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Author Topic: TheButterZone Removed From Default Trust  (Read 6591 times)
TECSHARE
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May 17, 2015, 04:15:57 PM
 #81

IMO the only reason they removed him in the first place is because they had just removed me from the default trust list for basically the same situation and they didn't want to look like even bigger hypocrites. This is why they are letting him back on because it was just a show to make it look like that actually enforce the rules for everyone.

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May 17, 2015, 04:25:01 PM
 #82

IMO the only reason they removed him in the first place is because they had just removed me from the default trust list for basically the same situation and they didn't want to look like even bigger hypocrites. This is why they are letting him back on because it was just a show to make it look like that actually enforce the rules for everyone.
TheButterZone also changed his negative rating to a neutral. From what I can see, it appears that you still have a negative rating on armis. TBZ also does not have quite the obsession of being included in default trust and has carried on about his business within the forum
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May 17, 2015, 05:10:04 PM
 #83

IMO the only reason they removed him in the first place is because they had just removed me from the default trust list for basically the same situation and they didn't want to look like even bigger hypocrites. This is why they are letting him back on because it was just a show to make it look like that actually enforce the rules for everyone.
TheButterZone also changed his negative rating to a neutral. From what I can see, it appears that you still have a negative rating on armis. TBZ also does not have quite the obsession of being included in default trust and has carried on about his business within the forum

I never asked to be on the default trust list, not once. I harp on the subject because the rules are unwritten and selectively enforced. It is a corrupt system. I don't want to be on it, I want it to end. I left my negative rating because I was told over and over again that trust ratings are not moderated, yet Theymos and other staff members had no problem coercing me into changing my rating by personally seeing to it that I was not only removed from the default trust, but then a new feature was added, so that I could be excluded from it 2x so that others on the default trust list could not re-add me.

That does not sound like an unmoderated trust system, this is a trust dictatorship where Theymos and only Theymos chose who stays and who goes. Furthermore they can't be bothered to post rules, or even uniformly enforce their unwritten rules. Armis was the perpetrator, and Theymos was happy to have an excuse to get personally involved and make sure I was removed and then excluded for the unforgivable crime of not following his orders to change my rating.

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May 17, 2015, 05:16:25 PM
 #84

IMO the only reason they removed him in the first place is because they had just removed me from the default trust list for basically the same situation and they didn't want to look like even bigger hypocrites. This is why they are letting him back on because it was just a show to make it look like that actually enforce the rules for everyone.
TheButterZone also changed his negative rating to a neutral. From what I can see, it appears that you still have a negative rating on armis. TBZ also does not have quite the obsession of being included in default trust and has carried on about his business within the forum

I never asked to be on the default trust list, not once. I harp on the subject because the rules are unwritten and selectively enforced. It is a corrupt system. I don't want to be on it, I want it to end. I left my negative rating because I was told over and over again that trust ratings are not moderated, yet Theymos and other staff members had no problem coercing me into changing my rating by personally seeing to it that I was not only removed from the default trust, but then a new feature was added, so that I could be excluded from it 2x so that others on the default trust list could not re-add me.

That does not sound like an unmoderated trust system, this is a trust dictatorship where Theymos and only Theymos chose who stays and who goes. Furthermore they can't be bothered to post rules, or even uniformly enforce their unwritten rules. Armis was the perpetrator, and Theymos was happy to have an excuse to get personally involved and make sure I was removed and then excluded for the unforgivable crime of not following his orders to change my rating.

