Guaging interest in gun sales for bitcoin

[RodeoX]

I am working with a local gun shop that is considering accepting bitcoin. I used to buy my guns from them but now I buy online for BTC and have them do the FFL transfer. this has gotten them very interested in these bitcoin things.
When I meet with them I would love to tell them that I know people are interested in this, and that they may find customers who otherwise would never have bought from them. So, is it true that you guys are interested in online or in-person sales of guns from a regular gun shop?

If you want to help the effort you could also send them an email or call and let them know. The place is: http://www.deerfieldpistol.com

Cheers

[RodeoX]

UPDATE: They are on-board. I am going to be their first customer and help them set up. Likely they will be using Tony's BitPay system. Although, today's news about PayPal may be another option for them.
Anyone who wants guns for bitcoin may want to check them out. They have a brick and mortar store in Deerfield Wisconsin, and can get about any gun you want.   

[h0lybyte]

Oh what are the legality issues that pertain to recreational guns for hunting?

Also, can you buy parts and bows (things of that nature) through BTC?

[Pkuwag]

Whether does the firearms require authentication?
But Bitcoin is anonymity

[BayAreaCoins]

I've sold a hand fun of guns for Bitcoin.

Gl with your shop & GJ.

[RodeoX]

Oh what are the legality issues that pertain to recreational guns for hunting?

Also, can you buy parts and bows (things of that nature) through BTC?

All laws still apply. If it is a handgun you will have to wait for a background check, etc. But it is a full service gun shop and I don't think there are many/any laws about buying archery equipment. Everything is the same except now you will have the option to pay with BTC. I'll know more after I meet with them Saturday. That will be their first sale. 

Whether does the firearms require authentication?
But Bitcoin is anonymity

You won't be able to buy anonymously. There are a lot of gun laws involving fingerprints and keeping records. These guys are mostly former cops and would not sell to criminals. No "black market reloaded" stuff here.

I've sold a hand fun of guns for Bitcoin.

Gl with your shop & GJ.

Thanks for your kind note. I have bought a gun for bitcoin, but Saturday will be my first in person purchase. I'm thinking about adding a Volquartsen trigger kit. I shot a friends Mark III with one of those triggers and it was sweet.

[RodeoX]

UPDATE: Yesterday I helped them set up a basic BitPay account and walked them through their first BTC sale; Just a box of ammo and an ID holder. Tomorrow we'll try it with a pistol purchase!

[noma]

Interesting. Does he also ship worldwide? Equipments for archery? I am sure guns will not be allowed to be shipped without violating international laws.

[RodeoX]

Interesting. Does he also ship worldwide? Equipments for archery? I am sure guns will not be allowed to be shipped without violating international laws.

Well, apparently BitPay rejects businesses that sell guns. I specifically checked their website about this and found that firearms were NOT on the list. Then after setting these guys up and doing a transaction they rejected it. WTF?

I'm going to look into coinbase and perhaps start recommending them as a payment processor. Anybody have any experience with them? Especially in a brick and mortar store.

[noma]

Interesting. Does he also ship worldwide? Equipments for archery? I am sure guns will not be allowed to be shipped without violating international laws.

Well, apparently BitPay rejects businesses that sell guns. I specifically checked their website about this and found that firearms were NOT on the list. Then after setting these guys up and doing a transaction they rejected it. WTF?

I'm going to look into coinbase and perhaps start recommending them as a payment processor. Anybody have any experience with them? Especially in a brick and mortar store.

Ah that sucks. You might was to email the payment processors before incase payments get rejected multiple times. Also since its a product, not a lot of people just buy this everyday, so you can also have the payments directly, by posting an address or something, so that an option to pay by bitcoins exist.

[BayAreaCoins]

Interesting. Does he also ship worldwide? Equipments for archery? I am sure guns will not be allowed to be shipped without violating international laws.

Well, apparently BitPay rejects businesses that sell guns. I specifically checked their website about this and found that firearms were NOT on the list. Then after setting these guys up and doing a transaction they rejected it. WTF?

I'm going to look into coinbase and perhaps start recommending them as a payment processor. Anybody have any experience with them? Especially in a brick and mortar store.

These business and forums that don't do business with guns need to be boycotted.

Just don't use them.

[toleng]

Interesting. Does he also ship worldwide? Equipments for archery? I am sure guns will not be allowed to be shipped without violating international laws.

Well, apparently BitPay rejects businesses that sell guns. I specifically checked their website about this and found that firearms were NOT on the list. Then after setting these guys up and doing a transaction they rejected it. WTF?

I'm going to look into coinbase and perhaps start recommending them as a payment processor. Anybody have any experience with them? Especially in a brick and mortar store.

I am not entirely surprised by this. I don't think that it is very good public policy to be mixing bitcoin and the purchase of weapons like this. I am a firm believer in the 2nd amendment however I do think there should be some restrictions on sales and transfer of firearms. To accept bitcoin to sell guns over the internet is just asking for trouble as this would likely create a demand for guns from people that should not be buying them.

I would be interested to see if coinbase will accept them, but I don't think they will.

I have read about one gun shop that has a bitcoin ATM inside (I think they also accept bitcoin) but the article that I read about it said that they would treat it as a "cash" transaction and the same ID and background check requirements would still apply and that customers can only buy by actually visiting the store

[Dabs]

Don't forget guncoin.

[BayAreaCoins]

Interesting. Does he also ship worldwide? Equipments for archery? I am sure guns will not be allowed to be shipped without violating international laws.

