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Alternate cryptocurrencies => Altcoin Discussion => Topic started by: bearex on February 12, 2016, 05:26:16 PM



Title: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bearex on February 12, 2016, 05:26:16 PM
Hey, how are you famillar with Vanilla coin? It offers zero time transactions (isnt that what we all want from digital currencies?

Check it out here: http://www.vanillacoin.net/

Also, if you have any experience with it or anything else, post your thoughts below.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bathrobehero on February 12, 2016, 05:30:44 PM
From a miner's perspective I hate their wallet. Sure, it's lightweight but it offers zero customization. Everything is needlessly small, you can't even resize the window and you can't even solomine to it.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: iCEBREAKER on February 12, 2016, 05:42:21 PM
Vanilla uses code stolen from Bitcoin, and the scam dev refused to do the right thing when gmaxwell, etc asked him to fix the lack of proper attribution, as required per the software license.

As for "instant" transactions, that lasted about a day on Poloniex.  Then they discovered it was probably a way for the Vanilla dev to force-feed them fake VNL in order to clean the exchange out of legitimate coins.

Is it true that Vanillacoin uses the BTC code?
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1151160.0

GMAXWELL:
[VNL] Vanillacoin, a quiet word of warning.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=920344.0

Smooth VS VNL
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1184904.0

Define "uses". There's certainly structural similarities:

https://github.com/john-connor/vanillacoin/blob/master/src/key.cpp vs
https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/blob/0.9/src/key.cpp#L16

Thanks for that.

Adding “#L34” to the vnl URI nails it for me:

Code:
int EC_KEY_regenerate_key(EC_KEY * eckey, BIGNUM * priv_key)
{
    int ok = 0;
   
    BN_CTX * ctx = 0;
    EC_POINT * pub_key = 0;

    if (eckey == 0)
    {
        return 0;
    }
   
    const EC_GROUP * group = EC_KEY_get0_group(eckey);

    if ((ctx = BN_CTX_new()) == 0)
    {
        goto err;
    }
   
    pub_key = EC_POINT_new(group);

    if (pub_key == 0)
    {
        goto err;
    }

Code:
int EC_KEY_regenerate_key(EC_KEY *eckey, BIGNUM *priv_key)
{
    int ok = 0;
    BN_CTX *ctx = NULL;
    EC_POINT *pub_key = NULL;

    if (!eckey) return 0;

    const EC_GROUP *group = EC_KEY_get0_group(eckey);

    if ((ctx = BN_CTX_new()) == NULL)
        goto err;

    pub_key = EC_POINT_new(group);

    if (pub_key == NULL)
        goto err;

That's a lot more than just a structural similarity.

It’s hard for me to see this as anything other than incontrovertible evidence of the author having a naively self-centred perspective on intellectual property rights, broadly translatable as “what’s yours is mine and what’s mine’s my own”.

More tellingly, it's also hard to reconcile this evident difficulty in critical thinking with any kind of work in the area of cryptography, notorious for its relentlessly stern demands of cognitive sophistication in its proponents.

Stand back a few yards and the picture becomes somewhat clearer. I've not even bothered looking at vnl, being confident that it’s just another variant of the “misunderstood but brilliant maverick outsider, wronged by a complacent community” media narrative and all the posturing is entirely consistent, even the expedient arrogation of others’ work. Given the evidence in the codebase, I'm reassured that my confidence is not misplaced, although I do have to admit that his choice of pseudonym is a bit of a give-away in and of itself.


Cheers

Graham


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: Gillette on February 12, 2016, 06:16:58 PM
Hey, how are you famillar with Vanilla coin? It offers zero time transactions (isnt that what we all want from digital currencies?

Check it out here: http://www.vanillacoin.net/

Also, if you have any experience with it or anything else, post your thoughts below.

If XMR famous fudsters especially smooth aka icebreaker criticize a coin, this means it`s a very good coin. Make a research how xmr fudded Vanilla some months ago, so this is a good reason to be sure VNL is a very innovative coin.

Generally XMR assholes are very hostile against every innovative coin.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: iCEBREAKER on February 12, 2016, 09:46:54 PM
Hey, how are you famillar with Vanilla coin? It offers zero time transactions (isnt that what we all want from digital currencies?

Check it out here: http://www.vanillacoin.net/

Also, if you have any experience with it or anything else, post your thoughts below.

If XMR famous fudsters especially smooth aka icebreaker criticize a coin, this means it`s a very good coin. Make a research how xmr fudded Vanilla some months ago, so this is a good reason to be sure VNL is a very innovative coin.

Generally XMR assholes are very hostile against every innovative coin.


The problem with using anti-Monero ad hom to deflect criticism of VNL:


Greeting, this evening john-connor (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=402318) showed up on the Bitcoin Core github with some rather aggressively ignorant minunderstandings of basic cryptographic consensus concepts: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/5634#issuecomment-69481908

Having no clue who he was I looked at his github account and googled a bit and found that he is the, seemingly pseudonymous, author of "Vanillacoin".

Vanillacoin was previously discussed on this forum, https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=890388.0 but he locked the threads in order to shuffle the users (victims?) off to someplace out of the light of day-- never a good sign, (nor is his BCT newbie account, for that matter).  The "vanillacoin" software has no source code available, it is binaries only (very much not a good sign, and usually severe malware concern; and an ultimate form of centralization), there are source links but they go to a basically empty github repository. There is a whitepaper, which like the comments on github show some general software development background they show no real sign of sophisticated understanding around decenteralized systems for adversarial networks or cryptocurrencies.

I don't know anything more about it, but I figure sunlight tends to be a good disinfectant; and with the threads locked it probably wasn't fair of me to say nothing while I was privately thinking "hm, that all smells pretty fishy".  Of course, the guy was a bit rude to me and also wasted my time-- so feel free to factor that bias in however you like. I'm just reporting my impression as a regular community member. You now know what I know.

[I'm the last person to play altcoin-cops... I mostly avoid this stuff except for the rare cases that are technically interesting: The drama can sink unbounded time and usually, when it comes to the more misguided altcoin cryptography, the only sane policy seems to be "If you see something,say nothing and drink to forget": there is too much crazyness and risk of being attacked for being critical of someones latest scheme. But if it shows up in my face, I can't quite stomach saying nothing at all.]

Cheers,


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: ol92 on February 12, 2016, 10:08:01 PM
...

As for "instant" transactions, that lasted about a day on Poloniex.  Then they discovered it was probably a way for the Vanilla dev to force-feed them fake VNL in order to clean the exchange out of legitimate coins.

...
Are you sure about this ? what is your source ?
Thanks


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: jimlite on February 13, 2016, 01:39:04 AM
The one confirmation has always been there for BTC and VNL. That is because Poloniex did a thorough code review as well as trusts the developer. It has been one confirmation for months. There was a problem on Polo's end for a few days where they went back to 7 confirmations and then once fixed it was back to one.  Icebreaker and Smooth constantly try and FUD VNL, this is nothing new. Price starts rising today and all of a sudden Icebreaker is back with year old FUD again. I really wonder if this guy is investing heavily in VNL.  VNL has a team of professional coders, lawyers, etc. it is not some clone coin and it certainly isn't doing anything illegal with code.  Icebreaker seems to have a problem with software that has 500,000 lines of code an 5 of them are the same as other crypto's to keep things compatible and not re-invent the wheel. VNL was written from scratch and more resembles Peercoin than Bitcoin, and dev said he would acknowledge either coin's dev if they asked him to. So far I don't see Satoshi Nakamoto or Sunny King asking John-Connor for that, but he would ablige.  VNL is a real business that is going to change crypto in speed, security, anonymous, and scaling.  Icebreaker congrats on your FUD to get cheap coins if it is working, but seriously it is getting old.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: r0ach on February 13, 2016, 02:02:56 AM
The part about not assigning attribution properly is honestly overblown since it's an anonymous dev and he's releasing free software, so who really gives a shit.  Whether the software works or not is all I really care about.  Having said that, he told me he was doing some insane number of TPS with no backlog using his insta send method, but nowadays he's saying it does create a backlog and is talking about raising block size to 30MB as I pretty much thought would be required to do these large numbers.

I'm not really sure how to value Vanillacoin at the moment.  If the insta send method doesn't have any security holes (if), then that would provide some increased utility, but transactions still need to be included in a block.  So I guess you get faster speeds only while the network is low traffic and if applied to Bitcoin, wouldn't give any gains if blocks are perma full since you would want to wait until the transaction is actually inside a block?

It seems like you would need to convert to a ledger system for this to be useful at scale and bypass the slowest component, blockchain part, but ledger systems already have insane speeds anyway.  Somebody correct me if I'm wrong about the usefulness of this here feature.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 13, 2016, 03:39:19 AM
As for the whole code issue, John-connor has an acknowledgment on the VNL website towards peer coin and wrote that he used peer coin as a reference while writing VNL.
I don't really care whether he inadvertently used some btc/ssl/goldcoin/ whatever came before that code to pull off the mundane crypto currency things.
If you don't like it, take it up with a legal body that cares....  wait there is none.

The rest of what icebreaker wrote is garbage.  VNL ZEROTIME transfers work very well, we are months in now and there is no evidence that a double spend has happened.   Where the fuck do you get off  making up shot about fake coins?  Show evidence in the block chain. .. wait you can't because you are full of shit.
His quote from gmaxwell was from VNL's first month after launch and is total and complete bullshit  FUD.  VNL code is open source check it out yourself.
also wasn't it Gmaxwell who was just caught with his pants down because he is selling a lightning network that he has no idea how to finish.

Well John-connor who supposedly has no clue about cryptography has already created one.  Not only that but he has implemented a pruning ledger, so there are no bloat issues.

PROOF IS IN THE PUDDING!!

and before you start your hypocritical shill rant, everyone knows your a core/monero shill so please sit down.





Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 13, 2016, 03:53:09 AM
The rest of what icebreaker wrote is garbage.  VNL ZEROTIME transfers work very well

monsterer, Fuserleer, and I analyzed the Zerotime whitepaper in thread some months ago and pointed out it is flawed.

This is another scam coin. And the new anonymity feature is also flawed.

Any speculator who buys this is contributing to the cesspool of scams in altcoins and is poisoning the well from which we all drink.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 13, 2016, 04:00:56 AM
The rest of what icebreaker wrote is garbage.  VNL ZEROTIME transfers work very well

monsterer, Fuserleer, and I analyzed the Zerotime whitepaper in thread some months ago and pointed out it is flawed.
As far as I can tell Zerotime is about 1000xs more secure than zero confirmation bitcoin transfer.  And when it comes to real world use that is what matters.
This is another scam coin. And the new anonymity feature is also flawed.

Any speculator who buys this is contributing to the cesspool of scams in altcoins and is poisoning the well from which we all drink.

.. must have got lost in the mail, please point out how it is flawed and even better road map out a point of attack.
Don't be so ambiguous.  All crypto is flawed when it comes to perfection whether in transfer time or anonymity.   We all know it is, but can you show me how it can be done.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: americanpegasus on February 13, 2016, 04:01:35 AM
The cryptocurrency equivalent of a Gender Studies Degree.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 13, 2016, 04:06:18 AM
When it comes to real world use Zerotime seems 1000xs  safer than a zero confirm btc transfer.  That is what matters, not whether it is 100% foolproof.

Now we just need generalize this to complete the circlejerk.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 13, 2016, 04:08:45 AM
When it comes to real world use Zerotime seems 1000xs  safer than a zero confirm btc transfer.  That is what matters, not whether it is 100% foolproof.

When exchanges lose their money then it won't acceptable that it can be Sybil attacked. The incentive has to be great enough for the attack to worthwhile.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 13, 2016, 04:15:29 AM
The sybil attack must happen within 3 milliseconds before a lock is put in place.  Even then only one of the transactions can be voted as true, and the person who has been ripped off will know it has happened.  I think there may actually be a mechanism in VNL that cancels out both transactions in that case, but I would need to reread up on it to make sure.  Also incentives ed full nodes protect against this further.

That being said all sidechain transactions are open to a sybil attack, but unless vnl becomes the next bitcoin, it just is not worth trying because it would be noticed to quickly.  Also even if it does become the next bitcoin it would only be on exchanges where this would be a problem, and since none of us care whether we need to wait a few minutes for a confirmation when it comes to buying and selling in an exchange your blatant FUD is proven misdirection.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 13, 2016, 04:28:17 AM
When VNL releases a detailed specification in a complete white paper, then we can cover all the ways it breaks. There is no way we are going to play cat & mouse game with John Conner where he refuses to provide all the details. It is all nonsense and timing and propagation is never proof in the Byzantine Generals Problem because distributed systems don't have synchrony. The best property he could possibly attain would be Stellar SCP's property that it is always safe but can be permanently preempted (delayed) by Sybil attack forever. Don't argue with a PhD professor from Stanford (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1319681.msg13778110#msg13778110).


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: smooth on February 13, 2016, 04:31:59 AM
The part about not assigning attribution properly is honestly overblown since it's an anonymous dev and he's releasing free software, so who really gives a shit.  Whether the software works or not is all I really care about.

It matters exactly to that, because first of all it is used to hype ("All new code!") and based on that observation you should seriously doubt whether the product is being sold on the basis of code that works or hype. In this case clearly the latter.

Second of all it tells you a lot about the credibility and integrity of the developer. Unless you are going to undertake a comprehensive top-to-bottom review of the design and code which done right could cost millions of dollars, you are unavoidably relying on his claims about what the code is supposed to do and what it actually does. In theory the code speaks for it self but in practice when there is zero chance of a competent and complete review ever being done, the credibility of the developer matters a lot.

As TPTB just said, at this point he hasn't even released a complete white paper for any of the features. So it can't be reviewed that way even if we were willing to take his word that the code does what the whitepaper says. It's all bunch of skin-deep hype for a pump.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 13, 2016, 04:38:26 AM

It's all bunch of skin-deep hype for a pump.


Still quoting things from 12 months ago.

I've been watching VNL for 4 months now, and although I've seen investors hype it( myself included)  I have never seen John-connor hype his own releases.  Everytime he ninja launches them, followed by an evening of questions and answers in IRC.

And don't go pointing hype fingers, some of us were around when Risto was on bitcointalk claiming XMR would be around parity by now.  Everyone in here that has slandered John is a hype pump king.



Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 13, 2016, 04:40:57 AM
You didn't address our point. Which is that he refuses to provide detailed specifications. Please STFU until complete and detailed specifications have been released.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 13, 2016, 04:44:01 AM
Same to you...  I know you want assume that VNL doesn't do what it says, so don't buy any then.   It does what I need it to.

I'm sure John will roll out the full details before full beta testing is done.

And that wasn't your original point.  Your original point was to say that you proved it was flawed and a scam...   I am just answerring your FUD.

Keep your comments clear and don't just throw out shit like sybil attack followed by scam accusations.  
Or would you rather I just let your blatant FUD SPAM go unacknowledged.

Edit.  BTW sorry I missed your last post before smooth.  And no I don't have an answer to that, neither does core or anyone that I know of for that matter.  

Thank you for returning to intelligent conversation.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 13, 2016, 04:44:47 AM
I'm sure John will roll out the full details before full beta testing is done.

And I am sure we will analyze it if he does. Until then, all you have is hype.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: smooth on February 13, 2016, 04:50:51 AM
There is another issue with plagiarism besides credibility and hype, which is that when you write code yourself you likely have some idea what the code actually does. When you run it through an automatic reformatting/refactoring tool in order to disguise the copying you very likely have no idea how the code actually works.

You also can't do any automatic or easy merges. It was already pointed out on one of the other threads that VNL had carried forward a bug (implausible if it were actually new code) that had subsequently been fixed in Bitcoin, yet ignored in VNL.

This played out recently in the case of SDC, who copied the cryptography from Cryptonote (but not the code, which they reimplemented). They did not understand how it worked and ended up reimplementing it incorrectly, leading to total deanonymization of their entire chain.

The large portions of the VNL code that were ripped off from BTC are almost certainly not fully understood by the developer, likely contain multiple unfixed bugs, and will be harder (likely to the point if impracticality for a small one-man project) to maintain due to the unnecessary reformatting/refactoring.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 13, 2016, 04:57:53 AM
Off to bed.  As always good to hear from you all, I like to argue, and you guys are always thoughtful.. well everyone except icebreaker....  don't know why I ever take him off ignore.  Oh yah, his banter with spoetnik  keeps me entertained...

Please refrain from using scam every second sentence, it will help me take you more seriously.

Smooth please go read through some of the thousands of other lines of code John has wrote, you will see why your last post is full crap.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 13, 2016, 05:16:25 AM
Smooth please go read through some of the thousands of other lines of code John has wrote, you will see why your last post is full crap.

No one said he can't write some code.

Smooth's point is that if he is cutting corners and even trying to obscure that fact that he did, by running the plagiarized code through a reformatter, and on top of that is my point that he hasn't released detailed specifications, then it at the minimum exemplifies that he doesn't have enough resources and is attempting to hide that reality. In the worse case, it is evidence of unethical foundation.

Thus when you all shrill and hype that which is not ready for prime time, and the fact that VNL is trading now even though it is not ready for prime time, then we have every right to point that out.

If John had first completed all the necessary work before providing coins to trade on the market, then we'd perhaps be less inclined to doubt his ethics and scammerness.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 13, 2016, 05:38:41 AM
Smooth please go read through some of the thousands of other lines of code John has wrote, you will see why your last post is full crap.

No one said he can't write some code.

Smooth's point is that if he is cutting corners and even trying to obscure that fact that he did, by running the plagiarized code through a reformatter, and on top of that is my point that he hasn't released detailed specifications, then it at the minimum exemplifies that he doesn't have enough resources and is attempting to hide that reality. In the worse case, it is evidence of unethical foundation.

Thus when you all shrill and hype that which is not ready for prime time, and the fact that VNL is trading now even though it is not ready for prime time, then we have every right to point that out.

If John had first completed all the necessary work before providing coins to trade on the market, then we'd perhaps be less inclined to doubt his ethics and scammerness.


Fuck you just described every Altcoin in existence. BTC included

I'm just here to add another side to the Fud.   Don't call me a shill for supporting a dev that I like.  
I'm also not here to talk against you specifically,  but more the XMR slander campaign that is running all over this forum using incomplete arguments and saying it's proof of one thing or another.

Fully on topic for one sec.  
How about vanillacoin?

Sure how about it.  While some here like to use every tactic to slander projects in development, I will give you my point of view on this project.
John-connor is a legit coder, he works tirelessly to roll out tech that can make a coin that works fast and efficiently, he fights hard to make sure that distribution is fair.  The team of vanillacoin support is always around to help people get things running.  He has delivered on his promises.
VNL is not some crappie clone coin, but a forward thinking practical project that has possibly solved many of bitcoin problems.
Come to vanillacoin.net or to its IRC channel to learn more
(That includes you haters as well)

Shameless plug for calling me a shill..



Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 13, 2016, 05:42:32 AM
You are an obfuscation machine same as your leader. Not all alt-coins have code run through an obfuscation reformatter. Many instead use the bitcoin code exclusively with only very slight modications and don't try to hide it. Thus the code can be more or less relied upon.

Monero for example doesn't try to hide that it is using the Bytecoin code, and they have also undertaken a long-term plan of reviewing every line of code. Afaik, a lot of code of has been rewritten. Meaning they understand all the code and have the resources to study every single line of code. As well, Monero is based on Cryptonote which has a very complete specification on the one-time ring signatures (well not for the PoW hash, but Monero put a lot of effort into the hash function as well).

Monero has numerous developers contributing. Many eyeballs. John Conner is off by himself trying to do it all. In some ways, you could compare my efforts to Johns in that respect. But the distinction is I didn't try to hype coins into the market before my shit was ready.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 13, 2016, 05:46:18 AM
You basically just made my point..


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 13, 2016, 05:56:21 AM
Fuck you just described every Altcoin in existence. BTC included

The bolded statement is egregiously incorrect.

I already refuted the other sentence in my prior post.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 13, 2016, 06:17:12 AM
John doesn't need to hide it, it's all open source.
BTW I have wasted a day of my time going through the codes side by side, as I was considering investing more, obviously you haven't. It's east to see a fish in the sea if someone is pointing at it.

And OK I'll withdraw my bitcoin statement, because without its successes we wouldn't have a benchmark to measure against.  But putting bytecoin in the same league as bitcoin..  come on, laughable.  Monero forked off a buggy/scammy alpha piece of brilliant code.

