Philipma1957's attempt to rate current Manufacturers of Asic . Results in.

[Zich]

[1713464816]

1713464816

[1713464816]

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[philipma1957]

You just skewed the poll. I wish you  had asked.

In a way it points out a very difficult problem on the site. How to keep the site fairly honest.  it is funny as I was writing this post  to respond to Bick  I went to post it and was told a new post came up.

[philipma1957]

So I am not going to take a fee for this. I will add 3 more questions .

 the 6th is  my question.

As a home miner which of the following would you want to buy Today?

1) Asic Mner --Prisma
2) Avalon ----- A4
3) Bitmaintech --S5
4) Spondoolies --SP20

[Swimmer63]

A lot of good comments.  Just my 2 bits:

Miners have a short "profit" life.  Any manufacturer poll can differ significantly depending on who has the hot miners.  Bitfury is not relevant right now and may not be again.  But if you took this poll last spring the answers would be very different.
And if you take it 3 months from now the answers will be different.
I will say that Bitmain and Spondoolies are the first manufacturers to show a consistent and relevant product line.  Asicminer has made great miners in the past and is the most generous with returns.  But there can be a long time where they don't have hot miner.  There are others like this.

So timing of this sort of survey is everything.

[philipma1957]

A lot of good comments.  Just my 2 bits:

Miners have a short "profit" life.  Any manufacturer poll can differ significantly depending on who has the hot miners.  Bitfury is not relevant right now and may not be again.  But if you took this poll last spring the answers would be very different.
And if you take it 3 months from now the answers will be different.
I will say that Bitmain and Spondoolies are the first manufacturers to show a consistent and relevant product line.  Asicminer has made great miners in the past and is the most generous with returns.  But there can be a long time where they don't have hot miner.  There are others like this.

So timing of this sort of survey is everything.

yep and I am reworking this as I type. 6th question is here. it is my question and it is blind poll.  Meaning no visible results until feb 6th.

I will put two more polls up later
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=938696.msg10284107#msg10284107

[opieum2]

Why do we need 6 or 7 polls for the same thing? Seems like a way to game the SEO to get your benefactors results up. All this just to bury a less than stellar review from dogie? Granted his reviews are not perfect, but they certainly have been a good guide to getting to a decent vendor. These polls come on the heels of spondoolies complaining in dogies thread about their pre-order rating (something the community overall hates as it puts the financial risk on the customer).

Overall they have proven themselves as a vendor so no knocks from me personally, but the community has made it clear they hate pre-orders. So its a sticking point that lowers their ranking. This seems fair to rate against considering the history of the pre-orders in the mining community.

EDIT: IMO though I do think Dogie might need to consider handing off the review thing to someone else who is willing to take it on that does not give off a biased appearance. While I personally do not think he is, I can see why people would considering his affiliation with bitmain.

[Guy Corem]

How about:
6a) Which manufacturer pays legendary members who are known to be positive towards their company, to commission and adjudicate polls that are biased towards their company, because they were unhappy with another user's ranking, and then tries to hide that they're actually the company paying for and commissioning them?
6b) Which manufacturer used a preorder model? [can't do this one on the forums, should really be doing this on survey monkey anyway]
6c) Which manufacturer should just be patient and await their perfect '100' score in dogie's rating if they follow through with promises, rather than going through all this and making things worse for themselves?
6d) Which manufacturer should stop trying to drag other's name through the dirt in order to fit a short term agenda, which through the virtue of NDAs can not be discussed, even when the topic / question is directly brought up by themselves?

Dogie, my disagreement with you is very open and public:

(1) You tweaked the criteria of your manufacturer's Trustworthiness Guide, refuse to update it and claim we're "Pre-Orders" company although we're selling only from stock (shipping immediately!) and I've publicly said (several times!) that we won't take pre-orders on our 3rd gen due to the high risk of the development. Customers reading your guide are getting wrong information.

(2) You raised hell after we did our SP20 Legendaries review, including asking a moderator to revive "Spondoolies Spam" thread and move it from Trash to Meta. You also unjustifiably reported some of my posts in the SP20s review threads to moderators. You don't have the decency to admit it turns out very nice and we now have very interesting SP20, S5 and Avalon4 reviews with full of good and relevant information under hardware. It servers Hardware subsection and make it more interesting.

Guy

Edit:
Dogie, on a personal note (yeah, I'm aware it's public), admitting a mistake shows a strength of character. It's not a weakness.
I resent the statement you wrote - "drag other's name through the dirt". I consider you a friend and I believe you're doing positive stuff to promote and help the industry and the home miners. You need to separate our arguments from the rest. I'm not trying to hurt you in anyway.

[philipma1957]

Why do we need 6 or 7 polls for the same thing? Seems like a way to game the SEO to get your benefactors results up. All this just to bury a less than stellar review from dogie? Granted his reviews are not perfect, but they certainly have been a good guide to getting to a decent vendor. These polls come on the heels of spondoolies complaining in dogies thread about their pre-order rating (something the community overall hates as it puts the financial risk on the customer).

Overall they have proven themselves as a vendor so no knocks from me personally, but the community has made it clear they hate pre-orders. So its a sticking point that lowers their ranking. This seems fair to rate against considering the history of the pre-orders in the mining community.

