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Author Topic: This is not a kangaroo court - innocent until proven guilty  (Read 5700 times)
genjix
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July 26, 2012, 02:09:06 PM
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We don't have all the information, and I'd avoid leaping to conclusions until you know more. Personally I'm staying out of this as I'm not qualified to make judgements and adequate people are already involved.

Here's an extract from an article I wrote:

Quote
In 1992, Stella Liebeck bought coffee at McDonalds. She spilled the hot drink on herself and later claiming injury against McDonalds because the coffee was too hot, initiated a lawsuit for $1 million. She is the poster child for frivolous litigation in the US.

What I failed to mention is that the coffee was served at over 90 degrees celsius and having suffered 3rd degree burns over 16% of her body, she spent 8 days in hospital for skin grafting and required 2 years of medical treatment. When she asked McDonalds to pay $20k to cover the remaining medical expenses which her insurance wouldn’t cover, they rebuked her with an offer of $800. During the case she offered to settle out of court with them for $20k and later $300k which they refused both times. During the case it was found there were 700 other similar court cases where McDonalds had settled out of court.
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davout
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July 26, 2012, 02:10:04 PM
 #2

So ?

DarkEmi
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July 26, 2012, 02:32:05 PM
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Arent you qualified to contact authorities, police, attorney, on the behalf of bitcoinica ?

speculate on the mtgox price - http://www.btcoracle.com/
buy Mastercoin - http://masterxchange.com
repentance
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July 26, 2012, 02:53:34 PM
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We don't have all the information, and I'd avoid leaping to conclusions until you know more. Personally I'm staying out of this as I'm not qualified to make judgements and adequate people are already involved.

No informal investigation can ever uncover all the information.  If no formal investigation takes place, then - for better or worse - this whole affair is going to be judged on limited facts in the court of public opinion.

All I can say is that this is Bitcoin. I don't believe it until I see six confirmations.
defxor
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July 26, 2012, 02:56:33 PM
 #5

We don't have all the information, and I'd avoid leaping to conclusions until you know more. Personally I'm staying out of this as I'm not qualified to make judgements and adequate people are already involved.

The strongest indication that one or more of the Bitcoinica hacks were inside jobs is that you, Patrick and/or Donald have not filed a police report.

Currently I consider the only unknown to be exactly who were in on it. Feel free to let us know how and why the source code got released btw, since that was the trigger needed to claim the latest "hack" Smiley


Frankie
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July 26, 2012, 03:03:59 PM
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Quote
In 1992, Stella Liebeck bought coffee at McDonalds. She spilled the hot drink on herself and later claiming injury against McDonalds because the coffee was too hot, initiated a lawsuit for $1 million. She is the poster child for frivolous litigation in the US.

What I failed to mention is that the coffee was served at over 90 degrees celsius and having suffered 3rd degree burns over 16% of her body, she spent 8 days in hospital for skin grafting and required 2 years of medical treatment. When she asked McDonalds to pay $20k to cover the remaining medical expenses which her insurance wouldn’t cover, they rebuked her with an offer of $800. During the case she offered to settle out of court with them for $20k and later $300k which they refused both times. During the case it was found there were 700 other similar court cases where McDonalds had settled out of court.

Actually, the 700 reports (not lawsuits) were over the previous decade.

The coffee was not served over 90 degrees, it was less than 85, and it is served even hotter today at Starbucks.

She sued for millions and millions in damages, and the jury would have given her 2.9 million, but the judge reduced it to $640,000, and the case settled for something more than a half million.

Courts since have routinely rejected the claim that coffee is unreasonably dangerous. McDonalds lost mostly because an executive came off as a jackass.
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July 26, 2012, 03:07:54 PM
 #7

We don't have all the information, and I'd avoid leaping to conclusions until you know more. Personally I'm staying out of this as I'm not qualified to make judgements and adequate people are already involved.

