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Author Topic: Who or what is this math being done for?  (Read 3337 times)
Fatbat
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May 18, 2011, 06:07:17 PM
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All around the world there are thousands or millions of CPUs/GPUs grinding away on math equations in the hopes that they will "solve" one of them and reap the reward of 50 bitcoins. One thing that troubles me (and Ive yet to find the answer); who is this math being done for? I can't imagine all the CPU cycles and kilowatt hours of electricity are being wasted "just because", otherwise that would be an enormous waste of resources. This reminds me of the SETI project where you would install and app on your machine and it would utilize unused CPU cycles when your machine was idle to listed for alien communications. Who or what is the math behind the bitcoin being done for?
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May 18, 2011, 06:11:52 PM
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All around the world there are thousands or millions of CPUs/GPUs grinding away on math equations in the hopes that they will "solve" one of them and reap the reward of 50 bitcoins. One thing that troubles me (and Ive yet to find the answer); who is this math being done for? I can't imagine all the CPU cycles and kilowatt hours of electricity are being wasted "just because", otherwise that would be an enormous waste of resources. This reminds me of the SETI project where you would install and app on your machine and it would utilize unused CPU cycles when your machine was idle to listed for alien communications. Who or what is the math behind the bitcoin being done for?

The math is being done to securely process the transactions made.

As we slide down the banister of life, this is just another splinter in our ass.
gigabytecoin
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May 18, 2011, 06:12:06 PM
 #3

Read satoshi's original PDF file. It explains things best.

No, these are not being done for nothing, they are being done to secure the network.
Garrett Burgwardt
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May 18, 2011, 06:13:12 PM
 #4

Next, try the search tool.

http://forum.bitcoin.org/?topic=3770.0

That is one of many threads on the subject.
jimbobway
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May 18, 2011, 06:13:38 PM
 #5

Why do people move dirt to find gold?  Wink

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MoonShadow
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May 18, 2011, 06:17:20 PM
 #6

Why can't newbies read the forum or the wiki before asking the same questions?

"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."

- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
rezin777
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May 18, 2011, 06:20:25 PM
 #7

Why can't newbies read the forum or the wiki before asking the same questions?

The internet is new, give people a couple billion years to evolve!  Grin
MoonShadow
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May 18, 2011, 06:22:59 PM
 #8

Why can't newbies read the forum or the wiki before asking the same questions?

The internet is new, give people a couple billion years to evolve!  Grin

This is my 2036th forum post.  At least 500 of those posts are me largely repeating myself.  It gets old.

"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."

- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
Fatbat
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May 18, 2011, 06:38:08 PM
 #9

Next, try the search tool.

http://forum.bitcoin.org/?topic=3770.0

That is one of many threads on the subject.

I have used the search feature and I've read the wiki and either I didn't find the answer (as is the case with the thread you've linked to) or didn't understand what I read. Otherwise I wouldn't have asked. Some of you are being elitist assholes. This community WILL be inundated with n00bs as it gets more and more press coverage and becomes more popular. Some of the concepts involved are way beyond what the average person is even remotely capable of grasping.

Thanks for your help!
mjsbuddha
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May 18, 2011, 06:41:39 PM
 #10

Its like Ender's Game. We're killing aliens.
gigitrix
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May 18, 2011, 06:41:45 PM
 #11

Guys, the 'search elitism' and what-not isn't going to help people understand (and ultimately use) bitcoin. Yes, there may be 10 common questions you've answered 100 times before. But those questions have to be asked because bitcoin is such a revolutionary (and complicated) concept!
BitterTea
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May 18, 2011, 06:46:35 PM
 #12

Next, try the search tool.

http://forum.bitcoin.org/?topic=3770.0

That is one of many threads on the subject.

I have used the search feature and I've read the wiki and either I didn't find the answer (as is the case with the thread you've linked to) or didn't understand what I read. Otherwise I wouldn't have asked. Some of you are being elitist assholes. This community WILL be inundated with n00bs as it gets more and more press coverage and becomes more popular. Some of the concepts involved are way beyond what the average person is even remotely capable of grasping.

Thanks for your help!

The computing power is being used to perform a simple cryptographic calculation (hash) trillions of times per second (across the whole network). Each resulting hash is compared to a very small number (target) which is related to the difficulty. If the hash is less than the target, you have found a valid block. The chance that each hash will yield a valid block is the same for all individuals, all that differs is the number of times per second you can check a new hash.

That's all that miners are doing, hashing and checking. It seems like it's a waste of energy, but I know of no other way to secure the network against double spend attacks in a distributed manner. Any "meaningful" computing would fail to be...

1) Difficult to counterfeit
2) Easy to verify
sammoocow
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May 18, 2011, 07:35:23 PM
 #13

Wait, so how will transactions be verified once all 21M are out?
MoonShadow
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May 18, 2011, 07:37:31 PM
 #14

Wait, so how will transactions be verified once all 21M are out?

Long before that time, transaction fees will have become the norm, and taken over for the block reward as the primary economic incentive to participate.

"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."

- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
goatpig
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May 18, 2011, 07:38:15 PM
 #15

Wait, so how will transactions be verified once all 21M are out?

There is no reciprocal relation between block reward and block production. Once all the coins are out, blocks will still be produced, without the reward, and the miners will rip their profit off of transaction fees.

btcarmory.com
MoonShadow
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May 18, 2011, 07:39:36 PM
 #16

We need a sticky faq with these simple questions right on the front page of the forum.

"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."

- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
goatpig
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May 18, 2011, 07:46:21 PM
 #17

We need a sticky faq with these simple questions right on the front page of the forum.

Wasn't eMansipater taking care of that or something?

btcarmory.com
BitterTea
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May 18, 2011, 07:48:26 PM
 #18

We need a sticky faq with these simple questions right on the front page of the forum.

Perhaps a mandatory FAQ, with a quiz at the end. Smiley
MoonShadow
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May 18, 2011, 07:49:28 PM
 #19

We need a sticky faq with these simple questions right on the front page of the forum.

Perhaps a mandatory FAQ, with a quiz at the end. Smiley

Excellent idea.  New users can't post until they can pass a fairly easy quiz, but can read whatever they like.

"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."

- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
Fatbat
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May 18, 2011, 09:07:26 PM
 #20

Thank you for your kind replies folks, I understand the maths concept now. Stickies for these things is a fantastic idea btw. One of those READ THIS BEFORE POSTING YOUR STUPID QUESTION threads would be most useful with perhaps the top 10 most often asked questions answered. It wouldn't stop all the dumb questions but it might help.
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