Losing faith

[TheTribesman]

I like the 'bigger fools' theory.

[dinofelis]

The only steps to get higher prices/value for BTC. If any of the traders miners in this world would start to buy a 0.1 each BTC price will rise to 1000$ easily and if anybody will keep holding it, it will always keep the exponential rise pattern.

... which would serve no purpose at all except making you somewhat poorer than you would have been without those coins.

Because what's the point in sitting on a stash of coins that are "worth a billion", on the condition that you never sell them ?  If you never spend them, the only thing you did was to have wasted some fiat you could have used to buy something you enjoyed (a holiday, a car, a new computer, a present for someone) into something you will never turn into something of any use.

Money is a store of value.... with the idea to cash in on that value one day.  Money doesn't serve any other purpose.

If bitcoin is to be money, it has to be spend on buying stuff that is actually useful to people.  Next week, next year, 10 years from now, it doesn't matter.  But it has to be spend buying stuff. 

To illustrate this, consider the following:

if you are really onto holding coins for ever, throw away your private keys !
Now, where will that bring you ? :-)

[lionelpaul]

If bitcoin is to be money, it has to be spend on buying stuff that is actually useful to people.  Next week, next year, 10 years from now, it doesn't matter.  But it has to be spend buying stuff. 

Totally agree.
It's strange to see people complaining every day about the rise and fall of BTC against $, which comes from speculation, while treating Bitcoin only as a speculative tool... Are you paying the same attention to the price of $ against € or £ or any other currency? Probably not, and the reason is that you don't care: you're just using your dollars every day, to buy stuff and live.

The most important thing about Bitcoin's future is not its value in fiat, it's its adoption. We should not be concerned about whether BTC will be worth $100 or $10,000. We should worry about the possibility that one day, 10,000,000 merchants worldwide accept Bitcoin, (instead of 100,000 now). When Bitcoin is accepted pretty much everywhere, nobody will care much about its value against USD.

[dinofelis]

If bitcoin is to be money, it has to be spend on buying stuff that is actually useful to people.  Next week, next year, 10 years from now, it doesn't matter.  But it has to be spend buying stuff. 

Totally agree.
It's strange to see people complaining every day about the rise and fall of BTC against $, which comes from speculation, while treating Bitcoin only as a speculative tool... Are you paying the same attention to the price of $ against € or £ or any other currency? Probably not, and the reason is that you don't care: you're just using your dollars every day, to buy stuff and live.

The most important thing about Bitcoin's future is not its value in fiat, it's its adoption. We should not be concerned about whether BTC will be worth $100 or $10,000. We should worry about the possibility that one day, 10,000,000 merchants worldwide accept Bitcoin, (instead of 100,000 now). When Bitcoin is accepted pretty much everywhere, nobody will care much about its value against USD.

Amen.  That's why I'm saying that the most important fundamental of bitcoin is merchant adoption.
Without that, bitcoin is indeed just a Ponzi scheme. And with that, it cannot go wrong.

For the moment, merchant adoption is on the rise, but I don't think that the current merchant adoption can even carry the current market cap - except maybe merchant adoption in the black markets.

This is why we shouldn't expect any sustainable price rise soon in my opinion, and yet another bursting bubble will do bitcoin more harm than good. 

Price will rise when merchant adoption generalizes, and if it doesn't generalize, bitcoin is essentially dead.  But that will take time.

[SunBin]

I bought in at 1000 , 750 , 650 , 450 , 350 , 270 , 350 , 420 , 350

Why are we still going down?
Is bitcoin failing?

It looks like he is right..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GYJdOiLqSxE

He sound like a genius right now. I don't think it is a coincidence Satoshi left this community.

[arbitrage001]

Everyone know bitcoin is a bubble. Some cash out too earlier and regret their actions.

It is not too late to cash out if one is an early adopter.

[piramida]

Everyone know bitcoin is a bubble.

Everyone know arbitrage001 is a dummy.

See? That's the sound of your empty statement with absolutely no ties to reality collapsing under it's own stupidity.

[picolo]

Everyone know bitcoin is a bubble. Some cash out too earlier and regret their actions.

It is not too late to cash out if one is an early adopter.

Early adopters that didn't believe in Bitcoin sold at 10$ or 30$ and were wrong so they don't have many bitcoins to sell anymore

[KeyJockey]

Indeed, because it is a rule of nature that the past is a guarantee for the future right? In other words: Bitcoin grew tremendously in the past, so it MUST keep on growing in the future. If this really is the cornerstone of your belief in Bitcoin, or any stock in that regard that fits this profile, then you will be in for a sobering surprise at some point.

Well of course "Past Performance Is No Guarantee Of Future Results", and if you actually READ what I wrote, you may notice that I said, multiple times, that "it may not happen" and "that's the risk we take" and etc.  But thanks for your kind concern for my financial wellbeing anyway I guess, LOL.

