Bitcoin Forum

YARR MATEY, HERE BE THE SEVEN C'S (C IS FOR CONTRACT)
C-2. Each bond will pay as coupon 0.01 per day excluding Sundays.
C-6. All unpaid coupons from prior months will be paid on or before the 7th of each month.

Plus, this is perpetual, and pays out essentially the same as foo.pppt -- which costs between 1.05 and 1.12 but is not insured at all.

Foo pays 7 Bitcents in 7 days, you pay 6 bitcents in 7 days (1 cent each day except sunday?). Or do you mean you pay for example 2 bitcents on mondays?
Can I trade in shares of other PPT assets as well in exchange for yours?

I still hope there's a dividend API soon, so daily payments are easily possible to automate...

Im guessing thats the cost to be 100% insured the other 6 days a week. Seems perfectly reasonable to me.

To me too, but after all last time I checked 6% is less than 7%. Not "essentially the same".

Might be interesting to buy YARR + CPA shares so you get some of the profits from that missing payment on sunday back.
Still I kinda find it a little bit odd/misleading to claim dividends every day but not pay sundays. 0.0085 BTC per day per share (also on sundays) would give even slighly better returns to usagi but be really "daily" (or 0.009 for slightly worse conditions for usagi but one decimal place less).

By the way, "subbing" is not needed any more, please use the watchlist @PsychoticBoy! (check my sig)

Interesting new offering.  Do I understand this correctly?

Each week you plan to sell 100 bonds.  Your expected selling price is 1.20 per bond.  So you plan to take in 120 BTC per week.

100 of this must go into your BS&T account leaving 20 BTC.

However, in order to satisfy the 100% insurance requirement you will need to add 80 BTC out of your own pocket each week in order to deposit 100 BTC into your insurance account.

I am assuming you will simply deposit the 100 BTC in your GLBSE account and use it to issue the permanent buy order at 1.0 BTC.

Bottom line from your point of view:

Every week you will need to come up with about 80 BTC out of your own pocket (could be less, but may actually be more).
Every day you will need to pay out the dividend out of your own pocket (Pirate only pays once per week to reimburse you).
For all this effort you will eventually make 1 BTC per week (the Sunday payments) on about 80 BTC invested.

A return to you of only 1.25% per week on money that has the same default risk as a direct depost that would make you 7% per week.

Unless I am missing something this is a horrible investment for you and I did not even mention all the GLBSE fees which will make it even worse.

On the other hand, if you would rather stick with YARR, we are fully insured by CPA, and CPA is Photo ID verified with the GLBSE  ;D

What's your plan for the upcoming interest reduction?

Interesting.  Still paying a great rate though.  I think people are spoiled.

I keep very little stuff tied up in Pirate stuff, just dabble here and there.

I believe the intention is to have a permanent buy order in place for all the outstanding bonds at 1.0 BTC per bond.  He cannot have the buy order placed without having the BTC in his GLBSE account.  So, you are assured that all the BTC are in place in the GLBSE account and no matter what happens - even a total Pirate default - you will always be able to sell your bonds back at 1.0 BTC per bond.

This is a great plan and does give the customers 100% insurance and assurance.  Is that correct?

If the bond is sold for 1.3 BTC, if he keeps 1 BTC sitting in GLBSE for a permanent 100% bid wall, he only has 0.3 BTC to invest in Pirate or elsewhere, and will still need to generate 0.07 BTC weekly, or 23% weekly ROI. I don't believe they can do that. More likely is that they will place some bids for day-to-day demand, and given time will replenish executed bids, withdrawing from investments if necessary.

And, they didn't commit to doing even that. They said that they will execute any asks within a reasonable time frame, without any clue what is "reasonable".

Oddly enough I didn't see a reply to this in the thread even though I would swear I responded to it earlier.

To put it on record, we will shortly be releasing statements which will assuage your concerns, including a spreadsheet which lists the information you have requested. The reason why it hasn't been released already is that we need to put a public face on what amounts to private customer data. We can't release the actual spreadsheets we use to track accounts because they contain sensitive customer information. You can, however, buy in as an insider and receive direct access to the company spreadsheets. Several people have gone that route and I must say, any one of them are qualified to answer your questions. That they have not chosen to do so already is their own prerogative. I won't reveal their names in public as some of them have requested anonymity but if they choose to do so that is up to them.

The ipo says you will pay 0.01 every day but contract says except Sunday. What is it?

Each bond you buy can be exchanged for 1 bitcoin face value AT ANY TIME!

C-3. We will fill any ask placed at 1 bitcoin or less within a reasonable time frame.

