Bitcoin Forum

How can we be expected to invest in this stupidity?

Here is a guy trying to give Andreas a tip of $1.50.  To do that, he paid $13.46 in fees.  Does that seem like a sensible payment system?  Not.  It is garbage.  SegWit didn't help with anything.  

https://i.imgur.com/DDMQjOw.jpg

That's where altcoins are useful. When bitcoin's value are so high that giving a tip is such a waste you can use altcoins. Bitcoin is not the only cryptocurrency. And bitcoin will not be on top if there's none on its bottom.

Bitcoin was supposed to be useful too.  Now it has been rendered nothing more than a Ponzi scheme.  It has no real purpose other than for more and more people to come one after another to give money to the guys already in.  Then BAM!!! a total freefall collapse.

bitcoin will have miserable end

Sorry? Your a legendary member and you don't even understand what's happening? I understand that you are upset since in the past, Bitcoin is a cheap way to do transactions or just simply send money other than remittance centers.

Now that Bitcoin's price surged hence reflected in the fees. It will take time to adjust. And... SegWit seems to be insufficuent to solve the issue since the congestion in the blockchain is still happening even after the implementation which is absurd.

This was one of the reason ethereum looked so nice  when I invested. Although the fees dont have to deal with the amount of btc, it is a problem with micro payments which is why people should use alternatives like litecoin, dash, ethereum.

Don't you see what happened to Ethereum over the last few days with all those kitties?

Thanks for informing me about trolling so perhaps better to ignore.
However the post made me think about the fee if i would send Andreas $1.50 from my standard bank account:
Fee 15 euro  => 17,65 US dollar.

Well sometimes i got the same feeling..... :(

But it would be unwise to say it a Ponzi. It doesn't fall in its definition.

Fine, agree!
You saved $4 in Bitcoin.
But can it be considered as use case of bitcoin? We can save billion in remittance fees using other better altcoins. Where is the utility of bitcoin?
It's mere a store of value or an investment asset that is highly overvalued with no intrinsic value. I don't understand why people don't see the reality? It is just a technology and technology goes obsolete.

If anyone here can explain me how bitcoin can sustain it's value in long run?

Fuck you.  That is total bullshit.  Even guys in this thread say the feel the same way.  That's not trolling buddy.  Just because someone says something against your personal feelings, it doesn't make them a troll.  

Satoshi Bitcoin, the real bitcoin, didn't have 1Meg blocks which totally fuck up the fees and MemPool.  1 Meg blocks are there just to drive demand for the Blockstream product 'Lightning'.  It's a scam, and you guys fell for it.  Thank god the people at Bitcoin Cash forked in time to forever get rid of that SegWit shit.  Now the chain has been preserved.  All you will come back to BCH when you finally figure it out that Blockstream is screwing you.  

Now go fuck yourself King Colon.

In a way you are right tho I gave someone 0.0015 and payed about the same in transaction fees the trouble will come when people who thought they were going to make a quick buck all try cashing out.

You don't have to tell me that.  I am always right so I already know.

If you're an idiot who thinks BTC was made to allow you to buy a pack of chewing gum or tip people $1 so they can buy themselves a soda, be my guest. What if somebody were to go to a bank in the United States and asked them to convert his $2 into Euro and send to his friend in France? We'd have a very similar situation where the bank fees would be higher than the payment itself. If you really want to send $2 in BTC at least be smart enough to make it a batch payment. Sending multiple single small transactions with a high fee (because a fee of $13 is far above the average) is a financial suicide.


The shiny rays of your modesty are blinding me.

I'm divided on transfer fees.

I know people dislike like paying $13-$20 in xfer.

Part of the issue could be blockchain.info publishing only dollar amounts and not disclosing the amount of BTC in exchanges. Looking at the BTC amounts of transfers 16 months ago, the amounts would be $1 in transfer fees but due to the rising value of bitcoin that $1 is now worth a lot more.

Also some wallets appear to be recommending far higher transfer fees than are required for reasonably fast transaction.

We all know that the fee are so high, but we are still using bitcoin as a payment? There are a lot of other means of tip that you can use. A lot of streamers online are having a lot of payment with a low amount and the people are not having any complaints,  why not use that? Bitcoin is getting expensive and expensive so I think the fees are expected to do the same.

Yes bitcoin is getting expensive they should reduce the fee in the blockchain. Oh I think we have a lots of forked of bitcoin cause the lower fees are visible at them.

Bitcoin is suffering growing pains right now. We need to give it some time in order for the scaling solutions to me researched, coded and implemented into the ecosystem. Once they are properly rolled out, we'll be back to cheaper and fast transactions like we grew accostumed to in the past.

The main reason is supply and demand. The amount of transactions that the miners can mine depends on the size of the block they mine. a 1mb block can only hold 1mb worth of transactions. For all of 2017, the number of bitcoin transactions people want to make has gone up. Usually it is more transactions than one megabyte every ten minutes can handle. Because of this, the price has gone up.

I could understand your true care :o :o :o about bitcoin.But don't worry and stay cool.We could hope that very soon lightning network would be activated and all these transacion fee problems would get solved.

This issue has mainly raised as many bitcoin holders tried to sell their bitcoins as bitcoin price reached ATH,they just tried to sell bitcoins to enjoy the high value benefit and more over christmas and new year coming or them to celebrate.

But,very soon this problem would get solved.

I don't understand how people with this much experience use apples vs. oranges arguments to justify serious flaws...and then present solutions like batch payments that A) are not practical to do most of the time and B) ~90% of users cannot and will never be able to learn how to do that.  Most people I know understand how to log into accounts and turn on their PC (if they still have one)....but anything else...good luck.

The current paradigm is the equivalent of the model T Ford.  I don't understand why people attack someone for pointing out the obvious.  We should be supporting people that do so and therefore put pressure on those that have the power to fix things since said things are clearly broken from the point of view of the average user that doesn't have the mental bandwidth for creative workarounds.

Buddy just because you are right about the fee situation we are currently facing, why do you go and call Bitcoin garbage? It isn't garbage, only a work in progress, and hopefully soon we will have a way to do free/instant transactions again. :)

But it's a damn shame that most retailers don't accept altcoins.  I looked up places where you can spend Dash, and there were absolutely no places where I'd want to buy anything.  It'd be great if Newegg took litecoin, for example--or anything else, because I agree with OP about this.  It just isn't practical anymore to use bitcoin for small purchases.  For a thing like a new computer, yeah, I'd spend a few dollars for network fees (with teeth a-gritting), but even that's a waste.  Why use bitcoin when you can spend fiat?  There's no fees on my end whatsoever using a debit card or cash.  And there's no opportunity cost, either, since the purchasing power of the US Dollar isn't going to explode overnight like bitcoin has done.  Ah well, maybe in the future.

Hi

if u compare to other coins technologies, yes BTC technology's is very old. but the new forks could not help it to correct this important problem like fee.

Yeah segwit doesn't help.... IF YOU DON'T USsE UT DURP. Hahahaha.

What's your solution rawdog? Troll bitcointalk forever and ever? Btw, maybe the guy was just a tool who didn't know how to send a proper transaction haha.

I am actually thinking that it was a pure stupidity. Tho it has nothing to do with bitcoin being labeled as a garbage. Yet we can't also deny the fact that the bitcoin's current situation with regards to transactions are getting worse day by day as the price goes up the fees are also pumping which is absolutely crazy

I am not surprised at the current Bitcoin fee transactions. Because Bitcoin Price can we say very high, obviously its use is also dissertation with high fee. Not because the fees are rising, but because Bitcoin Prices soar, the amount of Bitcoin that usually only 1 $ can go up to $ 5. And this is absolute.

If not that then, what unmet demand is meeting by Bitcoin?
Because I fail to see any. There are tons of cryptocurrencies better technically than bitcoin. Why should people invest? If people are only investing because of rising price which in turn is only connected to rising demand. Then, it is a sign of impending bubble and gonna pop up badly.

A legendary member that doesn't know that to send small amount of btc when the blockchain is overfilled with unconfirmed transactions will obviously get high fee to get priority over the waiting time is pretty ironical to me.

Bitcoin fees are too high but for now I think only ethereum and bch could eventually compete with it...

#This was one of the reason the rem looked so nice  when I invested. Although the fees don't have to deal with the amount of bitcoin.But it would be unwise to say it a Ponzi. It doesn't fall in its definition.

yeah bitcoin is indeed suffering from these sever pains these days and i think it has already given a time to fix it on the past but still we are still expereincing this kind of problem. bitcoin always undergo on segwit and hardforks but that didnt help even and infact the problem keeps getting worse and worse day by day due to this scaling/block problems. i didnt really feel those lightning networks that some are always keep saying  or maybe that has not yet been implemented?  past is totally different from the present of bitcoin because that time bitcoin was still verry cheap and people arent aware that bitcoins exists but today bitcoins value is friggin high due to the demand that it gets from the public and that is the main reason on why bitcoin networks are really congested.

bitcoin price increase so fees will also follow. miners and exchange sites just doing their business and they do not do it for free so better not send small amount of bitcoin if possible use altcoins to send.

When you tip with bitcoin, you don't tip $1.5, wake up.
Bitcoin is a king, therefore if you tip like a king, than you have to tip like a king, not like a pigeon.
Tip 0.01 Bitcoin, and everything will make total sense.

i told that all the time, bitcoin is useless garbage thats what caused litecoins recente one day 60% plus

i rather think we should get rid of the energy and ressource wasting stupidity kings

Oh, do you see any garbage worth $ 14,000?

Do you even own 0.01 BTC?  If not, I have a rubber hose I want to give to you for Christmas.

I've seen truckloads of crushed aluminum cans hauled out of a landfill once...and until it's cashed in that's essentially what it is...garbage.  The cans were probably worth about that much.  Ironically it's really difficult to tip using aluminum cans since the person receiving such a tip would need to go to a recycling center to cash it in.  The time that it would take out of their day (or the person giving the tip should they cash in the cans) would be about the equivalent cost of the fees.  So there's your analogy all tied up in a red ribbon.

Wow I'm a creative smartass sometimes....

I think you are missing the point, it's clear you shouldn't use bitcoin now for small transactions but to store high value and to transfer large amounts. $25 fee on $14,500 to transfer is less than 0.2% which is far cheaper than any exchange or bank.

When enough people figure this out we'll see alt-coins passing BTC in both price and market cap.  Is that what you want?  Or do you want the devs to fix the scalability problems?

behind the stupidity of the banksters there is no seriouseness, there is no one in the world that "works" for bitcoins, they all works for other currencies. and only the stupidity of the bankster cartels are causing bitcoin to have such value.

besides i would never accept bitcoin for anything anymore i paid once 60 USD for two transactions and i will never accept that piece of junk on my computer anymore.

I don't care how people would look at and even treat Bitcoin. I have learned my lessons and continue to hold on to my Bitcoins. Bitcoin has been called every single name in this world and where it is right now? It is high above every single cryptocurrency. And that is more than enough for me to buy even more if my savings would only allow it. As for now, I am contented with the growth of my portfolio's value which is mostly brought by the growth of Bitcoin's value as well.

jep you will go down with the bitcoin titanic for your stubornness

I wouldn’t call it garbage,  but sadly, unless things change, The dream of bitcoin becoming a world currency is going to die.  Bitcoin seems to be assuming the role of “store of wealth” or “digital gold”.  

It costs me $10 per transactions to trade stocks ...  seems like that is what bitcoin is becoming.  It’s trading like a stock.  

If you don't like it then don't get involve with it. I know that we'll find a way to solve these problems and I believe in bitcoin.

The cost he pays for each transaction is fixed and it has not changed over the past year so why do you think bitcoin is garbage? One year ago we still had to accept a fee of 10,000 - 100,000 sts ~ $ 0.5 but when the bitcoin value increased drastically and the bitcoin price was ~ $ 14,000 then the transaction fee was ~ $ 13. That's why it's not garbage and it's always been that way.

Damn, right.

So basically you are shilling BCH? Lol. How I remember Lauda painting red to those people who shilled it. And you are not a troll? Oh well...