Also you are colluding with my argument by using the monero model as your retort.
It developed way to slow, even with its many eyes.  
With its hard to mine beginning through its hard to use lifetime, it has been plagued by being entirely to prerelease since it's beginning.  And now as it points the finger at other crypto notes saying they are all flawed and it has the answer, it is to late.

If zcash (the reason we all started looking for anon  altcoins) comes out in six months and completes what zsnarks/crypto note could not, monero is done.

Here is a thought.  Could that be why all the fan boys are out promoting/fuding?
You guys want one last pump before you flood to zcash?

Sorry about the editing I'm doing all this typing on my phone.
Oh and sorry I went way off topic there.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: iCEBREAKER on February 13, 2016, 06:28:47 AM
Also you are colluding with my argument by using the monero model as your retort.

Speaking of Monero, I heard Shen Noether is going to destroy VNL as soon as he's done demolishing ShadowTrash.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: gregyoung14 on February 13, 2016, 06:34:49 AM
The cryptocurrency equivalent of a Gender Studies Degree.

Haha. So much LOL on this one. Vanilla Ice Ice Baby.
But seriously though, no matter how many altcoins are there in existence, I don't think it can take out BTCs out of the game.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 13, 2016, 06:37:25 AM
Also you are colluding with my argument by using the monero model as your retort.

Speaking of Monero, I heard Shen Noether is going to destroy VNL as soon as he's done demolishing ShadowTrash.

In case you missed it we were having a good discussion in here, not the pure useless dribble that you normally bring, BUT
Hooray icebreaker the king of REKT is back now it's really time to go to bed..

FLAME ON!!!


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: americanpegasus on February 13, 2016, 06:56:34 AM


Speaking of Monero, I heard Shen Noether is going to destroy VNL as soon as he's done demolishing ShadowTrash.

I heard he's seven feet tall, and if he were here, he'd flatten the English with fireballs from his eyes - and lightning bolts from his arse.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 13, 2016, 07:04:42 AM
John doesn't need to hide it, it's all open source.

He is not releasing complete specifications. Cryptonote white paper (https://cryptonote.org/whitepaper.pdf) is a complete specification of the one-time ring signatures. The Shazam encryption function specification I released this week (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1219023.msg13835940#msg13835940) is a complete specification. Period! Damn it! Don't make me write it again.

I haven't even released any coins into the market, yet my Shazam specification (which is mostly work I did in 2013!) on a minor component is more thorough than John's white papers on the larger scope of Zerotime and the new anonymity BS he is hyping.

You continue to twist and spin the facts to try to obfuscate what we are saying.

Don't say he didn't try to hide it. It has been proven by smooth and gmaxwell that he ran the plagiarized code through an obfuscation reformatter.

Also his refusal to release complete specifications means he can hide what the code (even the parts he didn't copy from Bitcoin and obfuscate) is intended to do specifically. No one has time to figure out what his code does without a specification to guide the study.

He exemplifies all the patterns of a huskster by releasing codes into the market without making complete specifications (and also the product not even developed to the point of being ready to be released to users), then on top of that even plagiarizing code, failing to give attribution as the copyright license on Bitcoin code requires, and then running through an obfuscation preformatter to try to hide his theft mentality.

That you align yourself with someone of his reputation is going to drag your reputation into the sewer as well.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 13, 2016, 07:37:11 AM
BTW I have wasted a day of my time going through the codes side by side, as I was considering investing more, obviously you haven't. It's east to see a fish in the sea if someone is pointing at it.

A day is not enough to fully understand even just 1000 lines of code in most cases. And I assume he has more than 1000 lines, since a crypto currency can't be programmed in 1000 lines of code.

And OK I'll withdraw my bitcoin statement, because without its successes we wouldn't have a benchmark to measure against.

The point is that Bitcoin has man-years of top notch developers. Bitcoin isn't perfect, but it isn't one guy who can't write complete specifications, stealing code without attribution, and releasing coins for sale with half-assed R&D and hype BS on anonymity and zerotime.

But putting bytecoin in the same league as bitcoin..  come on, laughable.  Monero forked off a buggy/scammy alpha piece of brilliant code.

What I wrote is they didn't hide it and instead endeavored to apply man-years of high quality developers on studying every line of code.

Also you are colluding with my argument by using the monero model as your retort.
It developed way to slow, even with its many eyes.  
With its hard to mine beginning through its hard to use lifetime, it has been plagued by being entirely to prerelease since it's beginning.  And now as it points the finger at other crypto notes saying they are all flawed and it has the answer, it is to late.

That is the pitch John tells you. I will agree only on one point, which is that Monero is not user adoption focused. But neither is VNL (nor all the other alt-coins).

Monero is developed slower than a Manhattan Project, because the developers are volunteers. There is no Steve Jobs/Bill Gates coming into their offices to crack the whip.

I suppose John has told his flock that he can develop faster. Well so far he has failed, because he can't write complete specifications.

These projects take a lot of time to R&D. I am actually trying to find a shortcut (and I don't know if I will succeed to), in that I will try to go directly to user adoption so I don't have to try to convince any of you of anything. In that case, you won't be able to attack me if I didn't release a specification, because I won't be selling anything here in this forum. Of course I will still be doing my best to make sure my technology is correct, but knowing full well that as only 1 man, I can't get it all perfectly correct. So I can only hope to get it correct enough, attain adoption, then from there fund more developers. That is my strategy.

What I see of John's strategy is he using deception and providing coins to speculators. So therefor he is going to be subject to this sort of skepticism.

Bottom line is his Zerotime won't work and his anonymity is BS. If he thinks otherwise, then produce a complete specification.

If zcash (the reason we all started looking for anon  altcoins) comes out in six months and completes what zsnarks/crypto note could not, monero is done.

Not necessarily. Zcash at least has issues about the funding model. This is an open question still being sorted out.

Also Zcash has the issue around trust of setup.

Also Zcash is not yet available and will need man-years of development to make sure the code is production level quality (bulletproof).

Perhaps Zooko can do a great job especially with adequate funding. We have to see how this will all play out.

For John to throw his hat into the anonymity arena at this point, is laughable. I even invented ZKT (similar and maybe better than RingCT), but I realized I have no future competing with Monero and Zcash. I either join them or move on to other opportunities. I so far have chosen the latter. I told Shen-Noether that if I knew he was researching RingCT, I would have never expended June/July 2015 researching and inventing ZKT. I hate to waste my effort on duplication. And that is what John is doing at the very best and at worst it is a scam.

Here is a thought.  Could that be why all the fan boys are out promoting/fuding?
You guys want one last pump before you flood to zcash?

Nah, I think americanpegasus really believes that Monero/Aeon will become world dominant. He drinks his KoolAid.

Sorry about the editing I'm doing all this typing on my phone.
Oh and sorry I went way off topic there.

Ah on a mobile phone. I forget that many do that. I am always on a 24" monitor.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: smooth on February 13, 2016, 07:50:43 AM
BTW I have wasted a day of my time going through the codes side by side, as I was considering investing more, obviously you haven't. It's east to see a fish in the sea if someone is pointing at it.

A day is not enough to fully understand even just 1000 lines of code in most cases. And I assume he has more than 1000 lines, since a crypto currency can't be programmed in 1000 lines of code.

It's about 100k lines (including blanks -- simple file line count). Good luck figuring out what all that code does, how it is being used, where it came from, whether it has unpatched bugs, etc.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 13, 2016, 07:55:08 AM
I couldnt resist to say HI to copy/paste/copyright FUD squad.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 13, 2016, 08:00:29 AM
I couldnt resist to say HI to copy/paste/copyright FUD squad.

Good luck. I'll be waiting for the complete specifications from John and hoping on his Zerotime he can prove all the PhDs wrong and somehow make the speed-of-light infinite by showing that synchrony is possible in distributed systems.  ::)


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: smooth on February 13, 2016, 08:01:30 AM
I couldnt resist to say HI to copy/paste/copyright FUD squad.

Shouldn't you be off in some walled garden controlled investor-fleecing forum somewhere?


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 13, 2016, 08:12:57 AM
I have explored every possible design for anonymity. I expended months and years thinking about every possible way it could be done. How many days I sat on my couch just running the possibilities through my mind. So if I say John is wasting his time, then you should believe it.

And by now getting close to that level of study also on consensus algorithms including instant confirmations.

Let John publish a complete specification if he thinks he invented something I (or others who I've studied) didn't already think of and dismissed. The likelihood although not absolutely 0, is exceedingly small.

smooth's implicit point (among other points) in his immediately prior post is that John isn't participating in peer view and prior art searching. No person is omniscient and there are very few things under the sun that others haven't also explored. I have been sharing my ideas and thoughts on this forum as a form of peer review.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 13, 2016, 08:14:21 AM
I couldnt resist to say HI to copy/paste/copyright FUD squad.

Shouldn't you be off in some walled garden controlled investor-fleecing forum somewhere?


No, I don't fleece.

...Oh, you mean like you are doing with XMR?

No, I'm not that kind of guy.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 13, 2016, 09:30:52 AM
I have explored every possible design for anonymity. I expended months and years thinking about every possible way it could be done. How many days I sat on my couch just running the possibilities through my mind. So if I say John is wasting his time, then you should believe it.

And by now getting close to that level of study also on consensus algorithms including instant confirmations.

Let John publish a complete specification if he thinks he invented something I (or others who I've studied) didn't already think of and dismissed. The likelihood although not absolutely 0, is exceedingly small.

smooth's implicit point (among other points) in his immediately prior post is that John isn't participating in peer view and prior art searching. No person is omniscient and there are very few things under the sun that others haven't also explored. I have been sharing my ideas and thoughts on this forum as a form of peer review.

WOW we should believe you cause you say so!
WOW, just WOW.
I really don't know what, where and how you explored what you are saying. I don't even know if you have couch but basically seeing you on the line with smooth I don't see even smallest possibility to believe you until you make something useful for anyone but you.

Well yes, let John finish/publish his project. He is busy with making his plans into fast, safe, decentralized and usable crypto currency ...and that is what I trust more than your forum FUD/ideas sharing or XMR project.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: john-connor on February 13, 2016, 11:31:30 AM
You basically just made my point..
Anonymous transactions are already done and live on main vanilla network. Goal accomplished more to set and bars to raise. Try to keep up it's going to be one hell of a ride. 8)


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: r0ach on February 13, 2016, 11:45:40 AM
There is another issue with plagiarism besides credibility and hype...

They say necessity is the mother of invention.  I guess you anon coin devs better look out because John Connor definitely doesn't want anyone finding out who he is with multiple accusations of plagiarism.  Unless Smooth actually does open "The Smooth Road", the necessity is going to be pretty lopsided on this one.  I'm still hoping for a release of The Smooth Road, though.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 13, 2016, 11:47:52 AM
smooth is not being anonymous because he is afraid of culpability. He is being anonymous because of the nasty things that jealous people can do.

I am 50 (and perhaps terminally ill) so I don't fucking care. Kill me and my gf's family will make sure you end up as Lechon before you can escape the Philippines. Haha.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: ray88 on February 13, 2016, 03:42:32 PM
How many hdd you guys have kill ? If only every one could easly run is own xmr wallet.
Fix your code xmr, fix the mem fix the hdd w/r. Let me know when my grandma or mom can use it.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CX61FHaUoAExVjG.jpg

Vanillacoin is nice because its very fast (zerotime 15k tx/sec), secure(whildpool encryption (nokia's algo)), fair distribution (no 51%, no abusive pool), simple to use and it fixed the node problem giving incentive to run one (it also help to get the nodes off the datacenters and have more of them in homes).
It has a mobiles wallets witch you can import the wallet.dat to any platform. He runs udp and tcp connections witch shows he know how networking works and its rare in cryptoland.

John is coding at least 6 days a week, hes invested$ and have no reason to fail.
I seen it all over the last year ! XMR fools never stopped bashing, i guess they feel the competition.
He delivers, help and inovate. He even helped peercoin and other coins pushing fix to help them.

Upcoming
-chainblender = anon sends/receive
-whisper = pc/mobile messaging and voip
-multi algo mining

White papers available here https://github.com/john-connor/papers (https://github.com/john-connor/papers)


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 13, 2016, 04:02:30 PM
-multi algo mining

x11 is reborn. Hallelujah. Praise the John.

https://metrouk2.files.wordpress.com/2015/03/ad_164132063-e1427381980736.jpg


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: ray88 on February 13, 2016, 04:06:14 PM

Can't wait till your not around anymore, Praise the lord.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 13, 2016, 04:07:45 PM

If you understood the reason x11 was nonsense, maybe you'd appreciate the implied technical point. It was inside joke for those who aren't n00bs.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: ray88 on February 13, 2016, 04:11:16 PM

If you understood the reason x11 was nonsense, maybe you'd appreciate the implied technical point. It was inside joke for those who aren't n00bs.

lol when i said multi algo i meant that atm you can mine with blake and in future it was talked whildpool could be readded as secound mining algo. In no way vnl is going x11 dumass.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: ray88 on February 13, 2016, 04:12:29 PM

I know what he meant because I think as a programmer does.

Programmers are precise and mean what they say. A period mean end this statement.

lol reading back your posts, if you think like a dev what do you understand of xmr ?

http://cdn.meme.am/instances/500x/65860984.jpg


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 13, 2016, 04:21:51 PM
lol when i said multi algo i meant that atm you can mine with blake and in future it was talked whildpool could be readded as secound mining algo. In no way vnl is going x11 dumass.

Well you still didn't get the technical point, because the nonsense of x11 was it was as weak as its weakest hash in terms of security and please tell John to flush some of the cryptanalysis that has been done on Whirlpool, as it is most definitely not as secure as Blake.

So now you can thank me for contributing to your coin. You're welcome.


Pwn3d.

http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo270/mattymac1375/ourkid.jpg


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 13, 2016, 04:28:52 PM
lol when i said multi algo i meant that atm you can mine with blake and in future it was talked whildpool could be readded as secound mining algo. In no way vnl is going x11 dumass.

Well you still didn't get the technical point, because the nonsense of x11 was it was as weak as its weakest hash in terms of security and please tell John to flush some of the cryptanalysis that has been done on Whirlpool, as it is most definitely not as secure as Blake.

So now you can thank me for contributing to your coin. You're welcome.


Pwn3d.

Just proves that John isn't the case you think he is.
There is a problem=John solves it.  Quickly.
Another reason to consider vnl.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: jwinterm on February 13, 2016, 04:31:00 PM


Speaking of Monero, I heard Shen Noether is going to destroy VNL as soon as he's done demolishing ShadowTrash.

I heard he's seven feet tall, and if he were here, he'd flatten the English with fireballs from his eyes - and lightning bolts from his arse.

I heard that motherfucker had like thirty goddamn dicks...


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: jimlite on February 13, 2016, 05:18:40 PM
Smooth please go read through some of the thousands of other lines of code John has wrote, you will see why your last post is full crap.

No one said he can't write some code.

Smooth's point is that if he is cutting corners and even trying to obscure that fact that he did, by running the plagiarized code through a reformatter, and on top of that is my point that he hasn't released detailed specifications, then it at the minimum exemplifies that he doesn't have enough resources and is attempting to hide that reality. In the worse case, it is evidence of unethical foundation.

Thus when you all shrill and hype that which is not ready for prime time, and the fact that VNL is trading now even though it is not ready for prime time, then we have every right to point that out.

If John had first completed all the necessary work before providing coins to trade on the market, then we'd perhaps be less inclined to doubt his ethics and scammerness.

TPTB, I am going to admit something here to you all based on your last line.  Almost a year ago, while this coin was still beta and being cpu mined, talk was going around about a gpu miner coming out soon.  People were on the original forums constantly trying to do off market buys and sells because there was no exchange yet.  I saw VNL as a very promising coin and thought that if people were cpu mining for a few months and then gpu mining for a few months with no exchange then later on people would yell foul, that it was mined by a select few nerds like DARK or something, and the forum would be filled with buy/sell postings.  I discussed this with john connor briefly and at first he said he didn't want it on exchanges yet, it wasn't ready.  Then later with more trades off market and speculation he said ok to me.  I then asked my contacts at Bittrex and Poloniex to add it, I gave them john's contact info as well (and I never had anything to do with C-Cex adding it). Well it took a couple months of me trying to get it listed, but in the end Bittrex and Polo did thorough code reviews and had the help of john and I believe ocminer in incorporating it. It was not a simple job, because it is not a clone.  So don't doubt his ethics. He has never hyped his coin and he didn't want it on exchanges yet, but myself and others felt it needed to be and he reluctantly agreed months later.  So if you want to blame someone for having the coin listed too early, blame me. But I have seen clone coins made in a day and listed the next. This coin was developed for a year before listed. And that one pump in the summer to 60k, that was just speculators speculating. It had nothing to do with john connor. In fact john buys coins when pumpers try to inflate the price before he thinks the price is where it should be naturally.  John also buys a lot of coins when the price dumps. He believes in his coin 100% and is like Jamie Dimon buying $26M of Chase (his own companies) stock when people think it is doomed. John has always delivered and puts his money where his mouth is.  Now I know everybody doesn't love his personality, and that is fine. Once you get to know him and his sarcasm, low tollerence for idiots, and humor, he is fun to talk to. Though he does get annoyed easily when people who are not very experienced dev/coders try to talk to him about VNL, because lets face it, almost no one can really read all his code, understand it, and have a meaningful debate with him.  He also holds two Ph.Ds I believe and has been in crypto and P2Ps major projects for two decades. He is no kid in his basement, and if you believe any of this FUD and miss out on the long term (not days or weeks) opportunities VNL is offering, well that is up to you.  I see a competant dev pumping code to git like a monster, delivering on all his promises, having lawyers and accountants look over his business, buying domains for his business, making contacts with important people and companies in crypto and outside of crypto looking to enter.  And while john is the main dev, there is other devs that help as well as his recent ad for a full stack dev.  This coin is as real as it gets. When it has whisper (encrypted) voice and text on cell phones, chainblender (anon coins), and is already the fastest coin with zerotime and probably the fastest even without zerotime, what is there not to like?  I am not saying it is going to overtake btc, though it does solve the scalability and speed problem, but it certainly belongs in the top 5 altcoins, and is nothing like the other 1000 clone copy paste scam coins.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: ray88 on February 13, 2016, 05:36:58 PM
lol when i said multi algo i meant that atm you can mine with blake and in future it was talked whildpool could be readded as secound mining algo. In no way vnl is going x11 dumass.

Well you still didn't get the technical point, because the nonsense of x11 was it was as weak as its weakest hash in terms of security and please tell John to flush some of the cryptanalysis that has been done on Whirlpool, as it is most definitely not as secure as Blake.

So now you can thank me for contributing to your coin. You're welcome.


Pwn3d.

http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo270/mattymac1375/ourkid.jpg

Well we can still look at this like there is nothing 100% proof vs time.
how would blake be more secure than whirlpool ? mining has nothing to do with the security of this coin its just a way of distribution.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 13, 2016, 05:52:41 PM

I am 50 (and perhaps terminally ill) so I don't fucking care. Kill me and my gf's family will make sure you end up as Lechon before you can escape the Philippines. Haha.

Well, I'm 45 and feeling sorry for you cause yes I'm that kind of guy.
... But than you, again, started posting shit which points to your terminal brain illness.
Still feeling sorry for you.
I hope it's not contagious.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 13, 2016, 06:05:09 PM
how would blake be more secure than whirlpool ? mining has nothing to do with the security of this coin its just a way of distribution.

You guys think you are capable of judging John's capabilities but you don't even comprehend very basic Bitcoin 101 issues.

If the mining hash function is sufficiently broken, the cracker can rewrite the entire block chain with a greater difficulty (i.e. he can produce great difficulty with very little computing hardware). If the crack is public knowledge, then the longest rule means nothing and chaos results.

Chaining hashes doesn't always fix the risk, e.g. if one of the hashes in the chain has a very high level of collisions.

Well, I'm 45 and feeling sorry for you cause yes I'm that kind of guy.
... But than you, again, started posting shit which points to your terminal brain illness.
Still feeling sorry for you.
I hope it's not contagious.

45/healthy and 51/chronically ill is indescribably different. 6 years ago I was still chasing girls and partying. Now I struggle with daily life. But don't feel sorry for me, I did it to myself with the life choices I made. And I am doing reasonably well with it since I discovered high dose curcumin extract. I think my problem is dysfunction in the pancreas, gall bladder, or colon (possibly cancer or auto immune disease thereabouts). Any way, I am getting some improvement, but it has taught me that life is for the moment. I don't think about living to 80. What ever I get, I will enjoy.

