistributes it.

To lift people's standards of living, new wealth must be created. Therefore, capitalism is required. In pure capitalism, the rewards tend to concentrate in the hands of a few. A touch of socialism (i.e. progressive income tax, estate tax, and social programs, as presently exist in most Western nations) redistributes the wealth enough to allow everyone a chance. All Western nations use economies that are a mixture of capitalism (free private enterprise) and socialism (government taxes and programs), therefore we are largely on the right track. Most economic political debates focus on where on the spectrum a society should be, with usually the furthest left and furthest right positions still remarkably close together on the spectrum.

[gts476]

30 dollars a month a lot? how can you survive?

Prices are usually adapted to the different realities...

Not when economies are globally connected.  A Toyota car or a Samsung phone costs about the same regardless of the market.  

Let me see how much you require a Toyota or a Samsung to survive...
hmmm...
...
Got it!
0.00%

But like I said early, "poverty" has a very wide meaning.

Id like to see you live on $30 a month even in the poorest country and tell us if its fine because prices adapt.

Seems like you've never been to poor country before

You are the worst caricature of the privileged white male

In a free market if you earn only $30 dollar a month its because your worth $30 a month. You are literally fucking useless and what you can do is so useless that someone will only pay you $30, wow. Find a way to be more useful or STFU.

Know why people earn more than you? Because what they do is more useful and more valuable.

Want more money? DO SOMETHING MORE USEFUL! BECOME MORE SKILLED! or stfu.

[BCEmporium]

In a free market if you earn only $30 dollar a month its because your worth $30 a month. You are literally fucking useless and what you can do is so useless that someone will only pay you $30, wow. Find a way to be more useful or STFU.

Know why people earn more than you? Because what they do is more useful and more valuable.

Want more money? DO SOMETHING MORE USEFUL! BECOME MORE SKILLED! or stfu.

You know things aren't that linear! If a corporate can threat the region with unemployment they will exploit the locals as far as they can. Even if what they do worth millions they will always try to pay for the lowest bid.
I see many uneducated good for nothing being well paid at Europe, and many skilled workers at Asia being overexploited.

[twiifm]

Hey everyone. In today's developed world where we have glasses that can access the internet and robots that can think on their own, it is a shame that there are still people in parts of the world living under 1$ a day.
What can governments do to end poverty in their countries? Is a solution possible under capitalism? Or did Karl Marx had the right idea with his recommendation of a socialist government?

Capitalism creates wealth. Socialism redistributes it.

To lift people's standards of living, new wealth must be created. Therefore, capitalism is required. In pure capitalism, the rewards tend to concentrate in the hands of a few. A touch of socialism (i.e. progressive income tax, estate tax, and social programs, as presently exist in most Western nations) redistributes the wealth enough to allow everyone a chance. All Western nations use economies that are a mixture of capitalism (free private enterprise) and socialism (government taxes and programs), therefore we are largely on the right track. Most economic political debates focus on where on the spectrum a society should be, with usually the furthest left and furthest right positions still remarkably close together on the spectrum.

Best answer so far

[gts476]

In a free market if you earn only $30 dollar a month its because your worth $30 a month. You are literally fucking useless and what you can do is so useless that someone will only pay you $30, wow. Find a way to be more useful or STFU.

Know why people earn more than you? Because what they do is more useful and more valuable.

Want more money? DO SOMETHING MORE USEFUL! BECOME MORE SKILLED! or stfu.

You know things aren't that linear! If a corporate can threat the region with unemployment they will exploit the locals as far as they can. Even if what they do worth millions they will always try to pay for the lowest bid.
I see many uneducated good for nothing being well paid at Europe, and many skilled workers at Asia being overexploited.

Free market? Then you agreed to work for $30 a month.

Non free market? Then its socialism/communism/fascism and your just an animal being farmed by your government.

In a free market you agreed to work for $30 because your worth $30.

More uneducated good for nothing in the EU? EU is not a free market, it is socialist as fuck.

Many in Asia exploited? Where? China? Communist, not free market.

[gts476]

Here is some more graphic's of welfare spending vs poverty

[gts476]

The solution that will end poverty is to abandon the money-market system and in its stead create a resource based economy that at its heart serves technological progress.

Put differently, to answer the OP, the answer is "neither".  

Techno Communism is still communism mate.

[gts476]

1 more graph for the socialists and communists to choke on

[giantdragon]

Capitalism creates wealth. Socialism redistributes it.
To lift people's standards of living, new wealth must be created. Therefore, capitalism is required.

Absolutely FALSE for the true socialism (with planned economy)! USSR had created a lot of wealth without market economy.

[BCEmporium]

"Free markets" will always need some sort of regulation, unless you want to destroy the planet for greed... because there will always be an idiot who thinks nobody will miss one tree less.

[twiifm]

Capitalism creates wealth. Socialism redistributes it.
To lift people's standards of living, new wealth must be created. Therefore, capitalism is required.

Absolutely FALSE for the true socialism (with planned economy)! USSR had created a lot of wealth without market economy.

What?  USSR collapsed

[giantdragon]

What?  USSR collapsed

I meant during its existence.