Where are the trustless or mostly trustless exchanges?

[jabo38]

I want to trade on an exchange that I know can't Gox or Bter me. 

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[CIYAM]

I want to trade on an exchange that I know can't Gox or Bter me.  

The problem is whether you want to trade "crypto for crypto" or "crypto for fiat".

The former will be able to be addressed soon (the AT project has already developed an "atomic cross-chain transfer" smart contract that can do this provided both blockchains have implemented AT) but the latter is not likely to ever happen (as fiat transfers basically *require* a trusted 3rd party).

[slacknation]

coinbase is probably your best bet

[Rannasha]

coinbase is probably your best bet

Except that it isn't, because Coinbase is far from trustless and can run with the money / get hacked just like Gox / BTER.

[jabo38]

coinbase is probably your best bet

Except that it isn't, because Coinbase is far from trustless and can run with the money / get hacked just like Gox / BTER.

Okay, so I should have been clear, for coin <-> fiat I think Coinbase is the way to go.  I have my coins in Coinbase in a multisig vault where I control the keys, so at least in my case it is literally impossible for them to Gox/Bter me.  That isn't the case with everybody or probably even most people on Coinbase, but it is interesting that at least the option exists. 

I want to trade on an exchange that I know can't Gox or Bter me. 

The problem is whether you want to trade "crypto for crypto" or "crypto for fiat".

The former will be able to be addressed soon (the AT project has already developed an "atomic cross-chain transfer" smart contract that can do this provided both blockchains have implemented AT) but the latter is not likely to ever happen (as fiat transfers basically *require* a trusted 3rd party).

I am basically wanting to know a good exchange for coin <-> coin.  I have watched AT and am very excited about it, but will AT enable exchanges? I was thinking it would be more for person to person coin trades.

[Lethn]

You cannot have a trustless exchange for paper based currencies.

[CIYAM]

I am basically wanting to know a good exchange for coin <-> coin.  I have watched AT and am very excited about it, but will AT enable exchanges? I was thinking it would be more for person to person coin trades.

AT on its own (using the ACCT use case) will only be suitable for more person-to-person trades *but* the CIYAM project has a Token package that is designed to work with ACCT making it perhaps a very suitable "trustless exchange platform" (it isn't using a blockchain yet but that is coming - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=598860.0).

[franky1]

for crypto -> fiat the most trustless exchange is localbitcoins. because your dealing with people more directly and not just having SQL databases of orders sitting there.

in short a trade cannot happen if the funds are not locked in, and once transfered, they can be withdrawn. thus little to no chance of fraction reserve stuff that mtgox was doing

[gbianchi]

read here

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=945881.0

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=945881.msg10437322#msg10437322

[tins]

I'd say Coinbase based on their relationships with major industrial companies.
They just have too much to lose and not enough to gain by pulling a gox.

[jabo38]

read here

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=945881.0

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=945881.msg10437322#msg10437322

Good links.  Here are some of the projects I like. 

https://coinfloor.co.uk/ 100% of coins are in cold mulitsig storage

http://www.coinffeine.com/  A painful but mostly trustless way to exchange fiat <-> coin.  There are a few weaknesses but they are too big of a threat.

https://bitsquare.io/ Another painful but fairly safe way to go from fiat <-> coin. 

https://www.therocktrading.com/ like Coinbase, they have an option for the user to control the keys.

All of the above are fiat to coin.  The last one is my favorite because I am looking for a coin <-> option.  It still has weakness though.

https://exchange.coinport.com/  Everything is opensource and open data.  Combine that with user controlled keys and I'm in.  I would be happy even with a GreenAddress method of keys where the user holds one and GreenAddress holds one, so neither can really act without the other.  There is a nuclear option though to get your coins back if GreenAddress shuts down. 
 

[jabo38]

Here is an idea that I got from a chat with a guy named Marshal.  This type of technology is possible and would greatly cut down on thefts. 


here is one simple step that I wish all exchanges could follow

all user wallet funds that are not actively being traded should be sent with ntimelock in the opcode

on 2/2 multisig

that way if the exchange ever goes down, the user can redeem funds

• days later that they can set in their preferences

greenaddress.it does this and it's great. Every time you deposit or withdraw funds you will get an email with an encrypted zip containing the singed transaction that you can broadcast after a certain number of specified days.