Main thing is I've stopped thinking like I was still young and my life is ahead of me. I started to think about decline and just making the most of remaining life. I think even without illness, this is a change in mental outlook that man goes through in his 50s. Perhaps it would be different if I was totally healthy and could still compete in athletics the way I love to. For example, last month I think I tore or strained the rotator cuff in my shoulder. Maybe just an occassional nuisance and maybe next time I need to remember i just can't go from doing nothing to shooting the basketball vigorously. Sometimes it feels like everything I try to do physically is a failure since I got ill. As I said, maybe my attitude will be different if athleticism returns consistently. Even when I jog my legs are often weak. But I will say I had a strong run the prior day and I was just happy with that. I live what ever I get.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 13, 2016, 06:31:33 PM
how would blake be more secure than whirlpool ? mining has nothing to do with the security of this coin its just a way of distribution.

You guys think you are capable of judging John's capabilities but you don't even comprehend very basic Bitcoin 101 issues.

If the mining hash function is sufficiently broken, the cracker can rewrite the entire block chain with a greater difficulty (i.e. he can produce great difficulty with very little computing hardware). If the crack is public knowledge, then the longest rule means nothing and chaos results.

Chaining hashes doesn't always fix the risk, e.g. if one of the hashes in the chain has a very high level of collisions.

Well, I'm 45 and feeling sorry for you cause yes I'm that kind of guy.
... But than you, again, started posting shit which points to your terminal brain illness.
Still feeling sorry for you.
I hope it's not contagious.

45/healthy and 51/chronically ill is indescribably different. 6 years ago I was still chasing girls and partying. Now I struggle with daily life. But don't feel sorry for me, I did it to myself with the life choices I made. And I am doing reasonably well with it since I discovered high dose curcumin extract. I think my problem is dysfunction in the pancreas, gall bladder, or colon (possibly cancer or auto immune disease thereabouts). Any way, I am getting some improvement, but it has taught me that life is for the moment. I don't think about living to 80. What ever I get, I will enjoy.

Main thing is I've stopped thinking like I was still young and my life is ahead of me. I started to think about decline and just making the most of remaining life. I think even without illness, this is a change in mental outlook that man goes through in his 50s. Perhaps it would be different if I was totally healthy and could still compete in athletics the way I love to. For example, last month I think I tore or strained the rotator cuff in my shoulder. Always painful to move my right arm.

You do realize that VNL switched to Blake after the flaw in whirlpoolX11 was found.
Thanks to those that brought the X11 flaw to light.  

John was very straightforward when he found that the whirlpool algo was also susceptible like other x11 algos, and immediately dropped the other things he was working on to keep vnl ahead of the flaw.

Thank you John-connor for keeping us ahead of the pack.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 13, 2016, 06:37:33 PM
Smooth please go read through some of the thousands of other lines of code John has wrote, you will see why your last post is full crap.

No one said he can't write some code.

Smooth's point is that if he is cutting corners and even trying to obscure that fact that he did, by running the plagiarized code through a reformatter, and on top of that is my point that he hasn't released detailed specifications, then it at the minimum exemplifies that he doesn't have enough resources and is attempting to hide that reality. In the worse case, it is evidence of unethical foundation.

Thus when you all shrill and hype that which is not ready for prime time, and the fact that VNL is trading now even though it is not ready for prime time, then we have every right to point that out.

If John had first completed all the necessary work before providing coins to trade on the market, then we'd perhaps be less inclined to doubt his ethics and scammerness.

TPTB, I am going to admit something here to you all based on your last line.  Almost a year ago, while this coin was still beta and being cpu mined, talk was going around about a gpu miner coming out soon.  People were on the original forums constantly trying to do off market buys and sells because there was no exchange yet.  I saw VNL as a very promising coin and thought that if people were cpu mining for a few months and then gpu mining for a few months with no exchange then later on people would yell foul, that it was mined by a select few nerds like DARK or something, and the forum would be filled with buy/sell postings.  I discussed this with john connor briefly and at first he said he didn't want it on exchanges yet, it wasn't ready.  Then later with more trades off market and speculation he said ok to me.  I then asked my contacts at Bittrex and Poloniex to add it, I gave them john's contact info as well (and I never had anything to do with C-Cex adding it). Well it took a couple months of me trying to get it listed, but in the end Bittrex and Polo did thorough code reviews and had the help of john and I believe ocminer in incorporating it. It was not a simple job, because it is not a clone.  So don't doubt his ethics. He has never hyped his coin and he didn't want it on exchanges yet, but myself and others felt it needed to be and he reluctantly agreed months later.  So if you want to blame someone for having the coin listed too early, blame me. But I have seen clone coins made in a day and listed the next. This coin was developed for a year before listed. And that one pump in the summer to 60k, that was just speculators speculating. It had nothing to do with john connor. In fact john buys coins when pumpers try to inflate the price before he thinks the price is where it should be naturally.  John also buys a lot of coins when the price dumps. He believes in his coin 100% and is like Jamie Dimon buying $26M of Chase (his own companies) stock when people think it is doomed. John has always delivered and puts his money where his mouth is.  Now I know everybody doesn't love his personality, and that is fine. Once you get to know him and his sarcasm, low tollerence for idiots, and humor, he is fun to talk to. Though he does get annoyed easily when people who are not very experienced dev/coders try to talk to him about VNL, because lets face it, almost no one can really read all his code, understand it, and have a meaningful debate with him.  He also holds two Ph.Ds I believe and has been in crypto and P2Ps major projects for two decades. He is no kid in his basement, and if you believe any of this FUD and miss out on the long term (not days or weeks) opportunities VNL is offering, well that is up to you.  I see a competant dev pumping code to git like a monster, delivering on all his promises, having lawyers and accountants look over his business, buying domains for his business, making contacts with important people and companies in crypto and outside of crypto looking to enter.  And while john is the main dev, there is other devs that help as well as his recent ad for a full stack dev.  This coin is as real as it gets. When it has whisper (encrypted) voice and text on cell phones, chainblender (anon coins), and is already the fastest coin with zerotime and probably the fastest even without zerotime, what is there not to like?  I am not saying it is going to overtake btc, though it does solve the scalability and speed problem, but it certainly belongs in the top 5 altcoins, and is nothing like the other 1000 clone copy paste scam coins.

Show me a full specification for Zerotime that convinces me. Then you will see me change my tune. You can even send it to me in private with an understanding I won't comment on it in public if you prefer.

I just haven't seen any thing yet that convinces me he is legit. I see grand claims without specification.

If he provides that then I will take the time to review the analysis we did of the prior Zerotime white paper and see if our analysis was flawed or if the Sybil attack alleged was unrealistic.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 13, 2016, 06:52:35 PM
Didn't we already discuss this? All lightning networks have a chance at a sybil attack.
In a trust less environment where the interaction is a fiat to coin transaction, ie; in an exchange, all instant transactions should only be used with the understanding of the risk involved.

I'm a Zerotime advocate, but even I agree that unless John proves that he has miraculously solved this problem Zerotime should not be used in a trust less interaction.

What Zerotime does do, is to add to the use ability of vanillacoin in human interaction.

The market also agrees with me on this, if John proves he has solved the sybil attack vector, VNL would be worth much much more than it is right now.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: jimlite on February 13, 2016, 06:55:48 PM
how would blake be more secure than whirlpool ? mining has nothing to do with the security of this coin its just a way of distribution.

You guys think you are capable of judging John's capabilities but you don't even comprehend very basic Bitcoin 101 issues.

If the mining hash function is sufficiently broken, the cracker can rewrite the entire block chain with a greater difficulty (i.e. he can produce great difficulty with very little computing hardware). If the crack is public knowledge, then the longest rule means nothing and chaos results.

Chaining hashes doesn't always fix the risk, e.g. if one of the hashes in the chain has a very high level of collisions.

Well, I'm 45 and feeling sorry for you cause yes I'm that kind of guy.
... But than you, again, started posting shit which points to your terminal brain illness.
Still feeling sorry for you.
I hope it's not contagious.

45/healthy and 51/chronically ill is indescribably different. 6 years ago I was still chasing girls and partying. Now I struggle with daily life. But don't feel sorry for me, I did it to myself with the life choices I made. And I am doing reasonably well with it since I discovered high dose curcumin extract. I think my problem is dysfunction in the pancreas, gall bladder, or colon (possibly cancer or auto immune disease thereabouts). Any way, I am getting some improvement, but it has taught me that life is for the moment. I don't think about living to 80. What ever I get, I will enjoy.

Main thing is I've stopped thinking like I was still young and my life is ahead of me. I started to think about decline and just making the most of remaining life. I think even without illness, this is a change in mental outlook that man goes through in his 50s. Perhaps it would be different if I was totally healthy and could still compete in athletics the way I love to. For example, last month I think I tore or strained the rotator cuff in my shoulder. Maybe just an occassional nuisance and maybe next time I need to remember i just can't go from doing nothing to shooting the basketball vigorously. Sometimes it feels like everything I try to do physically is a failure since I got ill. As I said, maybe my attitude will be different if athleticism returns consistently. Even when I jog my legs are often weak. But I will say I had a strong run the prior day and I was just happy with that. I live what ever I get.
I am 50 and have some of my own physical and mental challenges.  After about 40, things just start falling apart. Knee and back pain, insomnia, anxiety, high cholesterol, etc. etc.  The only thing I find that helps (other than doctors and the right pills) is you must take 5-10 minutes a day to stretch as your body becomes very rigid. Also do NOT try to do sports or activities like when you were 30. When I go to the gym I lift half the weight I did 20 years ago. If I try to push it, instead of just being sore for a few days, I get sore/injured and it is severe and lasts months to years. It is not worth it. As you age you just need to try and stay a little flexible and a little stronger with easy weight lifting. I do NO sports at all. If you really wanted to do a sport, swimming is probably the only safe one.  Also us coders and computer geeks spend 18 hours/day sitting, which isn't good at all. Get up, walk around every hour, put your feet up on the desk, change positions, do anything other than sit like a statue all day and night.  Best of luck.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 13, 2016, 06:58:33 PM
Didn't we already discuss this?

I don't remember any capitulation from VNL's side before. I did not participate in the ongoing discussion after I showed the Sybil attack vulnerability.

Perhaps it was the way some other VNL guys were shrilling it as the perfect instant transactions that caused me to judge more harshly the honesty of the project. I put that together with plagiarized code and then the recent anonymity claims with no complete specification.

All lightning networks have a chance at a sybil attack.

Not afaics in my design (subject to future peer review).

Afair, the reason for the potential Sybil attack in Zerotime is because every node participates in voting for the lock. These nodes can be Sybil attacked, because propagation isn't proof and there is no synchrony in distributed networks.

In a trust less environment where the interaction is a fiat to coin transaction, ie; in an exchange, all instant transactions should only be used with the understanding of the risk involved.

I'm a Zerotime advocate, but even I agree that unless John proves that he has miraculously solved this problem Zerotime should not be used in a trust less interaction.

What Zerotime does do, is to add to the use ability of vanillacoin in human interaction.

Okay but I want instant microtransactions in a trustless scenario. And I want a million tx/sec *potential* scaling. I need this for the application of the crypto currency that I am envisioning.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 13, 2016, 11:26:38 PM
So whether or not a sybil attack is possible VNL'S Zerotime transaction still allows 10's of thousands of transactions per second while still being safer than every third party transfer system in the world....  just don't use the instant transfer for money exchange...  or at least wait the couple minutes for 1 confirm before handing money over for vnl to some unknown entity.

Still better than anything released to date.



Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 14, 2016, 12:03:04 AM
So whether or not a sybil attack is possible VNL'S Zerotime transaction still allows 10's of thousands of transactions per second while still being safer than every third party transfer system in the world....  just don't use the instant transfer for money exchange...  or at least wait the couple minutes for 1 confirm before handing money over for vnl to some unknown entity.

Still better than anything released to date.

I see you asked John and that was his PR reply.

There is possibly a scaling issue but I would have to look again at the limited spec white paper. Afair, the transaction needs to propagate to many nodes and they have to vote on locking it. This means the scaling to high transaction volumes is going to be quite limited, especially as the network of full nodes increases in number?


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 14, 2016, 12:15:51 AM
So whether or not a sybil attack is possible VNL'S Zerotime transaction still allows 10's of thousands of transactions per second while still being safer than every third party transfer system in the world....  just don't use the instant transfer for money exchange...  or at least wait the couple minutes for 1 confirm before handing money over for vnl to some unknown entity.

Still better than anything released to date.

I see you asked John and that was his PR reply.

There is possibly a scaling issue but I would have to look again at the limited spec white paper. Afair, the transaction needs to propagate to many nodes and they have to vote on locking it. This means the scaling to high transaction volumes is going to be quite limited, especially as the network of full nodes increases in number?

Don't be so tin hat.  I make my own opinions,and even if it's only thousands and not tens of thousands of tps,  it still out scales the current market demands by a 100x's  what is necessary.
Don't obfuscate the obviousness of this reality.

Hehe.

BTW the number of nodes needed to perform a lock is in the whitepaper, though the speed and quantity of total voted rounds that can be done by each full nodes is dependent on the resources surrounding the node in question.
How many transactions can be fulfilled by 300 nodes/second when X node votes are needed for them to lock the transaction as true.
I'm sure you can do the math on this.

Not much more difficult than finding out your typing speed of words/minute then multiplying by the average words per thread your In. Than figuring out how much time you spend coding compared to typing/day...

Sorry couldn't resist.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 14, 2016, 12:54:27 AM
Oh and another reason to choose vnl.
The 600%/year increase in value.  It moves up at a snails pace in comparison to pump and dumps, but due to the constant adaptation it still outperforms other investments over the long term.

And there I go with the hype again. 
Or is that FUD in crypto, I am unsure.  5k use will only make you 25k by 2017 if vnl keeps at this pace.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: I am the guy on February 14, 2016, 03:04:34 AM
In case anyone is curious to why the coin is called Vanillacoin.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vanilla_software 


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 15, 2016, 05:05:39 AM
Don't know if it was mentioned yet, but android/ios wallets and chain blender are also being tested right now.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: traumschiff on February 15, 2016, 12:45:59 PM
Good to see the 3 trolls repeating themselves with the same baseless accusations.  Market doesn't seem to care and every minute wasted from your lives is another smile on my face.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 15, 2016, 12:49:23 PM
Insiders buying from themselves:



How new Alts / Scamcoins steal your Bitcoins


It seems every day a new alt coin pops up. They are easy to make - most are just clones of coins
that were programmed by someone else and just given a new name, a few graphic tweaks, etc. to make it look new.
It doesn’t take much work - a new scam coin is born.   Most of the devs who create these coins have only one intention - to steal bitcoins from others.  This explains how they do it.  


First they clone an existing coin, make a few tweaks, make a website (which helps scam coins look legit) then they pre-mine a good amount of coins which they will dump later on.
After the coin is up and ready for launch it is  Announced on various sites - bitcointalk.org, reddit, etc.


They get the coin listed on an exchange or two and then deposit a portion of their pre-mine coins they already
have saved up. They may make a few Bitcoins after their coin gets listed, but this is not the way they
intend to get your Bitcoins.   They let their coin do whatever the market wants for a month or two, maybe try to hype it up a little thru various forums and trollboxes to help legitimize it.  They don’t want to pump it as soon as it gets listed on an exchange - this would be obviously suspicious.


Then the day comes where they decide to make their move. They start by buying up the orders on
the exchange(s) to start driving up the price to give the illusion that their coin is starting to take of.  This doesn’t cost them anything because they pre-mined the coins for free and the Bitcoins they are using to buy up the orders go back to them because they are buying the scamcoin from themselves anyways.  After us innocent, unsuspecting users see that this alt
is moving up a large percent is when we start putting our bitcoin orders in so we don’t miss out on this coin that seems to be really taking off.  As soon as enough orders are put in / coins are bought - when the scammer devs are happy with the amount of BTC they have acquired, they dump the rest of their pre-mined coins on the order book to buy
up any lower bitcoin orders still on the books.   Congratulations, you have just become a bag holder of a worthless scamcoin that is back to its previous price of next to nothing, the devs have conned you out of your bitcoins and will let their scam coin die to start working on their next scam.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: traumschiff on February 15, 2016, 01:03:20 PM

Irrelevant bullshit from a 50 year old lunatic nerd.


No clone.

No premine.

Features with original code.

On proper exchanges, like Poloniex, with the lowest possible deposit time thanks to their code audit.

Project is over 1 year old.

You have only proven 1 thing with this quote, that your health status is hurting your capability to use your brain.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 15, 2016, 01:09:07 PM
No premine.

Mined coins are premines. Users aren't mining. Most speculators here didn't mine.

Your "rabid dog" phases only kill the credibility or air of respectfulness that bitcoin carpenter was trying to create.

Project is over 1 year old.

And still no white paper with full specifications.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: traumschiff on February 15, 2016, 01:15:57 PM


Pointless to argue with you, Karma is doing it's work.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: shanem on February 15, 2016, 04:02:44 PM
Finally, this coin is starting to rise after being below 15k for a few months. Is this the start of a new rally or is this just used to dump onto people who buy?
I don't see any good news for this coin at the moment.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 15, 2016, 05:05:37 PM
Finally, this coin is starting to rise after being below 15k for a few months. Is this the start of a new rally or is this just used to dump onto people who buy?
I don't see any good news for this coin at the moment.

Well, you should check better:

   https://twitter.com/john_a_connor/status/699111244104470528

In less than 3 days start new PoW rewarding system

   https://github.com/john-connor/papers/blob/master/rewardv2.pdf

   https://talk.vanillacoin.net/topic/221/6-month-timeline/2


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: mathgal23 on February 15, 2016, 08:25:40 PM
Still no detailed white paper or credit for copied bitcoin code used in VNL.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 16, 2016, 12:03:31 AM
Still no detailed white paper or credit for copied bitcoin code used in VNL.

... well, yes, nothing you can find here, just old farts and well known 'copyright FUD squad' bashing vanilla with nonproven accusations,
... so just move on to your XMR/AEON threads, at least you feel better there.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: smooth on February 16, 2016, 01:09:33 AM
nonproven accusations,

There proof of the plagiarism (including copied bugs in what is allegedly new code) has been posted before, including by people that have nothing to do with any of these coins but see what is obvious instead of denying it.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: I am the guy on February 16, 2016, 02:04:20 AM
Here we go again like a broken record.  ::)


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: john-connor on February 16, 2016, 02:05:08 AM
How many hdd you guys have kill ? If only every one could easly run is own xmr wallet.
Fix your code xmr, fix the mem fix the hdd w/r. Let me know when my grandma or mom can use it.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CX61FHaUoAExVjG.jpg

Vanillacoin is nice because its very fast (zerotime 15k tx/sec), secure(whildpool encryption (nokia's algo)), fair distribution (no 51%, no abusive pool), simple to use and it fixed the node problem giving incentive to run one (it also help to get the nodes off the datacenters and have more of them in homes).
It has a mobiles wallets witch you can import the wallet.dat to any platform. He runs udp and tcp connections witch shows he know how networking works and its rare in cryptoland.

John is coding at least 6 days a week, hes invested$ and have no reason to fail.
I seen it all over the last year ! XMR fools never stopped bashing, i guess they feel the competition.
He delivers, help and inovate. He even helped peercoin and other coins pushing fix to help them.

Upcoming
-chainblender = anon sends/receive
-whisper = pc/mobile messaging and voip
-multi algo mining

White papers available here https://github.com/john-connor/papers (https://github.com/john-connor/papers)

The SSD HDD and on-board controller failed within 48 hours of that v2 block experiment. Now, thanks to Monero it must forever use an external USB drive. I warned the devs their database was writing 100's of times the data it is reading from the wire but they just trolled me. So to stay on topic, yes how about Vanilla? It's great with a < .5 GB blockchain after a year+. 8)


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: smooth on February 16, 2016, 02:17:48 AM
The SSD HDD and on-board controller failed within 48 hours of that v2 block experiment. Now, thanks to Monero it must forever use an external USB drive.

Interesting how not a single person other than john-connor has reported such a problem.

Draw your own conclusions. I find his credibility highly lacking, but decide for yourself.

Moreover, interesting how john-connor decided to try to change the subject.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: ray88 on February 16, 2016, 02:37:08 AM
this is pathetic lol


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: iCEBREAKER on February 16, 2016, 03:35:42 AM
The SSD HDD and on-board controller failed within 48 hours of that v2 block experiment. Now, thanks to Monero it must forever use an external USB drive.

Interesting how not a single person other than john-connor has reported such a problem.

