just some food for thought rethinking money rethinking about money is to find the problems of money. and the main problem of money is how it is created. with national government currencies its created via loans. basically someone has to get into debt to the amount of its creation and then use their labour, skills, time to work off the debt, where by the funds are then kept by the banks these currencies make sure by their growth that a loaf of bread 20 years ago was 2x cheaper(5%/y inflation) and will probably be atleast 2x more expensive in 20 years
bitcoin is different as no one has to get into debt for its creation. no single institution licences, holds, secures the funds and its not limited to what country, person can apply to use it. just download a program, buy some, use some and its creation amounts is done so that buying something for 1btc 7 years ago.. you can now buy 1000 of those 'somethings' for the same 1btc now
sticking with a debt based currency is bad. sticking with a restrictive currency where institutions can control how much you can spend ($500 atm limits and $10,000 bank counter withdrawals) are a thing of the past
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there is no evidence it ever dropped long gaps between blocks (which is the only thing that definitely happened) are random. finding new blocks is probabilistic, not mechanistic. That means there is natural variability in how fast new blocks are solved, and natural variability can easily account for the tiny drop that happened for only a few hours on September 23rd. If this isn't a whole load of bullshit psychological price manipulation, how come the price didn't react until Sep 24th, over 24 hours later? ![Roll Eyes](https://bitcointalk.org/Smileys/default/rolleyes.gif) because it is, if you panic sold, you've been mugged 1. the time gap between blocks does not prove or disprove hashrate speed. hashrate is based on speed and time. so even if say blocks done 600,000exa every 10 minutes (100ex/sec) another pool can find a block in 6 minutes(400,000exa) but not broadcast it straight away, thus although the hash is 400k exa. the time shows as 10 minutes not 6 minutes because of the broadcast being late. thus appears to others as only ~60exa/s thus giving a pool 4 minutes head start for the next block before anyone even knows there is a solved block (yes pools have don this before and will do this again. although personally id say holding off for minutes is risky) 2. also the reason why there would be delay from hashrate drops to their being a price drop can be for several reasons a. the 100block reward maturity = not able to spend coins instantly b. the price unrelated to rewards of day, but traders fearing a scare, so reacting in a self fulfilling prophecy to cause the scare c. the delay bing due to that not all traders watch hashrate but do watch news alerts, and news took time to notice and report
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physical address links to a virtual office/pobox drop off service - flag 1 URL address links to proxy/hidden services - flag 2
descriptions pretend to be about carbon emmission clearup but their site and writing is like 95% how to invest and 5% occassional splashing of very non technical hints of being related to carbon emission clear up ..imagine it this way, if starbucks didnt have much content about coffee but obsessed about bank deposits, debit/credit cards and cash eg the whitepaper is about the investment not environmental science .. its as if they dont even care to even try to atleast research the science, to even appear as a project
so as an environmnt project. sorry but BIG FAIL "Carbon-based Transmutation Acquiring Green Source of Electricity"
sorry but landfill/trashing a tire does not cause more atmospheric CO2 than what burning a tire produces.. but guess what they promote.. burning tires. sorry but burning tires does not produce more energy per co2 output than other burnable materials.. in short they want to burn the most carbon vs least energy things. sorry but this company shows no actually proof or signs of doing a positive for the environment.
not only that, they pretend the purpose of polluting the atmosphere is to produce electric but have no big detail about the electric grid
so not only is this just a money grab but a dead project that is done under the FALSE pretense of being environmentally friendly.. while also begging for money whilst hiding where to truly locate them
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bitcoin is a store of value. as it first needs to be a store of value to then be a medium of exchange. by this i mean if having no value, people wont want to exchange it.
but people dont understand where the value comes from or what the value(financial) and values(function/feature) are
here is what a few people cant agree on. some people just think that it has no purpose/function and is just a store of value. this is usually the case in most peoples towns where they cant use bitcoin(as bitcoin, not converted) to buy food, rent, etc this is where people need to do things in their towns to actually ask their local shops to try accepting bitcoin. bitcoin is not some complex AI that can get on a plane or phone and talk to everyons local shops. people that actually want to use bitcoin locally need to actually be involved in getting retailers to adopt bitcoin
some people just think its value($) is based on being higher than the last person that bought it by this i mean the common sense is when someone buys an asset they are reluctant to sell at a loss, so if everyone bought at $10k then they would all have the common sense to want to sell for $10,001+ and thus there would not be any/much orders below $10k ..