That name really suits. Goodluck filming!

that s not how it was intedet to be used, its becoming just an empty energywasting object of speculation, a stock is at least a contracted financial basis for a productive value generating enterprise, bitcoin is the opposite of that a an valuedestroying energy wasting system, i am pretty sure there will be a tsunami in the future in the bitcoin world

Yes I really do agree on you. Bitcoin is not a garbage. If it is a garbage then why bitcoin really help other people? Why it is more useful right now? Bitcoin is a digital cryptocurrency, bitcoin is a money from the internet that right now is very useful. As we can see right now, technology is very important for us to work with bitcoin, it is really popular right this time. And it is really helpful that I hope it will take forever.

Same here. But What is wrong with this other people here. They are all bitcoin users. If they think that they cannot benefit anymore then it will easy for them to change their mind and find another way to cling on.  And if their problem that bitcoin is garbage then so what? It is a problem that is turned into a solution. Bitcoin helps us a lot. Bitcoin may be garbage, but garbage is money, garbage is a constant source of revenues. And this garbage (bitcoin) has a big potential to lead us into our future success. For those who still believe in bitcoin lets continue supporting it.

Maybe because it was the first cryptocurrency with the highest level of acceptance and integration into the payment systems, laws and so on? It's also the most popular one with a name and logo recognized all around the world? Or maybe because it's used as a base for all altcoin trading as exchanges that don't offer fiat-crypto pairs are all built around BTC? Or maybe because it's one of the few that you can actually spend in physical stores? Or maybe because it's leading the way and if it fails due to harsh laws and policies then all the other altcoins will suffer the same fate?


I've said it because of 2 things.
1. I know OP is using every opportunity to troll BTC and its users because he's just that type of a guy. He comes here every time he feels like telling us how pathetic we all are. It's like going to church to tell people that it's stupid to believe in something that doesn't exist.
2. Unfortunately BTC in its current state requires you to think and learn. the 90% you're talking about will have to wait until the software gets more newbie friendly.

The fees are the garbage not bitcoin itself. If you want to make the fees more worth it we must have sent a larger amount for us to see the worth of our fees.

bitcoin in todays price is precious. better use altcoins on tipping.
the fees are high because bitcoin is hard to mined. better use other cryptocurrency instead

I'm so tired of this excuse...."to spend less fees you need to spend more overall".  This is why rich people stay rich and poor people stay poor...because rich people want value for their money...they have learned and probably conditioned from birth to not just give away their money.  People with a poverty mentality will accept your philosophy...and then spend their entire lives wondering why they are poor.

Are you posting to up your post count or do you have an original thought that might lead us to a solution?  I'm pretty certain that I know where you are from so I must ask...have you ever actually spent any of your BTC?  Somehow I doubt it since I don't believe that there are any vendors within your reach.  In other words, until you understand the problem via your own experiences and the hassles that came with them, you are not part of the solution...you are only part of the problem.

Yeah agree with you just a day before yesterday blockchain asked for $8 to transfer $7 in btc. I mean how is that even possible and why would someone do it? If these things continue to.happen it marks the end of bitcoin era just after its beginning.

if you think that bitcoin is garbage , maybe you should read more about bitcoin , dont say bitcoin is a garbage , think it , if bitcoin is a garbage , you think some millionaire will invest at bitcoin?
bitcoin is a garbage? nope, impossible..

Seriously that 13$ fee on 1.50$ transaction was too much, I wonder who was the person sending out hat transaction lol

It would be like having Gold vs Silver or 500 Euro notes and 5 Euro notes one is easier to spend on small transactions than another.

I see your point....but at the same time I wish more people told me that I was crazy or stupid for my beliefs in a business I got involved in about 10 years ago.  If more people cornered me and made me think longer and harder, I think I wouldn't have made even half of the mistakes I made.  Instead I was surrounded mostly by cheerleaders.  Most people wouldn't believe the amount of money I lost and it's difficult to justify it as a learning experience.  You might not like it but someday hindsight will be 20/20.  Maybe what I said now might make a difference in your life.  I have no idea.  I hang out here to learn about the average BTC "investor" since so much has changed since I first learned of it in 2011 and then forgot about it.  Things have changed so much since then.  The vision that I heard on a podcast with the original dev team doesn't sound anything like we are seeing today...and I find myself seeing my overly positive attitude here with so many.  It's hard not to speak ones mind if they are honest...and I don't think Rawdog can help it...especially if he is honest and has a conscience.

If we talk about fee and this is the good option. Litecoin etherium and dash is very smaller than bitcoin fee.
I like altcoin with smaller fee to send

No bitcoin cannot be considered as a garbage it is kind of assets because in future the value will go upto1million

Why do you saying that the bitcoin is garbage? The bitcoin help me to earned money for my families and to help our expenses in our home. So why do you saying the bitcoin is garbage? The bitcoin is very powerful because it can keep the poor people to be a rich man. I want all of my family members to be a bitcoin user to help them in their personal expenses.

Bitcoin is garbage. that's what other people think about having trouble earning
It's not just time now
if you know how much bitcoin you can use but you only know how little you are to get married and do yourself
waste they do not know and how much bitcoin is today

Why the hell you are considering this system with a garbage? Have you any concrete and the logical issue regarding this opinion? I completely disagree with you on this matter. I think Bitcoin is getting accepted in a lot of developed countries as well as many online platforms.
If you have a little idea in terms of Bitcoin then you may not think as so. I recommend you study regarding this virtual currency and analysis of the recent time's price trend. I hope you will make a good conclusion if you can follow my advice. Bitcoin is not only a currency but also it's a profitable source of money.

I dont think so bitcoin is garbage! How could you say this? Bitcoin is been so useful, for everyone of us its had a lot of benefits, we can do more to get money, investment,capital, profit and so on..

You sounds like you never got any profit from Bitcoin.. Fees are high i agree but, you can't say the whole thing is garbage.. There are lot of people who found diamonds in that so called ' garbage'.

Bitcoin is not garbage, it's a valuable investment, in the long run.

And although in my opinion bitcoin will be asking, but not for a lot and then it will be stable.

Bitcoin wasn't a garbage tho. Due to its price raises so up nowadays, some couldn't afford it. Thus some wouldn't buy it for now because they are thinking and waiting for its price decrease again. And, Bitcoin is a looooong term investment. I've had converted 40Php (1 USD) back then now it is 2USD. It's still worth it.

Yep, definitely not garbage. not as right now. I dont see it.

WOW I dig it, some truth telling on this FORUM, u normally just see like minded circle jerking, and bias confirmation that the we're in a world of shit, and nobody smells the shit.

Emperors New Clothing comes to mind with BTC, and nobody is allowed to say that the Emperor has Alzheimer and is a a zombie

...

This is all the shake-out, eventually I concur it will be clear which is the correct coin,

IMHO BTC is for savings for rich ppl, it should not be used for day-trading or micro-transactions, but agreed all changes from satoshi are bullshit, these miscreants should have just written their own code from scratch, but stealing open-source and destroying it enables private profits,

SATOSHI didn't care about this enabling of certain company's, he was an anarchist,

Bring ANARCHY back to BITCOIN ::)

It's not garbage but its been balkanized, neutered, and repackaged into something that even a mother wouldn't allow into her house.

Still, garbage bitkoyn, in my opinion, no one called. Expensive garbage is obtained at a price of 15,000 dollars. A tip does not necessarily translate into bitkoyne. On that they tip that they are considered a pocket trifle. However, this bitkoyin already eliminated. A successful transaction was implemented using a network of "lightning", which provides a very fast transaction bitkoyna and allows you to transfer small amounts with low commission costs. After such improvements, the popularity of bitcoins should increase.

This is one of the big issues facing bitcoin at this stage. It is not suitable for small transactions. After all, it is too expensive, which is obviously not a reasonable channel.

For me bitcoin is not a garbage.it is really helped me and my family so much things.especially the educatoun of my children and now i earned to build a new and much bigger house than before because of the bitcoin.so how can you say that bitcoin is a garbage dont judge bitcoin if you dont know the importance of it!

BERNIE MADOFF made a lot of ppl rich, but he also hurt a lot of people, this is the point of BITCOIN, to only focus on winners, and deny losers exist

Winners of every PONZI will always protect it in earnest, until it bites them, then they will be 'shocked'.

That dream is still alive: Bitcoin Cash works exactly like Satoshi wanted it to because it is exactly like Satoshi's Bitcoin with no fukcing SegWit.


You are just the beneficiary of good timing.  Me too.  But, that doesn't preclude the fact that the network is all fucked up with unnecessary congestion and super high fees.  


$13.46 actually.  Don't forget the .46

SegWit Bitcoin is garbage.  The other Bitcoin is good.

I know the situation is bad but not this bad at this point which I honestly beleived it should not get to this point but at this pont there is hardly anything we can do about it but that does not make bitcoin a garbage as you have made it sound. I also believe that this will pass too just like several other issues that have happened in the past. On the issue of SegWit, its going to solve some problem and its roll out is in phases and when it fully circulates, it makes things more cheaper than what we are currently facing.

with the news like this, it's one big risk too, but despite such risks. does not mean we can call that bitcoin garbage.
because the world of reality is also a lot of sudaah assisted by the presence of bitcoin in circulation.

I am not sure if it will collapse with a BOOM. Price will decrease more and more over a long time period once people lose trust in Bitcoin.

Bitoshi are you an anyonymous account of satoshi nakamoto? hy man,

that message was very great, very intelligent, once the distrust and hatred towards bitcoin reaches a critical mass bitcoin price will collapse, that can happen very quickly and there are many reasons that cannot be solved.

transaction costs,
energy waste,
slow,

This what we call an encouragement from discouragement some sort of like this, we can get positive reliability while some others give negative response or in other words they bash bitcoin, but what are we really up to is not from the response of any other it's between bitcoin an individual user of bitcoin.

Man, I honestly don't know what to say now because you totally have a point. Most of the time I prefer Litecoins to send money abroad instead of bitcoin because of the fees. However, I cannot say that bitcoin is garbage because I earned millions out of thin air.

It was said when bitcoin was first introduced yet here we are now multiplying multiple times than the previous price. People like you who always think bad about bitcoin should not invest on cryptocurrency. You better bank your money and just earn 1% per annum on it while we invest bitcoin and earn 200-300% of our investment. It is also good to take the risk and earn something than doing nothing.

So this is what this thread was all about. Bitcoin is garbage because BCH is the new king :D
This started as a complain and ended up as sucking off Roger Ver's shitcoin.


You can always afford Bitcoin, just not a whole one and doesn't affect your potential profits. You can still double your investment now just like you could do it when Bitcoin was worth half of what it is now.

who said that bitcoin is garbage, if you then i ask from you that what are you doing in bitcoin forum, as of my opinion bitcoin is so far better than others.the only thing which is not good is that its price movements, every time and in seconds to seconds its price appreciate and deppreciate for which people feel fear,  because people do not want to be on loss.every person eyes is on to earn money and maximize its profit.

I totally agree, it's amazing to have to pay more expensive fees for something that wants to decentralize

Each and every coin in the crypto currency network will have a bottle neck period when there are a multi million users transacting and each and every coin present in the entire crypto space will cramp up,so it is not just the problem with bitcoin alone,it is the problem with each and  every coin,but bitcoin can still use the same fees to sent millions of dollars too,do not forget that. :P

Well, Bitcoin is not a garbage, but transaction fee is a major problem. I believe there is an urgent need to address this issue.

This garbage makes many billionaires and millionairess.the reasons was btc price is soo high now.if you dont link btc anymore you can use etherum and other altcoins

the fundamentals changed. The goal is not using bitcoin any more. It's making money. It's that simple.

The older investors are waiting for new comers to pay premium and it's not earned equally. You have to spend more everyday to someone that paid less at an earlier date.

Apart from cost of mining and development, there is no valuation so it's based on hype. /bitcoin is the source of hype and you surrounding yourself with similar minded people only adds to your delusion.

SO TRUE !  no other words to this comment.

RawDog, you are part of the few whoreally think with their brain and not saying "HOLDL, to the Moon" or other shits.

This garbage you say is gives a lot of earning also make a person a better life and change way of living in many lives in bitcoin user. And the reason why is still become popular because of many people get interested and also because of rising value of bitcoin.

As long as it stays above $12, I'm holding.

other user said very good :

"BERNIE MADOFF made a lot of ppl rich, but he also hurt a lot of people, this is the point of BITCOIN, to only focus on winners, and deny losers exist.

Winners of every PONZI will always protect it in earnest, until it bites them, then they will be 'shocked' .

