Proof that MineThatCloud is a Ponzi

[Mabsark]

The payments were made form 1844aNo5gAssVSmUmLwk6qG61uBNdQswH3 as shown in the payout history on their website.

0.0087 BTC was sent from 12wmRSVf1e6MTpmvGuUxreEXxbaRHkepuC to 1JgxteZWCuZLu4FnPUWv3Jxgj89QkFXLvX which sent 0.0087 BTC to 1844aNo5gAssVSmUmLwk6qG61uBNdQswH3 which sent 0.0001402 BTC to 12wmRSVf1e6MTpmvGuUxreEXxbaRHkepuC.

In other words, payouts are funded from new customers buying contracts.

More (found by jimmothy):

1PdvNQYCnWP9NftxE6gu5DvYVSnkgwnXu3 > 0.0087 > 1GSWxmZU3oHiyBA7PhoqE5ZrAN5YHtjbYx > 0.0087 > 1844aNo5gAssVSmUmLwk6qG61uBNdQswH3 > 0.0002804 > 1PdvNQYCnWP9NftxE6gu5DvYVSnkgwnXu3

1PdvNQYCnWP9NftxE6gu5DvYVSnkgwnXu3 > 0.0087 > 1LTcF4xkch1d5Gb5yTkbGCUsjspHp9KWVp > 0.0087 > 1844aNo5gAssVSmUmLwk6qG61uBNdQswH3 > 0.0002804 > 1PdvNQYCnWP9NftxE6gu5DvYVSnkgwnXu3

1s3DP7QaqwsRrTEn6UQBd9zPCmmvv6KW3 > 0.0087 > 1DzwbKnTXSJtnW2QXjE5EtV1TSSa5bDfki > 0.0087 > 1844aNo5gAssVSmUmLwk6qG61uBNdQswH3 > 0.0043462 > 1s3DP7QaqwsRrTEn6UQBd9zPCmmvv6KW3

Edit: The website was been redirected to Cloud Mining Website on Jan 22/23 2015.

[MineThatCloud]

The payments were made form 1844aNo5gAssVSmUmLwk6qG61uBNdQswH3 as shown in the payout history on their [website](http://www.minethatcloud.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=18)

0.0087 BTC was sent from 12wmRSVf1e6MTpmvGuUxreEXxbaRHkepuC to 1JgxteZWCuZLu4FnPUWv3Jxgj89QkFXLvX which sent 0.0087 BTC to 1844aNo5gAssVSmUmLwk6qG61uBNdQswH3 which sent 0.0001402 BTC to 12wmRSVf1e6MTpmvGuUxreEXxbaRHkepuC.

In other words, payouts are funded from new customers buying contracts.

Incorrect, We have our mining address with funds in.

So unless you know that, Your argument is flawed. We are not a ponzi and will prove that to our customer base.

We dont have to prove that to random people who wont stop harrasing us. Please leave us alone

I expect more from a hero member.

[TechnoBibble]

The payments were made form 1844aNo5gAssVSmUmLwk6qG61uBNdQswH3 as shown in the payout history on their [website](http://www.minethatcloud.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=18)

0.0087 BTC was sent from 12wmRSVf1e6MTpmvGuUxreEXxbaRHkepuC to 1JgxteZWCuZLu4FnPUWv3Jxgj89QkFXLvX which sent 0.0087 BTC to 1844aNo5gAssVSmUmLwk6qG61uBNdQswH3 which sent 0.0001402 BTC to 12wmRSVf1e6MTpmvGuUxreEXxbaRHkepuC.

In other words, payouts are funded from new customers buying contracts.

hmm. Lets be fair here.

MineThatCloud are still paying out and i'm sure with your stance on their operation that you have not invested? So the fact they are proving their payments and have not scammed you.... I dont see need for this thread? It is pure speculation.

Lets start to talk about who else "MIGHT" be a ponzi without any proof. What you have posted is not proof when you read MineThatCloud's statement. They are not obliged to show any information to you, especially if they feel you are "harrasing" them.

I can see because you are not on terms with this service you have also left bad trust.

Another case of trust abuse in a rediculous system. Dont let your high post count get to your head.

[s1lverbox]

The payments were made form 1844aNo5gAssVSmUmLwk6qG61uBNdQswH3 as shown in the payout history on their [website](http://www.minethatcloud.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=18)

0.0087 BTC was sent from 12wmRSVf1e6MTpmvGuUxreEXxbaRHkepuC to 1JgxteZWCuZLu4FnPUWv3Jxgj89QkFXLvX which sent 0.0087 BTC to 1844aNo5gAssVSmUmLwk6qG61uBNdQswH3 which sent 0.0001402 BTC to 12wmRSVf1e6MTpmvGuUxreEXxbaRHkepuC.

