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Author Topic: [GLBSE] LIVE! CANMINE 0.3BTC 1MH/s MINING BOND WITH CLEAR PATH TO ASIC UPGRADE  (Read 1851 times)
ciuciu
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June 20, 2012, 01:03:59 PM
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Hello bitcoiners,

22/06 The bonds are now listed on GLBSE https://glbse.com/asset/view/CANMINE.

I would like to revive my mining bonds offering taking in to account the new ASIC development.
As you may know, I'm betting heavily against the biggest mining bonds on the market. In my COOP ASIC thread I received suggestion that the mining bonds who presently pay dividents are better than the future bonds. So, I offer you the one and only mining bond with ASIC safety net.

15000 bonds will be sold valued at 0.3 BTC each. Each coupon will be worth 1Mh/s.
The payments will be done from my 15Gh/s mining farm. I intend to start doing payments next Monday after IPO.

From the amount I raise, a third of it will stay in an open deposit making 1% weekly. When BFL or other ASIC producer starts taking preorders we will use the money to buy ASIC equipment. At the moment I receive the ASICS and I put them online, the bond will be upgraded with the exact capacity our reserve fund has bought.

I reserve the option to repurchase bonds at 105% of the highest traded price over the last 15 days.

Note: This investment bear risks! Do not buy bonds with money you can't afford to lose.

Now to the good things: Earlier adopters have chance to better returns until the tehnolgoy gets widespread. I'm sure BFL will give top delivery priority to cash orders, not to upgrades on which other operators base their offers.

Suggestions and advice are always welcome!

Now I have references!

- fulfilled mining contract for amazingrando
- my forsale thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=85180.msg938864#msg938864
- some other references: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=87780.0

Thank you.

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ciuciu
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June 20, 2012, 03:11:39 PM
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Constructive criticism highly appreciated!





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June 20, 2012, 03:27:44 PM
 #3

I'm sure BFL will give top delivery priority to cash orders, not to upgrades on which other operators base their offers.

Thank you for being realistic. This is one of only a small handful of posts I have read from current BFL product owners that actually makes sense from a business prospective, regardless of how unfair it may or may not be to those customers.
thank you for that refreshing outlook on reality.
bitlane.

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June 21, 2012, 01:33:04 AM
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Let's go up!

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June 21, 2012, 01:54:28 AM
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The question for potential investors is pretty clear. Do you think half-dividends (compared to YABMC ATM) for 16-32 weeks is a cost worth ~26x the mining bond's original hashing power once ASICs are in the wild and the block reward halves?

Don't mix your coins someone said isn't legal
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June 21, 2012, 02:27:07 AM
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Why half divident of YABMC?
Yes, the answer to this question can bring us a lot of BTC.


The question for potential investors is pretty clear. Do you think half-dividends (compared to YABMC ATM) for 16-32 weeks is a cost worth ~26x the mining bond's original hashing power once ASICs are in the wild and the block reward halves?

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June 21, 2012, 02:34:20 AM
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Why half divident of YABMC?
Yes, the answer to this question can bring us a lot of BTC.


The question for potential investors is pretty clear. Do you think half-dividends (compared to YABMC ATM) for 16-32 weeks is a cost worth ~26x the mining bond's original hashing power once ASICs are in the wild and the block reward halves?
YABMC is for 1 MH/s as well and is trading for .15-.18 per bond (was looking poised to hit .1/bond just an hour or two ago), ATM. Since CANMINE would be ~2x the price per MH/s (until upgrade), that's effectively half the dividends you'd get with 100BTC worth of YABMC if that person went with CANMINE.

Don't mix your coins someone said isn't legal
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June 21, 2012, 02:43:11 AM
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Since I reserve .10BTC per bond for ASIC buying, the real cost is just .20BTC per 1MH/s. If the majority of bond holders no longer want to upgrade to ASIC, they can get 0.10BTC returned plus 1% weekly return, further reducing the initial bond cost. I agree that this is a gamble, but I believe at the moment is the best on the market.

So the question is: Will you Kluge invest in my bond?

Why half divident of YABMC?
Yes, the answer to this question can bring us a lot of BTC.


