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2181  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: It’s a curiosity to know on: December 06, 2019, 06:37:59 PM
Coinbase currently says it has more than 30 million users. One year ago, they said that they have more than 20 million users. That's a gain of 10 million, or about 30,000 per day. Keep in mind that these numbers are very imprecise, but you still can get an idea of the scale.
2182  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: BItcoin: The path to $10,000,000 ten million dollars per coin on: December 06, 2019, 06:23:39 PM
Actually, Hal Finney predicted 10 years ago that bitcoin could reach $10 million per coin. His assumptions were if the entire world M1 (or cash equivalent) would move over to bitcoin or about $300 trillion or something.
Still, that's going to take at least a couple of decades, so maybe 2040 or 2050 we can revisit this thread and see what has happened.
YES YOU ARE RIGHT, I fkn forgot about that post from Hal Finney...OMG.
But, we are getting to 10 million per coin waaaay before those years.

I believe that you are referring to the post in which he considers the possibility of Bitcoin replacing all the wealth of the world. Simply stated, he is wrong because money can't do that. He is conflating the "store of value" and "unit of account" aspects of money. For example, a house that you own has a value that is part of your wealth, but the house cannot not be replaced by Bitcoin.

It is also a mistake to compare Bitcoin to M1, M2, etc. because those money supply values include the result of fractional reserve banking. The correct comparison is the global monetary base. Matthew Mežinskis and Fernando Ulrich (cryptovoices.com) have done a lot of work along these lines and have come up with a maximum potential value of the Bitcoin money supply -- about 19 trillion USD, or about 900 thousand USD per bitcoin. Keep in mind that those values assume that Bitcoin will replace all of the money, which is not likely to ever happen. Note also that the values do not account for future economic growth and lost bitcoins.

WRONG
...

Don't be an ass. I may make some assumptions that you don't agree with, but that does not make me wrong.

I assume that Bitcoin is (or will be) a form of money, and that people will value it as a money. That is why I think it is valid to equate its value to the other monies in the world.

In contrast, you have yet to support your $10 million valuation by anything more than fantasy, wishful thinking, and irrational exuberance.
2183  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Did Satoshi steal other people's ideas for Bitcoin and one reason why he left? on: December 06, 2019, 06:06:01 PM
I have had many silent thoughts on this matter and I contemplated the outcome of this experiment, if Satoshi decided to reveal his true identity. How many people would actually take him to court for intellectual copyright infringement? Companies like PayPal revolutionized person-to-person payments online and they might even find a reason to sue him.  Roll Eyes
You can't copyright an idea (at least, in the U.S.).
Intellectual property is protected by laws specific to the expression of an idea. ...

The key word here is "expression". You can copyright the expression of an idea, but you can't copyright the idea itself. Satoshi used the ideas of several other people to develop Bitcoin, but he did not copy the expressions of those ideas (the words that they wrote), so there is no basis for copyright infringement.

Here's an example of the difference: The Winklevoss twins did not sue Mark Zuckerberg because he turned their idea for a website into Facebook. They sued him because he worked with them on their idea and then used the results of that work (the intellectual property) to start Facebook.

Similarly, you can't patent an concept, but you can patent an implementation of the concept. Nobody can patent the concept of a decentralized peer-to-peer electronic cash system, but Satoshi can certainly patent Bitcoin, which is an implementation of that concept.

Anyway, although I have researched this subject extensively, I'm not an expert, so my post may contain some inaccuracies.
2184  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: BItcoin: The path to $10,000,000 ten million dollars per coin on: December 06, 2019, 05:19:44 PM
Actually, Hal Finney predicted 10 years ago that bitcoin could reach $10 million per coin. His assumptions were if the entire world M1 (or cash equivalent) would move over to bitcoin or about $300 trillion or something.
Still, that's going to take at least a couple of decades, so maybe 2040 or 2050 we can revisit this thread and see what has happened.
YES YOU ARE RIGHT, I fkn forgot about that post from Hal Finney...OMG.
But, we are getting to 10 million per coin waaaay before those years.

I believe that you are referring to the post in which he considers the possibility of Bitcoin replacing all the wealth of the world. Simply stated, he is wrong because money can't do that. He is conflating the "store of value" and "unit of account" aspects of money. For example, a house that you own has a value that is part of your wealth, but the house cannot not be replaced by Bitcoin.

