Hello Everyone,
If you're running a larger than normal wallet and set "Amount to anonymize" to a really high amount, the client will prioritize money that has not been denominated, in effect denominating the entire amount ONCE (this could look like the round > 1 bug, but it's not). No input will reach 2 rounds before that amount is met. When the client detects you've reached the threshold you set, it will then start denominating round 2, then 3, etc.
From the looks of the thread all issues users are experiencing are not bugs at this point, just a misunderstanding of how Darksend works. All major bugs have been resolved and I'm going to move on to RC5 and other unique features of Darkcoin that we've had in the works for awhile (I'm going to wait till all of the weak hands have left the building then I have some really cool stuff to announce).
-Evan
ex1) Amount to anonymize : 1000 https://i.imgur.com/GRyMmNR.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/sVY9ov6.pngex2) Amount to anonymize : 50000 https://i.imgur.com/sxCuQSr.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/USlUvpQ.pngReading Evan post and looking at this behavior it seems "buggy" to me for large wallets with a large amount to DRK set to be anonymized. Why would 1 confirmation on all inputs be sufficient to start the next round it one case BUT an unknown amount of confirmations required to start the next round in another? No not buggy. ex1) 1000. ---> amount 1000 go round 2 and 3. ex2) 50000 ---> check confirmation, it's what Evan said. rounds = 1. different confirmation. OK got it. But why don't I see the rest of the 50,000 in coin control marked with -2? |
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Hello Everyone,
If you're running a larger than normal wallet and set "Amount to anonymize" to a really high amount, the client will prioritize money that has not been denominated, in effect denominating the entire amount ONCE (this could look like the round > 1 bug, but it's not). No input will reach 2 rounds before that amount is met. When the client detects you've reached the threshold you set, it will then start denominating round 2, then 3, etc.
From the looks of the thread all issues users are experiencing are not bugs at this point, just a misunderstanding of how Darksend works. All major bugs have been resolved and I'm going to move on to RC5 and other unique features of Darkcoin that we've had in the works for awhile (I'm going to wait till all of the weak hands have left the building then I have some really cool stuff to announce).
-Evan
ex1) Amount to anonymize : 1000   https://i.imgur.com/GRyMmNR.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/sVY9ov6.pngex2) Amount to anonymize : 50000   https://i.imgur.com/sxCuQSr.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/USlUvpQ.pngReading Evan's post and looking at this behavior it seems "buggy" to me in the case of large wallets with a large amount to DRK set to be anonymized. Why would 1 confirmation on all inputs be sufficient to start the next round it one case BUT an unknown amount of confirmations required to start the next round in another? |
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The price is rising again, we're back to 0.0055
I actually think it is a good thing that the price has dropped like this because it shakes out all the weak hands that had unrealistic expectations and those that can't tell the difference between DRK, which is trying to reinvent the wheel, and other anon coins which are rife with problems or are merely adding trusted mixers to the blockchain. Once those "investors" are gone the coin will be in better shape. Plus the accumulation of stronger hands will concide with the tech being in better shape (compared to previous rallies) owing to all the work the devs and testers have put in. If you can get BTC ready fast enough this is the time to accumulate. |
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CAN NOBODY HERE SEE WHAT I AM POSTING?
Question: I have read your post and a bit confused. I am new to drk, can you give me a break down of how much time it should takes to send various amounts of dark anonymously? Dark anonymizes the funds ahead of time and is constantly mixing the coin supply. This way when you need to spend, the transactions are immediate no need to wait. People are experimenting with how much time it takes to put large amount of DRK through the maximum 8 rounds of mixing which is an absolute over kill from a practical perspective, but is inevitable to want to test the system limits. But really you just anonymize once at your leisure and your anon coins sit there ready to be spent when you need to. Indeed ! People are not getting it! ... I put my coins on a ridiculous 4 round and only took about 2h to get 4000 DRK totally anonymised, and at a fraction cost so low its almost daft to consider!! Ok one further question.. Can you explain what is the difference between 1 round, 2 round, 3, etc of mixing. Why is 8 rounds even an option if 1 round is sufficient? How do you know how many rounds to pick to get anonymous? The several rounds are just to eliminate the possibility of a large number of masternodes colluding with each other to deanon transactions. The possibility of that happening is very very low with 2 hops and with 8 rounds is just practically impossible. There is a spreadsheet showing the probabilities in the link below and also an explanation from Evan on how it works. https://darkcointalk.org/threads/development-updates-july-15th.1788/thx for the info. So if I understand this correctly, using this mathematics: https://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080126081910AAdbGVx60 of the current 600 masternodes are owned by bad actors, and I send 100 transactions at a rate of 2 hops, then there is a 63% chance that one will get detected? Is this right and is there any way to avoid this if I want to do a large number of transactions anonymously? No in that scenario there is a 0.98% chance that party that owns 60 masternodes can deanon a