What's with the price of Qora?

[Come-from-Beyond]

Exactly.

I'm man enough to take things back...  be man enough to STOP all this now I have free time HORSESHIT too.

You should use something else. Strong language has never let to win a dispute.

Btw, WHAT should I stop?

[Come-from-Beyond]

NXT guys always makes people sick, your guys attack everycoin which may threaten NXT.

You are supposed to post few links that prove your words. You don't want others to put you into the list of people who spread baseless accusations, do you?

[Come-from-Beyond]

All this now I have free time HORSESHIT.

Good, let's continue.

Care to answer my question?

I'd like to hear your assumption why I tried to help to fix crypti's algorithm.

[TaunSew]

Exactly.

I'm man enough to take things back...  be man enough to STOP all this now I have free time HORSESHIT too.

Btw, WHAT should I stop?

Yeah stop trying to prove Qora is innocent and not a $hitcoin.. wait.. what...  
CfB boss man looks like our suspicions are correct, Qora is a $hitcoin and not even a good one at that.    

5 months these Qora people are delaying over the code... 5 months...   they could had even compiled fake code with all that time, good enough to fool old man Garzik into thinking the hashes match.

[Come-from-Beyond]

Yeah stop trying to prove Qora is innocent and not a $hitcoin.. wait.. what...  

If Qora is a clone then only bad thing is that its creator didn't say all the truth. You should know that the community of a coin has little common with the coin creator. You, UtopianFuture, know this much better than anyone else.

[Come-from-Beyond]

Based on your post in the Crypti thread (which came later)...  I took back the #trolling and didn't assume anything.

And this is your main problem. Being a troll you think that others are trolls too. An idea that someone may help other cryptos simply for the sake of helping cryptocurrency concept in general can't even come to your mind. Do you see this?

[Come-from-Beyond]

HORSESHIT   

Where the FUCK was anything related to helping cryptocurrency concept in the tweet to which I replied with #trolling?

When you made a decent post later on I took it back...  you should try it too sometimes...   

I bet your IQ is much higher than others may think looking at constant usage of one word. Make another post but without "HORSESHIT" this time, please.

[Come-from-Beyond]

Yeah OK...  like your sleazy wannabe sarcasm while beating around the bush is gonna convince us all...   

See, it's quite easy to troll at more intellectual level.

Now let's talk about QoraAT. Do you know that in its beginning AT idea was developed by CIYAM and me? We were talking a lot via Skype. During one of these talks an idea of Atomic Cross-Chain Exchange was born. This idea is not mine, it's CIYAM's too, I consider it as 50/50. Here is my post that proves that I knew how to do atomic cross-exchanges several months ago - https://nxtforum.org/smart-contracts/express-your-wish-(smart-contracts)/msg64511/#msg64511.

Would you still post this tweet - https://twitter.com/CryptoScalper/status/522103357012709377 - if you knew all this?

[Come-from-Beyond]

Says the guy who replied to that tweet saying it was a Coincidence.

ROFLMAO!   

I saw CIYAM's thread about AT later. It was a coincidence, what did you expect me to reply?

The idea explained here - https://nxtforum.org/general-discussion/not-a-holy-grail-of-cryptocurrencies-but-still-a-very-usable-artifact/ - came to my mind while I was thinking how to protect Counterparty against Luke-Jr and other guys who would like to censor Bitcoin transactions.

Don't you see a clear pattern here:

1. I try to help Crypti and post an idea how to improve their algo - you troll me.
2. I try to help Counterpart and improve the idea of CIYAM and me - you troll me.
3. I try to help Qora - you troll me.

You are not a hardcore troll like UtopianFuture/TaunSew. You should think about this pattern and change something in your life. Do you agree?

[Daedelus]

I knew how to do atomic cross-exchanges several months ago - https://nxtforum.org/smart-contracts/express-your-wish-(smart-contracts)/msg64511/#msg64511.

No matter how many links with dates and times you post, you won't convince him. He threw his teddies out of the pram on this before as no one would acknowledge he was the 'saviour of Nxt' RE: NxtAT and wouldn't stop trolling until Damelon deleted all traces in the Nxt thread. I posted links 3 times showing the plan had always been the same as events that passed... NxtAT to get its own testnet and that happened at the weekend.


But soon you will be part of the Nxt 'circle jerk' so welcome!  


I used to follow the Qora thread but if you asked the wrong questions (like 'how do you know it is new code?' rather than 'who is Qora's favourite member of One Direction and why?') then Smaragda and a couple of others chased you out for 'trolling'. I am probably not the only one who doesn't bother going over there anymore.

