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2181  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Is Bitcoin upgradeable to support smart contract? on: May 03, 2018, 11:45:46 PM
Basic smart contracts are already supported, otherwise Lightning Network wouldn't be deployable on the Bitcoin blockchain and token protocol layers such as Counterparty and OMNI of Tether fame wouldn't exist. There's little fanfare about it and they are rather limited in comparison to the likes of Ethereum, but Bitcoin does have scripting capabilities even now.

Apart from that there's the Rootstock sidechain in the works, which is already running mainnet tests:
https://www.rsk.co/

And somewhere far, far down the road we might even see the likes of Simplicity implemented and deployed:
https://blockstream.com/simplicity.pdf

FYI, specifically Bitcoin only support Non-Turing Complete script which use Stack-based programming language for simplicity and that's why most people refer it as basic smart contract or script.
If Bitcoin were to support Turing Complete, that would make lots of new bugs/vulnerability and burden the network due to Smart/Complicated smart-contract. Also, that would mean Bitcoin smart-contract use another language since i doubt anyone use Stack-based programming language these days.

In my opinion Turing-complete smart contracts are the biggest blunder to ever grace blockchains. They are simply not rigorous enough for an immutable, adversarial environment. The incentive to exploit a smart contract is too high to rely on scripts that can not be proven to be correct. Accordingly I welcome the decision to keep Simplicity non-Turing-complete. While current Bitcoin scripting capabilities are rather limited, Simplicity could change that in a secure and sane manner. Let's see if it ever gets beyond being a concept though.



I think it would not be as interesting as  you said,because there is no need for such a thing...Anyway its possible because of bitcoin’s developing nature but why do you need it when we already have ethereum? If there are problems in ethereum,we all know how good are the members of this project,therefore I can boldly say that they will develope everything on maximum level...

That's a silly thing to say.

"Why do we need Bitcoin if we already have the Dollar?"

"Why do we need email if we already have fax?"

"Why do we need automobiles if we already have horses?"
2182  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Bitcoin Technical Stack on: May 03, 2018, 05:18:47 PM
Oh really, well that's cool, I thought that you needed the entire space at first.

It would be cool to be able to run a pruned node by only downloading the last 550 MB of blocks or whatever setting you've selected, but I guess that is nonsense and would lead to endless possible exploits and problems.

What is the ideal setting to use in terms of decent security levels? if the setting is too low, it wouldn't be safe, if it's too high, it defeats the purpose of prunning... what is a good balance? 10GB maybe?

Actually I think for most use cases 550 MB should be plenty.

I'm not sure if I'm missing any metadata, but that's about 140 - 550 blocks worth of confirmations, depending on whether you assume full SegWit-transactions-only or full legacy-transactions-only blocks. Coinbase maturity seems like an adequate baseline and requires 100 confirmations, so these 140 - 550 blocks that a fully pruned node stores look good enough to me for the average user.
2183  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: Bitcoin Mining on: May 03, 2018, 04:20:37 PM
How to mine bitcoin?Is their any software or any websites to mine bitcoin.Websites like Bitminer are real or fake?

I've never heard of BitMiner before, and seeing how they claim to be "an industry leading Bitcoin mining pool" and are expecting you to send them money they are very likely trying to scam people.

BitMinter is a legit mining pool, BitMiner probably not so much.

Two rules of thumb:

1) If a website claims to mine for you, they're only after your money. This includes cloud mining services such as:

study this site with a little quality time and clear mind, it will help https://www.nicehash.com/

2) If a website offers software for download that supposedly mines on your home PC, they are likely trying to get you infected.


In general, cryptocurrency mining requires dedicated hardware. In the case of Bitcoin that's ASICs, specialized hardware that are good for nothing besides mining Bitcoin. Some alternative currencies also require ASICs nowadays. Most alts that don't require ASICs, will make only make sense to mine if you set up a dedicated mining rig using consumer grade, high-end GPUs. Either way you'll have to get physical.


If you're serious about getting into mining, check out the BitcoinTalk mining sub-boards. Make sure to read the stickies first.

Bitcoin mining:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?board=14.0

Alt coin mining:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?board=160.0
2184  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: How to run seperate wallet on same server? on: May 03, 2018, 01:36:54 PM
Running full nodes on a VPS is fine, but you definitely want to store the funds in cold storage.

Either implement application logic to immediately move the coins from your VPS hot wallet to cold storage, or better yet, use an xpub key to have the coins sent straight to cold storage without even touching the online server. Then fill the hot wallet from there, as required.