Draw your own conclusions. I his credibility highly lacking, but decide for yourself.

Moreover, interesting how john-connor decided to try to change the subject.

Have you heard?  Did you know?  Monero destroys hard drives!

Is it true?   :o


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitworldfun on February 16, 2016, 03:54:50 AM
please everyone stay on topic.

this is a conversation about VNL, and whether or not one should consider it as a legitimate project. 

please try to keep shill, and FUD comments to a minimum.

I am so sick of ICEBREAKER, and his useless comments in urelated topics.  I am also sick of the retaliation comments to his bullshit pulling other threads discussions into every corner of bitcointalk.

stop this bullshit..

lets discuss the viability of lightning transfer networks.

If you are doing it in a theoretical space, please discuss the pros and cons of your research.

If you are doing it through beta release, please test and bughunt the project in beta.

lets discuss obfuscation of transactions.

how much anonymity is enough, is there a perfect solution.  how will it work with the general user?  Is what is out there useful as it is.

JUST PLESE STOP THROWING SHIT AROUND YOU ARE EMBARRASING YOURSELVES!!

this is bitcoincarpenter btw, just not on my comp and cant remember my password.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: smooth on February 16, 2016, 03:59:07 AM
please everyone stay on topic.

this is a conversation about VNL, and whether or not one should consider it as a legitimate project.  

please try to keep shill, and FUD comments to a minimum.

I am so sick of ICEBREAKER john-connor and ray88

FTFY, since iCEBREAKER was not the one who tried to change the subject and talk about another coin.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitworldfun on February 16, 2016, 04:26:49 AM
  this isnt just about the last ten posts, you know that.

please lets go back to being on topic.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 16, 2016, 08:13:30 AM
nonproven accusations,

There proof of the plagiarism (including copied bugs in what is allegedly new code) has been posted before, including by people that have nothing to do with any of these coins but see what is obvious instead of denying it.


Just as I said, nothing to see here except old, well known 'copyright FUD squad'
btw
I wasn't checking but I heard that Yocom-Piatt also said Decred is 'created from scratch'


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: iCEBREAKER on February 16, 2016, 08:29:14 AM
this is a conversation about VNL, and whether or not one should consider it as a legitimate project.  

I don't consider VNL a legitimate project, because the dev uses stolen (ie unattributed) BTC code and when caught refused to do the right thing.

Where is the peer-reviewed cryptanalysis proving VNL's security is solid?

Is there a bug bounty, so Shen may be rewarded if he deigns to he come over here and teach you why VNL is broken?

Or is VNL too hard for anyone but JC to work on, since only he knows how the code he stole was munged in order to obscure its origin?

Another illegitimate detail of VNC is the fact its [ANN] thread is not only self-moderated, but locked.  Talk about your North Korean sensor ships!   :P


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 16, 2016, 08:38:30 AM
Oh, what a creatures.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: smooth on February 16, 2016, 08:57:38 AM
nonproven accusations,

There proof of the plagiarism (including copied bugs in what is allegedly new code) has been posted before, including by people that have nothing to do with any of these coins but see what is obvious instead of denying it.


Just as I said, nothing to see here except old, well known 'copyright FUD squad'
btw
I wasn't checking but I heard that Yocom-Piatt also said Decred is 'created from scratch'

john-conner did not write the original code unless he is a secret identify for several of the well known BTC devs such as sipa (fat chance), from whom he ripped it off, unlike the Company Zero folks who built decred using the btcsuite/btcd codebase, which they also built.

Nor is there even the slightest effort to obscure those origins:

https://i.imgur.com/Kr7VK3N.png

Yet Another stupid deflection fail from the VNL shills


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 16, 2016, 09:05:49 AM
nonproven accusations,

There proof of the plagiarism (including copied bugs in what is allegedly new code) has been posted before, including by people that have nothing to do with any of these coins but see what is obvious instead of denying it.


Just as I said, nothing to see here except old, well known 'copyright FUD squad'
btw
I wasn't checking but I heard that Yocom-Piatt also said Decred is 'created from scratch'

john-conner did not write the original code unless he is a secret identify for several of the well known BTC devs such as sipa (fat chance), from whom he ripped it off, unlike the Company Zero folks who built decred using the btcd codebase, which they also built.

Another stupid deflection fail from the VNL shills


I don't know any john-conner, so I think it's you who stupidly deflecting from your work filled with flaws and deceptions.

btw I said I wasnt't checking, so reading comprehention is welcome, but yes, as always, you see and take only what you want.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: traumschiff on February 16, 2016, 09:31:09 AM


You know whats really stolen iCEBREAKER? The money from the HashFast investors thanks to you.

Shame that Monero has supporters like you going rampart on competitor threads while being the biggest scammer on this forum.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: traumschiff on February 16, 2016, 09:32:01 AM
The SSD HDD and on-board controller failed within 48 hours of that v2 block experiment. Now, thanks to Monero it must forever use an external USB drive.

Interesting how not a single person other than john-connor has reported such a problem.



And that is your argument on why there is no such problem? Very factual.

Keep calling yourself a Monero dev while contributing a few lines of code and wasting 99% of your time on this forum repeating yourself. Must be hard living with a repetitive compulsion.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: smooth on February 16, 2016, 10:03:52 AM
The SSD HDD and on-board controller failed within 48 hours of that v2 block experiment. Now, thanks to Monero it must forever use an external USB drive.

Interesting how not a single person other than john-connor has reported such a problem.



And that is your argument on why there is no such problem? Very factual.

There is no problem. john-conner doesn't understand how computers work.

Here are my laptop stats after a couple of days of ordinary use (no database, blockchain, or anything particularly disk-intensive)

https://i.imgur.com/aIVsRrt.png

Should I order a new SSD now or should I wait a few days for it to fail?

The stupidity of the VNL shills including the chief conner would be funny if it weren't so sad.




Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: traumschiff on February 16, 2016, 10:04:03 AM
Or is VNL too hard for anyone but JC

Seems yes, since he alone did almost 1/3 of the commits in numbers what the whole bitmonero github section has in way less time.

And considering that he releases features instead of bugfixes (like the famous Hydrogen Helix) that's not a bad statistic.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 16, 2016, 10:46:46 AM

The stupidity of the VNL shills including the chief conner would be funny if it weren't so sad.


The ability of reading comprehension and writing is essential for developers.
...for some frustrated dev wannabe it seems not so much.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 16, 2016, 10:58:56 AM

There is no problem. john-conner doesn't understand how computers work.


Mighty o mighty smooth please tell us how computer works.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: traumschiff on February 16, 2016, 11:04:53 AM

There is no problem. john-conner doesn't understand how computers work.


Mighty o mighty smooth please tell us how computer works.

He invented comput0rs with his BFF Eduardo Decastro. They still hang around bitcointalk threads together.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 16, 2016, 11:21:50 AM

There is no problem. john-conner doesn't understand how computers work.


Mighty o mighty smooth please tell us how computer works.

Do they work like you are thinking...
...or you think like when you drinking
...do you feel your brain is shrinking
...you don't even know you thinking
...thinking damage your brain cells
...you should think before you bells


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 16, 2016, 11:34:30 AM

There is no problem. john-conner doesn't understand how computers work.


Mighty o mighty smooth please tell us how computer works.

He invented comput0rs with his BFF Eduardo Decastro. They still hang around bitcointalk threads together.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_D3VFfhvs4
 ;)


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: generalizethis on February 16, 2016, 12:03:47 PM

There is no problem. john-conner doesn't understand how computers work.


Mighty o mighty smooth please tell us how computer works.

Mighty o mighty smooth please tell us how computer works.

Do they work like you are thinking...
...or you think like when you drinking
...do you feel your brain is shrinking
...you don't even know you thinking
...thinking damage your brain cells
...you should think before you bells


John Connor "invented" vanilla coin
which is original as the name
(he gave himself and the coin),
but most can see the code's the same
as another coin we've found
to be original and innovative
with a Dev who's well known
through the power his creation.
Now Connor's shills are betting stupid
people will buy their heavy bags
of fool's gold and overly vapid
arguments of jealous Devs--
Now Smooth stands a Terminator
to this wimpy-kid impersonator.



Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 16, 2016, 12:08:27 PM

There is no problem. john-conner doesn't understand how computers work.


Mighty o mighty smooth please tell us how computer works.

Mighty o mighty smooth please tell us how computer works.

Do they work like you are thinking...
...or you think like when you drinking
...do you feel your brain is shrinking
...you don't even know you thinking
...thinking damage your brain cells
...you should think before you bells


John Connor "invented" vanilla coin
which is original as the name
(he gave himself and the coin),
but most can see the code's the same
as another coin we've found
to be original and innovative
with a Dev who's well known
through the power his creation.
Now Connor's shills are betting stupid
people will buy their heavy bags
of fool's gold and overly vapid
arguments of jealous Devs--
Now Smooth stands a Terminator
to this wimpy-kid impersonator.



Well, try again, I know you can do better.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: generalizethis on February 16, 2016, 12:16:37 PM

There is no problem. john-conner doesn't understand how computers work.


Mighty o mighty smooth please tell us how computer works.

Mighty o mighty smooth please tell us how computer works.

Do they work like you are thinking...
...or you think like when you drinking
...do you feel your brain is shrinking
...you don't even know you thinking
...thinking damage your brain cells
...you should think before you bells


John Connor "invented" vanilla coin
which is original as the name
(he gave himself and the coin),
but most can see the code's the same
as another coin we've found
to be original and innovative
with a Dev who's well known
through the power his creation.
Now Connor's shills are betting stupid
people will buy their heavy bags
of fool's gold and overly vapid
arguments of jealous Devs--
Now Smooth stands a Terminator
to this wimpy-kid impersonator.





Well, try again, I know you can do better.

Oh I can, but the subject matter is pretty juvenile.

If it makes one non-vanilla shill laugh, mission accomplished.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 16, 2016, 12:23:23 PM

If it makes one non-vanilla shill laugh, mission accomplished.

Well, finally one thing I can agree with.

edit

btw, why are you guys so frustrated, aggressive and focused on what others do, are you feeling threatened or what?


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: hughbt on February 16, 2016, 02:10:33 PM
There is no point in arguing with those idiots since they have a clear conflict of interest and they'll say anything to harm the reputation of this project.
Up till now Poloniex is the only independent, trustful party which reviewed the code. They gave a positive opinion about it and allowed it to be the only 1conf coin besides bitcoin.


Who do you trust? People who are in danger of losing a lot of money if this project succeds or Poloniex who has nothing to gain(and actually can lose reputation and money by adding flawed cryptocurrency)? (Don't answer, it's a rhetorical question) This should really end this pointless discussion.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitworldfun on February 16, 2016, 04:10:04 PM
There is no point in arguing with those idiots since they have a clear conflict of interest and they'll say anything to harm the reputation of this project.
Up till now Poloniex is the only independent, trustful party which reviewed the code. They gave a positive opinion about it and allowed it to be the only 1conf coin besides bitcoin.


Who do you trust? People who are in danger of losing a lot of money if this project succeds or Poloniex who has nothing to gain(and actually can lose reputation and money by adding flawed cryptocurrency)? (Don't answer, it's a rhetorical question) This should really end this pointless discussion.

yep.  Once again another thread has devolved into circuitous uselessness of a few supporters vs the XMR ratpack...  thanks guys for reminding me that bitcointalk is no longer the place to discuss ideas.





Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: davedx on February 17, 2016, 06:41:24 AM
this is a conversation about VNL, and whether or not one should consider it as a legitimate project.  

I don't consider VNL a legitimate project, because the dev uses stolen (ie unattributed) BTC code and when caught refused to do the right thing.

Where is the peer-reviewed cryptanalysis proving VNL's security is solid?

Is there a bug bounty, so Shen may be rewarded if he deigns to he come over here and teach you why VNL is broken?

Or is VNL too hard for anyone but JC to work on, since only he knows how the code he stole was munged in order to obscure its origin?

Another illegitimate detail of VNC is the fact its [ANN] thread is not only self-moderated, but locked.  Talk about your North Korean sensor ships!   :P

An "illegitimate detail" is you can't stand people calling you a cunt. Cunt. ;)


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitworldfun on February 17, 2016, 08:00:24 AM
..... where do you fucking people come from?

I am starting to fully understand why John wanted to move to other forums rather than be here.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 17, 2016, 09:54:35 AM
..... where do you fucking people come from?

I am starting to fully understand why John wanted to move to other forums rather than be here.

What is it, hangover?
What did you expect here, decent conversation with XMR shills?
LOL


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 17, 2016, 06:15:48 PM
Yes.

Don't forget to join the conversation at vanillacoin.net to learn more about what is going on with vanillacoin


Help us make a coin and community worth spreading.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: jimlite on February 18, 2016, 03:31:47 AM
Hmm, I just don't get this. Do two people from the VNL team go to XMR everyday and FUD their threads? No one from VNL constantly bashes XMR for no reason.  Why are Icebreaker and Smooth the alt coin police? And even if they are the alt coin police, their are about 239 other alts that are complete shit clones from 12 year old copy paste "devs". So why not go bother them instead of an OBVIOUSLY competent dev such as John-Connor.  Maybe he doesn't do everything by the book or acknowledge anonymous invisible devs like Satoshi, but no one can say he hasn't pumped out more code and features than just about any dev. Just check his github.  VNL has a lot of potential in many areas to improve crypto. Why not just leave the guy alone already?  Bill Gates and Steve Jobs fought and annoyed the hell out of each other for years, but it still didn't change the fact that they BOTH changed computers and our lives forever. And didn't one of them "steal" icons or mouse from Xerox or IBM or some shit? Code is redundant in crypto, for some basic functions. If 99.99% of your code is original and 0.01% is the same as another coin, it is NOT ripped off.  I've seen video games like Mad Max which is 99.9% same code as Batman Arkham, yet no one is going ballistic over that.  Seriously drop this shit. I mean you are typing to me with 1's and 0's, stop ripping off 1's and 0's from Turing, credit him for inventing the computer every time you type Icebreaker.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: l8orre on February 18, 2016, 05:44:11 AM
Hmm, I just don't get this... their are about 239 other alts that are complete shit clones from 12 year old copy paste "devs". So why not go bother them instead of an OBVIOUSLY competent dev such as John-Connor.  

because they don't employ high volume pump groups for their premined and backdoor ridden flea bags like VNL does

Quote
Maybe he doesn't do everything by the book or acknowledge anonymous invisible devs like Satoshi, but no one can say he hasn't pumped out more code and features than just about any dev.

yes and maybe he also sits on a $hitload of premine to dump on suckers and morons like youself, but obviously you don't care because you like being shat upon  ;D
- or you are part of the pump group and hope you can scavenge a few crumbs, in which case I'd like to call you 'dungbeetle'

also, by insinuating that your boss is a greater coder than Satoshi because the latters identity is unknown just shows your stupidity

Quote
Just check his github.  VNL has a lot of potential in many areas to improve crypto. Why not just leave the guy alone already?  Bill Gates and Steve Jobs fought and annoyed the hell out of each other for years, but it still didn't change the fact that they BOTH changed computers and our lives forever.


no, your poster boy is not on par with those guys. and no, he is not a poor little feller that deserves to be left alone to continue his vile exercises in depravity,
because he is a thieving lying piece of $hit scumbag that is out to harm all crypto in order to enrich himself.

Quote
And didn't one of them "steal" icons or mouse from Xerox or IBM or some shit?


no, that is not an excuse to unleash premined and backdoor ridden fleabags onto the crypto market

Quote
Code is redundant in crypto, for some basic functions. If 99.99% of your code is original and 0.01% is the same as another coin, it is NOT ripped off.  I've seen video games like Mad Max which is 99.9% same code as Batman Arkham, yet no one is going ballistic over that.  Seriously drop this shit. I mean you are typing to me with 1's and 0's, stop ripping off 1's and 0's from Turing, credit him for inventing the computer every time you type Icebreaker.

CODE BEING 'FREE' COMES WITH THE RIGHT TO FREELY USE IT AND DISTRIBUTE IT AND HENCE ALSO EXPLICITLY WITH THE OBLIGATION TO  NOT STRIP OFF THE ATTRIBUTION AND USE A TOOL TO OBFUSCATE IT AND CLAIM THAT YOU INVENTED IT!
 

That's like stealing research results and publishing it under your name. And it also guarantees more nefarious behaviour - like premine and backdoors.



Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: jimlite on February 18, 2016, 06:00:54 AM
The coin and code has been out for over a year. There is no backdoor. Where is your proof for this claim? Most malware wallets are found and exposed within 5 minutes to a few hours after a new coin/wallet launches, NOT a year later. It has proven safe over the test of time so far. And I never said he was a better coder than Satoshi, but that he is certainly a better coder than the other 239 shit clones out there now. And I also don't know of any pump group that is involved with VNL, I surely am not in a pump group. But as with any coin I suppose their could be one, though the price is really quite stable unlike EXP or ETH which were surely pumped recently. There was also no premine, so you really need to get your facts straight.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: traumschiff on February 18, 2016, 07:42:25 AM

To answer your points:

- You claimed that VNL has a backdoor

Proof? Of course you have none.

- That VNL has hired pumpgroups

Every coin has pumpgroups working on it, no one hired them here, they work for their own good. Else if you have proof show it.


- That VNL is premined

I'm mining since the first minute and it's not. Blockchain is open for everyone to view.

- That VNL has stolen code

This was answered several times. 99.9% of the code is brand new and unique, the base code is derived from PPC while the network communication protocol is brand new and unique. Good luck with going to curt with this case.



To sum up your comments, it's 100% bullshit with no proof backing it up. Sadly people like you manage to pass the autism filter on this forum called "registration", it should really be hardened a bit.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 18, 2016, 08:09:31 AM
- That VNL is premined

I'm mining since the first minute and it's not

Thanks for confirming it is premined.

No adoption users are mining VNL. That will be the difference between all the coins that came before mine (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1364269.msg13879328#msg13879328).


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 18, 2016, 08:15:44 AM
- That VNL is premined

I'm mining since the first minute and it's not

Thanks for confirming it is premined.

No adoption users are mining VNL. That will be the difference between all the coins that came before mine.

I'm mining it and I didnt mine it from first minute so, what else do you 'know'.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: traumschiff on February 18, 2016, 08:15:59 AM
- That VNL is premined

I'm mining since the first minute and it's not

Thanks for confirming it is premined.

No adoption users are mining VNL. That will be the difference between all the coins that came before mine.

It's free to mine for everyone since the first minute.

Premine by definition is something that got mined in the genesis block by the developer for various purposes. The word is 100% used for this definition on this forum.

Stop being a monkey and go out running instead, it better for your health.

That will be the difference between all the coins that came before mine.

Another vaporware announcement (advertisement) brought to you by TPTB (just like in the past year, every month).


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 18, 2016, 08:26:15 AM
It's free to mine for everyone since the first minute.

Premine by definition is something that got mined in the genesis block by the developer for various purposes. The word is 100% used for this definition on this forum.

It is not being mined by the users, thus it will never be a decentralized coin with maximum network effects.

I am changing the definition to a more correct one.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: traumschiff on February 18, 2016, 08:31:34 AM
It's free to mine for everyone since the first minute.

Premine by definition is something that got mined in the genesis block by the developer for various purposes. The word is 100% used for this definition on this forum.

It is not being mined by the users, thus it will never be a decentralized coin with maximum network effects.

I am changing the definition to a more correct one.

You are not the authority that can change a word's definition which is used by thousands of people on this forum.

You can already pay for VPN and encrypted mail services with VNL and some users have already did so, meaning they just became end-users while being early miners.

You can twist this all you want in your delusional and sick brain (body), but it's pointless because no one cares.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: generalizethis on February 18, 2016, 08:33:44 AM
It's free to mine for everyone since the first minute.

Premine by definition is something that got mined in the genesis block by the developer for various purposes. The word is 100% used for this definition on this forum.

because no one cares.

I said caring....


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 18, 2016, 08:41:55 AM
It's free to mine for everyone since the first minute.

Premine by definition is something that got mined in the genesis block by the developer for various purposes. The word is 100% used for this definition on this forum.

It is not being mined by the users, thus it will never be a decentralized coin with maximum network effects.

I am changing the definition to a more correct one.

You are not the authority that can change a word's definition which is used by thousands of people on this forum.

But I am a creator who can change the definition which is used by millions of users.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: traumschiff on February 18, 2016, 08:46:07 AM
It's free to mine for everyone since the first minute.

Premine by definition is something that got mined in the genesis block by the developer for various purposes. The word is 100% used for this definition on this forum.

