Bitcoin Forum

use more than two exchanges and turn your bitcoin in monero or another cryptonight coin that is less known, it should be enough to hide your transactions

The bitmixer might be the right option for you but if you don't want to the third party involvement, check out Xapo.

I am wondering whether it is possible to make Bitcoin transactions untraceable or not? As long as I know, Altcoins like Monero, BitcoinDark or Dash are using different concepts in order to make transactions untraceable. Is it also possible for Bitcoin by using some extra tools?

Did i get something wrong? i thought Xapo is a third-party wallet provider, too.

use more than two exchanges and turn your bitcoin in monero or another cryptonight coin that is less known, it should be enough to hide your transactions

or another simple thing is earning bitcoin through anon stuff like,  signature campaign, mining or faucets

If you are interested in a high level of anonymity for your existing coins, you may transfer them through several hot wallets of high volume. It could be exchanges, gambling sites, public mixers, etc. and using a chain of proxies to get a less traceable Internet connection.

Yes, this in an option. But every transfer through a hot wallet what you not control is a risk for your coins.

You should use a mixing service to mix your coins. Never use a service with logs though.

People keep talking about mixing services, but what about just using a casino? They generally move all funds to a central address, and then you can cash out. I'm pretty sure that should be enough obfuscation.

Casino will likely keep your transaction logs for a long period of time.
It is not a problem if you are trying to hide your coin source from your wife, but it could be a problem if you are trying to hide it from the government agency.

You need to use these:
1-mixer services
2-dice, bet and casino (gambling) sites
3-untrackable altcoins (xmr, dash etc.)

It's not that hard to hide your money.

apparently anonymity is critical to protect free people, but then there is no recourse for victims of theft and cybercrime?

You could try blockchain.info's "Shared Coin" (open source, based on CoinJoin) if you don't want to trust a third party.

It won't remove the link between your inputs and outputs completely. Instead, it groups multiple persons' inputs and outputs together and makes it very hard to trace the individual transaction.

use more than two exchanges and turn your bitcoin in monero or another cryptonight coin that is less known, it should be enough to hide your transactions

or another simple thing is earning bitcoin through anon stuff like,  signature campaign, mining or faucets

Stealth payments can also be used for making your transactions less traceable.

Reference links:

 • http://sourceforge.net/p/bitcoin/mailman/message/31813471/
 • http://sx.dyne.org/stealth.html
 • Stealth transaction: https://www.blocktrail.com/BTC/tx/6ea5c6f1a97f382f87523d13ef9f2ef17b828607107efdbba42a80b8a6555356

First put your BTC in a gambling for 1.01 odd. Next withdraw your earning to an altcoin exchange and buy Monero/Darkcoin. Then withdraw your altcoin to another exchange and sell. At last withdraw BTC to your newly created address.

A combination of a mixer and a gambling site would be enough for making your coins completely untraceable as well. And you really don't have to make a bet on a casino site to withdraw.

First put your BTC in a gambling for 1.01 odd. Next withdraw your earning to an altcoin exchange and buy Monero/Darkcoin. Then withdraw your altcoin to another exchange and sell. At last withdraw BTC to your newly created address.

I understand that some people would like to make their coins less traceable. There is no disadvantage in that.

The reason is the following (because someone else also asked me via pm). A friend of mine was using Bitcoin for some hosting stuff mainly. He bought some coins and spend them. What he did not know was, that a part of the bought coins was involved into a theft before. A couple of weeks later the police knocked on its door and asked him some questions. It was quickly clear that has nothing to do with the theft. But it was a strange situation. To prevent such happenings, I would like to make the coin origin invisible ;) By the way, the police got his address from the webhosting company where he paid its hosting plan with Bitcoin.

Xapo also claims to mix or scramble payment received so no one can track your balance if they've used a payment address in the past.

The bitmixer might be the right option for you but if you don't want to the third party involvement, check out Xapo.

The best way to make bit coin transactions untraceable and completely anonymous is to use bit mixer a few times after it you transactions will surely be untraceable as no one will know real bitcoin addressess

There have been studies done with mixers that show even after using multiple of them, there are still tracks that can be followed. While they definitely help obfuscate things, they aren't the ultimate solution.

oh that's good to know then and how about depositing to sports books for example then widrawing to a mixer and so on after doing these combinations it would be harder to trace it yes?