In other words, payouts are funded from new customers buying contracts.

another ponzi..great. what happened to old times when no one screwed another. This days business model is  to screw people over. how you sleeping over night I don't know.

[Mabsark]

Incorrect, We have our mining address with funds in.

So unless you know that, Your argument is flawed. We are not a ponzi and will prove that to our customer base.

We dont have to prove that to random people who wont stop harrasing us. Please leave us alone

I expect more from a hero member.

You are paying your customers directly with money that your customers have sent you. The proof is in the blockchain for everyone to see.

You are paid by a customer with address 12wmRSVf1e6MTpmvGuUxreEXxbaRHkepuC and a fraction of those coins are returned to the customer with that address after only passing through 2 other addresses.

Lets start to talk about who else "MIGHT" be a ponzi without any proof.

There is no "might be a ponzi" about it. They are paying new customers with the money from old customers.

[TechnoBibble]

Incorrect, We have our mining address with funds in.

So unless you know that, Your argument is flawed. We are not a ponzi and will prove that to our customer base.

We dont have to prove that to random people who wont stop harrasing us. Please leave us alone

I expect more from a hero member.

You are paying your customers directly with money that your customers have sent you. The proof is in the blockchain for everyone to see.

You are paid by a customer with address 12wmRSVf1e6MTpmvGuUxreEXxbaRHkepuC and a fraction of those coins are returned to the customer with that address after only passing through 2 other addresses.

Lets start to talk about who else "MIGHT" be a ponzi without any proof.

There is no "might be a ponzi" about it. They are paying new customers with the money from old customers.

What do you suggest they do, Have a seperate pay in account? Surely once the BTC has been sent to them its theirs to pay out?

if they carry on paying out, surely its not a scam?

[Sam the Man]

Incorrect, We have our mining address with funds in.

So unless you know that, Your argument is flawed. We are not a ponzi and will prove that to our customer base.

We dont have to prove that to random people who wont stop harrasing us. Please leave us alone

I expect more from a hero member.

You are paying your customers directly with money that your customers have sent you. The proof is in the blockchain for everyone to see.

You are paid by a customer with address 12wmRSVf1e6MTpmvGuUxreEXxbaRHkepuC and a fraction of those coins are returned to the customer with that address after only passing through 2 other addresses.

Lets start to talk about who else "MIGHT" be a ponzi without any proof.

There is no "might be a ponzi" about it. They are paying new customers with the money from old customers.

I dunno obviously I can't say anything for certain, cause im no pro.
But I still don't see how you can say they are a scam for certain.
So far they have paid up, and kept in contact and answered all my questions quickly and well...

Also did'nt in there original post it say that  they had btc in a mining address??
surely that disproves your theory on that account...

I would like to know to be honest i'm peppering them with questions on there site and so far they have given satisfactory answers to everything.

I'm not going against you or anything I just think that surely you need more solid proof to post scam accusations on here??

[Mabsark]

I dunno obviously I can't say anything for certain, cause im no pro.
But I still don't see how you can say they are a scam for certain.
So far they have paid up, and kept in contact and answered all my questions quickly and well...

Also did'nt in there original post it say that  they had btc in a mining address??
surely that disproves your theory on that account...

I would like to know to be honest i'm peppering them with questions on there site and so far they have given satisfactory answers to everything.

I'm not going against you or anything I just think that surely you need more solid proof to post scam accusations on here??

Do you even know what a ponzi is? PBMining paid out right up until it ran away with the money. So did Hashie. So did Cryptominer. So did every ponzi in existence. That's how they work.

As for their mining address:

We can assure you we are legitimate, But only time will prove that.

What is your mining address?

I'm not at liberty to disclose that as I have been informed it could lead to a potential attack. We do not want to give that out publicly.

[Syke]

if they carry on paying out, surely its not a scam?

And what will you say when they stop paying out? Here's proof they cannot continue paying out.

The costs I personally cannot help to clear up, I know we are taking a small loss and are very hopeful of increases to the value of bitcoin rising soon, but things are steady and only improving so we are in this for the long run without unforeseen problems .

Let's analyse this "small loss" using the best numbers possible.

