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Author Topic: ASICMiner BE300S Samples Arrived, <0.2W/G Achieved at Board Level  (Read 65865 times)
dogie
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December 21, 2014, 03:03:17 AM
 #221

They have to find really cheap power, if you ask me! i want to see 0.01$/KWh! That way they could build a really big farm an mine the hell out of the blockchain. AM isn't a small player, they should go as far as possible and re-claim those 40% in 2015! Also they could continue to offer a cutting-edge cloud mining!

Even if the network wouldn't grow much from today on, claiming 40% of the network possibly means building 100-150MW worth of new Bitcoin mines in 2015. That's about half of all of Google's capacity (265MW) by power combined. And twice the size of Facebook (78MW). And it remains a moving target during and after.

I had a post here with some numbers I put together recently:

Energy Consumption of the Bitcoin Network
http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=520977.msg9825138#msg9825138


Never going to happen, they simply don't have the cash to do that on this generation. Even Bitfury's level of cash would only just allow them to do that (if they started from 0%).

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December 22, 2014, 05:42:26 AM
 #222

They have to find really cheap power, if you ask me! i want to see 0.01$/KWh! That way they could build a really big farm an mine the hell out of the blockchain. AM isn't a small player, they should go as far as possible and re-claim those 40% in 2015! Also they could continue to offer a cutting-edge cloud mining!

Even if the network wouldn't grow much from today on, claiming 40% of the network possibly means building 100-150MW worth of new Bitcoin mines in 2015. That's about half of all of Google's capacity (265MW) by power combined. And twice the size of Facebook (78MW). And it remains a moving target during and after.

I had a post here with some numbers I put together recently:

Energy Consumption of the Bitcoin Network
http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=520977.msg9825138#msg9825138


Never going to happen, they simply don't have the cash to do that on this generation. Even Bitfury's level of cash would only just allow them to do that (if they started from 0%).

 BitcoinBrothers out of Germany claimed in November this year to have an ASIC based on a 16nm 3D finFET and have plans to unleash 300-400 PH onto the network in Q1 2015.   They also claim each of their 6 PH machines will consume 0.9 MW.  So using your initial assumption, it appears they are poised take a little more than 50% of the network (assuming they add 300 PH) using only 45 MW.
 I haven't dug very deeply into this claim but they seem to be echoing the claims of KNCminer as far as the 16nm 3D finFET based ASIC.  I haven't seen power consumption estimates from KNC however.
   
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December 22, 2014, 06:48:53 AM
 #223

BitcoinBrothers out of Germany claimed in November this year to have an ASIC based on a 16nm 3D finFET and have plans to unleash 300-400 PH onto the network in Q1 2015.   They also claim each of their 6 PH machines will consume 0.9 MW.  So using your initial assumption, it appears they are poised take a little more than 50% of the network (assuming they add 300 PH) using only 45 MW.
 I haven't dug very deeply into this claim but they seem to be echoing the claims of KNCminer as far as the 16nm 3D finFET based ASIC.  I haven't seen power consumption estimates from KNC however.  

Not sure where (electricity rate) they plan to drop their bomb, but the numbers you have posted put their power consumption at 0.15W/G.

Official claims we have (also from my internal report):

- Spondoolies Tech 0.05W/G mid 2015
- KnCMiner 16nm 0.07W/G early 2015
- Cointerra 16nm 5X (?) Q1 2015 (5X refers to their TerraMiner IV I guess)
- Bitfury sub-0.1J/G mid-year 2015

Not sure what to put on the Chinese ASIC manufacturers when it comes to official claims (Bitmain, Avalon, InnoSilicon, who else is significant or still in business?).

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December 23, 2014, 10:42:42 PM
 #224

....
The next step is to test the board with fully inhabited 24 chips.
Results? Competition says 0.5J/GH. AM says......... ?

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Changing one PCB with screwdriver and you have brand new miner in hand... Plug&Play, scalable from one module to thousands.
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December 26, 2014, 08:25:18 PM
 #225

BitcoinBrothers out of Germany claimed in November this year to have an ASIC based on a 16nm 3D finFET and have plans to unleash 300-400 PH onto the network in Q1 2015.   They also claim each of their 6 PH machines will consume 0.9 MW.  So using your initial assumption, it appears they are poised take a little more than 50% of the network (assuming they add 300 PH) using only 45 MW.
 I haven't dug very deeply into this claim but they seem to be echoing the claims of KNCminer as far as the 16nm 3D finFET based ASIC.  I haven't seen power consumption estimates from KNC however.  

Not sure where (electricity rate) they plan to drop their bomb, but the numbers you have posted put their power consumption at 0.15W/G.

