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Author Topic: Obama to ban bullets by executive action, threatens top-selling AR-15 rifle  (Read 3494 times)
Wilikon (OP)
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February 26, 2015, 08:20:48 PM
 #1




It’s starting.

As promised, President Obama is using executive actions to impose gun control on the nation, targeting the top-selling rifle in the country, the AR-15 style semi-automatic, with a ban on one of the most-used AR bullets by sportsmen and target shooters.

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives this month revealed that it is proposing to put the ban on 5.56 mm ammo on a fast track, immediately driving up the price of the bullets and prompting retailers, including the huge outdoors company Cabela’s, to urge sportsmen to urge Congress to stop the president.


Wednesday night, Rep. Bob Goodlatte, the Republican chairman of the House Judiciary Committee, stepped in with a critical letter to the bureau demanding it explain the surprise and abrupt bullet ban. The letter is shown below.

The National Rifle Association, which is working with Goodlatte to gather co-signers, told Secrets that 30 House members have already co-signed the letter and Goodlatte and the NRA are hoping to get a total of 100 fast.

"The Obama administration was unable to ban America's most popular sporting rifle through the legislative process, so now it's trying to ban commonly owned and used ammunition through regulation," said Chris W. Cox, executive director of the NRA-ILA, the group's policy and lobby shop. "The NRA and our tens of millions of supporters across the country will fight to stop President Obama's latest attack on our Second Amendment freedoms."

At issue is so-called “armor-piercing” ammunition, an exemption for those bullets mostly used for sport by AR-15 owners, and the recent popularity of pistol-style ARs that use the ammo.

The inexpensive 5.56 M885 ammo, commonly called green tips, have been exempt for years, as have higher-caliber ammunition that also easily pierces the type of soft armor worn by police, because it’s mostly used by target shooters, not criminals. The agency proposes to reclassify it as armor-piercing and not exempt.

RELATED: Colorado politician who survived Columbine wants concealed carry in schools

But now BATFE says that since the bullets can be used in semi-automatic handguns they pose a threat to police and must be banned from production, sale and use. But, as Goodlatte noted, the agency offered no proof. Federal agencies will still be allowed to buy the ammo.

“This round is amongst the most commonly used in the most popular rifle design in America, the AR-15. Millions upon millions of M855 rounds have been sold and used in the U.S., yet ATF has not even alleged — much less offered evidence — that even one such round has ever been fired from a handgun at a police officer,” said Goodlatte’s letter.

Even some police don’t buy the administration’s claim. “Criminals aren't going to go out and buy a $1,000 AR pistol,” Brent Ball, owner of 417 Guns in Springfield, Mo., and a 17-year veteran police officer told the Springfield News-Leader. “As a police officer I'm not worried about AR pistols because you can see them. It's the small gun in a guy's hand you can't see that kills you.”

Many see the bullet ban as an assault on the AR-15 and Obama’s back-door bid to end production and sale.

“We are concerned,” said Justin Anderson with Hyatt Gun Shop in Charlotte, N.C., one of the nation’s top sellers of AR-15 style rifles. “Frankly, we're always concerned when the government uses back-door methods to impose quasi-gun control.”

Groups like the National Shooting Sports Foundation suggest that under BATFE’s new rule, other calibers like popular deer hunting .308 bullets could be banned because they also are used in AR-15s, some of which can be turned into pistol-style guns. “This will have a detrimental effect on hunting nationwide,” said the group.


http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/article/2560750


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February 26, 2015, 08:46:18 PM
 #2

First they wanted to ban large mags now this and just as back then it will just make people stock up on it. and pump up the prices.
“As a police officer I'm not worried about AR pistols because you can see them. It's the small gun in a guy's hand you can't see that kills you.” - So true.