Expense:
Cost of 15x SP20s = $5,495
15x PSUs = $1500
Cost of power ($.26/kwh * 24 * 365 * 15 * 1.2 kw) = $40,997
Total Expense: $47,992

Income:
25.5 TH/s mining ($60.5 * 365) = $22,083
25.5 TH/s contracts sold (25.5 * 1000 * .00087 * 205) = $4,548
Total Income = $26,631

$48k vs $27k. They are running a massive loss, nearly double what the income is, not even counting the promotions, the free hashpower giveaways, website development, etc.

[MineThatCloud]

if they carry on paying out, surely its not a scam?

And what will you say when they stop paying out? Here's proof they cannot continue paying out.

The costs I personally cannot help to clear up, I know we are taking a small loss and are very hopeful of increases to the value of bitcoin rising soon, but things are steady and only improving so we are in this for the long run without unforeseen problems .

Let's analyse this "small loss" using the best numbers possible.

Expense:
Cost of 15x SP20s = $5,495
15x PSUs = $1500
Cost of power ($.26/kwh * 24 * 365 * 15 * 1.2 kw) = $40,997
Total Expense: $47,992

Income:
25.5 TH/s mining ($60.5 * 365) = $22,083
25.5 TH/s contracts sold (25.5 * 1000 * .00087 * 205) = $4,548
Total Income = $26,631

$48k vs $27k. They are running a massive loss, nearly double what the income is, not even counting the promotions, the free hashpower giveaways, website development, etc.

Your Numbers are Incorrect.

You know we do make a lot of our BTC from mining and exchanging scrypt coins? 35,300 MH/s infact Not Just SHA-256.

Get your facts right before posting, Dont speculate.

All this tread is about is useless unfounded speculation with no substancial reasoning.

[Mabsark]

Your Numbers are Incorrect.

You know we do make a lot of our BTC from mining and exchanging scrypt coins? 35,300 MH/s infact Not Just SHA-256.

Get your facts right before posting, Dont speculate.

All this tread is about is useless unfounded speculation with no substancial reasoning.

Show your maths then proving him wrong.

Also, you still need to explain why 12wmRSVf1e6MTpmvGuUxreEXxbaRHkepuC is being paid from the money they sent you via 2 intermediate addresses. That's the very definition of a bloody ponzi:

A Ponzi scheme is a fraudulent investment operation where the operator, an individual or organization, pays returns to its investors from new capital paid to the operators by new investors, rather than from profit earned by the operator.

[MineThatCloud]

This thread is a joke, pure unfounded speculation...

where did you get the SP20's from? I didnt say we used any spondoolie tech equipment.

as someone above said, im not obliged to explain myself to any of you idiots specualting alot of nonsense, I'm not going to waste my time

reading the above, Mabsark and Syke really need to get a life and stop harrasing a legitimate service, Stop wasting your time.

[Syke]

You know we do make a lot of our BTC from mining and exchanging scrypt coins? 35,300 MH/s infact Not Just SHA-256.

So when someone buys a SHA contract, you don't actually mine SHA coins? Do you mine any coins?

This thread is a joke, pure unfounded speculation...

where did you get the SP20's from? I didnt say we used any spondoolie tech equipment.

SP20s are the cheapest option. Ok, so you admit that you are using equipment that is more expensive and costly to maintain. Your losses are much greater than I estimated.

as someone above said, im not obliged to explain myself to any of you idiots specualting alot of nonsense, I'm not going to waste my time

reading the above, Mabsark and Syke really need to get a life and stop harrasing a legitimate service, Stop wasting your time.

You have shown absolutely no proof that you are legitimate, so I will continue shedding light on your scam everywhere I can.

[Sam the Man]

You know we do make a lot of our BTC from mining and exchanging scrypt coins? 35,300 MH/s infact Not Just SHA-256.

So when someone buys a SHA contract, you don't actually mine SHA coins? Do you mine any coins?

This thread is a joke, pure unfounded speculation...

where did you get the SP20's from? I didnt say we used any spondoolie tech equipment.

SP20s are the cheapest option. Ok, so you admit that you are using equipment that is more expensive and costly to maintain. Your losses are much greater than I estimated.

as someone above said, im not obliged to explain myself to any of you idiots specualting alot of nonsense, I'm not going to waste my time

reading the above, Mabsark and Syke really need to get a life and stop harrasing a legitimate service, Stop wasting your time.

You have shown absolutely no proof that you are legitimate, so I will continue shedding light on your scam everywhere I can.

How do you know your shining light on a scam.. Thats all i want to know i want definitive proof.

Not random speculations and theories.

I'm a firm believer in innocent until proven guilty,
where your philosophy seems to be Guilty because i say so..

