Bitcoin Forum

As a community, we seem to be the best line of defense against the prolific spread of scam "ASIC" companies. Everyday someone here at BitCoinTalk brings a possible new scam (or two or three) to our attention. I think it's time that we start and maintain a list of possible, probable and confirmed scams to protect ourselves from these unscrupulous criminals. And since not everyone who's interested in Bitcoin mining visits this forum, perhaps we can prevent less sophisticated miners from making huge mistakes if this thread were to appear in Google searches for the listed company names.

I'd like this to be a community project and welcome all input on how to maintain and improve this list.

Some thoughts...
- What rules should we adopt to qualify a company to be listed? I prefer that we took an aggressive approach and believe that potential scammers bear the burden of proof.  Meaning, borderline companies would appear until they prove themselves to several prominent members of the community
- Should we vote on who gets listed and what status they should be assigned? Should a new poll be started for each candidate for the list?
- Does anyone have special SEO skills that would make this thread more likely appear in online searches?
- How should we handle disputes from listed companies?
- Moderators, any advice?

Thanks!

You should add companies that have cause problems and cost people Bitcoin to the list.

Yes, I'm saying Bitcoin and not fiat.  If a company cost the community Bitcoin but not Fiat it should make the scam list.

Two I can think of are:  Avalon / BFL

I actually would rather we limit this list to obvious "scams"... companies that only exist to steal our bitcoins and cash.  This seems to be the most pressing issue right now and where most people will actually lose 100% of their investment.  Both Avalon and BFL are actually delivering miners at this moment in time, lol.



Off topic... anyone know how to format tables in BBCode?  This forum doesn't seem to recognize most common BBCode.  I'm getting line wrap and need to know how to extend column width.

I agree, we should leave out those companies that have shipped some products. you can say that they have poor customer service but cannot categorise them under scam.

I'll add 4 more.

phoenix technologies - scam confirmed - link (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=365585.0) - bitcoinminingcenter.com
mining heart - probable - link (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=366028.0) - miningheart.com
boscombe miner - probable
btc olympus - probable - link (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=362756.0) - btcolympus.com

Thanks!  Adding.

*Edit - I may take a more conservative approach until we get a community consensus on more recent scams.

adding one more

skyminer - very high scam possibility - link (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=360654.0) - skyminerlabs.com

I forgot about that one.  It's worth a laugh to follow the link!

looks scammy

sorry no discussion link that I know of

http://www.ttebitcoinmininghardware.com/#!store/c13wy


edit: another - bitcoinrigs - with scammy behavior thus far

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=366610.msg3915179#msg3915179

What about https://advancedminers.com/ ??  Cant figure if they are scam or not.

The representative from AMT cant really disprove that its not a scam, and his behavior is suspicious too.
One day he says he will post a video of them assembling a 192 GH/s but the next he only delivers shitty images.

Their own thread https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=304605.420

Thanks for making this x.  When I saw it come up yesterday I was reminded that I always intended to pick up where Operatr left off with Coin Canary.

I'm not sure if any of these are still relevant, but here is the link:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=176262.0

Found this one a while back; http://computergnomes.net/ (http://computergnomes.net/)

KnC has no idea who they are, and calling the number results in an answering machine with no company information included.

Glad to see Black Arrow isn't listed here.

www.btcfpga.com or bASIC or www.modminerquadstore.com (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=135301.0)

They had a good history of delivered FPGAs, took pre-order money on promise of delivering an ASIC, after a long time passed said the project was canceled, gave back some refunds (don't think they refunded everyone), said the company was sold to someone else, sold more FPGA's under a new domain name, then it went off-line for good after his account was hacked (apparently).

BUYER BEWARE! Sadly Arbitrage Scams are common in the Bitcoin community, they usually start off as a pre-order or group buy with long lead time, which after they run out of excuses, ends up with them either just running off with the money, refunding it in dollars after a rise in Bitcoin's value, or delaying delivery so they can mine on the machine you paid for!  :'(

I think I've added everything.  SHWEW!  Thanks for all of the suggestions.

Advanced Mining Technologies (AMT)... what does everyone think?

Let me know if you see any errors. or if you think I should change the status of a company.

agree they behave questionably, amt; they're part of virtualminingcorp, again no lonk so sorry, a member was ranting about them

thanks for the hard work

Hi,
nice thread. should nailed on top of custom Hardware Forum!

What is the criteria for 'looks scammy'. How about you come up with a checklist of actions/behavior/etc which will assign a rating to a company. That would take out the 'feels scammy', 'seems fishy' out of it and make it based more on facts than feelings.

Thanks for the suggestion but I've already addressed this in the second post of the thread.  I'm not assigning myself the job of ASIC cop although I've taken the liberty just to kickstart the list because I think it's important to get something out now.

Feel free to help develop rules for listing!

Coming out of nowhere / no one here has heard of
Will not supply videos / specs
Unlikely claims re price per hash or power per hash
Strange or no people on team
Just in time registering of website

some random pointers, sure there are more
I've called techtime 'looks scammy' as they sell a Monarch shipping in a month ffs

Excellent, thanks!  I reserved the 3rd post in this thread for "rules for listing" and will add these to that post.  Anyone else have more to add?

After we decide on rules for listing, we should devise a formula that determines the "level of scam potential".

Still seems subjective.

"coming out of nowhere" - where should they come from?

Unlikely claims seems easier to rate. There is only so many hashes from a chip right? Where is the line of unlikely?

"will not supply videos or specs" - That should be easy although I've seen companies post pics which were not good enough for the crowd here. What should be included in the pics to allow them to pass the scrutiny here?

"Strange people" - What the hell does that mean?

"Just in time registering" - How long should a web address be registered for a business before it is deemed trustworthy? How long should a new business wait to sell their products?


I would also like to add - Response time to emails

I don't think there is a way around being at least somewhat subjective.  That "gut feeling" is often correct especially when a large portion of the community shares that feeling.

I think it's best to be proactive and list suspected companies as quickly as possible to prevent the scam from sucking in more victims.  Let's demand that these companies prove themselves to us before we throw money at them time and again!

Hey mr amt shill, chill
It's late, I wanted to get the ball rolling. Feel free to gloss over any of my suggestions that were crap, and to answer some of your own questions with a suggestion or two.
Will not be possible to be subjective, it's a feeling thing, I guess you have those. Maybe rules we can't do already

willing to send early test models to hero members

I think I have Rule #1...
No official announcement thread on Bitcointalk.

If you're a legitimate ASIC developer you would post here first to announce your project.

Duh why didn I think of that yes of course. We are devising here guidelines to set up the perfect scam in a few months time, joke
afk

This is what I'm talking about. Ready with the pitch forks and torches. Hardly helpful. Nice little community your building here pal.

