DarthPiggy
Newbie
Offline
Activity: 14
Merit: 0
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August 17, 2014, 08:27:19 AM |
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Perhaps I am still misstating the math or misunderstanding the spread-sheet. Let's say I have 1 different coin sources. 60/600 compromised nodes I choose 2 hops and make 1 transaction. Then according to the spreadsheet, that one transaction has 1% chance of being compromised. Now lets say I have 100 different coin sources, one for each of 100 transactions. 60/600 compromized nodes at a 2-hop rate. Now each transaction itself has a 1% chance of compromise. thus in total, 63% that at least one of them is compromized. An example: let's say I have 100 dice with each having 100 sides. So each dice has 1/100 chance of rolling a "7". Now if I roll all 100, then there is 63% chance that at least one out of the 100 gets a "7", regardless of the fact that they are different dice. It's just acumulating the independent probabilities of the unrelated events
What is being traced? You have 1% chance of traced back to the one address. But that original address has no context. The coins for that address has itself been mixed. My original question was why are there different numbers of masternodes being chosen, in other words, 1, 2, etc.. rounds of mixing. the purpose of this question was I was wondering the speed of transaction involved. The answer was that "The several rounds are just to eliminate the possibility of a large number of masternodes colluding with each other to deanon transactions." and a spreadsheet was given with the probability of de-anoning happening. So as I understand it, the spreadsheet is telling you the chance of a de-anon'd transaction. Is this incorrect? My main point here is why do I have to do many hops if it takes a long time? If I only have to do 1 hops, why is there an option for 2 hops? why not just always do 1 hops?
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The Bitcoin network protocol was designed to be extremely flexible. It can be used to create timed transactions, escrow transactions, multi-signature transactions, etc. The current features of the client only hint at what will be possible in the future.
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Ozziecoin
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August 17, 2014, 08:29:45 AM |
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Perhaps I am still misstating the math or misunderstanding the spread-sheet. Let's say I have 1 different coin sources. 60/600 compromised nodes I choose 2 hops and make 1 transaction. Then according to the spreadsheet, that one transaction has 1% chance of being compromised. Now lets say I have 100 different coin sources, one for each of 100 transactions. 60/600 compromized nodes at a 2-hop rate. Now each transaction itself has a 1% chance of compromise. thus in total, 63% that at least one of them is compromized. An example: let's say I have 100 dice with each having 100 sides. So each dice has 1/100 chance of rolling a "7". Now if I roll all 100, then there is 63% chance that at least one out of the 100 gets a "7", regardless of the fact that they are different dice. It's just acumulating the independent probabilities of the unrelated events
What is being traced? You have 1% chance of traced back to the one address. But that original address has no context. The coins for that address has itself been mixed. My original question was why are there different numbers of masternodes being chosen, in other words, 1, 2, etc.. rounds of mixing. the purpose of this question was I was wondering the speed of transaction involved. The answer was that "The several rounds are just to eliminate the possibility of a large number of masternodes colluding with each other to deanon transactions." and a spreadsheet was given with the probability of de-anoning happening. So as I understand it, the spreadsheet is telling you the chance of a de-anon'd transaction. Is this incorrect? My main point here is why do I have to do many hops if it takes a long time? If I only have to do 1 hops, why is there an option for 2 hops? why not just always do 1 hops? I personally think anything more than 2 hops is overkill, unless the coins came from a personally identifiable source like an exchange with my real name on it. And it would just be silly to use your real name.
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camosoul
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August 17, 2014, 08:29:58 AM |
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Looking forward to the bounce.