particular transaction. See no single masternode knows what is up in a round you have to own the 2 that are randonmly selected in each round. If only one node is selected that is not compromised the attacker looses the trail. Plus the mixing happens ahead of time and the spending at any given time so timing attacks are pointless. But I am not an expert just sharing what I understand, just wait for Kristov Atlas review which should come out soon. What I am saying is that, since there is a .98% of any single transaction (as you have said) then given any 100 single transactions, there is a 63% that at least one of them will be discovered. This is regardless of whether the transactions are related or not, just any 100 single transactions at 1% should give a 63% chance of at least one of them being comprimised. Use more than 2 rounds. Ok, so at 2 rounds it's likely to be unsecure if you are doing say 3-4 transactions / day for a month with the variables above.. So let's bump the rounds up to 3 rounds. Are there statistics somewhere for that? I didn't seem them on thespreadsheet.. I'd like to figure out how many dark transactions I can make with different variables before I am likely to get caught using Dark. In addition, won't using more rounds make the anonymizing process longer? is this likely to be an inconveniently long time, or just a little bit longer. Is there any statistics for how much longer per each round? The key question I am wondering is how to find the "sweet spot" of number of rounds and convenience for anonymous transactions using DRK The process is only long (and by that if I mean a couple hours) if you are doing 4/5k coins through a lot of rounds. A few hundred coins is fast even at 8 rounds. If you are doing 3-4 transactions per day during hours you are awake (say 15 hours a day) then you are looking at a 4-5 hours gap between sends on average. So unless you are wanting to send like 5k coins 3-4 times a day you won't be inconvenienced. That number of coins sent that often is what we call an edge case. And then there the fact that maybe only 500-600 people even have more than 5000 DRK to begin with... I will take the "wait" involved with this system any day over using mixers (built into the coin or otherwise) that might steal your coins. |
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CAN NOBODY HERE SEE WHAT I AM POSTING?
Question: I have read your post and a bit confused. I am new to drk, can you give me a break down of how much time it should takes to send various amounts of dark anonymously? Dark anonymizes the funds ahead of time and is constantly mixing the coin supply. This way when you need to spend, the transactions are immediate no need to wait. People are experimenting with how much time it takes to put large amount of DRK through the maximum 8 rounds of mixing which is an absolute over kill from a practical perspective, but is inevitable to want to test the system limits. But really you just anonymize once at your leisure and your anon coins sit there ready to be spent when you need to. Indeed ! People are not getting it! ... I put my coins on a ridiculous 4 round and only took about 2h to get 4000 DRK totally anonymised, and at a fraction cost so low its almost daft to consider!! Ok one further question.. Can you explain what is the difference between 1 round, 2 round, 3, etc of mixing. Why is 8 rounds even an option if 1 round is sufficient? How do you know how many rounds to pick to get anonymous? The several rounds are just to eliminate the possibility of a large number of masternodes colluding with each other to deanon transactions. The possibility of that happening is very very low with 2 hops and with 8 rounds is just practically impossible. There is a spreadsheet showing the probabilities in the link below and also an explanation from Evan on how it works. https://darkcointalk.org/threads/development-updates-july-15th.1788/thx for the info. So if I understand this correctly, using this mathematics: https://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080126081910AAdbGVx60 of the current 600 masternodes are owned by bad actors, and I send 100 transactions at a rate of 2 hops, then there is a 63% chance that one will get detected? Is this right and is there any way to avoid this if I want to do a large number of transactions anonymously? No in that scenario there is a 0.98% chance that party that owns 60 masternodes can deanon a particular transaction. See no single masternode knows what is up in a round you have to own the 2 that are randonmly selected in each round. If only one node is selected that is not compromised the attacker looses the trail. Plus the mixing happens ahead of time and the spending at any given time so timing attacks are pointless. But I am not an expert just sharing what I understand, just wait for Kristov Atlas review which should come out soon. What I am saying is that, since there is a .98% of any single transaction (as you have said) then given any 100 single transactions, there is a 63% that at least one of them will be discovered. This is regardless of whether the transactions are related or not, just any 100 single transactions at 1% should give a 63% chance of at least one of them being comprimised. Use more than 2 rounds. |
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Looking forward to the bounce.
Me too... If that bug is handled Monday, I'll be back to long hodl. If it's not, I'll just bail when I see a peak. I tried to put the issue out there, but this is worse than "patriotism." Some of these people would stab out their own eyes to avoid seeing what they don't want to see... The issue has been reproduced on testnet and is being handled. What else are you looking for, a public apology from the members here that didn't believe you at first? |
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Why all that drama. If you can't stand the heat sell already and invest in some random coins. Meanwhile I'm in for the long term, the tech is great and has a bright future do the math.