Here's an extract from an article I wrote:

Quote
In 1992, Stella Liebeck bought coffee at McDonalds. She spilled the hot drink on herself and later claiming injury against McDonalds because the coffee was too hot, initiated a lawsuit for $1 million. She is the poster child for frivolous litigation in the US.

What I failed to mention is that the coffee was served at over 90 degrees celsius and having suffered 3rd degree burns over 16% of her body, she spent 8 days in hospital for skin grafting and required 2 years of medical treatment. When she asked McDonalds to pay $20k to cover the remaining medical expenses which her insurance wouldn’t cover, they rebuked her with an offer of $800. During the case she offered to settle out of court with them for $20k and later $300k which they refused both times. During the case it was found there were 700 other similar court cases where McDonalds had settled out of court.

Still waiting to hear why this matter hasnt been reported to the police by the principals.

greyhawk
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July 26, 2012, 03:18:56 PM
 #8

We don't have all the information, and I'd avoid leaping to conclusions until you know more. Personally I'm staying out of this as I'm not qualified to make judgements and adequate people are already involved.

Here's an extract from an article I wrote:

Quote
In 1992, Stella Liebeck bought coffee at McDonalds. She spilled the hot drink on herself and later claiming injury against McDonalds because the coffee was too hot, initiated a lawsuit for $1 million. She is the poster child for frivolous litigation in the US.

What I failed to mention is that the coffee was served at over 90 degrees celsius and having suffered 3rd degree burns over 16% of her body, she spent 8 days in hospital for skin grafting and required 2 years of medical treatment. When she asked McDonalds to pay $20k to cover the remaining medical expenses which her insurance wouldn’t cover, they rebuked her with an offer of $800. During the case she offered to settle out of court with them for $20k and later $300k which they refused both times. During the case it was found there were 700 other similar court cases where McDonalds had settled out of court.

Still waiting to hear why this matter hasnt been reported to the police by the principals.

They have to wait until their coffee is less hot.
Coinoisseur
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July 26, 2012, 03:30:42 PM
 #9

+1


Still waiting to hear why this matter hasnt been reported to the police by the principals.
Raoul Duke
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July 26, 2012, 03:47:14 PM
 #10

OK, genjix. We will leave Zhou Tong be for now.

Let's talk about the Bitcoinica source code you leaked.
So, the encoded file has the exact same thing on the /bitcoinica_legacy/.git/logs/HEAD file
Code:
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000 939e877106a5bd479f350adc6d9e4170c62df8f3 genjix <genjix@nite.(none)> 1338505438 +0200 clone: from git@github.com:bitcoinica/bitcoinica_legacy.git

Cloned by Genjix from the bitcoinica private github repo on May 31 2012... Interesting Wink

And look at who packed it... surprise surprise
Code:
drwxr-xr-x genjix/genjix     0 2012-07-07 20:18 bitcoinica_legacy/


Care to explain the above?

davout
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July 26, 2012, 04:39:29 PM
 #11

OK, genjix. We will leave Zhou Tong be for now.

Let's talk about the Bitcoinica source code you leaked.
So, the encoded file has the exact same thing on the /bitcoinica_legacy/.git/logs/HEAD file
Code:
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000 939e877106a5bd479f350adc6d9e4170c62df8f3 genjix <genjix@nite.(none)> 1338505438 +0200 clone: from git@github.com:bitcoinica/bitcoinica_legacy.git

Cloned by Genjix from the bitcoinica private github repo on May 31 2012... Interesting Wink

And look at who packed it... surprise surprise
Code:
drwxr-xr-x genjix/genjix     0 2012-07-07 20:18 bitcoinica_legacy/


Care to explain the above?
^ This

Raoul Duke
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July 26, 2012, 04:45:25 PM
 #12

davout, I'm having a dejá vu...