EDIT: IMO though I do think Dogie might need to consider handing off the review thing to someone else who is willing to take it on that does not give off a biased appearance. While I personally do not think he is, I can see why people would considering his affiliation with bitmain.

I can't set it up any other way. I would prefer to do an 8-10 question survey.

Once every 6 weeks. Post it and do the survey six weeks later. Stays up to date  this way.

This thread has done  one thing for sure it points out a real need for a fair listing of current gear/builders. Based on available gear.

 Dogie's trustworthy list is a bit outdated and far too long.
 This thread is getting too long.
 Keeping the 8 polls with 8 questions is too long. But I don't have any other way.  right now I have 6 .
 5 are open to the public and 1 is blind until feb 6
 If I do 2 more they would be blind to the public until feb 6.
 I don't really want a war but it is plan to see there are a lot of strong behind the scenes discussions occurring.

[Zich]

Off topic
I hope in future we can post poll in message
One poll on one thread not reasonable anymore since one topic will have many point to poll.

[btcshiner]

Hey Phillipma1957 great thread.  

If we are going to keep driving our manufacturer's to produce consumer friendly home miners to increase decentralization we need to provide feedback to keep them competitive.  
The new Asicminer chip seems to have great specs, but if I have to fiddle with a "controller", ask people to fix stratum to increase pools because I don't have a linux machine or don't like the ones they "forced" on me, I probably won't buy it.  My time is worth fiat and that is something I now take into account when buying a miner.

Personally without the threads of the people who received SP20's I probably wouldn't even look at them.  Up until the SP20 the power in my house really couldn't support their previous miners at a price point that Bitmain did.  Good move.

I love Bitmain.  It's the one company that has never failed to deliver a working miner for me.  Even though my s2 was poorly shipped, the lcd never worked, I had it up and working in 10 minutes.  And it's still hashing above specs.  I sold a few thousand U1's and U2's, went through a lot of s1's and s3's and less than 1% of each ever had an issue and that was mostly user error.  That said I am glad they are getting some competition.  
They need to be kept honest and on their toes.

Someone mentioned Rockminer and unless I missed an update I don't think they are producing anymore miners unless they find a new cheaper factory or get some contract work based on AM new chips.

[jamesg]

Maybe there should be another poll about which mining manufacturer is going to start self-mining next....

[philipma1957]

Off topic
I hope in future we can post poll in message
One poll on one thread not reasonable anymore since one topic will have many point to poll.

yeah an 8 to 10 question survey to be done every 35-40 days is a good idea.

we could have a  thread to hammer out the questions and a few people could run the thread .   The asic game has always been 90 days at a time.

Or 120 day at a time.  Then new gear.  A survey kept up to date would really help people get the 'now' gear from the current good seller.

KNC was godlike for about 60-90 days.  Sept-Nov 2013.  Jupiter's were the hottest gear and made money hand over fist.

[btcshiner]

One more thing Have the manufacture that you set the first 5 questions up for Donate your funds to your favorite charity.  You already did the work and posted the questions.  The MS Society is my choice if you put it to vote.

[philipma1957]

One more thing Have the manufacture that you set the first 5 questions up for Donate your funds to your favorite charity.  You already did the work and posted the questions.  The MS Society is my choice if you put it to vote.

  If they choose to do that I will donate it and show proof of the donation.

Please  note polls were deleted  by the forum mods.-----------

 I would still prefer to do a survey of current miners / gear.

[Guy Corem]

...
Please  note polls were deleted  by the forum mods.-----------

 I would still prefer to do a survey of current miners / gear.

Dogie, is it you barking again to the moderators ?

[Finksy]

For the sake of transparency, I will disclose that there is only one thing I dislike about Bitmain, and that is Dogie's holier-than-thou attitude. The speech about agendas was very touching. The irony.



Now for relevance sake, even if SP-Tech is trying to toot their own horn, at least they care enough about their customers to address any downfall they might have in comparison to their competitors in an open forum. BMT's product has always been top notch, but they haven't exactly been open to criticism, constructive or not.

When you are the best, you don't have to be afraid of competition and ratings. That isn't to say anyone stays the best for long though.

[Guy Corem]

Well, thank you Zich for capturing a snapshot before the mods police kill it without explanation.
Unbelievable. I'm speechless.

Guy

[Zich]

Well, thank you Zich for capturing a snapshot before the mods police kill it without explanation.
Unbelievable. I'm speechless.

Guy

No problem  

My my, all of the poll is deleted  

[philipma1957]

Not looking to do this anymore.

 Since this was cancelled to be fair Spondoolies-Tech ask me to do the thread and poll.



1) I run s-5's--------------------- 1 in house  1 at a Chinese hoster https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=934581.0

2) I run sp20's------------------- 9 in house

3) The avalon4 might be okay. read a review right here:  https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=938679.0


 One thing is obvious we need a better method to let people know what gear+ builders are worth using.

[Guy Corem]

Well, thank you Zich for capturing a snapshot before the mods police kill it without explanation.
Unbelievable. I'm speechless.

Guy

No problem  

My my, all of the poll is deleted  

I can't prove it, but I'm hearing sinister dog barks.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-g92VWIu8NQ