If you are going to be so fragile maybe you should step back from the keyboard.

If this system is going to work, it has to be consistent and easy for the members of this board to use and not based on your easy to hurt feelings. It also has to mean something for people outside of this forum. Believe it or not, not everyone involved in bitcoins is an active member here and as cryptocurrency moves forward, it will be less likely that users will even be aware of this message board. If this messageboard is going to claim authority over companies it must also exert responsibility.

Lol, never thought of it that way.  Maybe this is a horrible idea!

But to defend my rule, this community has members who are very tough on potential scammers.  And posting an official announcement thread causes these companies to open themselves up to intense scrutiny.  Does this community catch every scam?  Probably not.  But it sure is helpful to at least have a thorough, open discussion.

I would also like to propose something for the companies who do survive the gauntlet. Maybe supply them with a "Bitcointalk Verified" bug for their website. This may give them an incentive to provide proper documentation to members of this board.

It's deffo rule one. Some of the worst scammers never go on here just hoping for a complete newb to send btc to their sites.

How about: replies to emails and pms within 12 hours, unless they clearly state length of backlog.

other suggestions: Introduces the team, their qualifications, background...
Company history openly (oh dear subjective) discussed

shutting up now

I love the idea but I don't think I'd want that responsibility.  What if the "verified" company eventually ran off with a bunch of money?  I don't want an angry mob with torches and pitchforks at my front door! 

I will add these or merge them to existing rules.  Thanks for your suggestions!

You assume a newb here is a newb to the world.

This forum is not the end all be all but if it's going to have any influence and grow as this technology/currency/commodity grows, it must stay objective with it's assessment of emerging companies in this field. If it does not, it will lose its credibility.

My fear is that the massive amount of scams being perpetrated every day is causing more harm to the credibility of Bitcoin than anything else.  I'm sure we all welcome emerging companies to this forum.  But I do think it's important that we put pressure on them to prove themselves before we throw money at them.

So all new companies will be deemed 'scams' because this forum does not want to take the responsibility to deem someone trustworthy? It seems all companies will then be doomed here.

If this forum wants to elevate itself into a place of authority, it must also elevate its level of responsibility. It's just as irresponsible to label a company a 'scam' who is not, than it is to scam people to begin with. Yes, there are some bad people out there but there are also good people out there who are trying to make a living. Who is this forum to take that opportunity away from them because we didn't want to uphold our end of the responsibility?

Maybe it's not identifying a company as a scam but giving it a "trustworthy" rating and letting people decide for themselves?

If this community does not build credibility outside of these forum pages, all of the companies will leave this place and just post elsewhere. And if people who are outside of these forum (there are many) do not trust the 'opinion' of this forum then none of this matters. The opinion here has to be worth something to all parties for it to work.

YourPalToots stfu you ignorant pompous little shit. You obviously know nothing of this forum's centrality to the bitcoin project.

Oh get over yourself and comments like this give you zero credibility. How is someone looking for guidance going to look at this with any amount of worth?

xstr8guy so sorry for my part in taking this important topic ot

reading between the lines we're getting somewhere

I'd say change the Boscombe Pierlytics to probable, as their 'team' is all taken from http://www.msa.cz/en/o-firme/management-2 (http://www.msa.cz/en/o-firme/management-2). Unless you're waiting on confirmation from the original mythbuster.

Thanks!  I did see that earlier today.  I was just waiting for someone else to bring it to my attention.  ;)

FYI, I have been changing and adding text to the first 3 posts in the thread since posting.  Please re-read if you have suggestions for potential scams or rules for inclusion to the list.  I may have already added them.

Here's a bit of a "mission statement" that I just sent as a PM.  I thought it explained my intentions for this thread so I added it to the original post.

On a scale from 1-100, 1 being the worst and 100 being the best, is there a company out there right now that would rate a 100? Maybe we take the qualities of a 100 company and work backwards.

I would like to add a scam to the list or lests say probably scam to be fair.

I had a look on another forum, which was quite interesting, pretty much every thread was a scam. But this scam was the one they seemed to push hardest.

www.coreminer.com

Feel sorry for the poor guys on that forum that seemed to be falling for it. Anyway if they happens to stumble on to this forum instead they might see this list with coreminer included and save there money.

The company is a swedish registered company with no employees or consumer products (pays no Swedish VAT). And no funding etc..
They have not a 4Th asic for delivery in february.

Source:
http://translate.google.se/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=sv&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.allabolag.se%2F5567063200%2Fverksamhet

Update:
Haha this is funny, I exposed them on the other forum and now when I had a look now they have changed the info on the webpage from 3core Company Limited to another company, Data Converters Ltd. And the name of the guy in the picture is no longer Jonas Karlsson, his name is now RENATO PAIVA, IT- specialist.  :) So I guess this is a confirmed scam if you want to add it.

And he writes restaurant reviews in San Francisco CA as Peter M.

http://www.yelp.com/user_details?userid=lUB8ZYqp-iao2xwy5DRl_g


Carl can be found on Flicker

http://www.flickr.com/photos/41030803@N08/9201949067/


The group photo can be found here
http://www.auroville.org/journals%26media/avtoday/archive/2004-2009/2004-02/cynergy.htm

Coin Canary isn't a mining company.  Operatr is a forum member that used to run a list like this.  You might want to take a look at it.

There are a lot of scams out there.  You said earlier something to the effect of people are getting out their pitchforks and going after companies before they have a chance to prove their selves.  
Innocent until proven guilty and all that, but with bitcoin mining equipment you can go after a company hard.  If they are found to be clean it only helps them.  You don't see scams last very long here because the community watches so closely.  Unfortunately they only have to make a few coins per scam to be worthwhile.  The quicker one is taken down the better, otherwise it just encourages them to do more.

The number system isn't a bad idea, though.  Each category could be worth 5-10 points

Can they prove they are the people they say they are, and their experience?  This can be checked with Linkedin profiles, and other social media.  Once it's confirmed that this person is real, it's also a good idea to have someone call up the companies they have worked for to see if they have the experience they say.  

Do their product pictures (or profiles) come up on an image search?  Often people steal pictures and modify them.  This isn't necessarily illegal, or even immoral unless they contend that they made the picture, or that their product looks like this.  Often people hire graphic designers who will just rip pictures, so this doesn't automatically make a company a scam.

Is their company located where they say?  Google earth helps here, occasionally just looking at a spot is enough to cast a potential business as questionable.

Is this location a real business, a home address, a PO box, or a hole in the wall that many businesses use?

Do they post here to allow the community to check them?  One of the most common practices is to hope that random people will stop in and spend a few thousand dollars before people call them out.

In addition to the above, are they working with any of the programmers to ensure their equipment will run the protocols properly?

