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Author Topic: How to live off of your Bitcoins?  (Read 4325 times)
cytokine
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July 06, 2012, 10:49:38 PM
 #1

Speaking as someone who genuinely *hopes* to earn their income entirely in BTC in the future, I am wondering something - how does one best use them to live off of?

Obviously, it's easy to meet up and exchange BTC for cash each month. But, unfortunately, it's hard to use cash to pay for many things, for example:

- Health insurance
- Rent
- Various loan repayments ( mortgage etc. )
- Other things that I'm probably missing ( buying plane tickets online, etc. )

I suppose the way to deal with this is to liquidate just the minimum BTC each month to cover living expenses that cannot be paid in cash, and then pay income tax on that money.

What about anonymous debit cards that can be re-filled with BTC to pay off things that cash cannot? The problem is that they're not anonymous if you keep using the same card to pay your rent etc, so you might as well liquidate BTC on gox and pay the income tax.

Any other ideas would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
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July 06, 2012, 10:53:24 PM
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Probably at this point moving to New Hampshire which has  a large bitcoin using population untill bitcoin is more widespread.

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July 06, 2012, 10:54:52 PM
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Cash can be converted to money orders and/or cashier's checks.

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cytokine
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July 06, 2012, 11:08:02 PM
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Cash can be converted to money orders and/or cashier's checks.


I actually know someone who can pay their rent directly in BTC. That's probably the best route if you can do it.

Money orders/cashier's checks are a great alternative for bill payment, thanks. But I suppose for any major payments you should probably declare the income and pay the income tax for it ( even if you pay in cash or BTC ) since at some point someone is going to ask where the money is coming from.
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July 06, 2012, 11:19:34 PM
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Cash can be converted to money orders and/or cashier's checks.


I actually know someone who can pay their rent directly in BTC. That's probably the best route if you can do it.

Money orders/cashier's checks are a great alternative for bill payment, thanks. But I suppose for any major payments you should probably declare the income and pay the income tax for it ( even if you pay in cash or BTC ) since at some point someone is going to ask where the money is coming from.

Depends if you live below the radar with a shitty house and drive a shitty car no one will care Wink

No one asks you how you go the money for a $1000 car or where the rent money comes from of $300 a week.

Dont live like  a gansta and drive  a ferrari with no visible means of income.

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July 06, 2012, 11:32:51 PM
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Dont live like  a gansta and drive  a ferrari with no visible means of income.

True... one can drive an old car and live in a small apartment, but go out and eat lobster every night using cash. And you'd be just fine.

The funny thing is, in terms of quality of life that's actually probably a much better life than living in a nice house with two cars with payments you can barely make and having to slog to work for a 9 to 5 that you hate. For me, money is a means to freedom, not a means to "luxury".

On that note, I'm hoping to hit the road one day if I can make enough from BTC, and just travel and run my business from my laptop+clearwire connection. That would be the life for me. Smiley Maybe I could eventually settle down in New Hampshire if I meet up with a nice liberty oriented girl... *sigh*
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July 06, 2012, 11:45:58 PM
 #7

Move to Barbados, Cayman Islands, Ecuador, Estonia, Isle of Man, Singapore or any other country without any capital gains tax.  You could also become a sovereign citizen and hop around the planet with multiple residencies and passports.

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cytokine
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July 07, 2012, 12:02:19 AM
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Move to Barbados, Cayman Islands, Ecuador, Estonia, Isle of Man, Singapore or any other country without any capital gains tax.  You could also become a sovereign citizen and hop around the planet with multiple residencies and passports.

Now you're talking! Cool I'm actually a resident in several different countries already, but only a citizen of the US. And all my friends are here.

Meanwhile, I should probably get familiar with this:

Self-Employed Individuals Tax Center


Thanks for the ideas. I love the concept of being a "sovereign citizen", that is so cool! I just hate being tied down to any single location; I'd love to go around visiting friends all over the world and having adventures before I hit 30.
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July 07, 2012, 07:20:58 PM
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Freedom is one of my highest values in life and although I don't seek luxury I am fine with making as much wealth via productive means as possible.  I am happy to live quite simply with more emphasis on the important small things like healthful food and relationships than external status indicators.  There are lots of websites and individuals who claim to be able to teach individual sovereignty for a price like http://www.sovereignman.com but I'm pretty sure with some diligence you can find most of what you need to know gratis. Cheers Smiley

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cytokine
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July 07, 2012, 08:45:44 PM
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Freedom is one of my highest values in life and although I don't seek luxury I am fine with making as much wealth via productive means as possible.  I am happy to live quite simply with more emphasis on the important small things like healthful food and relationships than external status indicators.  There are lots of websites and individuals who claim to be able to teach individual sovereignty for a price like http://www.sovereignman.com but I'm pretty sure with some diligence you can find most of what you need to know gratis. Cheers Smiley

I could not agree with this sentiment more.