Official claims we have (also from my internal report):

- Spondoolies Tech 0.05W/G mid 2015
- KnCMiner 16nm 0.07W/G early 2015
- Cointerra 16nm 5X (?) Q1 2015 (5X refers to their TerraMiner IV I guess)
- Bitfury sub-0.1J/G mid-year 2015

Not sure what to put on the Chinese ASIC manufacturers when it comes to official claims (Bitmain, Avalon, InnoSilicon, who else is significant or still in business?).

The above figures are all somewhat speculative, there is nothing remotely close to them currently on sale, and anything that does come out is likely to  be running deep sub threshold, so you'll need 2 or 3 times as many chips to get competitive hash rates per unit area of silicon. This is clearly what AM have done, same as Bitfury. It's not new or 'experimental', companies have been doing this for years.

The only one that looks realistic (in both term of power consumption and silicon efficiency) is Cointerra's of 0.225 W/(GH/sec). KNC's is pure fantasy and Spondoolies said they would aim for their figure. I'm sure they'll get there but I'm also sure they'll be honest about how they did it ......




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December 28, 2014, 01:04:28 AM
 #226

BitcoinBrothers out of Germany claimed in November this year to have an ASIC based on a 16nm 3D finFET and have plans to unleash 300-400 PH onto the network in Q1 2015.   They also claim each of their 6 PH machines will consume 0.9 MW.  So using your initial assumption, it appears they are poised take a little more than 50% of the network (assuming they add 300 PH) using only 45 MW.
 I haven't dug very deeply into this claim but they seem to be echoing the claims of KNCminer as far as the 16nm 3D finFET based ASIC.  I haven't seen power consumption estimates from KNC however.  

Not sure where (electricity rate) they plan to drop their bomb, but the numbers you have posted put their power consumption at 0.15W/G.

Official claims we have (also from my internal report):

- Spondoolies Tech 0.05W/G mid 2015
- KnCMiner 16nm 0.07W/G early 2015
- Cointerra 16nm 5X (?) Q1 2015 (5X refers to their TerraMiner IV I guess)
- Bitfury sub-0.1J/G mid-year 2015

Not sure what to put on the Chinese ASIC manufacturers when it comes to official claims (Bitmain, Avalon, InnoSilicon, who else is significant or still in business?).



BlackArrow has made claims using a finFET asic chip as well at the .07W/gh - claiming 20TH from about the same draw as the 1TH of the x3.  BS or not - we will have to see.

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December 28, 2014, 01:11:47 AM
 #227

BlackArrow still has money? How?

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December 28, 2014, 01:16:08 AM
 #228

Quote
- Spondoolies Tech 0.05W/G mid 2015
- KnCMiner 16nm 0.07W/G early 2015
- Cointerra 16nm 5X (?) Q1 2015 (5X refers to their TerraMiner IV I guess)
- Bitfury sub-0.1J/G mid-year 2015

When i will see intel and amd have a mature desktop cpu at 14nm, then! and only then i will believe those numbers!

The smaller we go the harder it is!

Just a shot in the dark:  under .1w/g in 2016!
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December 28, 2014, 03:51:35 AM
 #229

Quote
- Spondoolies Tech 0.05W/G mid 2015
- KnCMiner 16nm 0.07W/G early 2015
- Cointerra 16nm 5X (?) Q1 2015 (5X refers to their TerraMiner IV I guess)
- Bitfury sub-0.1J/G mid-year 2015

When i will see intel and amd have a mature desktop cpu at 14nm, then! and only then i will believe those numbers!

The smaller we go the harder it is!

Just a shot in the dark:  under .1w/g in 2016!

I think it will happen in 2015.

H/w Hosting Directory & Reputation - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=622998.0
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December 28, 2014, 04:08:46 AM
 #230

Quote
- Spondoolies Tech 0.05W/G mid 2015
- KnCMiner 16nm 0.07W/G early 2015
- Cointerra 16nm 5X (?) Q1 2015 (5X refers to their TerraMiner IV I guess)
- Bitfury sub-0.1J/G mid-year 2015

When i will see intel and amd have a mature desktop cpu at 14nm, then! and only then i will believe those numbers!

The smaller we go the harder it is!

Just a shot in the dark:  under .1w/g in 2016!

I think it will happen in 2015.

It will likely be possible, but being possible and being the shipping clocks for a product is another thing. Maybe we will see both, maybe just one.

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December 28, 2014, 04:42:25 AM
 #231

Quote
- Spondoolies Tech 0.05W/G mid 2015
- KnCMiner 16nm 0.07W/G early 2015
- Cointerra 16nm 5X (?) Q1 2015 (5X refers to their TerraMiner IV I guess)
- Bitfury sub-0.1J/G mid-year 2015

When i will see intel and amd have a mature desktop cpu at 14nm, then! and only then i will believe those numbers!