Can I ask you again if you really want to be again in the defaultTrust list (depth 2) or do you want only that the whole trust system must be destroyed/removed? Thanks and I think your reply will make all the context clearer.
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May 17, 2015, 05:20:05 PM
 #85

IMO the only reason they removed him in the first place is because they had just removed me from the default trust list for basically the same situation and they didn't want to look like even bigger hypocrites. This is why they are letting him back on because it was just a show to make it look like that actually enforce the rules for everyone.
TheButterZone also changed his negative rating to a neutral. From what I can see, it appears that you still have a negative rating on armis. TBZ also does not have quite the obsession of being included in default trust and has carried on about his business within the forum

I never asked to be on the default trust list, not once. I harp on the subject because the rules are unwritten and selectively enforced. It is a corrupt system. I don't want to be on it, I want it to end. I left my negative rating because I was told over and over again that trust ratings are not moderated, yet Theymos and other staff members had no problem coercing me into changing my rating by personally seeing to it that I was not only removed from the default trust, but then a new feature was added, so that I could be excluded from it 2x so that others on the default trust list could not re-add me.

That does not sound like an unmoderated trust system, this is a trust dictatorship where Theymos and only Theymos chose who stays and who goes. Furthermore they can't be bothered to post rules, or even uniformly enforce their unwritten rules. Armis was the perpetrator, and Theymos was happy to have an excuse to get personally involved and make sure I was removed and then excluded for the unforgivable crime of not following his orders to change my rating.
It sounds like to me that theymos simply doesn't want ratings that are obviously outright inaccurate, and based on a personal dispute, and have zero to do with trust. Sure the trust system is not moderated, but that does not mean that others want to rely on trust ratings given by someone who leaves ratings that are regarding a personal dispute
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May 17, 2015, 06:23:14 PM
Last edit: May 17, 2015, 07:17:35 PM by TheButterZone
 #86

IMO the only reason they removed him in the first place is because they had just removed me from the default trust list for basically the same situation and they didn't want to look like even bigger hypocrites. This is why they are letting him back on because it was just a show to make it look like that actually enforce the rules for everyone.

TS for example, tried for months to damage my credibility with libel.  In my mind, that makes him untrustworthy and I left the appropriate trust.

So as we can see here, Vod's general reasoning on libel and neg trust is functionally indistinguishable from mine.

TECSHARE: If your case is truly what I bolded, then copy and paste the following* to make it absolutely clear that you've received unequal treatment:

Vod says he got libeled. Vod leaves negative trust on libelers. Vod wasn't removed from default trust (DT) for that.
TheButterZone says he got libeled. TheButterZone left 1 negative trust on 1 libeler using, unknowingly at the time, basically the same reasoning as Vod. He was removed from DT T2 for that, and restored only after downgrading it to a neutral. Vod hasn't similarly had to convert his negs on libelers to neutrals to stay in DT.
I, TECSHARE got libeled. I left negative trust on a libeler, using basically the same reasoning as Vod. I was removed from DT (T2?) for that despite Vod not being removed for the same thing.
I petition for myself, and all who leave negative trust on libelers, to receive equal consideration and treatment as Vod.



ETA: T1s dooglus and tomatocage appear to be Vod's T2 sponsors, so that's who I would petition first. It only appears that Vod is allowed to neg trust libelers ad infinitum without costing his T2, because of them.

Saying that you don't trust someone because of their behavior is completely valid.
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May 17, 2015, 07:37:03 PM
 #87

IMO the only reason they removed him in the first place is because they had just removed me from the default trust list for basically the same situation and they didn't want to look like even bigger hypocrites. This is why they are letting him back on because it was just a show to make it look like that actually enforce the rules for everyone.

TS for example, tried for months to damage my credibility with libel.  In my mind, that makes him untrustworthy and I left the appropriate trust.

So as we can see here, Vod's general reasoning on libel and neg trust is functionally indistinguishable from mine.