Do they have contracts with a foundry, or a chip design company?  If there is a legitimate company lending it's credibility to a new start up it is very likely they are the real thing.  Of course the connection has to be checked.  Once I emailed Global Foundries about a new company and they disappeared that day.

Are they registered as a business in the company of origin?  If you can't get to this information it's unlikely they are going anywhere, since such a large endeavor is going to quickly draw the attention of local bureaucrats and the police force pretty quickly if they aren't in compliance.

Do they have employees that can be checked on?  It's hard to start a company that just has a couple engineers to do everything.

Are they funded by a known group?  This connection needs to be checked of course.

Does their website look like it took a little work to make?  Many legit companies have failed here, breaking on the order page and whatnot, but it's still worthwhile to check.

Preorders?  If they aren't taking preorders, then they aren't a normal company in this space.  Still it should be a red flag that they are making their customers into investors.  This requires diligence in other areas.



Any of these points can have exceptions.  For instance Bitfury came out of nowhere defying the first point and probably others.  In the end, though, even if a company is listed as being a likely scam all they have to do is show up with a product (video, or samples sent to programmers) with an internally consistent story and people will flock to them.  
Unfortunately, as it has been mentioned, even if a company rates highly here it is no assurance they will deliver a product.  It should make it very likely that they at least intend to do so, though.

from: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=176262.0

LOL. They now make the fastest miners available. Just goes to show you never can tell the good ones from the bad. It's almost impossible!  ::)

Well done!

That Internet page is certainly a façade for an attempt of fraud.

Look at this:

http://www.coreminer.com/about.html

https://i.imgur.com/DW6jc5j.png

Now, look at this:

http://www.auroville.org/journals%26media/avtoday/archive/2004-2009/2004-02/cynergy.htm

https://i.imgur.com/jHGbJdg.png

Yes. Exactly what I posted earlier.

I verified the company show in the contact page:


Well, it turn out that company really had a director with the name Renato Paiva, however the company was dissolved on 31/12/2009:

http://corp.sec.state.ma.us/CorpWeb/CorpSearch/CorpSummary.aspx?FEIN=371434214&SEARCH_TYPE=1

NO dick, we're not part of virtual mining corp your thinking of the Advanced Mining corp or what ever company.. take us off!  You're confusing us with someone else. THIS IS OUR wonderful train wreck of an official thread! https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=304605.0

And this sent to me by PM...


So everyone, does AMT come off of the list?

http://s29.postimg.org/s2bceec4j/2013_12_06_00_01_19.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/s2bceec4j/)http://s29.postimg.org/b32dz50wz/2013_12_06_00_01_59.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/b32dz50wz/)http://s29.postimg.org/4mtf91sdf/2013_12_06_00_09_59.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/4mtf91sdf/)http://s29.postimg.org/xt1is4k4j/2013_12_06_00_10_26.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/xt1is4k4j/)http://s24.postimg.org/kt3uadde9/DSC_0052.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/kt3uadde9/)http://s24.postimg.org/8tsc327td/DSC_0067.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/8tsc327td/)http://s24.postimg.org/r82v71k41/DSC_0080.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/r82v71k41/)http://s28.postimg.org/ie7hyl0ih/IMAG0125.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/ie7hyl0ih/)http://s28.postimg.org/f630lje8p/IMAG0127.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/f630lje8p/)http://s28.postimg.org/p243l6k0p/IMAG0128.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/p243l6k0p/)

Are AMT miners actually shipping?  Has anyone here received one?

A community member had asked to add AMT to the list because of questionable actions.  I have removed it pending further investigation by the community.

BTW AMT, how about some chip pics?  

http://s24.postimg.org/b5x97jo5d/IMAG0083.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/b5x97jo5d/) http://s24.postimg.org/xgl47ilfl/IMAG0085.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/xgl47ilfl/) http://s24.postimg.org/6y2gysmpt/IMAG0106.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/6y2gysmpt/)http://s28.postimg.org/c6z6rg0zt/DSC_0068.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/c6z6rg0zt/) http://s28.postimg.org/okc0ycqo9/DSC_0069.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/okc0ycqo9/)

Bitfury..

Ah I see!  I mistakenly thought your were developing your own ASIC chip.  So you're just building miners with Bitfury chips then?

Wow, thanks for the input!  I will add/merge your rules to the list when I have a bit more time.  Thanks!

well done septimus.


I'll like to add another one

nitro miner - probable - link (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=360769.0)

They say they have customer all over the whole esp in china and will deliver in 2 months upon order. They advertised aggressively but I have never heard of anyone running a real nitro miner today, even in china.

Yes, we don't see the point in building our own chip. We have a few modular designs which is versatile enough to drive slot any chip. Currently we're  building on Bitfury, and Avalon and we're direct distributors of CoinCraft, building on that as well. Also looking into a few other players as well and building a litecoin miner. In general, we're pulling a dell.

Just keep us off you're list. If you want, you can resell our miners too just like you're doing for KNC.

Anyone receive their "Cryoniks Frostbit" 10th/s liquid nitrogen cooled miner with advanced led lighting yet?

Are we interested in calling out the scammy cloud asic mining companies?

I'd take AMT off, they're on my page.

Mark Payonix as Confirmed, they delivered nothing in the end (Was supposed to provide ASICS on December 9th), they're pics of their miners were other peoples miners, and they've kept a lot of peoples money i.e. no refunds. 100% scam, they've now taken down their website.

I'd add hashblaster as a scam: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=368243.0

I would also recommend putting the link to their website next to their status on the OP. Why? Because this gives a link back, causing any google seaches to go the the most reputable (highest hit) website --this one. So if anyone google's them, the chances of results showing they're scams or not comes here first in the results list. Google SEO ;). When the google bots crawl they'll see this as being the biggest discussion about them.

xstr8guy,

great job!
You can add representative name (if possible) to the company in list.
It can help to check their activities at this forum.

Add me to MiningHeart.com,

Thanks.

BTC-e.com!

OK, they dont make custom hardware but......

Blocks withdrawal of coins!

ignores (or autoreplies) support requests.

confirmation emails never arrive, yet autoreply 'check your spam folder' mails arrive in multiples of 3.

btc-e.support (thailand) on skype is more interested in gaining private email addresses and or phone numbers than getting this confirmation mail sent.