There have been studies done with mixers that show even after using multiple of them, there are still tracks that can be followed. While they definitely help obfuscate things, they aren't the ultimate solution.

References please. Anyone using a mixing service can use the blockchain.info taint analysis tool to determine if there is any correlation between coins submitted to the service and coins received. A proper mixing service will return bitcoins with zero percent taint. No taint means that the coins you received back from the mixer cannot be correlated to the coins you sent. Everyone knows that mixing services are popular with darknet drug vendors so the coins you get back from the mixer might be traced back to one of the darknet markets. That would be a separate concern.

Will this work for you? (http://css.csail.mit.edu/6.858/2013/projects/jeffchan-exue-tanyaliu.pdf) There's been evaluations outside of MIT, as well, showing similar situations.

Thanks for the link, much appreciated.

I would never trust Xapo

Xapo Adds Former Visa and Citibank Execs to Board of Advisors (http://www.coindesk.com/xapo-adds-visa-and-citibank-execs-to-board-of-advisors/)


Read all of this post, and you may get the gist of what I mean.

Stealth addresses are addresses which you publish and then somebody can use that "address" as a seed to create a new bitcoin address and a nonce. And if you give the owner of the stealth address the nonce, they can use it to get the private key for the bitcoin address. The idea is that by publishing a stealth address, somebody can now send you payments, but since no real bitcoin address was published, nobody aside from you and the person who pays you knows that you got paid, whereas if you had published a real address, people could just watch that address on the blockchain and know you got paid. So instead you publish this stealth address and then your client just scans ALL transactions that have an OP_RETURN output and attempts to decode it, and if it's able to decode it, it knows that it's a payment to its own stealth address and it can use the OP_RETURN data to derive the private key.

I always thought bitcoin was about being ANON but looking at the posts in this section no one give a damn whether they are spied on or not.

I am wondering whether it is possible to make Bitcoin transactions untraceable or not? As long as I know, Altcoins like Monero, BitcoinDark or Dash are using different concepts in order to make transactions untraceable. Is it also possible for Bitcoin by using some extra tools?

I am wondering whether it is possible to make Bitcoin transactions untraceable or not? As long as I know, Altcoins like Monero, BitcoinDark or Dash are using different concepts in order to make transactions untraceable. Is it also possible for Bitcoin by using some extra tools?

You have to use a mixer like bit mixer.io. But you have to mix many time your amount in way to keep safe that your transaction is untraceable. Anyway, consider that mixer takes some fee (Bitmixer.io charge 0.5% if I'm not wrong).

Even using mixers, it's entirely possible to track transactions. Essentially, you're paying money to make things slightly harder, while still not resolving the anonymity issue.

Also in my many month's on this forum sadly you will see mixers that just stop working.   People send money to them, and get nothing out.  Either scam or a site that no longer does the service.

Even if it works I don't think it's worth it.   I think it provides a false sense of security.  I personally have never used one and don't intend to.

This is also a valid concern. Not to mention they need a lot of liquidity to work in the first place (otherwise they accomplish nothing). I'd think sending them to an anonymous casino would accomplish almost the same thing, without the risk (anonymous being those that don't require you to make an account).

The blockchain only shows addresses, Having multiple addresses is a good idea, and by using a "mixer" you can send BTC from one address to another without anyone else even knowing you own both addresses.

I am wondering whether it is possible to make Bitcoin transactions untraceable or not? As long as I know, Altcoins like Monero, BitcoinDark or Dash are using different concepts in order to make transactions untraceable. Is it also possible for Bitcoin by using some extra tools?

You can constantly change your addresses manually to help stay "more" anonymous but it's never perfect.

xmr.to allows you to pay anyone that accepts btc completely anonymously by using monero

you have to take some pretty technical steps involving mixers and possibly other crypto currencies to make your Btcs close to anonymous.

Few things you can do to make it harder to trace. You can mix your coins around like using the services of bitmixer. You can also transfer to exchangers and exchange it to other altcoins and then exchange back to btc. It all depends in how you do it.

Mixer are best ways to do so...

