syfy323 (OP)
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September 21, 2014, 08:49:13 PM |
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Hi together,
since 2012 I am interested in bitcoin. My first tests with mining were when ASIC was not available (or in production), so I was mining with my Nvidia card.
I now got a chance to get some power for free, so I searched for the best GH/$ without import hassle. Currently the Antminer S1 is the cheapest device in this category.
OC'd I got them to work with 210 GH/s each, totaling 630 GH/s (stats from devices and btcguild).
With this mining-power, the ROI is somewhere in april - without power-costs! Calculating power-costs would make the whole thing unprofitable for me.
In my opinion, most people mine for cash - but how? Even with latest devices, the ROI is way to far. Are these people mining for a future price of 1,000$/btc?
For me, mining is fun, its the tech that makes me have fun with bitcoin. I don't need and I don't want to sell my bitcoins right away - maybe later.
I would love to see some responds with your opinions. Thanks.
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coinnewbit
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September 21, 2014, 10:14:59 PM |
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The retail prices of miners makes it so it will generally be unprofitable for people buying miners "retail" as the prices are generally too high. You will generally need to invest a lot into miners (being able to command a large discount from miner manufacturers) in order to mine profitably.
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Zelek Uther
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September 22, 2014, 12:46:16 AM |
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Why are people still mining? Some ideas...
1) To support the Bitcoin network (for people that believe in the concept over and above any mining income).
2) Speculative mining, in the hope that BTC to fiat value rises significantly in future.
3) Existing mining rigs that don't yet make sense to switch off.
4) Heating. (Parts of the Southern Hemisphere are still pretty cold right now)
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Run a Bitcoin node, support the network.
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philipma1957
Legendary
 Online
Activity: 4116
Merit: 7862
'The right to privacy matters'
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September 22, 2014, 02:40:25 AM |
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Hi together,
since 2012 I am interested in bitcoin. My first tests with mining were when ASIC was not available (or in production), so I was mining with my Nvidia card.
I now got a chance to get some power for free, so I searched for the best GH/$ without import hassle. Currently the Antminer S1 is the cheapest device in this category.
OC'd I got them to work with 210 GH/s each, totaling 630 GH/s (stats from devices and btcguild).
With this mining-power, the ROI is somewhere in april - without power-costs! Calculating power-costs would make the whole thing unprofitable for me.
In my opinion, most people mine for cash - but how? Even with latest devices, the ROI is way to far. Are these people mining for a future price of 1,000$/btc?
For me, mining is fun, its the tech that makes me have fun with bitcoin. I don't need and I don't want to sell my bitcoins right away - maybe later.
I would love to see some responds with your opinions. Thanks.
I am in New Jersey 15 cents a kwatt. It is just about impossible at 15 cents to make money. I look for a deal here and there. It involves a lot of work and time. It involves decent luck. I also have some miners at discounted power rates 2 antminer s-3's mining at 840gh and they pay only 2.4 cents a kwatt. if I could run a lot at 2.4 cents it would be easy. This oct to march I will run at least a kwatt in house even at 15 cents as they will give me heat and reduce my heating bill. |
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fewcoins
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September 22, 2014, 05:09:13 AM |
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Congrats, all of us retail investors just got crushed by BTC because we gave money to evil companies who just gave discounts to huge mining farms & over charged us so our equipment is not not profitable. Good job.
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dropt
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Activity: 1512
Merit: 1000
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September 22, 2014, 05:45:00 AM |
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Congrats, all of us retail investors just got crushed by BTC because we gave money to evil companies who just gave discounts to huge mining farms & over charged us so our equipment is not not profitable. Good job.
You forgot the part where they used their profits to build their own private farms to compete against their customers. |
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mwizard
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September 22, 2014, 06:08:59 AM |
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Whether or not Bitcoin mining is still profitable depends largely on your electricity cost.
So look at your electricity cost.