It is also a mistake to compare Bitcoin to M1, M2, etc. because those money supply values include the result of fractional reserve banking. The correct comparison is the global monetary base. Matthew Mežinskis and Fernando Ulrich (cryptovoices.com) have done a lot of work along these lines and have come up with a maximum potential value of the Bitcoin money supply -- about 19 trillion USD, or about 900 thousand USD per bitcoin. Keep in mind that those values assume that Bitcoin will replace all of the money, which is not likely to ever happen. Note also that the values do not account for future economic growth and lost bitcoins.
2185  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Did Satoshi steal other people's ideas for Bitcoin and one reason why he left? on: December 06, 2019, 10:48:07 AM
I have had many silent thoughts on this matter and I contemplated the outcome of this experiment, if Satoshi decided to reveal his true identity. How many people would actually take him to court for intellectual copyright infringement? Companies like PayPal revolutionized person-to-person payments online and they might even find a reason to sue him.  Roll Eyes

You can't copyright an idea (at least, in the U.S.).
2186  Other / Off-topic / Re: Flat Earth on: December 06, 2019, 10:28:02 AM
^^^ Your attempt to debunk that encyclopedia entry with .gov propaganda and tar me as a fool is a bad joke, let me explain:

   The encyclopedia article says the dome is 13,000 feet high "at about latitude 80°S., longitude 90°E.", and you claim I'm a fool because there's a mountain at "80°22′ S 77°22′ E" with dome in its name.

I'm not "debunking" anything. I'm just telling you that the encyclopedia is referring to Dome Argus, which is at about latitude 80°S., longitude 90°E and has an elevation of 13000 feet. Do you really think that an encyclopedia would mention the dome covering the earth? It's a mainstream publication written by mainstream scientists.
2187  Other / Off-topic / Re: Flat Earth on: December 05, 2019, 11:32:59 PM

Source: Encyclopedia Americana (1958)

You should be more careful. That "dome" is not what you think it is:

Dome Argus

Location: 80°22′ S 77°22′ E.

With a surface elevation of 4093 metres, Dome Argus is the highest place in East Antarctica ...

It seems to me that many flat-earthers often quote information that they don't understand. It is apparent that most simply don't have the knowledge and skill in math and science to understand and evaluate what they are reading, so they tend to point to evidence that is invalid and sometimes even irrelevant (such as in this case).

A good example of this lack of knowledge and skill in math and science is the misuse of refraction and perspective to explain the setting sun. Refraction and perspective are both well-understood and have a solid mathematical foundations. Someone that understands the math and science of refraction and perspective would have to conclude that they cannot be used to explain the setting sun.

While I don't believe the earth is flat, I would certainly entertain the notion if only there were a rigorous mathematical and scientific foundation supporting the theory. It is disappointing that flat-earthers cannot provide this.
2188  Other / Serious discussion / Re: Monaleza the reason for ups and downs!?!?!?!?!? on: November 30, 2019, 01:02:31 AM
The "signals" service is a common scam that has been around for a long time.

If they can actually predict movements, they don't need to make money by providing a service. In fact if they were really legitimate, such a service would inhibit their own profits.

Typically, the signals service scam is a pump-and-dump scheme. They first invest in an asset and then they recommend it (the "pump"). When clients start buying, the price goes up and they dump theirs for a big profit. Eventually, nobody is buying and everybody is selling. The price plummets and everybody loses money.
2189  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: Trying to figure out if my physical bitcoin is loaded with digital bitcoin on: November 30, 2019, 12:45:35 AM
A true physical bitcoin contains bitcoins. Yours doesn't. The coin can be bought on Amazon for $4.40 + shipping.

https://www.amazon.com/Authentic-BITCOIN-Commemorative-Round-Collectors/dp/B075FDGX48
2190  Other / Off-topic / Re: Flat Earth on: November 29, 2019, 05:47:06 PM
Flat Earth Logic ...

That is not the flat earth model. Try again.
2191  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Why bitcoin can not become a global currency on: November 29, 2019, 12:56:07 AM
Well, I think you have a valid point, there must be a means of ensuring accountability with Bitcoin, or else it will just end up being used for crimes because of its unaccountability.

Cars, shoes, email and phones are all being used for crimes. Should we ensure accountability of those, also?
2192  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Why the next Bitcoin halvening could be the most dramatic one yet on: November 28, 2019, 03:17:02 AM
...
Heralding a bull run
Historically, Bitcoin bull runs have been linked with halvings.
...

Despite the popularity of the myth, here is no correlation between halvings and bull runs.

Here is a simple way to show that: Take a log price chart, and without looking at the dates see if you can figure out from the chart when the halvings occurred. Next, assuming that there are certain features in the chart that indicate the times of the halving, note that those features also point to non-halvings. There is no correlation.
2193  Economy / Services / Re: strategy bitmex on: November 24, 2019, 06:58:03 AM
hi where to find investors ?I have developed a strategy in which a week you can earn 10% on bitmex
Smells like a scam. If you can earn 10% per week, you don't need investors.
so I have a balance of 0.008 and how long do I need to reach 1 bitcoin?

