Bitcoin Forum

Economy => Gambling => Topic started by: hippich on August 16, 2010, 06:51:57 PM



Title: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: hippich on August 16, 2010, 06:51:57 PM
Address of the project - https://betco.in . Any discussion are welcome! Contact with any personal/account related questions via contact form on the website.

Promotions:

- Happy Halloween 20% Deposit Bonus (see details below).
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About Happy Halloween 20% Deposit Bonus



Between now and November 1st all deposits will get 20% on top of it. Please contact us via site to claim your bonus (right now this is manual process).

Some limitations:

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- For deposit to qualify - for each 1 btc you need to get 100 rake back points. You have time till November 30 to get enough rake back points to qualify for deposit bonus.
- You should not cash your points until you claimed your 20% bonus. Once bonus is claimed you can cash your rake back points as usual.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: mtgox on August 16, 2010, 07:05:15 PM
Are you based in the US?
(I'll play when it is up)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: nelisky on August 16, 2010, 07:08:54 PM
I'm game, for sure.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on August 16, 2010, 07:16:57 PM
I'm in for testing for sure. Keep us updated.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on August 16, 2010, 08:23:28 PM
Are you based in the US?
(I'll play when it is up)

right now i live in us, but company or server - nope. =) if it will become too serious - tor will save us =)) but i doubt it will be necessary


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on August 29, 2010, 05:14:37 AM
Just want to let know everyone who tried it already - I've fixed few issues with queuing ajax requests and now it should be way faster. Also fixed anoying flash of previous cards before dealing new cards.

since there is not so much people yet, let's schedule time to play. I am on GMT-5 time zone.

for everyone: if you want to be beta tester - let me know via email pavel@yepcorp.com (better) or PM (not so good =)).
There is no option to play with "play" money, but there is table with as low as 0.02-0.04 bets.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on August 29, 2010, 05:26:49 AM
Just added https:// support just to make sure it's not so easy to sniff traffic. =)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on August 29, 2010, 06:48:18 AM
Cool. I'm going to be sitting at a table for a little while. It would be neat if there was a button people could press to "poke" me and make a beep or something because I can leave it open all the time, but I won't be monitoring it constantly.

I got a certificate warning, but that happens to me a lot. Am I doing something wrong?


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on August 29, 2010, 07:08:17 AM
I just realized that there is probably a noise when someone sits down or a hand is dealt or something. I had my headphones plugged in, but not in my ears when I tried it out before.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: lfm on August 29, 2010, 01:01:19 PM
Just added https:// support just to make sure it's not so easy to sniff traffic. =)

I tried to transfer 2.00 btc to the game but they never showed up in the balance on the poker site.

https is good


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on August 29, 2010, 01:05:09 PM
Cool. I'm going to be sitting at a table for a little while. It would be neat if there was a button people could press to "poke" me and make a beep or something because I can leave it open all the time, but I won't be monitoring it constantly.

I got a certificate warning, but that happens to me a lot. Am I doing something wrong?

Certificate is self-signed so it's good only for keeping traffic crypted and it will complain that browser can't confirm identity of certificate owner, becuase it's never was issues by root certificate issuers =).

as for "poke" - as you found already - it makes sound when someone joined same table as you. =)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on August 29, 2010, 01:06:54 PM
Just added https:// support just to make sure it's not so easy to sniff traffic. =)

I tried to transfer 2.00 btc to the game but they never showed up in the balance on the poker site.

https is good

I see your transaction in Bitcoin, but not in poker room. Did you pressed "refresh" link in Deposit page? I think it's a bit confusing, so I proably make it refreshing each time you open Deposit page or My  Account page tho..


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on August 29, 2010, 01:43:50 PM
Changed a bit code. Now balance refreshed everytime you access any /user/ page, i.e. My Account, Deposit, Withdrawal for now.

Decided if it will cause load problems, I always can cache on BitCoin Model layer instead forcing user to press "Refresh" everytime. =)

Also, added sorting to table list. Now tables will be sorted by number of people at them. So it will be easier to find table with someone already there =) Just small hack, probbably just for me =)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: Insti on August 29, 2010, 10:04:40 PM
Do you need to have so many tables/gametypes?

Can you add 0.01/0.02 NL?

Is there any rake?



Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on August 29, 2010, 11:50:01 PM
Well.. I expect that it will be popular =) So we definatelly need enough tables. =)

I've added .01-.02 table and called it "Instis". If you do not like it - provide better name =))

There is rake in system, but I am trying to turn it off. Will let you know when it will be done.

Also, on a side note, fixed issues with caching content by browser on HTTPS:// pages. Now it should work even faster =)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: lfm on August 30, 2010, 01:21:18 AM
Just added https:// support just to make sure it's not so easy to sniff traffic. =)

I tried to transfer 2.00 btc to the game but they never showed up in the balance on the poker site.

https is good

I see your transaction in Bitcoin, but not in poker room. Did you pressed "refresh" link in Deposit page? I think it's a bit confusing, so I proably make it refreshing each time you open Deposit page or My  Account page tho..

I eventually got it and was able to play, it worked well after that. Not sure about the refresh thing.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on August 30, 2010, 02:06:40 AM
I've reworked it when you came back so you did not noticed it. %)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on August 30, 2010, 03:02:37 AM
Brand new table for bitcoin poker room =))

http://imagebin.ca/img/OOfmr_m.png


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on August 30, 2010, 03:26:25 AM
Sweet


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: semyazza on August 30, 2010, 05:57:27 AM
Yes,
I have been playing there too. Things looks like they are coming along nicely. Very good work. Can't wait til it's out of beta and everyone is playing.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on August 30, 2010, 02:05:51 PM
Yeah, and I lost 10 bitcoins... Although, as usual for me in poker room =)))


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: nelisky on August 30, 2010, 02:43:31 PM
Just been playing. The general sensation is good, but one small thing kept bugging me, as setting the raise amount manually in the text box would never assume the changed value. If changing using the slide it works ok, though.

The other thing I got is once Insti, which was already there, left while I was playing against LINKOU which had joined after myself, the whole thing slowed down to a crawl eventually killing the flash plugin with it. Might have been unrelated, but hey...


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on August 30, 2010, 03:54:39 PM
Changing value is definitely bug in client. I will look into it once I will get back home from work. As for flash - in theory it's used only to play audio, but I will definitely change this into HTML5 <audio> soon.

I need to setup bugtraq for this project.. %)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on August 31, 2010, 03:40:05 AM
Fixed issue with manual setting raise amount. Also made slider to act realtime (instead setting value when you finished sliding)

Also implemented buttons with CSS3. Sorry IE8 and previous owners, you will see plain square buttons instead =(

Rearranged buttons as we discussed before, removed these pot, 1/2, etc buttons and made left buttons to be more easy to use. Comments on buttons welcome, since it is first time I work on UI stuff =))

http://imagebin.ca/img/Hdb_up2n.png


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on August 31, 2010, 03:57:06 AM
Oh, that's much better.

Have you stopped the rake for now?


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on August 31, 2010, 04:03:31 AM
not yet, but i already spoke with creators of poker-network software, and they pointed me to how i can do it. i will work on it tomorrow.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on August 31, 2010, 04:39:15 AM
Cool. To be clear, I absolutely think you should rake it a little bit when it's good to go. You need money for advertising and promotion and eventually to get it on a good server or even two(?). But while it's in testing it's kind of silly. You'll want to know how to adjust in the future anyway.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on September 01, 2010, 04:01:58 AM
Cool. To be clear, I absolutely think you should rake it a little bit when it's good to go. You need money for advertising and promotion and eventually to get it on a good server or even two(?). But while it's in testing it's kind of silly. You'll want to know how to adjust in the future anyway.

Hey, I finally did it. And I totally agree with you. =) So from now plays at BP are absolutelly free. (but not forever =))

Any idea what needed to be implemented/fixed before opening it to public? I really like idea of doing tourneys, but it will take a while to code this part. 

Do we need full-fledged profiles, or it's better to keep users anonymous? May be some kind of ratings (but what we should rate here?).

Anyway, I want to fix few nasty bugs, and open it to public finally. And work from there depending on what people want and how. Backend is pretty solid.

Need to shop for good domain name for it. If someone got some idea for domain name - let me know too =)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on September 01, 2010, 09:08:28 AM
My preference would be keeping things anonymous. Since it's going to start slow, a message about when peak time is would be good.

Security is very important. Both actually being secure and finding a way to convince people that it's true. Honestly I'll play lowish stakes without worrying, but I wouldn't recommend it or play higher until there was a third party review or something. Security should be an ongoing process, too, of course. As it grows hacking it will be more and more lucrative. And the nature of bitcoin is such that once a hack is successful there is no fixing it.

I'm thinking about domain names now, I'll let you know if I think of anything decent.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: Anonymous on September 01, 2010, 10:12:48 AM
@hippich

I thought of one for you -check your messages  :)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: nelisky on September 01, 2010, 11:06:00 AM
So, playing a bit more...

'I' call, 'he' raises, 'I'... don't get any action buttons, my time starts counting and I time out. The hand is closed with 'he' winning (everyone folded) and the next hand simply doesn't start. Sound plays fine, messages work fine too, just a lost hand that was actually quite good and no more cards. Good thing it's the micro stakes table!


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: TTBit on September 01, 2010, 12:33:43 PM
I would suggest doing something different than rake. Maybe a much smaller time charge or even a monthly fee option. i.e. can pay X.99 BTC per mo or have my pots raked.

don't even know if possible.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: TTBit on September 01, 2010, 12:39:23 PM
I was thinking -  couldn't this site be marketed as 'produce bitcoins on your computer and play them here' and 'ultimate free play poker site.' Therefore, play would be legal in the US, as this is just fake money.  Of course, we would all know that anyone could buy bitcoins and then cash them out at MtGox, as producing bitcoins is a problem for most.

I thought gambling in japan had a format like this. It is illegal to gamble, but you can buy those pachinko balls for x yen, play, then another store across the street buys them back from you.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on September 01, 2010, 01:05:00 PM
My preference would be keeping things anonymous. Since it's going to start slow, a message about when peak time is would be good.

Security is very important. Both actually being secure and finding a way to convince people that it's true. Honestly I'll play lowish stakes without worrying, but I wouldn't recommend it or play higher until there was a third party review or something. Security should be an ongoing process, too, of course. As it grows hacking it will be more and more lucrative. And the nature of bitcoin is such that once a hack is successful there is no fixing it.

I'm thinking about domain names now, I'll let you know if I think of anything decent.


Hm. I didn't thought much about security.. I've got idea today in the shower - I think I will setup cron job, which will transfer money regulary to another address(es) keeping only small amount to keep small withdrawals automated. If someone will decide withdraw 10X of what usually gets withdrawn per day, he will get his order in status "Pending" and I will recieve email to check if everything is fine, then transfer money to BP wallet and resubmit his requests.

This way even if someone will get total control over server, disaster will not happen.

As for security in general - I have experience working in this fields from both sides, so it's something i know already. And this server, where it's hosted, is dedicated server and fully in my control. If things will roll, I will move to separate server just for poker room.

But yeah, I like idea start slow. This is something I had in mind too. It's easy and in the same time, will fit better. =)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on September 01, 2010, 01:06:03 PM
@hippich

I thought of one for you -check your messages  :)

Great find!!! Thank you, I will do shopping today! =)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on September 01, 2010, 01:07:47 PM
So, playing a bit more...

'I' call, 'he' raises, 'I'... don't get any action buttons, my time starts counting and I time out. The hand is closed with 'he' winning (everyone folded) and the next hand simply doesn't start. Sound plays fine, messages work fine too, just a lost hand that was actually quite good and no more cards. Good thing it's the micro stakes table!


This is one of these nasty bugs I mentioned above. This happens when connectivity with server goes bad just for one request. I also got this behivior few times (with other buttons, like fold, raise, call). So it's something I want to fix asap.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on September 01, 2010, 01:11:05 PM
I was thinking -  couldn't this site be marketed as 'produce bitcoins on your computer and play them here' and 'ultimate free play poker site.' Therefore, play would be legal in the US, as this is just fake money.  Of course, we would all know that anyone could buy bitcoins and then cash them out at MtGox, as producing bitcoins is a problem for most.

I thought gambling in japan had a format like this. It is illegal to gamble, but you can buy those pachinko balls for x yen, play, then another store across the street buys them back from you.

As for rake/monthly fee/donations - will see. If project will roll - we will find out what best fit this community. I have total control over this poker room, so whatever will work best for us I can implement. (It's based on opensource components!)

As for marketing - you are right. I do not want to make bitcoin = dollar. And it's a reason why I want to be completelly separated from any exchanger, just to make sure, it's still "play money".


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on September 01, 2010, 07:40:10 PM
2Insti&semyazza

Regarding this Ad = 2c issue. I've found jpoker replaces identificators "Ad" with "Ax" in order to avoid ads blocking software. And of course, I missed this =)

So what happened - turn card showed (lowest) 2c card image instead of correct Ad card image, since it didn't matched Ad card CSS class.

I will fix this today in the evening.

Thank you for finding these weird bugs!!



Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on September 02, 2010, 03:04:51 AM
Fixed bug with wrong Ad card displayed.

Added lock on buttons, so now if you click multiple times on fold/raise/etc buttons, they will send request only once to server. Previously, if you clicked twice on these buttons and server did not responded fast it could generate two separate events and it acted as you clicked same button in next deal.

Fixed some random flashs of cards (which were refered, like you were able to see oponents cards. In reality this is cards from previous deal).

Added credits page, and cool domain name - thank you noagendamarket =)

next "features" will be captcha on login/register pages, password retrieve feature and support for uploadable avatars!


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on September 02, 2010, 09:25:29 AM
I saw myself bet .04 that I didn't think I bet, and then was raised to .04 very quickly (simultaneously? not sure). I think it displayed my opponent's raise in front of both of us.

There should be a clear "sitting out" notice on a player who is now sitting out. Is it changing color for that right now?


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on September 02, 2010, 10:33:17 AM
I guess the dimmer color might be good enough actually.

I noticed that when I use the check boxes the buttons still flash for a sec.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on September 02, 2010, 02:28:34 PM
I saw myself bet .04 that I didn't think I bet, and then was raised to .04 very quickly (simultaneously? not sure). I think it displayed my opponent's raise in front of both of us.

That's weird, since I think that's exactly what I've fixed. Do you think you can reproduce this "auto" raise behavior? If so, could you make sure to clear cache and try to reproduce it and let me how to do it.

Do you remember if table lagged at this moment?

There should be a clear "sitting out" notice on a player who is now sitting out. Is it changing color for that right now?

Yeah, it change's color of nickname to grey and show you link "sit in" instead nickname. I will look into source to see how it could be done more prominent. I like idea making the whole player area (avatar + nick + everything around inside this greenbox) to be darker.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on September 02, 2010, 03:28:06 PM
Also, I saw in chat logs you mentioned four colored deck. Could someone explain what this mean? As I understand, we play with one deck on table. So where from four colors should come?


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: TTBit on September 02, 2010, 06:17:09 PM
Also, I saw in chat logs you mentioned four colored deck. Could someone explain what this mean? As I understand, we play with one deck on table. So where from four colors should come?

Spades are black
Hearts are Red
Clubs are green (not black)
Diamonds are blue (not red)

easier to see flushes, especially if multitabling.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on September 02, 2010, 07:34:41 PM
These would make it much easier.

http://img838.imageshack.us/img838/5669/fourcolor.png (http://img838.imageshack.us/i/fourcolor.png/)



Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on September 03, 2010, 12:52:28 AM
Ah. Yeah. It's quite possible. Any guidlines regarding this image? Where from it came and could be it used in open source project?



Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on September 03, 2010, 02:50:38 AM
Ah. Yeah. It's quite possible. Any guidlines regarding this image? Where from it came and could be it used in open source project?



I grabbed it out of a thread on twoplustwo.com, let me see if I can find anything out.

The cards are very similar or maybe the exact cards as one of poker stars' options. I think they were put in the thread so people could mod their FTP layouts. They seem to simple to copyright to me anyway, but I wouldn't really know.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on September 03, 2010, 05:05:04 AM
Ah. Yeah. It's quite possible. Any guidlines regarding this image? Where from it came and could be it used in open source project?



I grabbed it out of a thread on twoplustwo.com, let me see if I can find anything out.

The cards are very similar or maybe the exact cards as one of poker stars' options. I think they were put in the thread so people could mod their FTP layouts. They seem to simple to copyright to me anyway, but I wouldn't really know.

Thank you!

My main concern is - this project will be opensourced right after opening project to public, so anyone will be able to grab copy and modify it, use and distribute. So I am concerned about including something what could infringe any other ownerships.

Probably, I will just work on existing card and will try to change their color. But if someone can contribute their graphical work - I will appreciate this =) Otherwise, it will take some time for me. I do better coding, then working with photoshop/GIMP =)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: chaord on September 03, 2010, 06:25:02 AM
I'm not much of a poker player, but I was thinking that a nationwide network of physical poker rooms would be a great way to run a bitcoin/cash exchange.  If set up correctly from an operational standpoint, from the state's perspective they wouldn't have anything to go on, unless of course friendly poker rooms are illegal in that state.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: Insti on September 03, 2010, 12:56:31 PM
Probably, I will just work on existing card and will try to change their color. But if someone can contribute their graphical work - I will appreciate this =) Otherwise, it will take some time for me. I do better coding, then working with photoshop/GIMP =)

Where are the current graphic files stored?


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on September 03, 2010, 11:23:48 PM
Here is uploaded to imagebin.ca - http://imagebin.ca/img/BJD5BjE.png

We need to preserve size and order of cards (at least for now).


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: Insti on September 04, 2010, 03:14:52 PM
Here is uploaded to imagebin.ca - http://imagebin.ca/img/BJD5BjE.png

We need to preserve size and order of cards (at least for now).

Ah they are stored in alphabetical order 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 9 A J K Q T. and Ad = Ax   


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on September 04, 2010, 08:31:42 PM
One guy from IRC promised to send tomorrow PSD of their own cards they used in their own poker room. Will see if they are better source to do colors tweaks! Will post it there once I will get my hands on.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: Insti on September 05, 2010, 07:02:46 AM
You probably should post here when you change your server ssl certificate..


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on September 05, 2010, 05:48:13 PM
Ah. sorry. yeah, I've got certificate from CACert.org =)

BTW, they have instructions how to make you browser trust cacert issued certificates by default - http://wiki.cacert.org/BrowserClients


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: BitcoinFX on September 06, 2010, 01:34:42 PM
Ah. Yeah. It's quite possible. Any guidlines regarding this image? Where from it came and could be it used in open source project?

Is the beta still running ? I will send you an email...


A great source for 'open source' card and table graphics would be the PokerTH 'Styles Gallery' http://www.pokerth.net/styles-gallery.html

Card Decks: http://www.pokerth.net/styles-gallery/card-deck.html ( Nobus 4-color full color card deck, is similar to the above. )

Game Table: http://www.pokerth.net/styles-gallery/game-table.html

Most of the 'packs' are available through deviantART.


Maybe someone could fork pokerTH to create BitTH or BitStars ! :D


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on September 06, 2010, 03:44:34 PM
Wow. That's great find! Thank you!

As for room itself - yea, it still beta. Still some annoy errors happens ) So please send email.


2All: What variant of cards you like the most? I think closest one is "Nobus 4-color full color card deck"? I need to check what is a license on them tho..


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on September 09, 2010, 11:12:18 AM
N/M


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on September 09, 2010, 02:56:36 PM
N/M

what does this mean? =)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on September 09, 2010, 06:23:24 PM
nevermind


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on September 10, 2010, 02:03:53 AM
four colored deck =)

http://img210.imageshack.us/img210/2004/bitcoinpokertable2.png

I've resized from original taller variant. this way it's much easier to integrate with existing design =))


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on September 10, 2010, 02:11:52 AM
Oh, it's pretty.



Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on September 12, 2010, 05:37:41 AM
Account edit page! =)


http://imagebin.ca/img/z5qcseT.png


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on September 12, 2010, 07:32:49 AM
Yes! 


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: LZ on September 15, 2010, 08:47:48 PM
Who wanna play holdem, guys? ;D


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on September 16, 2010, 05:04:16 AM
I've added plugins for keeping retrying to send packet to server in case of connectivity problem (after which room "freezes"). Can't tell for sure, but seems to work. Could someone play a bit and let me know if room will "freeze" again after clicking some action buttons?

This is biggest issue for me and snowstopper for opening room to public (imagine having AA in hand and room freeze =))


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: LZ on September 16, 2010, 06:30:45 AM
I recommend you to test through a slow connection (TOR, I2P, Opera Turbo, proxy, dial-up, etc).
I usually use a similar method for some software fast testing (an old computer, lack of resources).


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on September 16, 2010, 12:41:43 PM
I've used tc features in linux kernel to drop 50% packets and it still worked. If I keep increasing drop ratio, browser itself start throwing nasty errors, so I wanted to check in real environment. But this freeze issue happens only sometimes and hard to catch. =))


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on September 16, 2010, 05:06:06 PM
Continue to experiment with free SSL certificates providers. Now installed StartSSL free certificate, so do not surpised if browser will tell you difference =)

Hope, this will allow skip this ugly warning screen for most users.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on October 19, 2010, 02:50:19 AM
Finally, I decided to open it. Link already leaked, so no need to hide it anyway.

As a bonus for all beta testers I've deposited some bonuses. =) I did not had a lot of bitcoins, so do not expect a lot tho. =))

Anyway, spreading a word about it is highly welcomed!

Also, I am going to return rake back from now.



Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on October 19, 2010, 01:15:55 PM
As usual, there appeared bugs right after start. First one was realy serious, but thank you to joe, it is safe now.

Second one with showing wrong card faces.

Therefore I again shut it down and going to work on it.

Sorry guys. =(


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on October 21, 2010, 01:23:56 PM
It's up and running again =)

https://betco.in

Please, report all bugs you will find out. The best place is on GitHub (link in the bottom of the site) or here.

And consider this project still beta =)

Ah. If table will freeze for you - press F5 or right click and Refresh. And if it will happen often - report it back too!

Thank you everyone who were helping me with testing all of it!


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: TTBit on October 21, 2010, 03:34:35 PM
We need a poker night for the forum. I want to play, but don't want to wait for an opponent and then play heads up.

I'll start and say I'll be here during monday night football, which is 8:30pm ET (on monday) for 3 hours. I don't like to play short handed, meaning I'm bad at it.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on October 21, 2010, 04:18:27 PM
I am in! Will setup calendar notification for it!


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on October 21, 2010, 08:04:16 PM
We need a poker night for the forum. I want to play, but don't want to wait for an opponent and then play heads up.

I'll start and say I'll be here during monday night football, which is 8:30pm ET (on monday) for 3 hours. I don't like to play short handed, meaning I'm bad at it.

That is 2:30PM here which is tough for me, but I'll try.

Ohh, hippich, would it be hard to make it pop to the front of the screen when it is your turn?


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on October 21, 2010, 11:10:49 PM
We need a poker night for the forum. I want to play, but don't want to wait for an opponent and then play heads up.

I'll start and say I'll be here during monday night football, which is 8:30pm ET (on monday) for 3 hours. I don't like to play short handed, meaning I'm bad at it.

That is 2:30PM here which is tough for me, but I'll try.

Ohh, hippich, would it be hard to make it pop to the front of the screen when it is your turn?

Hm.. Interesting feature. I will look into makign it for sure! Thanx!


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on October 24, 2010, 11:27:00 PM
I've configured tables to have 180 secs timeout in case soeone experiense room freeze. i still look for options to eliminated this bug.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on October 26, 2010, 06:15:12 PM
Today tested room on iPad - work perfect =) Looking forward to test it on android device.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on October 26, 2010, 07:12:13 PM
Today tested room on iPad - work perfect =) Looking forward to test it on android device.

I played very briefly on my android one night when the power went out. It seemed to work fine.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on October 26, 2010, 07:17:26 PM
Was it phone or tablet?


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on October 26, 2010, 07:21:10 PM
Was it phone or tablet?

phone.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on October 26, 2010, 07:23:57 PM
I wonder what's about screensize. Was it's easy to play at all? Or you used some sort of zooming?


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on October 26, 2010, 07:48:12 PM
I wonder what's about screensize. Was it's easy to play at all? Or you used some sort of zooming?

It seemed easy to me, but I might have just been excited that it worked at all. It was only heads up, so maybe the whole table didn't fit, but it didn't matter. This was over a month ago, I'll try again later today and give a better report.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: bober182 on October 27, 2010, 02:30:30 AM
This is a general question for all gambling sites using bitcoin.
Wont it be good to impose a limit to stop 18 year and under kids from playing.
At least a formal warning and anti addiction messages.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on October 27, 2010, 03:38:59 AM
I do not care right now about all regulations and stuff like this. If kid was smart enough to find, buy/mint bitcoins - there is no moral right to limit his/her access to bitcoin poker room.

But later - proobably. If this thing will ever take off and bitcoins become second paypal - of course all these details will need to be fixed. But not right now.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on October 27, 2010, 03:40:43 AM
This is a general question for all gambling sites using bitcoin.
Wont it be good to impose a limit to stop 18 year and under kids from playing.
At least a formal warning and anti addiction messages.


Seriously? You think warnings stop people from doing what they want? Yes, people under 18 are people and choose to do what they want.

Did warnings stop you from watching porn?

Ageism is bigotry. It's been done to us, but we don't have to perpetuate the idea that there is some sub-human cutoff age if we don't want to.

Sorry to derail the thread, I won't discuss it here, but in another thread I'd love to rant for a while.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: nelisky on October 27, 2010, 03:49:09 AM
This is a general question for all gambling sites using bitcoin.
Wont it be good to impose a limit to stop 18 year and under kids from playing.
At least a formal warning and anti addiction messages.


Seriously? You think warnings stop people from doing what they want? Yes, people under 18 are people and choose to do what they want.

Did warnings stop you from watching porn?

Ageism is bigotry. It's been done to us, but we don't have to perpetuate the idea that there is some sub-human cutoff age if we don't want to.

Sorry to derail the thread, I won't discuss it here, but in another thread I'd love to rant for a while.

Yes please! But I can't wait... cannot hold it any longer...

What do warnings do for the user? Absolutely nothing! "No, officer, I didn't see the NO STEALING sign, or I wouldn't have gone for the cash register".
What do warnings do anyway? They serve as 'insurance' for those who don't want to take responsibility, like parents. Yes, I caught my son watching porn and the damn site didn't have a 18 year + warning, or I'm sure he wouldn't have clicked on it... ????

It's very late, I might have failed to express my feelings on this, but any kind of censorship is bad, disguise it as you wish. And I know, terrorists, child porn, you name your excuse for controlling everything and everyone, but I just feel that the flip side of the current censorship and control situation is much worse than what they say they want to avoid :) And you fill in the 'they' placeholders with whatever form of government you have where you live, it's pretty much all the same everywhere.

There, I said it, now off to bed.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: Drifter on October 27, 2010, 12:08:23 PM
You guys can call it "censorship" all you want but it doesn't take away from the fact that in the United States you can get in deep trouble for making a wager with a minor over the internet. Of course you'll argue "I had no idea he was only 15!", but the fact that you knowingly played poker at a site that did not even post an age restriction, well, "you should have known better" is what it will come down to.

You can take the risk if you want but I honestly see no point in doing so. Stand up for what you believe in, but this would hardly be the way to go about it. I can give my 5% rake to a poker table that I barely have to worry about technical issues, security, or legality. It has nothing to do with my stance on underage gambling, but all to do with my country's stance on this issue. If I object to that, I'll argue the law and try to change it, not disobey the law and explain myself later.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on October 27, 2010, 01:23:53 PM
This makes perfect sense and will be done sometimes. But just not now. Right now the whole bitcoins world is in it's infancy.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: nelisky on October 27, 2010, 01:24:55 PM
You guys can call it "censorship" all you want but it doesn't take away from the fact that in the United States you can get in deep trouble for making a wager with a minor over the internet. Of course you'll argue "I had no idea he was only 15!", but the fact that you knowingly played poker at a site that did not even post an age restriction, well, "you should have known better" is what it will come down to.

You can take the risk if you want but I honestly see no point in doing so. Stand up for what you believe in, but this would hardly be the way to go about it. I can give my 5% rake to a poker table that I barely have to worry about technical issues, security, or legality. It has nothing to do with my stance on underage gambling, but all to do with my country's stance on this issue. If I object to that, I'll argue the law and try to change it, not disobey the law and explain myself later.


It's the fact that it is law, and that people thing that's just what it is "in everyone's best interest" that puzzles me. I don't want to break the law, I don't have an issue with having the notice, it's the fact that people feel the notice is needed that shows the current state of afairs :)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: grondilu on October 27, 2010, 01:29:23 PM
It's the fact that it is law, and that people thing that's just what it is "in everyone's best interest" that puzzles me. I don't want to break the law, I don't have an issue with having the notice, it's the fact that people feel the notice is needed that shows the current state of afairs :)

Sometimes I wonder why we should respect laws we don't agree with.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on October 27, 2010, 02:24:28 PM
It's the fact that it is law, and that people thing that's just what it is "in everyone's best interest" that puzzles me. I don't want to break the law, I don't have an issue with having the notice, it's the fact that people feel the notice is needed that shows the current state of afairs :)

Sometimes I wonder why we should respect laws we don't agree with.


'cos law - is opinion of majority. and if you do not agree - you are minority. =) BTW, you can disrespect law, but you have to follow it to live with in society which use it without problems. =)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: nelisky on October 27, 2010, 02:40:05 PM
It's the fact that it is law, and that people thing that's just what it is "in everyone's best interest" that puzzles me. I don't want to break the law, I don't have an issue with having the notice, it's the fact that people feel the notice is needed that shows the current state of afairs :)

Sometimes I wonder why we should respect laws we don't agree with.


'cos law - is opinion of majority. and if you do not agree - you are minority. =) BTW, you can disrespect law, but you have to follow it to live with in society which use it without problems. =)

Well, yeah, the way society is wired now... but you should be able to not follow law, assuming you don't break it, so here it should be unlawful to entice minors to gamble, but if they do, well, tough.
But we don't put responsability in people, which is why we have laws and courts. We just don't trust people's good will or common sense. Yeah, some are crooks, but why do we all live under the assumption we are crooks?

while we're on politics, why not touch religion? :) Do god fearing people really need a priest saying they should not steal? C'mon! isn't that just common sense? No, because if they do steal there's a punishment. So stealing is not something one shouldn't do, but rather something you pay for if you do... as most good things are.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on October 27, 2010, 03:03:04 PM
Okey. This is going to completely different topic =))

It's not gambling yet. Bitcoin is virtual currency (for government sake). It's just another web for-fun poker game.