If you have an online server sending Bitcoins to another online server you're doing security wrong.


[...] The server will automatically reject most of these scan requests, but it is something to be aware of at all times.

Only if you set the server up accordingly. Out of the box your run-of-the-mill VPS server is a hackers-delight free-for-all all-you-can-crack buffet.
2185  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: If initiate sending bitcoin, it can't be reversible? on: May 03, 2018, 12:06:09 PM
So how much probability this orphaned block can happen? And if it happen, it does not sent to receiver actually?

The chances of an orphaned block happening rely mostly on the interval between blocks and the network connectivity between miners and nodes. With Bitcoin the chances of orphaned blocks are rather slim. To find out the probability of an orphaned block in practice you'll probably have to look at the orphaned block rate of the last few years and make an estimate based on those numbers. You'd probably have to check various sources though, because not all nodes are aware of all orphaned blocks.

If a block with a newly confirmed transaction is orphaned, and the transaction is not included in one of the other blocks, it simply remains unconfirmed until it gets included in a block. So basically -- it's been sent, but the confirmation never happened.


I found that orphaned block occured few times in a month at last year (2017-04), but from then to now, no orphaned block occured. Why?

Orphaned blocks happen all the time, the last being recorded by blockchain.info on January 2018:
https://blockchain.info/orphaned-blocks

Note that different nodes may see different orphaned blocks. Some orphans you see may not be seen by other nodes and vice versa. The only thing that is kept consistent across nodes is the blockchain -- consistency across nodes being one of the blockchain's main intent.
2186  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Technical Support / Re: Can a HD XPubkey be obtained back from a derived public address? on: May 03, 2018, 11:16:22 AM
What you should be aware of is that anyone who has access to your xpub key will be able to track any transaction that will move through its derived addresses. So while not as critical as private keys, you should also keep your xpub key safe from prying eyes, otherwise your privacy may be compromised.

Other than that, just like bob123 said: No, you can't derive the xpub key from one of its child public keys.
2187  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Resurrecting the Champ: PoW to become Bitmain/Buterin resistant on: May 02, 2018, 12:39:45 PM
For Bitcoin, I've come to a solution for implementing ASIC resistance with minimum side effects and risks. I'll discuss it in more details in a dedicated thread but for now I just use the core idea to show how wide is the range of possibilities:

[...]

Like many others in this thread I also highly doubt that a hashing algorithm can be found that will remain ASIC proof for the foreseeable future (say, 10 years from deployment), especially given the size of the market and the profits to be made.

I also see a lot of practical problems with your approach -- organizing non-partisan and sound reviews of MemHash, getting the community on board, difficulty / hashrate fluctuations during the transition period for example.

That being said, I'm looking forward to read a fleshed out version of your proposal.
2188  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Why does Bitcoin keep using SHA256 in its POW? on: May 02, 2018, 08:08:16 AM
Wouldn't it be good for the stability of Bitcoin's network to have numerous small miners scattered throughout the world rather than a couple of big miners centralized in those parts of the world where electricity is cheap? Wasn't that the original idea back then in 2009? I believe so. But I also get the reality of this mining business and I know that what I'm asking is probably unrealistic. People with big money will always find a way to game the system.

I am emphasizing the above sentence "couple of big miners centralized in those parts of the world where electricity is cheap?"

I want to ask you this: if some parts of the world have cheap electricity, do you think big miners will not arise there if the best hash implementations are runnable only on wetware brains, CPU, GPUs, or FPGAs, but NOT ASICs?

The issue is not ASICs, but about cheap electricity.

Interesting argument, but the issue still lies with ASICs, in that the access to ASICs is rather restricted -- as opposed to consumer hardware such as GPUs and CPUs -- while ASICs producer also stand to gain money by simpling producing ASICs for themselves rather than the general public.

Cheap electricity leads to geographical hotspots, but the core of the problem is the centralization of power in a handful of companies, rather than territories. A multitude of companies from various nations all mining in China is less of a problem than a single company mining all over the world. Not that the first option would be optimal, mind you.
2189  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Is Bitcoin upgradeable to support smart contract? on: May 01, 2018, 10:29:21 AM
Basic smart contracts are already supported, otherwise Lightning Network wouldn't be deployable on the Bitcoin blockchain and token protocol layers such as Counterparty and OMNI of Tether fame wouldn't exist. There's little fanfare about it and they are rather limited in comparison to the likes of Ethereum, but Bitcoin does have scripting capabilities even now.

