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Author Topic: Question about slush's pool and reward system  (Read 19514 times)
kiwiasian
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May 20, 2011, 01:12:11 AM
 #1

Alright, so I've been mining on slush's for about three hours and the values for estimated rewards and unconfirmed rewards has been increasing, but when will the confirmed BTC show up?

And how is payment calculated? I switched from Deepbit (the rates were getting ridiculous, it dropped from 0.0004 to 0.0002 to 0.0001 over the past few weeks). Deepbit had a proportional/PPS payment system, but slush's pool doesn't even specify how users are paid.


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SchizophrenicX
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May 20, 2011, 01:18:46 AM
 #2

Hi I'm totally new, and have started mining yesterday on slush's pool (Not even sure about other pool's existence lolx)

I basically followed those newbie guides and started mining before I started understanding what's going on. But regarding this, I've read somewhere that basically you need to wait for the unconfirmed rewards to 'clear' certain amount of 'blocks' or time? before they start turning into Confirmed rewards.

So the unconfirmed rewards from each round takes a certain amount of time before it will be confirmed. Then once the confirmed rewards accumulate to your set amount it'll then send to you wallet.

Something to this line. I'm not sure why they do this, it's probably got to do with some security of some sort. Maybe theres some way people could exploit if not done this way. I'm not sure.

Anyway, this is coming from a total newbie so I wouldn't listen to me haha.

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May 20, 2011, 01:25:03 AM
 #3

After 100 conformations a block is considered "valid". Click on the "stats" link on the left nav, it will give you an idea of how close your blocks are to being valid. It just takes the Bitcoin network some time to insurance that a coin will not get orphaned.

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Dhomochevsky
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May 20, 2011, 03:24:00 AM
 #4

Here's how it works:

You start mining in a round along with everybody else. By mining alongside others, you contribute your hash speed to the greater hash speed of the pool (a little bit from you, a little bit from some other guy, a greater bit from somebody with more hash power than you etc. it all adds up to the total hash speed of the pool). The greater the hash speed of the pool the faster it solves one block.
Here's the catch though. Each solved block gives away 50 bitcoins. Those 50 bitcoins have to be shared among avery person that contributed with hash speed to its solving. Naturally, the ones that contributed more will receive more. This is accomplished by shares. The number of shares you get represents the amount of bounty you get from the 50 BTC reward and is established by the hash speeds you contributed during the duration of the round. From that picture, I can see that your bounty, based on your current hash speed is estimated to 0.0704 BTC. Naturally, people contributing more Hps will probably have a bigger reward than you. When the block is solved and the round finishes, the estimated bounty will be added to the unconfirmed bounty field. From that moment on, you have to wait until the blockchain solves another 100 or 120 blocks (each block giving a confirmation of the sum to be paid to you). After the necesarry blocks are solved, the sum owed to you is moved from the unconfirmed bounty to the confirmed bounty field, and if it's enough for a payout, sent to you.

In simpler terms, the pool keeps the money it owes to you into escrow and after it receives enough confirmations, it releases the money from escrow. This waiting period exists so it can prevent potential shenanigans. Other pools such as deepbit offer an instant payout method, but they charge you a little bit more because of the risk.
kiwiasian
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May 20, 2011, 03:30:40 AM
 #5

So, 100 solved blocks later I will know how much I've made?

I actually like Deepbit's system a lot better. It's a lot easier to keep track of earnings. But if slush's pool yields higher rewards, I'll wait the 100 blocks.

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Meni Rosenfeld
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May 20, 2011, 03:50:03 AM
 #6

slush uses the score-based payout method described here.

You will know how much you made before the blocks mature (unless the block becomes invalid, which isn't very common), but you will get it only after it matures (until then it will be "unconfirmed reward", but will not change).

Deepbit's PPS rates drop because difficulty increases. This will cause an equivalent drop in the payouts of all pools. Deepbit's PPS calculates rates based on a 10% fee.

slush's main advantage over deepbit's proportional is that it is more resistant to pool-hopping.

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May 20, 2011, 04:08:30 AM
 #7

(unless the block becomes invalid, which isn't very common)

There were actually quite a few in the past 24 hours. Since I've only been doing this for a week or so and am not sure exactly what that means, it has me worried at bit;  One of my GPU's is overclocked quite a bit and I'm worried it's causing invalid results to be sent to the pool, would that cause an invalid block?  It seems the invalid blocks only occur during the times I participated, could that mean I screwed my fellow miners over?

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May 20, 2011, 04:09:16 AM
 #8

(unless the block becomes invalid, which isn't very common)

There were actually quite a few in the past 24 hours. Since I've only been doing this for a week or so and am not sure exactly what that means, it has me worried at bit;  One of my GPU's is overclocked quite a bit and I'm worried it's causing invalid results to be sent to the pool, would that cause an invalid block?  It seems the invalid blocks only occur during the times I participated, could that mean I caused the block to be lost for everyone by mistake?

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May 20, 2011, 04:32:39 AM
 #9

(unless the block becomes invalid, which isn't very common)

There were actually quite a few in the past 24 hours. Since I've only been doing this for a week or so and am not sure exactly what that means, it has me worried at bit;  One of my GPU's is overclocked quite a bit and I'm worried it's causing invalid results to be sent to the pool, would that cause an invalid block?  It seems the invalid blocks only occur during the times I participated, could that mean I caused the block to be lost for everyone by mistake?
No. If your GPU spews out something invalid the program will reject it, and even if not, the pool will reject it (one of the key features of hashing is that it is easy to verify, so the pool will just reject anything sent to it that is not 100% kosher). I know about the invalid blocks recently, they're probably a result of some technical issue on slush's end which should be resolved shortly.