but what people dont realise is that the PRICE.. is NOT the VALUE($) what people forget, dont know or dont understand is that when people buy btc they are not buying it 'at value'', same as gold. they are not buying it at value, they are buying it at a spot PRICE which is above value. and hoping value increases to ventually be abl to sell at a profit
imagine it like an iceburg in the ocean. people think that price and value is the tip of the iceburg. what they dont realise is the bit underwater is the value, holding it up. and the bit above the water(the iceburgs tip) is the price, which is speculative that can melt down or frost up, depending on the weather, environment.
then people need to know what builds up the value part. yes over time its the acquisition costs. such as if it cost $9kto make btc. and after many months of speculative trading eventually the majority of trader have bought btc above $9 then the waterline becomes $9k knowing most wont sell below it unless it became cheaper to mine it blow $9k or those buying early on at cheap can sell for less at a profit. eventually though, even when those early buyers sell, the next buyer has a higher line than previous people. so eventually the water line rises....
now to the main point. too many stupid and gready people do not care about btc's values(function/features) and just care about it as a buy low sell high. but if btc only became speculative with no underlying values, nothing holding it up above a waterline.. then it will just sink. as thats what things like ponzi's are. things with no purpose done just to get a new person to buy for more than the last person. in short.if people actually care about btc we should be caring about keeping bitcoins features and functions alive. not passing the value/valus off to some other network and using bitcoin as just a store. because if so, then yes that store would sink as it has nothing holding it up but vapour
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seems many are reacting to the hashrate chart drop.
simple demo(dont knit pick math inaccuracies/rounding) imagine 100exa cost $10k to mine. hense when btc was mining at 100exa prices were $10500(5% profit on sell) when people see a chart going down to 60exa. they fear the price too will tank to ~$6k.
the reason i say dont knitpick the inaccuracies, because the reality of 100xa is ~$9000. and the $1,500 ontop was speculation/drama/hype. so when the whole bakkt drama doesnt show the hype people hope for and then people see a hashrate dip, they double panic.. and do so foolishly
anyone trading based on emotion where they panic sell, at a loss due to fear of death. obviously dont understand the big picture
right now i dont see this event as a panic. but as a great day for discount bitcoin buying
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i too find it annoying when people scream murder when the price only moves a few percent. to me and many i know, its never a price 'drop', 'crash' 'dump'. its instead a discount day to buy extra cheap
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Do you think it has a correlation? Or it's just some big players that manipulating the market?
dump? not even a month ago the price was lower than it is today. what should be seen is more like a short spike september 3-6 and then settling back to norm. when prices fluctuate less than 20% thats the norm. its called volatility for a reason. from september peak of $10,700 to a low of $9,900 thats not even a 10% shift. thus not really anything to be concerned about
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I did see the Starbucks name mentioned, and I'm wondering what their involvement with Bakkt is. They don't actually accept bitcoin as payment for their products, do they? I've not been in a Starbucks in quite a while, but I also haven't read anything about that on the forum aside from some speculation that they might eventually take bitcoin.
alot of people wonder about starbucks involvement and think of them as just a retailer staffed with barrista's who are just trained to make throthy coffee.. what most people dont know or think about is that starbucks are actually huge players in the commodities market. think about it. they are the largest international trader of coffee bean commodities. there corporate offices specialise in knowing how the stock exchange works, what influences it and how to trade within it both as a supplier and buyer to starbucks, bitcoin is a safer asset to manage, they dont have to worry about costly distribution(trucks,boats) dont have to worry about warehousing, dont have to worry about seasonal changes(sun/rain) affecting their holdings, dont need to pay farmers. its just trading and concentrating on trading and not that other stuff also starbucks was and is a partly poker player and not the 'house' in regards to coffee beans as they are partially on the receiving end of bad seasons and boating accidents, mold, bad yields, etc. but with bakkt they get to be more of the 'house' meaning less risk for them as all they are facilitating is the trading gateway and taking a cut of the trade fee's without the hassles mentioned above. as the old addage says the house always wins
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before even trying to do gimmicks to get people to buy bitcoin under the ruse of saying its 'digital cash'. there needs to be a resurrection of projects aimed at getting merchant adoption onboard again. by resurrection i mean just that. i seen plenty of it in 2012-2015 but then it died out when core decided to treat btc as a reserve investment and not digital cash. (btc being the digital gold asset locked up and LN's millisats being the gold backed promisory notes(bank notes))
if the only reason to advertise to people is to say the price will rise. then that is a crap advertisement.
