CrazyLoaf's CrazySteak(TM) High PoS Investment Journal

[mtwelve]

I might be opening a position in a POS stake too.... Something like this is safer than buying into hashlets, as you own the coins. I'll let you guys know if I go through with this.

[ghostlander]

hBN has one advantage - many merchants

HBN has less than 10 merchants. ORB has over than 80 merchants. Feel the difference.

[presstab]

hBN has one advantage - many merchants

HBN has less than 10 merchants. ORB has over than 80 merchants. Feel the difference.

ORB isn't high PoS.

Also I would like to point out, as CrazyLoaf has a few times, that merchants don't matter.  For example, although ORB has 80 merchants, and according to coinmarketcap has traded $110 USD worth in the last 24 hours. HBN has a smaller amount of merchants and has traded $229 in 24 hours. HYP has absolutely no merchants and has traded $2,900 in 24 hours.

Having merchants is just another way to dump your coins, they end up on the same exchanges, traded for the same BTC, but the only difference is that the user is charged a fee for someone else to do it for them.

But nevertheless, many crypto users find it very important that a coin has a few merchants that accept it. For me, I just use btc for those types of transactions.

[CrazyLoaf]

hBN has one advantage - many merchants

HBN has less than 10 merchants. ORB has over than 80 merchants. Feel the difference.

ORB has an interesting distribution with the 1 ORB for every 20 ORB held, but I honestly was too stupid to be able to break my blocks up without having to wait a minute or so between each send to myself. I may take a look at it again, but I like my breaking and recombining to be easy.

[ghostlander]

hBN has one advantage - many merchants

HBN has less than 10 merchants. ORB has over than 80 merchants. Feel the difference.

ORB isn't high PoS.

Also I would like to point out, as CrazyLoaf has a few times, that merchants don't matter.  For example, although ORB has 80 merchants, and according to coinmarketcap has traded $110 USD worth in the last 24 hours. HBN has a smaller amount of merchants and has traded $229 in 24 hours. HYP has absolutely no merchants and has traded $2,900 in 24 hours.

Having merchants is just another way to dump your coins, they end up on the same exchanges, traded for the same BTC, but the only difference is that the user is charged a fee for someone else to do it for them.

But nevertheless, many crypto users find it very important that a coin has a few merchants that accept it. For me, I just use btc for those types of transactions.

ORB is higher PoS than HBN definitely. It is fixed reward PoS, therefore APR depends on difficulty. It can be as high as 500% compound per annum, though it's likely to be between 200% and 300% in reality.

You say merchants don't matter. What do you see a primary purpose of a coin? P&D on exchanges? ORB/BTC holds a steady exchange rate of 5k sat. at Cryptsy for the past month. There were a few sporadic high volume fluctuations, but the market held. According to your theory, these 80+ merchants should drive the price down by dumping their sales. It doesn't happen.

CrazyLoaf, it has been explained before. Generate maybe 5 to 10 addresses for your staking needs. Use the Coin Control and 'Add recipient' button to split large inputs into these addresses.

[breakbeater]

I might be opening a position in a POS stake too.... Something like this is safer than buying into hashlets, as you own the coins. I'll let you guys know if I go through with this.

+1

I'd like to add that all my POS coins are generating about 0,3-0,4 BTC/month at actual prices . Well i invested some good amount of BTC in POS coins , but it's worth it in any case.

[mtwelve]

I might be opening a position in a POS stake too.... Something like this is safer than buying into hashlets, as you own the coins. I'll let you guys know if I go through with this.

+1

I'd like to add that all my POS coins are generating about 0,3-0,4 BTC/month at actual prices . Well i invested some good amount of BTC in POS coins , but it's worth it in any case.

You want to give me some of that profit so I can start my own journal haha xD

[CrazyLoaf]

I'd like to add that all my POS coins are generating about 0,3-0,4 BTC/month at actual prices . Well i invested some good amount of BTC in POS coins , but it's worth it in any case.

This is pretty cool. There aren't too many other passive investments out there that can operate like this and, at the same time, give you the potential for huge upswings in value.

Let's say you get $250 a month. What else can passively generate that? Assuming 3% annual dividends, you'd need almost a $100k stock portfolio to generate that. You could move a little more high risk and with higher costs and invest in a rental property. Okay you buy a $25k property (good luck finding one that isn't a dump and/or doesn't require a ton of work). Hell netting $250, by the rule of thumb of 50% of rent going to costs, would require a $500 a month rent, so let's just bump up the home price to $75k - $100k.