In Madoff's case more people people got hurt. It wasn't even close to a 50/50, i'd say it was like 80/20 in favor of the broke. He was running an inefficient trading system since the beginning that worked only because some of those wealthy investors didn't need to cash out. He was taking 100 million from an investor and paying him 1 million a year from his own money, telling him that it's the profits and his 100 m is still there, while it wasn't.

Bitcoin isn't a ponzi scheme because there's nobody running it and taking the profits. It's simple economy running itself, but people used to a centralized system that doesn't give them full control can't understand it.

no why not...

It seems to me that the error is Satoshi Nakamoto was the fact that he didn't report the growth mechanism of the unit automatically in the system. The rate of mining coins, there is but indicative of the speed of transaction confirmation no. Perhaps in the future there will be a fixed price transaction that will benefit production and not to Rob users.

Yes! Bitcoin is definitely a garbage. High fees, slow transaction, so volatile, bubble and so on. Litecoin will be the next garbage.

not really

I'm not really digging the idea of not increasing the blocksize even to 2mb, but lightning is legit. Also, imo, the idea behind BCH is also legit. If anything, just for the sake of the experiment. But the people backing this coin, Ver and Wu? Yeah, no thx. These people are not in it because they think BCH is the "true vision of satoshi" or some similar retarded argument. They're in it because they want to be kings of crypto. They want bcash (suck it Ver) to eventually overtake the real bitcoin. Their relevance and corporate survival (at least for Wu) depend on it. I feel sorry for those that have been duped into believing they're saving bitcoin. I mean, I have some gripes with the core team, particularly Luke Jr., but Ver and Wu would mean the end of bitcoin at some point.

so,Blockstream  shit needed SegWit to make Lightning work, right ?  ;D :D :D :D

As explained by mr. Antonopoulos, Segwit is not REQUIRED to make lightning work, but it sure as hell makes things easier. Some aspects of lightning wouldn't be possible without segwit.

Ver and Wu are not good but Blockstream is great, correct?  ::)

I'm so sorry for the people who missed to understand what the bitcoin is all about and what is its true value. Don't know how else to say this. Bitcoin transactions has its price, like everything else in this world. When you are using your credit card that also has the price, everyone is forgetting about that. Or any other service you can think of.
Yes, fees are higher than before but there are reasons for that. At the end if you don't like it you don't have to use it, simple as that. No one is forcing anyone to use bitcoin so stop complaining.

It is just not a good idea to make casual payments with BTC. BTC is more for holdings like digital gold, and of course, for speculations.

For "digital cash" transactions just use DASH with instapayment and everything will be fine. There are lots of not so well known options too.

And please stop spam with worthless BCH shit. It is just clone of BTC with all drawbacks. The only "advantage" of BCH is that nobody actually uses it, so, yes, transactions are fast and cheap, but only because, again, nobody uses it.

yes there are better coins then those you mention now. But there too are just better known by the mass, and therefor in demand.

Everybody considering bitcoin garbage.... can you please let me have it?

i agree, that it is not useful.
Yesterday I had to go and start to use another payment solution which was not crypto because of the high fees of BTC.
I had to pay for my subscription of digital goods and the high fee was annoying as f.

Bitcoin fees are very high now.anyone do not transaction small amount.because fees.

This is so ridiculous that this person is using such words for bitcoin just because of transaction fees. Bitcoin is not a garbage at all, it is a blessing. Why you don’t look at other positive things that bitcoin has done to the society? It is so easy to blame it for high transaction fees but very tough for some people to praise it for all goods it is ding ti the society. Indeed, after activation of this very system, all is going to be fine, just be patient.

my card has NO fee. I don't pay any fee for any online or offline transaction and it is INSTANT. Don't tell me about settlement which may take a week.

all the vendors are receiving their funds within 1-2 days. it's all it matters. make an online transaction by using gold and it has a very modest fee. YES, it is possible and it's instant too :)

Garbage costing more than 15,000 dollars at the moment, this is too expensive rubbish. If we talk about the shortcomings of bitcoins, such as slow transactions and too high commission costs, then these problems seem to have been resolved. Recently, bitcoin transactions with the "lightning" project have been successfully completed, when we no longer need to wait for a long time for transactions and they will be made very quickly. Also this project allows you to carry out transactions with small amounts and commissions will be less than one dollar.

If they dont like the fee then there is no reason for it to call that bitcoin is a garbage and perhaps we all know that bitcoin are really helpful specially in our life it helps a lot so after we have been benefited by it and now experiencing some that you are not likely it was not a reason to be called it as a garbage.

Bitcoin is good crypto currency.But bitcoin transaction fee is too much.I wanted to make a small transaction but fee is very high, then I stop this :'(

I do not agree that bitcoin is garbage, but if the administration has had the problem of scalability.
The fees are horrible, and if the problem is not solved soon, another currency will take the place of bitcoin.
The refuge of value is a consequence of utility.

Not even Bitcoin Core believed that the fees would be so high, which shows how badly they have addressed the problem.

https://i.imgur.com/CVUwzQ3.png
source: https://bitcoincore.org/en/2015/12/23/capacity-increases-faq/

Hello! Very strange situation here!

I think that bitkoin was created for trial manipulation, so there is no need to impose high hopes on it

just amazing the price of fees, I've had the case several times as well

Bitcoin is very useful; it’s not like ponzi scheme at all. It is allowing investors to grow and make good amount of money in order to make their living standard good and enlist their name in the rich of tomorrow. It is allowing them to reduce unemployment to some extent. It’s just the beginning it has much more to achieve and give a high output to investors

Hey guys don't take the OP serious. This post was created by the person just to take benefit of the time when bitcoin price has gone a little down, mean while it will work as a convincing tool for the people to invest in the alts. By the way such a shame, these things are not gonna work for them.
Here we are going with higher goals with bitcoin. People here have not invested into to bitcoin to give someone a tip of $1.5. Bitcoin is not for micro payments, it's mean to be a medium of macro payments. Even if it charges more I will still prefer it over any altcoin.

There is not a single coin that has a better scalibility without compromising decentralization and network security. Littecon and bcash are complete garbage.

The author is absolutely right, because with such a commission it is impossible to make payments for small amounts. I understand the author's feelings, because he decided to spend 1.5 dollars, and spent 13, which is to say, in this situation it is better to use paper notes, but I am sure that in the future we will be able to pay bitcoin as well as ordinary money and the commission will be minimal.

Shit comment. Even Satoshi himself said that bitcoin was an alternative for the unbanked population, which represents 40% of the world's population.
The fees of bitcoin over $ 15 dollars, or even less, are more expensive than what 50% of the Latin American population earns daily.

People and comments like this do not contribute anything. This is a real problem, and your talking about the price going up.

Regarding decentralization, at what moment will the fees be more expensive than maintaining a node?
Do not you see the absurdity of the situation?

He paid that much because he wanted to be a quick transfer. You can change the fees if you want to.

bitcoin is verry useful for most of us especially earners and sellers because we dont get affected by these high trasaction fees problem because were  not sending any coins to other users anyway yet were only selling our coins and exchange it into our local wallets, sure it can also cost when converting but not that expensive enough when sending your bitcoins straight to your wallet on to someone else. its a good and  smart idea if you can only choose another coin or altcoin like litecoin or etherium to send a payment to someone in order to avoid such high fees. overall i must say that bitcoin is not a garbage for us rather it is the most  preciuos  and valuable thing ever invented.

Yeah it doesn`t make sense to pay more fee than the real amount but he tries to send it when btc is in uncontrol rise which is chaos in this scenario so this things happen and we shouldn`t judge from a single transaction

Hashanah these people are only here to get their own benefit. I always think why people are getting to be such selfish that for their own sake of interest, they make notorious roamers about something and try to degrade that. They shouldn’t be doing it. If you have some good idea or you want to sell something else, then market it. Don’t use such unethical and cheap way of selling.

That is not the problem of bitcoin, but the wallet's. Blockchain.info puts really high fees sometimes and there is no explanation why sometimes it is low and why it is not normal high. But just like the other people said already - Etherum is going to be better decision for transactions for you. I think soon all transactions are going to be provide in ETH due it's loyal fees.

Seems most of  your posts are sour on BTC, but I agree. Noobs are buying BTC only to store it away with no clue of what BTC really is. They hear the news or watch TV and are driven to buy it just cause mark cuban says it will make them rich. Lol. There are alt coins or will be that are 10x superior to btc. Maximalist will say no way and be deluded in their fantasy that btc will always be forever king. It will be for many years but that will change as soon as a new technology gets adopted. Will the price crash to 0? I don’t think so. But the other technology will take over. Which coin will it be? Who knows. With a supply of just 22 million that means only a few will have control to manipulate the market. It happens already in exchanges even though people want to deny it. Like I say manipulation in crypto is worse than Wall Street. It works out for us though since we accumulate more. But people are getting deluded.

People invests for the future. Even the fee is high due to the low throughput right now, but imagine that the lightening network is coming now. The payment fee will be low at that time.

What if he ends up being like chicken little and be right in the end? No one can predict the future. People are getting a bit crazy with the news not helping at all. Even my grandma wants to invest in it with NO IDEA what bitcoin really is. So that’s what’s driving prices up. IMO. Funny thing is say my grandma wants to buy $1000 in btc thinking it’s real money while in reality it’s virtual and while you can buy more things with it you really can’t buy barely nothing with it. Plus the transactions fees will eat the noobs with .0001 btc alive. Just saying.

Please everybody knows that this is a BTC forum, and that ETH is a piss-poor clone of BTC, that is created by a 16 year old man-child with no hair between his legs.

Let it go, downgrading the thread by mentioning Ether is like some kind of Scientology BS, again the thread here is about BTC, and ether is not, nor will it ever be BTC.

For the simple reason that good people created BTC, and BTC had no pre-mining, nor marketing, BTC is an organic evolution.

Ether on the other hand pre-mined 10Million coins, and has them all in a few hands, all the ppl who develop on github get nothing from GETH, yet on BTC the orginal ppl have been generous as 1,000's of people have coin on BTC, but again because all the ETH coin is in a few greedy hands, they have not even been willing to share with their own dev's, thus today the dev on GITHUB for ETH has been dead for years, while for BTC its flourishing.

The pre-mining model doesn't work, the bounty model, and mlm model, and all the token's is all bullshit, you want BTC, then U follow the BTC organic evolution by allowing 1,000's of people to do early mining and get coin, and share that coin with others.

Yup that is the problem I see. Bitcoin supposed to be a cheaper and faster alternative for other form forms of payment but right now the transaction fees are killing us and the dream of of Bitcoin becoming one of the consumer's top choices as a mode of payment. The burden of incurring additional cost (which is now more expensive than bank transfers) for sending money is really not appealing especially if we are looking for it to be adapted as a mode of payment alternative. The fees must be appealing to us consumers in order for it to be consumer worthy again.

I see the reason you are calling bitcoin to be garbage is that of the transaction fees that are required these days for each transaction. To a great extent, even I think that the transaction fees are too damm high. Bitcoin was created to become another form of currency that would be fast and easy to use but the transaction fees are killing it. One of my transaction is stuck from 2 days even after giving a transaction fee.

He's a fool, why do small deals with bitcoin even though it's just a tip. Just take the money in your wallet and tip him, the business is done.

transaction' fees might be high, but sometimes we need this one groundbreaking tech to open our minds to future possibilities- even if it's not perfected yet. Bitcoin is not trash, it is what triggered the whole crypto revolution that we all going to be a part of.

First of all, as someone else said, you use altcoins for small stuff and Bitcoins for large transactions. And second, I think everyone else here agrees with you on the matter of fees being too high.

The OP is just a fan of bitcoinshitcash dont listen to him

He knows bitcoinshitcash will never be successful on its own, so he bashes bitcoin every time he can :D

Goodness, this is eye opening. What I find ridiculous is people who are justifying these high fees. Please let make Bitcoin great again.


Why should people listen to him if his points are valid? You are the one I would advise against listening to, if just because you dont like what he likes. Now you are advocating against him. Thats ridiculous.

You are partly right, bitcoin HAS internal problems that desperately NEED to be solved

but the SegWit part is just wrong. Both the addresses used in the cited transactions are not SegWit. You cannot expect to receive the benefits of SegWit using the non-SegWit addresses. When more people use SegWit everybody will benefit from it too.

It's more comparable to gold (store of value), then a payment system, at least at the moment. It would be nice if they could fix the fees and speed though.

