So Mark what is Devcoins vision? what is it capable of? What is happening now?

But will they be able to pull together in time? I have noticed several mentions to limiting the number of writers because of the shares, but that diversification is necessary for upward movement at this point in time; They have hit rock bottom, almost, just 25 satoshi's to go.

other factors I've noticed is the lack of instructions to be a recipient of devcoins, they should be able to make affiliate websites for different developer communities. Knowing who to talk to, to link the community to Devcoin could save it... I am sure there are many communities out there who would like a creative incentive system. But of course we suffer from, not I, we will wait till someone does.

OP

Devcoin is a very decentralized system, I have been observing it for a while now.

I have noticed that for things to move forward there are different people in charge in different places.
The website is managed by one person, the registration by another, etc. It promotes diversity by asking for others to show some initiative in creating something better, but even getting added to the list of Devcoins recipients needs to be changed.

If someone cannot create a website or a system for rating, promoting, more content to distribute Devcoins to, it will die without a doubt. There must be an easier way to get signed up to the Devcoin distribution list if one is not a writer. Someone may have to create a Micro-coin to be able to distribute coins to musicians and painters, with the accompanying website or app for sharing their creations easily to be added to their running tally.

I write in a way that I can express my train of thoughts more precisely, and yeah I have read a lot of books.

I know there is a limited amount of true wealth in the world and that gets diluted by the number of active investments in the world.

Bitcoin has gained it's value by being magnitudes more efficient, and soon much better designed than the banking system that it will replace; This is why it is appreciating in value, the people see what it is worth and are rallying their economic power around it, they know it is better, too long has the technological potential of our minds been held back by ancient obsolete systems.

This is where Bitcoin is  getting it's wealth from, it's simply a better way of exchaning wealth.

The Alt-coins have limited potential simply because they are the same as Bitcoin, only small improvements or worse. The time and effort required to move to them would require another advantage that will have to be determined for that particular coin. It will gain a little wealth, but it must start at zero to assess it's value properly.

so I as well cannot determine where the wealth of these coins is coming from, A POW advantage can attract a specific type of person to complete the human challenges.

Devcoin is a great start, but it is definitely very badly executed, bad interface, limited scope for it's mission, not diverse enough, no place for it's members to congregate and exchange ideas more effectively, but someone will figure it out.

 

Now to address the Hyper-complexity of the multi-coin paradigm without taking into account the individual programability of each coin.

Different systems will react differently when interacting with each other, but they must work within the same framework.

Imagine a world where there are thousands of POW Coins in circulation in different niches fulfilling different roles.
In low economic areas, a Demurriage Coin is in circulation to enhance commerce, in areas where inflationary coins are required they will work there, others that need a deflationary one will have that and they will interact with each other to fulfill each zones/organizations goals according to their requirements.

In the deeper system a web of currencies modifying the flow of actions acting as a signaling system for the larger efforts of society in general, people go where the value goes. Imagine a deep interconnection of a designed cryptocoin ecology system, where different specializations of knowledge workers work under different coin systems that they are able to contribute to in exchange for their specialized knowledge, POWs tailored to peoples professions constantly changing if necessary the POW to move the coins local resources in it's specified direction. Each profession entwined and signaled according to the demand of all society to promote their specialized work.
  In a more advanced and larger scope these could be entire signaling systems for world wide efforts, Human efforts controlled by intelligently designed systems fully open-source for our new interconnected world.

the progression could look like this

Objects/Actions - Hyper-exchangeable currencies both Fiat and Crypto - sub-system coins with alternate designs - Organizational coins backing a cause - precise action coins for specific professions - Hyper-flexible self organization of decentralized mega-manufacturer / mega-conglomerate / A.I. Corporation Coins. etc .

These will be remixed and upgraded in ways we cannot foresee; All I can say is it will be an impressive world with very precise metrics on all Human endeavors.

On the larger topic of creating wealth, accretion of wealth must be seen beyond the Efficient Markets hypothesis, that rational actors gauge the intrinsic value of a object, commodity, stock based on sound real world information. The standard interpretation is that the Gold has value because I can exchange it, but what is gold backed by? belief that it can be redeemed, no one can eat gold, but it is precious theoretically because people use it for art and technology... yet, somehow the majority of traders, trade based on trends instead of real world data to back up their assumptions.

What happens if we separate the belief, assurance, confidence from the true value of an object? What if we take into consideration how much others will want it, believe in it? Gold for example, if taken on it's pure value, how valuable is Gold truly? We must gauge it according to it's uses in Medicine, Electronics, Aeronautics, Dentistry,etc and exclude it's prestige Industries: Jewelery, Finance, Awards, etc.  The value drops dramatically if these sources of demand are excluded from considering it's value, yet people are swayed by it's prestige; So too can an idea, or cause be created by being backed by a coin, and this is not the only reason that coin would gain value.

A coin would gain value by the percentage of the population that are aware of it, by the people who believe in it's purpose, By sheer human generosity, by it's usefulness, the value of it's community, the products that use it, many many reasons, and like all values it would be changing at all times by the priority of all the factors that affect an object and the percentage of actors trading the object actively, plus of course the prestige factor of future gains, speculation.