[21:08:46] b: Hi btc-e_support, I'd like to add you as a contact. b
[21:09:09] *** btc-e.support has shared contact details with b. ***
[21:09:44] b: hello. are you able to help with withdrawal issues?
[21:11:04] btc-e.support: your problem
[21:11:20] b: no confirmation email - i have tried many times
[21:11:38] btc-e.support: Send me the following information:
Your problem:
ID btc-e
email:
Email Password:
Ticket number:
Your country:
Account Transfer time:
Bank name:
Transfer amount:
Customer segment our review and resolve help you.
[21:12:27] b: no bank, only withdraw cryptocoins - why would you need my email password?
[21:13:28] btc-e.support: It is required of Direct Support.
[21:14:27] b: required for what purpose?
[21:15:18] btc-e.support: So that we can prove accurate account is yours.
[21:16:06] b: my btc-e ID is edgar. My problem is no confirmation email is arrived. all i require is an confirmation email, are you able to provide this?
[21:16:16] btc-e.support: After verifying correct. We will solve your problem.
[21:16:58] b: you do not need my email password to solve this problem. you already have my email address.
[21:17:01] btc-e.support: Please note the information we request.
[21:18:18] btc-e.support: What your email data. Can change to another email.
[21:19:27] b: why do i need to chnage email? the support mails arrive ok, why not the withdraw confirmation mail?
[21:20:58] btc-e.support: Please help us validate it. Then we can solve new problems collecting your question.
[21:21:38] b: that makes no sense. if support emails arrive, why do confirmation mails not arrive?
[21:23:09] btc-e.support: we are investigating these accounts having some doubts.
[21:23:35] b: which accounts? i have only 1 account.
[21:25:09] btc-e.support: Therefore verification requests. Please provide full information if you want to solve problems early.
[21:26:33] b: my email password is not of any legitimate use to you. you have my email address, you have my account name.
[21:27:38] btc-e.support: ok you can wait if you do not wish to provide information
[21:27:48] b: wait until what?
[21:28:19] b: i have been waiting since 2nd december
[21:28:40] btc-e.support: I am solely responsible for the information requested. The certification and solve problems are caused by customer segment.
[21:29:07] b: my email is confirmed on the site
[21:29:20] b: what else could be a problem?
[21:31:04] btc-e.support: It is asking customers and department management.
[21:32:04] b: all i want is the confirmation email sent, are you able to provide this witout my private email password?
[21:32:36] btc-e.support: You could offer to resolve them or wait.
[21:32:58] b: resolve what?

wait for what?
[21:33:10] btc-e.support: I am not responsible for this problem is the customer segment
[21:33:33] b: can u provide their details that i might contact them directly
[21:34:34] btc-e.support: There is only 1 recruit support in skype
[21:35:08] btc-e.support: You can expect after your account is verified.
[21:35:27] btc-e.support: Can a few weeks
[21:36:19] b: im afraid i do not understand what you are saying. my account is confirmed since months. i have not had this problem before. and it seems i am not the only person with the same concern
[21:36:40] b: why would any email take a few weeks?
[21:37:51] btc-e.support: there are many accounts as you have a situation
[21:38:07] b: yes. but my E-Mail: (confirmed)
[21:38:16] btc-e.support: and we need time to solve it.
[21:38:19] b: so why the hold up now?
[21:38:51] btc-e.support: where you come from.
[21:39:47] b: Europe. does this help with sending a confirmation email?
[21:40:47] btc-e.support: if you want fast processor Can our headquarters in Russia
[21:41:14] b: email? telephone? visit?
[21:42:07] btc-e.support: to meet in the center and provides general information
[21:42:38] b: general information will never include private password/s
[21:43:14] b: how to contact 'head' office?
[21:43:23] btc-e.support: We ask that all information I have told you
[21:44:09] btc-e.support: wait. Give us your phone number.
[21:44:38] btc-e.support: customer segment will contact you and provide time and location
[21:44:45] b: i dont think you are the right person to help me
[21:45:35] btc-e.support: parts our customers will help you

unimpressed doesn't come close!

Why is my old scam list listed as a scam on this one?

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=176262.0

CoinCanary was never a scam nor even an attempt to sell equipment, it was just an informative list just like this one of fly-by-night ASIC companies... ???

In fact you might want to give it a look over and see if any of those old scams are still around.

Hi Operatr, that was my intention in mentioning your thread.  I think it was misinterpreted in the initial rush.
Good to see you around!

Huh, I haven't had any of my coin withdrawls blocked at btc-e.com. I usually move mine from there to bitstamp or coinbase or such for cash out.

Very very sorry!  I'm not sure how that got in there.   :-[

Found that on the AMT thread. Still seems fishy to me, also some people has pointed out that the AMT cabinet is just a NAS server, from another company. And the boards they are posting pictures of, is from technobit.

True ralla, but marto74 is working closely with them.  He is the owner of technobit,and has vouched for them.  Of course that's not proof they are valid.

-edited..  damn spellchecker on my "smart"phone butchered that message and I didn't notice.  I guess they're only as smart as the user.  :)

Should add asic-products.com

Brought up in https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=366942.0 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=366942.0)

I can also say that KNC miner had very quick delivery times. They did slip their deadline, but have over delivered with their miners. Their packaging was crappy at first, but I hear they've fixed that. Their firmware support has been here and there, but they have made several attempts to bring people's miners to optimal performance.

Check out their thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=170332.0

http://virtualminingcorp.com is confirmed as a scam site

http://bitcoinscammers.com is  good site to keep informed to

I would love to see your proof :)

http://bitcoinscammers.com/virtualminingcorp-com/

This thread also states there a scam

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=360654.msg3905143#msg3905143

Please add to the shitlist

proof
noun

1. evidence or argument establishing or helping to establish a fact or the truth of a statement.



Taking a screenshot and posting it on a fly by night WordPress site does not constitute as proof.

I and potentially a lot of shareholders in this company would love to see undisputed proof of your claims. It would really help out so if you do have something substantial please bring it forward.

updated my last post with the thread that states there a scam
still trying to find more evidence

before you 2 get your handbags out, here's a strange one http://axonlabs.net/?l=


edit 20/12/13 now has its own amusing thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=378158.msg4052233#msg4052233

not as funny as amt thread, but funny

Anyone used

https://asic-market.com
https://terrahash.com

I don't think you understand how proof works.  Posting to a thread that says "yes they have been confirmed as a scam" isn't proof.  I can make a thread that my shit glows in the dark and smells like mint toothpaste and then link to it but that doesn't mean it's true.


And in a completely unrelated note, I can visit AMT if they ever have a working prototype of their own tech that they are willing to show off.

No but gathering as much informations from threads adds up to a decison they are a scam,i am in the process of getting the evidence so barewith me.

AMT has started to deliver.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=304605.msg4003058#msg4003058

You have to set the definition very clearly in the first post or else this is going to be pages of debating non-scams.

It doesn't matter what it is, but it can't be left to interpretation - it can't be anything about unknowable things like intent.

It has to be something objective like there are people who can prove that their money was taken and there are no people who can prove anything was delivered.