It is not being mined by the users, thus it will never be a decentralized coin with maximum network effects.

I am changing the definition to a more correct one.

You are not the authority that can change a word's definition which is used by thousands of people on this forum.

But I am a creator who can change the definition which is used by millions of users.

You are currently the creator of a cloud of vapor est. 2015.

Such a creator.

PS. I love how you avoid any answer that contradicts with your delusional statements. Living definition of an internet troll, even your IRL image would suit it with your health problems and lifestyle.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: l8orre on February 18, 2016, 09:07:50 AM


- That VNL has stolen code


This was answered several times. 99.9% of the code is brand new and unique, the base code is derived from PPC while the network communication protocol is brand new and unique. Good luck with going to curt with this case.



Thanks for admitting the obvious - Good for You!  ;D

Chicken Soup with only 10% Chicken $hit in it - YUMMIE! That looks just like you, doesn't it?
...
oops! Did my finger slip and make it only 90% Chicken Soup with 10% Chicken $hit? <YUK!>
ok, since I believe your finger may have slipped a bit too when you went for that magic 99.99999% number, let's strike a bargain: You get to eat your chicken soup with a staggering purity of 99% Chicken Soup, and only 1% Chicken $hit in it - YUMMIE!

Deal?!?!


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 18, 2016, 10:02:13 AM


- That VNL has stolen code

This was answered several times. 99.9% of the code is brand new and unique, the base code is derived from PPC while the network communication protocol is brand new and unique. Good luck with going to curt with this case.



Thanks for admitting the obvious - Good for You!  ;D

Chicken Soup with only 10% Chicken $hit in it - YUMMIE! That looks just like you, doesn't it?
...
oops! Did my finger slip and make it only 90% Chicken Soup with 10% Chicken $hit? <YUK!>
ok, since I believe your finger may have slipped a bit too when you went for that magic 99.99999% number, let's strike a bargain: You get to eat your chicken soup with a staggering purity of 99% Chicken Soup, and only 1% Chicken $hit in it - YUMMIE!

Deal?!?!

What, now we got some chef wannabe here comparing crypto with his famous recepies!?
LOL
Do you even know how to cook something?
Hmm deal!?
Oh, now I get it, you are just another gambler/loser who thinks he can make some $ with his pump/scam/fud/bluffs in crypto.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitworldfun on February 18, 2016, 03:43:11 PM
- That VNL is premined

I'm mining since the first minute and it's not


No adoption users are mining VNL.

I mine it and I have only been around for three months....  so yes there are adoption users mining it.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 18, 2016, 03:54:52 PM
- That VNL is premined

I'm mining since the first minute and it's not


No adoption users are mining VNL.

I mine it and I have only been around for three months....  so yes there are adoption users mining it.

You are not an adoption user by evidence of the fact that you claim you are mining, and not simply using it as a currency for daily activities.

People don't mine dollars, they just use them. Relatively few people invest in dollars (whereas most users simply adopt it as their permanent unit-of-account in their daily lives).

You are a miner (by your own admission) and ostensibly an investor.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 18, 2016, 04:29:18 PM
- That VNL is premined

I'm mining since the first minute and it's not


No adoption users are mining VNL.

I mine it and I have only been around for three months....  so yes there are adoption users mining it.

You are not an adoption user by evidence of the fact that you claim you are mining, and not simply using it as a currency for daily activities.

People don't mine dollars, they just use them. Relatively few people invest in dollars (whereas most users simply adopt it as their permanent unit-of-account in their daily lives).

You are a miner (by your own admission) and ostensibly an investor.

Ahh OK I see now, you think that all pow coins and the users that support the network through mining are essentially doing harm to the decentralized nature of their supported projects.

So what then? Air drops? IPO?
How does a project fairly distribute a coin without creating this problem.

Without the backing of a centralized authority there will always be this problem.

Coins don't become currency until distribution has reached a level where investors create the ecosystem where others can exchange goods for this coins in the place of a currency.

Bitcoin is still working on becoming this.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 18, 2016, 06:02:12 PM
Ahh OK I see now, you think that all pow coins and the users that support the network through mining are essentially doing harm to the decentralized nature of their supported projects.

So what then? Air drops? IPO?
How does a project fairly distribute a coin without creating this problem.

 :-X

Without the backing of a centralized authority there will always be this problem.

Coins don't become currency until distribution has reached a level where investors create the ecosystem where others can exchange goods for this coins in the place of a currency.

That is what you think.  ;)


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 18, 2016, 06:35:45 PM
Ahh OK I see now, you think that all pow coins and the users that support the network through mining are essentially doing harm to the decentralized nature of their supported projects.

So what then? Air drops? IPO?
How does a project fairly distribute a coin without creating this problem.

 :-X

Without the backing of a centralized authority there will always be this problem.

Coins don't become currency until distribution has reached a level where investors create the ecosystem where others can exchange goods for this coins in the place of a currency.

That is what you think.  ;)

Lay it on me brother...  how do you add worth to play money without centralized backing or without a mining system?


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: traumschiff on February 18, 2016, 07:09:23 PM
Ahh OK I see now, you think that all pow coins and the users that support the network through mining are essentially doing harm to the decentralized nature of their supported projects.

So what then? Air drops? IPO?
How does a project fairly distribute a coin without creating this problem.

 :-X

Without the backing of a centralized authority there will always be this problem.

Coins don't become currency until distribution has reached a level where investors create the ecosystem where others can exchange goods for this coins in the place of a currency.

That is what you think.  ;)

Lay it on me brother...  how do you add worth to play money without centralized backing or without a mining system?

Don't feed the troll, it is obvious that he has no answers just makes empty claims. You have seen that he avoids/fails to answer every single counter argument where he can't respond and simply quotes/answers single words/parts of a sentence which he in turn can attack or answer. This is the definition of an internet troll.

And to the type of question which you just asked (about a potential sollution to a problem with crypto in general) he will put an answer down pointing at his vaporware and vapor sollutions which are in works since more than a year.

Always the same, he has obvious mental issues.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: smooth on February 18, 2016, 09:05:56 PM
99.9% of the code is brand new and unique

Please knock yourself out trying to document anything close to that number because it doesn't fly. Already something in the neighborhood of 100s of lines of code have been specifically identified as copied and obfuscated. By inference the 99.9% number would put the size of the entire project at 100s of thousand of lines which is way off.

More likely very large portions of the code are copied, with the exception of the modifications for the new features, but it is extremely tedious to work out which ones, due to the obfuscation. I would make a large wager that it is nowhere near 99.9% however.

Again, there is nothing wrong with copying and adapting code. That is half the value of open source. The important observation here is not that code was reused, it is that VNL supporters continue to mislead about the scope and nature of the reused code, going all the way up to the top of course, but traumschiff just did it again.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 18, 2016, 11:42:49 PM
99.9% of the code is brand new and unique

Please knock yourself out trying to document anything close to that number because it doesn't fly. Already something in the neighborhood of 100s of lines of code have been specifically identified as copied and obfuscated. By inference the 99.9% number would put the size of the entire project at 100s of thousand of lines which is way off.

More likely very large portions of the code are copied, with the exception of the modifications for the new features, but it is extremely tedious to work out which ones, due to the obfuscation. I would make a large wager that it is nowhere near 99.9% however.

Again, there is nothing wrong with copying and adapting code. That is half the value of open source. The important observation here is not that code was reused, it is that VNL supporters continue to mislead about the scope and nature of the reused code, going all the way up to the top of course, but traumschiff just did it again.

To me, it's not even that - oftentimes supporters deny it completely. I actually think there's some cool stuff in this coin - just admit the dev is kind of an asshole for violating the license and I'm happy.

If I remember right from your reply to smooth big red leter post about john-connor in xmr thread for which you adviced him to delete it you said that dev is kind of narcissistic dictator.
Are you still feeling rekt for last year one stop ban you got from john-connor after your 'show' in vanilla IRC?


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: ray88 on February 19, 2016, 12:11:35 AM
99.9% of the code is brand new and unique

Please knock yourself out trying to document anything close to that number because it doesn't fly. Already something in the neighborhood of 100s of lines of code have been specifically identified as copied and obfuscated. By inference the 99.9% number would put the size of the entire project at 100s of thousand of lines which is way off.

More likely very large portions of the code are copied, with the exception of the modifications for the new features, but it is extremely tedious to work out which ones, due to the obfuscation. I would make a large wager that it is nowhere near 99.9% however.

Again, there is nothing wrong with copying and adapting code. That is half the value of open source. The important observation here is not that code was reused, it is that VNL supporters continue to mislead about the scope and nature of the reused code, going all the way up to the top of course, but traumschiff just did it again.

To me, it's not even that - oftentimes supporters deny it completely. I actually think there's some cool stuff in this coin - just admit the dev is kind of an asshole for violating the license and I'm happy.

If I remember right from your reply to smooth big red leter post about john-connor in xmr thread for which you adviced him to delete it you said that dev is kind of narcissistic dictator.
Are you still feeling rekt for last year one stop ban you got from john-connor after your 'show' in vanilla IRC?

Was that the drive by ban haha that was epic i will never forget


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 19, 2016, 12:37:22 AM
Ahh OK I see now, you think that all pow coins and the users that support the network through mining are essentially doing harm to the decentralized nature of their supported projects.

So what then? Air drops? IPO?
How does a project fairly distribute a coin without creating this problem.

 :-X

Without the backing of a centralized authority there will always be this problem.

Coins don't become currency until distribution has reached a level where investors create the ecosystem where others can exchange goods for this coins in the place of a currency.

That is what you think.  ;)

Lay it on me brother...  how do you add worth to play money without centralized backing or without a mining system?

Don't feed the troll, it is obvious that he has no answers just makes empty claims. You have seen that he avoids/fails to answer every single counter argument where he can't respond and simply quotes/answers single words/parts of a sentence which he in turn can attack or answer. This is the definition of an internet troll.

And to the type of question which you just asked (about a potential sollution to a problem with crypto in general) he will put an answer down pointing at his vaporware and vapor sollutions which are in works since more than a year.

Always the same, he has obvious mental issues.

I love it when people doubt me. I get the last laugh.

 :-X = my secret


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: cryptohunter2 on February 19, 2016, 01:10:09 AM
99.9% of the code is brand new and unique

Please knock yourself out trying to document anything close to that number because it doesn't fly. Already something in the neighborhood of 100s of lines of code have been specifically identified as copied and obfuscated. By inference the 99.9% number would put the size of the entire project at 100s of thousand of lines which is way off.

More likely very large portions of the code are copied, with the exception of the modifications for the new features, but it is extremely tedious to work out which ones, due to the obfuscation. I would make a large wager that it is nowhere near 99.9% however.

Again, there is nothing wrong with copying and adapting code. That is half the value of open source. The important observation here is not that code was reused, it is that VNL supporters continue to mislead about the scope and nature of the reused code, going all the way up to the top of course, but traumschiff just did it again.

Can I know the ability of this coder in your opinion aside from the fact he is not giving due credit to the original creators of some of the code he is using?

Are any of his features worth while and different? could any of these be of value?
Are they going to be easy for other coders to replicate?


------------------------------------
questions below directed at nobody singularly.

This is one coin that slipped past me... didn't mine it at all.

How was the initial distribution.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: smooth on February 19, 2016, 01:18:44 AM
99.9% of the code is brand new and unique

Please knock yourself out trying to document anything close to that number because it doesn't fly. Already something in the neighborhood of 100s of lines of code have been specifically identified as copied and obfuscated. By inference the 99.9% number would put the size of the entire project at 100s of thousand of lines which is way off.

More likely very large portions of the code are copied, with the exception of the modifications for the new features, but it is extremely tedious to work out which ones, due to the obfuscation. I would make a large wager that it is nowhere near 99.9% however.

Again, there is nothing wrong with copying and adapting code. That is half the value of open source. The important observation here is not that code was reused, it is that VNL supporters continue to mislead about the scope and nature of the reused code, going all the way up to the top of course, but traumschiff just did it again.

Can I know the ability of this coder in your opinion aside from the fact he is not giving due credit to the original creators of some of the code he is using?

Are any of his features worth while and different? could any of these be of value?
Are they going to be easy for other coders to replicate?

I haven't reviewed his code, and the obfuscation makes it hard for anyone to tell which parts are his code and which are not. The features as claimed seem worthwhile. TPTB says that his instant transaction feature is not really secure, and I don't doubt it (certainly it is true that his white papers are not detailed enough to review without digging through code). But used with caution, as with other "instant" transactions it seems potentially useful anyway.

I don't consider most of the other features particularly significant.






Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: cryptohunter2 on February 19, 2016, 02:06:23 AM
99.9% of the code is brand new and unique

Please knock yourself out trying to document anything close to that number because it doesn't fly. Already something in the neighborhood of 100s of lines of code have been specifically identified as copied and obfuscated. By inference the 99.9% number would put the size of the entire project at 100s of thousand of lines which is way off.

More likely very large portions of the code are copied, with the exception of the modifications for the new features, but it is extremely tedious to work out which ones, due to the obfuscation. I would make a large wager that it is nowhere near 99.9% however.

Again, there is nothing wrong with copying and adapting code. That is half the value of open source. The important observation here is not that code was reused, it is that VNL supporters continue to mislead about the scope and nature of the reused code, going all the way up to the top of course, but traumschiff just did it again.

Can I know the ability of this coder in your opinion aside from the fact he is not giving due credit to the original creators of some of the code he is using?

Are any of his features worth while and different? could any of these be of value?
Are they going to be easy for other coders to replicate?

I haven't reviewed his code, and the obfuscation makes it hard for anyone to tell which parts are his code and which are not. The features as claimed seem worthwhile. TPTB says that his instant transaction feature is not really secure, and I don't doubt it (certainly it is true that his white papers are not detailed enough to review without digging through code). But used with caution, as with other "instant" transactions it seems potentially useful anyway.

I don't consider most of the other features particularly significant.






Thanks a lot for the answer.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: hughbt on February 19, 2016, 09:17:35 AM
He really asked smooth if John is a good coder. This is ridiculous.  :(

Quote from: smooth
I haven't reviewed his code

LOL  :D


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 19, 2016, 10:28:44 AM
He really asked smooth if John is a good coder. This is ridiculous.  :(

Quote from: smooth
I haven't reviewed his code

LOL  :D

As john-connor would say, "go read the code"


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitworldfun on February 19, 2016, 02:32:12 PM
In many ways Vanillacoin has become a testpot for a lot if not all the features people have been asking for Bitcoin to implement.  whether that is significant or not is up to each person to decide.

but being that bitcoin is having an impossible time adding something as simple as scalable blocksize, and a lightning network without handing dev control to a group of heavilly invested entrepreneurs. VNL is a great project to see how these things can work in Real time and to test out the problems(if any) with them.

If it turns out that lightning networks/zerotime can work without to much risk,(please read up on sybil attacks), or if the mixer can be shown to run anonymously, quickly, and without bloat issues, then I will consider VNL as a frontrunner in the altcoin space.

If some of these things lend up being mathematically flawed, than at least it is another testing grounds for developers like John-connor to fix and grow from.

basically VNL by having these features has proved it isnt vaporware like so many other projects, but has not proved mathematically that it isnt flawed.... of course there is no such thing as 100% anonymity in crypography, and there is probably no such thing as an impossible double spend in a zerotime transaction, but if they work well enough to allow me to use them without worries of being cheated, I am happy.



Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: l8orre on February 19, 2016, 02:39:37 PM


As john-connor would say, "go read the code"


suuuuuuure! Which exactly were the stolen parts?  ;D
#!/usr/bin/perl -w
use strict;
    my
     @d;
    my$__                                        #
    = ':';                          my            #
     $___ =18                     ;for(          'a'
         ..'d'                   ){ push           #
          @d,$_                   .$__.       $___;$___
          ++;}$___               +=5;for('e'..'i'){push
          @d,$_.$__            .$___ ;$___+=6;}$___='';
            for(1..3)  {    $___.=$_}push@d,'j'.$__.$___
           ;$___='';  for( 1..9){$___.=$_ unless(($_-1)%4
          );     }push@d,'k'.$__.$___;$___='';  for('a'..
               'am'){$___.=$_;}push@d,'l'.$__. length($___
                  );$___=length($___)+36;push    @d,'m' .
                $__.$___;$___*=2;$___-=16;push   @d,'n' .
                  $__.$___;$___+=36;for('o'..   's'){push
                  @d,$_.$__.$___;$___+=7;}push    @d,'W'.
                    $__ .$___;my@__;$___='';      while(
                      <DATA>){chomp;s/\s//g;     $___.=$_;
                         }push@d,split/\//,      $___;my$m;
                           foreach(@d){if(     m/^(\w):(.*)$/
                          ){$m->{$1}="\033".    '[48;5;'.
                          $2."m \033[0m";}        else{
                          s/S/ /g;my$_oO_;
                          while((s/^(\d+)(.)//))
                          {$_oO_       .=$2
                         x$1}$_oO_    .=$_;$_=
                         $_oO_;$_.=   #########
                         reverse$_;   s/(\w)/$m->{$1}/g;
                        print;print     "\n";}}####
__DATA__
                         22S18         a/18S22b/16S24c
                     /14a2S21d3S/       14b2S13e11S/14c
                    3S17f6S/1S13d       3S17g6S/1S13e3S2
                    1h2S/1S6f3S5f5      S20i/2S5g5S6g6S1
                    6j/2S7h5S7h5S1      4k/2S9i5S8i5S11W/3
                   S4j2S5j4S10j4S8      W/3S4k4S5k4S9k6S5W/
                  3S4W6S5W5S6W9S2W      /3S6W6S5W5S4W3S2W6S/
                4S7W6S5W5S3W2S4W4S       /4S9W7S4W3S3W3S5W2S/
               4S 12W6S8W3S6W1S/6S       12W7S6W2S7W/8S13W6S4
              W3S6W/3S3W6S1W10l5S2        l1W3S1W5l/3S1W2l 2W
               5S2W16l1W2S1W5l/3S2        W3l2W5S3W13l1W3S
              1W4l/4S1W5m2W6S14W3S        1W4m/4S1W7m2W21S1W
               4m/4S1W8m1W21S1W4m/         5S1W7n1W21S1W4n/6S1W
               6n1W16S3W3S1W3n/6S1         W7n4W10S2W2n1W3S1W3n/
             6S1W11o4W3S3W4o1W3S1W         3o/6S1W14o1W2S1W7o1W3
            S1W3o/6S1W14o1W2S1W7o1         W3S1W3o/6S1W14p1W2S1W7
           p1W3S1W3p/7S1W13p1W2S1W          7p1W3S1W3p/7S1W13p1W2
          S1W7p1W3S1W3p/7S1W13q1W2S         1W7q1W3S4W/7S1W13q1W2
          S1W7q1W7S/7S1W13q1W2S1W7q         8W/7S2W12q1W2S1W15q/9
         S1W11r1W2S1W15r/10S1W10r            1W2S1W8r7W/11S1W9r1W2
       S1W7r1W7S/12S4W5s1W2S1W5s2W           2S6W/16S2W3s1W2S1W4s1
      W3S1W6q/18S4W2S1W4s1W2S1W7r            /24S5W2S1W8s/24S5W2S9W
     /26S2W3S9W/


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: traumschiff on February 19, 2016, 04:16:21 PM
There are two markets for crypto currency.

1. Selling features to speculators. Never mind if these features ever get used by millions of people, because none of these altcoins are ever going to attain that.

2. Attaining millions of users.

So far, no one has done #2. I intend to do #2.

As for #1, "John" (who is this anonymous person?) hasn't given us one complete white paper yet. So therefor he is being attacked (bcz the speculation market is all about perception), and rightfully so.

If he was all about implementation, then he would have a plan for #2. As I claim I do ( :-X = secret).

Right, as you claim you do. So... who are you to attack someone else when you're standing on weak ground yourself?

You entirely missed the point. Try reading again. Hint: #1 is where John is playing and #2 is where I am playing thus I am immune to foruming attacks. In #1, perception is what drives speculation.

Yeah, read Wolf0 again, you claim you are #2 and you are doing that since atleast a year on this forum.

But, hey, atleast you are giving people fun times while they laugh at you.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: traumschiff on February 19, 2016, 05:42:26 PM
There are two markets for crypto currency.

1. Selling features to speculators. Never mind if these features ever get used by millions of people, because none of these altcoins are ever going to attain that.

2. Attaining millions of users.

So far, no one has done #2. I intend to do #2.

