I would supply my contact info to bitcoinica...

[ElectricMucus]

but not the Chinese government.

I guess many people feel the same way, but haven't spelled it out yet.
amirite?

To zhoutong: Have you explored possibilities to get bitcoinica under a jurisdiction where collecting personal information isn't required to that extent?

[marked]

and what makes you think the Chinese/Russian/US intelligence don't already have that information.

marked

[Matthew N. Wright]

Sorry OP. You lost me.

As a US citizen who needs to supply birth certificate, passport, criminal background check, etc just to get certain types of visas, green card or dual citizenship in South Korea, the idea of providing my personal information to another country in exchange for a privilege of a service or access to something is far from foreign.

I scan my retinas, my fingerprints, and my face everytime I leave this country and everytime I get into another. There is a method to the madness. For people who are busy creating, it's seen as a discomfort and inconvenience, nothing more.

[late443]

Sorry OP. You lost me.

As a US citizen who needs to supply birth certificate, passport, criminal background check, etc just to get certain types of visas, green card or dual citizenship in South Korea, the idea of providing my personal information to another country in exchange for a privilege of a service or access to something is far from foreign.

I scan my retinas, my fingerprints, and my face everytime I leave this country and everytime I get into another. There is a method to the madness. For people who are busy creating, it's seen as a discomfort and inconvenience, nothing more.

I have never had to scan my retinas,fingerprints, or face when I leave the country.
and as far as personal information being collected, sometimes its for the best as long as the user is aware of it.

[ElectricMucus]

Sorry OP. You lost me.

As a US citizen who needs to supply birth certificate, passport, criminal background check, etc just to get certain types of visas, green card or dual citizenship in South Korea, the idea of providing my personal information to another country in exchange for a privilege of a service or access to something is far from foreign.

I scan my retinas, my fingerprints, and my face everytime I leave this country and everytime I get into another. There is a method to the madness. For people who are busy creating, it's seen as a discomfort and inconvenience, nothing more.

As a citizen of an European country I guess I am somewhat "spoiled" in that regard. But even I have heard enough of the TSA controversy... as an example. They don't exactly honor your rights with that....

But this is bitcoin, part of it is about rights, privacy and it is systematically opposed to centralized control.
I smell a little hypocrisy in your argument.

and what makes you think the Chinese/Russian/US intelligence don't already have that information.

If they do they got it without my cooperation. That's my point.

[zhoutong]

but not the Chinese government.

I guess many people feel the same way, but haven't spelled it out yet.
amirite?

To zhoutong: Have you explored possibilities to get bitcoinica under a jurisdiction where collecting personal information isn't required to that extent?

What makes you think that the Chinese government is concerning about your personal information?

As a Chinese citizen, I'm sure that even though the government is hard to deal with sometimes, it is one of the least troublesome ones in the financial world. I'm able to buy/sell gold and silver and put them in my bank savings account online and I've never heard of anyone close got investigated for money laundering because of weird transactions.

Of course, incorporating in China isn't an option. I'm not interested in doing this either.

[ineededausername]

electricmucus, you're back

[zhoutong]

FYI,

I voted "Yes".

[ElectricMucus]

What makes you think that the Chinese government is concerning about your personal information?

As a Chinese citizen, I'm sure that even though the government is hard to deal with sometimes, it is one of the least troublesome ones in the financial world. I'm able to buy/sell gold and silver and put them in my bank savings account online and I've never heard of anyone close got investigated for money laundering because of weird transactions.

Of course, incorporating in China isn't an option. I'm not interested in doing this either.

Let me be more specific:

My main concern isn't that your government does know who I am and where I live, in principle although I still prefer it doesn't. Mine does, for me that I have to accept and if they want that information they can probably transfer that information.

It is that very specific information is associated with the identification, every information stored on the bitcoinica servers which is bad on it's own but also my ip address and so every other of my online activity which is (supposedly and partly admittedly) monitored. And since I don't know how much information exchange takes place between different governments in the worst case all my online activity could be associated to my name and my address, and that in a officially documented (pun intended) way.

Furthermore I don't discriminate here, I don't want my government (or any other one) to know what I do with my money either, I know sometimes they (probably) still do but not in this fashion and not with the prospect of being associated with a specific group, in the form of a honeypot. My guess is governments don't discriminate either, in how they are regarding us.

@ineededausername, probably, I guess I moved on prematurely  

[Stephen Gornick]

I'm able to buy/sell gold and silver and put them in my bank savings account online

I don't intend to hijack this thread but that statement is interesting to me.  Are you saying that in China there are gold-denominated bank accounts?

[zhoutong]

I'm able to buy/sell gold and silver and put them in my bank savings account online

I don't intend to hijack this thread but that statement is interesting to me.  Are you saying that in China there are gold-denominated bank accounts?

Yes, my ICBC bank account supports Chinese Yuan, USD, AUD, SGD and gold ounce.

[stochastic]

but not the Chinese government.

I guess many people feel the same way, but haven't spelled it out yet.
amirite?

To zhoutong: Have you explored possibilities to get bitcoinica under a jurisdiction where collecting personal information isn't required to that extent?

Are you kidding?  Do you think China would look at the paperwork?  Every time I go to China there are two lines to follow when going through Chinese customs.  One green line for no declarations and a red line is for declarations.  There is no point in going to declare any items because the line just ends up in the no-declaration line anyway.

As long as someone doesn't endanger the thugs that run that country, a person can do whatever they want.

[Stephen Gornick]

Yes, my ICBC bank account supports Chinese Yuan, USD, AUD, SGD and gold ounce.

I see now.   If I understand it correctly, either the bank is selling the "paper gold" from a fund to you directly, or you are transferring the PM funds from an exchange to your bank account. 

I was thinking it might be some type of funds transfer system denominated in gold.   (Well it might be, but only between the exchange and your bank.)
 - http://www.icbc.com.cn/ICBC/E-banking/PersonalEbankingService/WealthManagement/GoldTrade/PreciousMetalAccount/

[pastory99]

It really doesn't make a difference whether they do or don't tbh.

[Bigpiggy01]

Agricultural Bank of China is supposedly launching physical accounts as well.

However if they're going to be available outside the PRC remains to be seen.