Apart from that there's the Rootstock sidechain in the works, which is already running mainnet tests:
https://www.rsk.co/

And somewhere far, far down the road we might even see the likes of Simplicity implemented and deployed:
https://blockstream.com/simplicity.pdf
2190  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Is Lightning Network inherently flawed due to required 24/7 online on: May 01, 2018, 07:41:53 AM
Most people already pay someone to check and make sure someone else isn't stealing your money. Banks, credit card providers, PayPal, etc do just that. With the exception of banks they merely got fairly good at hiding these costs from the average consumer.

That being said, I don't think watchtowers are a good solution either. Unless we find a trustless way to solve this issue, that is.

Yeah I mean for watchtowers...the point of decentralization is to NOT to have to trust others and pay them for that trust, the point is to cut out the middleman, hence Watchtowers would seem a big step backwards from decentralization.

Of course. Yet people use services such as Coinbase as a wallet. Some people even seem to prefer centralized cryptocurrencies for whatever good they are, but that's a different matter.

Like Danny pointed out, it's all about options. If centralized watchtowers become a thing I would definitely recommend people to avoid using them, just like I recommend people to not store money on exchanges or other centralized services. Some people may prefer it for convenience or whatever other reason one could think of. But keep in mind that using LN is both optional and probably not the end of the road as far as scaling is concerned. The Bitcoin base layer, ie. on-chain transactions, can still be used as is and other scaling improvements or protocol layers may come up in the future.

LN does not have to become THE payment platform / scaling solution for Bitcoin. But as long as it keeps some of the load off-chain it will definitely help.


I agree Bitcoin should stay as decentralized as possible, but if it can't scale then it isn't really a global currency. In that case it only enables a tiny fraction of the globe to take part in trustless permissionless payments.

Fair enough. Let's hope LN covers enough use cases to help keep transactions off-chain then Smiley


[...] Hopefully the design of the LN client applications hides some things and lets you know who is online and who isn't and if the application could queue up a payment until the other user got online that'd be pretty crucial too.

And that's exactly what I mean by good user experience mostly being a question of hiding and providing the right amount of information. Just because some aspects of LN's user experience are currently imperfect doesn't mean it has to stay that way.
2191  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Is Lightning Network inherently flawed due to required 24/7 online on: April 30, 2018, 09:38:36 PM
You're saying people can choose if they want to use bitcoin or a standard centralized service. Well of course. But isn't the point to get them to use Bitcoin, but that will only happen if the UX is as good as current options, and needing to be online 24/7 for LN cuts out an important use case for bitcoin.

The point of Bitcoin is to enable global, trustless, permissionless payments and to provide an alternative to already existing centralized services. Mass adoption is a nice-to-have but not the main goal -- at least in my opinion.

Now I'm not saying that user experience isn't important. I'm just saying that it's secondary to keeping Bitcoin as decentralized as possible. Also I'm fairly positive there's still room for improvement despite certain technological limitations. After all creating a good user experience is mostly a question of hiding and providing the right amount of control and information.


As far as Watchtowers that seems like a bad idea to me, because that would cost money, so you have to pay someone to check to make sure someone else isn't stealing your money. Why would the average member of the public choose to use a payment network in which that was the case? They wouldn't. I certainly wouldn't.

Most people already pay someone to check and make sure someone else isn't stealing your money. Banks, credit card providers, PayPal, etc do just that. With the exception of banks they merely got fairly good at hiding these costs from the average consumer.

That being said, I don't think watchtowers are a good solution either. Unless we find a trustless way to solve this issue, that is.
2192  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Technical Support / Re: what kind of node asic has on: April 30, 2018, 08:30:41 PM
But from a technical perspective it seems like they could run a pruned node just as well, since they only care about current transactions. Or would a mining pool be prevented from publishing blocks if they are not connected to the network as a full node?
Something tells me they might not get accepted if they don't run a full node.

Why not?

A valid block is a valid block.  The protocol and the rest of the network doesn't care how that block came into being, nor does the network know how that block came into being.

That's what I thought, thank you for confirming my suspicion. I was thinking that I may be missing a subtle technical reason for a mining pool being required to run a full node but I couldn't think of one.


Or they'd get DDoS a rediculous amount if they tried to get away without running one.

How would you know if they are running a pruned node or not?
If the pool is big enough, there will be people who run analytics on it.