And the beautiful thing is, each bond pays out 0.01 bitcoins EVERY DAY! (except Sundays!)

You read that right -- if pirate defaults we will buy back your bonds for 1 bitcoin each!

And they pay 0.01 bitcoins EVERY DAY!

Out of curiosity, what are you investing in now? I don't see why CPA or YARR is special and has to provide any extra information.

I was having a few CPA and have a bunch of YARR reserved, but cancelling those until I know what u are doing. My other investments are not so interesting for you.. :) If I'm going to insure or buy stocks or bonds or  something with your ''fully legitimate'' insurance company  then i want to know where to come and get my money in case of something goes wrong..  Your replies and answers are a little too arrogant/ignorant for having me investing in you..

And no.. I did not read the faq... maybe you or someone else can direct me to it's location..

tsukino.ca/cpa/faq

For what it's worth I'm sorry if you feel I am arrogant but put yourself in my shoes -- you are telling me that you are not going to invest money with CPA unless you get more disclosure. But you haven't bothered to read the discussion threads which link to the CPA website  ::)

You really should go there first, and read the discussion thread. All of what you have asked for is there.

Oddly enough I didn't see a reply to this in the thread even though I would swear I responded to it earlier.

To put it on record, we will shortly be releasing statements which will assuage your concerns, including a spreadsheet which lists the information you have requested. The reason why it hasn't been released already is that we need to put a public face on what amounts to private customer data. We can't release the actual spreadsheets we use to track accounts because they contain sensitive customer information. You can, however, buy in as an insider and receive direct access to the company spreadsheets. Several people have gone that route and I must say, any one of them are qualified to answer your questions. That they have not chosen to do so already is their own prerogative. I won't reveal their names in public as some of them have requested anonymity but if they choose to do so that is up to them.

Well, theoretically, if someone is willing to pay 1.05 for a share of FOO, which is completely uninsured, they should be willing to pay 2 for a share of YARR. In a pirate default you get 1 bitcoin back from YARR, so it's actually a better deal if you think pirate will default.

That being said, FIRST YARR DIVVIES GO OUT TODAY ME MATEYS! AHOY! 0.01! AHOY!

Dividends will be paid in just over 3.5 hours from the timestamp on this post...

Response has been phenomenal, thank you. We are now balanced at 500 shares.

No new shares will be issued at IPO price for the remainder of the month. There will be no exceptions.

New shares will be issued next month on or after August 1st at a time to be announced. I will lock this thread in 72 hours.

Thank you one and all! We love you, we love you every day.

What was the IPO price by the way?

Sold privately to people on IRC.

There's 27 shares left. Depending on how I handle the influx I could sell a few hundred more. But this is a tricky business, at some point I have to stop selling shares for a considerable length of time and I am trying to wrap my head around the best way to do that. Please contact me in PM or on IRC if you are interested in YARR shares going forward. I will keep a small amount up on the market if I can.

For convenience sake, I suggest you buy through the GLBSE. However if you really want to hold your shares with me offline, it's possible. Please send me a PM and I can set up a deposit address for you.

Thanks and good luck~

Hello!

I am happy to announce the availability of 1,500 shares of YARR.

These shares will be sold into the bid at precisely 2pm UTC, August 1st.

This is 11pm in Japan and 10am in Eastern Time.

Gentlemen please place your bids!

What price will they be released at?

There is not a fixed price. He just sell 1500 shares to the existing a that time bids. Some of them will be sold for 1.5 btc, other 1.4-3, third part will hit 1.2, etc.

Hello!

I am happy to announce the availability of 1,500 shares of YARR.

These shares will be sold into the bid at precisely 2pm UTC, August 1st.

This is 11pm in Japan and 10am in Eastern Time.

Gentlemen please place your bids!

I am constantly suprised by how the market is valuing YARR. People are buying YARR for 1.90 now. But when you think about it, it makes sense: at 1.90, YARR still represents 3.2% interest per week which is one of the best deals out there -- and it's insured. I guess that's why people are paying through the nose to get it.

At this point, I have absolutely no idea what I am going to do. The market is telling me I should sell at 1.70 and up. Why would I sell at 1.30 when people would pay 1.40 gladly? and so forth. So, I really don't know what price they will sell at. If I can get 1.70 per bond obviously I will do that than 1.50 or 1.60.

As for selling shares privately it turns out doing that isn't necessary. One person wants to buy all the YARR shares(!) in fact a couple of people have approached me with huge orders -- 100 coins, 500 coins, etc. I just can't keep up with all this. So I'll sell it on the market only. No more private deals. Sorry!