TECSHARE: If your case is truly what I bolded, then copy and paste the following* to make it absolutely clear that you've received unequal treatment:

Vod says he got libeled. Vod leaves negative trust on libelers. Vod wasn't removed from default trust (DT) for that.
TheButterZone says he got libeled. TheButterZone left 1 negative trust on 1 libeler using, unknowingly at the time, basically the same reasoning as Vod. He was removed from DT T2 for that, and restored only after downgrading it to a neutral. Vod hasn't similarly had to convert his negs on libelers to neutrals to stay in DT.
I, TECSHARE got libeled. I left negative trust on a libeler, using basically the same reasoning as Vod. I was removed from DT (T2?) for that despite Vod not being removed for the same thing.
I petition for myself, and all who leave negative trust on libelers, to receive equal consideration and treatment as Vod.



ETA: T1s dooglus and tomatocage appear to be Vod's T2 sponsors, so that's who I would petition first. It only appears that Vod is allowed to neg trust libelers ad infinitum without costing his T2, because of them.

So are you going to answer my question or are you going to keep being an instigator? The misuse of the trust system is fucking disgusting and people like you who are given power are the reason it's broken. There's a HUGE difference between you and everyone else's case. This is a clear case of trust system abuse, and you also went back and corrected your previous abuse after I had called you out on it. The trust system is supposed to be used for trading and conducting trades, not bullshit fucking drama and people who are on power trips. I've always been fair with my ratings and giving people feedback, but this is just disgusting to me. You do not deserve to be on the default trust list nor should your opinion be trusted.
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May 17, 2015, 07:40:39 PM
 #88

So are you going to answer my question or are you going to keep being an instigator? The misuse of the trust system is fucking disgusting and people like you who are given power are the reason it's broken. There's a HUGE difference between you and everyone else's case. This is a clear case of trust system abuse, and you also went back and corrected your previous abuse after I had called you out on it. The trust system is supposed to be used for trading and conducting trades, not bullshit fucking drama and people who are on power trips.
The trust system is not for trading, it is to determine how trustworthy someone is.

You are right that it is not for drama, however the issue has been resolved so there is no real reason why TBZ should not be back in the default trust network

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Wardrick
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May 17, 2015, 07:53:00 PM
Last edit: May 17, 2015, 08:05:40 PM by Wardrick
 #89

So are you going to answer my question or are you going to keep being an instigator? The misuse of the trust system is fucking disgusting and people like you who are given power are the reason it's broken. There's a HUGE difference between you and everyone else's case. This is a clear case of trust system abuse, and you also went back and corrected your previous abuse after I had called you out on it. The trust system is supposed to be used for trading and conducting trades, not bullshit fucking drama and people who are on power trips.
The trust system is not for trading, it is to determine how trustworthy someone is.

You are right that it is not for drama, however the issue has been resolved so there is no real reason why TBZ should not be back in the default trust network

Exactly it's to determine the level of trust of an individual, which is mainly used for trading and business. TBZ has used it because of his own personal opinion and that has nothing to do with whether or not I should be trusted. The reason for my feedback had nothing at all to do with trust. Also I don't think the issue is resolved, TBZ is failing to take any blame or come to a conclusion with me at any point. People like this should not be on the default trust list. TBZ sent me a download link in which I tipped him, where he reduced his rating to a neutral. He didn't do it because of the forum rules or to come to a resolution. The trust system is broken if people can make a comment and have somebody lash out at them using the system because they have more power (At the time I wasn't on D2) That's why people like this need to be axed from D2, or just change the trust system all together.


It's also not a big deal, but I don't take lightly to misuse of the trust system, especially when it's aimed towards me. I'm perfectly fine with leaving the forum because I'm not going to have this crap be done to me and nothing be done about it. I'm curious to see whether or not the forum thinks that TBZ's use of the trust system, based off the two or three comments that were no big deal in the first place, went across the line into abuse of the trust system. There's several uses for the trust system, but I'm positive that's not one of them.
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May 17, 2015, 08:21:52 PM
 #90

The trust system is not for trading, it is to determine how trustworthy someone is.

Indeed. He'd proven himself worthy of distrust by aggressive libel, but as he could have reinforced his negative trust by welching on his bounty just because I was the one who claimed it, and he didn't welch, I downgraded it to neutral.