Bitcoin is a garbage? where do you get that Idea? Bitcoin isn't a garbage ever, do you think it is a garbage if it is really useful in everydays life? Bitcoin isn't a garbage because if it is a garbage then why many people trust in this? It will never be a garbage because you can really gain such a good amount in this, you can gain a good profit or an extra income because of this and it can really help on daily needs so, it is really impossible that it will just be a garbage.

no it is not a garbage because many people rising thier life because of bitcoin so that bitcoin is not a garbage and bitcoin help us in our life so it is not a garbage

Transaction fee is the only problem if it really is a payment system since it is more expensive than taxes. That what makes Bitcoin not good for payments most especially smaller transactions such as tipping because we will expect to pay more than the amount we give as tip. But still Bitcoin is a good investment for me no doubt regardless of fee and tax when we cash it out on local exchanges.

why consider it as a garbage? because it is not useful? or youre not just using it the way it must be?
but in others opinion its not useful because its just a digital currency just like the others they have different kinds of uses
so why do you say bitcoin is a garbage of there are also currencies below it

It's merely a collectors item for rich people now. It can never be the currency it was intended to be anymore. I have sold all my bitcoin and will probably never buy any ever again, i have moved on to alts in the hope that they can keep the original crypto dream alive!

None of those adresses are segwit
How do you expect to get the benefits of segwit if you don't use it?

I agree that the commission is very high for transactions and with initial commissions!

We all know the pain everytime we send a transaction to the network due to high transaction fees especially to those hadn't large amount of bitcoins i don't know there is a spam going on or it's just we have too many users at the moment plus, the current price have a huge effect on the transaction fees just keep your patience a little longer because lightning network is on the way and currently test on the main networks sooner or later we will have LN and see how this plays out.

are you sure of this opinion. if garbage why lots of people searching? I rada bitcoin instead of garbage, bitcoin is the financial future of the world

Bitcoin is the future currency. The thing you may be worried about will be solved soon enough. So you do not need to spread wrong information here. Bitcoin is the best say to invest your money for the future. The wise people are already benefiting from bitcoin. Bitcoin is not a good option for transferring or paying money. And it is not meant to be used in that way also. It is type of an investment.

So you should never be worried about little hurdles as they will be solved very soon. And bitcoin will see another good year just like 2017. So it is the best time to invest.

Yes - and this is the solution: Adam Back will tell you that the fees have been cut in half from $13.46 to $6.73 because Lightning is a HUGE success and that he and his team are brilliant.  Fees payable directly to Blockstream company.  Every transaction on Lightning network will send money to Adam Back and his investors at AXA.  And you people are lining up to pay those fees because you are too dumb to understand the privatization of Bitcoin.  No thanks, I am going with the real Bitcoin, the whitepaper Bitcoin - Bitcoin Cash.

Proof of Ponzi - wow..great info.

Why are you using bitcoins for such small transactions? You're wrong I think. Use bitcoin just for a sizable kperluan, buying a beverage with bitcoin is just the same as silly stuff.

In practical application of payment, bitcoin there are many areas for improvement

If you send inside the USA perhaps you do not to pay a fee.
I can send EURO 1.50 to my neighbor and pay no fee.
But if you want to send to another country and in another currency?
(Sometimes you do not pay a fee for the exchange but have a bad exchange rate.)
It is possible to let the receiver pay the fee or a part of the fee however in that case he will receive less.
And yes there are cheaper way to send money.

People who don’t have enough resources to buy it they call it garbage because now its prices has gone so wild that only millionaires can invest into bitcoin and for them this a hen which is lying golden egg and there may be a chance that its prices will come down then there may be a chance that people statement will be changed and all this will depend on the prices if prices come down then mediocre level get into it,

What you noobs dont understand is bitcoin is the best we have. Other faster coins either have larger blocks or low volume. They dont have better tech or security.

It’s a very bad and sad news about bitcoin and I have no idea that why people are using such a words for bitcoin we are not giving something to bitcoin we are just giving time to bitcoin and as a result bitcoin is giving us money and every day I’m going to see some people are giving wrong statements about bitcoin some of the people are saying its dead and someone are saying its price is going down which is not good so we need to be very positive about bitcoin.

As much as i would lke to deny it, i cannot. This is slowly becoming a reality.

Bitcoin today just isn't like bitcoin a few years ago. Yes, its price has become really high and has gotten far - breaking record by record it sets. But the thing is, it is not as convenient as it used to be. It is not as useful as what it was back then,.

But despite all these. I still am not losing hope in bitcoin. I still believe bitcoin will overcome this challenge. It has already overcome a lot over the years. And if it doesn't manage to over come this predicament, then bitcoin doesn't deserve the trust i give along with other people's faith in bitcoin.

No bitcoin now is very bad payment system.
SegWit can help and make network better than now{1 MB is big problem}.
we need better payment system
 

I quite agree segwit didn't help with anything at all, it promised that the transaction fees was going to get lower and transaction time will be shorter, but it seems that the exact opposite is happening which is making things very difficult.

+1 to that.
Its not and never will be a payment system, it is a commodity.

I have been trying to tell people this would happen for so long but no one wants to listen.

Stubbornness is a strange thing, why people are willing to pay such huge transaction fees rather than admit bitcoin isn't a sensible payments system I will never understand.

I don't think many people really see bitcoin as a finished product or something that is suitable as a payment system right now. The fees will probably never be suitable for micro transactions as described. Bitcoin also cannot be useful right now due to the price fluctuations. But give it time, there is hope.

Honestly I do not understand why people don't go for manual fees. You do not need an instant transaction to pay Andreas a tip. After paying high fees is not the answer and not everyone accepts altcoin. I am sure it is going to take even more time to repair the fees trouble and I think we should go for manual transaction fees and we should wait a little it is better than paying a lot of fees only if you want use Bitcoin till now.

Honestly speaking, you get the idea of bitcoin all wrong. The way I see it, Bitcoin is not meant for giving tips. You wanna know why? Cause it is not garbage. I don't think bitcoin is here to take over the entire uses of national currency. Tips is a kind of thing you would do with dollar or euro. If you can't accept it then yes bitcoin really is garbage.

well, Bitcoin was created to be  a peer to peer currency. currency means you can tip, you can buy a coffee instantly.

can you do that with BTC? nope.   in the mean time, the developers (the company that owns BTC) decided otherwise :)

so it's not a digital currency. it's more like a settlement system or store of value but not digital currency.

Yes you are right , much better options tot use for payment.
Altough i think most people who buy btc now don't know that.

Well Bitcoin itself have "0" value, but we, the people make it valuable. But according to current demand and current supply along proof of existence with tremendous computing power's proof of work makes bitcoin unique and more valuable.

Some of characteristics of Bitcoins really bring revolution to world with innovative concept.

bitcoin was supposed to be currency but with this is gone so i think right now bitcoin can uses as store of value

I do not think bitcoin is rubbish, let them look at bitcoin as garbage, I will still look at bitcoin as a promising crown

It’s a very disappointing statement about bitcoin and I really feel bad when I see these kind of questions and answers I believe that there are some people who don’t to see bitcoin high price and they are trying to end bitcoin but it’s a mistake of them that they are using this kind of things world know about bitcoin and that why countries are going to make bitcoin legal because they know how bitcoin is important for them and they are supporting as well.

As long as it can bring us profit, who cares it's garbage or not?

Bitcoin is more a miracle than a technology. It is allowing the mass to earn good amount of money and make their present good and future secure. It is a promising currency and having promising projects for the investors. People are happy to get bitcoin and are working hard there to get some extra money. Bitcoin is not garbage because it is helping in reducing unemployment to some extent

This is due to the high prices of bitcoin. This problem will be solved by the arrival of the Lightning Network.

I just do not know if bitcoin is actually rubbish but I think Bitcoin and other cryptocurrency proponents, we're well-used to hearing disparaging talk about the technology we follow. It's easy and tempting to ignore, whether you're a long-time holder living off the gains, or a newcomer trying to build the financial infrastructure of the future.

Bitcoin's fees are really high rightnow more and more unconfirmed transactions are being applied to the blockchain.

Most of the users of bitcoin did switch to Ether due to the fees.

This usually happens when you use instant transaction. freebitco.in is a site where you can earn bitcoin with mining and with faucets. I don't use faucets since they're just waste of time i use the mining method. So last night i try to transfer my saothisi from site Account to my block chain wallet. I chose the instant transacting option. They cut highly fee and send just few satoshi , i become surprised after that incidence.

Nope, some people bitcoin is not a garbage, may for those who dont have any idea.about.bitcoin, maybe for them its garbage, but for those knows about.bitcoin, for them or for me bitcoin is the great, bitcoin is real.

This is the problem that bitcoin should address in order for bitcoin to succeed but I still believe that in the future bitcoin will become better. If you see bitcoin right now, this problem doesn't affect the price movement, I wonder why but I have to ride on this trend for me to enjoy some profit in the future.

RawDog you make excellent points.

Unfortunately... on this forum we are only pro-bitcoin though. So I am going to have to accuse you of FUD and report you


True story I just got banned because I'm not pro-bitcoin. This place is a joke

+1 million

It's shit. Unusable junk. If you need to transfer and use the coin then u'r shit outta luck. All  you can do is watch the $$$ value rise and giggle like a little school girl thinking how rich you will be if you don't touch it for another 3 years. Let's just all not touch it, miners don't seem to touch it anymore, it's like all of them left.

It's clearly seeable, 120k uncconf for days, never go up never go down, where are the miners? Anyone working the blockchain? Patethic garbage waste of a payment system. I hate it so fkn much can't get any work done for weeks because of this bullshit. I can't fucking wait untill they remove this waste of a shitcurrency from shiops so i am not forced to send this slow unbeareable piece of shit that never fkn conmfirms unless u pay the greedy miner fuck like 100$ for a transaction.

I will be the happiest man in the world when i see BCH/ETH/LTC added to my shops so i can stop using this garbage that is bitcoin and spare my head of more white hairs.

I can also make this statement: Gasoline is garbage.
If i go to a gasoline station an fill a bottle with one liter of gasoline and try to send this bottle to Andreas this will be quite expensive.
In fact most post services don't want to transport this dangerous liquid. 

Bitcoin is not a garbage some people say that but its not thrue because bitcoin has a lot of benefits some people didnt know about bitcoin.bitcoin is not a garbage because it helps the people who do not have a permanent job and also theirs a lot of benefits here in bitcoin

That is a lot for a fee..however couldn't you put it in the whole bill, rather than as a tip- hence you'd only pay the one fee?

I think bitcoin is not a garbage. In fact bitcoin is a precious thing comes from God which able to help every people in this world to become more successful in life.
Bitcoin secures your future because they believe that everyone’s dream is important to achieve the successful society in future.

Bitcoin is not a garbage but it is blessing from God and treasure that reserves from your bright future.
Bitcoin plays a big role in the society which they help to change the life of every individual. Establishing a organize society is also their goal and I don’t see anything trash from them at all.

I understand your point of view mate but It's all about the bitcoin price , not about the fees cause the fees are the same , only the bitcoin price is making things harder. I can see that in the upcoming future , bitcoin can die because if this fees , this is true.

Yeah true, it is ridiculous when people say that bitcoin is garbage. Don't they know how much we earn in bitcoin and how it helps us financially ? To those who said that bitcoin is a garbage. I dont think they know what bitcoin is. Maybe one day they will realise their lost for not believing in bitcoin.

Bitcoin is not garbage. I mean we in all cryptocurrency users can attest to jow cruptocurrency has managed to defy and beat the odds. However I still can see some of your valid points and K think everyone can also see the flaws and weaknesses of it.

Saying bad things about Bitcoin is normal since it is not always profitable due to the changes occurring on the trend. But, once it increases again, it can be profitable for you.

why rubbish?
maybe a sensible person who says bitcoin is rubbish ..
in fact I was lucky to play this bitcoin because my income a lot of luck.
play first what is a new bitcoin if not profitable for you, you deserve to say so.

  I think bitcoin is too big for a tip. That's why there is alternative crypto, it is much smaller and more suitable for small transactions. Bitcoin is not garbage, but real investment.

Why people are just focusing and always into the negative with regards to Bitcoin? People are just into the flaws of Bitcoin even if they are also benefiting into the positive things Bitcoin can do provide to its users. It is just normal that making transactions are really to expensive right now because we all know that Bitcoin price is rising, so the transaction will also be rising because it is an initiative that as the price rises, they can afford paying high transaction fee. So better do transactions with high amount so that you will not complain that the fees are higher than the amount you have spend.