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kiwiasian
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May 20, 2011, 02:30:32 PM
 #10

I've already noticed that slush pays out far more than deepbit over the same amount of time. I've only been mining on slush for a few hours and I already have 1 BTC. Compared to the ridiculous 2.5 BTC/24 hr on deepbit -__-

How do I manually pay out the BTC to my address? Is there a "send payment" link...somewhere? Or does it just have to reach the threshold?

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May 20, 2011, 03:24:49 PM
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I've already noticed that slush pays out far more than deepbit over the same amount of time. I've only been mining on slush for a few hours and I already have 1 BTC. Compared to the ridiculous 2.5 BTC/24 hr on deepbit -__-

How do I manually pay out the BTC to my address? Is there a "send payment" link...somewhere? Or does it just have to reach the threshold?

What card are you using? Whats your hashrate? 1 BTC in a few hours is not bad.
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May 20, 2011, 05:01:32 PM
 #12

I've already noticed that slush pays out far more than deepbit over the same amount of time. I've only been mining on slush for a few hours and I already have 1 BTC. Compared to the ridiculous 2.5 BTC/24 hr on deepbit -__-

How do I manually pay out the BTC to my address? Is there a "send payment" link...somewhere? Or does it just have to reach the threshold?
Kia ora - Ni Hao

Slush charges a 2% commission. Deepbit charges 3% or 10% depending on which plan you're on. Also, there is somewhat of a luck factor involved so payouts on either pool (unless you're on the 10% plan) can vary by quite a bit. 24 hours doesn't tell you much.

Slush only pays when you reach the threshold. To pay out nearly instantaneously, just lower the threshold to smaller than your confirmed amount. You will be paid out when the next block confirms.

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May 20, 2011, 05:14:41 PM
 #13

I actually like Deepbit's system a lot better. It's a lot easier to keep track of earnings.

Well, main difference that on my pool you see your income in *realtime*, deepbit has all stats delayed for one hour. You just have to wait until block is confirmed to withdraw bitcoins to your wallet, but this is mechanism how bitcoin network was designed.

Yes, there were invalid blocks yesterday, those were technical issues and I believe that everything is fine now. Corrupted GPU cannot affect pool itself.

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May 20, 2011, 05:29:16 PM
 #14

I actually like Deepbit's system a lot better. It's a lot easier to keep track of earnings.

Well, main difference that on my pool you see your income in *realtime*, deepbit has all stats delayed for one hour. You just have to wait until block is confirmed to withdraw bitcoins to your wallet, but this is mechanism how bitcoin network was designed.
I prefer Slush's system much more because of the realtime payout displays. Yes, it's a touch more complicated but you can see exactly what stages your btc mining is at. Slush also has very pretty graphs. Any word on when long polling is coming to slush pool?

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May 20, 2011, 05:59:32 PM
 #15

Any word on when long polling is coming to slush pool?

I'm coding right now Smiley. I know that LP is most wanted feature so far...

Dayofswords
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May 20, 2011, 09:18:34 PM
 #16

but slush's pool doesn't even specify how users are paid.



uhhh....



Quote
How does bitcoin pool work?

Our server gives users blocks of very low difficulty to solve. Each solution found is registered as one 'share'. Occasionally, a solution will happen to also meet the full-strength difficulty requirements of the Bitcoin network, resulting in a successful 50 BTC minting.

This 50 BTC is divided among all of the users that contributed to that round, weighted by the number of shares that they earned. Therefore, the reward earned by a given user is given by the following formula:
(50 BTC - 1 BTC fee) * (shares found by user's workers) / (total shares in current round)

Shares do not carry over from one round to the next. When the pool mine a block, only users who worked on that block are rewarded, and only for work they did on that block. This is an unavoidable consequence of the way that Bitcoin mining in general works.

The 2% fee is used to keep this service alive.

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May 20, 2011, 09:41:39 PM
 #17

Quote
(50 BTC - 1 BTC fee) * (shares found by user's workers) / (total shares in current round)

Well, this is not absolutely correct, because that describes share-based pool, not score based; but it is correct *enough* for brief information how it works. I still didn't found a way how to describe score based system in few lines for absolute beginners and don't cook their heads Smiley.

kiwiasian
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May 24, 2011, 01:40:41 AM
 #18

Quote
(50 BTC - 1 BTC fee) * (shares found by user's workers) / (total shares in current round)

Well, this is not absolutely correct, because that describes share-based pool, not score based; but it is correct *enough* for brief information how it works. I still didn't found a way how to describe score based system in few lines for absolute beginners and don't cook their heads Smiley.

It would be nice if you could make a short formula to make an approximate calculation of how much users can be paid over the course of 24 hours, with a few variables incl. # shares/hour, current reward per round, etc...

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kiwiasian
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May 24, 2011, 01:42:25 AM
 #19

What card are you using? Whats your hashrate? 1 BTC in a few hours is not bad.

Crossfire 5850 580 MH/s

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May 24, 2011, 02:06:30 AM
 #20

You should be getting 600 MH/s minimum, I'm getting 358 MH/s with one 5850 in Windows 7x64

Use stream sdk 2.4 and phatk kernel

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