I think there are plenty of poorly run businesses all over here which are their own worst enemy, but are not scams.

Agreed.

Here's another thread https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=342853.0 with its own accusations, shills etc. re https://kotaklabs.com/

one more possible scam

http://axonlabs.net/

3TH at 10k. Pretty good technology.

So you don't have evidence, but because YOU have decided they're a scam, that's all the proof we need?

You need to learn how to layout the evidence before declaring a scam. Might want to look up the definition of the words libel and slander.

Oh, and another thing, there, their, they're all mean different things.

VirtualMiningCorp street address leads directly to 'Springfield Fight Club.' Calling the available number results in an answering machine that sounds pretty legit however. I did not pursue contacting a support rep as it's easy to set up an answering machine and lie over the phone. Whether this points to a scam or not is questionable, but the fact the address points to a fitness club is highly suspicious.

This was probably the business that was in that building prior to VMC, has been discussed 6 months ago (You are a little late to the game) and people have visited to verify.

Forgive me for being new to the forums; I'm not married to it like some people. Simply trying to help the discussion, and stop the neanderthal-like assault on skeptics.

Just seems suspicious is all. After checking over the VMC topic, it seems you are quick to defend VMC. Sounds a lot like wishful thinking to me. That immediately makes me suspicious of you as well. Anyone can lie on the net, and until I see physical proof of work/claims, along with some legitimate customer feedback, I shall not believe.

Please don't be so defensive. There's no need to be rude.

I'm not asking you to believe, this is a scam list thread and it is obviously not a scam (yet). It just seems like a little research would go a long way. All of the preliminary "Googling" has already been done just go find it. Hell there are even pictures of the building.

As far as "physical proof of merchandise" well we're all waiting for that. KnC didn't have "Proof" until the very end of the 6 month wait basically and turns out they were the most legit company of all.

Either way relax buddy.

Rudeness is a matter of perspective.

A little research is exactly what I did, and apparently that has already been done...so no need to continue the discussion. I'm a doubting Thomas when it comes to all these new claims coming out that seem much too good to be true. VMC is one of those claims.

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=TerraHash+reputation

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=asic-market.com+reputation

VMC is paying people with promises of discounts and early delivery for defending them, not to mention the large number of "share holders" who have a direct interest in propping up perception of its legitimacy (and I suppose potential shareholders who believe its legit but want other people to not believe it's legit). Makes the subject very hard to discuss.

From what I've seen there is a fair amount of relatively concrete evidence that supports concern (including the offer for discounts to shill) and at this point people who jump on people pointing to the evidence ... uh. don't look very good.

I would be extremely interested in any evidence you have of "VMC is paying people with promises of discounts and early delivery for defending them".

I'm fairly good at keeping up with ActM and not once have I seen this take place.


You also mention "at this point people who jump on people pointing to the evidence". Again I would be very interested in your evidence as it would help all of the shareholders out.

I'm not defending ActM from ACTUAL facts/evidence. If there is any please bring it forward. Right now it seems to be people bringing up old issues that have already been corrected and also a lot of opinions which contrary to popular belief on this forum are not facts.

I should have hyperlinked, but that search button is sooo far away.  Here you go: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=304605.msg3893935#msg3893935

The fact that their videos/images were photographed in Bulgaria, along with their bank wire transfer info was very much news to me, and added to my less substantial concerns. But I don't follow very closely. If thats all been neatly explained, please toss over a link.

Cheers.

You have two companies mixed up,

That is AMT who I believe only ships Bitfury gear on boards they designed themselves.

VMC/AMC/ActM is ActiveMining https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=297503.0

Glad we cleared this up!

Indeed, AMC vs AMT. Erp!

Zte-ASIC scam
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=387168.0;topicseen

Mods Please make this thread a sticky so it remains on the top of page 1

new year new dodges?:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=392865.msg4233874#msg4233874
http://www.bitcominers.com/

moar scum?
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=398394.msg4304272#msg4304272
http://www.bitcoinmininglab.com/

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=361692.msg4337471#msg4337471

a scammy fake reseller of blackarrow gear

http://www.blackarroweurope.com/home/8-prospero-x-1-100ghashsecond-reseller.html

confirmed by ba matt https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=294197.msg4329281#msg4329281

Thanks for the vote of confidence. We hope we can live up to the status of recommended!

Why is BFL not on this list?

BFL delivered before.. just late. haha

How they handled refunds was borderline scammy in my opinion. And being 1 year late is not acceptable for any preorder.

I feel HashFast belongs on that list..

well, soon enough many companies will be in that list. late delivery seems way too common.

How come alpha-t.net isnt on the list? Is it only for bitcoin mining hardware?


    Website registered less than 8 months ago
    An 6U rack weighs approx. 12kg - EMPTY. Yet... the 5 x Viper weighs 6kg... approx.
    No name mentioned on website, except partner. No CEO. No engineer-named, albeit the fact that this must be quite a daunting undertaking.
    Picture of company shows banner, they cut-off the door, windows, street... "unwanted" signs?
    So far in the testing of the unit, and they can't show a decent enclosure?
    Website has 90% focus on sell, 2% on product, 8% the rest.
    If you outsource the CHIP-design, your focus must be marketing, so what are the "IT"-people doing? CPU development is a VERY difficult undertaking, so it won't do with people with MS-certifications, but very specialized labs.
    If the product is not yet finnished, how do they know the price now?
    If the product IS finnished, with 70% CM, it would be much more profitable to actually mine yourself because every machine would pay its own cost (with 25USD/LTC and DIFF = 3200) in 20 days or less.
    They know people will scrutinize, why on earth not show yourself + staff with picture, names etc? ANY person? ANY name? ANY photo?
    If you want to look like a scam, then it would look like this. And based on ockhams razor... this is then a scam.

No accounts filed with Companies House and they are renamed from another company that was dissolved after a year. You can order more info but you have to pay companies house for the fileings etc.

Company Details

Print Page. Open help text in a new window.

Name & Registered Office:
ALPHA TECHNOLOGY (INT) LTD
66 DICKENSON ROAD
MANCHESTER
ENGLAND
M14 5HF
Company No. 08483921


      
Status: Active
Date of Incorporation: 11/04/2013

Country of Origin: United Kingdom
Company Type: Private Limited Company
Nature of Business (SIC):
71121 - Engineering design activities for industrial process and production
72190 - Other research and experimental development on natural sciences and engineering
Accounting Reference Date: 30/04
Last Accounts Made Up To:  (NO ACCOUNTS FILED)
Next Accounts Due: 11/01/2015
Last Return Made Up To: 30/11/2013
Next Return Due: 28/12/2014
Mortgage: Number of charges: ( 0 outstanding / 0 satisfied / 0 part satisfied )
Last Members List: 30/11/2013
Previous Names:
Date of change    Previous Name
22/07/2013    CHESHIRE TECHNOLOGY LTD
UK Establishment Details
There are no UK Establishments associated with this company.
Oversea Company Info
There are no Oversea Details associated with this company.