Thanks for the website, it looks like a great resource.
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July 07, 2012, 09:07:48 PM
 #11

Sounds like a good idea Smiley Let us know how it goes...

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July 07, 2012, 11:49:21 PM
 #12

I could not agree with this sentiment more.

Thanks for the website, it looks like a great resource.

Other helpful resources are Nestmann and QWealth Report. Easily distilled it is the Six Flag Theory. Bitcoins are a great substitute for an offshore bank account to gain financial privacy.

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July 10, 2012, 11:41:12 AM
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If you want the benefits of being an American citizen then pay your taxes.  I get paid crap at my job and yet a portion goes to Uncle Sam.  If you aren't going to be able to pay your taxes and live off bitcoin.....maybe you aren't going to live off of bitcoin.

That or go move to Singapore or whatever the hell.
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July 10, 2012, 03:58:01 PM
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If you want the benefits of being an American citizen then pay your taxes.  I get paid crap at my job and yet a portion goes to Uncle Sam.  If you aren't going to be able to pay your taxes and live off bitcoin.....maybe you aren't going to live off of bitcoin.

That or go move to Singapore or whatever the hell.

All U.S. citizens pay plenty of taxes. Property taxes (schools, police), gas taxes (roads), sales taxes (state programs), corporate taxes (military), etc.

What benefit do we supposedly derive from paying the IRS' income tax? Do you even know where the money goes?

Bitcoin is the ultimate freedom test. It tells you who is giving lip service and who genuinely believes in it.
...
...
In the future, books that summarize the history of money will have a line that says, “and then came bitcoin.” It is the economic singularity. And we are living in it now. - Ryan Dickherber
...
...
ATTENTION BFL MINING NEWBS: Just got your Jalapenos in? Wondering how to get the most value for the least hassle? Give BitMinter a try! It's a smaller pool with a fair & low-fee payment method, lots of statistical feedback, and it's easier than EasyMiner! (Yes, we want your hashing power, but seriously, it IS the easiest pool to use! Sign up in seconds to try it!)
...
...
The idea that deflation causes hoarding (to any problematic degree) is a lie used to justify theft of value from your savings.
drrussellshane
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July 10, 2012, 04:02:36 PM
 #15

If you want the benefits of being an American citizen then pay your taxes.  I get paid crap at my job and yet a portion goes to Uncle Sam.  If you aren't going to be able to pay your taxes and live off bitcoin.....maybe you aren't going to live off of bitcoin.

That or go move to Singapore or whatever the hell.

All U.S. citizens pay plenty of taxes. Property taxes (schools, police), gas taxes (roads), sales taxes (state programs), corporate taxes (military), etc.

What benefit do we supposedly derive from paying the IRS' income tax? Do you even know where the money goes?


To pay the interest on the national debt to the international central bank cartel, of course!

Buy a TREZOR! Premier BTC hardware wallet. If you're reading this, you should probably buy one if you don't already have one. You'll thank me later.
westkybitcoins
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July 10, 2012, 04:07:23 PM
 #16

If you want the benefits of being an American citizen then pay your taxes.  I get paid crap at my job and yet a portion goes to Uncle Sam.  If you aren't going to be able to pay your taxes and live off bitcoin.....maybe you aren't going to live off of bitcoin.

That or go move to Singapore or whatever the hell.

All U.S. citizens pay plenty of taxes. Property taxes (schools, police), gas taxes (roads), sales taxes (state programs), corporate taxes (military), etc.

What benefit do we supposedly derive from paying the IRS' income tax? Do you even know where the money goes?


To pay the interest on the national debt to the international central bank cartel, of course!

Bingo.

Bitcoin is the ultimate freedom test. It tells you who is giving lip service and who genuinely believes in it.
...
...
In the future, books that summarize the history of money will have a line that says, “and then came bitcoin.” It is the economic singularity. And we are living in it now. - Ryan Dickherber
...
...
ATTENTION BFL MINING NEWBS: Just got your Jalapenos in? Wondering how to get the most value for the least hassle? Give BitMinter a try! It's a smaller pool with a fair & low-fee payment method, lots of statistical feedback, and it's easier than EasyMiner! (Yes, we want your hashing power, but seriously, it IS the easiest pool to use! Sign up in seconds to try it!)
...
...
The idea that deflation causes hoarding (to any problematic degree) is a lie used to justify theft of value from your savings.
sunnankar
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July 11, 2012, 03:55:39 PM
 #17

If you want the benefits of being an American citizen slave then pay your [involuntarily and coerced] taxes.