 :o are you reallly a legendary member? i'm confused.... you're trolling aren't you?

garbage? at a price this big and many users depends on it? it is ridiculous to say that bitcoin is garbage. within a year the price of bitcoin increase 2 to 3 times. their is no way bitcoin is garbage. people who invest and the price of bitcoin decreases,we could say negative but not garbage.

it is a bad scheme, if it is fixed and unchanged bitcoin will end miserable
they will switch to altcoin, bitcoin is indeed the first cryptocurenci but if no altcoin bitcoin will not be number one, because there is altcoin underneath

Well, please, all of your, please throw your garbage away. That is not just for cleanliness but for the protection of your health as well. And here I am, a lowly garbage collector ready to serve you. You can send your Private Message to me in case you want your garbage to be collected. I would be very happy to send you my garbage wallet address. What a nice year this would be if a lot of you will be throwing your garbage away and stop saving them despite your garbage remarks and complaints.  ;)

It seems to me that the error is Satoshi Nakamoto was the fact that he didn't report the growth mechanism of the unit automatically in the system. The rate of mining coins, there is but indicative of the speed of transaction confirmation no.

when thinking bitcoin is garbage then the person is nothing more than the junk itself and not understand the internet world

Is not garbage, moreover you can purchase another currencies that are definitely better to 'tip' and do small transactions than bitcoin at this point

Bitcoin was the first cryptocurrency so everyone loves it  ;)

Don't think about paying 1.50$ to Andreas, think big. Think making a 200000$ transactions with multiple outputs. You can do it whenever, from wherever to wherever. If you pay those 13$ fees then in some minutes. Isn't it just wonderful?

And by the way, if you really want to pay Andreas just make a transaction with 1 input and 1-2 output, I think you will be able to do it ;) Use custom fees not 400 sat/byte.

Not saying that It is not a problem, but from my perspective not a big one. Bitcoin is scalable and will solve this somehow (third parties could be useful)

Those people who say bitcoin is a garbage are the real garbage, I can prove to them that bitcoin is not because I am benefited on its great technology. Well if bitcoin is a garbage then this thing is the best garbage ever since bitcoin makes a lot of people rich. I want this garbage so badly, if you can't appreciate bitcoin, I am willing to loot your garbage.

Yes transaction is high now, but with the speed that technology is advancing towards, we will see a lower cost and faster transaction very soon. For now, for small amounts to transfer switch to Ethereum instead. There are more than enough reasons to prove that Bitcoin is changing the world, and sooner or later, it will be integrated in even our everyday life.

Ya I do think too that bitcoin is garbage right now. With the advance technologies nowadays, I still can not believe that the transaction fee of bitcoin is so high and took a very time. I think it is time for bitcoin to make a change or we make a change to move to other cryptocurrencies.

Well its sad that you have to say it is a garbage . Kindly go back and think that today you are earning something due to bitcoin and thus we have altcoins today because of the initial coin called as bitcoin. I do agree that the time to transfer is high in btc but once other coins gain popularity may be they will also take same time . I hope some how unconfirmed transactions also reduces

You know what it is too funny once you heard some people they say that bitcoin is just a trash. The garbage that they called is the asset of other people and become successful indeed.
Bitcoin is not a trash but a blessing which help all of us to become financially stable.

Well i think if it wasn't of bitcoin crypto world might still be unknown. Many people or should i say investors are being hooked up into bitcoins success and perhaps that transaction fee went high due to a massive increase in bitcoins price that time. If we knew that the transaction fee is that high, maybe we should just make our money worth it first before we get it.

I do not agree that Bitcoin is garbage. Many on Bitcoin have earned good money and its price is very high. The future will show the fate of Bitcoin.

If you invested in this coins some years ago and would decide to sell it then you’ll get a sum of money that really very impressive. We are talking about some hundreds percent of profit. Think about it!

  In addition, this guy who is trying to buy coffee for bitcoin, will have to wait a few days for confirmation of his transaction, otherwise he will not invest in 30 dollars. Therefore while bitcoin garbage is doubly. He obviously does not perform his basic function - a means of payment.

Bitcoin is not a garbage. Why? Coz you cant find BTC on trash can! Haha. Kidding.  But seriously why these people say so that BTC is garbage? They should search that bitcoin can help us an easy way of transaction and somehow can give us profit.

Do not  invest  if you really think that bitcoin has a miserable end. Your investment will be wasted   Lol!

If Bitcoin is garbage, send it to me. I will be happy to take your garbage. As the saying goes, one mans junk is another mans treasure! :)

Too much saying about transaction fees and waiting time, but we can't blame someone because things are really just different now, BTC is harder to mine and the network is congested. If they won't be able to find solutions in the underlying problems here then people will really start go to altcoins, BTC might be the purest and truest of all the crytocurrencies but the flaws are popping out. I will wait till the lightning network will go on functional. This will be bad if that won't solve the problem.

BITCOIN is bubble, therefore it is dangerous. BTC has increased more than 20 times since the beginning of this year, from around a thousand dollars to almost 20,000 at the climax of December. Not only the strength of this growth is impressive, but also the short period of time it took place.

Yes it's slow and the fees are ten times higher than anything else plus the lightning network
and Segwit are just excuses to keep playing people along with the hubs in LN being little
more than mini banks but don't worry they promise to keep the fees low but where have i
come across that one before.

The development team have had weeks to put a maximum limit on fees but it is obvious by
now they won't because they are running the mines and have sold out.

I FEEL ANOTHER BAN COMING UP SOON FOR HAVING THE BALLS TO SPEAK THE TRUTH

It's fine to be upset or critical.  But it's not fine to express your opinions in inflammatory posts, because it does not encourage thoughtful conversation.

Network congestion is not something that sells a network and it could be fixed in seconds by the development team
if they had not sold themselves out and if you look at the charts fees/price then the pattern is clear and my advise is
for everyone who's not a gambling addict to put a stop-loss on Bitcoin and sell if it goes below $10,000

20,000 miners to do seven transactions a second is at least 19,000 too many so they have started robbing us
instead to pay for the computer wars they are playing against each other.


 

Was your comment pointed towards me because if so then I would have to ask if it's "Hate Speech" and if it's fine for people here
to keep plugging BTC and making out that everyone is stupid then it must also be fine to say the obvious because I don't make
a habit of having to debate with one hand tied behind my back

Regards Anit-Censorship

You say that is garbage but you have invest in it, if you shit in your own home anyone can do it worst. Im agree with you, it is expensive in taxes/fees but it depends on how quickly do you want it to be done. But please dont shit in your invest and let it grow

So if I buy a car and it's useless then I must not warn other people not to buy one before I have
managed to sell it !

I will tell you who is "shit in your invest" and it's the development team and miners and that
is why the price is down so us "Investors" or should I say gamblers have every right to shout
at board meeting.

"let it grow" I have not seen any of that since fees went silly and if we don't house
clean then it will rub off on all the other coins too so what does that say to you about your
future earning prospect ?

It's a shit post, Why do you think that Bitcoin is becoming a garbage? I don't have anything to say about this issue, Bitcoin is becoming a great platform for making money and gaining profit nowadays. people are getting engaged in this platform for the purpose of making earning money a lot. So it's becoming lucrative along with a worthy platform day by day.

this really is posting does not make sense. who said if bitcoin is garbage, if bitcoin is garbage, surely not many people also participate and support bitcoin to be more advanced, until now. should we also support the development of bitcoin, instead of damaging the good name of bitcoin.

No i did the calculations and to match Tulip Mania it will need to stop (Sit down for this) at $200,000
in today's prices and to reach your number we would need 15 X the number of miners we have today so that's
300,000 and they will all be running quantum computers to play computer wars that need super
cooling so all we need to do is drag the sun down to the earth to feed our power stations.

Yeah oil one day will be $5,000 per gallon but Tulips are assets, like oil, digits are not

 

And we have got Peer to Peer Parking here plus my new "Censorship" token but if we keep this up we will
have so many token that not only will there be not need for money but we won't need Bitcoin

Sorry to the ten other good coins posting in this thread but correct me if I am wrong but could I be
forgiven for calling you black birds and trying to empty the nest of original eggs ???????????????????

Bitcoin is fantastic , buy our coin, buy our coin  :D

 

You may be right. But I can not imagine what a tragedy is.

Ok so i wont come out and blatantly say bitcoin is garbage or that it is going to fail because i truly don't believe that. Now i will say that the op does make a good point when it comes to the transaction fee and speed are horrible at this time. If i ever tip someone i use litecoin or ethereum.  For the mean time like i said i believe new innovations will come out for bitcoin.

Thats too much for a fee. I think bitcoin transaction fees are now getting high because of its value. I hope that it will be fixed soon because that is too much for everyone especially to those who invest in bitcoin.

What the hell??? Bitcoin is a garbage!!!! You must be day dreaming garbage or else you cannot say such a speech.
Bitcoin is the best virtual currency in the world. Not only that it is also the most valuable currency.Last year the price of Bitcoin was started with only 9000$ and ended with 16k$
This year if the price of Bitcoin rise like the last year then we will see the price at 40k$. So to becoming sure that if you invest now then there is a chance of a profit of 20k$ with in just a year. Again if you see the other people then you will observe that people are becoming addicted to bitcoin. That is the people are investing more and more in Bitcoin. The price of bitcoin will not be down easily. According to some economist, one day Bitcoin will rule the world. So if you want my suggestion then instead of storing it, invest it. More and more investment will make more and more profit.
So Bitcoin is not a garbage at all

There are really cases that it is not pleasing to everyone, especially the transaction fees. However, there are other cryptocurrency out there that you can use like altcoin.

No! Bitcoin is not a garbage, bitcoin is such a precious like gold, because bitcoin has a higher value than our real money, and it can change your life when you earn bitcoin, that's it is not a garbage it is like a gold.

Bitcoin is not a garbage but I really don't understand why the world need so many crypto currencies? Who can answer me?

Current bitcoin constraint is on the fee tx and the rest bitcoin is promising investment option. Bitcoin isn't a garbage unless worth billions of dollars.

then what are you doing here if you don;t like it?

Exactly. Something that can give you a pretty good amount of money can't be garbage and bitcoin can actually make you rich. A lotnof people, relevant people at that, support bitcoin and it's technology so its really far from being garbage

Since the value of bitcoins today is massively increasing then it only means that most of the altcoins will be really profitable because some of the investors will also be interested on investing in any altcoins, it was cheaper and some of the stores that are accepting bitcoins should also accept altcoins in order to have a micro payment.

I think that over time these nuances will be taken into account, and the commission will be less. While it is too early to talk about the everyday use of bitcoin, it is still too young.

The way I see it, Bitcoin is not meant for giving tips.

Bitcoin is garbage.

And when the price gets low enough, we will have a whole bunch of garbage collectors buying it up.

8)

so we cant tell bitcoin a garbage.it is the 1st crypto currency.and it is the heart of  crypto world.it is true that fees is too much.so new solution must find for them instead of calling it a garbage.because bitcoin gave lot of people money.bitcoin turn poor people to rich.and for me bitcoin gave lot of profits and change my world.garbage cant do that.only thing to do is find a solution for the problem.

Im not agree because the exchange rate now of 1 bitcoin is very high for dollars and for Philippines moneynow.

Bitcoin is a virtual currency, such as QQ coins, can be circulated on the Internet, bitcoin itself has no value, such as the issue of banknotes.

should we also support the development of bitcoin, instead of damaging the good name of bitcoin.For the mean time like i said i believe new innovations will come out for bitcoin.

Instead of being fooled by the price of bitcoin, Bitcoin should be a cryptocurrency. It has the value of investing only because people think that it has the potential and is worth supporting, not hype.

Well, its really hard to tell that something is garbage when that garabge that you are referring to or Bitcoin is something that has a value that exceeds all the price value of cryptocurrencies. However, it can still be pointed out that it still is imperfect but it still has benefits that far outweighs anything that we can theow at it in also regardig the numbe rof people who invested on it

Don't waste you time Rawdog.. they don't care as long as it can be used to profit REAL MONEY.