The fact of the matter is, for the lack of effort, you're not going to find something that can generate as much free-cash flow as these high PoS coins, and they have 24/7 hour markets to boot where you can unload them at almost no transaction costs.

[breakbeater]

@mtwelve
I builded my stash in about 8-9 months and in this time i let all POS blocks to compound. So, if you start now after 9-10 months you'll have (maybe) same profits

[presstab]

Yes that would be right then, I have never staked ORB so don't know what size of blocks actually stake in a timely manner. And then size of block would determine the PoS rate.

Yes I am sticking by my "merchants don't matter theory".  What is the purpose of a coin?  Well for me and a lot of other people, I think the answer is fun. Let's be honest, these high PoS coins are not the next bitcoin, or litecoin, etc. They are craft coins that gather respectable communities, that give input and help with the infrastructure of the coin. Having merchants is nice, but it is not the main feature of a coin, it is more of a marketing play. There are too many coins out there that are way too serious, which is what I and many others have loved about HYP, it is a place to come relax FUD free.

I suppose in my view of coin economics, the 3 primary drivers of demand for coins are: speculative value, community value, and novelty value.

Regarding ORB and value being stable while having merchants.. Is there any way to tell how much has been used for merchant transaction?

hBN has one advantage - many merchants

HBN has less than 10 merchants. ORB has over than 80 merchants. Feel the difference.

ORB isn't high PoS.

Also I would like to point out, as CrazyLoaf has a few times, that merchants don't matter.  For example, although ORB has 80 merchants, and according to coinmarketcap has traded $110 USD worth in the last 24 hours. HBN has a smaller amount of merchants and has traded $229 in 24 hours. HYP has absolutely no merchants and has traded $2,900 in 24 hours.

Having merchants is just another way to dump your coins, they end up on the same exchanges, traded for the same BTC, but the only difference is that the user is charged a fee for someone else to do it for them.

But nevertheless, many crypto users find it very important that a coin has a few merchants that accept it. For me, I just use btc for those types of transactions.

ORB is higher PoS than HBN definitely. It is fixed reward PoS, therefore APR depends on difficulty. It can be as high as 500% compound per annum, though it's likely to be between 200% and 300% in reality.

You say merchants don't matter. What do you see a primary purpose of a coin? P&D on exchanges? ORB/BTC holds a steady exchange rate of 5k sat. at Cryptsy for the past month. There were a few sporadic high volume fluctuations, but the market held. According to your theory, these 80+ merchants should drive the price down by dumping their sales. It doesn't happen.

CrazyLoaf, it has been explained before. Generate maybe 5 to 10 addresses for your staking needs. Use the Coin Control and 'Add recipient' button to split large inputs into these addresses.

[breakbeater]

I'd like to add that all my POS coins are generating about 0,3-0,4 BTC/month at actual prices . Well i invested some good amount of BTC in POS coins , but it's worth it in any case.

This is pretty cool. There aren't too many other passive investments out there that can operate like this and, at the same time, give you the potential for huge upswings in value.

Let's say you get $250 a month. What else can passively generate that? Assuming 3% annual dividends, you'd need almost a $100k stock portfolio to generate that. You could move a little more high risk and with higher costs and invest in a rental property. Okay you buy a $25k property (good luck finding one that isn't a dump and/or doesn't require a ton of work). Hell netting $250, by the rule of thumb of 50% of rent going to costs, would require a $500 a month rent, so let's just bump up the home price to $75k - $100k.

The fact of the matter is, for the lack of effort, you're not going to find something that can generate as much free-cash flow as these high PoS coins, and they have 24/7 hour markets to boot where you can unload them at almost no transaction costs.

+100
Totally agree with you

Last year when BTC rose up to 1000$ i made some good profits and about half of my BTC invested in POS. I knew about Hobo and thought it's a good investment. After TG launched his Journal, i even invested more .