Bitcoin has solved a lot of things, this is one of them, it is the gateway for all these alt-coins and causes to reach true wealth... Bitcoin links to true wealth directly and the new coins link to it creating a ecosystem of coins.

Now this new paradigm must be viewed as a new operational model and the potential complexity of the system may become apparent: People are creating organizations founded on an idea, a cause, a belief and applying a reward points model around it, in essence we are gamifying the system, people like to be challenged and being able to gauge there success is very appealing to people, Human psychology.

so for example. I create a merge-mined-coin as a general interface for wealth, a portal for hyper-exchangeable  items(fiat, gold, silver, etc) and tack a strongly backed cause, executed with clairvoyant precision(really good interface and marketing) with a excellent POW system in place to gauge the causes success or failure; Those who believe in the work that is being created by the people earning the rewards through the causes POW, will with generosity donate to the system with the understanding that their purchase is helping the cause by monetizing it's value, which at a later time can be redeemed back to them. If the cause is successful as more people become aware of it it will accrue value increasing marketing awareness until it reaches equilibrium of awareness and willing actors to participate in it at their own discretion.

It's a charity/NGO with a reverse payment option tagged to it. We are basically turning a Idea/Belief/Cause into a stock to fund actual real world actions.

And this response does not even address the hyper-complexity of a vast ecosystem of coinified causes... it truly is programmable money, coins within coins within coins, stacked on top of each other.

If it is a single computer, we can say that it is a quad core cpu that they were mining on.

so we have the intel quad core and amd phenom x4 also the server editions of these chips xeon,Itanium,Opteron.

if we link the 4mh/s rate we could figure out which of these processors was doing the work, I'm leaning towards a Intel since my old Bulldozer 8150 did 4mh/s when mining with the cpu, so only an Intel processor would be powerful enough to get those number in 2009.

We must not forget the power of this technology.

What is this revolution taking us to? What is it?

This is a paradigm shift where the problem of monetizing Value has become moot; This technology allows us to do that, we can monetize any value that people are willing to support.

Anyone can now fund a cause by quantifying their contribution, whether it is by money, moral values, admiration, or any factor, this technology has truly created programmable rewards in a very complex ecosystem.

And this technology is free for everyone... just think about that; You no longer have to wonder, " how am I going to fund that cause?" What are the market constraints against what can be done with the power of human belief? none, the market value of a coin becomes it's native support among the population and the awareness of that cause.

The old world used to trade different objects for their perceived value, innovation and difficulty to make, we called it barter, but were limited by the needs of others and the transportability of those objects; This created limitations on the scope of trade.

so one day we invented money, a object, an idea that could be exchanged for anything material and could convince others to work for it to trade, this had it's limitations. The idea of trading objects/actions for objects/actions, became objects/actions for money for objects/actions, without that initial object you could not fund change to convince others toward your cause; It was limited in how abstract motives and actions could be funded," the availability of objects became the inherit limit of this technology called money."

But, this new paradigm?... it is value/belief for money for objects/actions. This new technology can fund change without the constraints of needs and wants, you can change someone's life by just belief alone, you don't even have to ask for a loan from the bank... you just have to believe in what you are doing. Quantify the efforts and contributions from the true believers of your cause and they will reward you in ways that the old system could never do.

When anyone can create money what can you fund?

All you have to do is create a double Proof of Work, Use Bitcoins POW or Litecoins scrypt, merge mine with them to gain instant security and mining power, and then distribute your coins for a cause, the work that others do is the second Proof of Work.

now anything can be funded, and the ecosystem of the Cryptocoins can thrive in a complex array of markets, not just for objects or money, but markets that gauge the demand and supply of human needs and values that before could not be monetized.

 A market where causes, beliefs, movements, ideas can be traded; The ebb and flow of the collective thoughts of humanity.


Just wait till Open Transactions is fully operational, then you will know what I am talking about, May a thousand currencies bloom.
 

I think Satoshi should come forward... is everyone ready?

WE are Satoshi Nakamoto, founders of a decentralized, peer to peer, revolutionary vision of the future.

Our individual vision as users and thinkers is what makes this revolution so powerful, Our combined imagination, the
totality of our collective thoughts developing along the lines of the software that inspired us. WE are decentralized, peer to peer at every level from the creation of the protocol, to our organization and function as a community working toward our individual vision, creating all possibilities apparent and reproducible at the same time.

You mean an autonomous A.I. Botnet? What if a Botnet was a A.I. that did whatever it could to gain wealth by providing all available services? Even Illegal ones, basically programmed to meet all the needs of humanity?

That is an interesting question isn't it?

A A.I. that cannot be shut down because it is distributed and what if it's cause is condoned by a vast majority of society? How powerful could it get, If it is smart enough it could re-program itself, learn programming languages, barter with people, make deals, systems, new paradigms all to meet human needs in exchange for wealth... maybe even acting as a business that provides services and goods automatically.