i totally understand some holders only desire to get new people in, so that the new people can raise the price just so the holders can exit. but thats just selfish and just about going back to fiat rich. much like adverts for ponzis do by not advertising any utility the asset offers but just promising gains in returns when advertising has nothing to do with bitcoins purpose or features or options and just about 'get rich quick' then it tars bitcoin with a scammy, scheming gimmick.
just check out this board. more people are only wanting to talk about how to pump bitcoins price and not how to get new merchants onboard
i know a few people will reply with 'but whats wrong with it just being a investment'.. the answer is that those saying such dont care about bitcoins future once they exit richer.
so until people start caring less about their exit to fiat strategy and instead start caring about what can bitcoin be used to buy whilst staying in the community. its not worth advertising it. many people have been sold on the digital cash pitch only to find its pretty much useless as such in most towns, thus not truly a valued asset, but just a pricey asset.
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“The digital wallet device is electronically disconnected from other digital devices and comprising: a cryptocurrency integrated circuit (IC) that is isolated from any computer interface” … “and a unidirectional communication hardware for sending said transaction to a communication device for broadcasting said transaction via a network.” ![Cheesy](https://bitcointalk.org/Smileys/default/cheesy.gif) offline signing. then carrier pigeon to another location to broadcast ![Cheesy](https://bitcointalk.org/Smileys/default/cheesy.gif)
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This use case (ie. timestamped verification) has been widely discussed for years and to some extend even been put to practice -- on public permissionless blockchains. What about private permissioned blockchains though? How is a private permissioned blockchain run by private company nodes, editable only by company employees more trustworthy than the same set up using classical databases and access control? Same for private permissioned blockchains run by government entities on government nodes, editable only by government employees. Where's the benefit in this case?
editable?.. you must by now understand blockchains are append only, i mean come on its not your first day on the scene first understand distributed blockchains. "Editing" as in "writing data to" (eg. registering and timestamping the image hash, patent, prescription as per the use cases mentioned above). Speaking of editable: even in a system where all the nodes are run on a companies intranet(internal network) its still not possible for a single entity to edit the block/data. it would require all the employee's to collaberate. Like I said: In a permissioned setting rewriting history becomes a mere executive decision.
Or put differently: If the CEO of a company (or director of a government organization) tells their IT to roll back the private blockchain, that's exactly what they'll do: Collaborate to change supposedly immutable data. your missing a few basic points here. 1. imagine you had blocks 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10.. in blockchain you cant just edit an entry in block 5. without it affecting 6,7,8,9,10 and thus other nodes pick up that one version doesnt match the majority as thats called editing. what you are describing is a complete history destruction and rewrite.. theres a big difference. blockchains dont allow editing 2. for a complete rewrite would require the whole node set to comply. by which they obviously havnt bothered making a true blockchain with all the checks to prevent it by default 3. if you dont understand the whole concept of the chained hashes, the distributed verification, checkpoints and such, then its time you looked into blockchains 4. i see the purpose of blockchains in different industries done so, so that temp employee at random bank branch cant just add a few zeros to the end of his balance and then run off to a tropical island,, rich. 5. an im pretty sure if a company wants a secure data system then they would have systems inplace to make sure it actually a blockchain and not some backdoor filled crap that can erase data from all systems at the same time. even things like handing a checkpoint hash periodically to some attorney who can, if any data integrity quieries arise, can check to see if its true or not. which is backed up by some contract that fines the CEO personally if such event arises
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The only valid concern about storage is storage speed (random read/write), HDD has been proven : 1. Slowing down IBD (Initial Block Download) 2. Can't keep up when the Blockchain/Cryptocurrency network is very active. For example, you must use SSD to run Electrun full/archival node.