As for #1, "John" (who is this anonymous person?) hasn't given us one complete white paper yet. So therefor he is being attacked (bcz the speculation market is all about perception), and rightfully so.

If he was all about implementation, then he would have a plan for #2. As I claim I do ( :-X = secret).

Right, as you claim you do. So... who are you to attack someone else when you're standing on weak ground yourself?

You entirely missed the point. Try reading again. Hint: #1 is where John is playing and #2 is where I am playing thus I am immune to foruming attacks. In #1, perception is what drives speculation.

No, I saw your point clearly. My point is that it's invalid without supporting evidence, of which you provide none. A premise backed by nothing isn't even worthy of consideration - it is simply hot air. Meaning from where I'm sitting, John has actually showed more in results than you have thus far. Trying to call him out for what he's doing with his coin while claiming to know better ways of doing it - yet having nothing real to show - only makes you look like an idiot.

This isn't poker, bluffing gets you nowhere.

You can't even comprehend that whether I am succeeding in #2 (or not), is irrelevant to the point that John is playing his game in #1 and thus is subject to the fact that perception is what drives results in #1. It has nothing to do with me. Duh!

I'm stupid for not accepting your outlandish claims that you're succeeding in #2 - as of yet, you've shown proof of nothing. Okay, let's go with that.

It's relevant because your premise that John is playing the game you describe in #1 has supporting arguments that depend on previous attacks against what he's doing with his coin - and those attacks include the claim that you can solve what you see to be issues, while providing no evidence for this. Now that I've explicitly laid out the dependencies your main attack has, you should see quite simply how you're simply building atop bullshit that doesn't hold water (that is, your claims) and because of this, the entire argument falls apart.

Do we need to get out the crayons?

Well those with sufficient brain stem can see you still haven't gotten the point. Have fun with your crayons. I with not respond again to this retard.

http://www.troll.me/images/dawson-crying/you-mad.jpg


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 19, 2016, 05:44:39 PM
There are two markets for crypto currency.

1. Selling features to speculators. Never mind if these features ever get used by millions of people, because none of these altcoins are ever going to attain that.

2. Attaining millions of users.

So far, no one has done #2. I intend to do #2.

As for #1, "John" (who is this anonymous person?) hasn't given us one complete white paper yet. So therefor he is being attacked (bcz the speculation market is all about perception), and rightfully so.

If he was all about implementation, then he would have a plan for #2. As I claim I do ( :-X = secret).

Right, as you claim you do. So... who are you to attack someone else when you're standing on weak ground yourself?

You entirely missed the point. Try reading again. Hint: #1 is where John is playing and #2 is where I am playing thus I am immune to foruming attacks. In #1, perception is what drives speculation.

No, I saw your point clearly. My point is that it's invalid without supporting evidence, of which you provide none. A premise backed by nothing isn't even worthy of consideration - it is simply hot air. Meaning from where I'm sitting, John has actually showed more in results than you have thus far. Trying to call him out for what he's doing with his coin while claiming to know better ways of doing it - yet having nothing real to show - only makes you look like an idiot.

This isn't poker, bluffing gets you nowhere.

You can't even comprehend that whether I am succeeding in #2 (or not), is irrelevant to the point that John is playing his game in #1 and thus is subject to the fact that perception is what drives results in #1. It has nothing to do with me. Duh!

I'm stupid for not accepting your outlandish claims that you're succeeding in #2 - as of yet, you've shown proof of nothing. Okay, let's go with that.

It's relevant because your premise that John is playing the game you describe in #1 has supporting arguments that depend on previous attacks against what he's doing with his coin - and those attacks include the claim that you can solve what you see to be issues, while providing no evidence for this. Now that I've explicitly laid out the dependencies your main attack has, you should see quite simply how you're simply building atop bullshit that doesn't hold water (that is, your claims) and because of this, the entire argument falls apart.

Do we need to get out the crayons?

Well those with sufficient brain stem can see you still haven't gotten the point. Have fun with your crayons. I with not respond again to this retard.

Well,
go rest on your couch, if you have one, I know you are sad and angry that may happen that you wont live enough to see detailed white paper from John but...
..but please, it seems you are not quite well, sit and rest and drift away think about specs and distribution of your ImagoCoin in your dream land.
I hope you’ll feel better.
  


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 19, 2016, 05:45:22 PM
There are two markets for crypto currency.

1. Selling features to speculators. Never mind if these features ever get used by millions of people, because none of these altcoins are ever going to attain that.

2. Attaining millions of users.

So far, no one has done #2. I intend to do #2.

As for #1, "John" (who is this anonymous person?) hasn't given us one complete white paper yet. So therefor he is being attacked (bcz the speculation market is all about perception), and rightfully so.

If he was all about implementation, then he would have a plan for #2. As I claim I do ( :-X = secret).


Right, as you claim you do. So... who are you to attack someone else when you're standing on weak ground yourself?

You entirely missed the point. Try reading again. Hint: #1 is where John is playing and #2 is where I am playing thus I am immune to foruming attacks. In #1, perception is what drives speculation.

No, I saw your point clearly. My point is that it's invalid without supporting evidence, of which you provide none. A premise backed by nothing isn't even worthy of consideration - it is simply hot air. Meaning from where I'm sitting, John has actually showed more in results than you have thus far. Trying to call him out for what he's doing with his coin while claiming to know better ways of doing it - yet having nothing real to show - only makes you look like an idiot.

This isn't poker, bluffing gets you nowhere.

You can't even comprehend that whether I am succeeding in #2 (or not), is irrelevant to the point that John is playing his game in #1 and thus is subject to the fact that perception is what drives results in #1. It has nothing to do with me. Duh!

I'm stupid for not accepting your outlandish claims that you're succeeding in #2 - as of yet, you've shown proof of nothing. Okay, let's go with that.

It's relevant because your premise that John is playing the game you describe in #1 has supporting arguments that depend on previous attacks against what he's doing with his coin - and those attacks include the claim that you can solve what you see to be issues, while providing no evidence for this. Now that I've explicitly laid out the dependencies your main attack has, you should see quite simply how you're simply building atop bullshit that doesn't hold water (that is, your claims) and because of this, the entire argument falls apart.

Do we need to get out the crayons?

Well those with sufficient brain stem can see you still haven't gotten the point. Have fun with your crayons. I with not respond again to this retard.

http://www.troll.me/images/dawson-crying/you-mad.jpg

Lol. Of course not, I am laughing at you. I will not respond again to this second retard who can't seem to comprehend I have no reason to be mad because I was correct and it is hilarious that the supporters of VNL confirm their very low IQs and thus providing evidence as to why they are easily manipulated by their "John".


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 19, 2016, 05:46:31 PM


As john-connor would say, "go read the code"

suuuuuuure! Which exactly were the stolen parts?  ;D


Well that question show how much exactly you know, so..
If you have some questions you should probably ask your copyright FUD squad friends...

or

Go read the code, I wonder if you can
Than read the code again, and try to understand
What your FUD pals don't want you to know is
...that Vanilla is the only way to go.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: adhitthana on February 20, 2016, 12:47:58 AM
Vanilla uses code stolen from Bitcoin, and the scam dev refused to do the right thing when gmaxwell, etc asked him to fix the lack of proper attribution, as required per the software license.

So did GMaxwell copyright some code he added to the original Bitcoin code?


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: cryptohunter2 on February 20, 2016, 01:41:14 AM
He really asked smooth if John is a good coder. This is ridiculous.  :(

Quote from: smooth
I haven't reviewed his code

LOL  :D

What's ridiculous about it? G maxwell said in his comments (for exact words look up the thread ...) he sees the work of a general coder not someone with specific talents in the field of decentralized crypto currency? I was merely asking a reasonable person who is know to work in that field for a 2nd opinion.

I have a few VNL i was wondering if I should get a bit more or just put the rest into a different project. I was also asking about initial distribution because I don't like coins where there was a huge instamine or premine.

Question are not allowed?

Are you in a position personally to make in depth evaluation of his design and coding skills? if so you are probably in the minority.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: Riseman on February 20, 2016, 02:04:59 AM
Finally, this coin is starting to rise after being below 15k for a few months. Is this the start of a new rally or is this just used to dump onto people who buy?
I don't see any good news for this coin at the moment.

The good news should come soon if the 6-month timeline won't become a 12-month timeline.

I've been watching the VNL market quite closely during the past 2 months and I'm sure these spikes were just speculative pumps. I saw that guy moving his walls, "drawing" the chart with them and then dumping his coins while trying not to crash the market. After each spike he "releases" the market for some time and the daily volume drops to its usual 4-6 BTC. What is he up to in the end I don't know.

Actually I don't get it. There seems to be something really wrong with how this coin is traded. It's as if no one is interested and there is no activity apart from those fake rises and daily 4-6 BTC dumps (when only about 3 BTC worth of coins is mined daily). It's not just another shitcoin but it is surely traded like one.

Maybe it has already depleted it's "pump capacity" for the first couple of years after the launch and no one wants to take a risk. I mean not only to pump but also to invest big time and cause a natural growth.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 20, 2016, 02:16:27 AM
I am glancing at John's (VNL's) code now. I notice he likes to put the opening brace on the next line, which wastes vertical space (expert programmers like to maximize the LOC they can view without scrolling). And he places a redundant 'break;' after 'default;' (https://github.com/john-connor/vanillacoin/blob/master/src/address.cpp#L178) but this is form of protecting against future human error code edits. This sort of unnecessary structuralization of code is meaningful to junior programmers who think it works some kind of magic.

He is not at all using functional programming (https://github.com/john-connor/vanillacoin/blob/master/src/address_manager.cpp#L86) and instead creating procedures (i.e. have side-effects) which is known to produce spaghetti code (brittle code).

He sure loves to waste vertical space and make it appear his code has more LOC than it does! 3 line comments for 3 words (https://github.com/john-connor/vanillacoin/blob/master/src/address_manager.cpp#L137). Makes me think he gets confused quickly if code is dense.

Throwing exceptions (https://github.com/john-connor/vanillacoin/blob/master/src/address_manager.cpp#L448) puts the program in a state of indeterminism!

Quote from: myself
Catching an exception puts the program in a random state, because it is bypasses deterministic static typing of invariants. By definition of determinism, in every case where the is a determinstic state to bubble an exceptional condition to, i.e. to deterministically recover from an exceptional condition, this bubbling can be accomplished statically at compile-time. It is another way of saying that halting the program when it is in an non-deterministic state, is "given more eyeballs, all bugs are shallow".

The type of bugs that deterministically bubble coherently at compile-time, are those that are not semantic logic errors in the programmer's type design. Semantic logic errors means the program is by design in an incoherent, random state (that thus must be halted). Thus semantic logic errors that randomly trip on an exception, should be handled the same as bugs which deterministically bubble at compile-time and trip on an exception. Halting the program may be restarting the program from (i.e. rewinding to) a historic copy of coherent state, and/or reporting into a debugger.

There was a long fruitful discussion (http://phlegmaticprogrammer.wordpress.com/2011/01/15/how-to-think-about-parallel-programming-not/#comment-99) that illuminated the above concepts. Consider the following example, which asserts the invariants of the function (f) at compile-time, i.e. the function's invariants are statically typed and the throw (i.e. halt) is provably bubbled outside of the function at compile-time.

class NonZeroDiff
{
   a, b // also these might be declared to be read only outside the new() constructor
   new( a : Int, b : Int )
   {
      if (a – b == 0) throw "Unexpected inputs"
      this.a = a
      this.b = b
   }
}

function f( ab : NonZeroDiff )
{
   return (ab.a * ab.b) / (ab.a – ab.b)
}

result = f( new NonZeroDiff( 2, 1 ) )


Compare the above, to the following example, which asserts the invariants of the function (f) at run-time, i.e. the function's invariant type is dynamically typed. The inputs to the function (f) are statically typed Int, but the invariants a - b != 0 is not asserted by Int inputs, and instead the throw (i.e. halt) is inside the function at compile-time and can only bubble at run-time.

function f( a : Int, b : Int )
{
   // could instead be thrown by the / operator
   if (a – b == 0) throw "Unexpected inputs"
   return (a * b) / (a – b)
}

result = f( 2, 1 )


The fundamental conclusion is that in dynamic typing, the throw check is inside the function (f) being reused, and in static typing the check is outside the function, in the type of the invariants specified by the function’s type. Thus in the dynamic-typing case, the function inherently bind's its internal check in a futures contract to the universe of possible external code (because the external code is not forced by the compiler, to do a throw check itself), i.e. tries to in vain to define the limit of the external universe. Whereas, in the static-typing case, the external code is forced to check for itself, in order to comply with the compile-time checked invariants of the function.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 20, 2016, 02:52:41 AM
https://github.com/john-connor/papers/blob/master/chainblender.pdf

Sorry it can be jammed and/or Sybil attacked. Else it must use trusted relays (a la Dash masternodes), which means one need only control or infiltrate these trusted relays to deanonymize.

Sorry Cryptonote and Zcash are end-to-end principled anonymity, not this BS of putting the anonymity in the network. And Zcash does it correctly by making the meta-data such as IP address irrelevant.

Chainblender needs to split into denominations same as for Cryptonote, which Monero is eliminating with RingCT. Zcash/Zerocash never had this problem.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 20, 2016, 08:22:16 AM
He really asked smooth if John is a good coder. This is ridiculous.  :(

Quote from: smooth
I haven't reviewed his code

LOL  :D

What's ridiculous about it? G maxwell said in his comments (for exact words look up the thread ...) he sees the work of a general coder not someone with specific talents in the field of decentralized crypto currency? I was merely asking a reasonable person who is know to work in that field for a 2nd opinion.

I have a few VNL i was wondering if I should get a bit more or just put the rest into a different project. I was also asking about initial distribution because I don't like coins where there was a huge instamine or premine.

Question are not allowed?

Are you in a position personally to make in depth evaluation of his design and coding skills? if so you are probably in the minority.


What is ridiculous?
Well, it's like you ask Opel car salesman whether Audi is better car and he says, look I never drove the Audi but I think not.
Regarding G maxwell, he speaks about john-connor as 'general coder', but hey that general coder made ZeroTime while G maxwell even with raised $55 Mil can't explain how should Lightning Network work. So, if he can't explain how the hell he will make it.
If you have VNL and not only have them on exchange you should already know what is all about.
Initial distribution, about that you can hear stories and as far as I know and I mine VNL from almost beginning is that john-connor was always in fight with those who were looking for ways to instamine or rape the coin through mining, but than again after a year on exchanges that question becomes irrelevant.
Questions are welcome.
Everyone is in position to read the code, can one evaluate it is other thing but commenting code while claiming you read none is just BS.    


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 20, 2016, 08:44:06 AM
I am glancing at John's (VNL's) code now. I notice he likes to put the opening brace on the next line, which wastes vertical space (expert programmers like to maximize the LOC they can view without scrolling). And he places a redundant 'break;' after 'default;' (https://github.com/john-connor/vanillacoin/blob/master/src/address.cpp#L178) but this is form of protecting against future human error code edits. This sort of unnecessary structuralization of code is meaningful to junior programmers who think it works some kind of magic.

He is not at all using functional programming (https://github.com/john-connor/vanillacoin/blob/master/src/address_manager.cpp#L86) and instead creating procedures (i.e. have side-effects) which is known to produce spaghetti code (brittle code).

He sure loves to waste vertical space and make it appear his code has more LOC than it does! 3 line comments for 3 words (https://github.com/john-connor/vanillacoin/blob/master/src/address_manager.cpp#L137). Makes me think he gets confused quickly if code is dense.

Throwing exceptions (https://github.com/john-connor/vanillacoin/blob/master/src/address_manager.cpp#L448) puts the program in a state of indeterminism!

Quote from: myself
Catching an exception puts the program in a random state, because it is bypasses deterministic static typing of invariants. By definition of determinism, in every case where the is a determinstic state to bubble an exceptional condition to, i.e. to deterministically recover from an exceptional condition, this bubbling can be accomplished statically at compile-time. It is another way of saying that halting the program when it is in an non-deterministic state, is "given more eyeballs, all bugs are shallow".

The type of bugs that deterministically bubble coherently at compile-time, are those that are not semantic logic errors in the programmer's type design. Semantic logic errors means the program is by design in an incoherent, random state (that thus must be halted). Thus semantic logic errors that randomly trip on an exception, should be handled the same as bugs which deterministically bubble at compile-time and trip on an exception. Halting the program may be restarting the program from (i.e. rewinding to) a historic copy of coherent state, and/or reporting into a debugger.

There was a long fruitful discussion (http://phlegmaticprogrammer.wordpress.com/2011/01/15/how-to-think-about-parallel-programming-not/#comment-99) that illuminated the above concepts. Consider the following example, which asserts the invariants of the function (f) at compile-time, i.e. the function's invariants are statically typed and the throw (i.e. halt) is provably bubbled outside of the function at compile-time.

class NonZeroDiff
{
   a, b // also these might be declared to be read only outside the new() constructor
   new( a : Int, b : Int )
   {
      if (a – b == 0) throw "Unexpected inputs"
      this.a = a
      this.b = b
   }
}

function f( ab : NonZeroDiff )
{
   return (ab.a * ab.b) / (ab.a – ab.b)
}

result = f( new NonZeroDiff( 2, 1 ) )


Compare the above, to the following example, which asserts the invariants of the function (f) at run-time, i.e. the function's invariant type is dynamically typed. The inputs to the function (f) are statically typed Int, but the invariants a - b != 0 is not asserted by Int inputs, and instead the throw (i.e. halt) is inside the function at compile-time and can only bubble at run-time.

function f( a : Int, b : Int )
{
   // could instead be thrown by the / operator
   if (a – b == 0) throw "Unexpected inputs"
   return (a * b) / (a – b)
}

result = f( 2, 1 )


The fundamental conclusion is that in dynamic typing, the throw check is inside the function (f) being reused, and in static typing the check is outside the function, in the type of the invariants specified by the function’s type. Thus in the dynamic-typing case, the function inherently bind's its internal check in a futures contract to the universe of possible external code (because the external code is not forced by the compiler, to do a throw check itself), i.e. tries to in vain to define the limit of the external universe. Whereas, in the static-typing case, the external code is forced to check for itself, in order to comply with the compile-time checked invariants of the function.


LOL

This is like you are commenting handwriting neatness of Homer's Iliad & Odyssey


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: hughbt on February 20, 2016, 10:38:21 AM
He really asked smooth if John is a good coder. This is ridiculous.  :(

Quote from: smooth
I haven't reviewed his code

LOL  :D

What's ridiculous about it? G maxwell said in his comments (for exact words look up the thread ...) he sees the work of a general coder not someone with specific talents in the field of decentralized crypto currency? I was merely asking a reasonable person who is know to work in that field for a 2nd opinion.

I have a few VNL i was wondering if I should get a bit more or just put the rest into a different project. I was also asking about initial distribution because I don't like coins where there was a huge instamine or premine.

Question are not allowed?

Are you in a position personally to make in depth evaluation of his design and coding skills? if so you are probably in the minority.


What is ridiculous?
Well, it's like you ask Opel car salesman whether Audi is better car and he says, look I never drove the Audi but I think not.
Regarding G maxwell, he speaks about john-connor as 'general coder', but hey that general coder made ZeroTime while G maxwell even with raised $55 Mil can't explain how should Lightning Network work. So, if he can't explain how the hell he will make it.
If you have VNL and not only have them on exchange you should already know what is all about.
Initial distribution, about that you can hear stories and as far as I know and I mine VNL from almost beginning is that john-connor was always in fight with those who were looking for ways to instamine or rape the coin through mining, but than again after a year on exchanges that question becomes irrelevant.
Questions are welcome.
Everyone is in position to read the code, can one evaluate it is other thing but commenting code while claiming you read none is just BS.    



I couldn't have put it better myself. It's a common sense and natural thing that no person can judge a case in which they have an interest. Not every source of information is trustworthy. So far the only objective, independent and trustworthy party which reviewed the code is Poloniex. Besides bitcoin this is the only 1conf coin listed there.  So there is no need for academic discussions - if someone think it's flawed then double spend it or stfu. People can keep talking shit about extra brackets in the code(sic!) but life already verified those bs claims.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: Indianacoin on February 20, 2016, 10:58:15 AM
The community behind Vanilla coin is pretty small and it is not even known by 50% of altcoiners till now.
They need to uplift their community as well as try to advertise their asset.

Also they have a few exchanges (so far only at Bittrex and Poloniex).
They need to diversify their exchanges in order to get larger trade volumes + interest.