Actually, it's not "fully" insured (it being your investment)
Say you buy one for 2 BTC. If pirate defaults, you only get 1 BTC back. That's 50% insurance on 3% WPR. Still not a good idea if you think pirate will default in less than 17 weeks.

Actually, it's not "fully" insured (it being your investment)
Say you buy one for 2 BTC. If pirate defaults, you only get 1 BTC back. That's 50% insurance on 3% WPR. Still not a good idea if you think pirate will default in less than 17 weeks.

Actually, it's not "fully" insured (it being your investment)
Say you buy one for 2 BTC. If pirate defaults, you only get 1 BTC back. That's 50% insurance on 3% WPR. Still not a good idea if you think pirate will default in less than 17 weeks.

this is precisely how I've evaluated YARR. It is in fact, a partially insured bond. The typical trading price makes the insurance considerably less valuable, and(or) the premium exceptionally high.

the current offer to sell all of YARR to the highest bidder
A. calls into question the true value of the insurance provided
B. the solidity of any investment in YARR until such time as the asset is transferred to the eventual purchaser.

I would personally be interested in YARR at 1.1-1.2.

Hopefully your sale of the YARR business will go quickly.

I tend to agree with you. It seems that, until this sale has been completed and we know and trust the buyer, the actual value of the bond can be no more than the buyback amount of 1.3 BTC.

Disclaimer: I currently hold YARR

usagi has stated that YARR holds 3700 BTC in assets. Therefore, it's unreasonable to think that he would force the 1.3 BTC buyback: that would mean a loss of 1110 BTC. At least in this case, the invisible hand -- everyone doing what's best for them -- means the best for everyone.

In 3 days there will be 1,000 new backing for YARR and I will sell up to 1500 new shares around 1.40-1.50. This has been announced for about a week now. I really don't know why people like you and Nimda keep spreading FUD about 1.90, volume at that level is what, 100, compared to maybe 3,000 under 1.40.

This (along with Nimda, Obsi, and Psy's statements among others) are great examples of why if you don't know how to manage your money, for god's sake give it to a competent money manager.

If you did what you said and invested 1 bitcoin in pirate and 0.9 in say mining, your total interest rate would be about 4.3% The problem is that YARR pays a comparable interest rate at just 1.4 bitcoins. So investing in YARR at or around the average sale price is a better investment than what you have proposed.

In 3 days there will be 1,000 new backing for YARR and I will sell up to 1500 new shares around 1.40-1.50. This has been announced for about a week now. I really don't know why people like you and Nimda keep spreading FUD about 1.90, volume at that level is what, 100, compared to maybe 3,000 under 1.40.

Actually - you said people were buying it for 1.9. How is that FUD? 

I think we misunderstand each other. I was trying to say that a prospective buyer would have the option to exercise the buyback @ 1.3 BTC, not usagi. I also do not understand your math. I see that there were 2000 shares of YARR that received a dividend today. To buy back, it would be 1.3 * 2000 = 2600 BTC leaving 1100 BTC for profit.

*(there has been no official announcement that I can find but rumor has it at 5%.)

Hmm? There has (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=50822.0) been an official announcement, unless you don't consider the BS&T thread official...

why are you lowering now if there's whole week ahead with unchanged rates?

There isn't.

New rates are effective 8/20...

The question now is if people run to insured pirate pass throughs to save them from full pirate default, or not. If not, I expect that the fair value is now ~1.42 instead of 1.55. This is of course when Usagi fixes the rate.

Pirate has closed his BS&T. What will happen now with owners of YARR shares? Will you buy back all shares for 1 BTC each?

Where is this announcement?

As of today, YARR pays 1% per week (0.01 per share) payable on monday or tuesday. It is not worthless; it is worth 1 bitcoin. A bidwall will be put up over the weekend. Do not sell your shares for less than 1 bitcoin. Your value of 1 bitcoin is guaranteed by CPA. You WILL get your 1 bitcoin. Please allow 2 to 4 weeks for complete liquidation if there is a complete default by pirate.

YARR'S ACCOUNT STATUS:

2337 outstanding shares
2420 BTC in PIRATE SUB-ACCOUNTS and PPT PRODUCTS.
2200 BTC in MINING and OTHER

Our responsibility to shareholders is completely covered by out investments in MINING and OTHER, with a 100 shortfall to be made up by CPA in the case pirateat40 does not return investor's bitcoins. However, we expect that we will shortly receive final payouts for all PPT and SUB-ACCOUNT pirate products we own, and that a complete wrap-up of the fund as a pirate passthrough will be completed by next friday.