a block is only 1.3mb every 10 minutes. come on, even you know hard drives have no issue with it. as for the IBD... thats not a hard drive or internet issue. thats a programming issue. the only complaint people actually have about the IBD is that they have to download it before they can even use bitcoin. its not a 'my computers gonna blow up' experience. its a 'twiddling thumbs' experience this can be solved by letting users rpc-api request their peers to fetch them a small utxo set of just the addresses needed or even an entire UTXO set, so that users can then make transactions, and the IBD becomes a secondary background event rather than a 'must do before use' if you really think a blockchain running at 1.3mb per 10 minutes is somehow clogging up hard drive performance of hard drives of 250mb PER SECOND then there is something wrong with your 30yo hard drive. maybe time to get something made this side of the millenium. even basic simple maths puts the difference of ~1.3mb/10min vs 250mb/sec at a ~12,000x multiple which was another laugh i made years ago when core refused a base block of 2mb. .. and a further laugh when they went for 4mb weight, which debunked their own excuse for not doing 2mb base
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This use case (ie. timestamped verification) has been widely discussed for years and to some extend even been put to practice -- on public permissionless blockchains.
What about private permissioned blockchains though?
How is a private permissioned blockchain run by private company nodes, editable only by company employees more trustworthy than the same set up using classical databases and access control? Same for private permissioned blockchains run by government entities on government nodes, editable only by government employees. Where's the benefit in this case?
editable?.. you must by now understand blockchains are append only, i mean come on its not your first day on the scene first understand distributed blockchains. even in a system where all the nodes are run on a companies intranet(internal network) its still not possible for a single entity to edit the block/data. it would require all the employee's to collaberate. hense the need for distribution of the data. and the need to then secure the distribution by having a simple verification procedure which blockchains offer by default(hashes) yes in a central stored single database on a central server can b edited easily. yes in a distributed single database without any security checks can be edited easily. but to change data on all locations simultaneously whereby each location can check its peers for such attempts is something that single individual cant do.. plus it dosnt require IT guys, security teams, auditors to keep a check on it. as a blockchain is self checking/auditing alot of people think centralised is not able to be distributed and decentralised cant be controlled by a certain group hense if you get off the buzzword of 'centralised/decentralised' and think about blockchain distribution instead, you will soon learn what blockchains are really about, whether it be centralised or decentralised
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people say it cant scale due to storage(facepalm) in the 1990's kodak said digital photography wont scale because a floppy disk is only 1.4mb today, digital media smaller then the size of a postage stamp(24x physical size smaller then floppy) ![](https://ip.bitcointalk.org/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FHmyGjiX.png&t=665&c=IPSj7zneFXC4Yw) and each microxd stores 1,024,000mb
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Censorship-resistance, and security of Bitcoin as a cryptocurrency through decentralization, and your complaints about a group of developers who reject some "ideas" are two different things.
Why? You want me to drink the Roger Ver kool aid?
1. by a group even being able to reject an idea before the whole community get to try it. is censorship 2. by a group being able to ban other teams off the network because they dont agree, is censorship 3. by you thinking that a person thats not core hugging must be opposition, is censorship sorry but i dont follow ver.. but i do love how you show your colours of your desire for censorship by trying to say anyone that doesnt love core must be in some other group. in bitcoin there should not be one controling implementation/group. there should be no banning other idea's off the network before new rules even get a chance of find consensus.. purely to push through one groups goals without opposition
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alot of people think that blockchains wont work for companies because people believe a blockchain has to not only be a single database. but also has to include all the data.
imagine a blockchain where each block doesnt contain whole image files. but just the file hash of an image file, where by the image is stored separately.