Once it will become too serious, I will consider doing all law related stuff. Including obtaining gambling license if I will have to.

But really, I doubt this will happen soon. Right now I want to focus on fellow bitcoiners and provide another way of having fun for their minted/traded bitcoins, rather then trying to build any serious business out of it. So most important stuff for me right now - bugs and features of poker room itself =)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: Drifter on October 27, 2010, 03:23:28 PM
As far as I know, Bitcoins ability to be exchanged for real money makes a gaming license a requirement whether the bets are made with a recognized currency or not. Play money on a poker site is something entirely different, as it has no real value.

I'll stop derailing the thread though. The site has merit, just be careful.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on October 27, 2010, 03:32:11 PM
Another question for people out there:

I plan to pay back some percentage of rake paid to top X performers. I thought about setting up public "Top X players" showing their rake profit. There is question - should I show real nicknames or use something like "Player 1", "Player 2" instead hidding who is really top performer. Any thoughts appreciated!


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on October 27, 2010, 03:54:54 PM
Another question for people out there:

I plan to pay back some percentage of rake paid to top X performers. I thought about setting up public "Top X players" showing their rake profit. There is question - should I show real nicknames or use something like "Player 1", "Player 2" instead hidding who is really top performer. Any thoughts appreciated!

I think we'll have an idea of how much everyone plays anyway since it's a small pool for now. I guess that means show names. I suppose that's a little better transparency wise too, so that we all know that prizes are being paid to real people and not some phantom you invented  :P


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on October 27, 2010, 04:11:23 PM
Another question for people out there:

I plan to pay back some percentage of rake paid to top X performers. I thought about setting up public "Top X players" showing their rake profit. There is question - should I show real nicknames or use something like "Player 1", "Player 2" instead hidding who is really top performer. Any thoughts appreciated!

I think we'll have an idea of how much everyone plays anyway since it's a small pool for now. I guess that means show names. I suppose that's a little better transparency wise too, so that we all know that prizes are being paid to real people and not some phantom you invented  :P

I totally agree, but I am a bit concerned about someones trying to keep privacy. So i'd like to hear opinions before I will publish list of nicknames =)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: doublec on October 27, 2010, 10:51:23 PM
I totally agree, but I am a bit concerned about someones trying to keep privacy. So i'd like to hear opinions before I will publish list of nicknames =)
I have no problem with nicknames being shown.

One small request. I notice that if I have an email associated with my account it shows my gravatar. Is it possible to have an option to disable this?


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on October 28, 2010, 12:06:08 AM
I totally agree, but I am a bit concerned about someones trying to keep privacy. So i'd like to hear opinions before I will publish list of nicknames =)
I have no problem with nicknames being shown.

One small request. I notice that if I have an email associated with my account it shows my gravatar. Is it possible to have an option to disable this?

Make sense. Will add to list of features requests =)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: Cynosure on October 29, 2010, 07:43:50 PM
I'm sorry if I'm late to the rake discussion, but I'd like to know the current state of affairs...  I've played there a number of times.

It appeared to me that the rake was exorbitant, higher than live, especially for what are often HU games, without hand histories, etc., I can't verify these things, but it struck me that the following were the case:
  • Rake was not capped?!  I believe that in some huge pots, i.e., larger than 250 BB), the rake that flashed by was some VERY large number, and certainly not a simple, truncated number that would indicate a cap, and NO ONE has a rake structure that is capped above 250 BB, even at the lowest limit live raketraps...
  • The consequence of this is that a relatively short HU match (in hands - it's a slow interface) that involved me winning maybe about 2.5 buyins total, I ended UP maybe about 50 BB


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on October 29, 2010, 07:59:13 PM
The rake needs capped for sure. PS and I believe other sites have a much lower rake cap for HU games. I think it's still 50 cents instead of $3. This is especially important if you need game starters. I think there are plenty of people who want to play full tables, but not HU. You need HU to get things started.

I know you are just using the default setting because it was the default, just want to make sure it's clear that it'll be important to growing a healthy active site to put a cap on.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: Cynosure on October 29, 2010, 08:43:06 PM
Man this is frustrating.  I don't understand how the forum swallowed most of my post.  It was about 3x longer, well formatted, and included suggestions, etc.

Also included was what an explanation of what appeared to be a MAJOR bug in which the rake was not even based on the correct pot size!  I'm too frustrated to retype in entirety, but here's Cliff's:

* I'm 200 BB deep, Villain is 50 BB deep.  I CRAI on turn for my 200, villain called.  Rake appeared to calculated on a 250 BB pot (!!) when the pot was 100 BB (both of which, obv., should be above the cap.)

Winning ~3 BI over 75-150 hands and walking away with a ~25 BB profit is equivalent to a 92% rake.  A particularly harsh way to punish those players willing to play HU to start games, and a definite way to dry up your NL pool VERY quickly.  I wish I'd been paying more attention.

Site op, feel free to PM me with requests for elucidations/suggestions, etc...

I'm happy to deal with a perhaps necessarily clunky interface because poker and BTC are both fun things for me, but these issues really need to be addressed.

Best wishes, and kudos on the initiative; let me know if I can be of any service.

- Cynosure

I'm sorry if I'm late to the rake discussion, but I'd like to know the current state of affairs...  I've played there a number of times.

It appeared to me that the rake was exorbitant, higher than live, especially for what are often HU games, without hand histories, etc., I can't verify these things, but it struck me that the following were the case:

(....)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on October 30, 2010, 01:49:26 AM
Hey guys,

I think I reworked rake module to cap rake on 3BTC. Please, let me know if it will charge more.

I will try to reach author regarding HU blinds issue, but can't really tell for sure when it will happen. IMHO, He more concerned about licensing issue instead code from my short experience. =(



Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on October 30, 2010, 03:30:00 PM
i disabled rake again. will try to fix wrong pot amount used and then will turn it on again. until then - game is totally free =)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on November 15, 2010, 03:56:08 AM
Added "Hide Gravatar" in My Account - Edit form.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: LZ on March 25, 2011, 12:31:57 PM
What about to play today? :)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on March 25, 2011, 01:18:35 PM
depends on time =) i will be able to join game around 10pm GMT-5


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: care11 on March 25, 2011, 03:16:41 PM
I will play, only smaller limits tho


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: Fiyasko on March 25, 2011, 06:35:39 PM
Ohhhhhh this is just PERFECT! POKER TIME BOYSSSSSSSSS
This is whats gonna get Bitcoins up and running, work on making everything LOOK pretty so that RANDOM googlers will start playing


WHO WANTS TO LOOSE THIER .0x BTCs IN HOLD'EM BETCHES!!! ;D ;D

I've had massive bug while attempting to play poker, all players whom have a timer bar Do Not Have Any Actions to do, this occurs after the flop and after first raise, Once a player calls the raise, he is stuck with a timerbar and No Actions, leaving to whole table to spin around and time out every player, causeing whomever was the first player to push Call, to rake the entire pot


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on March 25, 2011, 08:33:06 PM
Ohhhhhh this is just PERFECT! POKER TIME BOYSSSSSSSSS
This is whats gonna get Bitcoins up and running, work on making everything LOOK pretty so that RANDOM googlers will start playing


WHO WANTS TO LOOSE THIER .0x BTCs IN HOLD'EM BETCHES!!! ;D ;D

I've had massive bug while attempting to play poker, all players whom have a timer bar Do Not Have Any Actions to do, this occurs after the flop and after first raise, Once a player calls the raise, he is stuck with a timerbar and No Actions, leaving to whole table to spin around and time out every player, causeing whomever was the first player to push Call, to rake the entire pot

This is long standing bug somewhere deep in libraries I am using but not written by myself. Since there is almost no public interest and no profit for me in this project, I am too lazy to find it and fix it..

Temporary fix for this - just click F5 in the table window.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: Fiyasko on March 25, 2011, 09:02:31 PM
Hippich, Y'know i wouldn't mind paying 1% of my winnings to play......


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: S3052 on March 25, 2011, 09:41:41 PM
The Poker room overall is a great project.

Just one minor suggestion for the homepage: You could revise it and remove the "you can generate coins" part, as most people entering the poker room would be "non-miners" and therefore should not be disappointed by the false expectations of generating coins.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 07, 2011, 02:37:33 PM
well.. i decided to work a bit on room. there were few annoying admin bugs and I added twitter notification feature. Now every 5 minutes it checks if there are any players and if they are - post notification to http://twitter.com/betcoin

Follow it to know exactly when someone is in room and join 'em!


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 07, 2011, 02:39:00 PM
Hippich, Y'know i wouldn't mind paying 1% of my winnings to play......

it was 1% before. but it did not have cap. other players were very angry =) so I put donation btc addresses. If someone feels this project is worth of effort or you just won huge pot - just tip a bit to the project. =)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: bitjet on April 09, 2011, 02:28:11 AM
theres 4 players right now.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: kiba on April 09, 2011, 02:34:44 AM
Hippich: your twitter message are annoying and polluting the twitter stream for #bitcoin.

I don't need to know how many players are in your poker room every time it change.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 09, 2011, 03:39:53 AM
removed hash tags =)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: ColdHardMetal on April 09, 2011, 03:58:09 AM
I've played a few hands so far but I do have some comments.

1. Hand Histories. If I get to showdown with someone I should be able to look at a hand history and see what cards he had if I win.
2. I sat down in front of the button and couldn't play. That is fine and as it should be. A few hands where dealt, the button passed me by and I was sitting in the CO and my blind was automatically posted. I was not in the BB position. I should have the option to either post early or wait until the BB comes around to me. I shouldn't have to enter early if I don't want to.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: ColdHardMetal on April 09, 2011, 03:59:14 AM
The betting bar should have something I can click to increase/decrease my bet amount by 1 BB instead of just the slider.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 09, 2011, 05:40:46 AM
thank you for all suggestions. but this thing do not gives me any profits and the only real bug I may be willing to try to fix is occasion freezes of the table over slow connection. rest of "must have" features or less major bugs - only if this project will ever take off.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: ColdHardMetal on April 09, 2011, 06:19:36 AM
thank you for all suggestions. but this thing do not gives me any profits and the only real bug I may be willing to try to fix is occasion freezes of the table over slow connection. rest of "must have" features or less major bugs - only if this project will ever take off.

Understandable, but you may find you need to fix some things before it will take off.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: kiba on April 09, 2011, 06:23:43 AM
removed hash tags =)

My search feed naturally detect any bitcoin related thing. It's still polluting the twitter stream. Perhaps you should limit it to a day summary or something.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 09, 2011, 05:30:15 PM
removed hash tags =)

My search feed naturally detect any bitcoin related thing. It's still polluting the twitter stream. Perhaps you should limit it to a day summary or something.

the point of these tweets - to give immediate update if someone joined room. so it do not make sense to post "summary" once per day.

I understand your frustration and once there will be enough users all the time, so random visitors will not stare at empty tables - i will remove these tweets completely.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 09, 2011, 05:34:51 PM
thank you for all suggestions. but this thing do not gives me any profits and the only real bug I may be willing to try to fix is occasion freezes of the table over slow connection. rest of "must have" features or less major bugs - only if this project will ever take off.

Understandable, but you may find you need to fix some things before it will take off.

from my experience, this statement is not correct =) it could be just my experience, but since I am doing this project, I will do it accordingly to my experience.

but since this is open source project too, you are always welcome to submit patches! or even fork it off github and start your own! =)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: ColdHardMetal on April 09, 2011, 05:39:22 PM
but since this is open source project too, you are always welcome to submit patches! or even fork it off github and start your own! =)

lol. The last thing you want is me hacking at your code  :D


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 09, 2011, 07:08:20 PM
well.. who knows. sometimes something seemingly hard just matter of two lines of code =)) (and vice versa =))


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: kiba on April 10, 2011, 08:33:34 PM
the point of these tweets - to give immediate update if someone joined room. so it do not make sense to post "summary" once per day.

I understand your frustration and once there will be enough users all the time, so random visitors will not stare at empty tables - i will remove these tweets completely.

Remove these tweet = stop polluting my twitter stream?


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: dust on April 10, 2011, 08:54:05 PM
Why not put the player count on the main page of the website and in your signature on the forums?


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 11, 2011, 01:46:36 AM
the point of these tweets - to give immediate update if someone joined room. so it do not make sense to post "summary" once per day.

I understand your frustration and once there will be enough users all the time, so random visitors will not stare at empty tables - i will remove these tweets completely.

Remove these tweet = stop polluting my twitter stream?

you are free to blacklist this account, setup filters in your client. whatever. i do not care. the only thing i care - to have players when someone come to the room.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: kiba on April 11, 2011, 02:08:34 AM
you are free to blacklist this account, setup filters in your client. whatever. i do not care. the only thing i care - to have players when someone come to the room.

I blocked you. The messages are still getting through so I am going to be slightly annoyed by your multiple tweets each time.

Anyway...just remember you are increasing noise to signal ratio. If I am brothered by this noisy activities, there are others who might be irritated too. That's going to be bad for your business and reputation.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 11, 2011, 02:31:48 AM
this is temporal solution and i will look in to it after while to see exactly if it bring anything to the project or not. if it will bring more players i definitely do not care about feedback from users who are not players. (sorry, but this is true =))


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: kiba on April 11, 2011, 02:41:16 AM
this is temporal solution and i will look in to it after while to see exactly if it bring anything to the project or not. if it will bring more players i definitely do not care about feedback from users who are not players. (sorry, but this is true =))

Please be considerate of people impacted by your negative externalities.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: Nekrobios on April 11, 2011, 02:44:13 AM
I find it annoying too, as it spams the twitter search for bitcoin. It would be okay if it was less frequent though.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: kiba on April 11, 2011, 03:06:27 AM
I find it annoying too, as it spams the twitter search for bitcoin. It would be okay if it was less frequent though.

Yes. Less frequency. No need to tell us there are 1 person in the room 5 minutes apart.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: S3052 on April 15, 2011, 07:26:30 PM
http://www.businessinsider.com/online-poker-websites-fraud-2011-4 (http://www.businessinsider.com/online-poker-websites-fraud-2011-4)

Pokersites shut down..
Be careful.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: bitjet on April 17, 2011, 12:30:01 AM
betco.in seems to be down. is my btc still there?



Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: EPiSKiNG on April 17, 2011, 03:44:42 AM
betco.in seems to be down. is my btc still there?



+1  down for me for the last couple of hours...

-EP


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: cdhowie on April 17, 2011, 07:46:55 PM
betco.in seems to be down. is my btc still there?

+1  down for me for the last couple of hours...

It seems functional now.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: EPiSKiNG on April 18, 2011, 02:47:04 AM
I'm extremely excited to see what happens to the traffic to betco.in


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 18, 2011, 02:54:08 AM
http://img6.imagebanana.com/img/rrmdrmct/thumb/Selection_001.png (http://www.imagebanana.com/view/rrmdrmct/Selection_001.png)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: kangasbros on April 18, 2011, 08:51:31 AM
thank you for all suggestions. but this thing do not gives me any profits and the only real bug I may be willing to try to fix is occasion freezes of the table over slow connection. rest of "must have" features or less major bugs - only if this project will ever take off.

Why don't you make this project for profit? I don't know much about poker myself (I don't like gambling at all), but isn't the standard to get some small % from each deposit, so that you can run the service.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FooDSt4mP on April 18, 2011, 03:15:49 PM
you are free to blacklist this account, setup filters in your client. whatever. i do not care. the only thing i care - to have players when someone come to the room.

I blocked you. The messages are still getting through so I am going to be slightly annoyed by your multiple tweets each time.

Anyway...just remember you are increasing noise to signal ratio. If I am brothered by this noisy activities, there are others who might be irritated too. That's going to be bad for your business and reputation.

Sounds like you should take the issue up with twitter.  It is their failure that your blocking is unsuccessful.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: EPiSKiNG on April 18, 2011, 09:46:37 PM
Feature request:  When seated with more than 10, the decimal does not show and it would be nice if it did.

Thanks Hippich... don't forget to rate me on #bitcoin-otc

thanks
-EP


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 18, 2011, 09:58:42 PM
please post all feature requests to https://github.com/hippich/Bitcoin-Poker-Room/issues - this will make it way easier to track all of them. as well as all bugs =)

2all struggling with freezes - i think i will order new server this week and start migrating all sites. it may take a while (i am using this server for hosting all of my projects. New server will have SSD drive as well as more memory. this will definitely help with response time. (this will not remove freezing bug completely, since this is bug in client, but it should happen less often with faster server)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: randomguy7 on April 18, 2011, 10:20:58 PM
Just for interest, do you currently use a vps or a dedicated server?


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 18, 2011, 10:25:41 PM
dedicated


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: EPiSKiNG on April 19, 2011, 12:42:40 AM
Also, I hear of people having issues getting BTC into your program... A guy has been waiting 30 minutes and shows confirmed on his end... Anyone had similar issues?

-EP


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 19, 2011, 12:43:37 AM
Also, I hear of people having issues getting BTC into your program... A guy has been waiting 30 minutes and shows confirmed on his end... Anyone had similar issues?

-EP

please ask them to write email to pavel@yepcorp.com with details. I've seen this in the past and I need to track it down.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: EPiSKiNG on April 19, 2011, 04:48:58 AM
Also, I hear of people having issues getting BTC into your program... A guy has been waiting 30 minutes and shows confirmed on his end... Anyone had similar issues?

-EP

please ask them to write email to pavel@yepcorp.com with details. I've seen this in the past and I need to track it down.

It appears to be down, and I sent you an e-mail regarding the deposit issue.

-EP

disregard: 9:54PST


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: Fiyasko on April 19, 2011, 07:51:20 AM
wow nice boxes... but the sig's a lil big,
Anything you can do about the lag in the rooms?


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 19, 2011, 12:43:41 PM
Also, I hear of people having issues getting BTC into your program... A guy has been waiting 30 minutes and shows confirmed on his end... Anyone had similar issues?

-EP

please ask them to write email to pavel@yepcorp.com with details. I've seen this in the past and I need to track it down.

It appears to be down, and I sent you an e-mail regarding the deposit issue.

-EP

disregard: 9:54PST


this, and you posted this post after 20 minutes after your email =) email answered


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: bitjet on April 19, 2011, 09:33:26 PM
Im having a lot of stability problems. Mostly that the room wont load, or that it loads then freezes and wont reload. Anyone else having this issue? Its really turing me off form playing. When it works its awesome though!


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 19, 2011, 09:41:20 PM
client have issues with concurrent requests to server - it do not resend packet if previous did not went through. this leads to break in workflow. Therefore right now the only way to mitigate this right now - make connection to server as fast as possible and make server operate as fast as possible. This is not a correct solution, since bug should be fixed in first place, but I just do not have time for this even if I had incentive to fix it.

if you are using tor or proxies - connecting directly should help a lot.

i am going to migrate server to another more powerful one in the end of april.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: bitjet on April 19, 2011, 09:47:29 PM
client have issues with concurrent requests to server - it do not resend packet if previous did not went through. this leads to break in workflow. Therefore right now the only way to mitigate this right now - make connection to server as fast as possible and make server operate as fast as possible. This is not a correct solution, since bug should be fixed in first place, but I just do not have time for this even if I had incentive to fix it.

if you are using tor or proxies - connecting directly should help a lot.

i am going to migrate server to another more powerful one in the end of april.

Yeah everyone I was just playing has the same problem. I think Im going to have to just stop playing, its ridiculously slow. The website seems to navigate fine, but the play is really really slow. I dont mind donating if you can fix the issue. Im connected directly to the site. I have an ~8gb connection so...



Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: EPiSKiNG on April 20, 2011, 07:32:26 PM
client have issues with concurrent requests to server - it do not resend packet if previous did not went through. this leads to break in workflow. Therefore right now the only way to mitigate this right now - make connection to server as fast as possible and make server operate as fast as possible. This is not a correct solution, since bug should be fixed in first place, but I just do not have time for this even if I had incentive to fix it.

if you are using tor or proxies - connecting directly should help a lot.

i am going to migrate server to another more powerful one in the end of april.

Yeah everyone I was just playing has the same problem. I think Im going to have to just stop playing, its ridiculously slow. The website seems to navigate fine, but the play is really really slow. I dont mind donating if you can fix the issue. Im connected directly to the site. I have an ~8gb connection so...



Awww Bitjet, don't give up!  I still have coins to win from you!  Monday it was working pretty superbly... Yesterday I was having some issues... But yes, Hippich, we're all excited to see this work properly, if there's anything we can do to assist you, please let us know!

-EP


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: sc8nt4u on April 21, 2011, 10:20:34 PM
Some suggestions:

- Your button position is off when playing heads up.

- A new room should open at the same limit when a person joins a table so that multiple tables are available at that limit.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 22, 2011, 02:43:22 AM
Some suggestions:

- Your button position is off when playing heads up.

- A new room should open at the same limit when a person joins a table so that multiple tables are available at that limit.

Please posst all requests to issues on project page. For example heads up mode button issue alredy there.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: sat0pi on April 24, 2011, 11:35:46 AM
I sent an e-mail, but just posting here until I receive a reply to see if anyone else is having this issue. I withdrew BTC 70.01 from my account last night, but I have yet to receive it. I got a different message than usual, saying that the request was received and was being processed and that if I did not receive the funds within 24 hours to contact via e-mail. I then tried a smaller withdrawal of BTC 0.16 to the same address and it worked instantly, so I'm wondering if maybe it was because it was a larger transaction that it is being manually verified or something? Anyone else had this issue?


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 24, 2011, 01:55:56 PM
I already wrote answer to email and will repeat here for everybody else.

I keep small amount of bitcoins on server for security. When there is no enough money on server I process transactions manually. In this case you withdraw more then available balance on server.

I am traveling right now and will be back home in 24 hours.


On  the other hand I am traveling and significant amount of money were deposited.

I just found someone with nickname mikerka found security hole in withdrawal code in successfully withdraw all money from the poker room to addresses:

1LdLEx6UhJfqDk3umY7xP6xU1geB6bvhyw
15FKrowdeAuuYchV2rmuWfUTuSgVRDwtQS
1GiPbAgjueb9N4mC9eY9ivSQohUvPK2P3F
1NS3PXX3TAwfbWD5go96jG9c6J35zCPSxd
1Ghkvw73yxHW4XHRYHq8MbfijfB28tqc47
1DUMMNpN7UMLmMfM71iFAoQFkdXaShQqx2
1FYMxvf5ZQtQNsXhSaAPLvELVYezfyyCKH
1fzyhsVGCPZsKutiT1XWpurZQuAL5r1N7
1C9GHhMJPQpPC5kdQYRAMkJsjXaGjReyMR
121CrVNnDkmqscwNDKJobeHKhvXKbBmaam
1LufSuuzs1LRZ3SBLohbGg3N2i6nnrBCix
1L8pxthTCzr3GbtL3XkBdrmdjHwVs9kwyZ
1Gr5BPJwmLHN3mJp2EJGQqWHhevUVQHgnu
1ENzxFpashPqCE8hCza4BA15rxigFcXs8q
1CzXBb7Pmpz8g1f9HmTxUBM9kK5sRjUYRt
1Pbzkyhoy2MwTLW8EKyuXXoKj7tQDLcWXt
1Eyr6CUgC646bpXsnMnQ2xZsDTDubEtjN3
13pCwrqQnjdwAPv8rv5Rvo2zqsZcEGMrzY
1Cp3pnnVdoy7JxuqSbbrQS6WzU3g3nDWbh
133TqWksjNEc7DkqHGhp3MMkFooRiBNo2Y
1BfrWmiwSAHn9NJoR9W1XCDFxrjDp5GmTx
1H9mAMX3rewKkjXQ62TAiaDdnYMKfPebKr
13aCsFYhtM1AAxhcXvugX97Go9G4mC7E82
1ASWJWD3hGhZXLVc5gLA9rnmMZtB9AVqDw
147neArqKo2y3qSYu5pKq5ptetGa1A1Wrn
19rpEJHChVWf2Mf7bxjGcaUaYPMQDLduTj
1DpzUsna4Sv8uZbUUpjVbtJB7JsjL1Q2jn
1AaSDKcn8zebYPZ5KvyiUBq1RDzX8GNirQ
1CbKTvFqV8xe8VRFcQqRarWSHEH4FGXrju
12zKjiJiqvMyvHqyce48ZEP4NpsoMKwhYc

I already fixed this hole. Now, if mikerka reading this I will really appreciate if you return money.

Withdrawn amount is 680 BTC.

2everybody else - i have enough reserve to cover this issue. So your balances are good. But any donations will be really appreciated.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on April 24, 2011, 02:17:53 PM
Damn that sucks.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: Fiyasko on April 24, 2011, 03:11:23 PM
Wow.....................................................
Thats REALLY not good for site development


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: sat0pi on April 24, 2011, 03:47:02 PM
Thank you for the update, and that sucks that someone stole all the money. Good thing you don't keep full balances on the server for security, though.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: DATA COMMANDER on April 24, 2011, 06:43:37 PM
I'm concerned not so much about the security breach but about the fact that if I hadn't visited this thread I would have no idea that it happened. There is no message on the main page and the site appears to be running normally.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: Cusipzzz on April 24, 2011, 06:53:30 PM
Everyone thinks, oh wow, bitcoin is perfect for Poker! And yes, in theory that is correct.

But there is so much more to a legit poker site than just dealing the cards. From basic security issues like this theft to collusion and bots, there are hard problem that require significant investment and strong, poker-smart, well-compensated management.

Enjoy the novelty of using bitcoins and plying rake-free/low rake poker, but nobody serious will play above the micros until these are addressed.

Really sorry to hear about the theft though. Sucks.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 24, 2011, 07:07:46 PM
This is not a commercial project. I hope it will be sometimes tho...

This just a test. I passed it in terms of saving users money. Will see how importa.t this project is for every one here tho. Will keep an eye on donations address.

Boarding on aircraft. Will be back soon and proceed all wizdraw requests.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 24, 2011, 07:09:36 PM
I'm concerned not so much about the security breach but about the fact that if I hadn't visited this thread I would have no idea that it happened. There is no message on the main page and the site appears to be running normally.
I am traveling. I closed breach using phone. Passwords to everything else is at home.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 24, 2011, 08:34:27 PM
Thank you for the update, and that sucks that someone stole all the money. Good thing you don't keep full balances on the server for security, though.

Your payment is processed. If someone did not receive their payments - please email me, but I think all others are withdraw money without problems already.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 25, 2011, 01:45:22 PM
New server was finally shipped and I started to work on moving everything to new place. Expect 3-4 days of down time. Thank you in advance for your patience.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: bitjet on April 26, 2011, 12:39:32 AM
New server was finally shipped and I started to work on moving everything to new place. Expect 3-4 days of down time. Thank you in advance for your patience.

You should really forward the URL to status page telling people why the sites down and expected time that it will be back up.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: DATA COMMANDER on April 26, 2011, 01:55:11 AM
New server was finally shipped and I started to work on moving everything to new place. Expect 3-4 days of down time. Thank you in advance for your patience.

You should really forward the URL to status page telling people why the sites down and expected time that it will be back up.

I strongly agree.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on April 26, 2011, 04:19:37 AM
Yeah, people are going to try for a few days and give up instead of knowing, not being frustrated, and being glad it's coming to a better sever.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 26, 2011, 07:23:33 AM
i have shut old server completely to make sure nothing is messed up. so there is no web server to do redirect...

anyway, it's already runs on new server. I am keeping an eye on it and finish moving other stuff, but it should be playable now. (i hope so =)). So let me know how it works for you.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on April 26, 2011, 05:26:39 PM
i have shut old server completely to make sure nothing is messed up. so there is no web server to do redirect...

anyway, it's already runs on new server. I am keeping an eye on it and finish moving other stuff, but it should be playable now. (i hope so =)). So let me know how it works for you.


doesn't work at all for me.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: EPiSKiNG on April 26, 2011, 05:56:41 PM
i have shut old server completely to make sure nothing is messed up. so there is no web server to do redirect...

anyway, it's already runs on new server. I am keeping an eye on it and finish moving other stuff, but it should be playable now. (i hope so =)). So let me know how it works for you.


doesn't work at all for me.

+1 for me... Used to work on my  android phone, and now when I click table, it makes a pop up window and doesn't load...

-EP


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on April 26, 2011, 06:00:24 PM
i have shut old server completely to make sure nothing is messed up. so there is no web server to do redirect...

anyway, it's already runs on new server. I am keeping an eye on it and finish moving other stuff, but it should be playable now. (i hope so =)). So let me know how it works for you.


doesn't work at all for me.

+1 for me... Used to work on my  android phone, and now when I click table, it makes a pop up window and doesn't load...

-EP

So you are getting the site? I'm not even getting that.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: Fiyasko on April 26, 2011, 06:16:44 PM
Sites up and fully working for me...


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on April 26, 2011, 06:20:37 PM
Sites up and fully working for me...

Weird, I still get nothing.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: EPiSKiNG on April 26, 2011, 06:28:32 PM
Sites up and fully working for me...

Weird, I still get nothing.

Yes... Seems to be working now.  Will be on later tonight.. Around 7pst


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: sethsethseth on April 27, 2011, 10:59:41 PM
its working great now.... we just need some lower stakes NL Omaha8 plz.  no one is going to play 100/200 on this site.  a bunch of us have been playing .50/1 and .25/.50 lately


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: sirius on April 27, 2011, 11:27:56 PM
The front page should display how many players are online.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: FreeMoney on April 27, 2011, 11:28:40 PM
The front page should display how many players are online.

For real. Why do we have to log in to see the tables list?


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 28, 2011, 02:19:15 AM
its working great now.... we just need some lower stakes NL Omaha8 plz.  no one is going to play 100/200 on this site.  a bunch of us have been playing .50/1 and .25/.50 lately

added 4 omaha8 low stakes nl tables. have no clue if these works correctly tho.. and if something comes to your mind for name for the table - let me know to =)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 28, 2011, 02:23:41 AM
The front page should display how many players are online.

For real. Why do we have to log in to see the tables list?

probably because i was concentrated on more important things? =)

you can always check http://twitter.com/betcoin for now. It spams this channel with current statistics on online users. You do not need to be registered with twitter for this.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: Fiyasko on April 29, 2011, 02:35:09 AM
The front page should display how many players are online.