The question for potential investors is pretty clear. Do you think half-dividends (compared to YABMC ATM) for 16-32 weeks is a cost worth ~26x the mining bond's original hashing power once ASICs are in the wild and the block reward halves?
YABMC is for 1 MH/s as well and is trading for .15-.18 per bond (was looking poised to hit .1/bond just an hour or two ago), ATM. Since CANMINE would be ~2x the price per MH/s (until upgrade), that's effectively half the dividends you'd get with 100BTC worth of YABMC if that person went with CANMINE.

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June 21, 2012, 08:42:16 PM
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Up.

Since I reserve .10BTC per bond for ASIC buying, the real cost is just .20BTC per 1MH/s. If the majority of bond holders no longer want to upgrade to ASIC, they can get 0.10BTC returned plus 1% weekly return, further reducing the initial bond cost. I agree that this is a gamble, but I believe at the moment is the best on the market.

So the question is: Will you Kluge invest in my bond?

Why half divident of YABMC?
Yes, the answer to this question can bring us a lot of BTC.


The question for potential investors is pretty clear. Do you think half-dividends (compared to YABMC ATM) for 16-32 weeks is a cost worth ~26x the mining bond's original hashing power once ASICs are in the wild and the block reward halves?
YABMC is for 1 MH/s as well and is trading for .15-.18 per bond (was looking poised to hit .1/bond just an hour or two ago), ATM. Since CANMINE would be ~2x the price per MH/s (until upgrade), that's effectively half the dividends you'd get with 100BTC worth of YABMC if that person went with CANMINE.

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June 22, 2012, 02:06:23 PM
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Quote
15000 shares will be sold valued at 0.3 BTC each. Each coupon will be worth 1Mh/s.
What shares? You are issuing bonds, not stock!

If you like to make this bond even remotely interesting, fix part of the coupon and let part of it float, based on Mh/s.
Make it even more serious, add a fixed price and the date, when your bonds mature aka date and price you buy back all the bonds.
This is how bonds are usually issued. This perpetual garbage, with floating call price and what not, has to die Smiley

If you really want to issue a proper perpetual bond, fix the call price and set a reasonable call protection (date before bonds can not be called).

Let me ask this. Will you lend me money on similar terms like this perpetual garbage that floats around in GLBSE? Something like this: I'll pay you a part of what ever I can earn from the money you gave me and I'll pay you back the loan when it has become worthless (coupon payments are close to 0 an nobody wants to hold the bond any more)? Pay pack the loan when? Oh, when ever I feel like Smiley
Will you lend me money on those terms?

BTW, In case of liquidation, bond owners come fist and you have to pay them before stock holders get anything. This also means you have to buy back all the bonds. Debt (bond, perpetual or not) must be taken care of first.


While reading what I wrote, use the most friendliest and relaxing voice in your head.
BTW, Things in BTC bubble universes are getting ugly....
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June 22, 2012, 02:21:13 PM
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Quote
15000 shares will be sold valued at 0.3 BTC each. Each coupon will be worth 1Mh/s.
What shares? You are issuing bonds, not stock!

If you like to make this bond even remotely interesting, fix part of the coupon and let part of it float, based on Mh/s.
Make it even more serious, add a fixed price and the date, when your bonds mature aka date and price you buy back all the bonds.
This is how bonds are usually issued. This perpetual garbage, with floating call price and what not, has to die Smiley

If you really want to issue a proper perpetual bond, fix the call price and set a reasonable call protection (date before bonds can not be called).

Let me ask this. Will you lend me money on similar terms like this perpetual garbage that floats around in GLBSE? Something like this: I'll pay you a part of what ever I can earn from the money you gave me and I'll pay you back the loan when it has become worthless (coupon payments are close to 0 an nobody wants to hold the bond any more)? Pay pack the loan when? Oh, when ever I feel like Smiley
Will you lend me money on those terms?

BTW, In case of liquidation, bond owners come fist and you have to pay them before stock holders get anything. This also means you have to buy back all the bonds. Debt (bond, perpetual or not) must be taken care of first.



