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Question: If it was up to you would you pick that drugs be allowed to list at en.bitcoin.it?
Yes - 76 (55.9%)
No - 52 (38.2%)
Only some - 8 (5.9%)
Total Voters: 135

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Author Topic: Should drugs be listed at bitcoin.it?  (Read 14263 times)
chickenado
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April 29, 2011, 09:23:49 AM
 #61

Aren't we missing a few things?

1. Some things are inherently immoral, like eating humans organ transplants, having sexual intercourse with a sibling/parent menstruating woman, and using drugs doing extreme sports.

2. I never understood why libertarians, who think "liberty", whatever that means, is some sort of ultimate moral principle, support the manipulation of people into surrendering their liberty and free will to drug extreme sport addiction (or, in the case of hallucinogenics climbing Mount Everest, to a state of detachment from reality).

3. Using drugs extreme sports are not a victimless crime. This is especially pronounced with cigarettes motorcycles - Some people think they have the right to smoke ride their bike wherever they want and subject their surroundings to [noise pollution] and noxious, foul-smelling gases. Even laws restricting places speeds allowed for smoking motorbikes have so far proven ineffective against this. At one time I had the displeasure to work with someone who smoked marijuana training for a triathlon, when he came back from a smoking session rode his racing bike to work he smelled so bad my eyes watered. What about my liberty to enjoy clean air?

[oh you forgot to say that drugs extreme sports wreck families and carry a high risk of death and brain injury]

Quote
So, for these reasons, as well as the obvious negative consequences for the success of Bitcoin, drug dealers outdoor stores and motorbike dealers should not be advertised in any official site.


 Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes  *eye roll*


By they way, I think that alpaca socks are inherently immoral. I can't give you a rational explanation, but they just feel wrong somehow. Any human being with a sense of decency blah blah blah ... will agree with me.  So, alpaca socks should not be advertised.  
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caveden
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April 29, 2011, 09:32:30 AM
 #62

Holy-Fire, you shouldn't be frequenting these "inherently immoral forums". Delete your account, go to the nearest church to confess/purify and don't ever come back here. Your imaginary friend is watching you!

18rZYyWcafwD86xvLrfuxWG5xEMMWUtVkL
Meni Rosenfeld
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April 29, 2011, 09:36:04 AM
 #63

I don't know whether to laugh or cry.
Laugh, it's better for your health.

Those things clearly go against your morals, but there's nothing inherently wrong with any of them.
Do I also get to use the "it only goes against your morals" card when people talk about how government is evil, or for that matter, how stealing, enslaving, kidnapping, raping and murdering are (or are these ok too)?

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Prze_koles
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April 30, 2011, 09:29:47 AM
 #64

Quote
>>Quote Originally Posted by hazek View Post
>>Judge for yourself: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Trade

Well I did look at that before and that's where my questions came from. The link made me not want to do BitCoins. Because I have a concern there would be no products I like when I cash out, and because people are openly selling drugs and porn. I see it as a dangerous thing to even be in support of, much less involved in.

Quote from http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?289898-What-is-with-the-bitcoin-obsession/page2

I think drugs don't need advertisement. Have you ever seen drug advert in real life? But ppl still using it   Kiss

Alex Beckenham
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April 30, 2011, 10:47:53 AM
 #65

Those things clearly go against your morals, but there's nothing inherently wrong with any of them.
Do I also get to use the "it only goes against your morals" card when people talk about how government is evil, or for that matter, how stealing, enslaving, kidnapping, raping and murdering are (or are these ok too)?

Absolutely you can play that card. Those things are okay to some people.

thatsrightlol
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April 30, 2011, 11:45:34 AM
 #66

Quote
2. I never understood why libertarians, who think "liberty", whatever that means, is some sort of ultimate moral principle, support the manipulation of people into surrendering their liberty and free will to drug addiction (or, in the case of hallucinogenics climbing , to a state of detachment from reality).

I never understood why fascists support the manipulation of Christians into a religion that removes their free will, and entraps them in a state of perpetual detachment from reality. Actually I do understand it perfectly. They want LSD illegal because it lets people experience God for themselves (and he is much nicer and less fond of them than they make it out to be!), where as if they go to church the preacher will tell them about God and lie in such a way that he can manipulate them to the whims of the fascists and create a self perpetuating mind virus that allows for control of the masses. Taking LSD breaks those chains so it must be outlawed.
jamen
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April 30, 2011, 02:27:03 PM
 #67

to me, the question is: how much are we willing to compromise in order to make bitcoins popular?

It seems to me that almost everybody here agrees that governments have no business in regulating what substances a person can or cannot eat/chew/smoke/drink/etc... But still a lot of us agree on removing the drug listing from the wiki in order to not attract negative attention from people who have the opposite opinion about drugs.


I totally agree.

I believe there is no right or wrong answer in this case, as we are not debating if drugs should be illegal or not, we are debating whether listing drugs on the wiki is a good marketing strategy. It depends on who you are pitching to, if it's the average person then probably it is a good strategy but if it's towards govts or corporations, it will most likely deter them a little.

But the hard part is that bitcoins are fundamentaly free, open, unregulated etc, and that censorship is not compatible with the model. So censoring the wiki would go against the bitcoin ideals, but on the other hand it gives a small impression that btc are used by drug dealers and vigilantes etc.