Me too... If that bug is handled Monday, I'll be back to long hodl. If it's not, I'll just bail when I see a peak. I tried to put the issue out there, but this is worse than "patriotism." Some of these people would stab out their own eyes to avoid seeing what they don't want to see... Sorry for the dumb question, but I'm short on time, LOL, what bug was found please? Cuz it's you... I've been accused of being a troll for finding a problem that nobody wants to believe exists. DS+ just quits working when a wallet gets to an as-yet undetermined size. I've tested it by starting out with small amounts, sending in more... After several thousand in DRK is there, it just stops. No matter what I set it to denom, if the wallet gets big, it quits. It's not a matter of not finding a suitable pair, it doesn't even look... Just stops. It doesn't slow down, it just plain stops. No log data produced. Just sits there. No new addresses, nothing... DS+ stops. Initially, it used to loop fees and never increase denom depth... No idea why it changed behavior. I've also noticed that when I tell it to only denom 100drk or 50drk, it still breaks up chunks of 900... I sent Evan a screenshot of this. With small quantities it works great tho... I've had enough of the "people" here giving me shit about it. Almost everyone is on my ignore list at this point. Accusing me of trolling the price down to buy more... I don't see it as a reason to sell. If nothing is done about it and the trend of denial/insults extends further up the chain, then yeah, I'd probably sell... Since this is yet to be seen, I fail to see how I can be a troll for a motivation that has not yet occurred and doesn't suit my interests... Ah, you're on here too much, camo! It's not good for the soul! Too many trolls, and it's finally getting to you! Alas, you're not invincible! I'm having trouble as well. My wallet freezes on my win7/64bit machine. I have no idea what is wrong. Nobody else has the problem apparently and I've spent the last day and a half or so running diagnostics and malware scanners, etc... but can't find anything. I don't know what's wront, it makes connections, but the blockchain download is super slow and the wallet keeps going non-responsive. I'm trying to do a tutorial on how to use the wallet, but I can't use it myself! LOL. it does work on my Linux though, however, I want it to work on my windows, and since I have a problem, I think I need to figure it out. So yah, there are probably a few hiccups left in there. The guys really work it over on testnet, but there are no masternodes running old versions there, no miners running pre-masternode paying wallets, Though they tried, you still have to jump into the deep end of main net to find all the hiccups Hey, take a break from here, it's so depressing in here, watch a good movie instead (Just watched true Grit tonight Great one!) The problems aren't what concern me. The refusal to acknowledge them and then the wave of douche bags that call me a liar... They're mad the price went down and want to scapegoat me. Do they really think I have so much influence that I can single-handedly kill DRK's value? Am I really so special and powerful? Then they tell me I'm an egotistical maniac when it's not my idea to pretend I'm magical... I'm not special, they are the ones who seem to think I have such powers... I expect there to be issues coming out of sterile testnet. I'd be suspicious if there weren't. The funniest trolls are the ones who think they can goad me into an emotional/panic decision and snatch up my bags cheap.... Lols on you losers! I'm not as stupid, or magical, as you pretend me to be... Whatever... I've got shit to do.
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. .OROCOIN. ▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀ | | █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ | | █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ | | █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ |
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nsimmons
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August 17, 2014, 08:30:03 AM |
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It's just acumulating the independent probabilities of the unrelated events
Are you sure they are independent? These aren't dice, binomial distribution may not apply. Considering this is a network i would doubt the trials are independent.