So, the encoded file has the exact same thing on the /bitcoinica_legacy/.git/log/HEAD file
Code:
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000 939e877106a5bd479f350adc6d9e4170c62df8f3 genjix <genjix@nite.(none)> 1338505438 +0200 clone: from git@github.com:bitcoinica/bitcoinica_legacy.git

Cloned by Genjix from the bitcoinica private github repo on May 31 2012... Interesting Wink

And look at who packed it... surprise surprise
Code:
drwxr-xr-x genjix/genjix     0 2012-07-07 20:18 bitcoinica_legacy/


And again, please genjix you explain this? Everything is falsifiable but ...

He won't explain shit. If he wanted to explain he would've done it by now.

lonelyminer (Peter Šurda)
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July 26, 2012, 05:11:33 PM
 #13

Care to explain the above?
That's easy. Someone hacked genjix' VPS.

But why they haven't involved the police is still a mystery to me.
Raoul Duke
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July 26, 2012, 05:20:18 PM
 #14

Care to explain the above?
That's easy. Someone hacked genjix' VPS.


Is your (user)name genjix?

lonelyminer (Peter Šurda)
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July 26, 2012, 05:59:22 PM
 #15

Is your (user)name genjix?
Care to explain why I should care about what you think?
Raoul Duke
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July 26, 2012, 06:04:16 PM
 #16

Is your (user)name genjix?
Care to explain why I should care about what you think?

I didn't ask the question to you, why would I care about any speculation that comes out of your mouth?

You lost a great oportunity to keep your mouth shut.

elux
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July 26, 2012, 06:05:22 PM
 #17

OK, genjix. We will leave Zhou Tong be for now.

Let's talk about the Bitcoinica source code you leaked.
So, the encoded file has the exact same thing on the /bitcoinica_legacy/.git/logs/HEAD file
Code:
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000 939e877106a5bd479f350adc6d9e4170c62df8f3 genjix <genjix@nite.(none)> 1338505438 +0200 clone: from git@github.com:bitcoinica/bitcoinica_legacy.git

Cloned by Genjix from the bitcoinica private github repo on May 31 2012... Interesting Wink

And look at who packed it... surprise surprise
Code:
drwxr-xr-x genjix/genjix     0 2012-07-07 20:18 bitcoinica_legacy/


Care to explain the above?

I've been wondering about this. Did you (genjix) leak the entire bitcoinica source code? If so, why?
kiba
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July 26, 2012, 06:08:18 PM
 #18

Genjix is probably not talking because "he stopped yapping and got lawyered up."

Raoul Duke
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July 26, 2012, 06:17:01 PM
 #19

Genjix is probably not talking because "he stopped yapping and got lawyered up."

Sorry, I don't believe in that.
The concern was first brought up on July 13. He yapped a lot after that date, even to the point of posting the communications he had with Mr. Seale. He carefully avoided answering about the source code leak that points to him.

LoupGaroux
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July 26, 2012, 06:31:19 PM
 #20

Funny how those very same advocates for this being the "Wild Electronic Frontier" and are all for unregulated freedom to conduct business pretty much any which way they want, all become solid Establishment proles when the worm turns against them.

Not a kangaroo court, but you are shocked when people expect you to follow through on your statements?

Innocent until proven guilty, yet by your own admissions you have not followed any other legal requirement in terms of professional practice, business registration, dispute resolution of fiduciary responsibility?

Not a kangaroo court, but you expect the entire world to abide by your random acts of business ethics, contradictory shell game of ownership, and extend you the ability to just walk away from tens of thousands of dollars in value that you assumed IN TRUST?

Innocent until proven guilty, but you hide behind a fabric on lies, non-communication and outright fabrication when confronted with any factual consideration about your actions, and run to find someone else to blame as the "responsible party" in your organization.

Sorry genny old sport, but you can only have one set of rules to play this game. You either follow the path of law and order and full disclosure- in which case you reported this to the authorities months ago when it first happened, and are using your business insurance to make good on all claims, or you want to play cash money big shot playa in the unregulated world, and you take the consequences of dealing with equally unrestricted, and possibly not quite socially restrained victims of your unethical acts.

Hope you are lawyered up with a good one, and a flak vest. You have pissed in the wrong bowl of breakfast cereal.

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