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Author Topic: The Bitcoin Community at its Worst  (Read 2969 times)
SecureErase
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June 09, 2014, 06:09:30 AM
 #1

Is it safe to come out again?

I say this because on Sunday we saw the very worst of the so called 'Bitcoin Community' (apologies to most on this forum as probably the silent majority also watched) on both this forum and Reddit where literally hundreds of vitriolic, aggressive, threatening etc posts / conversations were sprayed out left right and center attacking the CEX.IO / GHash.IO entity, including death and violence threats to owners / users of that service.

It was totally pathetic and to me it showed one very good reason why Bitcoin has a lot of growing up to do. No, not because of the 51% issue (yes that does need to be addressed, but by the industry participants / guardians of the Bitcoin protocol themselves collaboratively) but because of the type of poisonous rhetoric that came forth over the past day or so. Just imagine a newbie to crypto currency having a look at this new opportunity doing a bit of research on the so called informative forums to be presented with the type of crap that was seen. They would quickly retreat back to the 'Yeh Mt.Gox and angry trolls is what Bitcoin is all about to me'

How can we have an industry grow and encourage innovation and expect mainstream uptake when companies that offer services people want to use get attacked and vilified because they are doing a good job and attracting customers over and above their competitors. Lets all attack Intel they have too many processors in the computer ecosystem, lets all attack Apple they have far too many mobile phones in the mobile ecosystem.

So for me, Bitcoin Community needs to learn a lesson from this and look at a way of collaboratively addressing the underlying issue.


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June 09, 2014, 06:32:23 AM
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Bitcoin has in its community millions people, among the adopters there is a moltitude of individual's types, scammers / trusted / theft / others, Sunday you have seen the worst part.

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Ron~Popeil
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June 09, 2014, 06:33:02 AM
 #3

Is it safe to come out again?

I say this because on Sunday we saw the very worst of the so called 'Bitcoin Community' (apologies to most on this forum as probably the silent majority also watched) on both this forum and Reddit where literally hundreds of vitriolic, aggressive, threatening etc posts / conversations were sprayed out left right and center attacking the CEX.IO / GHash.IO entity, including death and violence threats to owners / users of that service.

It was totally pathetic and to me it showed one very good reason why Bitcoin has a lot of growing up to do. No, not because of the 51% issue (yes that does need to be addressed, but by the industry participants / guardians of the Bitcoin protocol themselves collaboratively) but because of the type of poisonous rhetoric that came forth over the past day or so. Just imagine a newbie to crypto currency having a look at this new opportunity doing a bit of research on the so called informative forums to be presented with the type of crap that was seen. They would quickly retreat back to the 'Yeh Mt.Gox and angry trolls is what Bitcoin is all about to me'

How can we have an industry grow and encourage innovation and expect mainstream uptake when companies that offer services people want to use get attacked and vilified because they are doing a good job and attracting customers over and above their competitors. Lets all attack Intel they have too many processors in the computer ecosystem, lets all attack Apple they have far too many mobile phones in the mobile ecosystem.

So for me, Bitcoin Community needs to learn a lesson from this and look at a way of collaboratively addressing the underlying issue.



Excellent post. The fear mongers screeching about this will scare many new users away. Of course as a community we pretty much treat new people like shit anyway for the most part.

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June 09, 2014, 07:11:35 AM
 #4

This isn't so much a Bitcoin-specific thing as it is an internet-in-general thing.  Mainstream internet is basically a teenager prone to tantrums and foul language.  Reddit in particular has never struck me as a significant source of sophistication and civil tongues. 

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June 09, 2014, 07:27:45 AM
 #5

reddit is hardly an example of community, look what they did with Doge, they basically kicked moolah out with their aggressiveness and censorship.

I don't use reddit. They lost me when they decided to censor peoples political beliefs.

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June 09, 2014, 07:33:03 AM
 #6

What posts? I barely noticed anything, mainly because I don't pay any attention to that kind of bullshit.

Honestly, we had the same rage about ASIC's awhile back if the longer term members remember, the reality is like with most 'board rage' over nothing it's about 20 people at most just spamming the shit out of the forums. It's only when you have thousands of people posting about it that you really need to worry.

Like with most rage surrounding Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies, most of it is unjustified, misinformed or just completely stupid, have faith in mathematics, not in emotions.
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June 09, 2014, 07:42:07 AM
 #7

There was no need to hurl all those expletives at GHash.io (they will ignore them anyway). They have already stated that they have no intention of reaching the 51% hash power.