Name & Registered Office:
CHESHIRE TECHNOLOGY LIMITED
GLOUCESTER HOUSE
CHURCH WALK
BURGESS HILL
WEST SUSSEX
UNITED KINGDOM
RH15 9AS
Company No. 07002975


      
Status: Dissolved 25/05/2010
Date of Incorporation: 27/08/2009

Country of Origin: United Kingdom
Company Type: Private Limited Company
Nature of Business (SIC):
None Supplied
Accounting Reference Date: 31/08
Last Accounts Made Up To:  (NO ACCOUNTS FILED)
Next Accounts Due:
Last Return Made Up To:
Next Return Due:
Mortgage: Number of charges: ( 0 outstanding / 0 satisfied / 0 part satisfied )
Previous Names:
No previous name information has been recorded over the last 20 years.
UK Establishment Details
There are no UK Establishments associated with this company.
Oversea Company Info
There are no Oversea Details associated with this company.

Another wanna be company claiming to be shipping miners now

http://hashcoins.com

I doubt there's really anything anyone can do. But I thought I'd post here to maybe shed some light on "Xtrememiners.net". First of all they've stolen over $200,000 so far.

They are clearly a fraud, and I stupidly sent them $10,000 worth of bitcoin about a month ago. I've come in contact with several other people that have been scammed, and managed to get some info on them.
contact with. They claim to be selling BTC Asic miners, but in reality they, their company, and their product do not exist. They make a good job of making them anonymous/unreachable as well.

Heres the small amount of information I have on them:

ISP: Affinity Internet (Now a subsidiary of Hostway Services)
Domain Security: Hostway Services
Web design service: Wix.com
IP: 10.60.103.211 (Blocked with a proxy) Public IP: 216.185.152.159
Main Bitcoin Wallet used to Launder funds: 18YZ4gSS8n84w9WY57nUW4UQFSQypMb7SV

I've tricked them several times into calling me, so I could bluff/scare them into giving my BTC back, or atleast shutting their website down. No dice. Both times a young woman answered the phone, and gave me a bunch of vague answers to rather probing questions (Why don't you have a VAT, Who is Mr.Berg, etc). The second time she called a few minutes later answering to a different name. I called her out on it, and she became panicky and hung up.

The information listed in their Impressum is false, and I have strong reason to believe they are based out of the U.S. based both on domain (.com/.de) Lack of business registration for Germany, and information gained through calls made to them.
I have tried getting information from Wix.com/Hostway Services/Affinity Internet, but they all say they cannot release information without a court order. I have tried taking this case to law enforcement, but no one has taken any action against these fraudsters, probably due to the murky nature of legislation regarding the currency.
If anyone could offer advice/help, I'd sincerely appreciate it, but I understand at this point I, and the other victims of the scam, pretty much just learned a $10,000 lesson in life.

Man you're calm about it. I'd be hopping up and down, and willing to travel, to strangle... enough about me.
Sorry for your loss. Keep all records. Join forces with other scamees. Maybe btc antiscam lawyers will become a thing. There's surely enough loot involved.

To anyone who thinks they have found an asic bitcoin miner: sorry, but no, you 99% likely have not.

There are about a dozen known hardware providers, see this thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=403459.msg4364939#msg4364939 and half of them are dishonest

otherwise all asic bitcoin miners and manufacturers are scams

edit: okay there are some providers not on either list, maybe 20 or so Chinese resellers of Avalon boards, maybe 10 known ( on this forum ) board and thumb makers, but

if you think you have found an undiscovered asic miner, no, please read here first or you will lose your money

Another SCAM to add to this sorry list:

Bitcoin Exchange Ltd, https://bitcoinexchangeltd.com

Claim they trade BTC for cash but my experience is they just take your BTC (see also https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=332876.msg4370868#msg4370868)

In the absence of my promised but yet to materialise refund my loss has been minor. It seems from https://blockchain.info/address/1Ndvbh9Li8Bm8jSSfPUyj3ytNrNz49HxWV (on just one of their deposit addresses) others stand to loose much more including several deposits since my earlier posts.

It also seems their claimed Company registration # 08459694 and associated address may not be their own (see https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=332876.msg4374395#msg4374395)

<<
Name & Registered Office:
BITCOIN EXCHANGE LTD.
 86-90 PAUL STREET
LONDON
ENGLAND
EC2A 4NE
Company No. 08459694

Status: Active
Date of Incorporation: 25/03/2013

Country of Origin: United Kingdom
  
Company Type: Private Limited Company
Nature of Business (SIC):  None Supplied
  
Accounting Reference Date: 31/12
Last Accounts Made Up To:   (NO ACCOUNTS FILED)
Next Accounts Due: 30/09/2014
Last Return Made Up To:
Next Return Due: 22/04/2014
  
Mortgage: Number of charges: ( 0 outstanding / 0 satisfied / 0 part satisfied )      
 
Previous Names:
No previous name information has been recorded over the last 20 years.
 
UK Establishment Details  
There are no UK Establishments associated with this company.
  
Oversea Company Info  
There are no Oversea Details associated with this company.
>>

Whois shows Michael Harris as their domain registrant. This is the same guy who pops up on their on-line chat though with me he claimed to be no more than a third party chat operator unable to make any decisions.

<<
Domain Name: BITCOINEXCHANGELTD.COM
 Registrar URL: http://www.godaddy.com
 Registrant Name: Michael Harris
 Registrant Organization: BITCOIN EXCHANGE LTD.
 Name Server: NS2.BITCOINEXCHANGELTD.COM
 Name Server: NS1.BITCOINEXCHANGELTD.COM
 DNSSEC: unsigned

 For complete domain details go to:
 http://who.godaddy.com/whoischeck.aspx?domain=BITCOINEXCHANGELTD.COM

 Information Updated: Fri, 10 Jan 2014 12:05:19 UTC
>>
 
If anyone has experience to contrary I'd be happy to know. If I receive my refund after all I'll let you know. Gross obstructiveness and incompetence is one thing, while fraud would be another entirely.

Meanwhile I've filed full reports with Action Fraud and the UK Office of Fair Trading.

Just to add..

I would urge anyone who believes they have been victim of fraud by https://bitcoinexchangeltd.com to report it ASAP to Action Fraud on 0300 123 2040.