Agreed


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: Ian Maxwell on April 29, 2011, 04:19:44 PM
Sorry to hear about the theft. I've got an idea:

I will pay would have paid (see below) a bounty of 10 BTC to whoever finds and reveals the identity of this thief (as in real name and address), as long as you aver that you have not violated the laws of your own territory in the process. You must provide enough evidence to convince me personally that you have correctly identified the guilty party.

This offer does not apply to you if you are the thief or are in collusion with the thief.

So that I don't have to hold my coins in reserve forever, let's say this offer expires on July 31. I may renew it then or not.

If others would like to contribute to the bounty, please do so! Feel free to split this off into a new thread if it's more convenient that way.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 29, 2011, 04:42:04 PM
SunAvatar, I really appreciate the fact you want to share this and help! I already found thief email and tried to contact him and convince him to return money. He did not respond. And bitcoin non-reversible nature is not helping here too =))

His nickname - mikerka - is pretty uniq one and he is registered over a lot of hacking-related websites. His email is mikerka@gmail.com . He is registered at Minecraft.

There is a secondlife avatar named mikerka Cluny who bought some coins from another bitcoin forum member recently. His IRC and otc-wot nick is FaktioNN. Keeping in mind bitcoin community size and uniqueness of nickname I am pretty sure all of this is the same person.

I think I seen somewhere age of someone with nickname mikerka of 41 years, but not sure about this part at all.

There is also another guy from CZ, but he too young and looks like not involved in coding/hacking at all, and there is another gal from russia, who is fan of stupid tv show - i doubt she do any hacking. So I believe our mikerka is from USA.

I doubt these bitcoins make any real difference to him in long run, but he did not agreed to return these in exchange for all due respect for finding hole in my software (really dumb one btw =)).

On the other hand this will force me to put more time in to this project and at some point start monetizing it. Either through rake or some sort of sign up fee. =)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: Ian Maxwell on April 29, 2011, 05:04:44 PM
Good work, hippich! This leaves me with an interesting question: Do I now owe you 10 BTC for identifying your own thief? I'll go with whatever the community says, but I'd prefer to make it my first contribution to a pool for paying similar bounties in the future, which I may start later today. Thefts like this will only become more common as the community grows.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: tanerlorn on April 29, 2011, 05:15:44 PM
Hippich, first of all thanks a lot for this, really appreciate it.

Second, I have some suggestions, you need to adjust your tables really.

Here is what you should do.

Elminate all tables above 2-4 No Limit, for right now.

Eliminate all omaha and stud tables, for now. I played omaha and was only able to see 2 cards, normally you should be able to see all 4 of your cards, so thats bad.

Eliminate all FAST tables, people need more time for action since theres so many bugs right now.

Have
5 .01-.02 no limit tables
3 .02-.04 no limit
3 .05-.10 no limit
3 .10-.25 no limit
3 .25-.50 no limit
3 .50-1.00 no limit
1 1-2 no limit
1 2-4 no limit

Then have
5 .02-.04 limit tables
3 .05-.10 limit
3 .10-.20 limit
3 .25-.50 limit
3 .50-1.00 limit
1 1-2 limit
1 2-4 limit

This is a much better setup. As for table names, don't sweat it table names don't matter at all. Can just say microstakes 1, microstakes 2, highstakes 1, highstakes 2, etc or whatever you can think of.

Finally, you must fix the structure in limit tables. The problem is, the software makes the blinds 2x big as they should be. In .02-.04 limit for example, the blinds are .02 and .04, when they should be .01 and .02. This makes the opening raise size to .06, when it should be .04. Now, due to this fact you would have to have .005 and .01 blinds, if you want to keep the .01-.02, limit tables. This would be fine, and I would make 5 of those as well. Currently at the .01-.02 limit tables the blinds are .01 and .02, and the opening raise size is .03, when it should be .02, and blinds .01 and .01. That would actually work too, so either .005 and .01 blinds, or .01 and .01, if you can't do 3 decimal points.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 29, 2011, 05:24:11 PM
Good work, hippich! This leaves me with an interesting question: Do I now owe you 10 BTC for identifying your own thief? I'll go with whatever the community says, but I'd prefer to make it my first contribution to a pool for paying similar bounties in the future, which I may start later today. Thefts like this will only become more common as the community grows.

If you want to donate to project - you are free to do it. =)

As for information I posted here I got from google and another bitcoin forum member. If he wants me to disclose his nickname - I can do it. That's been said - this info do not identify exact physical person, so I do not believe bounty should be paid anyway =)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 29, 2011, 05:30:50 PM
Second, I have some suggestions, you need to adjust your tables really.

Thanks for your input. I would like to hear what other members think about best combination of tables. This part is matter of messing with configuration files, so I can implement this fairly easy.

Also I never played anything beside hold'em, so I really do not know any details about other poker games (it just came with software and I left it as is). If there are bugs with it - please let me know. Probably it will make sense to push bug report to server software author.

Finally, you must fix the structure in limit tables. The problem is, the software makes the blinds 2x big as they should be. In .02-.04 limit for example, the blinds are .02 and .04, when they should be .01 and .02. This makes the opening raise size to .06, when it should be .04. Now, due to this fact you would have to have .005 and .01 blinds, if you want to keep the .01-.02, limit tables. This would be fine, and I would make 5 of those as well. Currently at the .01-.02 limit tables the blinds are .01 and .02, and the opening raise size is .03, when it should be .02, and blinds .01 and .01. That would actually work too, so either .005 and .01 blinds, or .01 and .01, if you can't do 3 decimal points.

Could someone else comment on this too? I do not have much experience in poker, but I always believe .01-.02 should refer to small and big blinds. Is this really incorrect? Any examples?


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: Garrett Burgwardt on April 29, 2011, 05:31:21 PM
I wouldn't mind a rake - if it keeps you in business, go for it. Just not too big ;)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 29, 2011, 05:32:41 PM
What is adequate size of rake?

Keeping in mind bugness and beta state of software.. =))


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: sc8nt4u on April 29, 2011, 06:16:41 PM
What is adequate size of rake?

Keeping in mind bugness and beta state of software.. =))

I'd use the rake structure of pokerstars or fulltilt.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 29, 2011, 06:23:39 PM
They have complicated enough rake structure tho.. i will probably try to implement it as 5% with some fixed cap for all table for now. Implementing rake per table will be too much for me right now =) But do not afraid - I have more important stuff to work on so this room will be rake-free for a while. But donations/tips are always welcomed! =)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: sc8nt4u on April 29, 2011, 06:27:30 PM
Second, I have some suggestions, you need to adjust your tables really.

Thanks for your input. I would like to hear what other members think about best combination of tables. This part is matter of messing with configuration files, so I can implement this fairly easy.

Also I never played anything beside hold'em, so I really do not know any details about other poker games (it just came with software and I left it as is). If there are bugs with it - please let me know. Probably it will make sense to push bug report to server software author.

Finally, you must fix the structure in limit tables. The problem is, the software makes the blinds 2x big as they should be. In .02-.04 limit for example, the blinds are .02 and .04, when they should be .01 and .02. This makes the opening raise size to .06, when it should be .04. Now, due to this fact you would have to have .005 and .01 blinds, if you want to keep the .01-.02, limit tables. This would be fine, and I would make 5 of those as well. Currently at the .01-.02 limit tables the blinds are .01 and .02, and the opening raise size is .03, when it should be .02, and blinds .01 and .01. That would actually work too, so either .005 and .01 blinds, or .01 and .01, if you can't do 3 decimal points.

Could someone else comment on this too? I do not have much experience in poker, but I always believe .01-.02 should refer to small and big blinds. Is this really incorrect? Any examples?

I personally play HU only and 7-game. There should definitely be HU only tables so people can focus on the game rather than worry about people joining in.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: Fiyasko on April 29, 2011, 06:27:52 PM
ewww 5%... Thats not much on small pots but damn that would be REALLY annoying!
start with 3%!


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 29, 2011, 06:30:57 PM
ewww 5%... Thats not much on small pots but damn that would be REALLY annoying!
start with 3%!

5% with cap, not 5% from the whole pot. in November i had 3% rake without limit. it was annoying to some guys when they were playing with hundreds in stakes. =) Cap I believe should be somehow correlated with blinds size.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: EPiSKiNG on April 29, 2011, 09:46:28 PM
Just FYI, I was playing with a couple of people at .50/1 no limit and there was close to 1000 BTC on the table... It was an exciting evening to say the least.  This guy named First took all my BTC!!! ;-)

-EP


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 29, 2011, 09:47:43 PM
wow.. that's close to $3k. real stuff!


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: EPiSKiNG on April 29, 2011, 09:48:44 PM
wow.. that's close to $3k. real stuff!

yeah, you're telling me... I had my heart set on winning it all and buying a bus for my band... Sigh....  Well at least it wasn't "real" money.

-EP


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 29, 2011, 09:50:58 PM
wow.. that's close to $3k. real stuff!

yeah, you're telling me... I had my heart set on winning it all and buying a bus for my band... Sigh....  Well at least it wasn't "real" money.

-EP

Hehe. I was telling same "it's not real money" when I found someone took all bitcoins... =))

On the other note, someone contacted me via email as mikerka and said he decide to return money. So fingers crossed.. =)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: EPiSKiNG on April 29, 2011, 09:53:32 PM
wow.. that's close to $3k. real stuff!

yeah, you're telling me... I had my heart set on winning it all and buying a bus for my band... Sigh....  Well at least it wasn't "real" money.

-EP

Hehe. I was telling same "it's not real money" when I found someone took all bitcoins... =))

On the other note, someone contacted me via email as mikerka and said he decide to return money. So fingers crossed.. =)

That's good to know... I wonder if he's trying to see if he can get traced somehow... Have a bunch of poker playing bitcoiners showing up at his house with guns.  ha.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: graingert on April 29, 2011, 09:56:32 PM
It would be great if there were boards to play with fake money only, perhaps use the Bitcoin test network :p


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on April 29, 2011, 09:58:15 PM
wow.. that's close to $3k. real stuff!

yeah, you're telling me... I had my heart set on winning it all and buying a bus for my band... Sigh....  Well at least it wasn't "real" money.

-EP

Hehe. I was telling same "it's not real money" when I found someone took all bitcoins... =))

On the other note, someone contacted me via email as mikerka and said he decide to return money. So fingers crossed.. =)

That's good to know... I wonder if he's trying to see if he can get traced somehow... Have a bunch of poker playing bitcoiners showing up at his house with guns.  ha.

Probably his point is just to teach me or something like this. Bug was really stupid. Anyway, let me see coins on my address first. This email could come from anybody.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: tanerlorn on April 29, 2011, 10:56:46 PM
Second, I have some suggestions, you need to adjust your tables really.

Thanks for your input. I would like to hear what other members think about best combination of tables. This part is matter of messing with configuration files, so I can implement this fairly easy.

Also I never played anything beside hold'em, so I really do not know any details about other poker games (it just came with software and I left it as is). If there are bugs with it - please let me know. Probably it will make sense to push bug report to server software author.

Finally, you must fix the structure in limit tables. The problem is, the software makes the blinds 2x big as they should be. In .02-.04 limit for example, the blinds are .02 and .04, when they should be .01 and .02. This makes the opening raise size to .06, when it should be .04. Now, due to this fact you would have to have .005 and .01 blinds, if you want to keep the .01-.02, limit tables. This would be fine, and I would make 5 of those as well. Currently at the .01-.02 limit tables the blinds are .01 and .02, and the opening raise size is .03, when it should be .02, and blinds .01 and .01. That would actually work too, so either .005 and .01 blinds, or .01 and .01, if you can't do 3 decimal points.

Could someone else comment on this too? I do not have much experience in poker, but I always believe .01-.02 should refer to small and big blinds. Is this really incorrect? Any examples?

Yes I am correct. Open a play money pokerstars table, with limit betting. 200/400 limit holdem has 100/200 blinds. etc

Also I forgot one VERY important thing

You must implement all hands to be shown at showdown. At current time, sometimes only winning hand is shown. This is to prevent teamplay/collusion, people working together. All players on table should be able to see the losing hand, at least in the "dealer chat" window.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: tanerlorn on April 29, 2011, 11:38:54 PM
What is adequate size of rake?

Keeping in mind bugness and beta state of software.. =))

I'd use the rake structure of pokerstars or fulltilt.

This is bad for a variety of reasons.

First of all the rake is really high at pokerstars and fulltilt. they had complete control of the US market so people didnt really have a choice.,...but it was really bad...

micro, and low stakes cash was almost unbeatable.

also those two sites had points and vip programs or rakeback, which ended up giving up to 40% of the rake back to the players

Plus since its really buggy...just keep working on it..

It is your choice what to charge for rake, but people are voluntarily playing here...and they don't HAVE to..if u charge the rake too high they might stop....In my opinion just start off charging 1% in rake...WITH a cap...at like 100bb....so the most ur taking off a pot is 1bb....also the pot should be a minimum of around 5bb to qualify to be raked...and the pot should see the flop, no preflop only rake

If you follow these guidelines, I think it'd be fine to start charging rake immediately.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: tomcollins on April 30, 2011, 01:27:01 AM
Second, I have some suggestions, you need to adjust your tables really.

Thanks for your input. I would like to hear what other members think about best combination of tables. This part is matter of messing with configuration files, so I can implement this fairly easy.

Also I never played anything beside hold'em, so I really do not know any details about other poker games (it just came with software and I left it as is). If there are bugs with it - please let me know. Probably it will make sense to push bug report to server software author.

Finally, you must fix the structure in limit tables. The problem is, the software makes the blinds 2x big as they should be. In .02-.04 limit for example, the blinds are .02 and .04, when they should be .01 and .02. This makes the opening raise size to .06, when it should be .04. Now, due to this fact you would have to have .005 and .01 blinds, if you want to keep the .01-.02, limit tables. This would be fine, and I would make 5 of those as well. Currently at the .01-.02 limit tables the blinds are .01 and .02, and the opening raise size is .03, when it should be .02, and blinds .01 and .01. That would actually work too, so either .005 and .01 blinds, or .01 and .01, if you can't do 3 decimal points.

Could someone else comment on this too? I do not have much experience in poker, but I always believe .01-.02 should refer to small and big blinds. Is this really incorrect? Any examples?

Yes I am correct. Open a play money pokerstars table, with limit betting. 200/400 limit holdem has 100/200 blinds. etc

Also I forgot one VERY important thing

You must implement all hands to be shown at showdown. At current time, sometimes only winning hand is shown. This is to prevent teamplay/collusion, people working together. All players on table should be able to see the losing hand, at least in the "dealer chat" window.

Please don't do this.  Just because a lot of online sites do this doesn't mean it's a good idea.  If you do this in live poker, you'll get a kick in the nuts if you do it too much.  Although this rule is supposedly designed to prevent collusion, it is very rare that it actually is.  However, a lot of nits like it since they get to see what people had.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: EPiSKiNG on April 30, 2011, 01:40:36 AM
Second, I have some suggestions, you need to adjust your tables really.

Thanks for your input. I would like to hear what other members think about best combination of tables. This part is matter of messing with configuration files, so I can implement this fairly easy.

Also I never played anything beside hold'em, so I really do not know any details about other poker games (it just came with software and I left it as is). If there are bugs with it - please let me know. Probably it will make sense to push bug report to server software author.

Finally, you must fix the structure in limit tables. The problem is, the software makes the blinds 2x big as they should be. In .02-.04 limit for example, the blinds are .02 and .04, when they should be .01 and .02. This makes the opening raise size to .06, when it should be .04. Now, due to this fact you would have to have .005 and .01 blinds, if you want to keep the .01-.02, limit tables. This would be fine, and I would make 5 of those as well. Currently at the .01-.02 limit tables the blinds are .01 and .02, and the opening raise size is .03, when it should be .02, and blinds .01 and .01. That would actually work too, so either .005 and .01 blinds, or .01 and .01, if you can't do 3 decimal points.

Could someone else comment on this too? I do not have much experience in poker, but I always believe .01-.02 should refer to small and big blinds. Is this really incorrect? Any examples?

Yes I am correct. Open a play money pokerstars table, with limit betting. 200/400 limit holdem has 100/200 blinds. etc

Also I forgot one VERY important thing

You must implement all hands to be shown at showdown. At current time, sometimes only winning hand is shown. This is to prevent teamplay/collusion, people working together. All players on table should be able to see the losing hand, at least in the "dealer chat" window.

Please don't do this.  Just because a lot of online sites do this doesn't mean it's a good idea.  If you do this in live poker, you'll get a kick in the nuts if you do it too much.  Although this rule is supposedly designed to prevent collusion, it is very rare that it actually is.  However, a lot of nits like it since they get to see what people had.

Yeah, I mean, if everyone could see the hands, then what value would bluffing have?  I know Tom wouldn't want that!  ;-)

-EP


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: tanerlorn on April 30, 2011, 12:38:42 PM
Second, I have some suggestions, you need to adjust your tables really.

Thanks for your input. I would like to hear what other members think about best combination of tables. This part is matter of messing with configuration files, so I can implement this fairly easy.

Also I never played anything beside hold'em, so I really do not know any details about other poker games (it just came with software and I left it as is). If there are bugs with it - please let me know. Probably it will make sense to push bug report to server software author.

Finally, you must fix the structure in limit tables. The problem is, the software makes the blinds 2x big as they should be. In .02-.04 limit for example, the blinds are .02 and .04, when they should be .01 and .02. This makes the opening raise size to .06, when it should be .04. Now, due to this fact you would have to have .005 and .01 blinds, if you want to keep the .01-.02, limit tables. This would be fine, and I would make 5 of those as well. Currently at the .01-.02 limit tables the blinds are .01 and .02, and the opening raise size is .03, when it should be .02, and blinds .01 and .01. That would actually work too, so either .005 and .01 blinds, or .01 and .01, if you can't do 3 decimal points.

Could someone else comment on this too? I do not have much experience in poker, but I always believe .01-.02 should refer to small and big blinds. Is this really incorrect? Any examples?

Yes I am correct. Open a play money pokerstars table, with limit betting. 200/400 limit holdem has 100/200 blinds. etc

Also I forgot one VERY important thing

You must implement all hands to be shown at showdown. At current time, sometimes only winning hand is shown. This is to prevent teamplay/collusion, people working together. All players on table should be able to see the losing hand, at least in the "dealer chat" window.

Please don't do this.  Just because a lot of online sites do this doesn't mean it's a good idea.  If you do this in live poker, you'll get a kick in the nuts if you do it too much.  Although this rule is supposedly designed to prevent collusion, it is very rare that it actually is.  However, a lot of nits like it since they get to see what people had.

Sorry but its completely different in live poker, Tom. In live poker, it is quite easy to tell if people are communicating, signaling, or using strange speech in order to telegraph their hands or the strength of their hands. In online poker, it is impossible, its just anonymous and anyone can come in with a friend and start sharing hole cards over the phone or an IM program. It is essential that this feature be implemented until there is sufficient support to review hand histories and prevent collusion. Preventing cheating and maintaining game integrity should be the #1 priority of this poker site.

I don't care if one gets a kick in the nuts for doing it live. For the record, I have played thousands of hours live and have never once asked to see someones mucked hand. I hope you can understand how completely different it is. Hands go to showdown around 5% of the time anyways, so its not like its gonna be showing your cards every hand. It will simply show the cards when someone bets with the best hand and someone else calls with a worse hand, it needs to show what worse hand they were calling with, this is extremely important if you just think about it for 5 seconds, come on man. It already shows someones hand if they are bluffing, at least if they are out of position, I'm pretty sure the software shows the bluffers hand and then shows the callers winning hand (but only if the caller had position, this should happen regardless).

There is a lot of differences between online and live poker, and one of them is you need to be able to see all hands that went to showdown, every time. You don't want your hand to be seen, then go play live poker and kick people in the nuts for asking. You wanna come on here, then abide by the rules. There's a damn good reason online poker has its own set of rules, that have been carefully honed and perfected by Full Tilt and Stars, the two main sites in the US market till recently. Its because those rules are the best rules for running an online poker room. Just because the rule only prevents collusion rarely, that is your argument for not having it? That is a god-awful argument, not trying to be a dick, just speaking my mind. It shouldn't matter at all how often it prevents collusion, if it does it ONCE its worth having.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: tomcollins on April 30, 2011, 02:28:27 PM
Second, I have some suggestions, you need to adjust your tables really.

Thanks for your input. I would like to hear what other members think about best combination of tables. This part is matter of messing with configuration files, so I can implement this fairly easy.

Also I never played anything beside hold'em, so I really do not know any details about other poker games (it just came with software and I left it as is). If there are bugs with it - please let me know. Probably it will make sense to push bug report to server software author.

Finally, you must fix the structure in limit tables. The problem is, the software makes the blinds 2x big as they should be. In .02-.04 limit for example, the blinds are .02 and .04, when they should be .01 and .02. This makes the opening raise size to .06, when it should be .04. Now, due to this fact you would have to have .005 and .01 blinds, if you want to keep the .01-.02, limit tables. This would be fine, and I would make 5 of those as well. Currently at the .01-.02 limit tables the blinds are .01 and .02, and the opening raise size is .03, when it should be .02, and blinds .01 and .01. That would actually work too, so either .005 and .01 blinds, or .01 and .01, if you can't do 3 decimal points.

Could someone else comment on this too? I do not have much experience in poker, but I always believe .01-.02 should refer to small and big blinds. Is this really incorrect? Any examples?

Yes I am correct. Open a play money pokerstars table, with limit betting. 200/400 limit holdem has 100/200 blinds. etc

Also I forgot one VERY important thing

You must implement all hands to be shown at showdown. At current time, sometimes only winning hand is shown. This is to prevent teamplay/collusion, people working together. All players on table should be able to see the losing hand, at least in the "dealer chat" window.

Please don't do this.  Just because a lot of online sites do this doesn't mean it's a good idea.  If you do this in live poker, you'll get a kick in the nuts if you do it too much.  Although this rule is supposedly designed to prevent collusion, it is very rare that it actually is.  However, a lot of nits like it since they get to see what people had.

Sorry but its completely different in live poker, Tom. In live poker, it is quite easy to tell if people are communicating, signaling, or using strange speech in order to telegraph their hands or the strength of their hands. In online poker, it is impossible, its just anonymous and anyone can come in with a friend and start sharing hole cards over the phone or an IM program. It is essential that this feature be implemented until there is sufficient support to review hand histories and prevent collusion. Preventing cheating and maintaining game integrity should be the #1 priority of this poker site.

I don't care if one gets a kick in the nuts for doing it live. For the record, I have played thousands of hours live and have never once asked to see someones mucked hand. I hope you can understand how completely different it is. Hands go to showdown around 5% of the time anyways, so its not like its gonna be showing your cards every hand. It will simply show the cards when someone bets with the best hand and someone else calls with a worse hand, it needs to show what worse hand they were calling with, this is extremely important if you just think about it for 5 seconds, come on man. It already shows someones hand if they are bluffing, at least if they are out of position, I'm pretty sure the software shows the bluffers hand and then shows the callers winning hand (but only if the caller had position, this should happen regardless).

There is a lot of differences between online and live poker, and one of them is you need to be able to see all hands that went to showdown, every time. You don't want your hand to be seen, then go play live poker and kick people in the nuts for asking. You wanna come on here, then abide by the rules. There's a damn good reason online poker has its own set of rules, that have been carefully honed and perfected by Full Tilt and Stars, the two main sites in the US market till recently. Its because those rules are the best rules for running an online poker room. Just because the rule only prevents collusion rarely, that is your argument for not having it? That is a god-awful argument, not trying to be a dick, just speaking my mind. It shouldn't matter at all how often it prevents collusion, if it does it ONCE its worth having.

So tell me how you detect collusion using that rule?  And why wouldn't the colluders just fold on the end to avoid detection?

It doesn't detect anything except for figuring out what people folded, giving you more information on how they play.  The rule doesn't protect collusion at all.

BTW- I have played at several online sites that do not show hands at the end.  Much more enjoyable than the bot-fest infected FTP and PS.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: tanerlorn on April 30, 2011, 03:14:55 PM
Bot fest infected? It is a known fact that other sites such as bodog, ub/ap, had well known botting problems that still exist, whereas stars/ftp at least had good support and eliminated bots when they first showed up on the sites, as well as having built in security now like captcha, not to mention a huge database of real player hand histories, to compare with suspected bot users.

The reason all cards must be shown at showdown is not due to when two colluders are HU in a pot, can't believe I have to explain this to you.

Its when a pot is multiway and someone is squeezed in between, and then river goes like one colluder bets the other colluder calls, and the person squeezed in between folds.....and then the callers hand is just mucked. Huge edges can be gained by making someone make incorrect folds in big bet games, such as no limit holdem. Implementing this rule we are discussing...This would be a very good situation and there is LITERALLY NO DOWNSIDE....more information is exchanged but like I said 5% of hands go to showdown anyways and the information is exchanged uniformly, it doesnt benefit anyone specifically, which is FAIR GAME.

I have tried to explain rationally why these are the rules basically everywhere, and you talk about sites that have a .0001% market share. How about you name some of the sites that have this supposed rule? I doubt you even can because they don't exist anymore. Stars/FTP had 90% of US market share for a reason, it was a pure free market, and they had the best game integrity, and customer service. Agreed, it was pretty terrible but it was the best in the industry, and as far as anyone can tell they both ran a fair game.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: eof on April 30, 2011, 04:30:57 PM
All hands that go to showdown *must* be visible to anyone.  It is "rude" to ask the dealer to show "both hands" or "all hands".. but you are allowed to for good reason.  As someone who has paid tens of k's in rake in my life; I would consider this an essential feature.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: abyssobenthonic on April 30, 2011, 11:53:31 PM
On the withdrawal security hole issue, I think a reasonable defense is something like:

* associate addresses with user accounts
* track deposits from each address associated with an account as a percentage of total deposits (see below)
* limit cumulative automatic withdrawals to an address to that percentage of account value
* users can optionally provide a public key for their account; if a user wishes to withdraw outside of the above constraints they request the site to send an email encrypted with that public key to them with a confirmation code.  The user then responds with the confirmation code and the amount to withdraw and the address to withdraw to and signs the response.  The withdrawal is then processed manually.

Computation of percentage would proceed as in this example:

* Initial deposit from address A for 10 BTC.  Address A now has a 100% deposit share for the account.
* Player builds balance to 20 BTC.  Address A's 100% share means that the whole account could be withdrawn in one-click to address A.
* Deposit of 5 BTC from address B.  Address B is assigned a share of 20% and address A's share is diluted to 80%.  The withdrawal maximums are now 20 BTC for A and 5 BTC for B.
* Balance declines to 15 BTC.  Address A's withdrawal limit is now 12 BTC and address B's is 3 BTC.
* Withdrawal to address B of 2 BTC.  Address B's share decreases to 7.6923076923...% ( (3-2)/(15-2); rounding error can be handled by for instance allowing any excess to be withdrawn from the account with the greatest share) and address A's increases to 92.3076...%.

(this is all based on speculation that the attacker in this case found a vulnerability that allowed the requestor to request a withdrawal to an arbitrary address)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on May 01, 2011, 01:14:31 AM
the particular security issue hacker used will not be avoided by technique you describe. Any code can have security issues. My bug was so simple... =)) Here is it - https://github.com/hippich/Bitcoin-Poker-Room/commit/ef5f1a181fb207fe5e1260b3190835384fe99190

I am using much more stupid but rigid system - coins are transferred from server to my own local wallet. Only small change is left to process small withdrawal amounts. Big ones proceeded manually. So even if code will be hacked (and this happens), only change will be lost, not the whole balance.

On the other note - hacker, who contacted me, never replied nor sent funds. So either he was not real hacker or just decided to use money instead of returning.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on May 01, 2011, 01:22:01 AM
Yes I am correct. Open a play money pokerstars table, with limit betting. 200/400 limit holdem has 100/200 blinds. etc

I do not have a lot experience in online poker, so I am sorry for stupid questions.. Could you explain what is referenced by these 200/400 then if blinds are 100/200?


You must implement all hands to be shown at showdown. At current time, sometimes only winning hand is shown. This is to prevent teamplay/collusion, people working together. All players on table should be able to see the losing hand, at least in the "dealer chat" window.

The whole server I believe is built around idea of dealing with hands like in real poker. I do not believe I will be able at this point modify code to enforce showdown cards in the end of game (I do not have needed skills for this).

I still believe our community is small enough to have such problems. If you do not believe to someone - do not play with them.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on May 01, 2011, 01:32:20 AM
Just rechecked transactions. Found that not all hacker's withdrawals were successful. Only 680 btc stolen.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: tomcollins on May 01, 2011, 01:35:57 AM
Bot fest infected? It is a known fact that other sites such as bodog, ub/ap, had well known botting problems that still exist, whereas stars/ftp at least had good support and eliminated bots when they first showed up on the sites, as well as having built in security now like captcha, not to mention a huge database of real player hand histories, to compare with suspected bot users.

The reason all cards must be shown at showdown is not due to when two colluders are HU in a pot, can't believe I have to explain this to you.

Its when a pot is multiway and someone is squeezed in between, and then river goes like one colluder bets the other colluder calls, and the person squeezed in between folds.....and then the callers hand is just mucked. Huge edges can be gained by making someone make incorrect folds in big bet games, such as no limit holdem. Implementing this rule we are discussing...This would be a very good situation and there is LITERALLY NO DOWNSIDE....more information is exchanged but like I said 5% of hands go to showdown anyways and the information is exchanged uniformly, it doesnt benefit anyone specifically, which is FAIR GAME.

I have tried to explain rationally why these are the rules basically everywhere, and you talk about sites that have a .0001% market share. How about you name some of the sites that have this supposed rule? I doubt you even can because they don't exist anymore. Stars/FTP had 90% of US market share for a reason, it was a pure free market, and they had the best game integrity, and customer service. Agreed, it was pretty terrible but it was the best in the industry, and as far as anyone can tell they both ran a fair game.

LITERALLY NO DOWNSIDE - except the entire table seeing what you had.

What is the upside?  The case that two colluders both call on the river?  Why wouldn't one colluder raise the other or just fold?

One I know off the top of my head is TruePoker.  You *can* see showdown hands, but you have to go through a bunch of menus and ask to have it emailed, and it takes 15-20 minutes to show up.

But hey, I know it would hurt you a lot if you are used to playing with HUDs and other "cheating" programs.  Stars/FTP had 90% of the market because they had huge advertising, had solid software, and catered to 20-tablers.  The more auto-pilot HUD-bots they had, the more rake they made as everyone passed money around.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: tomcollins on May 01, 2011, 01:40:23 AM
Yes I am correct. Open a play money pokerstars table, with limit betting. 200/400 limit holdem has 100/200 blinds. etc

I do not have a lot experience in online poker, so I am sorry for stupid questions.. Could you explain what is referenced by these 200/400 then if blinds are 100/200?