I'm pretty sure most miners just try which pool works best for them and then point their hashrate on it. Unfortunately people are barely caring about keeping the hashrate decentralized, I doubt many care about whether their pool of choice runs a full node or not as long as its reliable. Besides, if your pool is large enough you already got a big fat target painted on your back either way. There's plenty of reasons to DDoS a mining pool, them not running a full node probably being one of the pettiest.


What is forgotton is that miners should also be the main node runners and they should be able to distribute the blockchain.

Miners should create valid blocks.  That's all.  They are welcome to run full nodes and distribute the blockchain if they want to, but there is no requirement for them to do so.
They get a profit from the adoption of a chain as more people will start in the coin. Newbies also generally probably pay higher fees than other older members who can wait on their transactions as there's not as much excitement with sending a transaction now as there was when I sent say my first transaction. A greater bandwidth means that more people cna download and run core well as there's less people wanting to access the data per node.

From a purely business-oriented perspective, miners don't care which chain to follow. Rationally speaking they will simply follow the currency that is the most profitable. I also don't think that miners care much about user experience when it comes to a newbie opting for the Bitcoin Core wallet.

Whether they should run a full node from a "corporate responsibility" point of view is a different question of course. But I doubt it meaningfully influences their bottom line.


Also, if you have to reindex from a non-full node and you're bad a plotting failovers then the sync may take a bit longer initially.

That I could imagine to be a valid point of concern for a mining pool operator.
2193  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Technical Support / Re: Setting Up First Wallet -- BitcoinCore 0.16.0 on: April 30, 2018, 05:30:15 PM
Is it OK / safe to store the block chain on an external drive?  I have seen products which are 'physical wallets' (a USB drive) which seems like the same concept as I am investigating here.

To add to what achow101 and bob123 already posted on this matter:

Note that the blockchain is something entirely different from your wallet.

The blockchain is a collection of files that contains the whole history of every transaction ever made. A wallet file is a collection of private keys that enables you to sign transactions for later publishing on the blockchain.

Your wallet file, ie. your private keys or the seed from which the private keys are derived, is what you want to keep safe.

That's why the blockchain can be stored on an online device (well, it has to be an online device by necessity, as it has to be connected to other nodes to stay up-to-date) while your private keys should be stored on an air-gapped, offline device.

That's why with Armory you usually have a watch-only wallet that is connected to the internet (the one syncing with the blockchain) and an offline-wallet installed on a separate, air-gapped device that doesn't require the blockchain (the one you use to sign transactions with). Hardware wallets are basically the latter, in a more compact form, with the blockchain being hosted on a third party server.

Note that if you run Armory on a single device, without using two separate devices for a watch-only wallet and an offline-wallet respectively, you are effectively running a hot wallet and not using Armory's full security potential (ie. cold storage).
2194  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Technical Support / Re: what kind of node asic has on: April 30, 2018, 05:03:59 PM
in short. all Mining pools run a full node?. or some of pools are not?.  

If you want to run a pool, you need access to a node... So yes, they are either running a node, or they are paying somebody to run a node they can query.
The pool needs at very least the header of the previous block, and if they don't want to mine blocks with only the coinbase transaction, they also need information about the broadcasted transactions... And if they want to include these transactions, they need to update their utxo set, so they need to parse the complete blockchain... In other words: they need to run a node Smiley

I think what OP is asking is whether mining pool operators use a full or a pruned node.

In general it seems to make sense for mining pools to run a full node, since if you already harness millions of dollars worth of computational power there's no sense on skimping when it comes to running a node, amirite?

But from a technical perspective it seems like they could run a pruned node just as well, since they only care about current transactions. Or would a mining pool be prevented from publishing blocks if they are not connected to the network as a full node?
2195  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Why does Bitcoin keep using SHA256 in its POW? on: April 28, 2018, 11:11:53 PM
IMO, ASICs are fine. With CPU and GPU only coins, the possibility of botnets would still be there. One CPU one vote has never been a reality.

I also think that for the most part the upsides of ASICs outweigh their downsides. ASICs themselves are not problematic, it's when there's too little competition in the mining market that things could get ugly.

Given the recent uptick of Bitcoin's valuation I think it's likely that we'll see new players entering the mining business over the next couple of years though -- keeping the market fresh and flowing.


The question that comes in my mind is not regarded to ASIC resistance, but to the security of the hash function over time. What will happen with the current SHA256 implementation when SHA256 gets depricated and declared unsafe?

Depends on what kind of flaw is found. Keep in mind that the use case of a PoW scheme is different from the use case of eg. hashing your users' passwords.