Mixer are best ways to do so...

you should make your bitcoin anonymous from the start. which means you should buy it with cash from someone and place it in a new address.
this way it will have no links to you, because buying from any sort of exchange or using credit card would link it to you.

you should make your bitcoin anonymous from the start. which means you should buy it with cash from someone and place it in a new address.
this way it will have no links to you, because buying from any sort of exchange or using credit card would link it to you.

I think this would be a good idea, if a large majority of people had bitcoin and you could find people to sell/buy anywhere in the world... but where I live, there is hardly no one that carries bitcoin or would want to sell them.  I've check on localbitcoins website a good amount of times, and still have trouble finding someone in my area that's worth the drive.

Also, it would be nice to have bitcoinATM's to be able to buy with cash... but again, there are none where I live...

I think this would be a good idea, if a large majority of people had bitcoin and you could find people to sell/buy anywhere in the world... but where I live, there is hardly no one that carries bitcoin or would want to sell them.  I've check on localbitcoins website a good amount of times, and still have trouble finding someone in my area that's worth the drive.

Also, it would be nice to have bitcoinATM's to be able to buy with cash... but again, there are none where I live...

If you use it at some point, you've now created a link between you and the coins. So you still aren't anonymous.

- Just send it to a exchange and trade it for Doge.
- Move the Doge to a other exchange.
- Trade the Doge back for BTC
- Send the BTC to a new wallet.

Simply as that.  ;D

if you send for example 2.68btc worth of doge to various exchanges, and then withdraw the amount in btc 2.68btc directly to your wallet it still might be tracable as people can simply search for 2.68btc transactions. best is to wait a few days and withdraw it in 3 steps.

May have been already posted but there is a difference between having untraceable transactions and having untraceable bitcoins.

Completely untraceable transactions are not possible as far as I know.  You can try but anything that is close requires third-parties (mixers, exchangers, off-blockchain transactions) which creates a traceable papertrail, no matter what the third party says. 

Completely untraceable addresses are only possible if you mine a block, then you get 25 untraceable bitcoins because they are brand new.  Somewhat untraceable bitcoins can be had by earning them online, selling stuff for them in person or using local bitcoins to buy them using cash without ID.

Some governments may prohibit so you should check, if you care.

i didnt try making my bitcoin transactions untraceable yet though i am pretty sure that i would mix my coins with bitmixer a few times though i still dont know if it would be completely untraceable

Bitcoin needs more anonymity features, coin mixers are cool but not enough. You still have to trust the mixer owner, it's not decentralized.

Poloniex is a good way to mix your BTC

I dont know i think Bitcoin is already anonymous isn't it?

Try mixing the bitcoins through some bitcoin mixer, or if you want a cheaper alternative deposit it to a trusted gambling site, and then withdraw again. Its highly probable that your withdrawal will come from a different address than you deposited on, or if you would like to be double sure, repeat the deposit and withdraw for 5-10 times.

This is not a 'safe' way to mix your coins. Gambling sites keep records of their customers (IP address, deposit address, withdrawal request) and some of the gambling sites have a fee on deposits to prevent using gambling site as a mixer.

I heard many mixer services will make our transactions untraceable by using different bitcoin addresses. very much useful services.

I usually 'hide' my transactions by sending my coins to a trusted exchange and withdraw to a completely new address. Though it does not make it completely untraceable, still there is an added layer of confusion as to where the coins went after that certain transaction.

yeah sure, but the owner know your movements anyway, so they are not really that untraceable, unless only you know about it

i was thinking that someone should run his own mixer, if he want to stay more anon

That's great idea, even gambling sites keep records. They won't able track you far because you never give your identity.
But, they still keep record of every withdrawal request, so you must really trust that gambling sites.

Or you could use something even better, use many gambling sites for it.
Say deposit 1 btc in PD, withdraw 0.5 btc to an alt account(through deposit address not tip function) and 0.5 to another alt account, for even more privacy, do it using three browsers each with a different location VPN. Now withdraw that 0.5 btc to safedice on two alts and repeat the same thing again, then do it on PRC , then lastly on satoshidice. All of which I think are trusted enough for 1btc

I heard many mixer services will make our transactions untraceable by using different bitcoin addresses. very much useful services.

mixers are a good and fast way to become untraceable but the way that i found out to be working better than mixers is to exchange the coins to another altcoin.