1) 25 cents per Kilowatt hour - it is not even economic to turn many miners on. Definitely not economic to buy a new miner. Sell your miner.
2) 15 cents per Kilowatt hour - still economic to turn on miners purchased in the last 4 months. Unlikely to be economic to buy a new miner.
3) 5 cents per Kilowatt hour - still economic to turn existing miner on and probably will get ROI if buy new current miner.
The above is based on mining returning about 28 cents per terrahash. This is about to fall to 25 cents per terrahash with the next difficultly change. A typical miner will use about one kilowatt hour of electricity to perform one terahash. The newest miners are 20-30$ better than this but older were far worse.
If also paying for hosting you will need to add the hosting cost.
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-ck
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Ruu \o/
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September 22, 2014, 06:57:45 AM |
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It never was. You're all dreaming.
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Developer/maintainer for cgminer, ckpool/ckproxy, and the -ck kernel
2% Fee Solo mining at solo.ckpool.org
-ck
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mwizard
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September 22, 2014, 08:27:31 AM
Last edit: September 22, 2014, 08:51:28 AM by mwizard |
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It never was. You're all dreaming.
Mining may not be profitable for the person paying 15 cents or more per KWh, but someone has added over 30 petahash since the last difficulty change, that's over 2,000 terrahash of miners every day. This is getting towards adding something close to the equivalent of 80,000 S3s in 2 weeks. I don't think they are doing it for love. Someone certainly thinks mining is still profitable. |
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philipma1957
Legendary
Online
Activity: 4116
Merit: 7862
'The right to privacy matters'
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September 22, 2014, 11:41:18 AM |
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It never was. You're all dreaming.
Mining may not be profitable for the person paying 15 cents or more per KWh, but someone has added over 30 petahash since the last difficulty change, that's over 2,000 terrahash of miners every day. This is getting towards adding something close to the equivalent of 80,000 S3s in 2 weeks. I don't think they are doing it for love. Someone certainly thinks mining is still profitable. yeah bitmaintech does they build 5000-10000 s-4's mine them and then sell them. most likely at low power and .5 watts a gh they make a shitload of coin . |
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ChuckBuck
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September 22, 2014, 01:00:19 PM
Last edit: September 22, 2014, 02:29:19 PM by ChuckBuck |
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Mining isn't profitable for anybody at this point, especially with the price downswing. Only way remotely to get close to ROI, would be "free electricity", but that be in most cases stealing, and if caught more severe punishments (Fired from job, fined, put in jail, etc).
Only entities profiting realistically from mining right now are the ASIC manufacturers. Selling outdated, overpriced miners to customers, as well as, self mining on their massive private farms.
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TheJohn
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September 22, 2014, 01:58:26 PM |
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Not profitable at all, unless you can get real cheap per gh/s..
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kendog77
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September 22, 2014, 02:46:28 PM |
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Mining can be quite profitable if you don't overpay for hardware and have access to cheap electricity.
When evaluating a miner purchase, don't try to fudge assumptions to try to make the numbers work. Use conservative estimates for difficulty increases and BTC price in your calculations, and don't look at things through rose colored glasses.
Having said that, right now I don't see much of anything at all worth buying, and the next difficulty jump looks brutal. It's hard to justify investing in new mining hardware with BTC at $400 and a 35B difficulty.
Something has to give, so either the value of BTC will go up or many miners will shut down in the near future, which should cause the difficulty to level off a bit.
The profitability picture for miners looks worse and worse by the day...
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zvs
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https://web.archive.org/web/*/nogleg.com
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September 22, 2014, 04:56:13 PM |
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Hi together,
since 2012 I am interested in bitcoin. My first tests with mining were when ASIC was not available (or in production), so I was mining with my Nvidia card.
I now got a chance to get some power for free, so I searched for the best GH/$ without import hassle. Currently the Antminer S1 is the cheapest device in this category.
OC'd I got them to work with 210 GH/s each, totaling 630 GH/s (stats from devices and btcguild).