people can then validate the images are authentic/not been edited because they can see if the hashes match the ones in the blockchain. imagine its use for patent registration. the patent office doesnt need to store all the patent wording/images in the database, just the file hash of the submission. and then because the file hash is in a blockchain. its then timestamped and logged. anyone trying to edit a patent file ends up with a different file hash. which when comparing it to the blockchain. wont match and people can see that its a false/edited document
this then allows everyone to have a distributed database, without the worry of having to store millions of peoples files aswell, especially if they dont personally need to know about others files content
same goes for things like pharmacy prescriptions. a blockchain does not need to store the patients name, address, social security, doctors details, and medication+amounts. it just needs to store a hash of the data. which the pharmacy can then check actually exists in a blockchain. those know its a real prescription and not one created by a druggy using photoshop
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An append-only database. Why would companies want that, and if they truly did, how can they assure that their "private-centralized-blockchain-database" will be immutable, and secure from tampering? ![Cool](https://bitcointalk.org/Smileys/default/cool.gif) you have been very open to your subtle hints that you hate blockchain and you think people need to move off blockchains to either LN or liquid for btc, as well as saying blockchains wont work for other uses in different sectors. but you really need to, and i mean this sincerely, really need to do some dang research.
![Roll Eyes](https://bitcointalk.org/Smileys/default/rolleyes.gif) Troll harder. i understand you have limited technical knowledge, i understand your learning from a certain group of people with certain intentions. but it really is time you done some out of the box thinking.
I'm the stupid one. You are the person that newbies should listen to. I hope they do, and learn, the hard way. imagine a central database, and then needing to back it up periodically. and because its central. have IT guys, auditors, security professionals monitoring the central server to ensure tampering dos not occur. imagine a distributed database, which by its own design backs up each other (if one goes down others are available) where by design individuals cant tamper with it, it doesnt ned it, security, auditors either.
How can tampering then be assured impossible? What "proof" can they show its users that it's not "tamperable". ![Cool](https://bitcointalk.org/Smileys/default/cool.gif) Is there such a "database"? 1. companies do need append only databases take your car log book. you think it only lists you as the owner.. ever.. no. the car registration authority appends each new owner when the ownership changes. just because the latest append shows as you, doesnt mean that no other entries exist. same with land registry and many other things. also going into financials. like banks. ever thought about bank statements and how your only comparison of a blockchain being bitcoin is the same thing. where a wallet logs all payment history of an address/account ever thought that a bank balance is just a calculation done after adding/subtracting the total append only payments in and out of an account... think about it how else do you think they get to the 'current balance' if they are not taking previous ins and out into account so "why would a company want append only." .. simple. to keep a log to check everything audits correctly so "how to prove 'private-centralized-blockchain-database' is immutable".. simple. distribute it and check the hashes.. you really need to understand how blockchain security works.. (hint: do research) 2. by you saying blockchains cant scale, blockchains dont work, no one wants blockchains.. yes you say those things. you have been very very visible in your hatred of the technology. your only interest is the price of the asset and the desire to centralise it under a certain groups control. i would feel sorry for anyone that tried learning things from you not only for your motives, but also for your own lack of independant research 3. you are so unprepared to understand blockchains that you cant even recognise that blockchains exist even when one is being described to you. here il describe it again: "imagine a distributed database, which by its own design backs up each other (if one goes down others are available) where by design individuals cant tamper with it, it doesnt need IT guys, security, auditors either." also if you dont think these databases exist. then you are saying bitcoin is a figment of peoples imagination!?! i think its really time you start doing your research. not just about what blockchains are/do/how they work. but also about general life stuff like companies that can use such, are using such and will use such. have a nice day, but try not to spend it just replying. spend some time doing research first. it will help you i do have to laugh that you honestly thought such databases didnt exist.. that made my day
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$75mill... thats small
the UK 'creates' wll over £90mill every year, and thats just the government 'loan' let alone the commercial banks activities
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meet ups i have attended included things like: hand-to hand trading desk presentation stage - technologies/innovations/code (no investment talk allowed) recruiters general chat with like minded people product sales stands
its best to try finding out their ethos/agenda for the meets, and avoid the ons trying to 'seek investment'/offer investment ideas
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the decisions taken by the Core developers... vs ....censorship-resistance
and yet core are the censors.... just look at how many bips and idea's they have censored just look at how many dev teams they threw out the community you have certainly drunk the core koolaid
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