I think the current fee situation is several years premature. The block reward still makes up the large majority of miner payment. I don't know how much fee head room is left before people start shopping elsewhere.

Some bitcoin fans act like it has already won. Maybe they'll still be here after everyone else has reached their breaking point and they'll have wonderfully cheap fees again because there won't be any transactions.

Right now everyone should be all out to on board as many people as possible. Very few have a genuine need to use it, they just want to use it and that's slowly eroding.



Whoever started that sakes pitch was very stupid. This was always going to happen but it's happening far too soon.

I think they may be a little late to the party by now, but I'm sure that pump money will be welcomed by the people slinking away.

Even if we do end up living in a caliphate I'll be contentedly pig farming until they set my eyeballs on fire. I assume mohamed got fucked by an uppity sow or something. I've never got the religiously mentally ill problem with pork.

USD, gbp or whatever takes your fancy that isn't crypto. You'd be batty to think that Bitcoin pissing all over itself wouldn't have an effect on everything else too. If there is a contentious hard fork, and I don't believe there will be, I'd leave and not come back.

Yup. It's about time someone, or rather something, designed a crypto that was purely objective and gave its human followers electric shocks if they tried to fuck with its smooth operation.

I for one am pretty amazed there aren't more of them. Bitcoin is a very fertile petri dish for every conceivable type of disgusting behaviour.

The latter is rarely picked up on and it's extremely important. Everything that came after has the potential to be distorted by greed during its creation and indeed often has been. Sadly I'm not sure how many people actually care about that.

No mining is the answer. That automatically hugely reduces the need to sell. Miners have to constantly get rid to pay bills.

NEM is one of the few up there with no inflation right now so its behaviour will always be very different.

Oh and no recent ICO either. That breeds (more) pumpers and dumpers en masse due to the vested interests.

Well, if it's listed as an alt from the start that nullifies rather a lot of potential chaos. There'll be all sorts of silliness but no disaster. He has good points about Mr Ver and his brand awareness slipperiness though.

Overall I think it would probably put an end to crypto's progress for a long time. The code would be of massive use to private projects but the public side would probably never recover.

Two squabbling Bitcoins is exactly what many detractors expect anyway. If it can happen there it can happen absolutely anywhere.

Amount of what? No one should ever put much faith in node counts or the amount of noise a small number of people make. That goes for every camp.

That reads like bilge to me. It seems to imply that Core = Bitcoin forever which even Core themselves probably wouldn't endorse.

If 95% of people genuinely adored BU then it would become Bitcoin without question. Of course they don't so it'll never happen but it's just a matter of percentages and the contention factor.

Bitcoin's value comes not from the software version but the history, trust and money shoved in there. That supersedes any code if it's mutually agreed upon to transfer it to a different version. The present code doesn't have a great deal of similarity with the very first version.

The number of people with that much skin in the game can't be more than a few tens of thousands at best. If they try to operate in a vacuum then they're not going to get very far. I don't see how long it could survive as a pure top down deal.

Small fish are what got Bitcoin where it is today and they still sustain it. It's not a creation of big whales and I can't see much sign of them being present so far.

If all of this was taking place ten years in the future then it begins to make sense but miners would be very dim to count on an outcome that hasn't arrived yet. Small fish may walk away leaving nothing for whales to pick up.

Well, even if that is the case they've stoked enough 'real' people to get frenzied enough to get behind them.

I think you're describing a user 10-15 years in the future. You've still got to be pretty weird and greedy to be using Bitcoin at this stage. It's possible a lot of people aren't paying much attention to the usual echo chambers but the idea that they're as carefree as a debit card user doesn't ring true.

And from perusing these forums, the newer you are the more likely you are to be throwing your coins away on ludicrous investment schemes and ICOs.

Alts at present are largely a mirage but there might be a tipping point that no one notices until the moment has passed.

What is disappointing about it? Either it works or it doesn't. And that fact that it has arrived at this valuation and it's still a relative obscurity means there's a vast amount of headroom left. Or it'll flop fatally.

If alts survive and stick around long enough they'll breed their own holders. There are blatant one time orgasms like Blackcoin but there are ETH and XMR fans who've been into it for years now and probably won't be going anywhere else.

The fiat/BTC derision has a very similar flavour to the BTC/alt derision which is a little unseemly. It's still very much a developing landscape. Lots could happen.

Of course it's silly, but people are also silly. It's an utterly meaningless barrier but a psychological one all the same. It may be daft but it makes people pay attention.

Then said miners are monumentally stupid. The on chain fees for opening and closing channels will be staggeringly high. That's why I'm not so sure a Lightning Network will actually change much without quasi Paypals giving you IOUs to group them together instead.

We're already seeing a few merchants accepting Bitcoin solely through a Coinbase wallet to avoid going on chain. That might accelerate. If miners won't give enough permission to the capacity then people will route around them to everyone's detriment.

Hmm. I think it's a constantly changing thing. The first alt bubble in 2013 really was a shit show. I'm not sure there's a single coin from back then that ever recovered.

The current crop are a bit more resilient. It's getting to a point where if you just sit there you'll eventually get your money back. I think that's all down to Poloniex really rather than any 'fundamentals'.

The appetite for bonkers gains from alts is bottomless. Bitcoin needs to progress beyond the level it's at now to differentiate itself enough. The ETF would've done it. I think that's the cause for the alt pump.