The smaller we go the harder it is!

Just a shot in the dark:  under .1w/g in 2016!

I think it will happen in 2015.

It will likely be possible, but being possible and being the shipping clocks for a product is another thing. Maybe we will see both, maybe just one.

My money is on Bitfury and SP-Tech
sidehack
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December 28, 2014, 05:01:21 AM
 #232

But if BitFury does it, nobody gets to share the wealth?

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December 28, 2014, 05:05:39 AM
 #233

But if BitFury does it, nobody gets to share the wealth?

I suppose it begs the question: can these any of these companies get chips manufactured quickly enough to account for their lower power? 
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December 28, 2014, 07:35:56 AM
 #234

most likely Q3 2015.

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December 28, 2014, 08:10:40 AM
 #235

Quote
- Spondoolies Tech 0.05W/G mid 2015
- KnCMiner 16nm 0.07W/G early 2015
- Cointerra 16nm 5X (?) Q1 2015 (5X refers to their TerraMiner IV I guess)
- Bitfury sub-0.1J/G mid-year 2015

When i will see intel and amd have a mature desktop cpu at 14nm, then! and only then i will believe those numbers!

The smaller we go the harder it is!

Just a shot in the dark:  under .1w/g in 2016!

I think it will happen in 2015.

It will likely be possible, but being possible and being the shipping clocks for a product is another thing. Maybe we will see both, maybe just one.

My money is on Bitfury and SP-Tech

sp tech has not met a target hash rate or power draw yet

How is that Lexical analysis working out bickneleski?
Guy Corem
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December 28, 2014, 08:36:03 AM
Last edit: December 28, 2014, 12:23:05 PM by Spondoolies-Tech
 #236

...
sp tech has not met a target hash rate or power draw yet
Not my thread, I'm not sure I should reply here. Anyway:
We exceeded our 1st gen goals, we've missed (and compensated) our 2nd gen goals.
Regarding our 3rd and 4th gen ...  Smiley

New Mimblewimble implementation: https://www.beam.mw
Spondoolies is back with the SPx36: https://www.spondoolies-tech.com/products/spx36
elasticband
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December 28, 2014, 02:57:33 PM
 #237

...
sp tech has not met a target hash rate or power draw yet
Not my thread, I'm not sure I should reply here. Anyway:
We exceeded our 1st gen goals, we've missed (and compensated) our 2nd gen goals.
Regarding our 3rd and 4th gen ...  Smiley

so what were the expectations of the one generation that was released without customers funding it? it's pretty easy for you to say anything as it was not pre announced or pre sold.
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December 28, 2014, 04:02:07 PM
 #238

...
sp tech has not met a target hash rate or power draw yet
Not my thread, I'm not sure I should reply here. Anyway:
We exceeded our 1st gen goals, we've missed (and compensated) our 2nd gen goals.
Regarding our 3rd and 4th gen ...  Smiley
You missed the mark on the "Slow Corner" May SP10's as well.
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December 28, 2014, 04:03:59 PM
 #239

Yep...anyway this thread is about ASICMiner not SP  Roll Eyes

EYE




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novak@gekkoscience
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December 28, 2014, 06:11:51 PM
 #240

Quote
- Spondoolies Tech 0.05W/G mid 2015
- KnCMiner 16nm 0.07W/G early 2015
- Cointerra 16nm 5X (?) Q1 2015 (5X refers to their TerraMiner IV I guess)
- Bitfury sub-0.1J/G mid-year 2015

When i will see intel and amd have a mature desktop cpu at 14nm, then! and only then i will believe those numbers!

The smaller we go the harder it is!

Just a shot in the dark:  under .1w/g in 2016!

That's a reasonable position to take, as manufacturing does become more difficult as you shrink the architecture, however, there is quite a bit of difference between a SHA256 ASIC and a CPU.  The CPU is much more complex, as most of a SHA ASIC is simply repeated hash cores.

I think many manufacturers missed their efficiency targets at the last generation though (ASICMiner, Black Arrow, KnC, Spondoolies, and probably more), so that's not an unreasonable guess.  However, reading this thread from ASICMiner indicates that they now have enough experience to design an ASIC at 28nm and hit or surpass expected efficiency.  Whether or not companies can now drop down to 16-20nm or so and get the efficiency they think they can is the million dollar (actually probably a lot of millions) question.  It looks like we have announcements from multiple companies attempting it by mid 2015, so it is entirely possible.

--
novak
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