You must implement all hands to be shown at showdown. At current time, sometimes only winning hand is shown. This is to prevent teamplay/collusion, people working together. All players on table should be able to see the losing hand, at least in the "dealer chat" window.

The whole server I believe is built around idea of dealing with hands like in real poker. I do not believe I will be able at this point modify code to enforce showdown cards in the end of game (I do not have needed skills for this).

I still believe our community is small enough to have such problems. If you do not believe to someone - do not play with them.

200/400 refers to the bet size, not the blinds, in limit poker.

NL poker does not have fixed bet sizes, so it refers to the blinds.

Colluders and cheaters are perfectly capable of cheating and colluding without being able to be caught by the showdown rule.  They are really hard to catch online.  Fortunately, most are really bad at what they do so they either are super obvious or end up not making anything out of it.  The rule is much more useful in limit poker, where a 4-bet fold is really odd on the river, so they have to call.  Also, bluffing with complete trash is a lot harder to pull off, and colluding is a lot more powerful since you can see-saw people and make big pots when you have hands, and they have no way to counter.  In big bet poker, anyone can raise any amount, so it makes it that much harder to get a benefit from colluding.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on May 01, 2011, 01:44:55 AM
200/400 refers to the bet size, not the blinds, in limit poker.
NL poker does not have fixed bet sizes, so it refers to the blinds.

Oh. Now it makes more sense. I will reconfigure tables once room will be empty since I need to restart server to changes take effect.



Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: tomcollins on May 01, 2011, 01:47:58 AM
200/400 refers to the bet size, not the blinds, in limit poker.
NL poker does not have fixed bet sizes, so it refers to the blinds.

Oh. Now it makes more sense. I will reconfigure tables once room will be empty since I need to restart server to changes take effect.



BTW, if you want poker lessons, come to my home game, I will "teach" you. :)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: tanerlorn on May 01, 2011, 09:10:32 AM
Bot fest infected? It is a known fact that other sites such as bodog, ub/ap, had well known botting problems that still exist, whereas stars/ftp at least had good support and eliminated bots when they first showed up on the sites, as well as having built in security now like captcha, not to mention a huge database of real player hand histories, to compare with suspected bot users.

The reason all cards must be shown at showdown is not due to when two colluders are HU in a pot, can't believe I have to explain this to you.

Its when a pot is multiway and someone is squeezed in between, and then river goes like one colluder bets the other colluder calls, and the person squeezed in between folds.....and then the callers hand is just mucked. Huge edges can be gained by making someone make incorrect folds in big bet games, such as no limit holdem. Implementing this rule we are discussing...This would be a very good situation and there is LITERALLY NO DOWNSIDE....more information is exchanged but like I said 5% of hands go to showdown anyways and the information is exchanged uniformly, it doesnt benefit anyone specifically, which is FAIR GAME.

I have tried to explain rationally why these are the rules basically everywhere, and you talk about sites that have a .0001% market share. How about you name some of the sites that have this supposed rule? I doubt you even can because they don't exist anymore. Stars/FTP had 90% of US market share for a reason, it was a pure free market, and they had the best game integrity, and customer service. Agreed, it was pretty terrible but it was the best in the industry, and as far as anyone can tell they both ran a fair game.

LITERALLY NO DOWNSIDE - except the entire table seeing what you had.

What is the upside?  The case that two colluders both call on the river?  Why wouldn't one colluder raise the other or just fold?

One I know off the top of my head is TruePoker.  You *can* see showdown hands, but you have to go through a bunch of menus and ask to have it emailed, and it takes 15-20 minutes to show up.

But hey, I know it would hurt you a lot if you are used to playing with HUDs and other "cheating" programs.  Stars/FTP had 90% of the market because they had huge advertising, had solid software, and catered to 20-tablers.  The more auto-pilot HUD-bots they had, the more rake they made as everyone passed money around.

Sigh, dude I just explained the upside. Its amazing, really it is. Here we go one more time.

Colluder 1 makes a large bet on the river with middle pair. Colluder 2 is next to act, he calls the large bet with 7 high, something he would never do if playing legitimately. Legitimate Player 1 is next to act, he was planning to call Colluder 1's bet with top pair, but after seeing Colluder 2 call, he folds his hand.

Do you really not see how its different if "one of the colluders just folds on the end"?

Do you really not see that there could be other situations like this, where showdown cards must be shown to maintain game integrity?

Hippich, if you currently don't have the skills to code this, I suggest you make it your top priority to learn them. As much as you want to call this a "play money" site, the fact is bitcoins are easily exchangable for dollars and there are people already playing for them here. .50/1.00 btc is essentially high stakes since its basically 2/4 usd now. It's easy to say "if you feel something is fishy, you don't have to play," but the fact is when it comes to gambling people don't always think rationally, and can't help themselves and will lose and continue to play in a game where they can tell something is "off" but aren't exactly sure what or are trying to get lucky and win some of their money back.

Eof, thank you for backing me up on this, I have also payed tens of thousands of dollars in rake and was getting frustrated nobody here would agree with me. I guess if you're a losing player it doesn't matter to you much, you're gonna lose anyways, what does it matter who its to? Its the winning players who are much more affected by this as colluders take money that could be won by legitimate players.

Tom, you're simply very, very wrong. Colluding is not much more valuable in limit poker, its in no limit, where you can force people to make huge mistakes, such as 50bb losing mistakes. Where can you force someone out of a 50bb pot in limit? Its not possible. You still have yet to name one poker room that doesn't show all hands that went to showdown. True Poker still does, as you admit yourself. I would be fine with it taking 15 minutes and an email to get the information on betcoin, as long as the information IS available. Furthermore, your assumption that I am some 20-tabling HUD user, cashgamer, looking to hustle this site could not POSSIBLY be more wrong. I am a mtter, I never used a HUD and you show a complete lack of understanding of that software, the value does not reside in seeing people's mucked hands, the value is in large amounts of data on peoples folding frequencies and aggression levels on each street. Whether or not you can see people's mucked cards literally doesn't make a bit of difference in the effectiveness of a HUD.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: tomcollins on May 01, 2011, 12:52:37 PM
Bot fest infected? It is a known fact that other sites such as bodog, ub/ap, had well known botting problems that still exist, whereas stars/ftp at least had good support and eliminated bots when they first showed up on the sites, as well as having built in security now like captcha, not to mention a huge database of real player hand histories, to compare with suspected bot users.

The reason all cards must be shown at showdown is not due to when two colluders are HU in a pot, can't believe I have to explain this to you.

Its when a pot is multiway and someone is squeezed in between, and then river goes like one colluder bets the other colluder calls, and the person squeezed in between folds.....and then the callers hand is just mucked. Huge edges can be gained by making someone make incorrect folds in big bet games, such as no limit holdem. Implementing this rule we are discussing...This would be a very good situation and there is LITERALLY NO DOWNSIDE....more information is exchanged but like I said 5% of hands go to showdown anyways and the information is exchanged uniformly, it doesnt benefit anyone specifically, which is FAIR GAME.

I have tried to explain rationally why these are the rules basically everywhere, and you talk about sites that have a .0001% market share. How about you name some of the sites that have this supposed rule? I doubt you even can because they don't exist anymore. Stars/FTP had 90% of US market share for a reason, it was a pure free market, and they had the best game integrity, and customer service. Agreed, it was pretty terrible but it was the best in the industry, and as far as anyone can tell they both ran a fair game.

LITERALLY NO DOWNSIDE - except the entire table seeing what you had.

What is the upside?  The case that two colluders both call on the river?  Why wouldn't one colluder raise the other or just fold?

One I know off the top of my head is TruePoker.  You *can* see showdown hands, but you have to go through a bunch of menus and ask to have it emailed, and it takes 15-20 minutes to show up.

But hey, I know it would hurt you a lot if you are used to playing with HUDs and other "cheating" programs.  Stars/FTP had 90% of the market because they had huge advertising, had solid software, and catered to 20-tablers.  The more auto-pilot HUD-bots they had, the more rake they made as everyone passed money around.
[/quote]

Sigh, dude I just explained the upside. Its amazing, really it is. Here we go one more time.

Colluder 1 makes a large bet on the river with middle pair. Colluder 2 is next to act, he calls the large bet with 7 high, something he would never do if playing legitimately. Legitimate Player 1 is next to act, he was planning to call Colluder 1's bet with top pair, but after seeing Colluder 2 call, he folds his hand.

[/quote]

So there is one tiny case he does this.  Instead, 2nd guy could raise the river.  When the "victim" calls, he gets twice as much.  Oh noes, how awful.  The "call a bet to make a guy scared" technique.


Do you really not see how its different if "one of the colluders just folds on the end"?

Do you really not see that there could be other situations like this, where showdown cards must be shown to maintain game integrity?

Since it's so easy, show them to me.  I've played 8 years on a site that never did this, and never once did it "help maintain game integrity".

Hippich, if you currently don't have the skills to code this, I suggest you make it your top priority to learn them. As much as you want to call this a "play money" site, the fact is bitcoins are easily exchangable for dollars and there are people already playing for them here. .50/1.00 btc is essentially high stakes since its basically 2/4 usd now. It's easy to say "if you feel something is fishy, you don't have to play," but the fact is when it comes to gambling people don't always think rationally, and can't help themselves and will lose and continue to play in a game where they can tell something is "off" but aren't exactly sure what or are trying to get lucky and win some of their money back.
TOP PRIORITY I SAY!

Meanwhile, if you actually are competent at colluding, it does nothing.  He has no resources to put into people actually working together, and no time to ban people who might be.

Eof, thank you for backing me up on this, I have also payed tens of thousands of dollars in rake and was getting frustrated nobody here would agree with me. I guess if you're a losing player it doesn't matter to you much, you're gonna lose anyways, what does it matter who its to? Its the winning players who are much more affected by this as colluders take money that could be won by legitimate players.
Yes, losing players are never affected, since all losses are equal.  Another idiotic statement by you.  Winning players are actually be affected, since they don't run out of money.

Tom, you're simply very, very wrong. Colluding is not much more valuable in limit poker, its in no limit, where you can force people to make huge mistakes, such as 50bb losing mistakes. Where can you force someone out of a 50bb pot in limit? Its not possible. You still have yet to name one poker room that doesn't show all hands that went to showdown. True Poker still does, as you admit yourself. I would be fine with it taking 15 minutes and an email to get the information on betcoin, as long as the information IS available. Furthermore, your assumption that I am some 20-tabling HUD user, cashgamer, looking to hustle this site could not POSSIBLY be more wrong. I am a mtter, I never used a HUD and you show a complete lack of understanding of that software, the value does not reside in seeing people's mucked hands, the value is in large amounts of data on peoples folding frequencies and aggression levels on each street. Whether or not you can see people's mucked cards literally doesn't make a bit of difference in the effectiveness of a HUD.
How can you *force* someone to make a 50BB mistake,  by scaring them by calling?  Have you ever played limit poker?  Limit poker is a game of very small edges.  Every time you double an edge, you make a HUGE difference.  In NL poker, skill level makes up a much larger portion, and you can control your bet size.  If I cannot see-saw an opponent (see-sawing is extremely rare to begin with), I don't lose as much as I do in limit poker.  Sure I can scare them by calling, as you insist is a serious problem.  I'm not saying you are looking to hustle the site, but you are looking to instill the same attitude that has made online poker unplayable for the casual user.  "just do whatever ftp and ps did".  I couldn't disagree more from a user's perspective.  Those sites catered to the biggest rake generators, tried to make a game where people paid as much rake as possible while losing as little/winning as little as possible, so that they were the big winners.  This includes catering and allowing HUDs, sites that analyzed play, making it easy to data mine tables you weren't at, allowing way too many tables, and rewarding players who played ridiculous amounts of hands only possible from severe multitabling with huge incentives.  For a grinder, it was perfect.  For a casual player, it's one of the most boring games to play.

I already named one.  You cannot easily get the result of the hand.  You have to jump through a million hoops, then check your email 20 minutes later.  This is FAR different than your require.  Never once did I check due to collusion, but to see what someone had.  If someone was smart enough to collude, and this was actually going to detect them, they just collude better.  Maybe request it if you were in the hand on the river.  Plus, online poker allows for the management to see EVERY hand at any point in time.  If you suspect collusion, notify the operator.  They can check suspicious behavior of 100s of hands easily, and if some guy keeps calling with 7 high, you can catch him very easily looking at hand histories.  My guess is hippich has none of this infrastructure in place yet, so it would be difficult for him.

BTW- I do agree that all showdowns should be shown in a tournament where chip dumping would actually affect the game (unlike in cash game play).

But calling this top priority is laughable.  This site is still in the stone age (no offense hippich, I love what you are doing, it's just super primitive still- which you would expect since this is a spare time type project).  It freezes up, it's slow, there are only one table of any limit, no players, etc...  Hell, it was getting robbed not long ago.  Even if this was important, there are a ton of things even more important to worry about.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: tomcollins on May 01, 2011, 12:57:27 PM
BTW, if you really are concerned about collusion, just play heads up.

But the blinds being backwards are TOP PRIORITY in my opinion. It changes the game tremendously.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: tanerlorn on May 01, 2011, 01:51:06 PM
Plus, online poker allows for the management to see EVERY hand at any point in time.  If you suspect collusion, notify the operator.  They can check suspicious behavior of 100s of hands easily, and if some guy keeps calling with 7 high, you can catch him very easily looking at hand histories.  My guess is hippich has none of this infrastructure in place yet, so it would be difficult for him.

BTW- I do agree that all showdowns should be shown in a tournament where chip dumping would actually affect the game (unlike in cash game play).

But calling this top priority is laughable.  This site is still in the stone age (no offense hippich, I love what you are doing, it's just super primitive still- which you would expect since this is a spare time type project).  It freezes up, it's slow, there are only one table of any limit, no players, etc...  Hell, it was getting robbed not long ago.  Even if this was important, there are a ton of things even more important to worry about.

This is the whole point. The rule needs to be put in so that the players can police themselves, for the time being, till the project dies or Hippich expands it to include reviewing hand histories. But guess what? The more sure you are, the better, if "if you suspect collusion" well you're gonna be a lot more sure if you're able to see what hands people are going to showdown with. Furthermore, every hand isnt gonna be like the one I described, there is a lot more subtle ways to collude...I used a very obvious way as an example.

I for one cannot simply believe you are arguing that colluding is more profitable in limit games. How can that be possible? You say in one breath that limit games are games of very small edges. THIS PROVES MY POINT. Edges can be very big in no limit games and ffs you can gain these big edges by colluding. I just explained how you can force someone to make a 50bb mistake, if someone has a plan to fold river if someone else calls but call river if everyone else folds. Its really not all that "rare" a situation, and is just one of a million ways that colluders could gain an edge if cards aren't shown.

I understand Hippich has no resources to put into people working together right now and no time to ban people. That is why I suggested in an earlier post that he start charging rake and even went so far as to suggest a structure for it. Once he is making a small profit from it, he can decide if he wants to expand from there.

You clearly have some deep hatred for full tilt and stars, and its easy to guess why. I just cannot believe that your trying to claim that the sites were full of 20 tabling HUD users. Sure, there were a few there, but anytime you have a huge pool of fish, you're gonna attract the sharks. Its part of the game and there were 300k users on stars on an average Sunday. I guess none of them were "casual users" eh? Yeah all 20 tabling pros I'm sure. Haha, the stars tourneys were so filled with casual players it blows my mind that you would say stuff like this. Sunday million got an average of what, 9000 players all putting up $215.....how many of them were professional mtt players? I can give you an estimate since I have some knowledge...around 500.....thats 8500 "casual users" not affected at all by the "rampant HUD use" or "bot like multitablers". and thats just their flagship tourney....11 dollar tourneys would see 30,000 players regularly. All of these players were unaffected by and played despite the fact that their hole card information was available at showdown! Oh noes!

Also blinds being "backwards" changes nothing. It doesn't give advantage to any one player, all players must adjust to it accordingly.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on May 01, 2011, 02:02:43 PM
Another user submitted patch for reversed blinds, but, as others says, current code base I leverage is a mess. So I might start building the whole thing from the ground. (Hell, if I will not be able to monetize betco.in, I can sell engine itself for a bunch of bucks =)).

As for enforced showdown.. I see a lot of opinions on this. I think it will make more sense to implement it by table instead of at the whole room level. That's been said, current software will not support this for sure in any way.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: tomcollins on May 01, 2011, 02:27:14 PM
This is the whole point. The rule needs to be put in so that the players can police themselves, for the time being, till the project dies or Hippich expands it to include reviewing hand histories. But guess what? The more sure you are, the better, if "if you suspect collusion" well you're gonna be a lot more sure if you're able to see what hands people are going to showdown with. Furthermore, every hand isnt gonna be like the one I described, there is a lot more subtle ways to collude...I used a very obvious way as an example.
You keep saying "there are a lot of ways", but show me how having a forced showdown actually helps catch the problem?  Why not show every hand at showdown, whether you folded or not?  Then you couldn't get away with ANY funny business!



I for one cannot simply believe you are arguing that colluding is more profitable in limit games. How can that be possible? You say in one breath that limit games are games of very small edges. THIS PROVES MY POINT. Edges can be very big in no limit games and ffs you can gain these big edges by colluding. I just explained how you can force someone to make a 50bb mistake, if someone has a plan to fold river if someone else calls but call river if everyone else folds. Its really not all that "rare" a situation, and is just one of a million ways that colluders could gain an edge if cards aren't shown.
You clearly have little limit experience.  The edge you gain is by the power you have that your opponents do not have.

A million ways, yet you cannot name any more of them.  And of all the ways you can collude, this solves one tiny subset of them (and not that well, since colluders will adjust).  In the "call to scare" case, why not raise to REALLY scare?  And if you suspect it, you call and make twice as much money on the last bet.

I understand Hippich has no resources to put into people working together right now and no time to ban people. That is why I suggested in an earlier post that he start charging rake and even went so far as to suggest a structure for it. Once he is making a small profit from it, he can decide if he wants to expand from there.

You clearly have some deep hatred for full tilt and stars, and its easy to guess why. I just cannot believe that your trying to claim that the sites were full of 20 tabling HUD users. Sure, there were a few there, but anytime you have a huge pool of fish, you're gonna attract the sharks. Its part of the game and there were 300k users on stars on an average Sunday. I guess none of them were "casual users" eh? Yeah all 20 tabling pros I'm sure. Haha, the stars tourneys were so filled with casual players it blows my mind that you would say stuff like this. Sunday million got an average of what, 9000 players all putting up $215.....how many of them were professional mtt players? I can give you an estimate since I have some knowledge...around 500.....thats 8500 "casual users" not affected at all by the "rampant HUD use" or "bot like multitablers". and thats just their flagship tourney....11 dollar tourneys would see 30,000 players regularly. All of these players were unaffected by and played despite the fact that their hole card information was available at showdown! Oh noes!

Also blinds being "backwards" changes nothing. It doesn't give advantage to any one player, all players must adjust to it accordingly.

It changes NOTHING?  Are you kidding?  The player with the button has the advantage in the hand.  I'm not sure if this is news to you based on your complete ignorance of everything else poker related.  By having him act second, the small blind now folds FAR more often in correct play.  This makes a much more boring game.

What do tournaments have to do with cash games?  Why is that an argument?  Tournaments were the one thing that the multi-tablers could not game (unless they started entering multiple entries).  I am only talking about cash games.  Sunday Tournament is small potatoes for their revenue.  It was simply a promotion to get people to play other games.  And yes, the tournament grew so large, you pretty much had to give up an entire day to be able to play it.

I'm primarily talking about cash games (which hippich only supports).  If you have 800 casual users and 200 "for profit" players, you end up with a pretty nice balance at the tables and a fairly good game.  If the casual players play 1 table, and the 200 "for profit" players play 4 tables each on average, that means we move to a 50% solid player ratio rather than 20%.  If they 8-table, it means you have 75% solid player ratio.  It crushes games.  I've been around a long time, probably playing since you were in diapers.  I've seen the evolution of the game go from where you couldn't even multi-table, to 4-table max, to the expansion.  You end up with an army of nit-bots (who may not be huge in numbers, but play 20 tables) that make the game a rake-fest.  It's absolutely horrible.

But if you want to start talking about tournaments when I'm talking exclusively about cash games, go for it.  In the smaller tournaments, you still see some of the same problems (especially Sit-N-Gos, where serious players will play tons at a time, and casual players won't, making the ratio worse).  But comparing it to a 1-time special event like the Sunday tourney is of course silly.  I will give Stars and Full Tilt credit, they did a great job making that tournament huge.  Unfortunately it did become so big that it became a huge time drain to play for a lot of people (myself included).

If collusion really is a problem, maybe the site should just be heads up games.  Or if you really want, just play people heads up.  Collusion could very well be a serious problem.  But if you put in simplistic and ineffective measures to stop it, colluders will just avoid that small part of detection and move on.

How do you feel about my suggestion of showing EVERYONE's hand after it is over?  That way no one can collude no matter what without being obvious.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: tanerlorn on May 01, 2011, 06:07:22 PM
There are a lot of ways. I'm not gonna sit here and type of examples here for you so people can read them and start thinking of ideas. Use your brain. Heres one last one:

On the turn its 3 ways. Legit player checks, villian 1 bets large, villian 2 raises large....legit player decides to call this time, so hes winning money....river goes check, check, check....legit player shows the best hand and takes the pot....BUT DOESNT GET TO SEE WHAT THE OTHER TWO PLAYERS HAD. IF YOU CAN GET THIS THROUGH YOUR THICK SKULL, THAT IS SOME NECCESSARY INFORMATION TO FIND OUT IF THEY WERE COLLUDING.

As for showing every hand at every showdown? I'd be fine with that.

Little limit experience hahahahaha thanks for making me laugh! I've played more limit hands than you in my lifetime old man, and that is a god damn guarantee. Unless you've played over 2 million which I sincerely doubt. Stop saying that this rule would solve "one tiny subset" of colluding, this rule would allow players to police them GOD DAMNED SELVES and solve virtually the entire problem of colluding

Enough moving the goalposts with regards to tournaments. First of all, I was just using that as an example to show that people will play regardless. I said right there in writing that 9.000 players played it, while 300.000 users were on the site. I am acknowledging that cashgames are the bigger game, and cashgames are all that is available on this site anyways.

You really have a hatred for multitablers. Do you realize its only possible to 2 table on this site currently? Anyways, the stars games you are describing, do you not see how its not all advantage to the 20 tablers? They have to put up 20 times the money, first of all, and second of all they have to think about a lot more stuff whereas someone focusing on 1 table can be concentrating a lot more on decisions on that table.

Anyways, its all smoke and mirrors anyways, just because theres some people playing 20 tables, you act like online cash was so tough. It wasn't, get over it, there were still plenty of fish till it got shutdown.

Anyways, stop putting words in my mouth. I've continuously said that collusion isn't a problem, it just could arise in the future, especially since Hippich is currently accepting deposits and everything is motherfucking anonymous. This doesn't concern you in the least though eh?

Having the site be heads up games only would be a terrible idea. Almost no people like heads up and the variance is much higher, among other reasons. The bad players also go broke more quickly heads up which is bad for the site and bad for everyone except the person they're playing.

And again, I would be fine with everyone's cards being shown.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on May 01, 2011, 06:17:22 PM
I've updated code with submitted HU game patch. Please try it and let me know if it works correctly.

Also, I've added bunch of HU tables. Not sure if we need that much, so comments are welcome.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: tomcollins on May 01, 2011, 06:33:31 PM
There are a lot of ways. I'm not gonna sit here and type of examples here for you so people can read them and start thinking of ideas. Use your brain. Heres one last one:

On the turn its 3 ways. Legit player checks, villian 1 bets large, villian 2 raises large....legit player decides to call this time, so hes winning money....river goes check, check, check....legit player shows the best hand and takes the pot....BUT DOESNT GET TO SEE WHAT THE OTHER TWO PLAYERS HAD. IF YOU CAN GET THIS THROUGH YOUR THICK SKULL, THAT IS SOME NECCESSARY INFORMATION TO FIND OUT IF THEY WERE COLLUDING.

As for showing every hand at every showdown? I'd be fine with that.

Little limit experience hahahahaha thanks for making me laugh! I've played more limit hands than you in my lifetime old man, and that is a god damn guarantee. Unless you've played over 2 million which I sincerely doubt. Stop saying that this rule would solve "one tiny subset" of colluding, this rule would allow players to police them GOD DAMNED SELVES and solve virtually the entire problem of colluding

Well, for someone who's supposedly very experienced, it's amazing you were able to profit without understanding the game.

Why do you need someone to collude in your example?  In Big Bet, first guy can just bet big if he wants, he doesn't need his buddy to see-saw.  Sure, a raise might be scarier.  But if you suspect collusion, you can absolutely destroy the team.  If you do in limit, you can't do crap.  You pay double or more when a villain has a hand, you get paid only the smallest amount when they don't.



Enough moving the goalposts with regards to tournaments. First of all, I was just using that as an example to show that people will play regardless. I said right there in writing that 9.000 players played it, while 300.000 users were on the site. I am acknowledging that cashgames are the bigger game, and cashgames are all that is available on this site anyways.

You are the one who brought up tournaments, NOT ME.

You really have a hatred for multitablers. Do you realize its only possible to 2 table on this site currently? Anyways, the stars games you are describing, do you not see how its not all advantage to the 20 tablers? They have to put up 20 times the money, first of all, and second of all they have to think about a lot more stuff whereas someone focusing on 1 table can be concentrating a lot more on decisions on that table.

And this is a good thing.  Although sitting out at a lot of tables trying to get games going is probably a good thing since there aren't many players.

Sure, a 20-tabler isn't able to think as much.  Which is why they don't, they just play super nitty, at worst lose money to rake, and just follow whatever their HUD tells them to do.  A 1-tabler gets bored folding, plays hands they shouldn't, and keeps games interesting.  Rake will always win in a table of nits.

Anyways, its all smoke and mirrors anyways, just because theres some people playing 20 tables, you act like online cash was so tough. It wasn't, get over it, there were still plenty of fish till it got shutdown.

20-tablers have more risk?  Another hilariously wrong argument.  There is no more money on the line, it just means they get 20-times as many hands in. This reduces variance.  Poker moved from a game where you think to a game where you look at your HUD, then make a decision and move on to the next table.  It favors the Starcraft internet nerds more than poker players.  But I can see why you favor that style.

The games changed tremendously in the last 8 years, and multi-tabling HUD players are the reason why.  There are armies of solid low limit players.  I was shocked at how low stakes some of the serious players play (because they just grind out 20 tables).  Sure, they make decent money because they are playing 20 tables and grind a ton.  It wasn't always like that.  It's fantastic for the sites.  They make 20x as much rake.  Games are nitfests, and unless you are willing to just play a super nit style, wait until you have the nuts, then hope you are with the 1 fish, or constantly change tables until you find the fish and bumhunt.

But right now, the .5/1 games are harder than 5/10 NL was 5 years ago.  It's not even close. 

But you being a winning player without having a clue about anything shows you are probably right that it still isn't that hard to win.

Anyways, stop putting words in my mouth. I've continuously said that collusion isn't a problem, it just could arise in the future, especially since Hippich is currently accepting deposits and everything is motherfucking anonymous. This doesn't concern you in the least though eh?

Having the site be heads up games only would be a terrible idea. Almost no people like heads up and the variance is much higher, among other reasons. The bad players also go broke more quickly heads up which is bad for the site and bad for everyone except the person they're playing.

And again, I would be fine with everyone's cards being shown.

I'm actually a bit shocked you are fine with showing down hands at the end, but at least it's a position that isn't retarded.  It actually would help catch collusion other than your half-brained ideas that would catch only the most moronic of colluders (who probably would be losing money and exploited for their stupid collusion).  For a site that cannot actively monitor colluders, it actually is probably the best idea.  But there's no recourse now anyway, other than just not playing when those players are in.

Betco.in in it's current form is a great casual diversion but not anything I'd want to play for serious stakes.  And that actually is a good thing, I've actually enjoyed the social experience of it much more than Stars or FTP, where you might as well have been playing against robots.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: luv2drnkbr on May 01, 2011, 08:42:08 PM
How do you feel about my suggestion of showing EVERYONE's hand after it is over?  That way no one can collude no matter what without being obvious.

OMG that would be sick.  I wonder how I'd change my game to balance my preflop selection if I knew everybody would get to see them.  Theoretically, if they watch me for billions of hands, then can reasonably deduce it, but having them be able to deduce it within a few hundred hands is something else entirely.  Fuck, I'd just have to play GTO I guess.  Gross.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: anisoptera on May 01, 2011, 09:07:28 PM
Heads-up is definitely fixed, I watched a few people playing HU and everything looks good.

More changes coming soon once we get rake implemented.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on May 01, 2011, 10:48:17 PM
BTW, anisoptera started to work on back-end. And HU blinds were fixed by her!


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: marcus_of_augustus on May 01, 2011, 11:05:24 PM
Good work hippich and anisoptera, bitcoin poker has good potential imo ... limited downside due to it being legal in many countries.

It is great example of how bitcoin community can make s/ware (web) projects happen very quickly because there is huge surplus of competent coding potential from all over the globe, just sitting out there watching bitcoin marketplace and etc for work to come up paying in BTC. Some good entrepreneurs/managers to organise the work and run businesses will do well.

Any future plans on implementing some BlackJack tables? .... I might have a dabble at that ;)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on May 01, 2011, 11:07:25 PM
moa, this is completely different beast. I would like to implement it all, but I do not have enough time for poker... But I bet if you post it in marketplace section, someone will come with it.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: marcus_of_augustus on May 01, 2011, 11:10:35 PM
Quote
But I bet if you post it in marketplace section, someone will come with it.

I won't bet against that one ... I will post it though, thanks again.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on May 04, 2011, 01:29:33 PM
anisoptera fixed rake code. so room take rake now.

We do not charge rake if the hand ends on the first betting round - before the flop.

Heads-Up: we collect 1% rake with x5 BB cap and 0.5 BTC absolute cap.

Round: we collect 1% rake with x10 BB cap and 2 BTC absolute cap.

This should help us to develop it faster since we have incentive now =)


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: ColdHardMetal on May 04, 2011, 02:23:42 PM
Sounds fair enough to me.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: tomcollins on May 04, 2011, 03:04:19 PM
anisoptera fixed rake code. so room take rake now.