With this mining-power, the ROI is somewhere in april - without power-costs! Calculating power-costs would make the whole thing unprofitable for me.
In my opinion, most people mine for cash - but how? Even with latest devices, the ROI is way to far. Are these people mining for a future price of 1,000$/btc?
For me, mining is fun, its the tech that makes me have fun with bitcoin. I don't need and I don't want to sell my bitcoins right away - maybe later.
I would love to see some responds with your opinions. Thanks.
all these shenanigans for 'ROI'.. I can go to the bank and deposit some money into a daily compounding interest bearing checking account and make ROI after one day.. though I suspect it'd be less than inflation |
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idecable
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September 22, 2014, 05:11:21 PM |
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These days it looks only profitable if you go by several tera hash per sec. Just saying, this month if you have 1th you'll make $200 USD, next month $175. The competition is going high, so you better brace up with the latest hardware out there.
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kendog77
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September 22, 2014, 05:26:03 PM |
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These days it looks only profitable if you go by several tera hash per sec. Just saying, this month if you have 1th you'll make $200 USD, next month $175. The competition is going high, so you better brace up with the latest hardware out there.
That is a common myth. Mining returns scale perfectly linearly, so unless you can get a better deal on hardware by buying in bulk or have lower operating expenses, there is no advantage for the bigger miner. Bitmain and Asicminer margins both look like they are razor thin at the moment, so I doubt many hardware manufacturers are offering bulk discounts. Most of the time, the miner that has 10x the hash power also pays 10x as much for hardware, 10x as much in operating expenses, and earns 10x as much in return. At the end of the day, either the little and big guy are both profitable, or they both lose money. The only way this can change is if one has a significant competitive advantage over the other, like a lower cost to acquire hardware or lower operating expenses. |
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alh
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September 22, 2014, 07:05:06 PM |
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These days it looks only profitable if you go by several tera hash per sec. Just saying, this month if you have 1th you'll make $200 USD, next month $175. The competition is going high, so you better brace up with the latest hardware out there.
That is a common myth. Mining returns scale perfectly linearly, so unless you can get a better deal on hardware by buying in bulk or have lower operating expenses, there is no advantage for the bigger miner. Bitmain and Asicminer margins both look like they are razor thin at the moment, so I doubt many hardware manufacturers are offering bulk discounts. Most of the time, the miner that has 10x the hash power also pays 10x as much for hardware, 10x as much in operating expenses, and earns 10x as much in return. At the end of the day, either the little and big guy are both profitable, or they both lose money. The only way this can change is if one has a significant competitive advantage over the other, like a lower cost to acquire hardware or lower operating expenses. +1 The myth is perpetuated by the fact that many large mining farms have one or both of the advantages (miner cost or electricity cost) in play for them. Their hardware depreciates at the same rate as everybody else's. |
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fewcoins
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September 23, 2014, 04:51:46 AM |
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Because of our greed, we gave our money for "FASTER" equipment WAYYY ahead of time & now we got killed because of that.
We gave our money away to companies who got even better miners to destroy us & our currency BTC
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Dabs
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The Concierge of Crypto
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September 23, 2014, 05:03:51 AM |
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I found that you can make more money by gambling. As in, roll the dice.
If you buy mining equipment today, that's essentially what you are doing. So go have fun while you lose your money, play poker or something. Your agony is shortened from 3 months to 3 minutes.
If you get lucky, cash out. If not, you had fun and paid for it.
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hedgy73
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September 23, 2014, 08:42:49 AM |
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No mining is profitable IMHO be it sha256, scrypt or other algo's.
I've recently sold my sha256 mining gear and gpu's because I was barely breaking even with the cost of electricity and I already owned the gear outright. In fact some days depending on pool luck I was actually mining at a loss.
I'd be very surprised if anyone can invest in equipment either new or used and ROI at current difficulty and btc value. Perhaps with free electricity it might be possible.
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