Hi,

I surely wish I can offer what you are looking for, but I can't. What I can offer is a chance to be an early adaptor of ASIC tehnology, and getting some dividents while waiting for it.

Thanks.

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June 22, 2012, 02:44:35 PM
 #12

Hi,

I surely wish I can offer what you are looking for, but I can't. What I can offer is a chance to be an early adaptor of ASIC tehnology, and getting some dividents while waiting for it.

Thanks.

And how exactly is this ASIC upgrade going to benefit me, as a bond holder? Lets say that diff keeps going up at average 8% per months for next 6 months and then maybe at 3% for the following 6 months and the bond coupon is what ever 1 Mh can mine.


While reading what I wrote, use the most friendliest and relaxing voice in your head.
BTW, Things in BTC bubble universes are getting ugly....
ciuciu
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June 22, 2012, 02:53:32 PM
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Hi,

I surely wish I can offer what you are looking for, but I can't. What I can offer is a chance to be an early adaptor of ASIC tehnology, and getting some dividents while waiting for it.

Thanks.

And how exactly is this ASIC upgrade going to benefit me, as a bond holder? Lets say that diff keeps going up at average 8% per months for next 6 months and then maybe at 3% for the following 6 months and the bond coupon is what ever 1 Mh can mine.



The Mh/s bond value will be upgraded with the minig capacity provided by a third of the capital I get from the bonds sale. So the Mh/s value of the bond can go up 10 times more, I do not know for sure until BFL makes a complete announcement. Do not forget about the potential advantage of the earliest adaptors.
Don't ask me about future difficulty, I can't answer this.

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June 22, 2012, 03:30:48 PM
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The Mh/s bond value will be upgraded with the minig capacity provided by a third of the capital I get from the bonds sale. So the Mh/s value of the bond can go up 10 times more, I do not know for sure until BFL makes a complete announcement. Do not forget about the potential advantage of the earliest adaptors.
Don't ask me about future difficulty, I can't answer this.

I must be missing something here but where is that written in your contract?

Quote
...15000 bonds will be sold valued at 0.3 BTC each. Each coupon will be worth 1Mh/s.
The payments will be done from my 15Gh/s mining farm. I intend to start doing payments next Monday after IPO.

Let me rephrase my question: And how exactly is this ASIC upgrade going to benefit me, as a bond holder, if the bond coupon is "what ever 1 Mh/s can mine at difficulty X when the div is calculated".

While reading what I wrote, use the most friendliest and relaxing voice in your head.
BTW, Things in BTC bubble universes are getting ugly....
ciuciu
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June 22, 2012, 03:52:25 PM
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The Mh/s bond value will be upgraded with the minig capacity provided by a third of the capital I get from the bonds sale. So the Mh/s value of the bond can go up 10 times more, I do not know for sure until BFL makes a complete announcement. Do not forget about the potential advantage of the earliest adaptors.
Don't ask me about future difficulty, I can't answer this.

I must be missing something here but where is that written in your contract?

Quote
...15000 bonds will be sold valued at 0.3 BTC each. Each coupon will be worth 1Mh/s.
The payments will be done from my 15Gh/s mining farm. I intend to start doing payments next Monday after IPO.

Let me rephrase my question: And how exactly is this ASIC upgrade going to benefit me, as a bond holder, if the bond coupon is "what ever 1 Mh/s can mine at difficulty X when the div is calculated".

Everything I told you is on the top post and it will be my contract with the bond holders.
I get it, you don't trust me and it is OK, please do not invest with me.

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June 22, 2012, 04:15:25 PM
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Assuming that the reserve fund could buy a 1Th rig, my 1 Mh bond will worth 66,6 Mh by then?
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June 22, 2012, 04:20:26 PM
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Assuming that the reserve fund could buy a 1Th rig, my 1 Mh bond will worth 66,6 Mh by then?

Yes, it will.

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June 22, 2012, 05:53:48 PM
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The bonds are now on GLBSE.

Thank you.

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June 22, 2012, 09:01:27 PM
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As you can see, I'm fully verified with GLBSE.

Thank you.



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June 23, 2012, 12:58:25 AM
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First divident will be paid on Monday.

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