[Come-from-Beyond]

No matter how many links with dates and times you post, you won't convince him.

He behaved like a man once. He will do it again, I'm sure. For now I'm leaving this thread.

[Daedelus]

So we agree that vbecas and btc2nxt are the 'saviours of NxtAT' (aka the NxtAT devs) and put NxtAt on testnet as had been planned in June when CIYAM was still part of NxtAT. CfB referred to this as 'Nxtthereum' 

In order for us to co-ordinate two separate developers we are going to fork the public version of Nxt to continue this project (we have been given no access to the private Nxt repo so practically we have no other option).

We'll work out our own "testnet" for this (and run that on a different port) and hopefully we can get some people to help us out with running testnet nodes when we have that ready (this will probably be a few weeks from now as firstly coding to integrate AT with Nxt will need to be written).

PHEW! I thought you might flip out and act like an hysterical child. Thank god that didn't happen.


I think your issue is that you believe CIYAM was snubbed (and maybe CIYAM does too) and that has led to this behaviour toward CfB. NxtAT /= CIYAM, the project is open source with two other devs. I was sad to lose CIYAM in Nxt but I don't think he sees himself as aligned to any crypto. From some discussions with him, he seemed to believe he had something that would be the next step after blockchain tech.


CIYAM is very talented and is promoting AT well, Gavin A even checked in. QoraAT will be good. But AT implementation of Atomic Cross Chain Transactions requires NxtAT, DogeAT, LtcAT, BTCD AT etc etc... for it to be really useful and each one need the others. CIYAM doesn't need an 'attack dog' to protect him so let's just tone it down. AT will raise all ships.

[Daedelus]

Goes ahead and quotes CIYAM from a date preceding everything I quoted and the SHIT HITTING THE FAN...  

CIYAM left an open source project that has two other developers and a plan to implement on testnet.

Plan is carried out and NxtAT launches on testnet.



As I said before, this storm is only in your head. We have been over this, I am out of here too.

[rlh]

Guys, so long as Qora decides to keep the source sealed, we must accept that all arguments about originality are opinion-based, regardless of the coins you support.  If you cannot accept that the originating-state of the source (i.e copied, or not) is completely unknown, then this is going to be a tough coin to evaluate.

CfB, I appreciate your willingness to validate the source.  IMHO, this is good news, just of no immediate benefit.  I've said it before, I'll say it again.  I own a lot of Qora and I own a lot of Nxt.  I also don't care if Qora cloned an early copy of Nxt.  And so what if it was?  The dev is trying to branch out on an "original" front and if he does release this source, I've been intrigued with the nature of his silent work long enough that I'm becoming motivated to support it as a core dev "just because".

In other words, Nxt clone or not, this coin has potential to improve and be worth far more than it is now.  For now, attacking Nxt (for any reason) is like a cub attacking a dominate lion.  Pretty dumb today... but some cubs do grow up to be stronger than their father's.

Supporting Qora is an exercise in faith and patience.  Your faith is a factor of the size of your stake in the coin.

My personal hope is that bugs will be worked out, features will continue and once a little "shiny" is added to the application, we can push it by building out supported tools that can exist on their own, within the realm of cryptocurrency.

As I part, keep in mind there is over $42,000,000,000,000 worth of wealth in this world (source, ahem, XKCD) and all of crypto accounts for less than 1% of 1%.  There is room for everyone to innovate and capture the remaining 99.99%. Both Qora and Nxt.  If we both want this crypto-movement to mean anything we need to stop attacking one another (even if they started it) and start making useful tools that people outside of crypto will look at and go "Aha! I get it! Let me get into this crypto thing!"

[rabbiter]

Guys, so long as Qora decides to keep the source sealed, we must accept that all arguments about originality are opinion-based, regardless of the coins you support.  If you cannot accept that the originating-state of the source (i.e copied, or not) is completely unknown, then this is going to be a tough coin to evaluate.

CfB, I appreciate your willingness to validate the source.  IMHO, this is good news, just of no immediate benefit.  I've said it before, I'll say it again.  I own a lot of Qora and I own a lot of Nxt.  I also don't care if Qora cloned an early copy of Nxt.  And so what if it was?  The dev is trying to branch out on an "original" front and if he does release this source, I've been intrigued with the nature of his silent work long enough that I'm becoming motivated to support it as a core dev "just because".