I understand wanting proof but at the same time its there choice, your demanding stuff like you have some sort of authority over them

[Mabsark]

How do you know your shining light on a scam.. Thats all i want to know i want definitive proof.

Not random speculations and theories.

I'm a firm believer in innocent until proven guilty,
where your philosophy seems to be Guilty because i say so..

I understand wanting proof but at the same time like its there choice, your demanding stuff like you have some sort of authority over them

You've already been provided with blockchain proof that MineThatCloud "pays returns to its investors from new capital paid to the operators by new investors, rather than from profit earned by the operator."

What more proof do you want that they're a ponzi?

[Syke]

How do you know your shining light on a scam.. Thats all i want to know i want definitive proof.

Read my cost analysis. Roughly it is this, for every $500 they bring in, they pay out $1000. Now you tell me how that is possible.

I'm a firm believer in innocent until proven guilty,
where your philosophy seems to be Guilty because i say so..

My philosophy is when someone asks me for money, I demand some proof. Proof that is easy to provide by legitimate people. Why do they refuse?

[Puppet]

How do you know your shining light on a scam.. Thats all i want to know i want definitive proof.

Not random speculations and theories.

I'm a firm believer in innocent until proven guilty,
where your philosophy seems to be Guilty because i say so..

When it comes to trusting anyone with your money, of course you should assume 'guilty' unless proof of the contrary (ie legitimacy) is offered. Do you send money to any random nigerian prince emailing you offers of high returns, just because no one has proven, or even is able to prove he is a fraud?

Aim your question of "definite proof" to the operators, and if they refuse to provide any, you can safely bet its yet another ponzi scam.

[tmfp]

I understand wanting proof but at the same time its there choice, your demanding stuff like you have some sort of authority over them

He's just asking questions, like you. His criteria for investment may be a little higher than yours. 

to be honest i'm peppering them with questions on there site and so far they have given satisfactory answers to everything.

What questions are you peppering them with?

Have you tried:
Can I choose my own pool?
What hardware do you use and can the manufacturer confirm this?
Who are you? As in who am I dealing with, apart from a website and a wallet address?
If your operation is marginally profitable as you agree it is, how/why can you afford 7% affiliate fees?

if they carry on paying out, surely its not a scam?

That's just a lol.

[Mabsark]

Further proof of ponzi found by jimmothy added to op.

More:

1PdvNQYCnWP9NftxE6gu5DvYVSnkgwnXu3 > 0.0087 > 1GSWxmZU3oHiyBA7PhoqE5ZrAN5YHtjbYx > 0.0087 > 1844aNo5gAssVSmUmLwk6qG61uBNdQswH3 > 0.0002804 > 1PdvNQYCnWP9NftxE6gu5DvYVSnkgwnXu3

1PdvNQYCnWP9NftxE6gu5DvYVSnkgwnXu3 > 0.0087 > 1LTcF4xkch1d5Gb5yTkbGCUsjspHp9KWVp > 0.0087 > 1844aNo5gAssVSmUmLwk6qG61uBNdQswH3 > 0.0002804 > 1PdvNQYCnWP9NftxE6gu5DvYVSnkgwnXu3

1s3DP7QaqwsRrTEn6UQBd9zPCmmvv6KW3 > 0.0087 > 1DzwbKnTXSJtnW2QXjE5EtV1TSSa5bDfki > 0.0087 > 1844aNo5gAssVSmUmLwk6qG61uBNdQswH3 > 0.0043462 > 1s3DP7QaqwsRrTEn6UQBd9zPCmmvv6KW3

[fachan]

Your Numbers are Incorrect.

You know we do make a lot of our BTC from mining and exchanging scrypt coins? 35,300 MH/s infact Not Just SHA-256.

Get your facts right before posting, Dont speculate.

All this tread is about is useless unfounded speculation with no substancial reasoning.

Show your maths then proving him wrong.

Also, you still need to explain why 12wmRSVf1e6MTpmvGuUxreEXxbaRHkepuC is being paid from the money they sent you via 2 intermediate addresses. That's the very definition of a bloody ponzi:

A Ponzi scheme is a fraudulent investment operation where the operator, an individual or organization, pays returns to its investors from new capital paid to the operators by new investors, rather than from profit earned by the operator.

12wmRSVf1e6MTpmvGuUxreEXxbaRHkepuC is my address I bought 10 Gh this morning my time and I funded it from my coinbase account.  Right after bought the GHs I posted in his thread with my sig and got the free 100 and a small payout.