We advise you to place an ask for your shares at 1 bitcoin now to avoid transaction fees; do not sell under 1, we will be maintaining a bidwall at 1 for the near future.

If pirate ends up defaulting and not returning coins, don't worry. Just allow us some time to liquidate the fund.

Any questions, I will remain available here. Please post your questions and concerns here!

The bonds can become worthless? I have a few and they are trading under 1 btc now? I thought they would always be worth 1 btc?

Well, I bought back about 2,000 shares already. I'm just hammering it home. The difficulty is that selling the shares depresses the market price of the shares I am trying to sell, so I have to space it out a little.

Put up your shares at 1, and I'll buy them. Should take another 2 weeks to clear the remaining 600 or so shares.

Dividends from pirate?? Are you kidding?

He has not paid out dividends in weeks. Making a number on a paper go up is not paying out dividends. Esp when the guy even claims he defaulted.

So, you are holding on your shares and getting dividends while we are getting nothing?

Have you had your head buried in the sand for the past 2 weeks ? ....perhaps away on another planet ?

TBH your problem with YARR was that I thought of a good idea long before you did ;-) Your TYGRR.BOND-PI was essentially a copy of YARR except that instead of holding assets you had a Cassius coin. That about sums it up.

May I remind you that the second pirate defaulted, I bought back 1,000 shares of YARR and went about answering investor's questions on IRC, skype and PM while you went boating for the weekend. I didn't sleep all weekend trying to trade, sell assets, and buy back shares of YARR. Right now I've bought back around 70% of the issue with no loss due to panic selling the assets of YARR. So I don't think it is fair for you to comment on YARR the way you did.

As for ciuciu's words. I've been selling assets and moving money to pay back on YARR this entire time. So it's a little unfair and frankly quite vindictive that ciuciu said what he did. What you may not know is that ciuciu is just upset because I canceled his (very large, 2000+ coin) pirate contract with CPA and told him to buy YARR, about 2 weeks before pirate defaulted. Ciuciu has no right to say what he does because he doesn't know anything, he doesn't own any YARR. So he doesn't know I've been buying shares back ( a lot of shares ). I had talked to him before and he refused to buy YARR. So I know he is just bitter and it pisses me off that he would try to badmouth me in that way. When this is said and done several of the ppl who had accounts with CPA said they would let me reveal the names and size of their contracts. That will put a nice sock in the mouth of anyone that wants to badmouth CPA in the future.

As for the dividends from YARR's backing, that is owned by the backers. I put up over 1,000 bitcoins of my own personal money to back YARR. Of course I am entitled to the dividends. They're my shares. At what point does the contract say I will continue to pay dividends after pirate has defaulted? This is how insurance companies make money. We make money by charging a fair rate and then making money by investing the premiums wisely. No big suprise here.

My only care here is that when this pirate garbage is finally said and done, nobody will be able to say CPA didn't fulfil it's obligations.

You said, "Dividends from the shares she refuses to sell, not from the pirate." What the hell are you talking about?



Your problem is you expect me to do something that was never in the contract. The contract for YARR explicitly and in detail states what will happen when pirate defaults. You are the only one complaining about this and your complaint is not based on logic or reality.

One, you didn't even ask me whether or not I would sell the shares, second you don't know whether or not I have sold the shares, so don't sit there and say that I refuse to sell the shares.

This shares bring you dividends, don't they?

Of course. And these dividends, along with the captial raised from selling shares, is what is used to buy back YARR. Or am I missing something?

Ok, give me 3 examples.

Well, you said always -- should be pretty easy to come up with some examples?

Nahh this isn't a personal attack. If you wanted a personal attack I'd just tell people what you did with the money you took when you launched CIUCIU.BOND and were shorting mining stocks.


Read the contract. If you think I broke it, go e-mail nefario.

I don't see anyone else complaining.

You're welcome.

Ok, give me 3 examples.

If you don't have a question, seriously, stop being an asshole. Nobody cares whether or not you think I am a vampire or not and whether or not you want to bid -299 for YARR or whatever. Seriosuly (sic) you're making yourself look like an idiot.

Oh dear lord nimda.. You and your "exposed capital" theory.. seriously.  :D
Do you want me to explain again how 1 bitcoin at 7% plus .89 at 1.5% equals 1.89 bitcoins at ~4.3%? Sheesh.

Naw you don't get off so easy. -1 for not having the guts to stand behind what you said. I am kind of disappointed really, I was planning on having a lot of fun picking you apart. I guess you know where this would go and you don't want to have to face up to the fact you're just trolling.

ciuciu you have a complete and fundamental misunderstanding of how insurance companies work. I'm going to explain this to you once more.