Saying that you don't trust someone because of their behavior is completely valid.
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May 17, 2015, 09:15:43 PM
 #91

Vod hasn't similarly had to convert his negs on libelers to neutrals to stay in DT.
I, TECSHARE got libeled. I left negative trust on a libeler, using basically the same reasoning as Vod. I was removed from DT (T2?) for that despite Vod not being removed for the same thing.
I petition for myself, and all who leave negative trust on libelers, to receive equal consideration and treatment as Vod.

TBZ - I understand you no have no way of knowing this, so I won't blame you for it.

On at least one occasion, I have personally contact by Theymos and told a couple negative ratings left unfair is his opinion.  I changed them to neutral.  Had I not, I may very well have been removed from DT.   Undecided   Badbear removed me from his trust list because he didn't agree with my ratings.   I've been given at least one warning from TomatoCage about my ratings.

It's obvious (at least to me) that I am not protected by anyone, nor do I receive special treatment here.

BTW TBZ - you are on default trust, trusted under Badbear.

I'm into creating universes, smiting people, writing holy books and listening to Prayer Messages (PMs).
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May 17, 2015, 09:37:16 PM
 #92

Vod hasn't similarly had to convert his negs on libelers to neutrals to stay in DT.
I, TECSHARE got libeled. I left negative trust on a libeler, using basically the same reasoning as Vod. I was removed from DT (T2?) for that despite Vod not being removed for the same thing.
I petition for myself, and all who leave negative trust on libelers, to receive equal consideration and treatment as Vod.

TBZ - I understand you no have no way of knowing this, so I won't blame you for it.

On at least one occasion, I have personally contact by Theymos and told a couple negative ratings left unfair is his opinion.  I changed them to neutral.  Had I not, I may very well have been removed from DT.   Undecided   Badbear removed me from his trust list because he didn't agree with my ratings.   I've been given at least one warning from TomatoCage about my ratings.

It's obvious (at least to me) that I am not protected by anyone, nor do I receive special treatment here.

BTW TBZ - you are on default trust, trusted under Badbear.

Ok. So you changed some to neutral, but not 100% of your neg trusts of libelers. And you didn't mention if dooglus had warned you or not. So, BadBear removed you. Theymos might have removed you. You're yellow-carded (sorry, football reference) by TomatoCage, so even if Tomato removed you (RED CARD!), you'd still be on DT via dooglus, assuming nothing changed on his/her end.

Saying that you don't trust someone because of their behavior is completely valid.
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May 18, 2015, 05:52:05 AM
 #93

TheButterZone is now on default trust list again and he deserve this, I wonder how someone get into default trust list.
Its good to be on default trust list so that whenever they find a scammer(with proofs) they can leave him a negative trust so other people get warned about this, I have to send the message to default trust member to leave neg trust when I find a pot. scammer because my trust doesn't matter or add warning to their account.I have recieved weird response in past from default trust list member when I reported a scammer to him. Tongue

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May 18, 2015, 05:54:01 AM
 #94

Vod hasn't similarly had to convert his negs on libelers to neutrals to stay in DT.
I, TECSHARE got libeled. I left negative trust on a libeler, using basically the same reasoning as Vod. I was removed from DT (T2?) for that despite Vod not being removed for the same thing.
I petition for myself, and all who leave negative trust on libelers, to receive equal consideration and treatment as Vod.

TBZ - I understand you no have no way of knowing this, so I won't blame you for it.

On at least one occasion, I have personally contact by Theymos and told a couple negative ratings left unfair is his opinion.  I changed them to neutral.  Had I not, I may very well have been removed from DT.   Undecided   Badbear removed me from his trust list because he didn't agree with my ratings.   I've been given at least one warning from TomatoCage about my ratings.

It's obvious (at least to me) that I am not protected by anyone, nor do I receive special treatment here.

BTW TBZ - you are on default trust, trusted under Badbear.

