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August 05, 2010, 08:08:11 PM
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sgtstein
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August 05, 2010, 08:20:09 PM
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Oh boy, that will make it fun  Roll Eyes  Well, hopefully I can generate a block within the next 2 months now. Sheesh.

But, with it going up it's a good thing. More CPU power to try and take over.
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August 05, 2010, 08:45:09 PM
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 Undecided
Sadly this will make it even harder to get new people in, if they don't actually see any progress in the first few weeks/months of "usage".
Guess most testers wont stay long enough to generate anything.


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August 05, 2010, 08:47:21 PM
 #4

Oh boy, that will make it fun  Roll Eyes  Well, hopefully I can generate a block within the next 2 months now. Sheesh.

But, with it going up it's a good thing. More CPU power to try and take over.

Or it means someone is actively taking over ;-)

Undecided
Sadly this will make it even harder to get new people in, if they don't actually see any progress in the first few weeks/months of "usage".
Guess most testers wont stay long enough to generate anything.

IMO that's good news.  It shifts the emphasis over to adding value to the currency, rather than minting.

Jeff Garzik, bitcoin core dev team and BitPay engineer; opinions are my own, not my employer.
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BitLex
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August 05, 2010, 08:50:35 PM
 #5

IMO that's good news.  It shifts the emphasis over to adding value to the currency, rather than minting.
If you ask me, it's way to early.
We only got a few thousand users and almost nothing to "buy" for coins, why would someone want to "add value" to it?

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August 05, 2010, 09:48:47 PM
 #6

IMO that's good news.  It shifts the emphasis over to adding value to the currency, rather than minting.
If you ask me, it's way to early.
We only got a few thousand users and almost nothing to "buy" for coins, why would someone want to "add value" to it?
Way more than a few thousand I believe. I just shutdown a server farm last month of 300+ machines and the difficulty continues to climb, so there are a lot more people using it than what we see reflected at the forums here. If you run a supernode (not recommend unless you have gobs of CPU and bandwidth), you'll get a glimpse of how many machines are out there with the client running, my last count was 3,700 on one of mine.

BitLex
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August 05, 2010, 09:56:21 PM
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IMO that's good news.  It shifts the emphasis over to adding value to the currency, rather than minting.
If you ask me, it's way to early.
We only got a few thousand users and almost nothing to "buy" for coins, why would someone want to "add value" to it?
Way more than a few thousand I believe. I just shutdown a server farm last month of 300+ machines and the difficulty continues to climb, so there are a lot more people using it than what we see reflected at the forums here. If you run a supernode (not recommend unless you have gobs of CPU and bandwidth), you'll get a glimpse of how many machines are out there with the client running, my last count was 3,700 on one of mine.
Sure, that's running machines, but not users.  Wink

My point is, as long as we dont see some more stuff sold for bitcoins, there's almost no other reason to "use" bitcoin but to generate coins (to sell and make money of it and buy the stuff they want) for new users.
So far it's just a cute crypto-communities baby, that noone out there cares about, except for those crypto-freaks and wanna-be-anonyms.
If we want to beat PayPal, we need a whole lot more users,
but why should they use bitcoin instead of PayPal, if they need to use PayPal to buy bitcoins anyway and cant buy the stuff they want for bitcoins but for PayPal?

kiba
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August 05, 2010, 10:05:58 PM
 #8

Sure, that's running machines, but not users.  Wink

My point is, as long as we dont see some more stuff sold for bitcoins, there's almost no other reason to "use" bitcoin but to generate coins (to sell and make money of it and buy the stuff they want) for new users.
So far it's just a cute crypto-communities baby, that noone out there cares about, except for those crypto-freaks and wanna-be-anonyms.
If we want to beat PayPal, we need a whole lot more users,
but why should they use bitcoin instead of PayPal, if they need to use PayPal to buy bitcoins anyway and cant buy the stuff they want for bitcoins but for PayPal?

Pre-paid bitcoin cards that people can buy from others, circulate on the local market, etc?

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August 05, 2010, 10:17:54 PM
 #9

Pre-paid bitcoin cards that people can buy from others, circulate on the local market, etc?
Not sure if i get that right,
like to buy pizza and cigs with your coin-card?
No.