Statism Is Dead so become a libertarian bitch.

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July 11, 2012, 06:00:39 PM
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True... one can drive an old car and live in a small apartment, but go out and eat lobster every night using cash. And you'd be just fine.

The funny thing is, in terms of quality of life, that is a much better life than living in a nice house with two cars with payments you can barely make AND having to slog to work for a 9 to 5 that you hate. Money is a means to freedom, not a means to "luxury".

On that note, I'm hoping to hit the road one day if I can make enough from BTC, and just travel and run my business from my laptop+clearwire connection. That would be the life for me. Smiley Maybe I could eventually settle down in New Hampshire if I meet up with a nice liberty oriented girl... *sigh*  (sorry no help here!)

tl;dr people: Bye. OC. **ADMITTEDLY ECCENTRIC CONTENT ALERT** You've stumbled upon the most bizarre content that I've added to a post on our forum yet! You've already read the relevant part of this post reply... and in my defense, this is set to display in size one font. So I'll be straight-forward: This part of the content is just contributing to a badass line or two that I've decided to make. Yeah, seriously. Just that simple. I kept the word badass combined like that for a few reasons, but it was ultimately a conscious decision. It deserves a red underline when read in this box! Ha, see what I did? *cough* OK......you don't have to tell me about how lame that may have been. And just to weed a few people out here, if you're above something like 'this' or any other excuse that you could possibly use to externally shoot down another human being, then you can go now. Your opinion is not my fault, so why should your choice be to stay? Ok, back to being not-back to the topic. Yeah, read that again before moving on. You read it correctly the first time. Come on give yourself some credit you masochist. You've got this, you're back, and better than ever. If what I just said is somehow relevant to you in a some way, even more awesome! It's also great that you're seeing this line on the post for what it truly is. It's not your average line, is it? It took a bit more effort (and let it be known that no one is saying anything about valuable effort). Just a man left to his coffee. But I have a question for you. What led you to read this? No no, I retract that question. I suppose it doesn't really matter. There's such a limited amount of things that you or I could possibly know, at least right 'now' (and I use the term 'now' loosely). You're here and I'm here. Well, I suppose _was_ here. And now you're stuck through the linear progression of time, just like the rest of us, reading this message! Unless you can transgress it or something... But then I guess the real question would be: Why would you choose to be here doing this of every possible choice? Well I guess I could speculate that maybe you're doing everything all at once, because fuck the idea of time. Ah, the ultimate lie we all promised to believe... Whoa, I won't go there. Wouldn't want your brain to go all 'splody.  This is a fun-time post. I need some more content for my second line so it doesn't look retarded due to the first one's fullness. Ah, oh well. I suppose I'll settle for half of the way since it's a concrete marker to shoot for and I'm almost finished with my coffee. Any of you guys wondering why I emphasis font on my posts on here, I reply with a question and follow-up: Why the hell not?! It's just another medium of non-verbal communication--imagery. Makes sense right? Admit it. Now, I can understand if it isn't tasteful, but I really do try to not come off like an infomercial. In fact, if you find it distasteful you should drop me a PM. Or a pizza. Any reasons great for a pizza. That's tasteful. Nom. ~♫♫♫ Yeah! Badass alt code usage(--and usage of the word badass again!) Entertaining nimble-minded eccentrics are the ones to know! Why be boring? 'Ha, I got you!'(-- Maxi from Soulcalibur). I don't sympathize with your answer. Cheers! 
Blaztoize goggles on!

Lol I love your mindset and I'd be interested in doing most of the stuff that you've discussed in the semi-near future. Already planting the seeds to make this a reality, so I suppose that's a start! I feel that it's important to never forget your roots, but also silly to forfeit your brain when there's better ways to go about doing things.  Smiley


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July 11, 2012, 06:12:11 PM
 #19

Another way is to get 50x of your annual expenses saved in bitcoin form. Then just sell 2% of al your bitcoins slowly every year.

Enjoy your life while you are at it. You mileage (50x and 2%) may vary.


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July 23, 2012, 04:15:15 AM
 #20

Another way is to get 50x of your annual expenses saved in bitcoin form. Then just sell 2% of al your bitcoins slowly every year.

Enjoy your life while you are at it. You mileage (50x and 2%) may vary.



If I could only get BTC exchanged for a NON US currency such as the CAD in physical form and then convert CAD into USD in physical form and spend that using money order when needed and cash for the rest, that would be the best way I can see from avoiding the banks all together.

Am I wrong?

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