Well, apparently BitPay rejects businesses that sell guns. I specifically checked their website about this and found that firearms were NOT on the list. Then after setting these guys up and doing a transaction they rejected it. WTF?

I'm going to look into coinbase and perhaps start recommending them as a payment processor. Anybody have any experience with them? Especially in a brick and mortar store.

I am not entirely surprised by this. I don't think that it is very good public policy to be mixing bitcoin and the purchase of weapons like this. I am a firm believer in the 2nd amendment however I do think there should be some restrictions on sales and transfer of firearms. To accept bitcoin to sell guns over the internet is just asking for trouble as this would likely create a demand for guns from people that should not be buying them.

I would be interested to see if coinbase will accept them, but I don't think they will.

I have read about one gun shop that has a bitcoin ATM inside (I think they also accept bitcoin) but the article that I read about it said that they would treat it as a "cash" transaction and the same ID and background check requirements would still apply and that customers can only buy by actually visiting the store

There are plenty of regulations on selling guns for bitcoin or fiat.  FFL's don't care if you are giving the gun as a gift or sold it for a million the paperwork between them and the other FFL is still there.  Do not offer to drive guns across state lines because there is a bunch of technical bullshit to do with this.  Do not ship without a FFL unless you are overnighting a pistol to a FFL using Fedex. Blah blah blah Be paranoid to the fullest extent and if you have a question call the State Police.

You can use credit cards to buy guys.

They just don't have the balls to stand up for their constitutional rights or the extra work isn't worth it.

Edit:

Can they not just cash out at Bitstamp or BTC-e?  I would offer to cash them out, but my fiats working in other places unless they could take credit card and I could do up to $4000 a pop which is a large buy.

[TheButterZone]

Apparently using https://www.atfonline.gov/fflezcheck/ is too hard? Fuck's sake, BitPay.

[RodeoX]

EDIT: Response from CoinBase:

John replied: We are currently looking in to this and trying to make a decision on this very topic. Personally, I am all for this and think gun sales through an FFL is just about the safest transaction that can be done on the internet.
No one in the company is against gun sales but as you can imagine with investors, our bank etc we have more than a few interested parties that we have to clear things through.
Hopefully, we’ll have some word soon. You can reach out to me directly john@coinbase.com vice using our support platform.
Respectfully
John Kothanek
Director

For anyone concerned about buying guns online I can assure you that all the gun laws still apply. The payments may be pseudo-anomyous, but buying a gun is not.
Here is the process I have to go through to get this pistol...

1. Select gun and CALL the store. No sales unless you call and give name, phone, address, etc. Only then can I pay and start the process.

2. Next, go to the gun store that will receive the gun. Not the seller, the FFL transfer agent. There I fill out forms for my background check and show all sorts of ID. I can't get the gun yet however.

3. Now I wait while the gun is shipped and do my federally mandated "cooling off period".  

4. Now I can return to the receiving FFL and show my ID again. Assuming I pass the back ground check I can finally receive the gun.

The only difference is paying in BTC. This process is not how criminals get guns. It is a legitimate, gov supervised sale. By the same standard BitPay should not work with pharmacies, liquor stores, places that sell tobacco, etc. These are places that sell dangerous items that may kill people, why are they exempt?

 


 

[TheButterZone]

EDIT: Response from CoinBase:

John replied: We are currently looking in to this and trying to make a decision on this very topic. Personally, I am all for this and think gun sales through an FFL is just about the safest transaction that can be done on the internet.
No one in the company is against gun sales but as you can imagine with investors, our bank etc we have more than a few interested parties that we have to clear things through.
Hopefully, we’ll have some word soon. You can reach out to me directly john@coinbase.com vice using our support platform.
Respectfully
John Kothanek
Director

For anyone concerned about buying guns online I can assure you that all the gun laws still apply. The payments may be pseudo-anomyous, but buying a gun is not.
Here is the process I have to go through to get this pistol...

1. Select gun and CALL the store. No sales unless you call and give name, phone, address, etc. Only then can I pay and start the process.

2. Next, go to the gun store that will receive the gun. Not the seller, the FFL transfer agent. There I fill out forms for my background check and show all sorts of ID. I can't get the gun yet however.

3. Now I wait while the gun is shipped and do my federally mandated "cooling off period". 

4. Now I can return to the receiving FFL and show my ID again. Assuming I pass the back ground check I can finally receive the gun.

The only difference is paying in BTC. This process is not how criminals get guns. It is a legitimate, gov supervised sale. By the same standard BitPay should not work with pharmacies, liquor stores, places that sell tobacco, etc. These are places that sell dangerous items that may kill people, why are they exempt?

Because self-harm is lesser regulated by the government than harming violent criminals in self-defense.

[RodeoX]

Because self-harm is lesser regulated by the government than harming violent criminals in self-defense.

Since this one is only .22 cal., Maybe I can argue that it will not harm the violent criminal that much? Sure it will hurt, but I doubt he will die from that kneecap bull's eye.  

EDIT: Well, it looks like Circle.com is out of the running as well. This is from their TOS:

17. Restricted Activities

Using the Services to make the following types of payments is prohibited, and Circle reserves the right to monitor for payments that relate to:

    any Restricted Persons or persons or entities located in Restricted Territories (as each term is defined in Section 29);
    weapons of any kind, including but not limited to firearms, ammunition, knives, or related accessories;
    controlled substances including but not limited to...