In other words, Nxt clone or not, this coin has potential to improve and be worth far more than it is now.  For now, attacking Nxt (for any reason) is like a cub attacking a dominate lion.  Pretty dumb today... but some cubs do grow up to be stronger than their father's.

Supporting Qora is an exercise in faith and patience.  Your faith is a factor of the size of your stake in the coin.

My personal hope is that bugs will be worked out, features will continue and once a little "shiny" is added to the application, we can push it by building out supported tools that can exist on their own, within the realm of cryptocurrency.

As I part, keep in mind there is over $42,000,000,000,000 worth of wealth in this world (source, ahem, XKCD) and all of crypto accounts for less than 1% of 1%.  There is room for everyone to innovate and capture the remaining 99.99%. Both Qora and Nxt.  If we both want this crypto-movement to mean anything we need to stop attacking one another (even if they started it) and start making useful tools that people outside of crypto will look at and go "Aha! I get it! Let me get into this crypto thing!"

While I like your attitude and appreciate your input I disagree on a few points that are important issues.

The fact is Qora has said he had almost no prior knowledge of NXT and has built Qora based on no coin and if he was looking to improve on any coin then it would be Bitcoin which has stated was the purpose and goal of Qora.

So this idea that is somehow ok that he did in fact rip off parts of NXT matter a damn lot and is half the reason people not in the QOra camp have been able to undermine Qora with slights about it just being a reworked NXT.

Imagine if you had built something from scratch and then some other coin says oh you just copied half of ours WHEN YOU DIDNT!!! I would be annoyed to say the least. Honestly Qora must be a saint not to of gone all out on defending Qora as not NXT based I mean he knows the source code was going to come out so he must know his integrity is in question if the code has like 40% NXT code. So I'm thinking the best that he indeed has the patience of a siant and hasnt said a word against all these accusations. he has stated that it has no other coin was used to make Qora but apart from that he has been silent.

To me its simple its a question of Qora's integrity and indeed Qora's worth. If Qora is indeed a brand new source with NOTHING ot do with NXT then it should actually be valued on a similar level as NXT, who came first is of no importance if its entirely a different project.

So when people slip that little clause in 'oh it dosen't matter if Qora was developed from NXT' then you are basically saying its ok Qora is a damn liar and also that you have almost no faith in him telling the truth and probably he is lying. Its not just about questioning his integrity its also about questioning what you care about (not you personally, the concept).


Qora has been held back from the start over this NXT connection that I believe is invalid and a way for Qora to undermined as the innovative work it is. This whole oh its got similar functions so it must not be new cause NXT already did it! And therefore its similarity in function (functions that everyone has been calling for for years I might add) is as poor an argument as you can get. This of course is not an attack on NXT its an attack on the idea that they have any more connection than NXT has to Bitcoin or Ripple.

[jabo38]

Hey guys,

I will gain access to a private qora repository this week, and i can easily verify if it is or not nxt based. From the talks we had with qora about the intergration of the AT , i got the feeling that has some basic fundamendal at least difference from nxt. Now if some parts or ideas were borrowed from the nxt platform, i dont see why that is a problem.

Well.... this is great news. 

There is a lot of people on both sides really vested in their position.  Somebodies going to get their heart broken, but its gotta be done.  And I am guessing there will be a lot of "told you so" going on.  Hahahaha

Lets hope vbcs really gets a good look and makes the announcement.  I think the sooner the better so this can all be put to rest.

[Wulfcastle]

Qora promised Voting System and it was delivered.
Qora promised Arbitrary Transactions and it was delivered.
Qora promised wallet upgrades and it was delivered.
Qora promised Asset Exchange and it was delivered.
Now Turing Complete and new GUI is promised, so I would expect delivery

Why the volume is low? I don't know.

This looks suspicious. All these features were in Nxt source code (even Voting System which simply lacked client support in NRS and hence wasn't considered as "released") and Qora didn't offer any unique feature. It looks like Qora is really Nxt but with its own client part. We could solve this riddle easily in such the manner:

1. Someone sends me complete source code of Qora.
2. I check if it can be a modified Nxt.
3. I don't share the source code and delete it after the analysis without any copies kept.

Do you want to stop the FUD about Qora being a clone of Nxt?

Shit just got real, ball is in your court now Qora.

[wizzardTim]

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=522102.msg9294813#msg9294813

BOOM  

[BlackShibe1]

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=522102.msg9294813#msg9294813

BOOM  

[PondSea]

Nearly 10BTC worth bought on bter in an instant