Yeah, at these prices for the first time in a while I might have to ready some BTC. |
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Camo, could it be something with your network or internet connection? It's so bewildering when 20+ people have reported that it works.
I used a public WiFi 30 miles from home. I'm not wasting any more of my time trying to get people to pay attention to the issue. If everyone wants to pretend it isn't real, I'm fine with that at this point. I really wanted this project to be something, but a refusal to acknowledge a problem that I have repeated and thoroughly documented is irrelevant just because "It works for me on totally non-similar conditions" whatever... Yeah, I'm a troll, whatever. Nobody spits in my face and continues to get my support. It was already acknowledged and a bug report posted. Just wait to see if it get fixed. |
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Super Stoked for RC4!
Does anyone happen to know when the update will be available for the Mac Wallet??
It's already available on the website. |
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Woah, wait...
Let's not all jump on the guy when he is sleeping. I don't know about sell walls or whatever, but he is a big supporter with a lot of coins who is frustrated. To a certain extent I understand his posts over the last few days.
That said, hopefully he realizes that he is basically the "last" person having issues, stops posting here where he will find no help for his edge case, and talks to Evan and the other devs directly.
Dude is obviously not a people person, but let's not call his issues fake and bash him.
I think they are completely fake as well I'm sorry... He said "If it wasn't happening to me I wouldn't believe me" just one to many times. I smelt a rat from the start... Well you are entitled to your opinion, but I just can't see a reason to sabotage your own investment. He posted a pic of a wallet with 10k+ DRK. If I had that much, I'd have pompoms glued to my hands... while trying to help as many people solve their issues as possible.  |
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Woah, wait...
Let's not all jump on the guy when he is sleeping. I don't know about sell walls or whatever, but he is a big supporter with a lot of coins who is frustrated. To a certain extent I understand his posts over the last few days.
That said, hopefully he realizes that he is basically the "last" person having issues, stops posting here where he will find no help for his edge case, and talks to Evan and the other devs directly.
Dude is obviously not a people person, but let's not call his issues fake and bash him.
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4 rounds went smoothly. Have not had any issues with this latest wallet.
Yeah, I think we are on to edge cases at this point. Not really expecting to hear about problems outside of camo's. |
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+1 Obvious liars are obvious Any problems with Darkcoin should be reported here : https://darkcointalk.org/threads/rc4-issues-bugs-feature-requests.2039/If confirmed, it will be added to the bug tracker and fixed for the next release. The bugtracker is open for public viewing if you are interested. Anybody bitching here about problems who aren't willing to make their claim on the official forum should be disregarded as FUD. Eat shit cuntbucket. You've just made my day. Seriously. What are you, twelve years old? Glad you like to fix things. Go report it on the official thread and you'll get help. If that sort of thing makes your day, then go back and read your own garbage for an orgasm. Being a shitbag with fancy words is still being a shit bag. Pardon me for getting tot he damn point and not wasting tact on a douche. No, wait, don't pardon me, I don't need an excuse to call a spade a spade. This conversation is over. Camo, what has happened to you? I don't remember you spreading so much negativity in the last months as you have in the last days. I like most am getting tired of reading about your damn edge case problems. You are monopolizing this thread with your issues and cluttering it with negativity. Do us all a favor and go get the the help you need from darkcointalk and irc and report back here when you have something constructive for us. You may think you are helping darkcoin but really you are doing great damage to confidence with your ongoing drama. Well, if it were working I wouldn't have to... You basically just want me to shut up so it looks ok when it isn't? I'm going to bed. You assholes can blow me. I don't think that is what is being said -- people are saying that you may not find the help you need here. You right Evan may have some updates tomorrow, but likely if you stick to these forums your issues will never be solved. If you don't want to sign up to those forums then at least open a direct dialog with Evan on irc or via mail. I believe that you can also log bug reports directly on Jira without having to engage with IRC or the devs or even sign up to darkcointalk. True. |