It only takes 20 minutes or so to do so and the more reports submitted on individual fraudsters the higher the profile of their case with the police. The sooner these and similar fraudulent websites are taken down the better for us all and the future of Bitcoin/crypto currencies.

https://mammoth-mining.com/

have we done them? they seem dubious to say the least

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=420625.0

kotaklabs  https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=342853.100

cryoniks https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=214378.20  just for experience.

Thanks xstr8guy for the effort compiling and maintaining this list.

Just a suggestion: can we order them alphabetically?

I was about to report them here to,TheMaggot for a 3TH miner is helirous

Some experience with front-end programming (you should be able to code up a simple web site and/or an application).

That is a terriable way to describe the skills you need for that job

Here are couple more...

COMPANY..............	SCAM?.......	DISCUSSION...	WEBSITE (caution, offsite link)
asic-products.com	Confirmed	Link (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=366942)	Link (http://asic-products.com/)
asic-market.com	Confirmed	Link (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=366942)	Link (http://asic-market.com/)
bitcoin-world.net	Confirmed	Link (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=366942)	Link (http://http://bitcoin-world.net/)

BFL and Hashfast should at least get "special mention" on this list.  Delivering products far later then promised is basically a scam, because people will never earn back what they invest.

VMC/AMC does have a chip under development eASIC put out a press release (http://www.easic.com/vmc-uses-easic-to-achieve-24-756-ths-bitcoin-miner/) discussing their chip. I made a couple btc buying AMC stock on btct.co when that press release came out and then selling right away. Fun times.   I certainly wouldn't buy hardware from them, they are way late on hardware - they were supposed to start shipping in november and never did. I have no idea what happened with people's pre-order money, and their CEO has gone completely silent.

Also, I saw a link to mammoth mining (https://mammoth-mining.com/) earlier today, super-obvious scam.

What do you think about http://cryptcloudex.com/?

it's that triple b mining again, there was a thread on here a while back

I can't find the thread. Is it legit?

sorry nor can i for now. there's this https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=434343.0

but it's not helpful

suggest you add to that thread and treat all such new sites as scams unless proven otherwise.

if they were legit they'd be on here somewhere fighting back like ntek

found it dunno what to make of it

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=388972.0

user ninjaboon in that thread is trustworthy

What about http://miningbucket.com/

http://hashcoins.com/ - very high scam possibility

And Technobit.eu!

Scam

what about phoenix1969 / mauiflipper / aussiepete / searing etc?

BFL scammed me. I don't care what anyone says or what they are doing these days, those guys are straight-up con artists.

http://hashra.com/t-c , why does there postcode start with ec also?
be carefull people, people from london are scum of the earth

Please see this definitive warning about www.bitcoinexchangeltd.com from the Administrator of Bitcoinukforum. They are a scam. BUT NOT AFFILIATED OR ASSOCIATED with Bitcoin Exchange Ltd in any way. http://bitcoinukforum.com/index.php?PHPSESSID=e5ecc8f8a8b5d4fe5b74b3a15b52310a&topic=86.msg100#msg100

It's a company-in-a-box type service so you can register at that address instead of your own and they forward on the mail. Load's of scams seem to use the same services using EC2 postcodes as registered address. EC2 is not exactly a cheap part of london so any new company based there is either a scam or stupid.

Let's add axonlabs.net offering 3th miners.

http://www.bitcoinminingprolab.com/ looks like a scam

Miner Warehouse
http://minerwarehouse.com/

Status: confirmed scam IMHO.  I'm not going to give them the benefit of the doubt, too many red flags.

Proof: see my analysis from another thread below.  I just picked two products - one was a complete fake! - that was enough for me.  I can't be bothered blowing holes in the rest of their scam-site.  If someone else wants to take it up from here, feel free, but I've seen enough.  

Hey what does everyone think of Mining ASICs Technologies B.V. (MAT)?

There was an article about them in Bitcoin mag: http://bitcoinmagazine.com/11125/asics-litecoin-come/ (http://bitcoinmagazine.com/11125/asics-litecoin-come/)

And here is their store: https://www.mining-asics-technologies.com/shop/ (https://www.mining-asics-technologies.com/shop/)

With machines like that - I was astounded - yet they featured in Bitcoin mag yet it all looks too good to be true?

The team are listed with Linkedin profiles - one withe 350 connections, so that's two boxes ticked. But very long lead time is not good.

What do you think? Should we be trusting this one?

Regards
Estelle

Looks like a scam.

50mh miner is cheaper than 30mh.

All prices are just too low to be legit.

And September delivery is pretty late. I'm guessing this is so they can keep collecting preorder funds before people wonder why nothing is shipping.

This thread could not possibly keep up with all the scams out there.

Please don't imagine you can use your googlefu to find some wonderful new undiscovered manufacturer who will make you rich.

There's a good enough evaluation of manufacturers here:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=456691.0

It be easier if we had a REPUTABLE miner fabricator list leaving out those who have scammed or push pre-sales without the basic requirements expected by the community. Like a clear BTC/Fiat refund policy, TOS that is also clear, evidence that supports the fabricator has lived up to their promises. I think there have been some threads like that but we really need something that is stickied to the top.

You can then set the criteria for inclusion.

What do you think of http://asicminingequipment.com/ scam or not?

Selling neptunes for less than knc.

Definite scam.

Add photonicmining with their super mining machines. Google them for a good laugh, but don't be fooled by the website its very well done

Anybody heard of minersube.com

Do you really expect us to believe you are reselling knc neptunes for 8 btc when knc is selling for 20 btc?

Also you have 900 neptunes for sale out of the total 2000? Seems legit.

If you're going to scam at least put some effort in to it.

IMHO this is CLEARLY SCAMMER site. LOL "900 Neptunes" get a grip, this newbie has in his hands, 1/4 of the entire Neptune supply whilst KNC can not tell me how many KW to prep for..  right right..

100% SH!T BAGGER!!!

Yeah YOU do.. Scumbag SCAMMER!!

Over in another thread they just made the bold claim that mining with USB miners (think anything from Block Erupter through AntMiner U2 to hex•fury) is "still very profitable".  If they don't come up with some very solid data, this looks like, sounds like, and smells like a typical scam.. advertise fast, advertise hard, profit off of the few who fall for it / are willing to take the risk, then disappear without a trace.

Yes "he" has been a busy bee, saw a ton of high pressure BS he was hosing, NO phone, NO address, NO products == 100% Scam, NO doubt. Mod could do an IP lookup and alert authorities?

Hope no one falls for this crap-o-la  http://asicminingequipment.com/ scam

And just like that, *poof* he's gone :D

Just so everyone knows...user jefe541 is a SCAMMER! He ran a group buy and stole coins from me and many others. I have reported it to admin but they cant ban anyone..wtf...oh well. I just want others to be aware..here are links to the scam thread..


https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=508169.0

It is good to see someone taking up the mantle of my previous scam watch thread, thanks for doing this OP! It is important for new miners to see this before buying.