for example you can do this on shapeshift, and buy an altcoin, then move those to an exchanger and buy bitcoin with it and move it to your final wallet.
in this way you only lose some money on trade fees and transaction fees but it would be more effective.

but for the rest of us the mixers is more than enough :D

Mixers. Do. Not. Work. (http://css.csail.mit.edu/6.858/2013/projects/jeffchan-exue-tanyaliu.pdf)

Mixers. Do. Not. Work. (http://css.csail.mit.edu/6.858/2013/projects/jeffchan-exue-tanyaliu.pdf)

I am wondering whether it is possible to make Bitcoin transactions untraceable or not? As long as I know, Altcoins like Monero, BitcoinDark or Dash are using different concepts in order to make transactions untraceable. Is it also possible for Bitcoin by using some extra tools?

Well, obviously by my signature I'm biased... but cryptonotes are the only way to go if you want to become "untraceable" in your transactions.

look at my signature :)
you can use Bitmixer service if you want to make untraceable transaction, or you can use xapo
all people can't trace your transaction, but only xapo can trace your transacation ( i think xapo is profesional, he will never share his database)

Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't those altcoins, or at least function like them? Because if so, that isn't a solution -- that's like saying "you can send Bitcoin anonymously. Just convert Bitcoin to cash and pay the person in cash!"

If there is a database someone could give up I don't consider that a untraceable option.  If you want untraceable you should not have logs.  There have been many places that people thought would not share but if right 3 letter agency shows up a lot of things change.

I still think mining a new coin, and sending to a new address is the best cheapest way.  You can run through proxy or VPN with no logs.  And mine to it if done properly no one should know who it is just see coins in a address.

I don't see point of bringing in mixers or other services when you can do it all yourself.  And trust yourself 100 percent.

If there is a database someone could give up I don't consider that a untraceable option.  If you want untraceable you should not have logs.  There have been many places that people thought would not share but if right 3 letter agency shows up a lot of things change.

I still think mining a new coin, and sending to a new address is the best cheapest way.  You can run through proxy or VPN with no logs.  And mine to it if done properly no one should know who it is just see coins in a address.

I don't see point of bringing in mixers or other services when you can do it all yourself.  And trust yourself 100 percent.

Yeah, but why go through all the hassle of doing that though when there is a currency that does it for you every time you send coins to someone?  It's essentially a mixer that hides your address and the amount you send.  I just personally think if you would want to go about making anonymous transactions.. bitcoin is not really the right way to go.  Bitcoin is good for other purposes as of right now (purchasing power, most desirable coin, etc. etc.), but the way I see it.. people will start realizing there are in fact, better alternatives.

I'm not predicting any downfall of Bitcoin either, I'm just saying that there is a very good chance of bitcoin finally having it's "trifecta".  Bitcoin, Litecoin, Monero... they all serve a specific purpose, the choice is yours to how you want to use your money wisely and securely.

Yeah, but why go through all the hassle of doing that though when there is a currency that does it for you every time you send coins to someone?  It's essentially a mixer that hides your address and the amount you send.  I just personally think if you would want to go about making anonymous transactions.. bitcoin is not really the right way to go.  Bitcoin is good for other purposes as of right now (purchasing power, most desirable coin, etc. etc.), but the way I see it.. people will start realizing there are in fact, better alternatives.

I'm not predicting any downfall of Bitcoin either, I'm just saying that there is a very good chance of bitcoin finally having it's "trifecta".  Bitcoin, Litecoin, Monero... they all serve a specific purpose, the choice is yours to how you want to use your money wisely and securely.

The question I don't get is why do it at all.  I am doing nothing illegal, so I feel safe.  I don't care if exchange knows one of my address's.  It honestly does not hurt me.

If trying to make untraceable I just trust myself more then anyone else.  Weather it be currency or a service like a mixer.  With altcoin you can lose value or gain, highy depends if you are holding it.  BTC recently had a nice jump up.  So by holding in BTC I feel more safe value wise.

And if I wanted to be untraceable. I would mine through a known proxy or vpn that does not keep logs.  Some pools you can mine straight to address no signing up.  So you can do it all yourself.  

So why count on others to do it when you can do it all yourself?  I personally would feel better doing it myself then someone else doing it or even holding alt currency,

*made smaller quote was getting huge.

