pallas
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Activity: 2716
Merit: 1094
Black Belt Developer
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November 19, 2014, 01:36:09 PM |
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blah blah
let's see this working and then we'll compare it to "legacy" systems.
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ohad
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November 19, 2014, 01:39:08 PM |
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service, marketability, market presence...ect.
can you pinpoint something? from what you say generally, there is no justification at all for decentralized systems. |
Tau-Chain & Agoras
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ohad
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November 19, 2014, 01:40:15 PM
Last edit: November 19, 2014, 01:56:37 PM by ohad |
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blah blah
let's see this working and then we'll compare it to "legacy" systems.
ahh those jealous guys.. you tried to design such a system and failed? EDIT: i thought you talked about zennet rather ItsNotMe. apologies |
Tau-Chain & Agoras
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ItsNotMe
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November 19, 2014, 01:44:25 PM |
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service, marketability, market presence...ect.
can you pinpoint something? from what you say generally, there is no justification at all for decentralized systems. I pinpointed three for you... Service to users. Tech support of the of the product. Making potential users aware of the product. These are huge needs to a system you are proposing. A decentralized system does not work better in this use case. |
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ohad
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November 19, 2014, 01:49:50 PM |
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service, marketability, market presence...ect.
can you pinpoint something? from what you say generally, there is no justification at all for decentralized systems. I pinpointed three for you... Service to users. Tech support of the of the product. Making potential users aware of the product. companies can give services over decentralized systems and charge their clients. the product is open source, and a the money is used to develop and support the product. like in the open source world, you know. being aware is a bit more easy: each PC holder getting free money wouldn't stay a secret for long. These are huge needs to a system you are proposing. A decentralized system does not work better in this use case.
poinpoint. why decentralized system won't work better on this use case? it's also needed to say zennet is not 100% equivalent to aws, each have their own pros and cons. |
Tau-Chain & Agoras
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pallas
Legendary
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Activity: 2716
Merit: 1094
Black Belt Developer
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November 19, 2014, 01:53:18 PM |
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blah blah
let's see this working and then we'll compare it to "legacy" systems.
ahh those jealous guys.. you tried to design such a system and failed? haha no I just wanted that sterile discussion to end :-) |
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ItsNotMe
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November 19, 2014, 01:53:45 PM |
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service, marketability, market presence...ect.
can you pinpoint something? from what you say generally, there is no justification at all for decentralized systems. I pinpointed three for you... Service to users. Tech support of the of the product. Making potential users aware of the product. companies can give services over decentralized systems and charge their clients. the product is open source, and a the money is used to develop and support the product. like in the open source world, you know. being aware is a bit more easy: each PC holder getting free money wouldn't stay a secret for long. These are huge needs to a system you are proposing. A decentralized system does not work better in this use case.
poinpoint. why decentralized system won't work better on this use case? it's also needed to say zennet is not 100% equivalent to aws, each have their own pros and cons. I did...you are trolling your own forum. Have fun. |
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ohad
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November 19, 2014, 01:55:34 PM |
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blah blah
let's see this working and then we'll compare it to "legacy" systems.
ahh those jealous guys.. you tried to design such a system and failed? EDIT: i thought you talked about zennet rather ItsNotMe. apologies haha no I just wanted that sterile discussion to end :-) it was a good discussion until ItsNotMe got out of answers.. either he doesnt like decentralization, or crowd funding, or zennet, or myself. PS i edited the comment for you above.. |
Tau-Chain & Agoras
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mr.coinzy
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November 19, 2014, 06:38:59 PM
Last edit: November 19, 2014, 08:08:45 PM by mr.coinzy |
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Some people will object (for various reasons), some will try to minimize or even ridicule, but all of them will eat their hat once this system is up and running. The possible benefits of a centralized system are smaller than those found in a decentralized one that works well, and as stated before, the zennet system will not compete in all aspects of the old systems already running, but will offer a great alternative to many of them.