I went back through my original list to see which of those sites is still operational if you would like to include them, thankfully the majority of them are either offline or completely gone now, unfortunately followed up by this latest crop of swindlers.  

Still Active (not including vendors that proved to be real later on):

http://www.gxmining.com/

http://asicrigs.com/
http://gpurigs.com/

I'm fairly sure all three are the work of the same miscreants due to each being very similar to each other.

They certainly try hard to look legitimate; linkedin profiles and all.

I do however wonder why Brian Chee (http://www.linkedin.com/pub/brian-chee/8b/259/467?trk=pub-pbmap) is aka Dr Ken Chu:
https://i.imgur.com/xZfznc5t.png (https://i.imgur.com/xZfznc5.png)
https://lsm-labs.com/team

https://i.imgur.com/bcviNHJt.png (https://i.imgur.com/bcviNHJ.png)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ken_Chu_(businessman) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ken_Chu_(businessman))

Edit: And Prakash Goya (http://www.linkedin.com/pub/prakash-goya/8b/809/629) is also very stocktastic: http://smlme.com/images/sliderimage/20130723/bussiness-man.png

That's some expensive connectors ;)  Can't just source those locally?  Edit: I see you're trying to do exactly that (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=580955.new#new). Not that you should have to, I know, but...

I don't think Bitmain is a scam operation (plenty of people do have working hardware delivered) so much as just a (potentially) horribly mismanaged operation when it concerns after sales support and possible QC issues.  They wouldn't be the first; lack of organized communication plagued another well-known seller for a whilem but that seems to be in the past and they're now much more responsive).  While it would be great if every company was as communicative and responsible as e.g. BenTuras (OneStringMiner), I think that might be a pipe dream.  But that doesn't really make them scammers.

See also OP's notes and discussion on this on the first page of the thread; https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=366659.msg3915964#msg3915964

Sorry to hear about your trouble, I hope you are up and hashing soon.

Bitmain are not a scam, I personally own an S1 and an S2. Both are hashing right now.

Scams are companies that take your money and literally do not have a product, and never will have a product. They won't ship you anything, ever. That is what this thread is for.

Not technically a scam, but you need to be very wary when ordering with Cointerra.

If you request a refund you will have a fight getting a penny out of them. I was told 2-4 weeks for my refund. Its been 5 now and I still haven't received a penny of the $25k they owe me. Not only that they have ignored my last couple of emails. There's a growing thread of similar complaints on their forum. So definitely one to keep an eye on. 

It's getting to the point where I am looking at local debt collection agencies and court orders to go in and remove their furniture.

Fun times

AMT Should be on the list. Not a single miner which they claim they have shipped thousands of have been seen WORKING in the wild. Everyone has received broken crap, or like me, nothing at all. They don't honor the order numbers (I am 899 and they have shipped orders in the thousands). They refuse requests for refunds and will not even respond to me regarding where my order (that I placed in December 2013) is.

They are also facing a class action lawsuit. People need to watch out for AMT, they will NOT get what they paid for. Plain and simple.

they called me liar and refuse to send thhe parts they lost as well as sending back the parts I already had, the thermal paste is still on the boards has same Smear pattern from when I took them off. Ya OK not a scam, but scammers for not doing their part as a business upholding their end. You get broken equipment your basically fucked..... FUCK Bitmain

Can most probably add http://www.extolabs.com/ to the list.  Thread here: Extolabs - legitimate ASIC maker or scam? (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=583857.new;topicseen#new).  tl;dr: the usual shiny website with unsubstantiated claims taking pre-orders while having nothing convincing to show and draws their staff member pictures from the interwebs, photoshopped chip images, etc.

AMT should definitely be on the list, for there's still not one working complete unit that they shipped into the wild that's shown or claimed working.

def not a scam....

This list is really helpful, thank you very much for your help

well then - this forum has members all over the world - ask someone to pay them a visit or even offer them some money to pay them a visit.

I'd like to second having Bitmine.ch added to the scam list.

I placed my order in November 2013 for February delivery.

I cancelled the order in April 2014 and requested a refund due to non-delivery.

I was told in June that due to the large number of refunds requested, they could not make them all in a timely fashion as their bank only allowed a certain number of transactions per month (a likely story... not).

I am still waiting for a refund which I doubt I shall see without legal action.

If AMT miners is not on this list the whole thread had better be deleted. These guys are the biggest scammers on earth. Their newest spin on the mining industry is to take your money ($6,000 in my case) and wait 9 months until comparable hashing rates are a 1/6th of what they were - monetarily speaking. they claimed they had their own miners and were an American company. almost a year later, no miner, no refund, they are trying to give customers a re-branded chinese miner worth a 1/6th of what monies they took from customers LAST YEAR!

Well well well...


How did AMT work out for people? Marto vouched did he?

Thanks for the list. I'll watch out for these scammers.

AMT is a scam, plain and simple. The way it works is simple with them:
-Order hardware (Performance specs which is misrepresented on their site even now)
-Get an incomplete unit (in the case of customers months later)
-Run around when requesting replacement/RMA/refund
-They send out an underperforming/undervalued unit weeks/months later
-Profit!

They get to walk away with the amount paid, and people get stuck with an expensive paperweight.

They currently are using our funds to fight the very lawsuit customers brought against them. They also use said funds to get new petahash farms and all sorts of other cloud based mining deals. Additionally in the last few weeks it appears that AMT opened up 2 new offices one in China and another in Bulgaria. This obviously takes money to do. So the question is where are the refunds they promised very publicly? Nowhere. They have made various public claims and many have been lies. They only thing we know for sure is that Joshua Zipkin is a real person. Beyond that very little can be validated. He appears to be running a legitimate operation on the surface, but this is no different than BFL in practice. Delays, Distraction and Ignore all while difficulty rises and hardware does not ship. There are a number of other customers many spend thousands more in larger orders who are still waiting.

Can we nominate HASHRA?

Seems impossible to find a tracking number for a moonraker, maybe they will be the next BFL.

Black Arrow, they stole $5.5k USD from me. I ordered in November 2013 and I've received nothing but additional spam in my due to them selling my info.

$5.5k + $13k in mining revenue, gone with nothing (but spam) in return.

I should note that they delivered a few units last month that exploded and burst into flames but only to customers who requested refunds.

While smaller than BFL this is defiantly the most crooked ASIC company to date. Its director Alex SOVU is a convicted criminal from doing credit card fraud out of Romania.

This thread is no longer being updated. There are much better sources of information on this forum.

Please see Dogie's Manufacturers Trustworthiness Guide for current information...
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=456691

Thread locked