The interest rate to secure the network is also very low (only 0.7%) which is why most members are not interested to invest in it. In other words the interest rate not worth nowadays.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: traumschiff on February 20, 2016, 11:25:34 AM
Quote
The community behind Vanilla coin is pretty small and it is not even known by 50% of altcoiners till now.
They need to uplift their community as well as try to advertise their asset.

Everything is a community effort currently, so that explains why advertising is non-existent currently. Also advertising on this forum will be called out as shilling, scamming etc. Seems Monero shilling is the only accepted form of advertising here.

John will push marketing when the product is finished, while other projects are getting pushed even while being in a buggy/non-finished/alpha state.

Quote
They need to diversify their exchanges in order to get larger trade volumes + interest.

Well these are the better western alt-coin exchanges, Chinese exchanges will follow up probably after the coin gets marketing rolling and additional miners and investors.

Quote
The interest rate to secure the network is also very low (only 0.7%) which is why most members are not interested to invest in it. In other words the interest rate not worth nowadays.

The POS part was probably never meant as a source of income, if the project would reach it's true value in the future, even that 0.7% might be a good interest for "only" securing the network. Since VNL has a staking android and iOS wallet, which really don't take up much battery life (1-2% maybe), that's not a huge price for getting "free" coins.

It was mainly meant for further securing the network. POW/POS models should be more secure than simply POW or POS networks (see Decred is also running with this model).  Also since fees are burned so it evens out the coin count in the future.

Also if you want something that pleases investors, VNL has Node Incentives running where you can run a Super Peer with collateral running (10k) and get a % of PoW rewards.

---

I'm fine with POS, but I agree that we need more marketing and exchanges, but it will all follow up with time when the "product" is finished.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 20, 2016, 11:40:04 AM
The community behind Vanilla coin is pretty small and it is not even known by 50% of altcoiners till now.
They need to uplift their community as well as try to advertise their asset.

Also they have a few exchanges (so far only at Bittrex and Poloniex).
They need to diversify their exchanges in order to get larger trade volumes + interest.

The interest rate to secure the network is also very low (only 0.7%) which is why most members are not interested to invest in it. In other words the interest rate not worth nowadays.

That is because john-connor said it's not yet time for marketing, he always wanted to finish project first. Some members of community even left Vanilla cause they were against such approach and I can't blame them if they were looking for quick pump but Vanilla is not that kind of project. Look at Ethereum, Decred they all came out as not even semi finished products, on recently heavily pumped EXP you can even find one of those people on community manager position. Anyway this what I said should also shut mouth to dose saying that john-connor only want to sell his coins by developing Vanilla features while they are not mentioning that several coin developers already pulled some fixes from Vanilla for their coins.

Regarding exchanges, there was c-cex but their incompetency cost some of us some Vanillas, nothing huge in my case but still, some other exchanges tried to implement Vanilla but without success, meaning Vanilla is not just another 15 min copy/paste clone and that's why you can see all that copyright FUD/steal/scam/ FUD coming from 'respectful' project members. Their projects and their full bags are threatened to become worthless. And they follow Goebbels strategy that if you repeat lie 100 times people will think it must be something there and they'll decide to stay away.

Regarding network security I can say you didn't asked and searched enough and I'll point you to
https://github.com/john-connor/papers
…specially this one
https://github.com/john-connor/papers/blob/master/node_incentives.pdf
…and I can say it’s very profitable investment anyone can do.  

edit
... and here you can check current network status:
http://www.vanillacoin.net/network.php


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 20, 2016, 12:11:47 PM
I already explained upthread that ZeroTime (even when it is not Sybil attacked) can't scale (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1362198.msg13876396#msg13876396) and even your own shill admitted it isn't trustworthy (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1362198.msg13874142#msg13874142).

And I already explained (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1362198.msg13944909#msg13944909) that ChainBlender is another Dash-like nonsense anonymity design.

The 'John' is not at our level. Period.

Now you know why the community is ignoring you. And I will now ignore you as well. Enjoy your circle-jerk.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 20, 2016, 12:23:24 PM
I already explained upthread that ZeroTime (even when it is not Sybil attacked) can't scale.

And I already explained that ChainBlender is another Dash-like nonsense anonymity design.

The 'John' is not at our level. Period.

Now you know why the community is ignoring you. And I will now ignore you as well. Enjoy your circle-jerk.

You explained only that you are angry/sad/probably terminally ill dev wannabe dreamer, nothing else.
Yes, john-connor actually working on real solutions he is not at your vaporware dreaming about level.
Yea sure, just your wishful thinking... again.
Finally, please ignore us, go somewhere, we all know circle-jerk follows you...
...or go rest on your couch and dream about features of your imaginary coin.  


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: traumschiff on February 20, 2016, 12:46:30 PM
Nice links bro

Funny thing is non of your links offer any proof on your claims. You keep going lower and lower TPTB.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 20, 2016, 12:57:47 PM
I remember in the summer the community gave you the chance to perform a double spend based on your accusations then that ZT was flawed. There was a bounty. You never accepted the offer

Blah blah blah. No one whose opportunity costs is $200,000 - $500,000 yearly wastes their time on your nonsense tiny bounty in a coin that doesn't have sufficient liquidity to short and in which the mining (i.e. Zerotime network) is controlled by the flock of delusion shills. (additionally the bounty is in VNL and I had explained before what is the point of finding a flaw then the bounty value will decline as well)

We focus on the technical analysis and how it will perform in the wild.

Your rebuttal is entirely nonsense (as it was in the past), but of course you retarded shills will continue on with your delusion.

Readers are smart enough to see who is the fool in this debate. Delude yourself as you wish. Piss into the wind and troll your shadow in your tiny circle-jerk with your cohort bag holding shills.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: traumschiff on February 20, 2016, 01:03:00 PM
Proof within proof on various claims

Oh nice, another link where you call people retards and shills while offering no proof on any of your claims.

You keep the audience thrilled and amazed with the insight you give into the mind of a hideous internet troll.

This is almost as exciting as when you announced your vapor project for the first time a few years ago.

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/14/fa/90/14fa90e8276e8b96b42e7436ac667650.jpg


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 20, 2016, 01:17:19 PM
I remember in the summer the community gave you the chance to perform a double spend based on your accusations then that ZT was flawed. There was a bounty. You never accepted the offer

Blah blah blah. No one whose opportunity costs is $200,000 - $500,000 yearly wastes their time on your nonsense tiny bounty in a coin that doesn't have sufficient liquidity to short and in which the mining (i.e. Zerotime network) is controlled by the flock of delusion shrills. (additionally the bounty is in VNL and I had explained before what is the point of finding a flaw then the bounty value will decline as well)

We focus on the technical analysis and how it will perform in the wild.

Your rebuttal is entirely nonsense (as it was in the past), but of course you retarded shrills will continue on with your delusion.

Readers are smart enough to see who is the fool in this debate. Delude yourself as you wish. Piss into the wind and troll your shadow in your tiny circle-jerk with your cohort bag holding shrills.


Here you come again TPTB_need_war, you can't argue without insulting people.
Didn't you said that you'll ignore us?
What is it? TheFascistMind in you can't let you out?


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 20, 2016, 01:26:52 PM
you can't argue without insulting people

Why don't you check upthread who insulted whom first.

Being retarded is a problem. You might want to work on that. But it seems to be a disease that prevents its cure.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: hughbt on February 20, 2016, 01:30:42 PM
No one whose opportunity costs is $200,000 - $500,000 yearly wastes their time on your nonsense tiny bounty in a coin that doesn't have sufficient liquidity to short and in which the mining (i.e. Zerotime network) is controlled by the flock of delusion shrills.

Yet for some reason they keep wasting their precious time...  8)


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 20, 2016, 01:49:03 PM
you can't argue without insulting people

Why don't you check upthread who insulted whom first.

Being retarded is a problem. You might want to work on that. But it seems to be a disease that prevents its cure.

...or you should check through all your posts.
I agree being retarded and inconsistent is problem, but I can't help you with that disease.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 20, 2016, 02:26:24 PM
http://cdn.quotesgram.com/small/61/44/899644785-Wise-men-dont-need-advice_-Fools-wont-take-it_Benjamin-Franklin-Quotes.jpghttps://begabungs.files.wordpress.com/2013/06/if-you-want-to-live-a-happy-life-tie-it-to-a-goal-not-to-people-or-things-albert-einstein.jpg?w=411&h=290

Proverbs 9:8:

http://emilysquotes.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/EmilysQuotes.Com-Intelligence-correct-fool-wise-appreciate.jpg


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: agusmf on February 20, 2016, 03:04:09 PM
I'm not really sure how to
value Vanillacoin at the
moment.  If the insta send
method doesn't have any
security holes (if), then that
would provide some increased utility, but transactions still
need to be included in a block.
 So I guess you get faster
speeds only while the network
is low traffic and if applied to
Bitcoin, wouldn't give any gains if blocks are perma full
since you would want to wait
until the transaction is actually
inside a block?


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: molan on February 20, 2016, 03:54:37 PM

This is maybe going to be a surprise for you but i think it's pretty much etablished that wise men don't take advice from old/grumpy/bitter phillipinos on forum boards.  ::)


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 20, 2016, 04:40:12 PM

Proverbs 9:8:


Making jokes? This way!? Really? In your condition?

If you remember I said I feel sorry for you, but then you continued with your shit.

So...

Proverbs
 - 9:9, 9:10, 9:11, 9:12

Matthew 23:12


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 20, 2016, 05:00:59 PM
from old/grumpy/bitter phillipinos on forum boards

Retards can't spell filipino, and don't know the difference between an expat US citizen and a filipino.

And apparently retards think a man is "old" when he looks to be in his early 40s (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1219023.msg13891294#msg13891294) or late 30s (and 4 years ago before I got sick with some sort of cancer or problem in my gut, I was consistently told I look not older than 35).

The only hope in hell you have that I won't wipe your faces on my ass, is that I have some sort of cancer or serious issue in my gut which is making it very difficult for me to work.

I am 50 and have some of my own physical and mental challenges.  After about 40, things just start falling apart. Knee and back pain, insomnia, anxiety, high cholesterol, etc. etc.  The only thing I find that helps (other than doctors and the right pills) is you must take 5-10 minutes a day to stretch as your body becomes very rigid. Also do NOT try to do sports or activities like when you were 30. When I go to the gym I lift half the weight I did 20 years ago. If I try to push it, instead of just being sore for a few days, I get sore/injured and it is severe and lasts months to years. It is not worth it. As you age you just need to try and stay a little flexible and a little stronger with easy weight lifting. I do NO sports at all. If you really wanted to do a sport, swimming is probably the only safe one.  Also us coders and computer geeks spend 18 hours/day sitting, which isn't good at all. Get up, walk around every hour, put your feet up on the desk, change positions, do anything other than sit like a statue all day and night.  Best of luck.

Look I was hesitant to respond to this before, because frankly I am 50 and suffering pain in my gut yet I can still kick ass in athletics. I suffer from a lot of pain in my gut which also causes pain in my head, but this is due to the illness. In spite of that I still have had days where I got nuts in the gym same as I did throughout my entire life. Watch my video, I don't look old. I am worn down in my eyes from the illness.

Just 4 years ago, I was still able to go full blast on any athletics. I am athlete. I ran sub-35 minutes 10Ks, etc.. I play American football.

I messed up my shoulder recently shooting the basketball too much and boxing. I bought a hand dumbell for the house this week and I am rehabilitating the shoulder.

Hey even sick and not able to train effectively I still have a 26" vertical leap. It is far down from my 36 - 38" in my 20s but if I could just train regularly I am confident it would climb back up to 30".

I don't feel old except for this damn fucking shit in my gut, which is really holding me back from everything in my life. Arggggrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 20, 2016, 05:02:22 PM
I'm not really sure how to
value Vanillacoin at the
moment.  If the insta send
method doesn't have any
security holes (if), then that
would provide some increased utility, but transactions still
need to be included in a block.
 So I guess you get faster
speeds only while the network
is low traffic and if applied to
Bitcoin, wouldn't give any gains if blocks are perma full
since you would want to wait
until the transaction is actually
inside a block?

You should read up on lightning networks and Zerotime.   Limitations of blocksize  does not directly related this way. VNL can do 100's of tps  and Zerotime can add 100x's more tps without filling the blocksize as it is right now.  Along with this VNL is set to have pruning and scaling of the block chain in place.  Blocksize is never going to be an issue with vnl.

The security holes are inherent in all crypto.  In bitcoin a 0 confirm transaction is very very risky.  This is why companies that allow 0 confirm  (coinbase) require your info to make all transactions trusted.

Zerotime adds security on top of that by having nearly instant locking mechanism that runs through a group of incentivesed nodes.  As far as I know there is no 100% way to do 0 conf transfers, but the money and energy it would take to double spend in a lightning network such as Zerotime makes the  chances of it happening almost zero.

Think of Zerotime as a massive security wall made to allow you to make instant transfers in a trusted situation with zero risk, and in a trustless situation with massive protection.



Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 20, 2016, 05:07:28 PM
from old/grumpy/bitter phillipinos on forum boards

Retards can't spell filipino, and don't know the different between an expat US citizen and a filipino.

And apparently retards think a man is "old" when he looks to be in his early 40s (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1219023.msg13891294#msg13891294) or late 30s (and 4 years ago before I got sick with some sort of cancer or problem in my gut, I was consistently told I look not older than 35).

The only hope in hell you have that I won't wipe your faces on my ass, is that I have some sort of cancer or serious issue in my gut which is making it very difficult for me to work.

Enough of this.   Go make a thread discussing the project you are working on, there is no reason for you to constantly discuss it in other threads.  Get it working in test net, publish your papers, and be scrutinized.

Constant TROLLING, will do nothing for your project but turn off potential investors.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 20, 2016, 05:12:26 PM
from old/grumpy/bitter phillipinos on forum boards

Retards can't spell filipino, and don't know the different between an expat US citizen and a filipino.

And apparently retards think a man is "old" when he looks to be in his early 40s (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1219023.msg13891294#msg13891294) or late 30s (and 4 years ago before I got sick with some sort of cancer or problem in my gut, I was consistently told I look not older than 35).

The only hope in hell you have that I won't wipe your faces on my ass, is that I have some sort of cancer or serious issue in my gut which is making it very difficult for me to work.

Enough of this.   Go make a thread discussing the project you are working on, there is no reason for you to constantly discuss it in other threads.  Get it working in test net, publish your papers, and be scrutinized.

Constant TROLLING, will do nothing for your project but turn off potential investors.

You guys are trolling me. I responded. You go make another thread if you want (don't you ever tell me what to do, you are not the owner of this thread!). I have every right to respond to attacks.

I posted facts in this thread and the retards don't like facts. So they attack me personally. That is what losers do.

Readers are wise to your tactics.

Yeah I wish enough of this. But your cohorts retards will never stop lying and trolling.

WHY ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT MY PROJECT??????????? WE ARE TALKING ABOUT VANILLACOIN. WHY DO YOU MOVE THE GOAL POSTS. SOMETHING TO HIDE???

WHY ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT ME????????????? NONE OF YOU CAN REFUTE ANY OF THE FACTS ABOUT VANILLACOIN. YOUR ONLY REBUTTALS ARE ATTACKS ON MY PERSON.

LOSERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!

RETARDS!!!!!!!!!!

SCAMMERS!!!!!!!!!!


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 20, 2016, 05:23:29 PM
I'm not really sure how to
value Vanillacoin at the
moment.  If the insta send
method doesn't have any
security holes (if), then that
would provide some increased utility, but transactions still
need to be included in a block.
 So I guess you get faster
speeds only while the network
is low traffic and if applied to
Bitcoin, wouldn't give any gains if blocks are perma full
since you would want to wait
until the transaction is actually
inside a block?

You should read up on lightning networks and Zerotime.

Dude why don't you come off your high horse. I have researched LN intensively. I read the white paper. I watched a very long video where the creators explained the issues.

That you equate Zerotime to LN shows you don't have a fucking clue about the technology.

Do you guys even have a fucking clue whom you are talking to??????????????? Do you think your ignorance can match someone who has been coding and doing computer science research for 30 years. You guys are just pathetic.

LN is totally different technological concept from Zerotime.

Limitations of blocksize  does not directly related this way. VNL can do 100's of tps  and Zerotime can add 100x's more tps without filling the blocksize as it is right now.  Along with this VNL is set to have pruning and scaling of the block chain in place.  Blocksize is never going to be an issue with vnl.

Pruning has nothing to do with scaling the tx/sec rate. And you don't even comprehend why I said Zerotime won't scale. It is just n00b garbage that you are slobbering.


blah blah blah nonsense

Everything you write is wrong. Wrong, Wrong Wrong.

You idiots enjoy fist fucking each other because you are going to be selling VNL bags to street children in exchange for used bottle caps.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 20, 2016, 05:58:10 PM
Dude read what I wrote.  I didn't say LN and Zerotime are the same thing.

It was an answer to the previous posters queries on how instant transactions effect the total tps due to max blocksize.

Also I never said pruning effects blocksize, but it does effect the nodes requirements to run the network.

As for the TROLLING.  I use that in direct relation to your constant eluding towards a better project.  And how you need to move that conversation to another thread.

So far any topics you have brought up about VNL I have no problems with and have discussed them very civilly with you.  You need to stop thinking of everyone on here being a collective persona, and direct conversations with each person individually.

I'm done chatting with you.  You obviously have a very distinct conflict of interest regarding VNL, and your lack of civility shows an abhor ant absence of ability towards working with others. 


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: traumschiff on February 20, 2016, 06:37:33 PM
from old/grumpy/bitter phillipinos on forum boards

Retards can't spell filipino, and don't know the different between an expat US citizen and a filipino.

And apparently retards think a man is "old" when he looks to be in his early 40s (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1219023.msg13891294#msg13891294) or late 30s (and 4 years ago before I got sick with some sort of cancer or problem in my gut, I was consistently told I look not older than 35).

The only hope in hell you have that I won't wipe your faces on my ass, is that I have some sort of cancer or serious issue in my gut which is making it very difficult for me to work.

Enough of this.   Go make a thread discussing the project you are working on, there is no reason for you to constantly discuss it in other threads.  Get it working in test net, publish your papers, and be scrutinized.

Constant TROLLING, will do nothing for your project but turn off potential investors.

You guys are trolling me. I responded. You go make another thread if you want (don't you ever tell me what to do, you are not the owner of this thread!). I have every right to respond to attacks.

I posted facts in this thread and the retards don't like facts. So they attack me personally. That is what losers do.

Readers are wise to your tactics.

Yeah I wish enough of this. But your cohorts retards will never stop lying and trolling.

WHY ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT MY PROJECT??????????? WE ARE TALKING ABOUT VANILLACOIN. WHY DO YOU MOVE THE GOAL POSTS. SOMETHING TO HIDE???

WHY ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT ME????????????? NONE OF YOU CAN REFUTE ANY OF THE FACTS ABOUT VANILLACOIN. YOUR ONLY REBUTTALS ARE ATTACKS ON MY PERSON.

LOSERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!

RETARDS!!!!!!!!!!

SCAMMERS!!!!!!!!!!

https://rlholland.files.wordpress.com/2014/08/tobey-maguire-crying.jpg

I especially love the part where you write "NONE OF YOU CAN REFUTE ANY OF THE FACTS ABOUT VANILLACOIN".

It's time to take your meds mate.





Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 21, 2016, 12:28:06 AM
Retards can't spell... retards think ...
The only hope in hell you have that I won't wipe your faces on my ass, is that I have some sort of cancer or serious issue in my gut which is making it very difficult for me to work.
 I am 50 and suffering pain in my gut yet I can still kick ass in athletics.
 I suffer from a lot of pain in my gut which also causes pain in my head, but this is due to the illness. In spite of that I still have had days where I got nuts in the gym same as I did throughout my entire life. Watch my video, I don't look old. I am worn down in my eyes from the illness.

Just 4 years ago, I was still able to go full blast on any athletics. I am athlete. I ran sub-35 minutes 10Ks, etc.. I play American football.
I messed up my shoulder recently shooting the basketball too much and boxing. I bought a hand dumbell for the house this week and I am rehabilitating the shoulder.
Hey even sick and not able to train effectively I still have a 26" vertical leap. It is far down from my 36 - 38" in my 20s but if I could just train regularly I am confident it would climb back up to 30".
I don't feel old except for this damn fucking shit in my gut, which is really holding me back from everything in my life. Arggggrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You guys are trolling me.

I posted facts in this thread and the retards don't like facts. So they attack me personally. That is what losers do.