Well the question becomes, why are you mixing your coins if you don't want to remain somewhat private in how you are handling your Bitcoins?  Did you just commit a crime?  The answer I hope would be, of course not, but then again none of this should matter to anyone.

Monero proposes an idea of issuing a currency that can be completely anonymous if the person wants to be, and also be completely transparent if need be as well.  You can provide view and amount keys to auditors if you run a business accepting monero, that's the beauty of what they are trying to do.  Bitcoin was meant to be digital "cash", and it has failed to be that... you can easily trace any transactions to anyone, when it should be none of that person's business.

Don't get me wrong... I completely understand what you're saying about holding bitcoin for potential increase in value.  But I hold a little XMR on the side as well, because I believe in what it is trying to accomplish.

Edit: you should probably see "why privacy matters" too... it doesn't mean that you only have to be private if you are committing a crime, so to speak. Your business should be your business... end of story.

You found my fear of reason of people using mixers or other way's to seem more untraceable.  Are they just worried about holdings, and don't want amount they have to be known?  Or are they doing something they should not be?   Illegal I believe takes away from bitcoin value and makes bitcoin look bad.  But this is really for another thread as this is not why are people doing it but how.

Holding a lot of alt currency  you can lose value or miss BTC going up in value.   I don't consider an alt coin a true option.  I think you need to stay in BTC after all the thread is "Bitcoin transactions untraceable?" not how can I use alt coins.

I suggested mining where you do not count on others.  It loses a lot of relying on other people problems.

Dude it is impossible to make the transactions intraceable....  :-\

No, Monero is truly a whole different beast... Cryptonote technology is the new upcoming technology for sure IMO, but that's just me.  If you'd like to read more, look at my links and look up the whitepaper for XMR...

But essentially Dash or dark and other scam coins that pose they are "the true anonymous coin" are mistaken... the Devs that are currently working "under the hood" for the new GUI that's about to come out are well known in the crypto world and are proposing that everything will be set up and running by spring or summer of next year.  Basically what monero does is have a private key, a view key, and now with the new addition to xmr, a "ring CT" which will make up an "amount key".

So, XMR not only hides where the coins are coming from, but now hides how much coins are being transacted to one another.
https://github.com/ShenNoether/MiniNero/blob/master/RingCT0.1_copy.pdf

If you'd like to get technical, you can read that... but the terminology in that paper is way over my head.  I just know the ELI5 version of everything going on right now.

it's very possible you can read all post above
you can choose 1 way of all tips to make untraceable transaction

It might be described at hard to trace.  I mean I think a lot that think they are untraceable if a government threw enough money and time twords finding them they could.   I mean if someone is watching it's pretty easy to follow the chain once it starts being sent.

There are a few way's like my favorite of anonymous mining that might make you untraceable on storage.  When you go to use it you lose some of that being untraceable.

And again I hope people are doing this as they don't want others online to see their holdings, or other legal reasons. 

The big issue with that is that like you said, as soon as you use it, you become traceable. Use eventually leads to personal identity -- whether you're using it for web hosting, to buy something, pay bills, etc. you create a trail at some point. Bitcoin was never made to be anonymous; it was made to be decentralized.

Not always true, What about using fake ID, Most places you can get away with using fake scan's.

Bitcoin can be as anonymous as you want if you know how to make yourself anonymous..

Not only that. Know how to leave "fake" footprints.. Everyone knows about IP's and VPN's but how many people know to spoof there browser user agent Disable IPV6 to stop DNS leaks, Remove WEBRTC from there browser. Spoof there network card or wireless card MAC address. Any fool can download tor and "think" that's them covered. This is not the case.

There are many ways to make BTC anonymous when you use them, Its the effort you are willing to put in that will determinate how "anonymous" your coins end up..

I heard many mixer services will make our transactions untraceable by using different bitcoin addresses. very much useful services.

The big issue with that is that like you said, as soon as you use it, you become traceable. Use eventually leads to personal identity -- whether you're using it for web hosting, to buy something, pay bills, etc. you create a trail at some point. Bitcoin was never made to be anonymous; it was made to be decentralized.

Mixers are centralized third parties. This is not a trustless solution

You can use different mixers and gambling sites to lower the probability of it getting linked together. You could potentially send it to a trustable mixer which delete logs but still it may be possible that they are keeping them.You can also exchange the Bitcoin to Monero using exchange A and send the monero to exchange B to withdraw. Many exchanges do not require verification.