We do not charge rake if the hand ends on the first betting round - before the flop.

Heads-Up: we collect 1% rake with x5 BB cap and 0.5 BTC absolute cap.

Round: we collect 1% rake with x10 BB cap and 2 BTC absolute cap.

This should help us to develop it faster since we have incentive now =)

Good luck.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: Cusipzzz on May 04, 2011, 03:12:36 PM
No idea why anyone would play non-heads up at any stakes other than micros. Collusion is way too easy. Even showing all cards at showdown is not enough. You need skilled people reviewing full hand histories, tracking user IDs, IP addresses, etc. This stuff isn't easy and is why large poker sites have huge Security departments.

But hey, it's a start, keep at it.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: hippich on May 04, 2011, 03:15:29 PM
No idea why anyone would play non-heads up at any stakes other than micros. Collusion is way too easy. Even showing all cards at showdown is not enough. You need skilled people reviewing full hand histories, tracking user IDs, IP addresses, etc. This stuff isn't easy and is why large poker sites have huge Security departments.

But hey, it's a start, keep at it.

I believe at this point we will not have this particular problem due to small size. But if someone suspect non honest game - please report. If it become often enough I will develop tools/policies to review such cases and prevent harm from it.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: anisoptera on May 04, 2011, 04:16:30 PM
I can tell you that at non-micros (NL25+) currently the players at that level all know each other (seth!!!!!) and so we would immediately notice a new player at those limits; any more than one in a day would be a complete abnormality, and definitely arouse suspicion among the current "community". Even having a non-HU game at those stakes is a rarity right now.

(I would actually say this is true for all limits on the site right now, but at micros there are more often newcomers :) )

When the site gets bigger we will have to revisit this problem. Hopefully that coincides with the rewrite of the code.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: luv2drnkbr on May 07, 2011, 03:43:11 AM
 :'(  Seth won't play me any more

/not-so-thinly-veiled-brag


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: anisoptera on May 07, 2011, 05:36:31 AM
:'(  Seth won't play me any more

/not-so-thinly-veiled-brag

ahaha, are you serious? wow.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: eof on May 08, 2011, 09:29:16 PM
what is the URL?  i would like to play..  betco.in never has any traffic.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: anisoptera on May 08, 2011, 09:39:59 PM
what is the URL?  i would like to play..  betco.in never has any traffic.

This thread is for betco.in - https://betco.in . It is the "biggest" BTC poker site currently. There aren't any others. The reason we have no traffic is that no one seems to want to play. I think it is an issue with getting games started - people look at the table list, see 0 players, and leave.

If you want to play and there isn't traffic, sit at a table and do something else until you hear the chime of someone else sitting down. The site has a Twitter account (http://twitter.com/betcoin) and will tweet when people are sitting and how many. If no one ever sits, games never get started. If someone starts a game, other people join pretty often. The more people in a game, the more attractive it is.

Also, if you sit, I'll probably sit with you and donate BTC to you because it turns out I am terrible. :P

Don't go AFK though, it's just as bad to sit at a table with 2 people that aren't even there. If you are actually leaving your computer, stand up :)

We are actively working on development of the site; Omaha is coming, and we've been working on other client issues as well. The more people play, the more we'll be able to develop the site.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on May 08, 2011, 09:48:04 PM
URL is https://betco.in - there is no alot of players and usually they get in to room during evenings.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: HostFat on May 08, 2011, 09:52:54 PM
Can you add some fun-tables with "virtual" bitcoins? :)
So people will be able to test your website without using real bitcoins.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on May 08, 2011, 10:03:22 PM
Technically this is doable, but it's too much hassle. I have more bigger problems and do not want introduce something which will potentially bring even more problems. So, no. No free tables.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Third Way on May 09, 2011, 12:29:36 AM
I'm going to play but there is none around. And this is me willing to bet my last BTC2.50 because I lost quite a bit in blackjack haha. I wish I hadn't gotten scammed when I first started, but such cases I guess. I will be in the small bets room


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on May 09, 2011, 12:39:17 AM
I'm going to play but there is none around. And this is me willing to bet my last BTC2.50 because I lost quite a bit in blackjack haha. I wish I hadn't gotten scammed when I first started, but such cases I guess. I will be in the small bets room

Thank you Third Way for letting us know!

BTW, this is the best way to get into game - sit at table and post announce (here or in separate topic). Bitcoin forum have a lot of visits and your post will be noticed for sure!


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: eof on May 09, 2011, 12:56:52 AM
sitting right now..


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Third Way on May 09, 2011, 01:09:35 AM
Well, that;s it for me, EOF had lucks side, and I am now broke. Good Game and good luck to all. Be careful out there, gambling is more addicting than drugs if you don't notice.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: eof on May 09, 2011, 01:25:16 AM
Well, that;s it for me, EOF had lucks side, and I am now broke. Good Game and good luck to all. Be careful out there, gambling is more addicting than drugs if you don't notice.

sorry thirdway; hope it wasn't your last .4btc !

Admin should note that thirdway said he was folded before seeing cards one hand.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Third Way on May 09, 2011, 01:47:52 AM
Well, that;s it for me, EOF had lucks side, and I am now broke. Good Game and good luck to all. Be careful out there, gambling is more addicting than drugs if you don't notice.

sorry thirdway; hope it wasn't your last .4btc !

Admin should note that thirdway said he was folded before seeing cards one hand.

It's alright, it was my last 2.50, and I was only playing for fun, not profit. I don't take this personally. Make nothing of it.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: eof on May 09, 2011, 10:36:57 PM
sitting at the .01/.02 and .02/.04 tables

COME PLAY


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: eof on May 09, 2011, 11:26:53 PM
game going right now..


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on May 10, 2011, 02:49:39 PM
Today thisweekin.com should do live interview with Gavin and I believe they should touch poker topic as well. I hope it will bring some users too =)

Show should start today at 1pm PST if I am correct - http://twitter.com/TWistartups/status/67800608727498752


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: accord01 on May 14, 2011, 04:03:19 PM
Some critical problems with the table structure and software that needs to be addressed:

Table spreads-

The availability of just 1 table .02/.04 limit table and a 2/4 table makes no sense, as.

Having so many hu tables is not really need considering there isn't too much traffic to begin with, it does help to bring in more rake though.  However, limit games bring in more rake then NL, that is a known fact.

The following is a good example as a good spread:

.01/.02 NL ---> 2 regular table, 1 hu table
.02/.04 nl  ---> 2 regular, 1 hu
.05/.10 nl  ---> 2 regular, 1 hu
.10/.25 nl  ---> 1 regular, 1 hu
.25/.50 nl  1 regular 1 hu
.5/1 nl  1 regular 1 hu
1/2 nl x 1


and perhaps a nl 5/10, but there wouldn't be action, atleast not the immediate future.

For limit games, the following should be spread:


2c/4c
10c/20c
25c/50c
.50/1
1/2
and 2/4

i dont think pot limit games are needed, nor the nl 10/20 etc etc.


Structure:

3 Bet cap in limit, needs to be raised to ATLEAST 4 bet cap.

The muck/fold problem.  Normal protocol is the player that has been called or checked to must show first.  Having the person out of position show first no matter what, and the person in position mucking changes a lot.  

Button placement
:

Fold button is way too small in comparison to raise button, it is too close to the raise button.

folding when you have the option to check, this causes a lot of misclicks and problems

delay in clicking, i have clicked a blank screen only to call an allin once the button showed up.

Rake:

Having a 100bb cap is a good ruling.  Another good guideline is to have a 10bb min.  The pot has to be atleast 10bb -100bb to be raked 1%.

For example: i am playing some one in 2c/4c hu limit.  After about a few hours, an entire buyin (1btc) has been raked, because there are so many flops seen in hu, yet the pot is so small.  So basically we lose 1% of our bets every hand, that can get pretty hefty.  And for such a small site, most of the action is HU anyway.

software bugs:

delays in the auto fold auto call check boxes. I once clicked auto call 5cents when my opponent raised it to 5cents, only to call a 20c raise, because someone reraised him, even though i had clicked "call 5c"

Freezing after calling a bet out of position, this gets tough after having to press f5 every other hand.

The sit out problem.  When i try to sit out, it does not allow me to sit out the next hand.  It seem to take 10-30 seconds to work and that could cost someone a lot of money.

The auto post blind problem, self explanatory, "I was just here to sit and chat, but i posted my blind and now i have QQ facing a raise"


I think i covered some of the critical issues that needs to be addressed NOW.  This would definitely help this site to grow, once these things are fixed, i think this site will see a lot more traffic.  There's definitely a lot of good things about this site and great potential, and these things will be greatly appreciated by the customers!










Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: anisoptera on May 14, 2011, 06:11:27 PM
Some critical problems with the table structure and software that needs to be addressed:

Table spreads-
This looks like a good spread and we'll probably use it. Thanks! Especially having multiple tables at the same stakes so you can multitable.

You're right that the nosebleeds probably don't need to exist.

We also probably need to enhance the table listing interface to make it easier to find the ones you're interested in. If we had that then we should be able to have two HU tables per stake and have them invisible to people that don't care.


Quote
Structure:

3 Bet cap in limit, needs to be raised to ATLEAST 4 bet cap.

The muck/fold problem.  Normal protocol is the player that has been called or checked to must show first.  Having the person out of position show first no matter what, and the person in position mucking changes a lot. 

Eww, didn't know it had a 3bet cap. Ugly. Will fix asap.

We're working on the mucking thing. For now the intended fix is just that everyone shows everything at showdown. We might revisit this after the rewrite.

Quote

Button placement
:

Fold button is way too small in comparison to raise button, it is too close to the raise button.

folding when you have the option to check, this causes a lot of misclicks and problems

delay in clicking, i have clicked a blank screen only to call an allin once the button showed up.
The fold button is small because you can click it when you can also check. But maybe it should be next to the check/call button :)

Stars lets you open fold, I don't see any reason to disallow this.

The delay is an issue. I suggest using a WebKit-based browser - Chrome or Safari - these have the best JS engines for the site and it's much smoother in these browsers.

Quote
Rake:

Having a 100bb cap is a good ruling.  Another good guideline is to have a 10bb min.  The pot has to be atleast 10bb -100bb to be raked 1%.

For example: i am playing some one in 2c/4c hu limit.  After about a few hours, an entire buyin (1btc) has been raked, because there are so many flops seen in hu, yet the pot is so small.  So basically we lose 1% of our bets every hand, that can get pretty hefty.  And for such a small site, most of the action is HU anyway.

Thanks for the suggestion, but we are not going to institute a minimum raked pot size.

No other site does this. I looked up Stars' rake and they don't have a minimum raked pot size - effectively, they do (20c) but only because you can't take less than a penny out of a pot. Our rake is a fifth of theirs at micros. 1btc is also not an entire buyin at any stakes we spread (yet) - there's no such thing as a buyin at limit; 1BTC at 20/40 mBTC is 25BB, hardly high rake for playing a "few hours".

That said, we also don't plan on increasing the rake either. 1% with fractional rake is working really well. We are going to drop the absolute rake cap to 1BTC, because at this point 2BTC is astronomical.

Quote
software bugs:

delays in the auto fold auto call check boxes. I once clicked auto call 5cents when my opponent raised it to 5cents, only to call a 20c raise, because someone reraised him, even though i had clicked "call 5c"

Freezing after calling a bet out of position, this gets tough after having to press f5 every other hand.

The sit out problem.  When i try to sit out, it does not allow me to sit out the next hand.  It seem to take 10-30 seconds to work and that could cost someone a lot of money.

The auto post blind problem, self explanatory, "I was just here to sit and chat, but i posted my blind and now i have QQ facing a raise"

We might just end up removing the call X box. I never used it on Stars because of the exact reason you stated. It probably doesn't work right anyway.

We know about the call bet OOP bug, it's really aggravating and we're working on that one :)

I've never had a problem with sitting out. I click Sit Out and then the next hand that is dealt I'm out? Don't wait until the end of the hand to sit out; if you know you're going to leave after the current hand, sit out at the beginning.

Don't sit in if you don't want to play. Uncheck the "Sit in" box on the buyin window or don't buy in at all. I can think of worse things than accidentally sitting in and getting QQ ;)

Quote
I think i covered some of the critical issues that needs to be addressed NOW.  This would definitely help this site to grow, once these things are fixed, i think this site will see a lot more traffic.  There's definitely a lot of good things about this site and great potential, and these things will be greatly appreciated by the customers!

Definitely. Thanks for the comprehensive suggestions!


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: accord01 on May 14, 2011, 06:46:59 PM
Some critical problems with the table structure and software that needs to be addressed:

Table spreads-
This looks like a good spread and we'll probably use it. Thanks! Especially having multiple tables at the same stakes so you can multitable.

You're right that the nosebleeds probably don't need to exist.

We also probably need to enhance the table listing interface to make it easier to find the ones you're interested in. If we had that then we should be able to have two HU tables per stake and have them invisible to people that don't care.


Quote
Structure:

3 Bet cap in limit, needs to be raised to ATLEAST 4 bet cap.

The muck/fold problem.  Normal protocol is the player that has been called or checked to must show first.  Having the person out of position show first no matter what, and the person in position mucking changes a lot. 

Eww, didn't know it had a 3bet cap. Ugly. Will fix asap.

We're working on the mucking thing. For now the intended fix is just that everyone shows everything at showdown. We might revisit this after the rewrite.

yea, i didnt mean to say "ATLEAST", 4bet cap is standard

Quote

Button placement
:

Fold button is way too small in comparison to raise button, it is too close to the raise button.

folding when you have the option to check, this causes a lot of misclicks and problems

delay in clicking, i have clicked a blank screen only to call an allin once the button showed up.
The fold button is small because you can click it when you can also check. But maybe it should be next to the check/call button :)

Stars lets you open fold, I don't see any reason to disallow this.

i meant that there should be a warning before u open fold, it is very easy to misclick since the fold button is so tiny and bunched up with other buttons

The delay is an issue. I suggest using a WebKit-based browser - Chrome or Safari - these have the best JS engines for the site and it's much smoother in these browsers.

Quote
Rake:

Having a 100bb cap is a good ruling.  Another good guideline is to have a 10bb min.  The pot has to be atleast 10bb -100bb to be raked 1%.

For example: i am playing some one in 2c/4c hu limit.  After about a few hours, an entire buyin (1btc) has been raked, because there are so many flops seen in hu, yet the pot is so small.  So basically we lose 1% of our bets every hand, that can get pretty hefty.  And for such a small site, most of the action is HU anyway.

Thanks for the suggestion, but we are not going to institute a minimum raked pot size.

No other site does this. I looked up Stars' rake and they don't have a minimum raked pot size - effectively, they do (20c) but only because you can't take less than a penny out of a pot. Our rake is a fifth of theirs at micros. 1btc is also not an entire buyin at any stakes we spread (yet) - there's no such thing as a buyin at limit; 1BTC at 20/40 mBTC is 25BB, hardly high rake for playing a "few hours".

That said, we also don't plan on increasing the rake either. 1% with fractional rake is working really well. We are going to drop the absolute rake cap to 1BTC, because at this point 2BTC is astronomical.



Quote
software bugs:

delays in the auto fold auto call check boxes. I once clicked auto call 5cents when my opponent raised it to 5cents, only to call a 20c raise, because someone reraised him, even though i had clicked "call 5c"

Freezing after calling a bet out of position, this gets tough after having to press f5 every other hand.

The sit out problem.  When i try to sit out, it does not allow me to sit out the next hand.  It seem to take 10-30 seconds to work and that could cost someone a lot of money.

The auto post blind problem, self explanatory, "I was just here to sit and chat, but i posted my blind and now i have QQ facing a raise"

We might just end up removing the call X box. I never used it on Stars because of the exact reason you stated. It probably doesn't work right anyway.

We know about the call bet OOP bug, it's really aggravating and we're working on that one :)



I've never had a problem with sitting out. I click Sit Out and then the next hand that is dealt I'm out? Don't wait until the end of the hand to sit out; if you know you're going to leave after the current hand, sit out at the beginning.

Don't sit in if you don't want to play. Uncheck the "Sit in" box on the buyin window or don't buy in at all. I can think of worse things than accidentally sitting in and getting QQ ;)

Quote
I think i covered some of the critical issues that needs to be addressed NOW.  This would definitely help this site to grow, once these things are fixed, i think this site will see a lot more traffic.  There's definitely a lot of good things about this site and great potential, and these things will be greatly appreciated by the customers!

Definitely. Thanks for the comprehensive suggestions!

np, definitely a good service, helps the btc economy


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: sethsethseth on May 15, 2011, 05:37:34 AM
YAY its back we are playing with the software update.  lots of good stuff


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on May 15, 2011, 06:20:25 AM
Room switched to bitcents. i.e. if you see on table 1, this means you bet 0.01 BTC.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: cam02003 on May 15, 2011, 11:27:06 AM
Why are there no hand histories?
These are important for protection of both players and website!



Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: tomcollins on May 15, 2011, 01:07:21 PM
Room switched to bitcents. i.e. if you see on table 1, this means you bet 0.01 BTC.

The tabbed sections don't work on Chrome for Windows.  You can't click on Heads Up or Regular - you only see the Popular tables.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on May 15, 2011, 04:13:54 PM
Why are there no hand histories?
These are important for protection of both players and website!

Hands are saved in DB, but in not human-readable way. Once I will fix connection issues I plan to implement hands history viewer as well.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on May 15, 2011, 04:25:47 PM
Room switched to bitcents. i.e. if you see on table 1, this means you bet 0.01 BTC.

The tabbed sections don't work on Chrome for Windows.  You can't click on Heads Up or Regular - you only see the Popular tables.

Could someone else confirm this bug? I just tried in Win7 with freshly downloaded Chrome and it works.

tomcollins, what browser and OS version you use? may be something specific to these versions.. Also, please try to clear cache and try again. May be something cached?


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: nextnonce on May 15, 2011, 05:59:11 PM
It seems to work fine for me in Win 7/Chrome. Firefox is another story though.  The tabs there aren't tabs at all.  

Also it seems that our account balance units are bitcents but are the tables still showing bitcoins?  That's unclear and should be reconciled.  

Edit: getting a persistent "waiting for betco.in" status bar after sitting at a table.  It's my first time using chrome instead of FF so maybe it's always been that way?


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on May 15, 2011, 06:15:58 PM
It seems to work fine for me in Win 7/Chrome. Firefox is another story though.  The tabs there aren't tabs at all. 

Installed both FF3.6 and FF4 into Win7 - in both betco.in tables pages work fine. Could you post screenshot of an issue?

Also it seems that our account balance units are bitcents but are the tables still showing bitcoins?  That's unclear and should be reconciled. 

Site uses bitcents now everywhere except deposit/withdrawal page. I.e. on the 1c/2c table you real blinds are 0.0001btc / 0.0002btc

Edit: getting a persistent "waiting for betco.in" status bar after sitting at a table.  It's my first time using chrome instead of FF so maybe it's always been that way?

i think it was forever. will look in to it after major problems solved.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: nextnonce on May 15, 2011, 06:33:55 PM
It seems to work fine for me in Win 7/Chrome. Firefox is another story though.  The tabs there aren't tabs at all. 

Installed both FF3.6 and FF4 into Win7 - in both betco.in tables pages work fine. Could you post screenshot of an issue?


FF4 on Win7:
http://i.imgur.com/Xtkau.png


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on May 15, 2011, 06:41:41 PM
Try to clear cache. I am pretty sure that should do it.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Dangerhorse on May 15, 2011, 08:18:40 PM
Can you make the units more explicit in the tables list?  I see there is a 10/20 game going on right now, but I'm a little uncertain on whether that's 10/20 bitcoins or 10/20 bitcents.  Don't really want to sit down in case it's bitcoins!


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on May 15, 2011, 08:21:08 PM
all tables are in bitcents right now. ie 10/20 - is 0.1BTC/0.2BTC


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: gigabytecoin on May 15, 2011, 08:34:43 PM
I signed up... but there only seems to be 3 players online?

Sunday afternoon is pokerstars.com's busiest day....?

That, and the two players I saw playing were almost definitely bots. They were folding and betting hands within fractions of a second.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Dangerhorse on May 15, 2011, 08:48:54 PM
all tables are in bitcents right now. ie 10/20 - is 0.1BTC/0.2BTC

OK, but you really ought to say that on the page somewhere, no?  (Rather than just assuming everyone knows.)

Don't mean to sound negative - really like what you've done.  I guess there was an update in the last 24 hours?  The interface seems slicker, although I've only played around with the site a little bit.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on May 15, 2011, 08:57:40 PM
all tables are in bitcents right now. ie 10/20 - is 0.1BTC/0.2BTC

OK, but you really ought to say that on the page somewhere, no?  (Rather than just assuming everyone knows.)

Don't mean to sound negative - really like what you've done.  I guess there was an update in the last 24 hours?  The interface seems slicker, although I've only played around with the site a little bit.


Nothing set in stone and you are right - I am going to find best way to tell what is real stakes are. Either through using "chips" as internal currency or referring to bitcents (or bitmili ?). Anyway, this project will be changing constantly to fit most of requirements of players that's why I need your feedbacks. Thank you!


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on May 15, 2011, 08:59:11 PM
I signed up... but there only seems to be 3 players online?

Sunday afternoon is pokerstars.com's busiest day....?

That, and the two players I saw playing were almost definitely bots. They were folding and betting hands within fractions of a second.

Currently only real room fans sits there constantly. And they are definitely not bots. Just play for fun and fast =)

From my experience, room sees the most people during late evening US time and less during weekends.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: eof on May 15, 2011, 10:17:23 PM
Can you check the account history for user `eof`?

I thought I should have a couple BTC in there, and I am seeing nothing.

Last Thing I knew is i took 16 btc to a table and donked it off.. while there was like 18.something in the account. 


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: gigabytecoin on May 15, 2011, 10:35:00 PM
Can you check the account history for user `eof`?

I thought I should have a couple BTC in there, and I am seeing nothing.

Last Thing I knew is i took 16 btc to a table and donked it off.. while there was like 18.something in the account. 

If I had a dollar for every time I thought there was still some money in my online poker account... and there wasn't... I'd be playing poker.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on May 15, 2011, 11:46:22 PM
Can you check the account history for user `eof`?

I thought I should have a couple BTC in there, and I am seeing nothing.

Last Thing I knew is i took 16 btc to a table and donked it off.. while there was like 18.something in the account. 

340   Bitcoin   6.27   1LYGCz9C2DDwmAwZR9s7qnCaPoJBEXEmRe   2011-05-08T23:26:45   2011-05-08T23:26:45
341   Bitcoin   6.66   1MeU1RQE6tBGDJ3dgoVBy7BtJuPrvhtTxE   2011-05-09T01:46:21   2011-05-09T01:46:21

This are two withdrawal done from your account. if you do not recognize these - contact me via email to investigate it.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: eof on May 16, 2011, 12:01:06 AM
hrm.

no those were both my transactions.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: tomcollins on May 16, 2011, 12:26:15 AM
Room switched to bitcents. i.e. if you see on table 1, this means you bet 0.01 BTC.

The tabbed sections don't work on Chrome for Windows.  You can't click on Heads Up or Regular - you only see the Popular tables.

Could someone else confirm this bug? I just tried in Win7 with freshly downloaded Chrome and it works.

tomcollins, what browser and OS version you use? may be something specific to these versions.. Also, please try to clear cache and try again. May be something cached?

Now it works.  Weird.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: nextnonce on May 16, 2011, 01:51:44 AM
A tip for betcoi.in: rename the .css file each time you change it, otherwise ppl will have the old one until F5.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: FreeMoney on May 16, 2011, 08:59:27 PM
I signed up... but there only seems to be 3 players online?

Sunday afternoon is pokerstars.com's busiest day....?

That, and the two players I saw playing were almost definitely bots. They were folding and betting hands within fractions of a second.

If you come in during a hand it catches you up at lightning speed. You probably saw that. If the speed persisted they were just really fast players.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: tanerlorn on May 17, 2011, 11:49:35 PM
10 20 nl being played


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: anisoptera on May 17, 2011, 11:59:14 PM
10 20 nl being played

To be specific - 10/20 bitcents, not btc :) (not quite the crazy nosebleeds)


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Dangerhorse on May 19, 2011, 05:10:48 PM
Small bug?  You can't withdraw fractions of a bitcent apparently.  I had 1.0933 bitcoins and it would let me withdraw 1.09, but not 1.0933.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: anisoptera on May 19, 2011, 05:14:33 PM
Small bug?  You can't withdraw fractions of a bitcent apparently.  I had 1.0933 bitcoins and it would let me withdraw 1.09, but not 1.0933.


This is not a bug, the site calls this out as a limitation on the withdrawal page.

Well, I mean. Clearly it isn't a feature either, but we know about it and warn you on the site. Maybe we could send fractions as long as it's over a penny (to avoid your entire tx being eaten by fees), I'll look into it.

Another solution would be to buy in with your fractions and flip until you lose or have a whole penny :p


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Dangerhorse on May 19, 2011, 06:18:39 PM
The withdrawal page says the minimum withdrawal amount is 0.01 bitcoins (one bitcent), but that's not the same as saying that you can't withdraw fractions of a bitcent as part of a larger withdrawal.

Not a big deal, but maybe you want to clarify the warning (or else fix the issue for larger withdrawals).


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: anisoptera on May 19, 2011, 06:22:10 PM
The withdrawal page says the minimum withdrawal amount is 0.01 bitcoins (one bitcent), but that's not the same as saying that you can't withdraw fractions of a bitcent as part of a larger withdrawal.

Not a big deal, but maybe you want to clarify the warning (or else fix the issue for larger withdrawals).


Yeah, I can see that. I'll look into it. Thanks :)


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: cmondegens on May 26, 2011, 05:57:50 PM
Cmon degens spread the word. With the government now going after the smaller sites (bodog, cake, etc) this is now the only option for people in the us to decide whether they want to voluntarily play a card game. Get this thing running through tor, fast, and get it up and promote, promote, promote. p5s, 2p2, etc, cmon we are all born with human rights...lets not let them take this away from us.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: cmondegens on May 26, 2011, 06:00:01 PM
This is quoted from another forum, in a discussion regarding whether or not weapons should be sold on that forum. These are the type of people we have supporting us. Cmon we can do this.

Quote
I think it's a great idea.   GPS dead drops of weapons will give us the money and force we need to maintain
staying power as the united states economy crumbles.   Think about what crime did for the USSR after they fell apart.
   It's why we have WMZ today.

There is no reason to avoid this opportunity, or to be so happy puppy rainbow hopscotch lollipop sunday surprise
 that we can presume that good vibes will keep us safe forever.   we should be protecting our interests and be
openly preparing to militarise our highly mobile cellular based units so that our ideological suit has potential
 to survive in the upcoming tempest.

ignoring the obvious is a fatal position.

I think you're missing the forum for the trees, admin.    Half liberty is not liberty, and the ugly fact is
that the truth about what freedom actually means doesn't necessarily resonate with most.   If you're trying
to win a popularity contest you can bet that running a huge public international drug vending site isn't going
 to get you far.

also: isn't it interesting that most of our thoughts expressed publicly on this site are going to end up in the
minds of the opposing force?    That's sort of neat, isn't it?   I wonder if they're keen on memetic warfare, yet?
   Planting dangerous seeds like "love everyone" seems like a blast to me, all abyssal gazing aside.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: tanerlorn on May 28, 2011, 07:30:06 PM
4 handed 4btc action


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: tanerlorn on May 31, 2011, 07:28:34 AM
oma freaking ha


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: tomcollins on June 04, 2011, 03:50:31 PM
Now that the price of BTC has gone up so much, 1BTC max rake seems a bit high ($17!).  It is rare that a pot will get that large, but it is scaring some people away.  The 1% rake structure is extremely fair.  Perhaps make a .4 BTC (40 chip) max rake now (.2BTC HU - 20 chip) ?


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: eof on June 04, 2011, 03:57:19 PM
1% upto 5 BB would be super fair.

Live casinos, which have the worst rake are typically 10% upto $4 or $5 depending on the limit.



Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: tomcollins on June 04, 2011, 04:07:17 PM
1% upto 5 BB would be super fair.

Live casinos, which have the worst rake are typically 10% upto $4 or $5 depending on the limit.



It's 10 BB now, which isn't even that bad (you only get that when you have a 1000BB pot, which is super hard to get).  But the cap of $17 is real high.  You'll have $10 rake if you ever have a $1000 pot, which is pretty steep.

I bet if you went through the hand histories, there was never a hand where more than $5 USD was ever taken, so it's not like it would really change anything other than not scare people away.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: anisoptera on June 04, 2011, 04:29:16 PM
If BTC continues to be valued so high for a while, we'll probably adjust the cap down, like we did previously. As I said the last time this came up - no one plays high enough to hit the cap anyway, so we can wait and see what happens to the market.

After all, it could just be a bubble. ;)


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: anisoptera on June 06, 2011, 07:03:39 AM
Latest update fixes omaha8 and re-enables mucking at showdown, since cards are now shown in hand histories.

Going in sometime this morning when the server gets restarted (while no one's playing, hopefully!)


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: luv2drnkbr on June 06, 2011, 10:06:32 AM
I'd love to test it out but the STT satellites at the series are so fucking soft, I'm spending almost every waking moment at the Rio.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: anisoptera on June 06, 2011, 03:26:23 PM
So jealous.

Maybe next year we'll be running WSOP satellites ;)


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: tanerlorn on June 07, 2011, 06:02:11 PM
Hand history a little off one of the aces shows up as Ax, I think its the Ad?

And 20bb min buy still isn't on.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Micon on June 07, 2011, 08:07:27 PM
Hand history a little off one of the aces shows up as Ax, I think its the Ad?

And 20bb min buy still isn't on.

lololol hi HIV!  I heart bitcoin poker so hard.

good fucking job everyone involved with this, I would be glad to help out.  My name is Bryan Micon and I run a site called donkdown, it's an uncensored poker forum and podcast.  we discussed bitcoins / betco.in towards the end of our Monday 6/6/11 episode.

keep up the good work boys. 


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: luv2drnkbr on June 09, 2011, 06:03:34 AM
Yay Micon found bitcoins!!!!!  God there is going to be an AVALANCHE in buying up bitcoins when American poker pros find bitcoin.  MtGox prices will go up $100 overnight.  I sure hope bitcoin poker takes off.  Plus bitcoins>>exchanges>>Moneybookers/WMZ/ucash>>poker sites means that dedicated Americans don't just have to move or not play, even if they want to play with crummy old USD.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: anisoptera on June 10, 2011, 08:18:25 AM
Fixed the Ax/Ad thing.