At 10% per week, it will take less than a year.
2194  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: BItcoin: The path to $10,000,000 ten million dollars per coin on: November 24, 2019, 06:52:44 AM
Quote from:  link=topic=5202906.msg53151127#msg53151127 date=1574447439
patroncito is a fag, as it is all he thinks about.
Hard facts and Khaos are officially warning people not to fall for the retarded lies spread by the idiot knows as patroncito.
Here , Fixed that for You!
 Cool
I know who you are, and I have had the sweet company of your wife everytime you are out.....ask her. Nobody believes you anyways. Everyone here knows the great potential bitcoin have and that there are a lot of nonsend idiots like you and hard facts who like to talk down Bitcoin.
Oh by the way, she found a dildo in your closet.
Oh , so your the idiot that screwed the transvestite that was house sitting for us,  
sorry my wife and I were on vacation that week.
The transvestite must have brought the dildo, and God knows where he/she had it.
You might want to get an aids test.
FYI:
Personal note, screen house sitters better in the future.  Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy

2195  Other / Off-topic / Re: Flat Earth on: November 24, 2019, 06:46:26 AM
Water always finds its level.

I've seen that written so many times by flat earthers, but I don't know what it means. I wonder if it isn't just a mantra. Can you explain what it means in more scientific terms?
2196  Economy / Services / Re: strategy bitmex on: November 23, 2019, 09:14:57 AM
hi where to find investors ?I have developed a strategy in which a week you can earn 10% on bitmex

Smells like a scam. If you can earn 10% per week, you don't need investors.
2197  Other / Serious discussion / Re: We're not cutting co2 emissions any time soon on: November 22, 2019, 12:01:37 AM
The fact is, nuclear power is by far the most efficient form of alternate energy away from fossil fuels and nuclear power is the only way climate change is going to get addressed with current energy needs. China and India are not going to slow down population growth any time soon and coal/fossil fuels aren't going to get the job done.

This sort of statement has always (in the past, at least) ignored the issue of nuclear waste. There's always some large proportion of nuclear fuel that cannot be repurposed once it's life-cycle in the powerplant is complete. It tends to be the highly radioactive material with 100's or 1000's of years half-life, and it therefore needs incredibly long-term safe/secure storage facilities.

I can believe that the re-use of spent nuclear fuel is constantly improving, but there's always going to be some significant proportion that cannot be reused or re-processed, and it's always an unrepresented hidden cost of the entire "enterprise" (i.e. the long term costs of storing radioactive waste offset against the economics of running a nuclear power plant make it appear overall a very expensive way of producing electricity)

The key question is this: For an equivalent amount of generated energy, which produces a more dangerous amount of waste -- nuclear or fossil fuels? I believe the answer is that fossil fuels produce the more dangerous waste.

Also, which will cost more -- storing nuclear waste safely or mitigating the effects of global warming? I believe the answer is that mitigating the effects of global warming will cost more.
2198  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: BItcoin: The path to $10,000,000 ten million dollars per coin on: November 21, 2019, 11:42:47 PM
I have a question for everyone. Was 20,000 expected or even predicted in 2010??. If you have said that one single Bitcoin would be worth 20 thousand dollars in the next 20 years in 2010 people would just laugh and call you crazy, retarded and drug addict. Wake up!!!!!

Everyone is thinking in FIAT and stock market terms. Bitcoin is not a stock nor fiat.

Sure, $20k was unexpected, but I don't think anyone thought it was impossible. On the other hand, you can't provide any facts or numbers that might support your $10 million value. I can see the price potentially reaching $300k someday, and even $1 million because of speculation, but $10 million would be hard to justify.

If you could justify a $10 million price, then I would have to agree with you. But I don't think you can. You are fooling yourself with your wishful thinking and unrealistic expectations.
2199  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: [Merits again] Discuss the velocity of Bitcoin on: November 20, 2019, 09:44:05 AM
The term "velocity" comes from the Equation of Exchange, MV = PQ, where M is the money supply, V is the velocity, and PQ is the total value of goods exchanged for the money. The velocity can be thought of the number of times a particular unit of the money is spent in the time period.

The velocity is important because it determines the value of the money supply. You can rewrite the equation as M = PQ / V. Since the number of bitcoins can be considered constant at 21 million (though we are actually not quite there yet), this shows that the value of a bitcoin depends on adoption (as measured by PQ) and the velocity. Assuming constant adoption, increasing the velocity results in a lower value and decreasing the velocity results in a higher value.

The velocity is affected by several factors, including hoarding, fractional reserve banking, and technology.

Hoarding: If a portion of the money supply is hoarded and thus spent very slowly, then that behavior, of course, reduces the velocity.

Fractional Reserve Banking: With fractional reserve banking, each actual bitcoin backs a larger number of apparent bitcoins. The ratio is called the money multiplier, and the velocity is increased by this ratio. You could instead apply the ratio to the number of bitcoins, but I think it is easier to apply it to the velocity and stick with a constant 21 million bitcoins.

Technology: One of the factors that affects the velocity is simply how quickly a person can spend money that they have received. For example, the artificial delay in money transfers in the U.S. ("3 to 5 business days") lowers the velocity. Technology can speed this up. Bitcoins can be spent again by a receiver even before the transaction has been confirmed. The Lightning Network allows bitcoins locked up in channels to be spent and respent over and over. Better technology increases the velocity.

2200  Economy / Speculation / Re: In 3 sentence or Less- Post your Fundamental Analysis of Bitcoin on: November 20, 2019, 08:56:35 AM
Any real fundamental analysis starts with:  MV = PQ
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