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DarthPiggy
Newbie
Offline
Activity: 14
Merit: 0
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August 17, 2014, 08:44:41 AM |
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Perhaps I am still misstating the math or misunderstanding the spread-sheet. Let's say I have 1 different coin sources. 60/600 compromised nodes I choose 2 hops and make 1 transaction. Then according to the spreadsheet, that one transaction has 1% chance of being compromised. Now lets say I have 100 different coin sources, one for each of 100 transactions. 60/600 compromized nodes at a 2-hop rate. Now each transaction itself has a 1% chance of compromise. thus in total, 63% that at least one of them is compromized. An example: let's say I have 100 dice with each having 100 sides. So each dice has 1/100 chance of rolling a "7". Now if I roll all 100, then there is 63% chance that at least one out of the 100 gets a "7", regardless of the fact that they are different dice. It's just acumulating the independent probabilities of the unrelated events
What is being traced? You have 1% chance of traced back to the one address. But that original address has no context. The coins for that address has itself been mixed. My original question was why are there different numbers of masternodes being chosen, in other words, 1, 2, etc.. rounds of mixing. the purpose of this question was I was wondering the speed of transaction involved. The answer was that "The several rounds are just to eliminate the possibility of a large number of masternodes colluding with each other to deanon transactions." and a spreadsheet was given with the probability of de-anoning happening. So as I understand it, the spreadsheet is telling you the chance of a de-anon'd transaction. Is this incorrect? My main point here is why do I have to do many hops if it takes a long time? If I only have to do 1 hops, why is there an option for 2 hops? why not just always do 1 hops? I personally think anything more than 2 hops is overkill, unless the coins came from a personally identifiable source like an exchange with my real name on it. And it would just be silly to use your real name. I see, so the main problems would be when doing darkcoin linked to other goods such as bitcoins, or things which can be traceable through the mail or something.. or personal transactions with the coin.. if you are just transferring darkcoins from wallet to wallet then not a problem?
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Ozziecoin
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August 17, 2014, 08:47:18 AM |
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Perhaps I am still misstating the math or misunderstanding the spread-sheet. Let's say I have 1 different coin sources. 60/600 compromised nodes I choose 2 hops and make 1 transaction. Then according to the spreadsheet, that one transaction has 1% chance of being compromised. Now lets say I have 100 different coin sources, one for each of 100 transactions. 60/600 compromized nodes at a 2-hop rate. Now each transaction itself has a 1% chance of compromise. thus in total, 63% that at least one of them is compromized. An example: let's say I have 100 dice with each having 100 sides. So each dice has 1/100 chance of rolling a "7". Now if I roll all 100, then there is 63% chance that at least one out of the 100 gets a "7", regardless of the fact that they are different dice. It's just acumulating the independent probabilities of the unrelated events
What is being traced? You have 1% chance of traced back to the one address. But that original address has no context. The coins for that address has itself been mixed. My original question was why are there different numbers of masternodes being chosen, in other words, 1, 2, etc.. rounds of mixing. the purpose of this question was I was wondering the speed of transaction involved. The answer was that "The several rounds are just to eliminate the possibility of a large number of masternodes colluding with each other to deanon transactions." and a spreadsheet was given with the probability of de-anoning happening. So as I understand it, the spreadsheet is telling you the chance of a de-anon'd transaction. Is this incorrect? My main point here is why do I have to do many hops if it takes a long time? If I only have to do 1 hops, why is there an option for 2 hops? why not just always do 1 hops? I personally think anything more than 2 hops is overkill, unless the coins came from a personally identifiable source like an exchange with my real name on it. And it would just be silly to use your real name. I see, so the main problems would be when doing darkcoin linked to other goods such as bitcoins, or things which can be traceable through the mail or something.. or personal transactions with the coin.. if you are just transferring darkcoins from wallet to wallet then not a problem? Yes. That is my understanding.
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UdjinM6
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1318
Merit: 1040
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August 17, 2014, 08:49:46 AM |
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This analysis will have to continue after I awake. 6 hours from now - continued..... Until then- Thank you following my post today I leave you with another tune: Dedicated to DRK - Because DRK should NOT have to try..... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GXoZLPSw8U8You can also follow me on twitter: @MangledBlue I'll love DRK - even if it comes in a DOS version...... (sigh).... Mangled Blue, thanks for investigating! Could you please send all 10K+ funds to another fresh wallet (1 new address) and to investigate from that starting point too? Will it denominate for you then? Thanks! EDIT: the idea is to have one large (10K) input at the beginning instead of few small (1K) ones
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DASH: XsV4GHVKGTjQFvwB7c6mYsGV3Mxf7iser6
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innergy
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August 17, 2014, 08:49:49 AM |
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What means innmlist: in Chaeplin list?