Oh and the guy you mentioned said on Twitter way back that ETHEREUM can not compete with Bitcoin.
It was never designed to and it's not a currency.
It's an App's platform "DAPPS" gimmick smart contract fuel token system.. for profit.
Hence why it was launched as an ICO and thus manipulated heavily on launch and ever since.
Making the guy who made rich beyond comprehension.

He wasn't the only notable person who said this.
I said it all along as other well known crypto guys.

Once again the hoards of deaf and dumb greedy useless tits on a bull parade it around as the Bitcoin killer.. the "no. 2 coin".. *soon to dethrone BTC. (the same types of greedy idiots said that about Doge coin in late 2013 / early 2014 too across the entire web hoping to lure in more suckers)
It's been swiss-cheese with security, speed problems, forks, centralization, manipulation, legal problems and was rigged on launch like all ICO's.

It's going nowhere.. like all of crypto.
This shit is a retarded failure.
Why ?

Imagine knowing that a comet / meteor was coming to wipe us all out then doing nothing about it for 8 years.
What the OP here illustrated nicely with pictures for dumb people was known since day one.
We watched it get this bad bit by bit gradually as NO ONE gove zero fucks.
Why ?
Because Bitcoin is awesome and WORTH $20,000.00 per coin .

https://youtu.be/CAmd0enttBw

I strongly disagreen Bitcoin is a good cryptocurrency. This has been speedily taking over the market. Its growth and popularity is skyrocketing and this will continue to develop as time pass. Also, a lot of people has been earning good vecause of bitcoin.

This is one of the reason why bitcoin dropping price it has too high transaction fees. Bitcoin network currently experiencing record high traffic resulting in higher miners fees and longer confirmation time for transaction. If you want to give some tip use other coins that you think have lower fees so that you can save your bitcoins.

This is really too much. But still it does not prove BITCOIN to be a garbage.You should yourself think once that if BITCOIN would be the garbage then no one is this much stupid that he will pay such a high fees.

Bitcoin is not garbage but is just experiencing some downward trend which will later phase off.

One man's garbage is another man's gold.

Transaction costs are too high. Confirmation time blocks too. I think bitcoin is losing faith. However, there are many other good coin and you should invest in them. ETH is an example

You do realize many people couldn't care less what they are worth right ?
Why did you post that ? You clearly did not get what he said or understand crypto.

People in crypto are now brain damaged pajeets.
I can't be bothered talking to you idiots.. you are insufferably stupid.

Recap for the 'tards.
If the thing doesn't work ? Then it's worthless.
Understand what investing means now dumb fucks ?
Would you invest in a company that makes broken products ?
YES.. you would which is why BTC is worth 10k.

Please kill yourselves idiots.
I can't believe there is this many morons on the web.
The rise of BTC and popularity is eye opening.. i had no idea there was that many brain dead greedy dipshits out there.

ETH has also been quite good for me.   

Yes I agree with you RawDog that currently bitcoin is garbage. In btc protocol it should be enforced that fee cannot exceed to-be-transferred funds.  If I want to pay for a coffee $5 with btc I DO NOT agree to pay $10 fee. If that doesn't change people will choose altcoins with near zero fees.

Does PeerCoin (PPcoin) have fees?    8)

I dont think so becouse if it falls than all altkoins grows up, and thats interesting and can help us to trade!

How can bitcoin be a garbage if many people are still using it and through this, many people can provide their financial needs. Just like what they always say that the mans garbage will turn to gold, so it means bitcoin is a garbage because it is our gold. Our gold that helps many people for everything. Helps people to provide their daily needs and some of our desires.

Crypto will overcome these things or they just simply die. Bitcoin can make a big improvements.
I'm waiting to see that lightning network first.

I don't think we are using it for payments and it's more of a gambling chip except no one dare deposit
BTC at on-line casinos because their fun money has gone before they get to play.

Lets face it Bitcoin is useless as a currency and the development team is owned by the miners
and keeps coming up with excuses to rip us off. Segwit wallets is hardly cheaper and all the
dev teasm needs to add to Bitcoin core is the line of code shown below if they were too stupid
to add it in the first place.

public static money MaxFee=150 // The rich can wait in the bus queue and take turns like the rest of us sheeple

I think the fee of bitcoin transactions is pretty so high! if developers can settle lower transaction for lower fee then bitcoin stay fair conditions.

I think the thing is because they do not like bitcoin, as we know that cryptocurrency and bitcoin are the greatest threats of the established system of morality that makes people hate bitcoin and say bitcoin is garbage.

Bitcoin is a store of value

I think ETH has more perspectives than bitcoin at that monent!

If you are taking about garbage it means it is useless. But some are recyclable. Bitcoin is not a garbage, it is one source of funds for all. I wanted to recommend to somebody that register in bitcoin because it is a big help to all. You can save a money on it. Many people expect too much in bitcoin because it is a good investment at all. Because of bitcoin, they raise the level of their livings.

the real facts is that,  bitcoin has failed big time.  The transaction fee made everything worse.
Imagine you sending $1.5 to a friend  and you  are been charged $13 fee what do you call this?
The system is a mess

I strongly disagree when we talk about bitcoin as a garbage because if they just have an idea of how it helps those people using it , I am pretty sure that they will get interested about it and they will find ways how to be engaged with this so that they can acquire or avail all the good things and benefits it can give .

How other people says that bittcoin is garbage?For me it's not because this is the way I've only known how to earn money so that I probably support the needs of my family.maybe to others it is garbage but in my own opinion,no!

Bitcoin is going through hard times now. Now it really is not in the best shape and does not fully perform its main function of the payment facility. But let's hope that everything changes soon. Bitcoin developers are still deciding what is best to use for bitcoin to eliminate its shortcomings. Although, to be honest, it has long been possible to do so. I'm still inclined to think that it would be better to introduce a network of lightning.

I agree with you about it, the system is loss its positions....

While bitcoin is not ready to make small purchases with it. But over time, these inconveniences should be adjusted. In the meantime, it is worthwhile using bitcoin as an investment, in long term or for a short period.

This is certainly a big limitation of Bitcoin, transfer fees has increased considerably over the years.

i strongly disagree about the saying.because only few people saying like that.most of the people who are engaging with the market never say like that.bitcoins are now most popular currency in the world.most of the transactions are done using bitcoins,then how it will become a garbage.

A lot of people who have been earning really good (!) money on Bitcoin will never agree with your strange statement. Of course, to get profit from BTC you must consider all the facts – have enough information about crypto market, know the rates statistics well, use good exchangers, etc.

Agree with the author. Bitcoin was cool when it was the first cryptocurrency. Now, it has no any advantage it was created for: transactions are slow, fees are high, no micropayments - one satoshi is approximately one kopeyka (1/100 from russian ruble).

Lol you're a legendary member, supposedly you noticed the happenings in bitcoin and still you you can't still find the beauty in bitcoin.

Maybe to those people  who does not  believe about it think it is garbage. They don't really know how this bitcoin makes life of the people  change. Specially how it gives earnings and daily expenses to them. In some saying it makes garbage because some of the people don't know it

Why thier are still many people saying bitcoin is a garbage.they forget the importance of the bitcoin in thier life. They earn  more money and bitcoin change thier life. From poor to riches. So for me bitcoin is not garbage.its a source of income that we have now. So we are very lucky for this that we all know the importance of bitcoin and
now we are gaining more money.

How come that their are some people giving such comments like this "Bitcoin is garbage". I think those people not relly become careful I think they involved with phishing sites they they blame it to btc.

Lightning is a scam.  Won't be ready for another two years.  Don't kid yourself.  Bitcoin Cash is the only way from here.

Yep - but you can buy Bitcoin Cash, the real Bitcoin for a huge discount.  Soon, it will be the dominant network.  Just as soon as everyone finds out it is the original bitcoin anyway.  Then its price will go to $20000 and the broken one will fall like rocks.  The last one to switch loses the most money.  The first one to switch earns the most money.

Simple facts.

It's successfully tested on the testnet. I believe it will be ready soon. But in case the lighting network is failing and took too long time, I guess the 'flippening' will happen. Which is the worst case scenario. I'm sure Bitcoin can still make an improvement if we consider Bitcoin is still at early age, and start to gain a momentum at the late of 2017.

Did you sell all your BTC before the ride to the moon?

He is very lucky if he can pay only $13.46 in fees. I have been forced to pay even double so much if I wanted to be sure that the Bitcoin arrives at destination before I become old.

that's the unfortunate truth about bitcoin these days but for saying a garbage i think that is a bit too harsh, don't forget that bitcoin started this industry/market and without its creation we might not experience the fortune this cryptocurrency gave to use. I'm hoping someday this expensive transaction cost will be solve soon, so sad many people already complaining bout this and i think it hardly affects the price of bitcoin.

You probably believe in unicorns too.  Unfortunately, that doesn't make them come true any sooner.  lightning is a scam.  The early release is only to create positive PR because everyone was losing confidence.  Lightning is about 2% ready for prime time use.  Forgetaboutit.

It was solved soon: It is called 'Bitcoin Cash'.  It was solved by Satoshi himself.  Bitcoin Cash is original Bitcoin without the bullshit of SegWit and without the bullshit of Lightning.  

Monkey money is not available to the saints but it is not a boon to all people. Money is the main cashback of the person's life, as the oil without the car, or the bitcoin, the world is stagnant.

If you look at the transfer fee from bitcoin % perspective, a transfer of funds from an exchange to any bitcoin wallet would only cost 0.002 btc or 0.2%.
0.2% transfer fee is cheap.

But change 0.002 btc to it's dollar value = around $24 at this time. That indeed is pricey and changes anyone's perspective.

First comment and pretty much every one of them since here says..

ALTCOINS !

..you're fucking idiots.  ::)

What happens when all of the users of Bitcoin move over to say Litecoin ?
And would they ?

Know why BTC forks don't work ?
Greed.
Everyone simply dumped their Bitcoin cash.
It's about incentive
It's about what's in it for me ?

How many fucking times do i tell you all you are greedy non-supporters?
When the fork in the road comes to support 1 coin or profit off another the choice is always predictable.
8 years and nothing has changed.

And why would it ?
You all are happy as a pig in shit with BTC being used as a pointless hyped "commodity" failed currency.

Crypto = Stupid, greedy and deceitful profiteer investards.

LUL, why he doesn't choose ETH instead of making the tip via BTC. What a dump guy! You can't blame him cause of his stupidity , it's not a sin .

Perfectly no! It's paperless so it doesn't create much garbage. But kidding aside, bitcoin is an investment not a garbage or a job.
Be wise about investments so you won't regret any single cents of it; in investment it will guide to you to become successful in future.

Its not just a sin, it is also a crime.  He should be jailed for being so stupid.  At least 3 years.  No parole.

BTC isn't a garbage however it is favoring from God and fortune that stores from your splendid future. BTC assumes a major part in the general public which they help to change the life of each person. Setting up a sort out society is likewise their objective and I don't see anything waste from them by any means.

Going by the popularity bitcoin is gaining every single day and its acceptance worldwide and also the increase in its price every single day it's no wonder that bitcoin will be the only money in the future used extensively especially on the internet

Bitcoin is not money, it is a greater fool token.  You "invest" in it, and that's a rational decision, as long as you have rational arguments to believe there will be greater fools with slightly less rational arguments that will pay more for it than you did.

And look, it worked out already marvellously 3 times in a row: in 2011, in 2013 and in 2017.  Each time, a new army of greater fools is rushing in, to spend their hard-earned money on tokens sold to them by the previous greater fools (except those smart asses that were there in 2010).  As such, they give their hard earned money to pay the gains of their predecessors (that's the "fool" part).   But if they are smart, they  can wait for another army of dudes to rush in, to pay THEM their gains.  (that's the "greater" parts).  Hell, those that were the fools in 2011, were the smart guys selling in 2013.  And the greater fools of 2013, were the smart guys selling last year, to the even greater fools (mostly Koreans I think ; let's call them that way).   But maybe these "Koreans" will be the smart guys selling to the (last?) army of greatest fools, I don't know, in 2021 or so.  And then it's over, because there aren't any more on earth.  Maybe we can sell to the inhabitants of Sirius then.  Or maybe it's over already, and the greatest fools were the "Koreans".  These games end always when they run out of greater fools, but there's still  3/4 of a planet to take.

This was seen from the beginning, in February 2010  https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=57.msg390#msg390

Fool: you pay for the benefits of others

Rational: you'll find a greater fool, paying you a lot of benefits.