Here is an excerpt from their press release, a few months ago:

GHash.IO does not have any intentions to execute a 51% attack… it could risk our investments in physical hardware and we see no benefit from having 51% stake in mining


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Justin00
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June 09, 2014, 07:46:42 AM
 #8

bitcoin brings out the worst of people, and the worst people.
alot of people who are jobless and need money.
nothing wrong with not having a job, but using this forum as your source of income... well that is another issue.
but yeah it has the potential to bring out degenerates who are here to scam and make a quick buck, or 10000000 bucks as has been the case with alot of scammers Sad

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June 09, 2014, 08:53:39 AM
 #9

In most part, your post is correct, but you have few errors that i would like to straight.

1) Yes, ppl are somethimes assholes. Well, truth be told, they are assholes most of the time. Whoever can't filter assholes from real stuff will have problem with anything online, not only BTC. I agree that BTC needs special kind of asshole / fud filter in place.
With that in mind, you should remember that 51% attack is direct attack on someones assets (your, mine, whoever has any BTC). It can render BTC useless or even kill it. So when threat appears that could damage so many, it's normaly that people that are assholes in their nature, go to turbo mode just to survive.
I wouldn't blame it on them (people) tho. 51% attack can be prevented on software side like some other alt coins. So basicly, what needs to be done, is to channel all that energy into improving BTC. making push on to devs to prevent 51% attack from evenr happening from software side.
What ghas.io situation is showing is that ASIC's are NOT good keepers of BTC network safety. Safety should be enforced on software side. Solutions are all around (some altoins), it's just question of will to implement them.
2) It's not Intel that has too many processors. It's ARM (google it, you'll find it really interesting).
3) Apple...really? Apple? No m8...again, it's Samsung. Apple lost it few years ago...it's Samsung now...
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June 09, 2014, 09:16:53 AM
 #10

Luckily I missed that little storm.

Since there have been no flames in the topic as of yet I reckon it's "safe" for now.


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June 09, 2014, 09:32:08 AM
 #11

@SecureErase Its normal buddy. When a million people are dealing with a Billion dollar economy, it is expected. Look, now as Ghash.io is down to 32% in last 24 hours and Bitcoin is trading below 650 USD, everything is so calm Smiley

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June 09, 2014, 09:36:33 AM
 #12

Yeah I missed it too. How big was this? I saw a post last night and commented - after all it is not for the good of the community that any pool have 51%.  The pool itself is compromising bitcoin by permitting this. That's not competition anymore.
Still, you've gotta love our community. We lash out sometimes, we have trolls to deal with other times, but hey - when I want a good opinion on bitcoin I come here and I know I'm gonna hear what people really think.
Even when I'm busy and I want to see if it is a good bitcoin day or a bad bitcoin day, I skim through the titles to see the general mood.
But yeah.. we should be nice to everybody.
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June 09, 2014, 09:52:36 AM
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What posts? I barely noticed anything, mainly because I don't pay any attention to that kind of bullshit.

Honestly, we had the same rage about ASIC's awhile back if the longer term members remember, the reality is like with most 'board rage' over nothing it's about 20 people at most just spamming the shit out of the forums. It's only when you have thousands of people posting about it that you really need to worry.

Like with most rage surrounding Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies, most of it is unjustified, misinformed or just completely stupid, have faith in mathematics, not in emotions.

That is right.No one should look at this so bad,it happends all the time.Few bad things,a lot of good things.
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June 09, 2014, 10:00:43 AM
 #14

Nothing to see here people, move along, move along.

Seems to be safe again  Wink

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June 09, 2014, 11:37:41 AM
 #15

The funny thing is that we are joining bitcoin because it's decentralized, but we still tend to prefer using the biggest exchange, the biggest pool, the biggest wallet. Etc

In essence we are centralizing a decentralized system by picking a favorite.

To truly keep bitcoin decentralized we should encourage competition. However to have competitors succeed the competitors should offer at least similar benefits than the most popular one, which can sometimes be hard.
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June 09, 2014, 11:55:15 AM
 #16

The funny thing is that we are joining bitcoin because it's decentralized, but we still tend to prefer using the biggest exchange, the biggest pool, the biggest wallet. Etc

In essence we are centralizing a decentralized system by picking a favorite.