What is that? I was hit twice. Is something wrong with my masternode?
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MasterMined710
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1182
Merit: 1000
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August 17, 2014, 08:51:12 AM |
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Drk has working anon, yet the market dumps. Go figure.
It's not the market dumping naturally. There is no reason for the coin losing over 1/3 of its value in 3 days... It's the games a group of people plays. They sold us expensive coins and they still have the power (amount of coins) to torture us until we sell, so as to start a new cycle. True !! I would literally sell a kidney or a testicle or... faaaaaack!!! Do anything for anything to be able to grab some DRK right now.... If it wasn't bolted down at my house, it went on eBay this week, including a 2nd car we hardly use. I'm scouring the net right now looking for anyone that will convert paypal to BTC instantly for me lol. paypal to localbitcoins to bitcoins. done in a few minutes.
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DarthPiggy
Newbie
Offline
Activity: 14
Merit: 0
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August 17, 2014, 08:52:44 AM |
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It's just acumulating the independent probabilities of the unrelated events
Are you sure they are independent? These aren't dice, binomial distribution may not apply. Considering this is a network i would doubt the trials are independent. It would take some rather deep analysis of the process to see what the dependence is, but I expect the lowest probability of getting de-anon'd should be the independent probability case since any relation between the transactions should make them easier to de-anon, given proper analysis.
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HiddenDark
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August 17, 2014, 08:54:30 AM |
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The price is rising again, we're back to 0.0055
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DarthPiggy
Newbie
Offline
Activity: 14
Merit: 0
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August 17, 2014, 09:01:24 AM |
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Perhaps I am still misstating the math or misunderstanding the spread-sheet. Let's say I have 1 different coin sources. 60/600 compromised nodes I choose 2 hops and make 1 transaction. Then according to the spreadsheet, that one transaction has 1% chance of being compromised. Now lets say I have 100 different coin sources, one for each of 100 transactions. 60/600 compromized nodes at a 2-hop rate. Now each transaction itself has a 1% chance of compromise. thus in total, 63% that at least one of them is compromized. An example: let's say I have 100 dice with each having 100 sides. So each dice has 1/100 chance of rolling a "7". Now if I roll all 100, then there is 63% chance that at least one out of the 100 gets a "7", regardless of the fact that they are different dice. It's just acumulating the independent probabilities of the unrelated events
What is being traced? You have 1% chance of traced back to the one address. But that original address has no context. The coins for that address has itself been mixed. My original question was why are there different numbers of masternodes being chosen, in other words, 1, 2, etc.. rounds of mixing. the purpose of this question was I was wondering the speed of transaction involved. The answer was that "The several rounds are just to eliminate the possibility of a large number of masternodes colluding with each other to deanon transactions." and a spreadsheet was given with the probability of de-anoning happening. So as I understand it, the spreadsheet is telling you the chance of a de-anon'd transaction. Is this incorrect? My main point here is why do I have to do many hops if it takes a long time? If I only have to do 1 hops, why is there an option for 2 hops? why not just always do 1 hops? I personally think anything more than 2 hops is overkill, unless the coins came from a personally identifiable source like an exchange with my real name on it. And it would just be silly to use your real name. I see, so the main problems would be when doing darkcoin linked to other goods such as bitcoins, or things which can be traceable through the mail or something.. or personal transactions with the coin.. if you are just transferring darkcoins from wallet to wallet then not a problem? Yes. That is my understanding. Thx for the discussion
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Terzo
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August 17, 2014, 09:06:27 AM |
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I do not see any bug . Where is the bug ?
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Dusty11
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August 17, 2014, 09:13:04 AM |
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Gahh the price is going up. Typical.