Also added ratholing protection (whenever the next server restart happens).


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: TheBitMan on June 12, 2011, 12:10:56 AM
Anyone up for lotto?
http://lnk.co/BitcoinLotto
Hopefully add some gambling in the future!
Working on more features like game now!


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: anisoptera on June 12, 2011, 12:35:21 AM
Thanks for spamming our thread with yet another lottery.

How about you actually develop a game before you start advertising?


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: TheBitMan on June 12, 2011, 12:49:38 AM
Thanks for spamming our thread with yet another lottery.

How about you actually develop a game before you start advertising?
I actually need help making the game...


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: anisoptera on June 12, 2011, 12:52:21 AM
Oh, good.

Hey guys I have this great idea for a game. I just need a programmer, and an artist, and....

but apart from all the work, I can do everything else!


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: TheBitMan on June 12, 2011, 12:59:39 AM
Oh, good.

Hey guys I have this great idea for a game. I just need a programmer, and an artist, and....

but apart from all the work, I can do everything else!
that hurt im not gonna lie, I can do the art actually I just don't know programing...


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: anisoptera on June 12, 2011, 01:01:41 AM
On the upside, all the free bumps are kind of nice.  :P


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: tanerlorn on June 12, 2011, 10:06:31 PM
Free bumps, you say?


edit: OH OH OH? RATHOLING NOW DISABLED


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: dkehler on June 12, 2011, 10:21:12 PM
What's with all the freezing?  Three times today (my first day).


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: tanerlorn on June 18, 2011, 05:36:29 AM
free bump


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: tanerlorn on June 20, 2011, 06:14:54 AM
In times like these we must remember there are upstanding members of the community like hippich, who when was hacked, instantly was communicative and returned all balances. Let's hope magical does the same.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: thundertoe on June 20, 2011, 06:31:36 AM
had fun playing there today. stakes confused me at first. .10/.25 is main table going lately and at 17$ a bitcoin is like 2/4, or 2 cent/ 4 cent for those not used to poker lingo.

come join the fun at the penny poker tables!


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on June 20, 2011, 12:39:46 PM
In times like these we must remember there are upstanding members of the community like hippich, who when was hacked, instantly was communicative and returned all balances. Let's hope magical does the same.

Thanks. Although, it was much lighter issue back then =) But lesson learned and no big balances left on server.

But still, I believe it's owner of the coins who should be responsible for most coins. Keep only minimal amount you use on third party services (including mine). The rest - in safe place. It's just a good idea. Hacker will have to work much more to hack individual users instead one centralized place.

ps: fixed _possible_ csrf issue right after heard about all these issues with mtgox.
pps: I recommend people to change their passwords on betco.in if you used same password on mtgox.com.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Bind on June 20, 2011, 06:02:14 PM
I went in to watch but it kicked me out after a couple minutes.

Is there a way we can observe without getting kicked out ?

so we can learn the ropes a bit.

I love poker but I never played the holdem.

Just regular poker.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on June 20, 2011, 06:04:26 PM
It supposed to allow you to keep window with table open without being sit any amount of time. If it "kicks out" - this probably a bug. To see why this happens I need to know more information. The best will be to see log from Console from Developer Tools in Chrome or FireBug in FireFox.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: curtism74 on June 21, 2011, 06:33:48 AM
It supposed to allow you to keep window with table open without being sit any amount of time. If it "kicks out" - this probably a bug. To see why this happens I need to know more information. The best will be to see log from Console from Developer Tools in Chrome or FireBug in FireFox.
I've watched plenty with Chrome and haven't had any problems.
But there seems to be a problem joining a table at the moment, heres the message:

Lost connection to the poker server. Click to retry.
{"xhr":"{\"status\":500,\"responseText\":\"Traceback (most recent call last):\\n  File \\\"/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/twisted/internet/base.py\\\", line 778, in runUntilCurrent\\n    call.func(*call.args, **call.kw)\\n  File \\\"/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/pokernetwork/pokeravatar.py\\\", line 381, in longPollDeferredTimeout\\n    d.callback(packets)\\n  File \\\"/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/twisted/internet/defer.py\\\", line 280, in callback\\n    self._startRunCallbacks(result)\\n  File \\\"/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/twisted/internet/defer.py\\\", line 354, in _startRunCallbacks\\n    self._runCallbacks()\\n---  ---\\n  File \\\"/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/twisted/internet/defer.py\\\", line 371, in _runCallbacks\\n    self.result = callback(self.result, *args, **kw)\\n  File \\\"/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/pokernetwork/pokersite.py\\\", line 255, in render\\n    session.site.updateSession(session)\\n  File \\\"/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/pokernetwork/pokersite.py\\\", line 483, in updateSession\\n    serial = session.avatar.getSerial()\\nexceptions.AttributeError: Session instance has no attribute 'avatar'\\n\",\"readyState\":4}","status":"error","url":"/POKER_REST","error":"Internal Server Error"}attempt to stringify failed with exception: ReferenceError: printStackTrace is not defined


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on June 21, 2011, 12:43:43 PM
Thanks for reporting this. I will put this into issues list.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: MilkMan on June 21, 2011, 08:39:03 PM
Is there any way we can get a daily, weekly, and/or monthly tournament going ? I think it would attract new members and get more people people, like the old ones on PokerStars. Actually anything you emulate from PokerStars is a good idea but a daily No Limit Hold em tournament that starts at the same time every day would be beneficial to all parties involved.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Fjordbit on June 22, 2011, 04:04:20 AM
I just wanted to say thanks. I finally have enough mining going that I get to .01 on deepbit. I was able to put it over to your site and had a good time on the .0001/.0002 tables. It's way more fun than the free sites where jackasses come in and just push their daily coins all in. Great job!


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: gboytazzz on June 23, 2011, 11:52:37 PM
yes i love this site !!! 1btc will last me weeks  :)  :)  ;D ive had some nice pots too its purely entertainment for me while im bored at work lol ....

sidenotes:

the tourny idea mention above me is a great idea !!!!
not sure if this is a bug but while playing if me and another play both go all the way ( all 5 cards on board) there are times it wont show what they had and i would like to know what i lost too...
not a big deal but having an "all-in" button would be nice.


ill think of more once i start playing more again lost all my chips today  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: foggyb on June 24, 2011, 12:22:32 AM
When are we getting NLHE STT and MTT?


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: h2ofusion on June 24, 2011, 06:34:37 AM
Hey great work.  I love the site.  I've gone from 13 BTC all the way down to .5 BTC the past few days. It's been a roller coaster of fun.  By the way, I recently tried to withdraw a certain amount of BTC and I got the message that the withdrawal was under review.  All the other times I withdrew bitcoins I had the message that they were sent right away.  Is there some threshold where over a certain amount it needs a review? It kinda worries me that my BTC's are in limbo and there is no way to see your list of withdrawals on the site.

 I think a separate page with a list of all your Deposits and Withdraws would be nice.

Again, great work, keep up the updates.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on June 24, 2011, 02:26:23 PM
It is not under any type of review. I setup cron script which send away most of coins from server. If server unable to send coins right away - it will tell you. Once this happens I go to admin panel, look for not processed withdrawal and send em from local wallet. That's it =) I understand that this can be annoying but  I once lost 680 btc due everything being automated and security vulnerability exposed =)  Just processed all unprocessed withdrawals.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Intertreuton on June 24, 2011, 09:36:18 PM
Hello,
my  1st. question is: How will you know me as the sender of the BTCif I choose another adress than the emergency one? I do not get it..please enlighten me  ;D
2nd one: I do not see any 0.01 tables , I see only 0.1 to 0.2 tables. Maybe I understand sthg wrong? Can you name me a table with lower bets? I am not a natural english speaker so maybe I am getting the decription wrong.
Thanks!


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on June 24, 2011, 09:39:51 PM
Hello,
my question is: How will you know me as the sender of the BTCif I choose another adress than the emergency one? I do not get it..please enlighten me  ;D

Each account have uniq btc address. All money sent to this address will be deposited to your account. Emergency address is for case when some disaster happen (read, some government agency do a raid to data center and steal whole rack of servers instead of just one offending... =)). Server stores only small amount of bitcoins. Therefore it will be possible to return most of 'em in case of server problems.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Intertreuton on June 24, 2011, 09:43:46 PM
Thanks for quick reply, was just editing my post with a 2nd question and here you are....
and just saw my mistake, it was about the . before the number, so now I got it.
In Germany we use 0,00 and not 0.00, that had confused me.
Thanks!


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on June 24, 2011, 09:44:45 PM
0.01 - 0.02 - is lowest possible table.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Intertreuton on June 24, 2011, 09:46:49 PM
0.01 - 0.02 - is lowest possible table.

Yupp, got it!


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Fjordbit on June 27, 2011, 07:18:23 AM
0.01 - 0.02 - is lowest possible table.

Yupp, got it!

Note that's .01/.02 "chips" which is really .0001/.0002 btc. I still get a little messed up when I'm thinking about my bets "is this pot worth $2 or 2 cents?" :)


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: pokermon919 on June 27, 2011, 08:06:48 AM
I wrote an email suggesting  Sit N Go tourneys. Just wanted to be annoying cause I'm drunk sorry. Enjoying the site very much btw.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: iopq on June 27, 2011, 12:06:10 PM
I'm playing 3/6 as we speak
this is a cool project, I put some money on the site

the interface is not very responsive, however
also, I would like the option to wait for the big blind to come around instead of posting


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: 2weiX on June 28, 2011, 06:10:15 PM
can you pleeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaseeeeeeeeeee make players' timebank a little SMALLER? plays like molasses.


other than that: GREAT WORK!


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on June 28, 2011, 06:11:59 PM
can you pleeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaseeeeeeeeeee make players' timebank a little SMALLER? plays like molasses.

other than that: GREAT WORK!

Thanks for feedback! =)

As for time bank - each table have 5 limits. 1 - slowest, 5 - fastest (make sure you are on a good connection to server to play at table 5). Just browse available tables on the left and sit at one you like =)


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: tomcollins on June 28, 2011, 07:25:22 PM
I wrote an email suggesting  Sit N Go tourneys. Just wanted to be annoying cause I'm drunk sorry. Enjoying the site very much btw.

SNG will be hard to pull off since getting 10 players to play the same limit is tough enough.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: foggyb on June 28, 2011, 07:32:55 PM
I wrote an email suggesting  Sit N Go tourneys. Just wanted to be annoying cause I'm drunk sorry. Enjoying the site very much btw.

SNG will be hard to pull off since getting 10 players to play the same limit is tough enough.

You're thinking backwards.

SNG are very popular. I don't play there now because SNG are not offered. Its my favorite format.

SNG does not have to be 10-max. 6-max and 2-player are just as popular.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: tysat on June 28, 2011, 07:34:50 PM
I wrote an email suggesting  Sit N Go tourneys. Just wanted to be annoying cause I'm drunk sorry. Enjoying the site very much btw.

SNG will be hard to pull off since getting 10 players to play the same limit is tough enough.

You're thinking backwards.

SNG are very popular. I don't play there now because SNG are not offered. Its my favorite format.

I second this, SNG tournaments are great.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: anisoptera on July 02, 2011, 03:18:22 AM
SNG is definitely something we are working on, as are MTTs.



Next server restart will bring a long-awaited change. That's right, the raise amount now actually makes sense!

And we know what a bet is, we promise :)


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: bitbetter on July 02, 2011, 03:40:34 AM
I've found bitcoins only month ago, but it really represents something I thought about. And I really like the fact this is open source project.

As a first my project where I am going to use bitcoins - I created poker room which accept bitcoins and only bitcoins.

Address of the project - https://betco.in

Any discussion are welcome!

I hate hijacking threads, but I have, at least, something relevant to add. BitBetter.org is also conducting poker games, but with no rake. You win, you get the whole pot. Check us out if you're bored and you love poker. 10 people max, can do high/low bitcoin buy-ins.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: pokermon919 on July 02, 2011, 10:00:55 PM
I just woke up and I need my poker fix!!! This update (in my head) is taking too long! Need poker fix now!


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: anisoptera on July 02, 2011, 10:33:23 PM
Back up now. Sorry about that!


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: foggyb on July 03, 2011, 01:02:21 AM
Can we see 5-player sit-and-gos where the top three players win prizes. 

3rd place wins 20% of pool, 2nd place wins 30% of pool and first place wins 50% of the pool (5 entry fees = pool)

This model can be used with any price buy-in  Buyins could be 1 BTC, 2, BTC, 5 BTC, 10 BTC, 20 BTC, ect. ect. 



Any special reason for 5 player? 6 is standard.



Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: pokermon919 on July 03, 2011, 08:26:46 AM
down again darn..


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: h2ofusion on July 03, 2011, 10:07:12 AM
I'm hoping that us that were playing while the site was down don't get screwed out of our chips that we won during the maintenance.  Other than that, keep up the good work with fixing bugs and such.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: pokermon919 on July 03, 2011, 07:16:13 PM
any idea when the site will be back up?


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: bitbetter on July 04, 2011, 12:04:40 AM
Can we see 5-player sit-and-gos where the top three players win prizes.

3rd place wins 20% of pool, 2nd place wins 30% of pool and first place wins 50% of the pool (5 entry fees = pool)

This model can be used with any price buy-in  Buyins could be 1 BTC, 2, BTC, 5 BTC, 10 BTC, 20 BTC, ect. ect. 




The odds are better, the payout is much more inviting, and its just a more casual format.
5-mans were the old-school way sites did things.  it be nice to see some 5-mans going on.

Thanks for the consideration

Here: http://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=25622.msg318849#msg318849 (http://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=25622.msg318849#msg318849)

You can run what ever type of game you want, even tournaments where the top players win certain amounts. In fact, you can even make a rake and keep it yourself.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: anisoptera on July 04, 2011, 01:17:36 AM
Could you please at least try to keep the spam to once per page? I mean, twice in five posts? Really?

Anyway...

Server's back up, nobody lost anything! Sorry about the downtime.

Basically, we discovered a data corruption issue had made its way into production - it only corrupted the backend in specific scenarios; everything in memory was fine, until we took the server down. But it was logging errors when this happened; all the data we needed just had to be parsed back out of the logs.

So we locked the site to prevent anyone else from getting on, gracefully took the site down, worked out a fix (I haven't gotten much sleep or time with my family this weekend), restored the data (look ma, no rollback!) and now we're back up.

Thanks for flying betco.in! :D

Next up on my priority list is definitely tournaments - especially STTs. I'll be working on a more flexible way to create new tables at the same time. People who like obscure tournament formats will enjoy what's coming :)


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: tomcollins on July 04, 2011, 01:50:35 AM
Paying 3 players in a 5 player tourney is awful.

Winner take all!  Or if you must, 2 players paid, 60%-40%.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 04, 2011, 04:35:53 PM
Accept my cashout asap please.

You could save your time if instead of contacting me over email + private message + icq + here by reading what site says you when you do withdrawal. To make sure you read it this time - it says that withdrawal will be processed within 24 hours.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: pokermon919 on July 06, 2011, 07:25:46 AM
suggestion: when there is a showdown the loser shouldn't be able to muck their hand. Although its recorded in the  hand history its a pain that i had to go through it to see what my opponent was playing with.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: anisoptera on July 06, 2011, 07:46:51 AM
suggestion: when there is a showdown the loser shouldn't be able to muck their hand. Although its recorded in the  hand history its a pain that i had to go through it to see what my opponent was playing with.

The loser is able to muck their hand if the winning hand is shown first. This is standard for all poker rooms.

You're able to see the hand because those hands are available on request in all poker rooms.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Micon on July 06, 2011, 10:18:57 AM
bug -- guy bet 22 or something on the river, i had 29 left or something and tried to click raise button, but it wouldn't take - after clicking it a dozen times i was timing out and clicked call, which worked...  just an fyi


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: 2weiX on July 06, 2011, 01:01:20 PM
bug -- guy bet 22 or something on the river, i had 29 left or something and tried to click raise button, but it wouldn't take - after clicking it a dozen times i was timing out and clicked call, which worked...  just an fyi

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betting_in_poker#Incomplete_bet_or_raise


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 06, 2011, 01:02:25 PM
bug -- guy bet 22 or something on the river, i had 29 left or something and tried to click raise button, but it wouldn't take - after clicking it a dozen times i was timing out and clicked call, which worked...  just an fyi

Could you please find hand # in My Account - Hands history for this game? Sounds like a bug.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: 2weiX on July 06, 2011, 01:02:54 PM
can you pleeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaseeeeeeeeeee make players' timebank a little SMALLER? plays like molasses.

other than that: GREAT WORK!

Thanks for feedback! =)

As for time bank - each table have 5 limits. 1 - slowest, 5 - fastest (make sure you are on a good connection to server to play at table 5). Just browse available tables on the left and sit at one you like =)

Thing is - there's only ever one to three tables occuped AT ALL when i play (I'm on European Summer Time).

So I dont have much of a choice, really. Just get rid of the two slowest, if you would?


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 06, 2011, 01:04:38 PM
well.. i can't rid of them 'cos some people like slow play.. Just sit at fast table and may be join slow table and offer player to join fast table.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: 2weiX on July 06, 2011, 01:10:12 PM
well.. i can't rid of them 'cos some people like slow play.. Just sit at fast table and may be join slow table and offer player to join fast table.

it's gotten to the point where of 9 other players, 5 take the FULL time to make a decision. reallyfuckingsucks.com !


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: tanerlorn on July 06, 2011, 07:11:38 PM
bug -- guy bet 22 or something on the river, i had 29 left or something and tried to click raise button, but it wouldn't take - after clicking it a dozen times i was timing out and clicked call, which worked...  just an fyi

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betting_in_poker#Incomplete_bet_or_raise

Regarding this bug, it has nothing to do with this link you posted. The link is about reopening the betting action.

Micon is saying that he had 29 chips left on river, opponent bet 22 to him and he could only call or fold, not raise his last 7 more chips.

I can confirm that this bug is indeed happening since the last update. You can recreate it yourself easily, just go to a table with two test accounts, and get in a similar situation on the river, where you bet more than half your opponent's stack. Try differing amounts, I'm not sure if it works with all different amounts, but I have had this happen to me several times now since the last server restart.

Also, another bug since the last server restart is sometimes you can't even raise allin when its a big raise size. Example: opponent has 1000 chips on river, I have 1000. He bets 25, I try to raise to 1000 but when I click raise the raise button doesn't process. I try over and over again to raise to 1000 but it doesn't work, I move the bar slightly down to 998 and it works. Or any other amount or clicking call works, just raising allin doesn't. I think it may have something to do with the superfluous fractions of chip that are kept in player chipstacks, like when you have 1000.25 and you bet allin it only bets 1000, and then the other player can raise you and then you have the option to call with your last 0.25 chips allin, or fold. I'm not sure if these bugs happen every time but I can confirm they have happened multiple times.

Also, a little more info on the freezes, freezing seems to be highly dependent on clicking rebuy, I freeze maybe 20% of the time when I click rebuy, as compared to 1% of the time normally.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 06, 2011, 07:22:45 PM
iamhiv, thank you for your info. First also said that he got disappeared buttons after Rebuy, so I assume this is right way to dig it. Will test this locally.

As for unable to raise - sounds like you are correct - some small part is being rounded wrong way somewhere. Will look into this as well.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: FreeMoney on July 06, 2011, 07:52:16 PM
bug -- guy bet 22 or something on the river, i had 29 left or something and tried to click raise button, but it wouldn't take - after clicking it a dozen times i was timing out and clicked call, which worked...  just an fyi

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betting_in_poker#Incomplete_bet_or_raise

You can move all in for less.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: FreeMoney on July 06, 2011, 07:53:42 PM
well.. i can't rid of them 'cos some people like slow play.. Just sit at fast table and may be join slow table and offer player to join fast table.

it's gotten to the point where of 9 other players, 5 take the FULL time to make a decision. reallyfuckingsucks.com !

Start 30 second games?

But really this is why sites have a normal time and a time bank. Sometimes you need extra time, but that's no reason to give every time.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: pokermon919 on July 06, 2011, 08:06:36 PM
suggestion: when there is a showdown the loser shouldn't be able to muck their hand. Although its recorded in the  hand history its a pain that i had to go through it to see what my opponent was playing with.

The loser is able to muck their hand if the winning hand is shown first. This is standard for all poker rooms.

You're able to see the hand because those hands are available on request in all poker rooms.

if there is a showdown the loser shouldn't be able to muck the losing hand.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 06, 2011, 08:09:02 PM
suggestion: when there is a showdown the loser shouldn't be able to muck their hand. Although its recorded in the  hand history its a pain that i had to go through it to see what my opponent was playing with.

The loser is able to muck their hand if the winning hand is shown first. This is standard for all poker rooms.

You're able to see the hand because those hands are available on request in all poker rooms.

if there is a showdown the loser shouldn't be able to muck the losing hand.

We were discussing this a lot. We came to conclusion that to take good from both approaches, we will allow to muck loosing hand, but show full hands in history.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: pokermon919 on July 06, 2011, 08:16:24 PM
suggestion: when there is a showdown the loser shouldn't be able to muck their hand. Although its recorded in the  hand history its a pain that i had to go through it to see what my opponent was playing with.

The loser is able to muck their hand if the winning hand is shown first. This is standard for all poker rooms.

You're able to see the hand because those hands are available on request in all poker rooms.

if there is a showdown the loser shouldn't be able to muck the losing hand.

We were discussing this a lot. We came to conclusion that to take good from both approaches, we will allow to muck loosing hand, but show full hands in history.

what good would there be to allow the losing hand to muck when there is a showdown? You just making more than half the ppl go through hand history when it doesn't need to be that way.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 06, 2011, 08:20:38 PM
in real life you are allowed to muck loosing hand if you are after winning hand. the bluff is huge part of the game and mucking hand is important part of it. In online poker it would be good to have option to see mucked hand in order to prevent misuse of this feature.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: anisoptera on July 06, 2011, 08:47:32 PM
what good would there be to allow the losing hand to muck when there is a showdown? You just making more than half the ppl go through hand history when it doesn't need to be that way.

Please find me a single online poker site where it doesn't work that way. It's easier to code it the way you want, by the way - all the other sites wrote code to make it work this way, same as we did.

The point of mucking is to, well, muck your hand. In a real poker room it's considered poor etiquette to ask to see someone's mucked cards, but you're allowed to. So online, you have to take extra steps to get the cards.



Pushed a fix for the all-in issue. Once it's on the server, you should be able to hit Raise and have it work no matter what.

The bet input box now works as well. So, when the slider doesn't quite get you there (i.e. you have that extra .25 in your stack), just type in a larger number than you actually have. The client will bet the maximum possible in that case.

This is the quick-fix - I have a better solution for the all-in issue but it needs more testing than this one, and it's kind of important to fix, so you get the monkeypatch first :)


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Trayber on July 07, 2011, 07:27:44 AM
suggestion: when there is a showdown the loser shouldn't be able to muck their hand. Although its recorded in the  hand history its a pain that i had to go through it to see what my opponent was playing with.

The loser is able to muck their hand if the winning hand is shown first. This is standard for all poker rooms.

You're able to see the hand because those hands are available on request in all poker rooms.

if there is a showdown the loser shouldn't be able to muck the losing hand.

You obviously havent played live poker before. Like the admins state its poor etiquette to demand to see the losing hand. This is not a tournament where in All-in situations players have to show their cards face up. This is a cash game it is not required. Also, I'd like to ask you to stop berating the bad players on the site when you go back and look at their losing hands and making fun of them in the chat box. I have seen you do this alot and I say nothing when a bad player plays bad cards because I don't want them to leave or change how they are playing. Kid you have a lot of growing up to do. Get out of your moms basement and become a man.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Fjordbit on July 07, 2011, 06:05:46 PM
Also, I'd like to ask you to stop berating the bad players on the site when you go back and look at their losing hands and making fun of them in the chat box. I have seen you do this alot and I say nothing when a bad player plays bad cards because I don't want them to leave or change how they are playing.

Amen. The one thing I don't like about the site is the culture. I beat people and they yell at me that I'm a bad poker player. If you think someone is bad, then just play them. They are probably just having fun while you're making money.

(note I don't think pokermon919 did this to me, but it is a common issue with the players there, calling out "fish" etc)


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: luv2drnkbr on July 08, 2011, 09:49:15 AM
x-post from new real tangible physical bitcoin coin (https://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=24983.0;all) that seemed appropriate here:

Quote
So I've been at the Rio pretty much 24/7 during the World Series of Poker.  I got a new card protector in the mail today...  what do you guys think??..

http://i.imgur.com/y217W.jpg

And using it to spread the word about Bitcoin:

http://i.imgur.com/JrXqk.jpg


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: 2weiX on July 08, 2011, 04:54:49 PM
x-post from new real tangible physical bitcoin coin (https://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=24983.0;all) that seemed appropriate here:

Quote
So I've been at the Rio pretty much 24/7 during the World Series of Poker.  I got a new card protector in the mail today...  what do you guys think??..

http://i.imgur.com/y217W.jpg

And using it to spread the word about Bitcoin:

http://i.imgur.com/JrXqk.jpg


subtle braggery!


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Melbustus on July 09, 2011, 08:28:26 PM
suggestion: when there is a showdown the loser shouldn't be able to muck their hand. Although its recorded in the  hand history its a pain that i had to go through it to see what my opponent was playing with.

The loser is able to muck their hand if the winning hand is shown first. This is standard for all poker rooms.

You're able to see the hand because those hands are available on request in all poker rooms.

if there is a showdown the loser shouldn't be able to muck the losing hand.

You obviously havent played live poker before. Like the admins state its poor etiquette to demand to see the losing hand. This is not a tournament where in All-in situations players have to show their cards face up. This is a cash game it is not required. Also, I'd like to ask you to stop berating the bad players on the site when you go back and look at their losing hands and making fun of them in the chat box. I have seen you do this alot and I say nothing when a bad player plays bad cards because I don't want them to leave or change how they are playing. Kid you have a lot of growing up to do. Get out of your moms basement and become a man.


Agreed about berating the bad players, but on all the big online sites, any player dealt into the hand (cash or tourney) can easily see an opponent's mucked showdown hand. Yes, it's a different culture than live games, where as you note, it is indeed poor etiquette to ask (though you always have the option). There are a lot of "cultural" differences between online and live play, and this is one of them. Given that we're talking about an online poker room, I'd argue that the online culture/status-quo is what most readily applies.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: done on July 09, 2011, 09:34:45 PM
fun site


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: anisoptera on July 11, 2011, 03:01:15 AM
Agreed about berating the bad players, but on all the big online sites, any player dealt into the hand (cash or tourney) can easily see an opponent's mucked showdown hand.

After they bring up the hand history. It's not displayed at the table.



The client will now never post the BB out of position; it will always wait for the BB to come around before auto-posting.

In the future, of course, you'll be able to select whether you want to auto-post blinds and also whether you want to post OOP. But for now, this seemed like the most sensible choice. :)


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: PandaMiner on July 14, 2011, 09:14:33 AM
The client will now never post the BB out of position; it will always wait for the BB to come around before auto-posting.

I noticed. I didn't like it before hand.

Also, I'm having problems when trying to make a withdraw.  Say I have 2.86 BTC, and I want to take a portion out, like 1.5, it doesn't let me.  I can take out 1, or 2, but not the decimals?


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 14, 2011, 01:13:13 PM
Also, I'm having problems when trying to make a withdraw.  Say I have 2.86 BTC, and I want to take a portion out, like 1.5, it doesn't let me.  I can take out 1, or 2, but not the decimals?

Non decimals should work fine. Did you receive message that your withdrawal needs additional processing or it did not go through at all?


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: PandaMiner on July 14, 2011, 08:53:51 PM
Also, I'm having problems when trying to make a withdraw.  Say I have 2.86 BTC, and I want to take a portion out, like 1.5, it doesn't let me.  I can take out 1, or 2, but not the decimals?

Non decimals should work fine. Did you receive message that your withdrawal needs additional processing or it did not go through at all?

That's what I'm saying, non-decimals are fine, but the actual decimals aren't fine.

It errors out.. says something about "wrong number." I can't remember.

EDIT:

I think I figured it out....  You know how it has your chips balance, and then your BTC balance in parenthesis? Well, the BTC balance is ROUNDED to the nearest bit cent.  So, I had 285.75 chips and (2.86 ฿). So, when I tried to take out coins, I put 1.86 btc, but that's wrong. I should have put 1.85 btc. (I wanted to leave 1 coin in there)

So, when your script is rounding UP, the btc balance in essence, is wrong. It won't let you take out that amount. When it's rounding DOWN, there's no problem.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 14, 2011, 08:56:23 PM
That's very strange, since I approved batch of withdrawal today and 90% of them are x.xx type of numbers.

just random thought - do you use dot or comma? never tried comma and pretty sure it will not work.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: PandaMiner on July 14, 2011, 09:03:35 PM
I edited my last post, but you probably won't see it unless I make this post.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 14, 2011, 09:05:20 PM
Ah. Now make sense. =)

Yeah, I need to go away from rounding to 2 digits after dot completely. It was laid down when software did not support more then 2 digits after dot =))


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: 2weiX on July 15, 2011, 06:38:03 AM
anyone know this site here: http://playbitcoinpoker.com/ ?
seems like a bit of a ripoff, to be honest.
no players, as well.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 15, 2011, 07:24:55 AM
looks like they just "took space". but i kinda like their design =)


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: pokermon919 on July 18, 2011, 03:21:52 PM
removed


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 18, 2011, 03:24:19 PM
prove it or shut up. it is simple.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: pokermon919 on July 18, 2011, 03:38:28 PM
removed.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: TheBitMan on July 18, 2011, 03:40:08 PM
The site can't freeze like it does...


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 18, 2011, 03:42:29 PM
so you're saying you checked the hand history if pigki and saw nothing wrong with his all in plays? Oh and then u came on the table to tell the remaining players to learn how to play when they had pigki beat 90% of the time, did you not say that?

exactly. what can you put on table to prove you are right? and i came to table because someone was sending me chats. i looked at how it was going on and after seeing you and other players accusing another guy of cheating - i stepped in. btw i still look over what you chat about even if i do not sit there...


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: pokermon919 on July 18, 2011, 03:45:11 PM
removed


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 18, 2011, 03:47:14 PM
let's make it easier for you. will you put your whole balance on what you tries to prove here? I have much more hands histories of this guy then you...


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 18, 2011, 03:52:14 PM
Don't get me wrong.. But this "case" took my 30 minuts (which cost a lot btw) and you convinced bunch of people that site is hackable and that one of players (who BTW do not have several accounts) is cheater. Will you put your balance where your mouth is?


