Destroy Bitcoin Foundation?

[nelruk]

I've been reading a lot but writing few about the Bitcoin Foundation. It seems most of you don't have a good image of this foundation, since they made a lot of mistakes.

I have three puntual questions about it and I would like to hear opinions:

1.- Is Bitcoin Foundation necessary?
(Depending what your answer 1 is)
If yes: why should we support it?
If no: why would you like to destroy it?

2.- What were the mistakes made by the Foundation? Did they do something to fix the errors?
3.- What is your alternative proposition to Bitcoin Foundation? And if it's running, I would like to know what is it?

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[DannyHamilton]

I've been reading a lot but writing few about the Bitcoin Foundation. It seems most of you don't have a good image of this foundation, since they made a lot of mistakes.

I have three puntual questions about it and I would like to hear opinions:

1.- Is Bitcoin Foundation necessary?

No

(Depending what your answer 1 is)
If yes: why should we support it?

You shouldn't

If no: why would you like to destroy it?

I wouldn't like to destroy it.  I just don't see any need to support it since I don't think it is necessary.

2.- What were the mistakes made by the Foundation?

I don't know.  I don't care.  They are a private club that has given themselves a fancy sounding name.  Why would any mistakes they make matter to me?

Did they do something to fix the errors?

I don't know.  I don't care.  They are a private club that has given themselves a fancy sounding name.  Why would the things that they do to fix their mistakes matter to me?

3.- What is your alternative proposition to Bitcoin Foundation? And if it's running, I would like to know what is it?

I prefer The Bitcoin Association.  It's a private club that I created with my friends. We do much better work and are much more trustworthy.  If anyone wants to join my club, they just have to send me 100 BTC for a full membership.  This will provide them with all the rights and privileges that come with club membership.

[RodeoX]

I don't think bitcoin is going anywhere except legislative death without a lobby group. A lot of people think the government should do this or that, they do not hear you and are not interested in listening. They do however listen to lobbyists. It's not cool, but that is the way it is. I am aware of no other effort to provide guidance to the government in regulating bitcoin.

Make no mistake, there are new laws coming. The only question is whether they will be made with input from the bitcoin community or just made up by regulators who don't even understand it. Here in the U.S. that is the greatest threat to bitcoin.

[Spendulus]

I don't think bitcoin is going anywhere except legislative death without a lobby group. A lot of people think the government should do this or that, they do not hear you and are not interested in listening. They do however listen to lobbyists. It's not cool, but that is the way it is. I am aware of no other effort to provide guidance to the government in regulating bitcoin.

Make no mistake, there are new laws coming. The only question is whether they will be made with input from the bitcoin community or just made up by regulators who don't even understand it. Here in the U.S. that is the greatest threat to bitcoin.

Actually, none of that is true. 

All of it may seem to be true in the very short term in the local environment.  In the medium and long term and the global environment it is a different story.

We have dozens of clear examples of substitute currencies starting to be used historically, we know how this happens and why.  It happens most commonly due to abuse of the national fiat currency by the government and in opposition to it.

[Rampton]

1.- Is Bitcoin Foundation necessary?

3.- What is your alternative proposition to Bitcoin Foundation? And if it's running, I would like to know what is it?

1) No, it's not necessary but we can't do anything about that. All we can reiterate is that they're a centralized organization of a decentralized idea and they don't necessarily support the whole community.

3). We don't need one, but at the end of the day anyone could create their own foundation. The current one isn't the "official" one and I don't see how it ever could be.

[RodeoX]

I am basing my statements on what I have been told by regulators that I personally talked with. I assure you guys that they are not going to entertain rants from the internet. They will listen to individual opinions only if they get a huge number of emails or a lesser number of snail-mail letters. But mostly they listen to lobbyists. Some of it is just for reasons of practicality. For example, they may schedule a meeting to talk about bitcoin with elected officials. Could you fly to Washington D.C. to make that meeting next week? I can't. So I pooled my money with others at the foundation to hire a pro to represent our opinions about not regulating bitcoin. They will hear my voice, but will they hear yours?

[xmasdobo]

Here's another Bitcoin Foundation question...  Why is this secretive foundation had so much turnover? And why are they not pushing for decentralized crypto exchanges? Centralized exchanges are an insult and outright contradiction of bitcoin and the blockchain!

[Spendulus]

I am basing my statements on what I have been told by regulators that I personally talked with. I assure you guys that they are not going to entertain rants from the internet. They will listen to individual opinions only if they get a huge number of emails or a lesser number of snail-mail letters. But mostly they listen to lobbyists. Some of it is just for reasons of practicality. For example, they may schedule a meeting to talk about bitcoin with elected officials. Could you fly to Washington D.C. to make that meeting next week? I can't. So I pooled my money with others at the foundation to hire a pro to represent our opinions about not regulating bitcoin. They will hear my voice, but will they hear yours?

Actually, no they won't hear your voice.  Not ever, from the BitcoinF.

They'll hear what the major players tell the "pro" to say.

And it won't be something that helps you.  Unless what's Good For Karpeles and Shrem is Good for You.

[S133p]

Here's another Bitcoin Foundation question...  Why is this secretive foundation had so much turnover? And why are they not pushing for decentralized crypto exchanges? Centralized exchanges are an insult and outright contradiction of bitcoin and the blockchain!