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February 26, 2015, 11:16:53 PM
 #3

First they wanted to ban large mags now this and just as back then it will just make people stock up on it. and pump up the prices.
“As a police officer I'm not worried about AR pistols because you can see them. It's the small gun in a guy's hand you can't see that kills you.” - So true.
Some of the most peaceful countries are in europe and they don't let you have any guns.
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February 26, 2015, 11:26:21 PM
 #4

First they wanted to ban large mags now this and just as back then it will just make people stock up on it. and pump up the prices.
“As a police officer I'm not worried about AR pistols because you can see them. It's the small gun in a guy's hand you can't see that kills you.” - So true.
Some of the most peaceful countries are in europe and they don't let you have any guns.
UK has 8 times higher violent crime rate than us, and thats completely gun free:
https://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/2013/09/11/uk-violent-crime-rate-eight-times-higher-than-the-us/

Wilikon (OP)
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February 26, 2015, 11:26:48 PM
 #5

First they wanted to ban large mags now this and just as back then it will just make people stock up on it. and pump up the prices.
“As a police officer I'm not worried about AR pistols because you can see them. It's the small gun in a guy's hand you can't see that kills you.” - So true.
Some of the most peaceful countries are in europe and they don't let you have any guns.


Europe has always been peaceful, even before the invention of the gun... Love and peace, gun free for thousand of years. Not so much after the invention of the USA though...

 Cool



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February 26, 2015, 11:28:05 PM
 #6

Not all cops are good but they almost all have guns.
bitgeek
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February 27, 2015, 01:04:10 AM
 #7

Some of the most peaceful countries are in europe and they don't let you have any guns.

I live in one of those countries and imagine that today they found a 17 yo girl stabbed in the heart. She was cycling through a park at night and was attacked.
Some other cases? Few years ago some guy was killed with a machete in broad daylight on the street. I personally know a guy that was stabbed in the neck and barely survived and another guy, who was stabbed in the leg, also in the middle of the day on the street (they wanted to rob him but he refused to give them anything so they left a knife in his thigh). Things like sabres, swords, throwing knives are all available in stores and every teenager can have one. FYI if you get attacked on the street by someone proficient with a knife you have no chance if you don't have something better with you.

Oh, and if you want to get a gun to kill somebody you still can, just like Breivik in Norway or this teenager in Germany http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winnenden_school_shooting


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TheButterZone
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February 27, 2015, 01:41:53 AM
 #8

First they wanted to ban large mags now this and just as back then it will just make people stock up on it. and pump up the prices.
“As a police officer I'm not worried about AR pistols because you can see them. It's the small gun in a guy's hand you can't see that kills you.” - So true.
Some of the most peaceful countries are in europe and they don't let you have any guns.

Peaceful for the demociders, sure. https://www.hawaii.edu/powerkills/20TH.HTM

Saying that you don't trust someone because of their behavior is completely valid.
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February 27, 2015, 05:17:46 AM
 #9

First they wanted to ban large mags now this and just as back then it will just make people stock up on it. and pump up the prices.
“As a police officer I'm not worried about AR pistols because you can see them. It's the small gun in a guy's hand you can't see that kills you.” - So true.
Some of the most peaceful countries are in europe and they don't let you have any guns.
UK has 8 times higher violent crime rate than us, and thats completely gun free:
https://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/2013/09/11/uk-violent-crime-rate-eight-times-higher-than-the-us/


The comparison he makes makes no sense. The way it's measured in both countries is different. Violent crime includes a lot more offenses in the UK. And the rate of homicides is higher in America. As you would expect from people using guns instead of knives.

@TheButterZone that's a very black and white view. You really think having a few guns will prevent a government from killing you? Even if they don't immediately they will criminalize your life. And get others to come for you or isolate you from society. Best bet is to change the government before it gets to using guns.
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February 27, 2015, 05:25:53 AM
 #10

First they wanted to ban large mags now this and just as back then it will just make people stock up on it. and pump up the prices.
“As a police officer I'm not worried about AR pistols because you can see them. It's the small gun in a guy's hand you can't see that kills you.” - So true.
Some of the most peaceful countries are in europe and they don't let you have any guns.