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: pokermon919 on July 18, 2011, 03:56:01 PM
removed


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 18, 2011, 04:08:04 PM
and for me important two things: reputation of my website and reputation of my users.

i had issue with cheaters. but this one - is definitely not one.

so if you have something except "i have 10+ years of poker experience" put it down or shut up (or better for your karma - give apology to everyone you insulted).


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: pokermon919 on July 18, 2011, 05:09:04 PM
removed


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: pokermon919 on July 18, 2011, 05:11:09 PM
removed.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 18, 2011, 05:16:56 PM
Quote
I'm not trying to say your site is compromised or anything like that at all

You did it several times.

Quote
I just wanted you to look into it but you spent 5 minutes or so on the table, declared everyone is a dumbass and left.

i spent 30 minutes analyzing hands and looking how y'all playing and then stepped in just to ask you stop saying he is cheater. I do not have to sit at the table to see hands, nor see table playing nor to see chats.

here is ultimate prove he is fair player: his total deposits were lower then he withdraw in total. Do you think if he could find such a hole in the site he will be leaving room with less then he came in?

Once again, to not look like a dumb, do not accuse people of cheating ever without having evidence. (again - "10+ years of poker experience" - is not an evidence). This way you look like a child who lost and try to blame everybody except himself.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: pokermon919 on July 18, 2011, 05:41:14 PM
removed. Because of no contribution to the site.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: bitbetter on July 18, 2011, 08:42:24 PM
This guy is legit! I can confirm it. I know the previous comments have now been removed, but just thought I'd let any hapless person stumbling around this forum know. No reason not to trust this person.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: 2weiX on July 18, 2011, 08:43:41 PM
Hi all,

two things:


1) If someone really were to be convicted a cheater, you'd need to have massive mathematical / statistical evidence. The site's operator, of course, should always run a couple of these tools in the background against all players' hands and keep a kind of log (the more detailed, the better). All this just in case someone were to accuse a player or (ghasp) the site of collusion, h4x0rz or whatever. I am sure the guys ate the 2p2 forums will gladly provide the knowledge. It's for the sake of the site, really. No site can afford to be associated with cheaters (potripper/UB poker, anyone?). I also feel that I need to respectfully ask you to keep a professional attitude even towards the most unruly of customers. It seemed that spirits got a little hot last two days. I am glad, however, that things got sorted out :-D

2) Tonight, after sitting at Isgar3 and witnessing the cheating discussion wind down, I had the most fun at an online table I had in months. Just looking at the average pot of 104 at 40 hands/h might give a slight indication of this! The crowd was awesome, everyone was in good spirit and just getting their gamble on. This is how it should be!

Please keep promoting the site, i really enjoy the work you did!


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: pokermon919 on July 18, 2011, 08:49:43 PM
the freebie game is over haha. Maybe sometime in the future I will dick around and hand my chips away again. It was a pretty interesting little mini game that spawned out of no where lol quite fun indeed.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 18, 2011, 08:53:18 PM
2weiX, this is not walmart-type business, where customer can just come and start bashing everyone including owner, and leave unaffected. Treat this place as private club. If you have problems - contact me and we will resolve 'em (we already did before). this pokermon/superman/whatever_nicks_he_registered is simply troll, who can't even put his money where his mouth is. and instead of apology of his ontilt behavior, he just removes his posts.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: pokermon919 on July 18, 2011, 08:59:48 PM
uh no I ain't no troll I'm just a concerned player that saw something that is odd. Again I guess we will have to agree to disagree. Good day sir.

Edit: I removed the posts because I didn't want ppl to view your site as a illegitimate site. If you like I can post everything back.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: 2weiX on July 19, 2011, 01:51:57 PM
2weiX, this is not walmart-type business, where customer can just come and start bashing everyone including owner, and leave unaffected. Treat this place as private club. If you have problems - contact me and we will resolve 'em (we already did before). this pokermon/superman/whatever_nicks_he_registered is simply troll, who can't even put his money where his mouth is. and instead of apology of his ontilt behavior, he just removes his posts.

well, if you have hopes for bitcoin as i do, your business might become the pokerwalmart of bitcoin. wouldnt that be something? as of now, it's a teenie bittie tiny club. i hope it grows - and so will your responsibilities! start planning ahead! :-D

in the discussion i witnessed he offered to let it go and remove his posts. he followed thru. aside from whatever beef you got, that's cool in my book.

bitcoin is a nerdthing - nerds are known to have difficult personalities, to even not be "people persons" sometimes. as far as i can tell, he just lit up the table last night (night HERE, afternoon US). 100+ avg pots! look at the rake, and then tell me that doesnt get you smiling. i know the people at that table were!

anyhow - see you at the tables.



Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 19, 2011, 02:35:41 PM
well, if you have hopes for bitcoin as i do, your business might become the pokerwalmart of bitcoin. wouldnt that be something? as of now, it's a teenie bittie tiny club. i hope it grows - and so will your responsibilities! start planning ahead! :-D

I wish it become second PS, but even if it will get there - i will take a while. Right now I have very limited number of users and will not allow bashing lucky one just 'cos he went all in several times and won. This is small party and I would like to keep it friendly.

And just like I said before, any accusation of somebody of cheating - is accusation of my project being cheat-able. And since this is very small project - I care about what people says. Once it will be PS (fingers crossed =)) I and other players will not even notice guys like pokermon =) So problem will disappear by itself.


in the discussion i witnessed he offered to let it go and remove his posts. he followed thru. aside from whatever beef you got, that's cool in my book.

Most of the time I stay to what I said. I would like keep this in history so other people could expect certain things.

anyhow - see you at the tables.

I am really bad at poker =) For my history playing just on betco.in I lost about 300+ coins... That's too much for me. May be eventually at 0.01/0.02 tables... =)))


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Trayber on July 19, 2011, 02:50:39 PM
LOL at becoming the next Pokerstars. You are kidding right? Soon legislation will pass to legalize online poker in the US and then it will only be a matter of time before licenses are issued for poker rooms to open up. Then your site will be a complete ghost town. It almost already is except for a few die hards that want to play poker. I had fun on the site back when there was a lot of action a few weeks back but now its mostly filled up with nit regs who wait for kings or aces. The problems with lag, timing out, not seeing your cards was just too overwhelming to continue playing. Its also not fun when you get it all in preflop vs someone and you don't even get to see the board run out. It just tells you lost or won without any drama. You don't even get to see the cards to see how you lost until you muck the hand. Simply awful and not exciting. Also there seems to be  situations of people opening up multiple accounts and its just to anonymous for my liking. Many of your regs have multiple screen names or simply change them once they have played to long on one account so people cant quickly identify their playing style. It seems very hard to control security and creates situations for rampant cheating to exist. You seem like a good guy Hippich but this is not going to be the next pokerstars. Your only main appeal is to US players as foreigners don't need to play on a crappy software site like bitcoin poker they have many options to choose from the big name poker sites and most US players have no clue what bitcoins even are.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 19, 2011, 02:59:23 PM
trayber, my target is not being pokerstar. it would be nice, but believe me, i do software development for living, and i understand what it involves to get near PS level.

I just enjoy the ride building what i like. and this is primary reason why i reacted like this to pokermon accusations - this is very personal project.

Now, calm down and if you know any good developers (or may be you are the one one?!) who can hep with theses issues (not for free, but their changes will be available as a part of the whole open source project), give me a lead to them.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: 2weiX on July 19, 2011, 05:18:51 PM
Flipping OMAHA 8 on INSTIS 4


0,02 BTC STACKS!





Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Litt on July 20, 2011, 06:15:03 AM
I was not only threatened by the admin that he will lock my funds without any proof of wrong doing, the admin thinks the money is his once it's in the site for gameplay. I was accused of logging on multiple accounts and playing on the same table which I have never done. I only changed the account names and moved the funds. When I asked about being limited to only one account name, I did not even get a response. There is no way he can prove that I was playing in a same hand on two different accounts ever. If you can, I ask the admin to provide this proof.

The REAL issue was that I was using up the entire timer allowed each time I was given a turn because I use the style to throw people off that are impatient. Now admin obvious doesn't like this because hand/hour goes down and rake goes down. Apparently some people complained about my issue with taking my time, which I am allowed by design, and admin had the nerve to come in and accuse me of something I didn't do, then proceeded to make THREATS TO HOLD MY BTC LIKE IT WAS HIS TO KEEP! This is utter nonsense. What a pitiful joke... CAN YOU TRUST THIS SITE WITH YOUR MONEY?

Not only that This site is full of cheats and tag teaming idiots. Not to mention a huge A Hole for an admin who is infinitely immature and selfish with complete disregard to fairness and completely ignoring his own rules and design of software.

He thinks that he can have some kind of power over you because he is holding your funds. What a joke. DO NOT USE THIS SITE UNLESS YOU ARE OK WITH GETTING YOUR FUND LOCKED IF ADMIN FEELS LIKE IT. I'M DEFINITELY ACCUSING THE ADMIN OF ABUSING HIS OWNERSHIP OF THE SITE.

I would direct everyone to go to a much better built site. BTConTILT.com. This place is utter joke run by some angry guy who doesn't know how to run a real business.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 20, 2011, 06:23:26 AM
as i said before - this is private club. i want people to be nice to each other. if one player drives crazy 9 other players at the table - i will kick him out.

now, i never said you were using many account in the SAME time. I said you had more then one account. This is separate topic if this should be allowed or no, but I tend to agree it should be allowed as long as this is the only "problem" player cause to other players. In the end - nobody even will notice that.

Now, you were able to withdraw your funds. But if I would notice you using same account at the same time at the same table - believe me, your account would be locked before anyone complain. And yes - i will do what I feel right to do since I am _admin_ of the site.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Litt on July 20, 2011, 06:40:25 AM
as i said before - this is private club. i want people to be nice to each other. if one player drives crazy 9 other players at the table - i will kick him out.

now, i never said you were using many account in the SAME time. I said you had more then one account. This is separate topic if this should be allowed or no, but I tend to agree it should be allowed as long as this is the only "problem" player cause to other players. In the end - nobody even will notice that.

Now, you were able to withdraw your funds. But if I would notice you using same account at the same time at the same table - believe me, your account would be locked before anyone complain. And yes - i will do what I feel right to do since I am _admin_ of the site.

This is exactly what I'm talking about. You think you are trying to make it sound like you don't allow cheating, but you know exactly what you did and what you said to me. What utter nonsense this is... You trying to come here and trying to make it sounds like something other than your own greed and power tripping.

You think you can keep people's money if you feel like it because you are the admin which is wrong on so many levels for a poker site. And because you think this is OK, you feel that you can make THREATS to players saying you will close account without refund if they do anything that messes with your profit within your private poker club. WHAT MORON WOULD PLAY THERE?

Play at btcontilt.com where the admin doesn't make threats to keep your money because you are playing the way you want.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: anisoptera on July 20, 2011, 06:41:24 AM
You think you can keep people's money if you feel like it because you are the admin which is wrong on so many levels for a poker site. And because you think this is OK, you feel that you can make THREATS to players saying you will close account without refund if they do anything that messes with your profit within your private poker club. WHAT MORON WOULD PLAY THERE?

I dunno. A lot of people play at PokerStars and they have similar policies. Are they morons?


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 20, 2011, 06:47:44 AM
players saying you will close account without refund if they do anything that messes with your profit within your private poker club.

correction: messes with players playing here.



Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: 2weiX on July 20, 2011, 06:57:49 AM
You think you can keep people's money if you feel like it because you are the admin which is wrong on so many levels for a poker site. And because you think this is OK, you feel that you can make THREATS to players saying you will close account without refund if they do anything that messes with your profit within your private poker club. WHAT MORON WOULD PLAY THERE?

I dunno. A lot of people play at PokerStars and they have similar policies. Are they morons?


People played at Full Tilt, amirite? And no, they weren't. And yes, Full Tilt embezzled funds. The worlds #2 poker site! UB poker had a player who could see everyone else's holecards! I cannot blame anyone who plays on a "home-coded" site to at least be very attentive and maybe overcautious.


BTT:
If someone uses all their time bank every hand, let them. Move to a faster table. That's what I do, call people over there and play quicker. Worked fine last night! I personally hate it and I think it's rude to use this tactic, but hey, I'll waste my breath on other things.
 

Now even if it's a private club, the owner needs to be held to the highest standards and assure the safety and comfort of all players. This involves "proving" that nothing's wrong - chat histories, hand histories (for analysis for statistical anomalies) etc etc.

aren't we all libertarians at heart? isn't transparency what we strive to achieve?


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Litt on July 20, 2011, 08:09:06 AM
DOUBLE POST


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: anisoptera on July 20, 2011, 08:33:40 AM
As we all know, capital letters mean that people will definitely listen to what you have to say.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Litt on July 20, 2011, 08:56:16 AM
All I did was use up my timer and bet out small amounts when it was my turn. I did not do anything wrong or directly break any rules that were stated anywhere on the website.

Now tell me exactly how me taking my time betting using the timer on the site "abusing players"? Don't you mean "abusing your profits"? Am I not supposed to trying "abuse" other players and pressure them so I can win? What is this some poker fairytale?
 
If I'm playing to win, it's my job to make the position of the other players as uncomfortable as possible. You want me to play so that people like me on the site? Are you joking?
IT'S BAD ENOUGH THERE ARE CHEATING TAG TEAMS THERE ALL THE TIME PLAYING.

What rule do any other sites have regarding using their timer to the full extent and betting out in small amounts? If I have broken any rule, I would not be complaining. I apparently got on the admin's nerves for slowing down the rate and hands/hour along with a few players that couldn't handle the play-style of mine and cried about it to the admin on IRC. IT'S NOT ROCKET SCIENCE TO ME OR ANYONE ELSE THAT GREED WAS THE REASON FOR YOUR TANTRUM.

I NEVER logged on and played on multiple accounts, yet it is the FIRST THING ADMINS ACCUSES ME OF WRONG DOING PROCEEDED BY A THREAT TO CLOSE MY ACCOUNTS WITH FUNDS IN THEM. Admins then comes in and basically says here on the thread that I"m lucky I got the money out before I posted this while making some lame excuse about how if I actually did multi-logged then he would have ALREADY held the money. YES WE KNOW YOU WISH YOU HAD THE CHANCE TO KEEP MY MONEY. YOU JUST WANT AN EXCUSE TO DO IT. NO DIFFERENT THAN POLICE LOOKING FOR AN EXCUSE TO LOCK YOU UP OR SHOOT YOU FOR RESISTING ARREST. HOW PATHETIC YOU ARE. ABUSING THE LITTLE TINNNNNNNY BIT OF POWER YOU HAVE AS AN ADMIN OF A POKER WEB SITE THAT FILLS UP MAYBE TWO FULL TABLES ON A GOOD DAY. YOU ARE THE REASON WHY BITCOIN WAS CREATED AND THE CENTRAL BANKS BEHAVE THE WAY THEY DO. PATHETIC PARASITE.

if you are someone who knows how to critically think for yourself and not some drone, you would obviously see where I'm coming from. And I know people here will agree with me on this. I'm 100% not on the wrong here. Not even a little bit. Otherwise I would not be taking such extreme side. Consider this a valuable lesson in karma that you spoke so highly of in your previous posts.

The admin has proven time and time again on this very thread how childish and limited he is in his capacity is to think beyond justifying his obvious shortcomings in common sense.

I WOULD STAY FAR AWAY AS POSSIBLE FROM THIS PLACE IF YOU LIKE KEEPING YOUR MONEY.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: 2weiX on July 20, 2011, 09:17:08 AM
All I did was use up my timer and bet out small amounts when it was my turn. I did not do anything wrong or directly break any rules that were stated anywhere on the website.

Now tell me exactly how me taking my time betting using the timer on the site "abusing players"? Don't you mean "abusing your profits"? Am I not supposed to trying "abuse" other players and pressure them so I can win? What is this some poker fairytale?
 
If I'm playing to win, it's my job to make the position of the other players as uncomfortable as possible. You want me to play so that people like me on the site? Are you joking?
IT'S BAD ENOUGH THERE ARE CHEATING TAG TEAMS THERE ALL THE TIME PLAYING.

What rule do any other sites have regarding using their timer to the full extent and betting out in small amounts? If I have broken any rule, I would not be complaining. I apparently got on the admin's nerves for slowing down the rate and hands/hour along with a few players that couldn't handle the play-style of mine and cried about it to the admin on IRC. IT'S NOT ROCKET SCIENCE TO ME OR ANYONE ELSE THAT GREED WAS THE REASON FOR YOUR TANTRUM.

The timer is there so people can think if thought is needed or that people on bad connections dont get diso'd and have some time to reconnect before their hand is folded.

It is NOT REPEAT NOT the purpose of the clock to enable players to piss other players off and/or stall the game for strategic reasons. You are in fact, and I say this with all due neutrality "abusing" this function. While well within the scope of "legal" tactics, it's widely agreed upon that it sucks donkeyballs. Noone can do shit to stop you from doing it, but noone will want to play with you.

I did ask the admin to make the clock faster, he simply told me to go to another, quicker table and thats what I did. With the rake being as little as it is and with only two or so table open at any time I sincerely doubt that you're really interfering with the "profits" of the site, unless you were playing at a full table of 500/1000 No Limit ^^


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Litt on July 20, 2011, 09:48:44 AM
All I did was use up my timer and bet out small amounts when it was my turn. I did not do anything wrong or directly break any rules that were stated anywhere on the website.

Now tell me exactly how me taking my time betting using the timer on the site "abusing players"? Don't you mean "abusing your profits"? Am I not supposed to trying "abuse" other players and pressure them so I can win? What is this some poker fairytale?
 
If I'm playing to win, it's my job to make the position of the other players as uncomfortable as possible. You want me to play so that people like me on the site? Are you joking?
IT'S BAD ENOUGH THERE ARE CHEATING TAG TEAMS THERE ALL THE TIME PLAYING.

What rule do any other sites have regarding using their timer to the full extent and betting out in small amounts? If I have broken any rule, I would not be complaining. I apparently got on the admin's nerves for slowing down the rate and hands/hour along with a few players that couldn't handle the play-style of mine and cried about it to the admin on IRC. IT'S NOT ROCKET SCIENCE TO ME OR ANYONE ELSE THAT GREED WAS THE REASON FOR YOUR TANTRUM.

The timer is there so people can think if thought is needed or that people on bad connections dont get diso'd and have some time to reconnect before their hand is folded.

It is NOT REPEAT NOT the purpose of the clock to enable players to piss other players off and/or stall the game for strategic reasons. You are in fact, and I say this with all due neutrality "abusing" this function. While well within the scope of "legal" tactics, it's widely agreed upon that it sucks donkeyballs. Noone can do shit to stop you from doing it, but noone will want to play with you.

I did ask the admin to make the clock faster, he simply told me to go to another, quicker table and thats what I did. With the rake being as little as it is and with only two or so table open at any time I sincerely doubt that you're really interfering with the "profits" of the site, unless you were playing at a full table of 500/1000 No Limit ^^


Not trying to pick an argument as I see where your view is coming from, but where does it say that I cannot use the time that I am allowed? It's is exactly as you put it, "legal". If I need to take time on each bet, then I will use it every time. Just because "you" or anyone else think that it sucks "donkeyballs" still doesn't make it wrong. I am free to play as I please within the rules of the website and it's software. That is the end of the story. I did not cheat or do anything that was not allowed from the very beginning. Just because few people went crying to mommy doesn't mean it can all be turned upside down. In fact, the admin himself addressed much of the same issue about delays in the past by telling people to deal with it by going to shorter timer rooms, but why is it different this time including threats?

Oh I'm sure it was about money and nothing else. I know it because he told me first thing as he came in the room telling a LIE saying it was because I was "MULTI LOGGING" he was in there giving me the warning. I repeat, I NEVER multi logged and played a single hand on two accounts together EVER. This was CLEARLY NOT THE REAL REASON AND WE BOTH KNOW IT. He's now talking out of his ass saying he didn't say EXACTLY this. So if it is NOT this reason, then what is? MONEY OBVIOUSLY. In fact, when I asked directly back to the admin to explain how I was multi logging he left because he knew that I never did such thing. He was only there to use that as a leverage to make this threat sound more fitting and plausible. So it's like labeling me first a "terrorist"/"cheater" for something i did not do, then proceeded to threaten me of "forced military action"/"holding my btc" against me. Awesome. I mean I would love to subject myself voluntarily to situations like this... if I were a mindless idiot.

When there is only one table running and I'm slow in betting turning players away, I'm lowering the profit down purposely in the admins eyes. The admin has no regards for my freedom to play as I choose. Whatever profit rake was making does get effected more or less directly proportionally to time and hands/hour. This is not debatable. It is a fact. Amount being large or small is irrelevant here simply because at the time of this incident there was only one single table up and running. Any percentage of slowing down directly will effect the amount of rake produced. It is the only other thing that is more or less directly proportional outside of hand/hour. To say that this had no effect on this actions is being shortsighted imho.

I, too, want to know if there actually was another reason. They will probably claim that it was to "protect" it's player base. Just like how U.S Homeland security is there to "protect" it's citizens. Yeah... right. It's NOT their job to protect other players chips from me. Their job is to facilitate the game and fair play. That is it.If they just came out and said I was ruining their business and they won't allow my act from the get go, at least that would have been an honest move. I wouldn't have argued with that at all actually because it's easy to understand his situation for a startup website. I would have stopped if he explained the issue to me the right way because I personally liked the site despite it's shortcomings being a pioneer somewhat.



Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: 2weiX on July 20, 2011, 09:55:14 AM
All I did was use up my timer and bet out small amounts when it was my turn. I did not do anything wrong or directly break any rules that were stated anywhere on the website.

Now tell me exactly how me taking my time betting using the timer on the site "abusing players"? Don't you mean "abusing your profits"? Am I not supposed to trying "abuse" other players and pressure them so I can win? What is this some poker fairytale?
 
If I'm playing to win, it's my job to make the position of the other players as uncomfortable as possible. You want me to play so that people like me on the site? Are you joking?
IT'S BAD ENOUGH THERE ARE CHEATING TAG TEAMS THERE ALL THE TIME PLAYING.

What rule do any other sites have regarding using their timer to the full extent and betting out in small amounts? If I have broken any rule, I would not be complaining. I apparently got on the admin's nerves for slowing down the rate and hands/hour along with a few players that couldn't handle the play-style of mine and cried about it to the admin on IRC. IT'S NOT ROCKET SCIENCE TO ME OR ANYONE ELSE THAT GREED WAS THE REASON FOR YOUR TANTRUM.

The timer is there so people can think if thought is needed or that people on bad connections dont get diso'd and have some time to reconnect before their hand is folded.

It is NOT REPEAT NOT the purpose of the clock to enable players to piss other players off and/or stall the game for strategic reasons. You are in fact, and I say this with all due neutrality "abusing" this function. While well within the scope of "legal" tactics, it's widely agreed upon that it sucks donkeyballs. Noone can do shit to stop you from doing it, but noone will want to play with you.

I did ask the admin to make the clock faster, he simply told me to go to another, quicker table and thats what I did. With the rake being as little as it is and with only two or so table open at any time I sincerely doubt that you're really interfering with the "profits" of the site, unless you were playing at a full table of 500/1000 No Limit ^^


Not trying to pick an argument as I see where your view is coming from, but where does it say that I cannot use the time that I am allowed? It's is exactly as you put it, "legal". If I need to take time on each bet, then I will use it every time. Just because "you" or anyone else think that it sucks "donkeyballs" still doesn't make it wrong. I am free to play as I please within the rules of the website and it's software. That is the end of the story. I did not cheat or do anything that was not allowed from the very beginning. Just because few people went crying to mommy doesn't mean it can all be turned upside down. In fact, the admin himself addressed much of the same issue about delays in the past by telling people to deal with it by going to shorter timer rooms, but why is it different this time including threats?

No need to argue, this discussion is as old as onlinepoker itself.  i myself am using "timing tells" now and then, but again, it's my personal opinion that using the clock the way you are doing is a prime example of lawyering asshattery and for that reason i play with the 30s tables if i can.

whatever is between you and the admin, i cannot judge. since shit is hitting the fan almost every day now, i suggest SOMEONE bring some chatlogs.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Litt on July 20, 2011, 10:08:46 AM
One thing we can agree on is that shit is hitting the fan every day nowadays and it's not hard to see why from where I'm standing. You call it "lawyering asshattery", I call logical thinking.

Based on that, I was not in the wrong from any angle. You can't just change a right from wrong no matter how much "asshattery" there is. Neither I nor the admin can change the facts. Just because you think it's "lawyering asshattery" or "annoyingly slow" doesn't mean you can just bend the existing system way you want to abuse it. And certainly not by creating lies to justify making an undeserved threat. That is the true "asshattery" you are talking about. Not what I'm trying to do.

The fact is you are only allowed to act such way because the SYSTEM ALLOWS IT ALREADY. If it wasn't allowed, I couldn't have done it.

Fact is that the recent debacles speak for themselves.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: 2weiX on July 20, 2011, 10:40:38 AM
One thing we can agree on is that shit is hitting the fan every day nowadays and it's not hard to see why from where I'm standing. You call it "lawyering asshattery", I call logical thinking. Based on that, I was not in the wrong from any angle. You can't just change a right from wrong no matter how much "asshattery" there is. Neither I nor the admin can change the facts. Just because you think it's "lawyering asshattery" or "annoyingly slow" doesn't mean you can just bend the existing system way you want to abuse it. And certainly not by creating lies to justify making an undeserved threat. That is the true "asshattery" you are talking about. Not what I'm trying to do.

Fact is that the recent debacles speak for themselves.


all references to asshattery and donkeytesticles were only and ONLY made regarding use of the clock. everything else, as stated before, I really cannot opine on unless

a) chatlogs are posted
b) the trajectory of shit via fan is towards me.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Trayber on July 20, 2011, 12:22:07 PM
You're lucky the owner was so kind to even give you a warning and tell you not to do it again. Now he was out of line to threaten to confiscate your balance but you must have got him heated with all the complaints about your stalling. He should simply tell you are no longer welcome to play at the site anymore and tell you to give him an address to withdrawl your remaining balance to. The time system is there in place for the occasional times you are involved in a big hand and may need extra time in deciding your actions not to abuse it every single hand to piss off other players to try to drive them on tilt. If you did this in a live game where there is no time limit persay you would not be welcome to play there either and the floor would kick you out without a hesitation and not welcome you back. I suggest you go to your local card room and try your tactics and see how long you are welcome there. Yes you are taking away from the owners bottom line and he has EVERY right to kick you out. He is there to make money and if you are PURPOSELY affecting that than you are an annoyance to him and he has every right reserved to not want to accept your play. There are situations involving where stalling is an effective tactic and those situations would mostly come up in a tournament where you have already paid your entry plus rake. Those situations might come up around the bubble time when you are stalling to make the money. Those are perfectly within the rules and can be highly effective if you are the short stack trying to hold on. But in a cash game you doing it EVERY hand is not an effective strategy.

Now concerning the rampant multi accounting that is going on the at the site is not acceptable either. Most of the big online poker rooms policies do not allow you to be able to freely switch from one account to another to keep the integrity of the game intact. Yes there are a few sites that will allow you to change names every so often but most have a very strict policy against doing it. Once you sign up with an account and select your screen name thats it you do not have the option to change it. In fact on most if you are caught making several accounts you are in violation of the Terms and Conditions and the poker room can have every right to confiscate your funds. I wish the owner here would take a stronger stance on this issue seeing that there are several players that have been abusing this power frequently. I would say most are honest and stick to one name. I know who the multi accounters are for the most part but it takes some time at the tables and using my own notes to detect who they are but usually only after several hands of play.

It is UNFAIR to me since I am using one name and they already know my style of play but because they are constantly changing names on a daily basis I do not theirs until several hands of play. Then I can say oh this is so and so I know how he plays and I can adjust how I play that player. This is why they do it to take advantage of it. It is definitely a form of cheating and deception that shouldn't be allowed but the owner freely says its ok to do so in essence he is allowing a form of cheating to exist. The only way to combat this as a player myself is to change player names on a daily basis to even the playing field. In short, this shouldn't have to be how we play and there should be a stricter policy on multi accounting. I don't want to resort to that having to remember several usernames/passwords just to keep a one up on my opponents like they are doing to me.

 To you out there doing it and I KNOW who you are you have no ethics or morals and I can only hope for bad karma to come your way. You know why you do it is because you suck at poker and once people figure out how to exploit your plays you simply change screen names and come back as a new user.

Another good point brought up is the collusion that is also going on. Yes I know who I suspect is doing it and it quite obvious. While I won't say its going on all the time I keep my eye on a few players who I suspect are friends instant messaging each other their card holdings and cheating. There is just too much shady stuff going on at the site and I think other users have thought that as well which is why there are far fewer people playing on the site these days. Simply put I don't believe there is enough auditing of game security going on behind the scenes to prevent the integrity of the game is being upheld. Then again with only it being a one man operation I can't expect that he has the time necessary to put towards keeping the site up and doing all the security checks etc to be able to provide his clients a completely honest game.



Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 20, 2011, 01:46:44 PM
My _current_ view in short form: =)

1) Multi accounts - I can't prevent it from creation due nature of internet and bitcoin. If someone can come up with good strategy to prevent it - let me know. Until then I will allow it as long as it is the only issue with player.

2) Forfeiting funds - this happened only once in the life of the project. In that case person had three accounts and was colluding another guy. Forfeited funds were used to re-pay what another player lost due colluding.

3) Why forfeiting funds instead of banning users - see #1 - there is no way to ban user. Only if user be afraid to loose their money I can be sure they will not do tricky stuff.

4) If you catch colluder(s) - email me with hands ## and their nicknames and I will look into it.

5) Be nice to other players and you will never have any problems on this site.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: anisoptera on July 20, 2011, 03:28:59 PM
5) Be nice to other players and you will never have any problems on this site.

Wheaton's Law (http://"http://twitter.com/#!/wilw/status/5966220832").

I mean, that's what it boils down to. :)


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: bitbetter on July 20, 2011, 06:26:29 PM

1) Multi accounts - I can't prevent it from creation due nature of internet and bitcoin. If someone can come up with good strategy to prevent it - let me know. Until then I will allow it as long as it is the only issue with player.


You could try whitelisting IP addresses. However--this gets very annoying for the users. But--it can surely cut down on SOME of the multiple accounts. Such an annoying issue!