Sounds like a lot of work and on mixer your trusting someone else you have no idea who it is. I still think mining sounds like easiest way.

Mine through a proxy or vpn you know does not keep log and mine directly to bitcoin address you want.  It's a new coin so no real history but from pool sending it.

Again, those providers may just be making a false promise and not actually deleting the logs or worst, giving them to the government. Unless you have any miners that is efficient, it probably won't work and the risk is huge. Renting rigs wouldn't help either, they typically sell their hashpower at more than what you can earn.

Again, those providers may just be making a false promise and not actually deleting the logs or worst, giving them to the government. Unless you have any miners that is efficient, it probably won't work and the risk is huge. Renting rigs wouldn't help either, they typically sell their hashpower at more than what you can earn.

I am kinda a pessimist on some things.  I look at it as chances are a mixer has some records.  They need to know what comes in and what goes out ... or how do they know they are making a profit? 

They have wallets somehow connnected to the site.  Can you imagine having a decent hot wallet running a mixer and not logging IP's or other info?  I mean what if they are hacked they need info on where coins are sent... and more info.  I think they as a business have some logs in most cases.   

the first thing is to not reuse addresses. rather, generate a new address every time

Well with a lot (if not all) wallets that you use, the wallet generates a new address each time you receive bitcoins to the previous address... so that's already implemented.

I'm not aware of any that do that. Can you name some? Xapo, Circle, Coinbase, Blockchain.info, MultiBit, Bitcoin QT, Electrum, (I know I'm missing a lot here) definitely don't.

Well I personally use breadwallet for iOS... I know for a fact this wallet does, but have used blocktrail in the past as well that did it... I have just assumed that all wallets changed the wallet address after each transaction had been received?

That's definitely the exception, rather than the norm. Some, like Coinbase, will make a new one when you send a transaction, but not when you receive one.

Well in that case, if you use Android, I would suggest you look into getting blocktrail (I think blocktrail is supported by Android)... Regardless, this thread does seem to go off tangent very quickly haha.

But blocktrail seems to be a very secure wallet, while offering that service.  I just prefer bread because it connects directly to the blockchain network.

I dident think that you can make them untraceable.

I think it's actually on topic. Different addresses for each received transaction is a huge thing. Is Bread the one that does dynamic fees, too?

No, I don't believe it takes out any fees at all... just takes out the $.07 or so in miners fees.  But changing the public address isn't really that big of a deal in terms of keeping your transactions untraceable, IMO... all of the previous transactions before can be linked by following where each transaction goes too.

But for example when using a wallet that mixes coins automatically when sending coins out, now that would help out a lot in keeping everything untraceable... I would input the "M" word here now, but I'm going to keep things on topic.  :)

No, I don't believe it takes out any fees at all... just takes out the $.07 or so in miners fees.  But changing the public address isn't really that big of a deal in terms of keeping your transactions untraceable, IMO... all of the previous transactions before can be linked by following where each transaction goes too.

But for example when using a wallet that mixes coins automatically when sending coins out, now that would help out a lot in keeping everything untraceable... I would input the "M" word here now, but I'm going to keep things on topic.  :)

By fees I meant the dynamic miner's fees. Like instead of always being 0.0001 BTC, it will choose whatever is the lowest that will get it confirmed (usually less). I forgot what wallet does that.

You should use a mixing service to mix your coins. Never use a service with logs though.

electrum will automatically calculate the minimum required fees for the tx to get included in the next block. But many ppl are using different wallets or online one. They couldn't do the calculation. So We have to calulate ourself based on cointape.com. Easy and quick!

Whoa, never even heard of cointape! That's awesome. And I didn't realize Electrum did it, either. Thanks for the heads-up on both!

Trade bitcoin for altcoins on one exchange. Move altcoins to another exchange.and trade for BTC. Move to a wallet you control. Use Tor when you do this.

If you're going to do that, might as well say "trade BTC for cash and then use the cash to buy BTC." This has nothing to do with making it untraceable. Converting from one to another isn't making it anonymous, it's using alternate forms of money. Two very different things.

I may be wrong but it is traceable in most alt coins but how about anonymous coins like monero? Wouldn't this reduce the risk? The change is price is another thing.