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JGCMiner
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August 17, 2014, 09:14:50 AM |
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The price is rising again, we're back to 0.0055
I actually think it is a good thing that the price has dropped like this because it shakes out all the weak hands that had unrealistic expectations and those that can't tell the difference between DRK, which is trying to reinvent the wheel, and other anon coins which are rife with problems or are merely adding trusted mixers to the blockchain. Once those "investors" are gone the coin will be in better shape. Plus the accumulation of stronger hands will concide with the tech being in better shape (compared to previous rallies) owing to all the work the devs and testers have put in. If you can get BTC ready fast enough this is the time to accumulate.
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MasterMined710
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1182
Merit: 1000
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August 17, 2014, 09:15:30 AM Last edit: August 17, 2014, 09:28:04 AM by MasterMined710 |
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i am a cloakcoin troll and i promised the cloak dev i would not troll dark but now that most of my cloakcoin was stolen because of the non-trustless posa v1 bug i don't care what the dev says. i need to troll dark and pump cloak so i can dump them and get out like bob said to do in the pm.
if you continue to troll dark i will start asking tough questions in the cloakcoin thread and i know you don't want that. i have never posted anything in the cc thread but when i start i won't stop. it won't be pretty. no one wants that. you have been warned.
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atavacron
Full Member
Offline
Activity: 224
Merit: 100
The definition of insanity is doing the same thing
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August 17, 2014, 09:15:43 AM |
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I do not see any bug . Where is the bug ?
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nsimmons
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August 17, 2014, 09:17:23 AM |
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I do not see any bug . Where is the bug ?
So whats the deal, I've heard this story, but I was also told numerous times its not the origin of the term bug.
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Dusty11
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August 17, 2014, 09:25:39 AM |
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Bravo those who sold at 0.01 and bought back in low again. I missed it this time due to laziness.
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MasterMined710
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1182
Merit: 1000
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August 17, 2014, 09:25:59 AM |
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Perhaps I am still misstating the math or misunderstanding the spread-sheet. Let's say I have 1 different coin sources. 60/600 compromised nodes I choose 2 hops and make 1 transaction. Then according to the spreadsheet, that one transaction has 1% chance of being compromised. Now lets say I have 100 different coin sources, one for each of 100 transactions. 60/600 compromized nodes at a 2-hop rate. Now each transaction itself has a 1% chance of compromise. thus in total, 63% that at least one of them is compromized. An example: let's say I have 100 dice with each having 100 sides. So each dice has 1/100 chance of rolling a "7". Now if I roll all 100, then there is 63% chance that at least one out of the 100 gets a "7", regardless of the fact that they are different dice. It's just acumulating the independent probabilities of the unrelated events
What is being traced? You have 1% chance of traced back to the one address. But that original address has no context. The coins for that address has itself been mixed. My original question was why are there different numbers of masternodes being chosen, in other words, 1, 2, etc.. rounds of mixing. the purpose of this question was I was wondering the speed of transaction involved. The answer was that "The several rounds are just to eliminate the possibility of a large number of masternodes colluding with each other to deanon transactions." and a spreadsheet was given with the probability of de-anoning happening. So as I understand it, the spreadsheet is telling you the chance of a de-anon'd transaction. Is this incorrect? My main point here is why do I have to do many hops if it takes a long time? If I only have to do 1 hops, why is there an option for 2 hops? why not just always do 1 hops? I personally think anything more than 2 hops is overkill, unless the coins came from a personally identifiable source like an exchange with my real name on it. And it would just be silly to use your real name. I see, so the main problems would be when doing darkcoin linked to other goods such as bitcoins, or things which can be traceable through the mail or something.. or personal transactions with the coin.. if you are just transferring darkcoins from wallet to wallet then not a problem? Yes. That is my understanding. Thx for the discussion yeah it's like your cloakcoin but pow and not a pos rollback coin. it's trustless and your money can't be stolen by a man in the middle attack like in posa v1. also you don't have to worry about the federal gov tracking down the devs and shutting down your coin and losing all you money because people are using the onemarket thing to sell wacky tobacky. if you can't even sell weed on onemarket then what use is it? might as well just use openbazzar or darkmarket (no relation to darkcoin).
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