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 20, 2011, 06:28:25 PM
bitbetter, for now i want try to keep anonymous play via tor. and black/white listing by IP address will eliminate it. Will see. If people start abuse it - I will start blacklisting. But I hope I will not need it.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: bitbetter on July 20, 2011, 06:50:32 PM
bitbetter, for now i want try to keep anonymous play via tor. and black/white listing by IP address will eliminate it. Will see. If people start abuse it - I will start blacklisting. But I hope I will not need it.

indeed. I hope it doesn't come to that as well.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: TeraPool on July 20, 2011, 06:52:43 PM
bitbetter, for now i want try to keep anonymous play via tor. and black/white listing by IP address will eliminate it. Will see. If people start abuse it - I will start blacklisting. But I hope I will not need it.

I have always thought about perhaps maybe a captcha system of some sort...?

Well, obviously not a captcha, nobody would play there lol ... but something that can dissuade bots from playing? Like constantly changing the colors of the buttons you clikc perhaps?

If you held AA then the call button could be a varation or a picture of two aces, but always different, so that a human could read it but not a bot.

Just an idea.

Good luck with the site.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: anisoptera on July 20, 2011, 07:20:10 PM
bitbetter, for now i want try to keep anonymous play via tor. and black/white listing by IP address will eliminate it. Will see. If people start abuse it - I will start blacklisting. But I hope I will not need it.

I have always thought about perhaps maybe a captcha system of some sort...?

Well, obviously not a captcha, nobody would play there lol ... but something that can dissuade bots from playing? Like constantly changing the colors of the buttons you clikc perhaps?

If you held AA then the call button could be a varation or a picture of two aces, but always different, so that a human could read it but not a bot.

Just an idea.

Good luck with the site.

We're not chasing bots, we're chasing multi-accounters. Bots also aren't thwarted in any way by the things you describe. The protocol is open, the whole thing is open, if someone wanted to make a bot they certainly wouldn't have to use our client to do it.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 22, 2011, 06:22:44 PM
site was down yesterday for the whole night + a bit in the morning.

startheory player is not a bot 100%.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 22, 2011, 06:31:53 PM
Here is log of "polite" asking me something:

Quote
* Jordan_ (4b0d5e01@gateway/web/freenode/ip.75.13.94.1) has joined #betcoin
<Jordan_> hi
<hippich_work> hey
<Jordan_> hey so there is a bot playing on your site now, and if Im reading correctly, on the forum the administrator wrote that he would allow a bot to play on the site
<hippich_work> what is your nick on site?
<Jordan_> why does that matter?
<Jordan_> the bot is star theory
<hippich_work> what is your nick, not "bot"'s
<Jordan_> you are really going to let him play on the site?  what a fucking joke
<Jordan_> why do you want my nick?
<Jordan_> dude, we are going to telleveryone
<hippich_work> ok, naturalorder8.
<hippich_work> "we" - you have many identities? =))
<Jordan_> your site is going to fall apart
<hippich_work> yeah, right =)
<Jordan_> dude, i cant believe what scum you are
<Jordan_> and yes your site is going to fall apart, for sure
* hippich_work sets ban on *!*4b0d5e01@*.75.13.94.1
* hippich_work has kicked Jordan_ from #betcoin (Jordan_)
<hippich_work> fu =)


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: TheBitMan on July 22, 2011, 06:35:24 PM
I don't get it..so how is the site owner the bad guy..who is using the bots?


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: TheBitMan on July 22, 2011, 06:46:34 PM
After multiple complaints, the connection still sucks. I have to hit the button multiple times and the button still doesn't work.. if the button is there, half the time it isn't. And for the site owner to be using bots?? That's the nail on the coffin for me..I'm done with this site.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 22, 2011, 06:47:11 PM
2NaturalOrder8, I have different opinion. Since you did not ask me anything (sometimes you see users terrorize services to get something back - money or free service or something else), you own or affiliated with other poker rooms. Only this way can be explained why you are trolling here.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: TheBitMan on July 22, 2011, 06:50:03 PM
2NaturalOrder8, I have different opinion. Since you did not ask me anything (sometimes you see users terrorize services to get something back - money or free service or something else), you own or affiliated with other poker rooms. Only this way can be explained why you are trolling here.

Your just a dick plain and simple. I see people complain here all the time. I have been interested from this site from day one. It had potential but the way you run it, it should be down in no time.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 22, 2011, 06:54:14 PM
Ha, so you both are same person, I see =)


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: TheBitMan on July 22, 2011, 06:56:00 PM
Ha, so you both are same person, I see =)
How are we the same person?


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: TheBitMan on July 22, 2011, 06:56:52 PM
We are both online at the same time..my name is winnerchickendinner on the site you can go ahead and deactivate that too now. Won't be needing it.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 22, 2011, 06:58:25 PM
I closed your account? =)) That's a news


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: TheBitMan on July 22, 2011, 06:59:03 PM
These responses from Hippich are PRICELESS.....


Actually, I have re-evaluated playing online poker from the lack of security.... I actually wont really be playing any more online poker for now... and I hadnt played online poker for years until bitcoin came along...

I never advertised any other sites, and I dont want anything for free.... You closed me account because I asked about the bot, and I never planned to deposit any more money....


I have seen people comment and the ways he responds is extremely unprofessional for simple questions. Also I just saw his bot in a room.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: TheBitMan on July 22, 2011, 07:05:26 PM
If you are new to this site..do not use it. When you go to hit bet or raise (after you click it more than 10 times) it makes you fold. Which probably helps him win with all his bots.
I never say a site is bad unless I have used it. And I have used this..it is awful save your self the time and bits. - TheBitMan


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: x0Jakeyboy0x on July 22, 2011, 07:44:29 PM
I would like to note two things.

One, NaturalOrder8 isn't the best spokesman in this situation and although his intentions in this bot case are good, he is insufficient in his abilities to portray the issues in a tasteful. NaturalOrder8 seems to think he has evidence of a bot being used. If a user by the name of StarTheory is indeed actively playing on a large number of tables, this could very well be true but does not prove so. However even if StarTheory is a bot that does not mean hippich is the owner of said bot.

Two, hippich does seem to have good intentions in providing updates for Betco.in, but obviously good intentions are not keeping his costumers happy. Though, that does not imply he is obligated to. He has the right to run his website any way he wants; bots, scams and all if he so chooses.

That being said, hippich, I recommend that you do answer NaturalOrder8's inquiry in a professional manner as I'm sure he does speak for a greater whole, even if he does represent it poorly. Look into the possibility of StarTheory being a bot and condemn the accusations being put against you. If you do not do this, people such as TheBitMan may begin to see your website in a new light and feel as if you have something to hide. You do have the potential to lose users.

Bugs, bots, and arguing aside however Betco.in is still a halfway decent site and is definitely not a blatant scam.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: hippich on July 22, 2011, 07:53:39 PM
x0Jakeyboy0x, his intention is not to get answer, but start holy war. I already pointed several time online in chat that StarTheory is not a bot. I answered here that too. And if you do not believe my word.. well.. I doubt there is anything else that can prove you =)


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: x0Jakeyboy0x on July 22, 2011, 08:08:55 PM
x0Jakeyboy0x, his intention is not to get answer, but start holy war. I already pointed several time online in chat that StarTheory is not a bot. I answered here that too. And if you do not believe my word.. well.. I doubt there is anything else that can prove you =)

I will admit NaturalOrder8 does have a way about him. If you feel you've addressed the concern then you've done your share.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: anisoptera on July 22, 2011, 11:03:39 PM
I don't understand something. Well, a few things, but we'll start with the biggest one.

We have quite a lot of BTC on the site right now. Like, a whole lot. I'm not going to give ranges, but, it's definitely more than enough to tempt anyone.

If we were going to scam people...

Why would we resort to anything sneaky? Why would we be, to reference another person, looking for any reason to close an account and confiscate money?

We could close the site and run off with the money, and nothing could be done about it. And I WILL tell you that the amount of BTC we would get from this is much, much higher than we've earned in rake. Much higher than any bot could ever win for us.

So... why would we bother sneaking around like this? If this was a scam, why would we bother doing anything but just taking the money and running?

Why do we essentially beg our users to keep as little money on the site as possible, so we don't have to be responsible for such a large amount of money, if we want to do these things?

That's the first thing. That's the thing no one has ever been able to explain, about any poker site, in any "rigtard" debate. Why bother with the pocket change when you can just take the gold?



Secondly...

Why does everyone assume that bots have magic powers? That they are somehow able to win at poker 100% of the time? Because they don't. They're universally terrible at nearly every game. Why in the world would we spend the insane effort involved in making a winning poker bot to unleash it on... a bitcoin poker site with an average of three tables running at any time? Why not use this magical thing on PokerStars, or really anywhere where you could actually, you know, make money from it?

And if you're implying that this alleged bot that we're running has been given magic powers that allow it to see other players' hands or the future board cards - Why would we run a BOT to do that? Why not just. You know. Give ourselves those powers, and win money that way? It'd be way more fun that way, at the very least.

And the code is open source, too. What, do we have a private fork that implements these features? Yeah, wasting time on managing a separate codebase for cheating sounds like an excellent use of our development time.

Where do we fit that in, and still find time to write patches for the public codebase? Why even bother with the open source if we're going to do that?



You'll have to do better than "No, it's really a bot, I swear, just WATCH it" and "He left a substantial amount of time after I said something on an internet forum, that PROVES it!!" to get anywhere with this.

If you don't want to play on our site, that's cool. I won't try to sugarcoat it, we have a bunch of issues with the client. Stuff is still broken. It's totally reasonable that you wouldn't want to play here over Stars, for example, if you have access to other sites.

But we're paying people to fix it, out of the rake we collect. We're working to fix it ourselves, and we're throwing money at anyone who wants to help. And we're sharing the results of that with the world.

In the long run, this site is going to make us more money than we could get by scamming. Just like Stars doesn't have an incentive to cut and run, or rig their games, because honest games will make them more money in the long run. We don't need to rig it. Honest games pay well enough, and as a bonus, I can look at myself in the mirror in the morning.

I used to play poker professionally. A lot of what I get out of this is emotional. I'm happy to be working on the most advanced open source poker software out there, I'm happy that I am, in some way, helping the online poker community. The money is nice, I won't lie, but there's more to it than that for me. I'm not interested in becoming famous for starting the next UltimateBet.


This is probably just a waste of time - I kind of expect this to fall on deaf ears - but, well, maybe not. I'm not going to let myself be trolled further, though.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: anisoptera on July 23, 2011, 01:30:33 AM
You clearly don't have the slightest clue what you're talking about. You want to talk about insults to intelligence, it's the fact that you continue to make these arguments without any basis for your claims, and act as though they should be so obvious to anyone.

This is the last time I am going to respond to you, because I'm almost sure you're trolling.

By point:

Not a "dude". And "It's clear as day" is not, in fact, a compelling argument of any sort.

You're right. We would. We'd also have the easiest time running off with the entire balance of the site, or superusing. That, too, is not in any way a compelling argument.

That is correct, a bot is only as good as its writer. I find it interesting that you point this out, because you also claim that a bot has an "insurmountable edge", and clearly that would only be true for the absolute best human players. And the skill involved in writing a bot to any level of skill is orders of magnitude higher than learning to play at that level. Have you ever tried? I have. I gave up a thousand hours later.

This is a non-argument. You are arguing that a bot with access to data that players do not have would have an advantage over those players, though you seem to be quite unimaginative in how you would use this access. Hand history data? Really? Have you ever heard of a HUD? Humans can do exactly what you describe with one of many publicly available software packages, though only for hands they legitimately have the data for.

But if we're moving into the realm of cheating, why in the world would one go to all the trouble of complex opponent modeling? Just give the bot access to the future board cards and allow it to see player hands. A monkey could write a bot that could win under those conditions.

At that point, though, why not just superuse? Why let a computer have all the fun?

Saying that it's an "insult to 'our' intelligence" is also not a compelling argument against my statement. Please provide examples of the winning bots that are so commonly used, and explain why they have an insurmountable edge. The things you named are not arguments in favor of this, as they apply equally well to human players using HUD software. And while you could make the same argument there, you'd be laughed out of any serious poker discussion.

Oh. I'm sorry. There is even less traffic on the site than I said. That sure does destroy my point, which was that it would be really silly to spend an enormous effort to write a winning bot to play on a site that has no traffic instead of taking it somewhere useful.

Yes. There were bots on Stars. They played games we do not spread, and won largely by collusion and volume. They were not run by the site administration, but rather individual players. They were eventually found by large amounts of data mining by interested players that presented statistical evidence for their claims.

And Stars being inaccessible is news to me, I logged on just last night in fact. I mean, if you mean that US players cannot play on Stars for real money? Sure. But the US is not the world, and there are probably ways around that anyway.


Also, that's cute. You claim that terse responses indicate guilt, then when you get a substantial one, that, too, indicates guilt.

Please fly away, troll.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: darkwon on July 23, 2011, 01:26:25 PM
wow this naturalorder guy is so annoying, could we please ban him?

Every day he makes new accusations, just 2 days ago he accused me of colluding on your site in an extremely rude and harsh tone. Next day I saw him saying the exact same thing to another person. It's not even funny anymore, please don't waste your dev time replying to him.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Litt on July 23, 2011, 06:30:30 PM
Quote
All I did was use up my timer and bet out small amounts when it was my turn. I did not do anything wrong or directly break any rules that were stated anywhere on the website.

Now tell me exactly how me taking my time betting using the timer on the site "abusing players"? Don't you mean "abusing your profits"? Am I not supposed to trying "abuse" other players and pressure them so I can win? What is this some poker fairytale?
 
If I'm playing to win, it's my job to make the position of the other players as uncomfortable as possible. You want me to play so that people like me on the site? Are you joking?
IT'S BAD ENOUGH THERE ARE CHEATING TAG TEAMS THERE ALL THE TIME PLAYING.

What rule do any other sites have regarding using their timer to the full extent and betting out in small amounts? If I have broken any rule, I would not be complaining. I apparently got on the admin's nerves for slowing down the rate and hands/hour along with a few players that couldn't handle the play-style of mine and cried about it to the admin on IRC. IT'S NOT ROCKET SCIENCE TO ME OR ANYONE ELSE THAT GREED WAS THE REASON FOR YOUR TANTRUM.

I NEVER logged on and played on multiple accounts, yet it is the FIRST THING ADMINS ACCUSES ME OF WRONG DOING PROCEEDED BY A THREAT TO CLOSE MY ACCOUNTS WITH FUNDS IN THEM. Admins then comes in and basically says here on the thread that I"m lucky I got the money out before I posted this while making some lame excuse about how if I actually did multi-logged then he would have ALREADY held the money. YES WE KNOW YOU WISH YOU HAD THE CHANCE TO KEEP MY MONEY. YOU JUST WANT AN EXCUSE TO DO IT. NO DIFFERENT THAN POLICE LOOKING FOR AN EXCUSE TO LOCK YOU UP OR SHOOT YOU FOR RESISTING ARREST. HOW PATHETIC YOU ARE. ABUSING THE LITTLE TINNNNNNNY BIT OF POWER YOU HAVE AS AN ADMIN OF A POKER WEB SITE THAT FILLS UP MAYBE TWO FULL TABLES ON A GOOD DAY. YOU ARE THE REASON WHY BITCOIN WAS CREATED AND THE CENTRAL BANKS BEHAVE THE WAY THEY DO. PATHETIC PARASITE.

if you are someone who knows how to critically think for yourself and not some drone, you would obviously see where I'm coming from. And I know people here will agree with me on this. I'm 100% not on the wrong here. Not even a little bit. Otherwise I would not be taking such extreme side. Consider this a valuable lesson in karma that you spoke so highly of in your previous posts.

The admin has proven time and time again on this very thread how childish and limited he is in his capacity is to think beyond justifying his obvious shortcomings in common sense.

I WOULD STAY FAR AWAY AS POSSIBLE FROM THIS PLACE IF YOU LIKE KEEPING YOUR MONEY.

NaturalOrder you deserve to lose your account.. I already stated multiple times that this is the most Facist poker site ever and you still played on it. LOL.

Not gonna take your word on bots playing there now, but I know for a fact that there are almost always player team of 3-4 players most of the time colluding on hands on the table with most players. Bot are probably unlikely and unnecessary. The team members also change their names all the time, but I can easily tell by their play-style because of the limited number of usual suspects on the site due to low traffic.  I can so easily tell these people are trapping fishes, it's laughable. Only reason why people don't see this is because you ARE the fish or you choose to ignore this - looking at you greedy admins.

Also, saying something like "running the business is more profitable so why would they steal" is like saying "Gov only exist to serve the people, so why would it tried to steal from them" It's called because you can and you have the incentive to perform such heinous acts behind the close doors for your own greed. Just saying you are looking at it long term does not provide any logical evidence or reason that proves your company honest in any way. It just provides us with ONE logical reason you MAY NOT act such way, but doesn't guaranty it in any shape or form. You just want people to believe that your company operates with such morals.






Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: error on July 24, 2011, 09:47:53 PM
OK, everybody settle the fuck down.

Is there some actual evidence that this Startheory is a bot? If there was, I somehow missed it.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: accord01 on July 26, 2011, 04:41:02 AM
OK, everybody settle the fuck down.

Is there some actual evidence that this Startheory is a bot? If there was, I somehow missed it.

no
 bots aren't programmed to jam every hand and lose 50 coins in 1 day


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit tables available.
Post by: Micon on July 26, 2011, 06:53:45 PM
The thing is a bot... im watching it now.... Its a bot, go watch for yourself

1)  I have done lots of research on bots, played many of them, and can spot a bot relatively easily.  I will watch betco.in and report findings

2)  if you out a bot on here, they will obv just create another anonymous account under a different name

3)  I would bet it's not a bot before doing any research, in that the relatively low rent state of bitcoin poker would be a pretty labor intensive project for almost zero (or negative) reward.


Title: Re: Bitcoin Poker Room
Post by: btcace on August 03, 2011, 02:30:33 AM
Good work, hippich! This leaves me with an interesting question: Do I now owe you 10 BTC for identifying your own thief? I'll go with whatever the community says, but I'd prefer to make it my first contribution to a pool for paying similar bounties in the future, which I may start later today. Thefts like this will only become more common as the community grows.



editout





Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: hippich on August 04, 2011, 11:26:26 PM
Just pushed S'n'G tourney code. Please help test. Right now there is scheduled single Free Roll SNG with 1 chip prize pool.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: Trayber on August 06, 2011, 06:32:30 AM
your sites a ghost town now dude. you ran it into the ground with your horrible style of management to legitimate player concerns over cheating/bots/etc. its a shame you had one of the best poker sites for bitcoin but now place is empty.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: hippich on August 06, 2011, 01:49:28 PM
TL;DR;
this is just seasonal drop in site traffic due drop in bitcoin popularity


Long:

Trayber, problem with cheating/bots/etc (what is etc in this case?) was only with few players (possible same person behind usernames). Real players who play with real money and not register accounts just to bash admins and other players, do not have problems on the site.

Just an example: NaturalOrder8 in one of chats on btcontilt.com asked Weaver (support guy on the website) to go fuck himself after Weaver tried to resolve issue.... Great respect for Weaver's patience.. This kind of players will have "problems" on any website.

Just like before bitcoins skyrocketed, there is no a lot of traffic going on right now. That's why you see less players playing. http://www.google.com/trends?q=bitcoin&ctab=0&geo=all&date=2011&sort=0

Traffic dropped to April levels and my site is still first on google for bitcoin poker. As you can see, interest in bitcoins right now is 25% of what it was when site was "best poker site" =)

I bet dropped price of bitcoin also contributed into it - I've seen huge withdrawal requests, possible from players, who wanted to cash out their bitcoins..


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: hippich on August 06, 2011, 08:43:52 PM
This is "ghost town":

http://img641.imageshack.us/img641/5551/selection009.png


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: Weaver on August 06, 2011, 09:20:31 PM
Just an example: NaturalOrder8 in one of chats on btcontilt.com asked Weaver (support guy on the website) to go fuck himself after Weaver tried to resolve issue.... Great respect for Weaver's patience.. This kind of players will have "problems" on any website.
NatOrder and I eventually resolved the issue he was having. He apologized to the chat room for his outburst. It was simply a matter of miscommunication along with a series of unfortunate errors.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: kabevinetto on August 22, 2011, 12:38:36 AM
Hello,

So I deposited a small sum into betco.in and on Friday I won about 25 bitcoins....

I have requested to withdraw 10 and another withdraw request to withdraw 5.

The with draw requests were done quickly!  Great DEAL!


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: hippich on August 22, 2011, 12:51:32 AM
kabevinetto, no, I am not on vacation and I've been in IRC last time on Friday...

I am sorry for delay, really busy weekend. Glad you posted it here - so I noticed a lot of unprocessed withdrawals. Just processed all of them. Let me know if you will not receive yours.

Also, you said you contacted me and did not receive response, how did you contact me? Via e-mail posted on site?


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: kabevinetto on August 22, 2011, 01:29:20 AM
Hi, thanks so much for the quick processing....

yes I just sent you a few emails....

Thanks so much, i really enjoy the site.



Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: hippich on August 22, 2011, 02:35:17 AM
Heh. You are right. Gmail put your mails into spam folder for some reason.. Marked all your emails as not spam so next time it should go straight into mailbox. If you will not get response - PM me here =)


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: kabevinetto on August 24, 2011, 02:28:15 AM
Hey, waiting on some withdraw requests from last night... hope to get them tonight....

Thanks again


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: hippich on August 24, 2011, 02:51:42 AM
Thanks for reminder - was busy implementing Bcrypt hashing and finally did it! Here is long story why bcrypt is better - http://chargen.matasano.com/chargen/2007/9/7/enough-with-the-rainbow-tables-what-you-need-to-know-about-s.html . Basically, this means that even if my server get hacked, your passwords are safe.

Just processed all withdrawal requests.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: 2weiX on August 24, 2011, 11:22:45 AM
Thing is though... tables are dead :-(


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: Weaver on August 27, 2011, 09:47:06 PM
Thing is though... tables are dead :-(
Not on my site ;)


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: BitcoinStars.com on August 27, 2011, 10:06:49 PM
Thing is though... tables are dead :-(
Not on my site ;)

We should be building eachother up (building bitcoin up) not this kinda stuff man.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: Weaver on August 28, 2011, 12:03:14 AM
Thing is though... tables are dead :-(
Not on my site ;)

We should be building eachother up (building bitcoin up) not this kinda stuff man.
BTC On Tilt has done nothing but promote the Bitcoin Economy. We hold weekly tournaments EXCLUSIVELY using websites that use Bitcoin. We're also going to be funding several other things that have yet to be announced :)
I want to see you start proposing ways to be building each other up. Not just saying that we should. Words are easy, I want to see you taking a little action.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: BitcoinStars.com on August 28, 2011, 12:25:11 AM
Thing is though... tables are dead :-(
Not on my site ;)

We should be building eachother up (building bitcoin up) not this kinda stuff man.
BTC On Tilt has done nothing but promote the Bitcoin Economy. We hold weekly tournaments EXCLUSIVELY using websites that use Bitcoin. We're also going to be funding several other things that have yet to be announced :)
I want to see you start proposing ways to be building each other up. Not just saying that we should. Words are easy, I want to see you taking a little action.

Silly Weaver. Were not interested in saying things negatively to you. Remember we were the ones cheerleading you most when you opened. Just like we do with nearly every type of bitcoin site. Go Bitcoin!!!


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: 2weiX on August 31, 2011, 11:03:52 AM
Thing is though... tables are dead :-(
Not on my site ;)

sadly, i cannot play at yout site.
i play from "work", and the funky port i need to connet to is out of bounds for me.
should you change it to 80 or 8080, lemme know.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: hippich on September 05, 2011, 11:08:56 AM
Just pushed new code update for points-based rake back system. Once you reach 100 points you can exchange them at 1 point = 1 chip rate.

Number of points depends on rake paid and position on the table. It varies from 10% to 120% - yes, you can get 20% more chips then rake paid!

Here is url to file for implementation of points - https://github.com/hippich/Bitcoin-Poker-Room/blob/master/lib/ppn/pokernetwork/pokerbonus.py

Shortly - if there only two players - first one will get 20% rake back points, second one - 10% rake back points. If there are 7 or more players, first player will get 120% rake back points!

Now how place is defined - first place at 10-max table is left top, next one - next clockwise seat. On HU table - top one. Once more tables be added I will add page describing in details rules of this points system.

So if you are going to play - make sure to sit at top left seat and once you will get 7+ players at the table you will actually start earn money from rake!


All this is very rough. It might change in future and I am looking to get feedback =)


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: 2weiX on September 06, 2011, 08:33:37 AM
Just pushed new code update for points-based rake back system. Once you reach 100 points you can exchange them at 1 point = 1 chip rate.

Number of points depends on rake paid and position on the table. It varies from 10% to 120% - yes, you can get 20% more chips then rake paid!

Here is url to file for implementation of points - https://github.com/hippich/Bitcoin-Poker-Room/blob/master/lib/ppn/pokernetwork/pokerbonus.py

Shortly - if there only two players - first one will get 20% rake back points, second one - 10% rake back points. If there are 7 or more players, first player will get 120% rake back points!

Now how place is defined - first place at 10-max table is left top, next one - next clockwise seat. On HU table - top one. Once more tables be added I will add page describing in details rules of this points system.

So if you are going to play - make sure to sit at top left seat and once you will get 7+ players at the table you will actually start earn money from rake!


All this is very rough. It might change in future and I am looking to get feedback =)

i sincerely dislike the ranking of players by seat number. if you really need to discriminate, just do it by order of appearance, or better yet - on a contributed / dealt basis.

there are a metric shitload of rake calculations out there, no need to make your own.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: hippich on September 06, 2011, 01:10:29 PM
2weiX, absolutely agree that using seat position is pretty dumb. Here is why I am using it - simply order of appearance information is not available in code. And I would assume players who know about this current scheme will be able to sit at most profitable seat.

Good thing - I put point awards code into separate class and from now it is much easier to develop it further. Once we add code for storing order of appearance in game state - I will be able to use it inst
ead of position (it should be as simple as changing pair of variables now)..

Hope this make sense...



Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: 2weiX on September 06, 2011, 01:58:21 PM
2weiX, absolutely agree that using seat position is pretty dumb. Here is why I am using it - simply order of appearance information is not available in code. And I would assume players who know about this current scheme will be able to sit at most profitable seat.

Good thing - I put point awards code into separate class and from now it is much easier to develop it further. Once we add code for storing order of appearance in game state - I will be able to use it inst
ead of position (it should be as simple as changing pair of variables now)..

Hope this make sense...



i figured something like that. :-D


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: HostFat on September 16, 2011, 03:00:13 PM
Can you add free tables with your actual code? :) ( fun play )


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: hippich on September 16, 2011, 03:01:43 PM
Can you add free tables with your actual code? :) ( fun play )

There will be never free tables like you see in existing poker rooms. But there will be something else you might like. I will announce it once it is ready for a spin. =)


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: HostFat on September 16, 2011, 03:19:33 PM
Good to know!
Even if I'm not a poker player ... I like your site.
You are one of older services here on the Bitcoin forum, and you are still here and improving it.
I wish you good luck! ;)


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: hippich on September 16, 2011, 03:40:21 PM
Thank you =)


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: pokermon919 on September 20, 2011, 11:30:38 AM
HAHA you drove your own site to the ground, and I'm laughing my ass off cause you totally deserved it. Treating ppl that play at your site like shit and even calling them names. Crash and burn a hole.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: HostFat on September 29, 2011, 12:44:42 PM
There aren't any updates on GIT from August.
Are you still working on it?


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: SmokeAndMirrors on September 30, 2011, 01:34:53 AM
What language is this site written in?


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: hippich on October 03, 2011, 08:47:16 PM
Oops. Somehow missed new posts :)

2HostFat - I am working on some new features and these require quite substantial code refactoring. Also, main development still done in the old github repo - https://github.com/hippich/Bitcoin-Poker-Room

2SmokeAndMirrors - this project is mix of several open source projects + my own stuff on top of it. Poker server written on Python, table itself - mostly jQuery, and my stuff, actual website - Perl.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: hippich on October 04, 2011, 05:51:31 PM
Running small promotion - http://twitter.com/betcoin/status/121280707644497921 right now :)


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: HostFat on October 05, 2011, 01:17:11 AM
I really think that you should add a feature to give free chips directly from the website.
Something like 0.00001 chip, that has the value of 0.00000001 * 100 chips. ( it's like zero value ... but it is enough to play )

Example:
Then the user can ask for the free chip more than one time every 3/4 days, and only if he has less than 0.0001 chips.

Some tables are also needed for these kind of players ( to avoid big walled players ... )

This will make possible to have many new players on the service without Bitcoin involved.
They will be able to play even if they don't know anything about Bitcoin, but it will be enough to get them addicted to the game/service.


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: hippich on October 05, 2011, 02:48:43 AM
I really think that you should add a feature to give free chips directly from the website.
Something like 0.00001 chip, that has the value of 0.00000001 * 100 chips. ( it's like zero value ... but it is enough to play )

Example:
Then the user can ask for the free chip more than one time every 3/4 days, and only if he has less than 0.0001 chips.

Some tables are also needed for these kind of players ( to avoid big walled players ... )

This will make possible to have many new players on the service without Bitcoin involved.
They will be able to play even if they don't know anything about Bitcoin, but it will be enough to get them addicted to the game/service.

Exactly for this reason I keep free roll going on - you do not need a penny to participate in it. It needs just 6 persons to start. And these freerolls restarts every hour or even faster (depending on how popular this free roll is).

So I believe it is best way to try it out - you can play and also you can get some chips you can use to play ring games. :)


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: HostFat on October 05, 2011, 03:20:13 PM
I think that you should better advertise these free rolls on the homepage, like a dynamic pop-up.

Example:
"x Free Rolls available. Play and win for free!"


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: hippich on October 05, 2011, 03:29:39 PM
Yeah. Interesting idea. Also major stats on what tables are live, etc. And also more information about rake and rake back..


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: hippich on October 25, 2011, 12:02:45 PM
I want to try to do small promotion. Will see if it take of and if it do - I will work on implementing some code to do more often. (Right now it will be totally manual process :))

Happy Halloween 20% Deposit Bonus - see first post - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=840.msg9795#msg9795


Title: Re: Texas Hold'em and Omaha/Omaha8 Poker Room - NL, Limit, Potlimit games
Post by: extro24 on June 23, 2014, 08:07:28 PM
Hippich

You still around?  Trying to implement your poker room for some altcoins.