Ok. So you changed some to neutral, but not 100% of your neg trusts of libelers. And you didn't mention if dooglus had warned you or not. So, BadBear removed you. Theymos might have removed you. You're yellow-carded (sorry, football reference) by TomatoCage, so even if Tomato removed you (RED CARD!), you'd still be on DT via dooglus, assuming nothing changed on his/her end.

Why is that?  Because I do a lot more good than I do harm.  I'm an asset to the community, but in no way protected.

I'm into creating universes, smiting people, writing holy books and listening to Prayer Messages (PMs).
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June 09, 2017, 12:13:28 PM
 #95

Meanwhile people like butterzone go around every day leaving trust for people who don't even have any direct involvement with them, but my use of trust to defend myself from harassment was wrong.  Roll Eyes

When the neutral trust option bubble was added a few days ago, I downgraded almost all my negs to neutrals as appropriate. I think all the negs I've left are now for the "I am a victim of this person, so nemo me impune lacessit" circumstances.

I'm not sure about the whole menstrual deal, but he gave me negative feedback too.  Only after my 2nd post with no warning. 

I have never even dealed with him.

I'm trying to run an honest business but with people like this my noob reputation now became untrusted noob.
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June 09, 2017, 05:19:33 PM
 #96

Meanwhile people like butterzone go around every day leaving trust for people who don't even have any direct involvement with them, but my use of trust to defend myself from harassment was wrong.  Roll Eyes

When the neutral trust option bubble was added a few days ago, I downgraded almost all my negs to neutrals as appropriate. I think all the negs I've left are now for the "I am a victim of this person, so nemo me impune lacessit" circumstances.

I'm not sure about the whole menstrual deal, but he gave me negative feedback too.  Only after my 2nd post with no warning.  

I have never even dealed with him.

I'm trying to run an honest business but with people like this my noob reputation now became untrusted noob.

Sorry, how long am I supposed to wait for PayPal to start reversing all the PayPal Friends and Family payments you send to your customers after you bold-faced lied about those payments being irreversible?

I offer paying with Paypal (send money as a friend) which is not reversable just like bitcoin.

 Angry

Even if we assume for the sake of argument that you don't personally reverse your payments to your customers... as soon as any of your customers have PayPal reverse payment on YOU (or PayPal does it on their own volition, or there's a court order or other legal action), there begins a domino effect well-known to veteran BTC traders, where anyone you paid with those funds (even if you used one account to receive from customers, sent to another separate pay-to-customers account, then paid them from that one), has your payment reversed out of their account, through all accounts back to the original payer/reverser.

Saying that you don't trust someone because of their behavior is completely valid.
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June 09, 2017, 08:53:22 PM
 #97

I offer paying with Paypal (send money as a friend) which is not reversable just like bitcoin.
Angry
That is an outright lie. I've left him a negative rating as well.

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Maum
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February 10, 2018, 01:21:13 PM
Last edit: February 10, 2018, 01:46:01 PM by Maum
Merited by dillpicklechips (3)
 #98

I bump this thread, because his last activities got my attention and are clearly abusing the trust system. He tags members because of "violating" his own "auction term" and only wants to remove, when he gets paid a certain amount.
I would name that
"abusing trust system for personal advantages".
Please have a look to his trust page. Two tags of 12/29/2017
The members asked questions, they shouldn't have to ask. But they didn't have a trade with him and didn't scam, as I see this.
I do not speak for certain members, because I do not know them and their activities. But I stand against abuse of the trust system.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=60600
Maybe it was not his intention to abuse the trust system for his own advantages, but it looks like that to me.
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February 10, 2018, 06:57:25 PM
 #99

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2661903.0;all

Saying that you don't trust someone because of their behavior is completely valid.
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February 10, 2018, 10:17:37 PM
 #100

This thread is a PERFECT example of why theymos needs to seriously look into the DT list and start removing some users.
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