Best case it's the kind of flaw that makes SHA256 faster to calculate, in which case we'll simply see a new generation of miners.

Worst case Bitcoin needs to hardfork to a new PoW scheme. This would come with a lot of drama on which algo to choose, possibly leading to a multitude of competing PoW hardforks, but sooner or later one blockchain would emerge as the canonical Bitcoin blockchain. Even then we might see the original, SHA256 Bitcoin, continuing its existence although at likely a much lower market rate, corresponding to the severity of the found flaw.
2196  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: [LIST] List of decentralized Stablecoins on: April 28, 2018, 10:38:59 PM
Nice writeup. While I don't follow Stablecoins all that closely it definitely is interesting to see a comprehensive list of approaches at controlling volatility.

I'm not quite convinced that stability can be reliably achieved within tolerance levels that are acceptable for the general populace (say, < 5%) but they do give an opportunity to look at market forces in wholly new ways.
2197  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: How cryptocurrencies emerged as a side product of digital cash on: April 27, 2018, 02:45:29 PM
To realize digital cash you need a payment network with accounts, balances, and transaction.

Not quite, Bitcoin has neither accounts nor balances Wink

It's just transactions all the way down...

Bitcoin has neither accounts nor balances, but it is not transaction all the way down. Bitcoin(and other cryptocurrencies as well) have wallet, which is used instead of accounts, with a designated address to send  and receive coins which can be controlled by using the private key. It also got blockchain that helps it successfully finish one cycle of transaction and block explorer to track the transaction's progress.

It really is just transactions all the way down though, that's how the protocol works. All that wallets do is process these transaction in a way that make sense to the user. That is, they scan the blockchain for transactions of which they can spend the outputs and show it to as the balance of the respective address and subsequently as the total balance of the wallet or account (the latter applying to HD wallets).

In the case of Bitcoin, accounts and balances are just metaphors that we use to make our life easier. From a technical perspective they are neither needed nor implemented.
2198  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: I.T Professionals and bitcoin industry on: April 25, 2018, 04:11:03 PM

Once the monthly wage is gone from a mobile wallet, those people will lose all trust into cryptos (even if their mobile is at fault).
A few of such cases would lead to a huge wave of criticism towards cryptos in general.

I don't know for sure but so far Bitcoin itself seems to have held up quite well when it comes to security but as I understand it
if a lightning wallet transmits an out of date transaction to the network then the banking hub can claim all the money in the
off-chain private ledger.

Only your direct counterparty can claim the collateral in case of a explicitely provoked channel state mismatch. Routing nodes along the way have no say in this. They don't even know who's sending how much to whom.


Thing is who do you call if it was not your fault and how can you compete against bankers rules since they have full access to the
protocol that won't be available to normal wallets.

No such thing as different kinds of access to the protocol. Both the protocol specification and the various LN implementations are open source and available to the public.
2199  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Why Transaction Fees in the First Place? on: April 25, 2018, 02:49:40 PM
Market forces did not work when it came to Tx fees as they hit $55 per transaction with these 20,000 miners
so obviously it's nothing more than a monopoly.

I'm not sure what you're trying to say here, but mining has nothing to with how much transaction fees are calculated.

There's limited space on the blockchain. As such, if the demand (ie. transaction count) exceeds the supply (ie. available space per block) mining fees go up, as people try to get on top of the priority list. That's how a market works. That's all there is to it.


EVO/IOTA/Ripple/RailHash/DAC

PayPal and VISA, you forgot about those two.
2200  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: Hackers everywhere - GUIDE - How to keep your crypto wealth safe on: April 25, 2018, 01:31:30 PM
Solid writeup. Apart from some typos, just two minor nitpicks:

Quote from: Crypto Community Foundation
all ERC20 tokens can be stored in wallet you can create at myetherwallet.com and then to access them is most secure to use metamask Google or Firefox extension

myetherwallet can also be used in conjunction with hardware wallets, which is yet another step up from metamask Wink


Quote from: Crypto Community Foundation
always use antivirus — Avast, AVG, Norton, ..

Nowadays third party antivirus software is turning out to be more of a liability rather than an improvement. They tend to install questionable root certificates and effectively MitM otherwise secure connections. All in all third party antivirus software increases your attack surface, so in most cases your probably better off using the antivirus software that comes out-of-the-box with your operating system (eg. Windows Defender in the case of, well, Windows).

It is also worth noting that against properly written, targeted attacks, most antivirus software is pretty much useless.


But apart from that, like I said, solid writeup.
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