Call bitcoin, the digital currency of the future economy - garbage, I'm just outraged. It's a denial of everything new ...
It is because of such desperate statements that you are becoming increasingly aware that bitcoins are afraid not only of the old people-investors, but also of whole states-while they can not do anything about it. And this further gives confidence in the power of bitcoin. And no fork, such as bitcoin cache, will not affect this.

Maybe the person who says that bitcoin is rubbish is a very stupid person and could be that person does not understand about bitcoin, I personally followed the bitcoin that was quite successful....

This is still a major problem in bitcoin, where people who want to transact in small quantities, must pay a fee greater than the amount to be sent. But it's all back to its users. Maybe you think BCH is faster than bitcoin because it can process transactions instantly, but you need to know that everyday bitcoin averaging 400k transactions while bitcoin cash is not up to 4k per day. Why did it happen? well, let's just say passengers who want to ride a 5-star plane certainly more than the passengers who want to ride a 1-star plane. Because 5 stars plane is more ensure the safety of the passengers.

Bank wire fee $20 is the same for $100 or $500 or $1000 or $10,000 or $50,000 and so on..

Bitcoin is no comparison to bank-wire transfers in terms of fee.

If someone who has a very good mind may be someone will sell half of their bitcoin income, until bitcoin rose to the moon ..

I agree with the author completely. Those who were smart sold bitcoin whet it was all time high at $18k in December, then it will go down. Too many people now so price will go down, but it is not too late to sell at decent price.

Any cryptos using Blockchains in the future will die out because quantum computers are on the way.  The new cryptos which do not use blockchains are the future.

Fees hitting $55 per transaction killed the goose that laid the golden egg because the miners got too greedy and the greed is far from
over since they are the ones running hubs on the lightning network that charge fees and interest on BTC needed to keep channels open
but if we call hubs by the correct name then they are known as banks

Feel free to argue that this looks like Alice and Bob are using Lightning so Bob can buy a Coffee from Alice
https://lnmainnet.gaben.win/

Block-chain can scale but just now how it's been used in Bitcoin and clones however hybrid versions
will take over and bitcoin development team could had fixed it instead of building Lightning which is a banking network
and designed to server banks using inter bank lines of credit that they call channels in LN

You are being treated to Problem-Reactions-Solution

 

i agree btc will never be payment method as long as fees are too high
i wonder how people want shops to accept btc
last time i had to pay 11$ fees to send 10$ only of btc

I think the fee for bitcoin transactions is getting more expensive, maybe that's what keeps the bitcoin price down now? By the beginning of 2018 bitcoin continues to decline and also followed by other altcoins, or will this be the end of bitcoin?

Speak quite or the regulars, defenders of the faith we be sent in to pick a argument with you
Contains a coded message

In terms of the financial sector, as long as the funds flow in flexibility, some people take the plate, even scams, but also for a long time to play the wind and water. There are countless start-up teams who earn a lot of money by selling their designs. In the vast number of digital currency, you can not see clearly what is hidden under the sounding package of monsters. So I can not buckle all the pots to bitcoin.

    Bitcoin popularity is not just based on the price. Bitcoin  is volatile,changeable,it's price rapidly change which is normal in the market. Popularity of bitcoin is based on the acceptance of the community. Even there are many altcoins rising you still need bitcoin,you need to convert it into bitcoin before you can exchange it into fiat or local money. So,it means bitcoin price go down but not loses it's popularity.

Bitcoin is definitely  not a garbage it is like an asset. Many people become rich because of it. Because of bitcoin my mother doesnt need to sell garbage to earn money. I really thanks bitcoin. It helps my family a lot so I never think that it is a garbage because it is a gold.

Who said? For me btc help me to improve my financial and fullfill all my expense live

Actually, this is the "fake news" that has been spread.  In reality, the miner consortium is the consortium that pushed hard for BCH,with bigger blocks and smaller fees, EXACTLY because they knew it would kill their golden goose and they had a lot of hardware stake in it.  And BCH was accused of being "a Chinese miner consortium attack on bitcoin" in a completely bogus narrative that worked.

In reality, the miners tried to save bitcoin, and a totally different group killed the golden goose with a deceptive narrative.

The deceptive narrative was:

1) the lie that bitcoin needed many full nodes for "decentralization" (even though Satoshi designed bitcoin to RESIST a sybil attack by many nodes, and introduced proof of work exactly for that reason), and that "big blocks" would kill "many full nodes".

2) that 1 MB was largely enough but that bitcoin was a victim of evil spam by "the miner consortium" (even though, if you look at the evolution of block size on blockchain.info, it was clear that we were hitting the 1 MB limit for real).

3) that in any case, the 1MB limit was a hard limit in the protocol, and that a hard fork would be the end of the world, too dangerous.

And who was at the origin of that deceptive narrative ?  The inventors of the Lightning Network.   The Lightning network can only work, if fees are high and people keep their computers running.  If fees on the block chain are low, nobody will go through the hassle of the LN.  One has to be convinced that the direct block chain transactions don't work, before one is even going to consider using this second layer.  Also, in order for the LN to work well, people need to be trained to "keep their PC running all the time".  Otherwise, it doesn't work.  So the narrative of the necessity of many full nodes was also a good story here.

Now, miners have high stakes in bitcoin, through their hardware investment.  The inventors of the LN, none.  Miners like fees, but they like even more  a high bitcoin market price, because they are mainly still paid by block reward.  The inventors of the LN don't care about bitcoin's market price.  They are financed to get their LN working, and it can't work if the block chain transactions work well.  

This is why they needed a narrative that will get the block chain congested with high fees and little room.  Satoshi's mistake in 2010 of programming a 1MB limit was leveraged to a holy principle to do this, with 2 bogus reasons: the need of many full nodes, and the fear of a hard fork.  And their narrative to put the fault on exactly their detractors worked well.

Lies and deception.  Works amazingly well.

This is as a big impact that bitcoin faces at this stage. It is not suitable for small transactions, anyway it is too expensive which is obviously not a plausible channel. 8)

I think it remains to be seen if bitcoin can be labeled as garbage.  It has survived for 10 years and has sprung up a crypto market worth 1/2 billion dollars.  Yes the prices might go down.  I wouldn't call it a freefall.  Right now the whole crypto Ecosystem pricing has a strong correlation with the pricing of bitcoin, but it might eventually decouple itself for other cryptocurrencies.  Too soon to tell IMHO.

Thats why I'm mostly using Ethereum - lower transaction fees and transactions are way faster

Bitcoin is not too expensive rather it is highly profitable. Even if it is expensive, people have made it because it deserves to be. There are many cases where bitcoiners have made millions with this currency. People face some problems in the beginning to own bitcoin but even if they are unable to pay on the nail for buying bitcoin, they can work with signature campaigns to have bitcoin. There are many options for earning bitcoin.

It doesn't appear that bitcoin is a garbage, yet!  There was a news today referencing bitcoin up while stock market is down.  CRYPTOCURRENCIES like bitcoin, Ripple and Ethereum are have all soared after the Dow Jones index collapsed this week following a particularly trying month for digital cash. So what does the stock market blip mean for cryptocurrencies in the future?

How come that other people calling bitcoin as a garbage, of course not, it is not a garbage and would never be, it is something that we need today tomorrow and for the rest of our life, let us be honest that cryptocurrency brings a lot of opportunities for all of us and our life had change not only to the fact that we are earning but because of the convenience it had help us a lot so how can someone could say that it is a garbage, maybe that person is just after the money that he can have here and not truly embracing the concept.

People sold at $6k and now they are mad, it's natural for one to get defensive after getting rekt. I personally believe we should all do everything we can to support bottom sellers, they sold us their crypto for next to nothing after all

No, bitcoin is very useful to many people they work with bitcoin to feed their families.

Bitcoin is not a garbage, in fact you earned a money when you play bitcoin. in the place where bitcoin is forbidden and maybe they call it a waste but here in the philippines many profitable nets and when you earn it you can consider it as your part time job.

If you've been reading some of the most recent headlines, you'll see that several experts predicted higher bitcoin prices, with the lowest prediction being $50,000 by the end of the year, and the most extreme is 1 million $USD by MacAffee.  He even said he's gonna eat his own copulatory organ if it doesn't happen.  Who says bitcoin is garbage???

I keep saying that we overlook the basis and focus on the minors. Remember when cell phones used to be so huge? But the technology was genius. Same here. We are evolving with bitcoin.

These are just hypotheses. I do not believe in the hypotheses of experts or even those who have entered into the perennial crypto market. We all will be wronged. Instead of believing in someone else's words, I'll find out for myself about the crypto market. That is the best way to bring in real income.
My friends have trusted the experts and they have suffered a very heavy loss. I will learn from it.

do not ever assume that bitcoin is rubbish is actually going on is bitcoin convert sampat to gold and must be enjoyed all the people until now that i see is many people will get it and they will assume bitcoin is magic money because without form having high price,
and imagine if it is considered garbage is wrong without form but is considered waste ;D ;D

Nobody says that now bitcoin is perfect. Yes, he is now going through a difficult period, considering ways to get out of the situation with its hanging transactions and high commission fees. As a way out, there is a network of lightning, and more recently a more advanced phantom network. Therefore, the situation can soon be corrected. All this is temporary.

Maybe going to continue going down forever.  Function isn't going up.  Lightning is broken already.

Why all of your sentence include garbage? Is it so necesarry to say like that? I think there is something else that you can say but not garbage.
However garbage is not all not useful. You can filter the garbage into some category like organic and anorganic. The organic one is very useful and you know how we can use organic one for our life. So although you said bitcoin is garbage but bitcoin is not always bad.

i guess bitcoin is not a garbage bitcoin can use to you daily needs. but you can spend more time to make your bitcoin to get more income .. 😃

I think most people not agree with you by saying bitcoin is garbage.
I think bitcoin is related with this forum. Stay here will make you being a garbage.

BTC is not for for real life use now, as it'sole purpose was when the algorithm was being designed.

It has become more of an investment option and this is how people have find it's relevancy and this is how it would be considered. Once 21 million BTC are mined, it would be like an asset and you need to pay additional fee to buy and sale BTC, as there would be no BTC for miners to validate the transaction.

So, the problem would remain the same for which the BTC was developed.

Yep since ages people saying Bitcoin is a scam, yet Bitcoin still exists and gain a lot of popularity. And I don't see the lightning network is a failure, it being successfully tested on the mainnet test.

no. BTC is the best digital coin .

Bitcoin is not garbage. The user only has a problem

try it now, Using Lighting Network ;)

Lightning is not safe. The CEO of Lightning said don't use it on main chain.

I can understand very well because many times I faced the same thing , where I needed to pay more than what I was needed to pay to the receiver ( payment accepter )  Because of high fee only .
But still I think we can do something better to keep himself from such type of high fee .
First option is to use any altcoin like digibyte coin , etherium coin , dash coin etc .
Second option is to put the money in yobit.net and during payment use yobit code that is free of fees system .
Third option is to use segwit wallet transaction that is really cool and no need big amount of fee for the transaction .

Absolutely right! Bitcoin is not a garbage, it is an investment, a profitable investment. Bitcoin for me is an asset, i valued bitcoin because these is where i started i earn a lot at bitcoin. Im almost there at the peak my ambitions, without bitcoin i cannot earn as high as what i usually earn at my job salaries.

Yes, its better for investment so far and not as currency because it slow to use for transaction.
In another thing, bitcoin also being applied high fee. It should problem for small payment if we use it for payment.

It has come to my attention (this thread) that many of you still have no clue about the lightning network.  Have you guys not seen fees and transaction times lowering and speeding up?  

Here is an article those of you unfamiliar with the Lightning Network should read ASAP- https://medium.com/@melik_87377/lightning-network-enables-unicast-transactions-in-bitcoin-lightning-is-bitcoins-tcp-ip-stack-8ec1d42c14f5

Now take a look at where the hash rate is- https://blockchain.info/charts/hash-rate

Transaction cost-  https://blockchain.info/charts/cost-per-transaction


Also outlets like Coinbase are FINALLY starting to implement SegWit.  

Bitcoins future is still very bright and the blockchain can ALWAYS be updated to make Bitcoin better.  Don't let a "Legendary" status member influence you, the status means little to nothing here.  If you read his trust it looks like his agenda is pretty clear.  FUD spreader.