Europe has always been peaceful, even before the invention of the gun... Love and peace, gun free for thousand of years. Not so much after the invention of the USA though...

 Cool





ahahaha, now I know you lied... peacefull = you can do what you want? I prefer the Gun laws of the West... be carefull, be honest, trust in God, and maybe you will live... ahah aha.

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February 27, 2015, 05:38:10 AM
 #11

@TheButterZone that's a very black and white view. You really think having a few guns will prevent a government from killing you? Even if they don't immediately they will criminalize your life. And get others to come for you or isolate you from society. Best bet is to change the government before it gets to using guns.

The main prerequisite for democide in Europe was to disarm the people that were intended to be democided. Fuck "the world is gray and morals are relative" sociopathic bullshit.

Do I think a gun can stop a nuclear weapon, et al? No, but mutineers with guns refusing to commit democide can shoot the evil bastards who are willing to "just follow orders". And they must, with an event that could mean the extinction of the human race, on the line.

Saying that you don't trust someone because of their behavior is completely valid.
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February 27, 2015, 06:15:52 AM
 #12

@TheButterZone that's a very black and white view. You really think having a few guns will prevent a government from killing you? Even if they don't immediately they will criminalize your life. And get others to come for you or isolate you from society. Best bet is to change the government before it gets to using guns.

The main prerequisite for democide in Europe was to disarm the people that were intended to be democided. Fuck "the world is gray and morals are relative" sociopathic bullshit.

Do I think a gun can stop a nuclear weapon, et al? No, but mutineers with guns refusing to commit democide can shoot the evil bastards who are willing to "just follow orders". And they must, with an event that could mean the extinction of the human race, on the line.

exactly. it's the job of the SA. when a SS or WM handlers was going nuts, to the camp like the others mof or S.E. if the crime requires it, at the judgment of the officer of the SA in charge.

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February 27, 2015, 10:20:50 PM
 #13

First they wanted to ban large mags now this and just as back then it will just make people stock up on it. and pump up the prices.
“As a police officer I'm not worried about AR pistols because you can see them. It's the small gun in a guy's hand you can't see that kills you.” - So true.

What's going on here is that there are different levels of bulletproof vests.  Lightweight ones, such as cops wear, will stop pistol bullets but not rifle bullets.  They will not, however, stop specialized "cop killer" bullets that exist for some pistols.  That is exotic stuff, think James Bond and such.

Now some "pistols" get made that fire the 223 cartridge, which is a rifle cartridge.  The argument is somehow that now that the round is fired from a pistol, it is a "cop killer."

This is crazy talk and legaleze.  These pistols are not really even good for anything, they remind me of 50 cal desert eagle and the 50 cal Glock conversions.  Sort of bragging rights but not practical, either for self defense or anything else.

I can't see standing an shooting an 800 pound charging wild pig with one of these, as one example.

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February 27, 2015, 10:23:15 PM
 #14

I have no idea why they are banning the "bigger" guns and their bullets. Concealed weapons are much more deadly then weapons that cannot be hidden.

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February 28, 2015, 05:34:09 PM
 #15

First they wanted to ban large mags now this and just as back then it will just make people stock up on it. and pump up the prices.
“As a police officer I'm not worried about AR pistols because you can see them. It's the small gun in a guy's hand you can't see that kills you.” - So true.

What's going on here is that there are different levels of bulletproof vests.  Lightweight ones, such as cops wear, will stop pistol bullets but not rifle bullets.  They will not, however, stop specialized "cop killer" bullets that exist for some pistols.  That is exotic stuff, think James Bond and such.

Now some "pistols" get made that fire the 223 cartridge, which is a rifle cartridge.  The argument is somehow that now that the round is fired from a pistol, it is a "cop killer."

This is crazy talk and legaleze.  These pistols are not really even good for anything, they remind me of 50 cal desert eagle and the 50 cal Glock conversions.  Sort of bragging rights but not practical, either for self defense or anything else.

I can't see standing an shooting an 800 pound charging wild pig with one of these, as one example.