To truly keep bitcoin decentralized we should encourage competition. However to have competitors succeed the competitors should offer at least similar benefits than the most popular one, which can sometimes be hard.
+1
and thats why a true bitcoiner SHOULD complain when something is at risk of being centralised and controlled.

sitting back and letting things happen should be kept for the FIAT sheeple. although i never thought ghash had any intentions of doing anything nasty if/when they reach atleast 51% control, it should still be noted that we need to keep the network split apart between many pools.

and as a personal note although i seen not that many actually insult ghash the other day i do like and find very amusing how the OP himself whinges about others whinging. and insults others for insulting. which makes himself part of his own problem.

the problem in is eyes is that we are all individuals, with our own opinions and own self control not paid PR staff with a single agenda.. which to me is the solution, not the problem

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June 09, 2014, 12:42:26 PM
 #17

The funny thing is that we are joining bitcoin because it's decentralized, but we still tend to prefer using the biggest exchange, the biggest pool, the biggest wallet. Etc

In essence we are centralizing a decentralized system by picking a favorite.

To truly keep bitcoin decentralized we should encourage competition. However to have competitors succeed the competitors should offer at least similar benefits than the most popular one, which can sometimes be hard.

Bingo!
They say history repeats itself. Left to our utmost freedom we end up centralizing, We end up pushing the difficulty higher and higher because WE want to have the fastest miner, and it's a matter of time before we have bitcoin banks.

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June 09, 2014, 02:17:52 PM
 #18

The funny thing is that we are joining bitcoin because it's decentralized, but we still tend to prefer using the biggest exchange, the biggest pool, the biggest wallet. Etc

In essence we are centralizing a decentralized system by picking a favorite.

To truly keep bitcoin decentralized we should encourage competition. However to have competitors succeed the competitors should offer at least similar benefits than the most popular one, which can sometimes be hard.
+1
and thats why a true bitcoiner SHOULD complain when something is at risk of being centralised and controlled.

sitting back and letting things happen should be kept for the FIAT sheeple. although i never thought ghash had any intentions of doing anything nasty if/when they reach atleast 51% control, it should still be noted that we need to keep the network split apart between many pools.

and as a personal note although i seen not that many actually insult ghash the other day i do like and find very amusing how the OP himself whinges about others whinging. and insults others for insulting. which makes himself part of his own problem.

the problem in is eyes is that we are all individuals, with our own opinions and own self control not paid PR staff with a single agenda.. which to me is the solution, not the problem

this thread is over now.

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June 09, 2014, 02:36:29 PM
 #19

The reason the rhetoric became so barbaric and horrifying is because in capitalism, most people value money more than they value life (human included).

I saw the same thing happen in the physical world of my community (NYC) during the last gas crisis. People threatening each other, fist fights, one guy even pulled a gun on someone at a gas station.

If humanity is going to survive the 21st century, we need to abandon all violence and instead turn to reason to solve our problems. Like it or not, that means moving beyond capitalism and the nation-state, both of which rely on systemic, hierarchical violence to exist. Remember, our world is a zero-sum game between reason and violence. As one increases, the other diminishes.

Let's choose reason - let's choose life, fellow humans. Humanity can do better than war. Humanity can do better than poverty and starvation. Humanity can do better than capitalism.

Related: How much is a life worth?
Related: Sunset of the State
Related: The Long Reach of Reason
Related: Capitalism Hits the Fan
Related: The World Peace Game
Related: Alternative Economy Cultures

Remember Aaron Swartz, a 26 year old computer scientist who died defending the free flow of information.
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June 09, 2014, 02:47:40 PM
 #20

Human nature evolved to be what it is today so we could survive what our surroundings (other humans and rest of the nature) throws at us. It's nature's way (survival of the strongest) that make us do alot of things that we shouldnt do. It's our nature and it's hard to change (not saying that we cant or should not change, just saying that it's hard). But what we can easy do is change world around us, in this case BTC ecosystem. If BTC was to be changed to penalize big pools, or to reward p2p pools or something else, our biggest problem would be resolved.
There are so many good solutions to problems that BTC has, but noone cares to implement them.

Instead of "protecting network" with hardware, we should protect it with software. Instead of fixing problems caused by software, with software, we fix them with hardware etc. But hey...as long as hardware companys have as much influence on BTC development as they do have now, norhing will change. Humans will be humans.
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