I really don't think there is a correct answer in this case, it depends on what level you look at it from. That is my unbiased logical opinion.

Now my personal emotional opinion: I think some drugs could be listed especially those that are beneficial to our bodies (medicines etc) and also some that are more psychoactive, that I believe actually help us understand things better, but NOT cr*ck or crystalm*th...
 
xf2_org
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April 30, 2011, 02:40:55 PM
 #68

Listing drugs on the wiki is bad marketing, pure and simple.

It also implies that the entire bitcoin community endorses drugs, which is vehemently not true.

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April 30, 2011, 03:29:42 PM
 #69

Listing drugs on the wiki is bad marketing, pure and simple.

It also implies that the entire bitcoin community endorses drugs, which is vehemently not true.


Pure and simple? Can't argue with that. That's some serious air tight logic.
It implies nothing. It is simply a finger, pointing in the direction of a product. A product nobody is forcing anybody to buy.
BitterTea
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April 30, 2011, 04:25:31 PM
 #70

Listing drugs on the wiki is bad marketing, pure and simple.

It also implies that the entire bitcoin community endorses drugs, which is vehemently not true.

Wikipedia links to methods to synthesize illegal drugs. It implies that the entire internet community endorses drugs, which is vehemently not true.

 Roll Eyes
Jeffpod
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April 30, 2011, 04:56:15 PM
 #71

The only people who don't like drugs, are people who have never tried any form of the freeing release that many illegal drugs give.  Shocked
Prze_koles
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April 30, 2011, 05:00:20 PM
 #72

Guys, but look at my previous post. One guy on other forum didn't like the bitcoin idea because we have drugs and porn listed in wiki.

Meni Rosenfeld
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April 30, 2011, 05:07:59 PM
 #73

Those things clearly go against your morals, but there's nothing inherently wrong with any of them.
Do I also get to use the "it only goes against your morals" card when people talk about how government is evil, or for that matter, how stealing, enslaving, kidnapping, raping and murdering are (or are these ok too)?

Absolutely you can play that card. Those things are okay to some people.
Interesting.

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Alex Beckenham
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April 30, 2011, 05:21:23 PM
 #74

Those things clearly go against your morals, but there's nothing inherently wrong with any of them.
Do I also get to use the "it only goes against your morals" card when people talk about how government is evil, or for that matter, how stealing, enslaving, kidnapping, raping and murdering are (or are these ok too)?

Absolutely you can play that card. Those things are okay to some people.
Interesting.

Things don't magically have an inbuilt 'wrongness' factor. They're only wrong or right based on the perceptions of individual minds.

sortedmush
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April 30, 2011, 10:30:01 PM
 #75

Guys, but look at my previous post. One guy on other forum didn't like the bitcoin idea because we have drugs and porn listed in wiki.

OMFG! So what?

If this one guy on another forum doesn't want to use bitcoin because a wiki points in the direction of something he doesn't like, he's a fool. And when he realises that he missed the boat because his tiny puritan mind failed to accept that other people like the things he doesn't like, I hope he cries himself to sleep.
xf2_org
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May 01, 2011, 12:24:09 AM
 #76

In general, this is very selfish attitude.

If you think drugs should be legal, fine.

But it is self-evident that many people do not.

Bitcoin should be usable by the most conservative imam in Saudi Arabia, as well as the most libertarian, drug-seeking teenager on this forum.

BitterTea
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May 01, 2011, 12:44:07 AM
 #77

Bitcoin should be usable by the most conservative imam in Saudi Arabia, as well as the most libertarian, drug-seeking teenager on this forum.

You never miss an opportunity to call libertarians immature, do you?

If what you say is justification for banning links to drugs, then it also justification for banning links to porn, alcohol, religious objects, and just about anything else.
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May 01, 2011, 12:45:18 AM
 #78

In general, this is very selfish attitude.

If you think drugs should be legal, fine.

But it is self-evident that many people do not.

Bitcoin should be usable by the most conservative imam in Saudi Arabia, as well as the most libertarian, drug-seeking teenager on this forum.



^ Has obviously never been to hive or bluelight, where some of the most intelligent PHD chemists in the world trade tips on synthesis of extremely complex psychoactive drugs. Why is it that your idea of the average drug user is a teenager, when I know highly intelligent physicists, doctors, chemists, mathematicians, philosophers, programmers and more in their 20's, 30's and 40's who are the primary drug using group I talk with? Many of the drug users I know are brilliant individuals who most likely would put you to shame both in IQ and in number of years lived. I love when you idiots show your stereotypical thinking, how does it feel to be mind raped by the government?
oregreiogerjk
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May 01, 2011, 12:47:20 AM
 #79

I guess Alexander Shulgin is an immature teenager, despite being a PHD holding biochemist and the inventor (and first person to take!) hundreds of psychedelic drugs through out his life. I guess his entire crowd of friends who took drugs and wrote trip reports with him, you know intellectuals from academia backgrounds, are also all drug using teenagers.
ShadowOfHarbringer
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May 01, 2011, 12:54:55 AM
 #80

Bitcoin should be usable by the most conservative imam in Saudi Arabia

Logical inconsitency.

Dollars are used both for trading drugs all around the world and by conservative imams in Saudi Arabia (and most other islamic countries since oil can only be bought for dollars)...

All currencies can be used for both good and bad things. Using currency for "bad" things doesn't mean that the currency itself is bad.

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