The short answer is greed. In Bitcoin's early days a lot of people were willing to donate to them and they donated in terms of bitcoin, which has since risen significantly in price since they received the majority of their donations. By not being transparent, they can prevent them from receiving pressure to spend more of their money on the community. 

[gweedo]

1.- Is Bitcoin Foundation necessary?
(Depending what your answer 1 is)
If yes: why should we support it?
If no: why would you like to destroy it?

No, and no they are a lighting rod and it is better than other people to take the blame.

2.- What were the mistakes made by the Foundation? Did they do something to fix the errors?

What mistakes weren't made, they control the official client, they pay developers to do nothing. They allow people with criminal pass be board members. The biggest mistake they sat by as Mt Gox imploded.

3.- What is your alternative proposition to Bitcoin Foundation? And if it's running, I would like to know what is it?

Nothing, let us be we don't need a core of bitcoin.

[gweedo]

I don't think bitcoin is going anywhere except legislative death without a lobby group. A lot of people think the government should do this or that, they do not hear you and are not interested in listening. They do however listen to lobbyists. It's not cool, but that is the way it is. I am aware of no other effort to provide guidance to the government in regulating bitcoin.

Make no mistake, there are new laws coming. The only question is whether they will be made with input from the bitcoin community or just made up by regulators who don't even understand it. Here in the U.S. that is the greatest threat to bitcoin.

The foundation has done nothing to better this and I disagree we don't need government to do anything. Bitcoin is not political stop making it.

[Ron~Popeil]

The beauty of it is that anyone can start a bitcoin group to lobby, work on PR stuff or anything else that they think is important. If the ideas this group puts forward are good and they make a coherent case for them people will naturally move in that direction with donations and other kinds of support.

The bitcoin foundation we talk about is somewhat irrelevant outside of the attention we give them.

[TinaK]

I think it is necessary, which as American workers need workers' associations, women need women's associations, Hitler need alliance of political parties and so on.

Not only do we need to Bitcoin Foundation, and according to the principle of separation of powers, we also need to establish the Bitcoin Supervisory Board and the Global Bitcoin Parliament

[bluemountain]

I think it is necessary, which as American workers need workers' associations, women need women's associations, Hitler need alliance of political parties and so on.

Not only do we need to Bitcoin Foundation, and according to the principle of separation of powers, we also need to establish the Bitcoin Supervisory Board and the Global Bitcoin Parliament

I hope you are kidding about this. Your examples of what is "necessary" are increasingly bad ideas, as the subjects that are represented in each of your examples get worse and worse off when they participate in each of your examples.

It is obviously not good to have TBF, nor do we need any of your other suggestions to "help" bitcoin

[TinaK]

I think it is necessary, which as American workers need workers' associations, women need women's associations, Hitler need alliance of political parties and so on.

Not only do we need to Bitcoin Foundation, and according to the principle of separation of powers, we also need to establish the Bitcoin Supervisory Board and the Global Bitcoin Parliament

I hope you are kidding about this. Your examples of what is "necessary" are increasingly bad ideas, as the subjects that are represented in each of your examples get worse and worse off when they participate in each of your examples.

It is obviously not good to have TBF, nor do we need any of your other suggestions to "help" bitcoin

okay, I listened your voice, but what's your idea? could you share it with me?

[Tarantino]

I don't think we should concern ourselves too much with The Foundation. I'm sure they will destroy themselves eventually but the public must realise they don't own or control bitcoin.

[RodeoX]

You guys can say what you want. I know what I know because I am directly involved. The meetings that will decide the laws concerning bitcoin are happening now. I don't understand how you think it is better to let people with zero knowledge decide for you. And spend your time infighting? You are the banks best friend in this. 

There is just something cultural in the bitcoin community about being superstitious and resistant to any organized anything. That opinion will not stop the train and I think we are loosing the regulation battle at the moment. We have only one shot at this. Once laws are passed, overturning them is unlikely.

[nelruk]

Having read all the posts you did (thanks at first), I can see the Bitcoin Foundation has some Public relations problems considering they have been envolved at Mt gox mess, Board members dark side and little advance considering the money spent in developers. Actually the only developer I always see making AMA and other activities in the web is Andresen, nobody else.

Also, RodeoX is telling us what is like to fight in the political front making lobby but beyond that (I'm very honest at this) I didn't see any efforts to keep moving to make Bitcoin a global contribution and maybe I'm wrong because I didn't see the activities. Are there?

[hsz]

And, Here's another Bitcoin Foundation question:Who are using Bitcoin?

[countryfree]

We need to make the difference between necessary and useful.

There's another topic about a central bank, that is totally unnecessary and it would be totally useless, but a foundation can be useful. It can act as a lobby group, and everybody shall remember that we live in a world dominated by huge lobby groups. So having one dedicated to BTC can help. Besides that, the latest release of bitcoin core software is 0.9.3 and we need some need kind of organization to decide what new features future releases shall get. A foundation looks like the best thing to do that.

Having said that, I understand today's foundation is far from perfect, but our politicians aren't either. Our cars are not perfect. YOU are not perfect and neither am I. Nothing and nobody's perfect, but I believe I'm useful to a few people, and so does the foundation.