You did not respond to this part, the most relevant part:
"Neither of these are the case. A pirate default results in a [partial] loss of investors money in both PPT and YARR."
I hope you don't mean to tell me that a pirate default would not result in a loss of YARR investors' money, because that's simply not true.

Now back to your regularly scheduled trolling.

Lol. Remember the cop in the movie, "I didn't say anything about no bitcoins in pirate...." ;-)

I don't know what you're talking about. I didn't say anything about that. Remember? You said it yourself.

Summary:   Daily Insured Pirate Pass-through

C-1. Each bond has a permanent face value of 1 bitcoin.

C-3. We will fill any ask placed at 1 bitcoin or less within a reasonable time frame.

Well, I bought back about 2,000 shares already. I'm just hammering it home. The difficulty is that selling the shares depresses the market price of the shares I am trying to sell, so I have to space it out a little.

Put up your shares at 1, and I'll buy them. Should take another 2 weeks to clear the remaining 600 or so shares.

YES!

YOUR DREAMS HAVE COME TRUE!

YARR is BACK, baby!

Back and paying fat divvies each week, yo ho ho and a bottle of RUM!

How it works is simple; AS SOON as shares are paid back, likely middle of next week-ish, I will load YARR with OBSI.HRPT to match currently outstanding dividends, and begin selling shares of YARR at 1 BTC again. Each share of YARR will be worth 10 OBSI.HRPT shares.

Then.... and then... my dear friends... the madness will continue.

My intention is to buy back all the shares which are listed at "1".  However, now, my dear crewmembers, you have an exciting option:

PULL your shares OFF the market! And partake in the second sailing of the Pirate Ship REVENGE! Sailing the high seas of completely safe, 100% insured investments!

As soon as there are no more shares for sale at 1, I will be speaking with Nefario and CHM about the changeover from Pirate to OBSI.HRPT.

The contract will change. My obligation to you will not change.

This guarantees you guys will get your shares back at 1 sooner, or, for a higher price, sooner!

Please vote on the motion here: https://glbse.com/vote/view/115 (https://glbse.com/vote/view/115)

To quote pirate: "You have 48 hours."

Thank you and good luck.

AS SOON as shares are paid back, likely middle of next week-ish

If the shareholder vote passes, then I will wait until Nefario and/or CHM can approve the new contract, and then we will immediately begin operating under the new deal.

C-3. We will fill any ask placed at 1 bitcoin or less within a reasonable time frame.

C-3. We will fill any ask placed at 1 bitcoin or less within 14 days.

A tip for the future.  "reasonable time frame" are weasel word and have no place in a contract.  
As the thread shows it means one thing to the issuer and completely different thing for the investor. The entire item could be removed from the contract without it changing the terms of the contract.

Something like would be explicit and there would be guessing on the maximum amount of time necessary to buy back shares.

Oh wait, I think I've misread something. Have all Yarr shares been bought back with a forced buyback (@1.0 each)? If so, please disregard my previous post :)

I still hold all mine shares. If you sold yours, that's late now :)

You had a VIP YARR subscription, so I don't see the problem with that. Please send 8 bitcoins to your subscription address and I will send Mushoz 8 shares of YARR :)

YES!

YOUR DREAMS HAVE COME TRUE!

YARR is BACK, baby!

YARR motions to switch to OBSI.HRPT and continue operations at 0.01 per day (or as OBSI.HRPT sees fit to pay). Essentially this is a motion to change one line (only) of our contract from: C-5. If Pirate or any pirate-backed issue we invest in defaults or changes their terms we reserve the right to change our interest rate proportionally. to: C-5. If OBSI.HRPT defaults or changes their terms we reserve the right to change our interest rate proportionally. So there you have it. YARR, risen from the dead. Let's go! Management suggests you vote yes.

The motion was passed unanimously!

However, Nefario said no, he will not allow a new pass through of this type "on GLBSE".

--BUT--

he also said that there is a new "GLBSE Pink Sheets" system coming (in a week? a month?) and that it will be allowed then.

I'll ask him again soon and we'll see what we can do. The key here is that the contract must be changed; until then, no dividends will be paid.

For the curious, the OBSI.HRPT shares are already in YARR and waiting to go. So as soon as Nefario gives the okay (when GLBSE Pink Sheets are out) we can start paying divs again.

Well! Look what we have here!

http://anonymouse.org/cgi-bin/anon-www.cgi/http://img715.imageshack.us/img715/5944/glbse.png (http://anonymouse.org/cgi-bin/anon-www.cgi/http://img715.imageshack.us/img715/5944/glbse.png)