Readers are wise to your tactics.

Yeah I wish enough of this. But your cohorts retards will never stop lying and trolling.

WHY ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT MY PROJECT??????????? WE ARE TALKING LYING ABOUT VANILLACOIN. WHY DO YOU MOVE THE GOAL POSTS. SOMETHING TO HIDE???

WHY ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT ME????????????? NONE OF YOU CAN REFUTE ANY OF THE FACTS ABOUT VANILLACOIN. YOUR ONLY REBUTTALS ARE ATTACKS ON MY PERSON.

LOSERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!

RETARDS!!!!!!!!!!

SCAMMERS!!!!!!!!!!


Dude why don't you come off your high horse. I have researched LN intensively. I read the white paper. I watched a very long video where the creators explained the issues.

That you equate Zerotime to LN shows you don't have a fucking clue about the technology.

Do you guys even have a fucking clue whom you are talking to??????????????? Do you think your ignorance can match someone who has been coding and doing computer science research for 30 years. You guys are just pathetic.

Everything you write is wrong. Wrong, Wrong Wrong.

You idiots enjoy fist fucking each other because you are going to be selling VNL bags to street children in exchange for used bottle caps.

Well dude,
 please stop calling people bad names and just to sum it up for you, we, as you call us, the 'idiots/retards/losers/scammers' trolling you and your project???!?
Who do you think you are?
As I marked in your last few posts, you constantly talk about yourself, about your superiority, about your project, your lifestyle, you living as expat,...
 your terminal illness for which I still feel sorry for you,…
 but as I said and marked it's you who constantly talks about yourself.

Newsflash for you, there is more than one car producer, computer producer, mobile phone, milk, bread, clothes,... producer.
There is more than one currency in existence in the world so why do you think that there should be only one fast anonymous decentralized crypto currency like Vanilla is.

I just spent nice afternoon and evening with my son, we were at handball game after which we discussed strategy for his handball game he’ll have tomorrow …
... but guess what, who cares.

If you want I could talk/write you for hours about my life, family, company, skills, houses I have, my war path, connection with bankers and politicians…
... but probably you don’t care just as I/we here don’t care who you are.

You could be gold Olympic medalist and Nobel prize winner in one person, you could even be Bill Gates or president of US/Russia but ...
... that doesn’t change the fact that in the same time while highly educated you are dumb as rock.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: l8orre on February 21, 2016, 08:00:05 AM
@john-connor

which parts exactly are the stolen parts?

Code:
  

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              }if($o){#3                    Y=21;$Y>1;            
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  my$X=$V&0x              03;$V>>=2;                              
  unshift@$Q  ,[$X,$Y]}#  8@$O,$Q}@$                              
  P}map{B("b  lack",$_)}  ([128,648,        280,8],[12  0,620,8,36
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              ){map{$a#6                    Y]#6_]=0}(  0..9)}}^B{
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  $X,$Y,$W,$  H)=@_;$W||                                =28;$H||=2
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              J=$a#6Y];#        9X=0;$X<@$  J;$X++){my  $V=$J#6X]|
              |0;($V>4)#        2++$F->{$V  };next`if(  #7$E->{$V}
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                    G>0and$G!=  $V)and++$E                        
                    ->{$V}}}#9  Y=2;$Y<22;                        
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                    V=$J#6X]||  0;(#7$E->{                        
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                                X]=2}}(key  s%$F)?$F:0            
                                }^N{&F;for  `my$u(@$b)            
                                {my$X=128+  28*$u->[0]            
                                ;my$G=[$X,  664,28,14]            
                                ;my$T=B("p  urple",$G)            
                                ;push@$e,[  $T,$G]}}';            


s+\s*++g;$o=0;for$l(' and return ',' return ',' or next;',###########
' for(my$','->destroy}','delete$','->[$','exists','push',# by golux #
'for(my$'){s&#$o&$l&g&&++$o}eval if s&\^&sub &g&&s&`&$"&g#2015-10-12#



Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 21, 2016, 11:06:21 AM
Just to conclude my last post, cause when I wrote it, it was really late, so late that it was really to early to write anything more, I'll add this.
As usually I really don't care what others think cause I have brain and with 45 years on my shoulders I know how to do my researches I know that people are looking for advices from someone who they trust and while it's not really important who I am, cause in Crypto I'm no one but average Joe, I think that all who are in crypto and were mining some coin know ocminer / https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=43526 the guy who runs suprnova.cc pools, the fixer, guy who deals with all kinds of shit that can happen during the mining day.
So, here is what he say about john-connor

I've been coding the RPC side of the coin with John "on-the-fly" in IRC .. I was coding the pools side, while he integrated the calls into the daemon.

We did that over several hours/days and also latter anti-ddos mechanisms and other stuff were/was integrated while "talking" in IRC to each other, he's certainly no "copy&paste" coder like many, many others, I can vouch for his skills, I've worked with him together several times already, he knows what he's doing.

Also for all those who are in doubts regarding xmr shills and why they attack Vanilla so much here is some interesting reading, IDK if anything from that thread is right, but as I said it's interesting to read.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1272304.msg13866366#msg13866366


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: generalizethis on February 21, 2016, 12:07:52 PM


https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1272304.msg13866366#msg13866366

You're an imbecile if you read sputz interpretation and believe it. David Latapie was conned out of money when he was starting a company and sputz attempted to turn David's apology for being scammed into some admittance of fraud. The man was embarrassed and BCT's resident troll turned it into a dumb-down version of spin city, but I'm sure if you would have read through the posts, you could have figured that out for yourself. I hope you don't have this lackadaisical attitude when it comes to researching your investments..


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 21, 2016, 03:03:52 PM

Also for all those who are in doubts regarding xmr shills and why they attack Vanilla so much here is some interesting reading, IDK if anything from that thread is right, but as I said it's interesting to read.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1272304.msg13866366#msg13866366

You're an imbecile if you read sputz interpretation and believe it. David Latapie was conned out of money when he was starting a company and sputz attempted to turn David's apology for being scammed into some admittance of fraud. The man was embarrassed and BCT's resident troll turned it into a dumb-down version of spin city, but I'm sure if you would have read through the posts, you could have figured that out for yourself. I hope you don't have this lackadaisical attitude when it comes to researching your investments..

You xmr guys really have problem with understanding of what is written. I said nothing, I left for reader to make conclusion.
It seems that new definition for word imbecile is 'the one who can read, understand what is written and make conclusion'.
By that definition it seems you are not the one.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: generalizethis on February 21, 2016, 03:11:30 PM

Also for all those who are in doubts regarding xmr shills and why they attack Vanilla so much here is some interesting reading, IDK if anything from that thread is right, but as I said it's interesting to read.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1272304.msg13866366#msg13866366

You're an imbecile if you read sputz interpretation and believe it. David Latapie was conned out of money when he was starting a company and sputz attempted to turn David's apology for being scammed into some admittance of fraud. The man was embarrassed and BCT's resident troll turned it into a dumb-down version of spin city, but I'm sure if you would have read through the posts, you could have figured that out for yourself. I hope you don't have this lackadaisical attitude when it comes to researching your investments..

You xmr guys really have problem with understanding of what is written. I said nothing, I left for reader to make conclusion.
It seems that new definition for word imbecile is 'the one who can read, understand what is written and make conclusion'.
By that definition it seems you are not the one.


You made an implication based on Sputz post, which would naturally be filled in negatively since you are also playing the"I don't know if this is true, but...." card. I would call anyone who uses this type of tactic an imbecile (or do you really think people here are too stupid to realize the cheap ploy you used? So I'm going to say you are an imbecile or you think everyone else is an imbecile. Either way you look like an ass.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: YAdaminer on February 21, 2016, 03:41:02 PM

Also for all those who are in doubts regarding xmr shills and why they attack Vanilla so much here is some interesting reading, IDK if anything from that thread is right, but as I said it's interesting to read.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1272304.msg13866366#msg13866366

You're an imbecile if you read sputz interpretation and believe it. David Latapie was conned out of money when he was starting a company and sputz attempted to turn David's apology for being scammed into some admittance of fraud. The man was embarrassed and BCT's resident troll turned it into a dumb-down version of spin city, but I'm sure if you would have read through the posts, you could have figured that out for yourself. I hope you don't have this lackadaisical attitude when it comes to researching your investments..

You xmr guys really have problem with understanding of what is written. I said nothing, I left for reader to make conclusion.
It seems that new definition for word imbecile is 'the one who can read, understand what is written and make conclusion'.
By that definition it seems you are not the one.


You made an implication based on Sputz post, which would naturally be filled in negatively since you are also playing the"I don't know if this is true, but...." card. I would call anyone who uses this type of tactic an imbecile (or do you really think people here are too stupid to realize the cheap ploy you used? So I'm going to say you are an imbecile or you think everyone else is an imbecile. Either way you look like an ass.

Thank you, when that comes from you it's almost like compliment.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 21, 2016, 08:25:42 PM
Oh great so the mod removed all the evidence where john-conner was calling me a scammer because he claimed my illness was faked. And then I challenged John to a bet on that and John never replied. Even another user who I don't know had commented that John's post was despicable but the mod deleted his post as well. Sure seems the mod is confused or is a VNL supporter (I assume the former).

So the mods think they are helping to spread the truth when they delete evidence  ???

I asked the mods to deal with the tit-for-tat attacks on my person which are irrelevant to the facts I presented about Zerotime and Chainblender which haven't been rebutted.

Instead of deleting those, they deleted the evidence that incriminates John.  ???

Basically the situation is I presented my analysis of Zerotime and Chainblender upthread, then instead of replying on those points, the VNL shills pursued an attack on my person instead. Because they are unwilling to discuss the facts. My person is irrelevant to the facts about VNL. They think that by slandering my person, they can cause readers to think that my analysis of the facts is wrong, without ever presenting an actual rebuttal on the facts.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: generalizethis on February 21, 2016, 08:42:23 PM
Oh great so the mod removed all the evidence where john-conner was calling me a scammer because he claimed my illness was faked. And then I challenged him to a bet on that and John never replied. Even another user who I don't know had commented that John's post was despicable but the mod deleted his post as well. Sure seems the mod is confused or is a VNL supporter (I assume the former).

So the mods think they are helping to spread the truth when they delete evidence  ???

I asked the mods to deal with the tit-for-tat attacks on my person which are irrelevant to the facts I presented about Zerotime and Chainblender which haven't been rebutted.

Instead of deleting those, they deleted the evidence that incriminates John.  ???

Basically the situation is I presented my analysis of Zerotime and Chainblender upthread, then instead of replying on those points, the VNL shrills pursued an attack on my person instead. Because they are unwilling to discuss the facts. My person is irrelevant to the facts about VNL. They think that by slandering my person, they can cause readers to think that my analysis of the facts is wrong, without ever presenting an actual rebuttal on the facts.

It will live forever in my messages and an rft file in case the mods try to delete that  ;)


"Quote from: john-connor on Today at 12:58:11 AM

The "terminal illness" is a lie to gain confidence, refer to con-man 101 or matchstick 101. The lies about his vapornothing and loving to argue about nothing, it's sad. Seek therapy. but yes Vanilla is quite nice, clean asynchronous code design. 🍒 Cool"



Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 21, 2016, 08:48:00 PM
Dude read what I wrote.  I didn't say LN and Zerotime are the same thing.

It was an answer to the previous posters queries on how instant transactions effect the total tps due to max blocksize.

Also I never said pruning effects blocksize, but it does effect the nodes requirements to run the network.

As for the TROLLING.  I use that in direct relation to your constant eluding towards a better project.  And how you need to move that conversation to another thread.

So far any topics you have brought up about VNL I have no problems with and have discussed them very civilly with you.  You need to stop thinking of everyone on here being a collective persona, and direct conversations with each person individually.

I'm done chatting with you.  You obviously have a very distinct conflict of interest regarding VNL, and your lack of civility shows an abhor ant absence of ability towards working with others.  

Your entire post was filled with technical error stacked upon error.

For example:

Blocksize is never going to be an issue with vnl.

That statement is entirely wrong. John has designed nothing to deal with the fundamental Tragedy of the Commons issue around block size (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1183043.msg13850005#msg13850005) (refer also to my posts and video in the Ethereum Paradox thread which expound on that). Dude I have been writing about that issue since 2013 when I was perhaps one of the first to nail the block size (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=340686.msg3681159#msg3681159) as the future issue of failure for Bitcoin and even explained it recently to smooth and ArticMine (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1183043.msg13844014#msg13844014) in the context of showing that Satoshi did not solve the Byzantine Generals Problem (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1183043.msg13823607#msg13823607). You are not qualified to challenge me on that this issue. Please learn to respect those who have more knowledge than you do, or at least take the time to read and understand the points I have made in my 10,000+ post history which contains my research. If you think otherwise, then present your detailed technical rebuttal.

Again note that pruning has nothing to do with block size.

And again, replying with attacks on my person, just shows that you shills are incapable of debating the technical facts. The tactics of you shills is when ever I make a strong factual post, you follow it with as much noise posts attacking my person as you can, to bury the facts and never address them.

Edit: I am only operating on about 10 - 20% of my capability due to chronic illness. I am sorry but this is a fact.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bl234st on February 21, 2016, 09:47:30 PM
Oh great so the mod removed all the evidence where john-conner was calling me a scammer because he claimed my illness was faked. And then I challenged John to a bet on that and John never replied. Even another user who I don't know had commented that John's post was despicable but the mod deleted his post as well. Sure seems the mod is confused or is a VNL supporter (I assume the former).

So the mods think they are helping to spread the truth when they delete evidence  ???

I asked the mods to deal with the tit-for-tat attacks on my person which are irrelevant to the facts I presented about Zerotime and Chainblender which haven't been rebutted.

Instead of deleting those, they deleted the evidence that incriminates John.  ???

Basically the situation is I presented my analysis of Zerotime and Chainblender upthread, then instead of replying on those points, the VNL shrills pursued an attack on my person instead. Because they are unwilling to discuss the facts. My person is irrelevant to the facts about VNL. They think that by slandering my person, they can cause readers to think that my analysis of the facts is wrong, without ever presenting an actual rebuttal on the facts.

Yep. He deleted my post! Not cool. Guess calling someone a faker is ok, but calling someone despicable for saying it, is not.  :o


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 21, 2016, 09:48:44 PM
Yep. He deleted my post! Not cool. Guess calling someone a faker is ok, but calling someone despicable for saying it, is not.  :o

The mod simply didn't understand the entire context because he just read a few posts and made a quick decision. I don't really blame the mod. I did message him about it.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 22, 2016, 03:47:01 AM
He deleted my posts as well..

We were way off topic though.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bakedrice on February 25, 2016, 07:15:39 AM
what's the big deal with vnl anyway?

what makes it better than the thousands of coins out there?


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: iCEBREAKER on February 25, 2016, 07:31:03 AM
what's the big deal with vnl anyway?

what makes it better than the thousands of coins out there?

Only big deal about vnl was the hype.

Nothing made it better than the other shitcoins.

Unlike ShadowCash, vnl isn't even cool enough to be broken by Shen.

vnl is only famous for having stolen code, and a dev that attacked GMAX for pointing out that fact.

2/10.  Lame.  Would Not Pump Again.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: traumschiff on February 25, 2016, 09:31:23 AM
what's the big deal with vnl anyway?

what makes it better than the thousands of coins out there?

Only big deal about vnl was the hype.

Nothing made it better than the other shitcoins.

Unlike ShadowCash, vnl isn't even cool enough to be broken by Shen.

vnl is only famous for having stolen code, and a dev that attacked GMAX for pointing out that fact.

2/10.  Lame.  Would Not Pump Again.

Good thing you have no credibility left on this forum or in the whole bitcoin space Eduardo.

-∞/10


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bitcoin carpenter on February 26, 2016, 01:00:15 AM
If you want to know all the reasons vnl is worth looking at go to vanillacoin.net.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bigfryguy on February 28, 2016, 03:07:16 PM
CHAINBLENDER RC1 is now released, and being tested.  join vanillacoin.net to try it out. 


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bigfryguy on February 28, 2016, 04:06:21 PM
what's the big deal with vnl anyway?

what makes it better than the thousands of coins out there?

Only big deal about vnl was the hype.

Nothing made it better than the other shitcoins.

Unlike ShadowCash, vnl isn't even cool enough to be broken by Shen.

vnl is only famous for having stolen code, and a dev that attacked GMAX for pointing out that fact.

2/10.  Lame.  Would Not Pump Again.

wrong again... 

apart from all the other features John has released,
VNL is famous for being the only coin in altcoinland to have 3 distinct growth cycles in one year, all having higher highs and higher lows than the one before.  also it just recently touched on a fourth ATH in VNL/USD,  if it breaks out and surpasses its last ATH/BTC it will be the only project in cryptoland including BTC to do this cycle 4 times in that period of time.

VNL is the opposite of a P&D


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: Riseman on February 28, 2016, 06:22:20 PM
what's the big deal with vnl anyway?

what makes it better than the thousands of coins out there?

...

wrong again...  

apart from all the other features John has released,
VNL is famous for being the only coin in altcoinland to have 3 distinct growth cycles in one year, all having higher highs and higher lows than the one before.  also it just recently touched on a fourth ATH in VNL/USD,  if it breaks out and surpasses its last ATH/BTC it will be the only project in cryptoland including BTC to do this cycle 4 times in that period of time.

VNL is the opposite of a P&D

How can it have 3 pumps followed by crashes in one year and not be a P&D? Please note that I'm not speaking about the tech, the devs, their intentions or anything else - only about market behaviour. As far as I see what is happening now is pure P&D. Moving walls, fake support, massive sell off, etc. There was even a "dump on the news" - 30% (yet) price crash at the precise moment of Chainblender RC release. I may be wrong but I see it this way.

I mean the tech is great and promising but it doesn't ensure someone doesn't use the hype to do P&D. This is what all crypto markets are about.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bigfryguy on February 28, 2016, 08:42:49 PM
pump and dump is a term referring to the scam of one group of people buying up supply early in a coins life then driving its price through the roof(way over its actual value, creating an overvalued asset) then selling off all there coins and leaving the project, or at least no longer investing in it.

markets that recover from quick exponential rises by keeping prices higher ( higher highs, and higher lows than the previous normal before the exponential rise) should be considerred undervalued assets as the investors/developers have decided to keep their wealth inside the project and have not run off with the investment.

its economics


this latest speculative rise is definately being controlled, and past performance never proves future performance, but the past performance has followed my second scenario, and only time will tell whether this pattern continues.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: bigfryguy on February 29, 2016, 12:33:27 AM
what's the big deal with vnl anyway?

what makes it better than the thousands of coins out there?

...

wrong again...  

apart from all the other features John has released,
VNL is famous for being the only coin in altcoinland to have 3 distinct growth cycles in one year, all having higher highs and higher lows than the one before.  also it just recently touched on a fourth ATH in VNL/USD,  if it breaks out and surpasses its last ATH/BTC it will be the only project in cryptoland including BTC to do this cycle 4 times in that period of time.

VNL is the opposite of a P&D

How can it have 3 pumps followed by crashes in one year and not be a P&D? Please note that I'm not speaking about the tech, the devs, their intentions or anything else - only about market behaviour. As far as I see what is happening now is pure P&D. Moving walls, fake support, massive sell off, etc. There was even a "dump on the news" - 30% (yet) price crash at the precise moment of Chainblender RC release. I may be wrong but I see it this way.

I mean the tech is great and promising but it doesn't ensure someone doesn't use the hype to do P&D. This is what all crypto markets are about.
How can it?
well if a boom and bust cycle surpasses the previous one is how. In the case of VNL there has only ever been massive sell pressure, the buy pressure has always been met with immediate wall builds that have stopped the rise from prematurely going way over its true value.

for how a pump and dump looks please check the total charts for every other project over a year old.   All of them are  pump and Dump, the only one that I can find that had a healthy constant low afterwards is XMR, and coming from me towards a project that I have totally removed myself from this is high praise.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: TPTB_need_war on February 29, 2016, 02:00:33 AM
I mean the tech is great and promising

Please justify that incorrect claim with a sufficiently elaborate presentation of technological understanding.

Otherwise please stop contributing to the P&D by making claims that you are not qualified to make.


Title: Re: How about Vanilla coin
Post by: Riseman on February 29, 2016, 02:49:41 AM
I mean the tech is great and promising

Please justify that incorrect claim with a sufficiently elaborate presentation of technological understanding.

Otherwise please stop contributing to the P&D by making claims that you are not qualified to make.

No and no. How about that? ;D