Yes transaction is high now, but with the speed that technology is advancing towards, we will see a lower cost and faster transaction very soon. For now, for small amounts to transfer switch to Ethereum instead. There are more than enough reasons to prove that Bitcoin is changing the world, and sooner or later, it will be integrated in even our everyday life.

paypal is doing that(instant transaction and low fees) since 2000 :)

so, what's new?

may be it will be better not to transfer small amount if money
but if you have to then you can use other altcoin that will be so much helpful .....

Alt coins are good for testing out new protocols like segwit, and lightning network, and there will probably be other updates to the BitCoin Core in the future as more and more people are using it.
If BitCoins going to be updated, it's best to test it out on the litecoin blockchain first, as it's the next best thing to bitcoin. if it's good, bitcoin gets it too.

As for small transactions... BitCoin may not be the best currency for that.
Lot's of alt coins out there that are.

The issue is that if you have only bitcoins, you will have to exchange it first and with that they are still going to charge fees, we are lucky that the fees are currently manageable now because not a lot of transactions are being made.

Every time Bitcoin dumps or has some problems with fees evryone is like "it is garbage, bla bla", but they dont mind that they have earned big money or got rich using it. Everything has some bad days and that is annoying but you dont appreciate when it has good moments, were you happy as much you are mad now when the price got to $17000?

Lol!  If somebody think that bitcoin will end,  they should stop doing trading and stop reading here.  I guess they are just wasting their time if they will not believe with bitcoin.

I am here because  i believe and support bitcoin.

This is the only thing I hate about bitcoins, but I don't consider bitcoins trash even if the price of transactions and the transfer fees are expensive and slow. But I do hope someone makes a solution for this one. This is a huge setback to bitcoins specially in terms of investments.

If it is a "garbage" why you are here and why buy? That's ridiculous knowing that a lot of people have already changed because of bitcoin. Their way of living changed because of the help of bitcoin.

it does not waste the bitcoin actually or just big enough to help me and my parents if you waste your eyes on me but it helps bitcoin help me and other people bitcoin.

Have you done any homework at all or just here to be another typical clueless poster whom complains but doesn't take the time to actually learn?  If you would have done anything but just waste internet space with your last post you might have noticed a couple posts before yours I discussed the transaction fees and speed.  The lightning network and outlets adding SegWit finally are already making big changes.  I loathe users such as yourself, do some homework and stop wasting internet space.

For everyone else on the opposite side, thank you! BlackRacerX how about trying to learn a little here-  https://medium.com/@melik_87377/lightning-network-enables-unicast-transactions-in-bitcoin-lightning-is-bitcoins-tcp-ip-stack-8ec1d42c14f5

Bitcoin not garbage is not garbage . Bitcoin is one of the best investment you can do .

Bitcoin is not a garbage for me because it gives me everything bitcoin is garbage to someone who didn't know about bitcoin and doesn't have any knowledge or idea about it

In my own opinion, expensive fee's is just fine as long as you have a very high security in your cryptocurrency holder. Now a days, security is a must since the value of cryptocurrency is increasing as well as the hackers that are trying to get in the exchangers that are holding our coins.

Bitcoins are chasing the lives of people. Someday it would be changing the whole world. Like you have said, they are worth using because whos ever have used them, they come to a stage where they are easy to change their life style. People shown the best practices in this world and now they are earning more than handsome moony out of these bitcoins, thus enhancing their financial status.

That is spot on - and this is why it will never work, and continue to decline

The price goes up a bit, but the whole crowd is moving to the alts and making tons of money there.  Lightning is still many years away from real use.  Bitcoin might not be the leader in just 3 months.  Blockstream messed it all up.

That's too rash a statement. Bitcoin takes time to become an ordinary, household currency so that everyone can use it in a shop or cafe. I trust bitcoin and know that its real heyday didn't come yet.

I think that's due to the density of the transaction flow on the blockchain that makes it that way. It is not rubbish and it will slowly improve as it is now. If you feel bad about it, you should not try to send it in small quantities. Try to exchange it with altcoins and send the funds with the same amount of usd. Hope it helps you.

Now this issue is regulated by all means, as the bitcoin Commission left much to be desired. However, the new Lightning Network technology has reduced the size of the commission.

Bitcoin is not a garbage but it is blessing from God and treasure that reserves from your bright future.
Bitcoin plays a big role in the society which they help to change the life of every individual. Establishing a organize society is also their goal and I don’t see anything trash from them at all.

If Bitcoin is garbage, then why are you in this forum, if you do not like Bitcoin, then chances are you can find something else out there .. LOL  ;D ;D ;D :D :D

 BTC is just an e-currency like e-gold or LR was, nothing more. e-gold was much better.  Calling it, " blessing from God" , make me think that you are a cultist or a shill :)

...or possible a moron. 

Use Dogecoin for tipping.

BTC is currently simply acting as the "standard" for ppl to enter into crypto.

the first bitcoin is until no one wants to take it, and the garbage now becomes very precious to them. could they leave their main job for bitcoin, because they already think that bitcoin is the future.

In what way can quantum computers influence cryptocurrencies and the blockchain? Will mining happen faster and will it be more profitable to buy it? I just don't understand what the reasoning behind it is.

I don't believe that Bitcoin is a garbage. Some people call it as a garbage cause they believe in some black propagandas that widely spread in the internet. But actually according to JP Morgan Chase that it is a holy grain that will be valued in the future. Competition in cryptocurrency world is very tight and some don't go through a healthy competition . So I don't believe that Bitcoin is a garbage because it is useful to us.

Developers always trying to make blockchain better and make our life simple. When something like this happening better to wait for updates and everything will be alright.

I think the guy knew about this fee, and does not need to be surprised. Another bitcoin is not yet suitable for small payments.

yes it is true, but not necessarily in litecoin too. I agree ethereum is the best alternative to the others. but I still hope bitcoin remains the best.

The fees being charged currently has been greatly reduced and because of that more and more transactions are being made, I will not be surprised if that's one if the reasons why the value is so high now.

very true, how can bitcoin be a garbage when we are esrning from joining here in bitcoin talk forum?  for me it is not a grabge but an opportunity that is too good to be true. imaginw earning in here without any investment came out from my pocket. that itself says a lot. I do beliver inn bitcoin and grateful that i am beig introduced jn here.

What I think is people who do not believe in Bitcoin are junk. Because some people call it a long-term living income because they believe bitcoin brings good luck, for those who do not believe bitcoin thinks bitcoin is like some widely spread black propaganda on the Internet. But actually in the future it is the currency we use later. Competition in the world of crypto is very gait and also very tight and some projects do not do a healthy competition. So I do not believe that Bitcoin is garbage because it is very useful for people like us.

I don't think bitcoin is a load of crap. Bitcoin gave many people faith in crypto-market with cryptocurrencies and gave the opportunity to earn online. It happens that people lose a lot of money on cryptocurrencies, but as they say, who does not risk - he does not drink champagne. Personally, I am pleased with the possibility of earning on cryptocurrency including bitcoin, who knows, but it can reach a large growth, which is predicted by many.

No sense. Payment higher than the transaction. It's just thievery. It was not like that before. Fees depend on the amount of cash sent ...

Yeah, I heard about that technology, too. And I agree that it has allowed bitcoin to gain a foothold as a means of payment.

The general director of Mastercard Ajay Banga spoke extremely negatively about the crypto-currency, calling it "garbage".

Digital currencies are a direct competitor of a company like Mastercard. Therefore it is not surprising that when the CEO of Mastercard was asked to express his opinion on the crypto currency, he demonstrated an extremely negative attitude.

Bitcoin is faced with serious opposition and prone to crime today because its seriously thriving in the CryptoFortune currency world. Many people now use it for ponzi scheme and crimes. Nevertheless, we have altcoins that could actually serve as alternative. Bitcoin is not complete without alt coin.

No, the bitcoin is not a garbage because the bitcoin helps lot of people. They are not dump in our society because they help lots of people to change their life and become a successful person.

All that is true - and the fees are high.  Even though everyone quit using Bitcoin and it is dying, the fees are low today.  But if anyone starts using it again, high fees MUST return.  Fees are low because no transactions - not because SegWit is doing something good.  Transactions are at all time low because people quit using Bitcoin and started with things like Bitcoin Cash which works with low fees no matter how many transactions.

Bitcoin is not a garbage, it is actually a hope to everyone especially for those people who do not have a permanent work or for those people who are unemployed.

Dude just think if bitcoins is garbage or there s no future of a bitcoin then why multi national companies are accepting payments in bitcoins :P

How can you say bitcoin is garbage? For me bitcoin is so useful, many people are using bitcoins now because they what its worth. Someday bitcoins will be accepted in many convenience stores, shops worldwide. If that happens, we can easily purchase anything whatever we want. And because of bitcoins, many peoples lives has changed and their financial problems are solved.

This is so rude to label bitcoin as garbage when we all know that it is not the reality at all. Bitcoin has saved many people from living a life of frustration and poverty. Numerous unemployed people started earning and supporting their families because of bitcoin.

Bitcoin is not garbage. Bitcoin is high priced. But now Bitcoin is competing with other currencies, including ETH. That's why Bitcoin's price is somewhat stable. Maybe there is some work going on to restore Bitcoin back to its earlier state. I hope the bitcoin will quickly get to the previous position after passing through all the obstacles.

Bitcoin is now more invested.

Some people think that bitcoin will have a tragic ending, I can't predict the future, but now bitcoin is still very popular, and many people recognize and invest in bitcoin.

agree , that is why bitcoin is not garbage but the person who create this thread is the real one. i guess this is just another fud in order to take down bitcoin so that the person behind this can posibly buy bitcoin at a cheaper cost if ever the value of bitcoin will be affected to this fud.  another factor  is that the person behind this is just butthurt and noob , to think that bitcoin is a scam or maybe he invest in some other coins . That is why he is anti bitcoin.

http://business.financialpost.com/diane-francis/bitcoins-and-other-cryptocurrencies-are-like-the-bre-x-stock-they-will-leave-investor-hopes-in-tatters

Bitcoin failed as a payment system, getting taxed, will get stricter regulations because of its decentralization and anonymity launch.

Wells Fargo CEO is calling Bitcoin as a Scam/Ponzi for investments.

In mining fees. Your complaining about mining fees. It just shows how shallow you are not knowing the importance of mining fees.

you are stupid bitcoin isn't garbage maybe you because the bitcoin is very important now a days or in the future It is worth the value of a bitcoin you can get rich with just a bitcoin.

To be frank, this is the things that weakens bitcoins as a whole. With tremendous transfer fees and waste of time transaction rate, it's better if we use traditional moneu or fiat money to transact rather than bitcoins. I hope the community does something to alleviate this problem.

bitcoin is rubbish this sounds funny. According to you, the billionaire they are smart? Why are they still investing in something called waste? But what you call garbage has made so many people rich, and I do. So I refuted the idea above.

The fees were high because some idiots were spamming the network. But that seems to be solved, looking at the current fee of about 10 cents. So, what's your opinion about Bitcoin now?

Not in any way bitcoin isn't rubbish people are rushing toward it with a wild craze .Bitcoin is most perfect way to get money or benefit.it is great investment  for individuals who need to gain Profit, and it is total package which can change your life as whole,

Hey guys 535-203-631

Bitcoin is rubbish?
The fool who says this, bitcoin helps the human economy and even bitcoin is also the best asset to invest if I think. And it's all rubbish? :-\

hoping that problems should not happen with bitcoin can be overcome and not protracted. bitcoin should still exist and do not get this destroyed by irresponsible people.

Thinking that way right now can't be help, because we are all expecting that 2018 would be the bitcoin's year(Pumps every months), but what is happening is the opposite of it. We don't know when will the price will go back to its normal rate, but still, we must hold our bitcoins and strongly believe that it is not yet the end of it, there is a lot of things that bitcoin could prove to us, that we have bright future on it when we hold it until the right time comes.

Fees are low because 100 percent of merchants quit using the network and all others who were doing transactions for normal none $1M transfers.  The network only support very high value transfers and very few of them.  The fees will always be low when the transactions per second are so low.  But if transactions per second goes back up - BAM!!! Big ass fees will follow. 

Bitcoin will never be a garbage it is a reason why everybody survive their financial needs and I am one of that to prove.It depends on how you manage it and control your money on crypto so thats why you can say it on higher fees calling btc is a garbage .Many people now have a job because of this,everybody got a brighter future on digital currency.