However, are you *seriously* advocating an investment ideology equivalent to buying stock of companies who's market share, customer base, sales total, etc... nevermind simply "stock price" -- are on long-term DOWN trends?

Given two stocks, one of which is going generally up and getting increased customers and the other of which is going generally downward and getting fewer customers, I'd say that, on average, the UP TREND one will always end up doing better than the DOWNTREND one.

"No Guarantee" of course but, again, in GENERAL, on AVERAGE.

About my earlier comment about personal surroundings: this including what I pick up in the media over here (Western Europe), and Bitcoin just is not a topic in mainstream media, nor do I ever hear people talking about on the (financial) news. I don't read about it in newspapers, nor do I really read about it on sites not dedicated to Bitcoin...

LOL okay, so you also advocate taking all your investment data only from what the mainstream media tells you to believe?  Great, good luck with that.

I'd recommend, instead, actually looking at the investment, the company, the product, the MARKET DATA for yourself and then make your decisions based on your own intelligence and careful analysis of ALL data.... not just what the Tee Vee Talking Heads tell you is "truth".

But, anyway, yeah okay whatever man: if you don't like bitcoin any more... sell it.  Get out if you can't handle the long term volatility, or whatever.

The rest of us who can SEE what's really valuable and important will be happy to take your coins off your hands, no problem. 

[neurotypical]

I just do not know why some people can still make big money when prices fall.

Market manipulation and/or luck. Can't predict chaos.

[Daanie]

your name zeurpiet makes sense. lol. Nah, there are big times to come, but you were unlucky so far. Maybe trading isn't your thing.

[NotLambchop]

...LOL okay, so you also advocate taking all your investment data only from what the mainstream media tells you to believe?  Great, good luck with that.
...

I prefer to get my investment data opinions from the seediest corners of the intertubes, from Anon going by "KeyJockey" if at all possible

[johnyj]

Actually the biggest faith in bitcoin lies in the fact that fiat money is a Ponzi scheme. As long as this scam continues and more and more people start to discover this scam, bitcoin will always find its ground: Maybe bitcoin is not very ideal, but fiat money is an unsustainable Ponzi scheme

[Foxpup]

I just do not know why some people can still make big money when prices fall.

Short selling, of course. But what we really need is better options markets so that we can still make big money when prices stay the same. I hate stability.

Binary options ?

No, vanilla options.

[KeyJockey]

I prefer to get my investment data opinions from the seediest corners of the intertubes, from Anon going by "KeyJockey"

Ha, well lucky for you that I'm here then, eh?   I aim's ta please: happy to oblige  

Srsly, it's all just 'data' -- even "opinion" is "information" and ya gotta collect as much input as possible, then process it as objectively and carefully as you can, to have any chance of a really solid OUTPUT in any attempt to figure this stuff out.

This shit's just difficult, no matter how you slice it, and there's always still gonna be an element of random chance luck too.  Anything can FAIL in the end, and the weirdest most bizarre things can succeed too.  Nobody knows.

But compared to the stupid banks offering some pathetic .01% savings interest, and the built-in inflation degrading the dollar, I'm personally quite happy to park the fruits of my labor in bitcoin, even if it HAS been going down all year.

Maybe that makes me "delusional" as some above have said, or maybe a year or two from now if BTC is going for $10,000+ some people will look back at this thread and say, "Wow that guy was really a visionary"... LOL.  We'll see, one way or the other, but either way I'm happy with my decision no matter which way it ends up.  Nothing ventured, nothing gained

[NotLambchop]

...
Maybe that makes me "delusional" as some above have said, or maybe a year or two from now if BTC is going for $10,000+ some people will look back at this thread and say, "Wow that guy was really a visionary"... LOL.  ...

"We will go down in history either as the world's greatest visionaries or its biggest lolcows."--Satöshi Göring

[KeyJockey]

"LolCow"....?  So, I'm funny, how I mean, funny like I'm a clown?  I'm here to fuckin' amuse you?     

http://youtu.be/IWINtUCshxY

 

[scryptasicminer]

...
Maybe that makes me "delusional" as some above have said, or maybe a year or two from now if BTC is going for $10,000+ some people will look back at this thread and say, "Wow that guy was really a visionary"... LOL.  ...

"We will go down in history either as the world's greatest visionaries or its biggest lolcows."--Satöshi Göring

Did satoshi actually say this? Where is his original post if you don't mind linking.

[Daanie]

"LolCow"....?  So, I'm funny, how I mean, funny like I'm a clown?  I'm here to fuckin' amuse you?     

http://youtu.be/IWINtUCshxY

 

You sound like a gta v character in my head right now. Lol

[NotLambchop]

...
Maybe that makes me "delusional" as some above have said, or maybe a year or two from now if BTC is going for $10,000+ some people will look back at this thread and say, "Wow that guy was really a visionary"... LOL.  ...

"We will go down in history either as the world's greatest visionaries or its biggest lolcows."--Satöshi Göring

Did satoshi actually say this? Where is his original post if you don't mind linking.

Original post was deleted.