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Djinou94
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Activity: 1036
Merit: 1000
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November 20, 2014, 02:42:42 AM |
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I dont undestand when the IPO start?
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Coinmin
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November 20, 2014, 02:54:01 AM |
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How can I buy this gems?
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Mig-23
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Activity: 1176
Merit: 1000
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November 20, 2014, 02:58:41 AM |
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it seems like new technology
interested..
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ohad
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November 20, 2014, 08:54:36 AM |
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you will definitely notice when the sale begins  |
Tau-Chain & Agoras
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kjn311
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Activity: 319
Merit: 10
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November 20, 2014, 03:25:20 PM |
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you will definitely notice when the sale begins There is a new Proof of Stake kid on the block called Tendermint. Tendermint.com to read the whitepaper. |
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Hueristic
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Activity: 4018
Merit: 5587
Doomed to see the future and unable to prevent it
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November 20, 2014, 03:59:14 PM |
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you will definitely notice when the sale begins There is a new Proof of Stake kid on the block called Tendermint. Tendermint.com to read the whitepaper. I foresee no problems with losing coins in that scheme. |
“Bad men need nothing more to compass their ends, than that good men should look on and do nothing.”
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ohad
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November 20, 2014, 04:05:50 PM |
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you will definitely notice when the sale begins There is a new Proof of Stake kid on the block called Tendermint. Tendermint.com to read the whitepaper. I foresee no problems with losing coins in that scheme. besides that, what problems do you foresee and how do you suggest overcoming them? using bitcoin isn't an option unless you can make it work faster. we can also discuss anything on the irc channel #zennet @freenode. |
Tau-Chain & Agoras
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pallas
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Activity: 2716
Merit: 1094
Black Belt Developer
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November 20, 2014, 04:17:42 PM |
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what I don't like about tendermint:
"If the validator causes the blockchain to fork while its coins are locked in bond, all of its coins are destroyed."
so if the developers make some mistakes, or I have some network problems or whatever and it forks, I loose the coins. Wow!
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ohad
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November 20, 2014, 04:34:44 PM |
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what I don't like about tendermint:
"If the validator causes the blockchain to fork while its coins are locked in bond, all of its coins are destroyed."
so if the developers make some mistakes, or I have some network problems or whatever and it forks, I loose the coins. Wow!
I didnt like it (yet?), but I think this specific issue you raise is fine: only a validator loses its own bond when they fail to function whatsoever. |
Tau-Chain & Agoras
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pallas
Legendary
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Activity: 2716
Merit: 1094
Black Belt Developer
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November 20, 2014, 04:49:47 PM |
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what I don't like about tendermint:
"If the validator causes the blockchain to fork while its coins are locked in bond, all of its coins are destroyed."
so if the developers make some mistakes, or I have some network problems or whatever and it forks, I loose the coins. Wow!
I didnt like it (yet?), but I think this specific issue you raise is fine: only a validator loses its own bond when they fail to function whatsoever. even if it's not their fault... that's what I don't like :-) getting into a fork can be very easy with PoS: with a poor connection and some stake you can easily generate orphans and get them accepted by your neighbours. |
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kjn311
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Activity: 319
Merit: 10
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November 20, 2014, 06:24:16 PM |
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From what I understand, and the reason I mentioned it here, is that tendermint confirmations times are limited only by the bandwidth of the network, for example, with about 10,000 validators = about 1min confirmations times and also unlike dpos doesn't rely on having trust in the 101 delegates. "On the other hand existing proof-of-stake protocols do not have a well defined intrinsic penalty for instigators of a double-spend attack. This is commonly called, ironically, the “nothing at stake” problem. Newer protocols like the BitShares delegated-proof-of-stake protocol attempt to address this problem by placing the role of ranked-delegate at stake [3], but security is dependant on the extrinsic ability of stakeholders to accurately predict the future performance of delegates." Reference on confirmation time about 19:00 mark http://letstalkbitcoin.com/blog/post/beyond-bitcoin-21-consensus-without-mining |
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