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+1 Obvious liars are obvious Any problems with Darkcoin should be reported here : https://darkcointalk.org/threads/rc4-issues-bugs-feature-requests.2039/If confirmed, it will be added to the bug tracker and fixed for the next release. The bugtracker is open for public viewing if you are interested. Anybody bitching here about problems who aren't willing to make their claim on the official forum should be disregarded as FUD. Eat shit cuntbucket. You've just made my day. Seriously. What are you, twelve years old? Glad you like to fix things. Go report it on the official thread and you'll get help. If that sort of thing makes your day, then go back and read your own garbage for an orgasm. Being a shitbag with fancy words is still being a shit bag. Pardon me for getting tot he damn point and not wasting tact on a douche. No, wait, don't pardon me, I don't need an excuse to call a spade a spade. This conversation is over. Camo, what has happened to you? I don't remember you spreading so much negativity in the last months as you have in the last days. I like most am getting tired of reading about your damn edge case problems. You are monopolizing this thread with your issues and cluttering it with negativity. Do us all a favor and go get the the help you need from darkcointalk and irc and report back here when you have something constructive for us. You may think you are helping darkcoin but really you are doing great damage to confidence with your ongoing drama. Well, if it were working I wouldn't have to... You basically just want me to shut up so it looks ok when it isn't? I'm going to bed. You assholes can blow me. I don't think that is what is being said -- people are saying that you may not find the help you need here. Your right Evan may have some updates tomorrow, but likely if you stick to these forums your issues will never be solved. If you don't want to sign up to those forums then at least open a direct dialog with Evan on irc or via mail. |
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+1 Obvious liars are obvious Any problems with Darkcoin should be reported here : https://darkcointalk.org/threads/rc4-issues-bugs-feature-requests.2039/If confirmed, it will be added to the bug tracker and fixed for the next release. The bugtracker is open for public viewing if you are interested. Anybody bitching here about problems who aren't willing to make their claim on the official forum should be disregarded as FUD. Well not everyone has an account there so that is a bit unreasonable... I apologise if I come across as being unreasonable but I'm trying to encourage people to get an account there and actually report their issues through the formal channels. Of course people should be sharing their experiences of problems here, but they should also be reporting the issue in the proper place so that it gets fixed. But we can't force them -- I have been trying to help people here and report issues over my head in that thread. I already mentioned the issues camo is having over there. Sure it is best if people got an account but sometimes for the good of the coin it is best to take matters in your own hands (not implying that you haven't done this regarding some issues). |
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+1 Obvious liars are obvious Any problems with Darkcoin should be reported here : https://darkcointalk.org/threads/rc4-issues-bugs-feature-requests.2039/If confirmed, it will be added to the bug tracker and fixed for the next release. The bugtracker is open for public viewing if you are interested. Anybody bitching here about problems who aren't willing to make their claim on the official forum should be disregarded as FUD. Well not everyone has an account there so that is a bit unreasonable... Whether they post there or not, judging by their history in this thread it is pretty clear which people are FUDing and which are not. For example, it makes no sense for someone who has as much DRK as camo to be spreading FUD. |
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did a backup. deleted my wallet and everything. installed fresh .31 wallet and downloaded block chain. Installed backup. Now it works. Weird. Glad its finally working though.
I've done this 4 times. No effect. Still does only 1 round, fees, 1 round, fees, 1 round, fees... Or sometimes just locks the whole wallet and does nothing... I've just recently started trying it with smaller quantities. No effect. 100 in wallet, 500, 600, 400, 1200, 4000, 1500, 2000... It doesn't matter. Same problems. I wish it weren't true. But it is... I've been up all damn night with it. It's 7am now... It doesn't work. Have you gotten in contact with Evan? Looking at both forums and all the success cases reported you are clearly experiencing an edge case and I doubt anybody other than Evan can help. |
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Guys, don't you think 8 rounds is an overkill? 4 should be the max.
You see, many people will automatically go for highest level of anonymity and they will complain how costly and long process it is.
Also, the fee is too large as it is - no need to bribe the miners as it is not really an extra work for them - otherwise they would just be solving mathematical riddles so 0.001 is fine to prevent bloating traffic.
Yeah, but 0.001 didn't work. After being raised to 0.0125 most people have reported success. Furthermore, as long as people know in advance that 8 rounds cost more in time and money then if they set it like that then they have nobody to blame by themselves. |
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And if it is, how exactly do I get rid of that message?
Yikes, I could tell you exactly on Linux or Mac but I haven't used Windows in some time. If I recall, you would just edit the shortcut you use to run QT by appending the salvagewallet option. Something like: \DarkCoin-Qt.exe -salvagewallet This is correct. Make a shortcut and edit the target to have -salvagewallet at the end. @HiddenDark Also make sure to delete everything but wallet.dat and re download before trying. That method has worked for others in the past. |
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qwizzie bro i know that but understand that there is guys here that dont understand that... example MY BROTHER was like what? fee? isnt that automaticly ?
you see... we must deal with this normal way... so we need to put this somewhere for anyone to see
You are right about this. I would say right now the tech works for 95% of users, but the ease of use and ease of understand is still poor. I assume this is the next step for the team. |
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