[CrazyLoaf]

Yes I am sticking by my "merchants don't matter theory".  What is the purpose of a coin?  Well for me and a lot of other people, I think the answer is fun. Let's be honest, these high PoS coins are not the next bitcoin, or litecoin, etc. They are craft coins that gather respectable communities, that give input and help with the infrastructure of the coin. Having merchants is nice, but it is not the main feature of a coin, it is more of a marketing play. There are too many coins out there that are way too serious, which is what I and many others have loved about HYP, it is a place to come relax FUD free.

I suppose in my view of coin economics, the 3 primary drivers of demand for coins are: speculative value, community value, and novelty value.

There's nothing wrong with a coin being an avenue to more BTC or whatever the dominant crypto is in the future. A lot of these alts already function like that with a large pump and subsequent dump to BTC. High PoS avoids the constant new coin creation cycle to get more BTC by letting it be a part of the coin ecosystem. High PoS just tries to "stick to the cooking" and not enter the technological arms race we see in other spheres of crypto.

[ghostlander]

Regarding ORB and value being stable while having merchants.. Is there any way to tell how much has been used for merchant transaction?

I don't think CoinPayments are going to disclose this information.

[mtwelve]

@mtwelve
I builded my stash in about 8-9 months and in this time i let all POS blocks to compound. So, if you start now after 9-10 months you'll have (maybe) same profits

Oh goody! Ill get to it

[presstab]

ghostlander, or anyone familiar with ORB. About how long would a 24/7 running daemon take to stake a block of 20 ORB on average?

[breakbeater]

ORB POS diff is pretty high, i had about 2k ORB in many small blocks (25-40 coins) and weight of 20k coin days age (or something, quite confusing term) and it minted about 3-4 POS per day /1 ORB each (that is 4 ORB/day). After 3 weeks it has become boring and i dumped all my ORB. I prefer x% after y days , than many small transactions everyday.

[ghostlander]

ORB POS diff is pretty high, i had about 2k ORB in many small blocks (25-40 coins) and weight of 20k coin days age (or something, quite confusing term) and it minted about 3-4 POS per day /1 ORB each (that is 4 ORB/day). After 3 weeks it has become boring and i dumped all my ORB. I prefer x% after y days , than many small transactions everyday.

Sure you prefer to start up a client once or twice a month to collect interest, but you don't help the network much this way.

ghostlander, or anyone familiar with ORB. About how long would a 24/7 running daemon take to stake a block of 20 ORB on average?

When the PoS difficulty was 0.01 to 0.02, it was about 10 days. Now the difficulty is 0.02 to 0.03, so it takes longer. Maybe 12 days. Larger inputs stake faster.

[breakbeater]

So what's the difference between a coin that generates POS blocks every 10 days and ORB (or any other high diff POS coin) that stakes at 10-12 days. Where is the "help" to the network?
I'm confused.......  

[ghostlander]

So what's the difference between a coin that generates POS blocks every 10 days and ORB (or any other high diff POS coin) that stakes at 10-12 days. Where is the "help" to the network?
I'm confused.......  

If you keep your wallet offline almost always and generate a single block with an interest, that's one situation. If you keep the wallet online 24/7 and generate 10 blocks, that's another situation. In the former case, you don't help to distribute the block chain and relay transactions, don't create many blocks which is the most important work. The network is less secure against 51% attacks with most stakers offline.

[CrazyLoaf]

So what's the difference between a coin that generates POS blocks every 10 days and ORB (or any other high diff POS coin) that stakes at 10-12 days. Where is the "help" to the network?
I'm confused.......  

As far as I can tell, ORB pays out a fixed amount (1 ORB per block(s) of 20 ORB). On it's face, that seems to be 5% let's say every 10 days. However, as some people have reported, the system likes larger blocks to stake, but you're limited to that earlier reward amount, reducing your effective interest. The help to the network is giving your computer power to keep track of transactions. That's why a wallet has to be open and downloading blocks to "stake" in the first place.

Really, the fact that people seem to be competing like mad for blocks and then some people have to have larger blocks to get the reward doesn't make the coin as interesting to me. Any time spent recombining or splitting blocks is time destroying stake age. I'll take another look at ORB, but I am a creature of habit and the NVCS inspired coins seem easier to work with and not lose too much time on.

If I recall, Presstab in HYP is actually working on a system where the blocks automatically resize and optimize based on your wallet practices. I think for coins that take PoS seriously, this is the future, especially as HYP, CAP, and HBN institute max stake subsidies to better reward those that protect the network.