I agree 100%
The real vest penetrators like FN Five-seven have been around for years. They are known to penetrate IIIA armor that is made to stop 44 magnum rounds.
Not even a steel plate can protect you https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rEnqjSqqXIs unless it's a full level III armor plate.


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March 02, 2015, 10:02:44 AM
 #16

First they wanted to ban large mags now this and just as back then it will just make people stock up on it. and pump up the prices.
“As a police officer I'm not worried about AR pistols because you can see them. It's the small gun in a guy's hand you can't see that kills you.” - So true.
Some of the most peaceful countries are in europe and they don't let you have any guns.
Almost everyone in CH owns a gun.

http://www.reddit.com/r/pics/comments/jfl5p/this_is_apparently_normal_in_switzerland/

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March 02, 2015, 02:07:31 PM
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This is a trick and trap. Many people will believe Obama has the right to control their lives in this way. Rather, it is the other way around. The only possible way that he might have this authority is in the case of a national emergency. But, if that emergency is terrorism, the opposite of this executive action should take place. People should be armed to the hilt, just to protect themselves from the terrorists.

As men and women, we have power over government, through the courts, if we only take the time to learn how easy it is to use the courts. Arms and ammo are our property. If we make the arms and ammo from scratch, they are our property that we made from other of our property.

We have the right to contract. If we contract with someone, so that we are not making an offer to the public, then we can trade our property - arms and ammo that we have made - for their property - their labor in the form of money.

It's about time that we stop making public offers for some of the things that we sell to people. Rather, let's make proper agreements in the form of contracts with others, so that our offer is a private offer. If we do this, we come out from under virtually all the rules and regulations of government.

If you weren't selling the marijuana, if you were only using it, and if they take it from you, require and demand in court that the man or woman you have harmed by your action of smoking pot get on the stand and show how your actions harmed him/her. If nobody comes forward, require your property back. Do this even for the property of your body if they have taken you and thrown you in jail. Then sue the pants off them (their bond), individually and personally, for even touching you, a man or woman.

You will win if you do it right, so study now, while you have time. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HOkAHRzuiOA&list=PLHrkQxgz0mg6kUBciD-HIvTXByqjcIZ-D

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March 04, 2015, 06:58:10 PM
 #18

Police say Obama bullet ban isn't needed, AR-15 round isn't a threat

Quote
A top police representative on Tuesday said that there is no history of criminals using a round popular among AR-15 rifle shooters against officers, undermining the Obama administration's argument for banning the 5.56 M855 "lightgreen tip."

"Any ammunition is of concern to police in the wrong hands, but this specific round has historically not posed a law enforcement problem," said James Pasco, executive director of the Washington office of the Fraternal Order of Police, the world's largest organization of sworn law enforcement officers, with more than 325,000 members.

He told Secrets that the round used mostly for target practice "is not typically used against law enforcement."

While he said that he is "not finding fault" with the surprise move last month by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives to classify the round as "armor piercing" and then ban it, Pasco added, "While this round will penetrate soft body armor, it has not historically posed a threat to law enforcement."

More...http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/police-say-obama-bullet-ban-isnt-needed-ar-15-round-isnt-a-threat/article/2560964

The only thing I can see going on here is that sales of this type of ammo are gonna go through the roof. Not to mention, lots of money flowing into pro-gun groups.
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March 04, 2015, 07:01:39 PM
 #19

Not gona happen. I know dozens of shooters with brass, dies, etc. Not gona happen.

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March 04, 2015, 07:38:17 PM
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The only thing I can see going on here is that sales of this type of ammo are gonna go through the roof. Not to mention, lots of money flowing into pro-gun groups.

That's what I said earlier in the thread and thats exactly what happened when they tried to limit clip sizes, because according to them only terrorists need the big ones.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UN4hX4ODBDA

Years ago they even had plans to raid people's homes, because if you're stocking up on guns and ammo you're probably planning a terrorist attack. This caused a small panic among gun collectors and enthusiasts in the US some time ago.


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