You don't buy stuff on your local market for PayPal (or other virtual currencies), do you?
But you do online. There's not much choice if you want to buy with bitcoins.
You have to check this site to see what's available and if your lucky, you get something, prolly not what you are looking for.
So why use it?

kiba
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August 05, 2010, 10:51:47 PM
 #10

Pre-paid bitcoin cards that people can buy from others, circulate on the local market, etc?
Not sure if i get that right,
like to buy pizza and cigs with your coin-card?
No.

You don't buy stuff on your local market for PayPal (or other virtual currencies), do you?
But you do online. There's not much choice if you want to buy with bitcoins.
You have to check this site to see what's available and if your lucky, you get something, prolly not what you are looking for.
So why use it?

What I mean is that these bitcoin cards are credits for you to claim your bitcoins. You could basically enter whatever serial numbers...and it will either direct you to a wallet or send you money to your wallet.

BitLex
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August 05, 2010, 10:51:53 PM
 #11

Should have mentioned in my first post, but everyone remember, during this last change, 0.3.6 came out and doubled the hashing rate... so that really just reflects the increase in efficiency of the new version.
True, still 2weeks+ to generate something on an average-users desktop (to finally notice: "it works!", or "damn, no luck and next diff.upgrade")
is way to much for most people. Those i know are not that patient, are you?
And still, what for, if theres nothing todo with those coins besides get-your-energy-costs-back by selling them on the market?

What do you tell people to MAKE THEM USE bitcoins?
Why should they download and install?
They want to buy stuff, but there isnt any.
They want to "make money", but they got no server-farm to spare.
What other reasons are there to use a system like this?

I for myself just do it to support the system, nothing else.
I havent bought anything so far and i'm not planning to in the near future (except a lot more onlineshops and isps accept them)
and i'm not making any profit of it, so far it just costs me, but i dont care, it's kinda fun and might even work (or be worth the effort) someday, so i wanna be part of it.

But I'm not the average guy or girl that just wants to buy stuff online, if i were, i wouldnt use bitcoins at all, i'd just use PayPal, or moneybookers, or my CC.
Oh wait, i'm average, i do exactly that, why don't i buy stuff with bitcoins?

knightmb
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August 05, 2010, 11:02:49 PM
 #12

Should have mentioned in my first post, but everyone remember, during this last change, 0.3.6 came out and doubled the hashing rate... so that really just reflects the increase in efficiency of the new version.
A very good point, I hadn't thought of that. So if that's true, everyone should generate at about the same rate they did before since the bar was raised for everyone by everyone?

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August 06, 2010, 08:40:35 AM
 #13

I just checked the block averages, since the bump up in difficulty the average has actually be lowered to about the 6/hour target now (where as before it seem to be 10/hour and the difficulty was always climbing)

Seeing how the new client is a lot faster now, seems the difficulty finally caught up with the CPU power out there. I wonder if the difficulty will go again in the next week or so.  Lips sealed

joechip
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August 09, 2010, 02:26:32 PM
 #14

Should have mentioned in my first post, but everyone remember, during this last change, 0.3.6 came out and doubled the hashing rate... so that really just reflects the increase in efficiency of the new version.

That means that the net difficulty actually dropped back to a normalized 176, from 244.  Generation rates should then improve.

Ta,
lfm
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August 09, 2010, 04:36:51 PM
 #15

Here is a new plot of the difficulty since the start:



note the log vertical axis, don't be misled, the recent increases are bigger than they may look.
mizerydearia
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August 10, 2010, 06:25:05 AM
 #16

Just bumped up from what was it, 244?

List of difficulties: http://nullvoid.org/bitcoin/difficultiez.php
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August 10, 2010, 11:15:58 AM
 #17


What do you tell people to MAKE THEM USE bitcoins?
Why should they download and install?


Just present the people an easy and convenient way to vote with their bitcoins for
forum posts, or blog comments, etc.
I mean, there should be a lot of software in the form of plugins and libraries for
the most popular social networking software packages, that allow any administrator
to integrate Bitcoin vote system into his site.
People will spend bitcoins just for fun, raising the demand for them.

How about sponsoring some experienced marketer to promote the system further.
I'll send my bitcoins to whatever address you present me on this forum for such purpose.
Surely!
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