No one would be able to shut it down, It's counter would have to be created and backed by established systems, but our society would not be prepared for such an A.I.; it is too chaotic, everyone for themselves type world, a methodical, systematic, intelligent machine could only be countered by another. That agent would embody the principals of the system to maintain the status quo and would have to be backed by processing power and scope... I am sure a whole new world of law enforcement would emerge,  the new trying to fight the old.

As with any system both would adapt to the point of equilibrium where both paradigms expend the minimal amount of energy to co-exist, or expand all energy for destructive purpose soon to deplete all available resources.

I leaned toward no.

but then we have to consider the pros and cons and even the interesting parts about this question.

Pros

If they come forward they know the entire system and could begin making changes to the kernel with surgical precision.
Their appearance will show the face of Bitcoin, who created it.
It would be nice for marketing.
If they got sued by the banks, the different paradigm in which Satoshi works would render all attacks on them pointless(Satoshi built it by themselves, their iniciative shows they'd do it again anyway.)

Cons

They are falable human beings; Character assassination would be innevitable, the vision in everyones mind of Bitcoin would fade, only satoshi's vision would prevail.
They would get sued by the banks guaranteed.
A lot of the creative work on Bitcoin may be subdued
Some may not like a concise solid vision, would not think to alter it, even though satoshi encouraged it.

Interesting

They may have some pretty crazy ideas never seen before
What if satoshi rallied the millions of Bitcoin users, considering we comprise the top 1% in intelligence in the planet it could change the world... they could act like a General organizing the Bitcoin collective into a cohesive group... forming the largest corporation on earth.
What if Satoshi is just a regular guy, an autodidact? who learned everything on their own and has no accreditation?
What if they are a she?
What if it is the NSA?

So let us not forget the example of slashdot, and remember the blockchain; The undisputed record of Bitcoin's history, everyone has to verify for themselves and work out the proof of work to make sure it is valid. That is the best way, use your judgement, use your intuition and work out the logic to build the next step. That is what I am doing, i see the system as sound, could it be better yeah for sure, but that is because I understand it and know the need for it in today's world.  

don't forget your own logic, don't stop adding to your own personal Blockchain, the record of your history from which you build upon. no sense in taking someone elses advice without doing a little thorough thinking.

yeah I agree, Doublec is probably extremely overwhelmed, so maybe backing off and letting him do his work would be more productive, working under stress is bad enough, but trying to figure out who to prioritize all the time, that makes it even harder.

In my experience everyone, it is better to not be discouraged by the reactions of others, after all  was it not Thomas Edison that said, " We don't know 1 millionth of 1 percent of anything." If we think about that statement how can anyone be sure of what they know? or have just learned? No, you master it first, become an example, make your cash and remember Bitcoin is not the only show in town... it's the BATTERING RAM that will trash the gates for other cryptocurrencies... don't forget about them.

The total system is composed of various different forms of money, Bitcoin is the gateway into fiat. With merged mining many different schemes can be used like Demurrage, Devcoins charity system, Feathercoin and others... consider all the cryptocurrencies and you'll know there is a lot more money out there than just Bitcoin's 2 billion dollars.

I to am ridiculed by it... but I got Bitcoins, we'll see who has the last laugh... sure make people feel uncomfortable when they think about it someday.

What if it was overclocked? would that affect the outcome of a computation. I find that overclocking even when things look stable... are not quite right.

I thought about it too.

Bitcoin: Currency for the Autonomous agent to use.
Namecoin: Decentralized distributed computer to computer linkage through the internet, would make it impossible to take down.
Open Transaction: A software suite for the agent to manage it's finances securely.
Bitmessage: distributed protocol for it to communicate with other autonomous agents with OT.
Hadoop: a distributed cpu/storage system to enhance A.I. and create a marketplace for it to gain services... it would learn so much if there are thousands of users that are offering it storage space in private hard drives. It could pay people to gain cpu cycles.

plus a extra module a program that distributes thinking power, BitThink. The p2p Bink of distributed computing that it could use to solve problems.

In the legal scope these corporations would never have to be approved by government, just by the people who use them, and if the programmer who builds it makes it so that the program distributes it's profits only keeping enough to pay it's own needs and future expansion... this would change the world. who could compete with a corporation of autonomous agents that does not have employees and only share holders.

I haven't seen the video yet, but this is completely possible now.

When you think about Nature, how it functions you have a tree, an agent, that gives out fruit for it's own gain(to spread it's seed), it independently assesses it's own needs. But a third agent that can act as the intermediary, middle man, to enhance the perceived cognitive deficits or logic of that agent( it promises greater reach in exchange for control of the fruit) gains control changing this dynamic. What if things returned to the natural balance?

The autonomous Factory Churns out products off it's 3D Industrial Printers, keeping tabs on production, material costs, local demand to asses it's contracts being submitted through Open Transaction servers, Running it's reserves off of Bitcoin for collateral.
A Customer makes an order and the nearest Autonomous Factory starts manufacturing it and sets up the logistics with the local autonomous Quad-rotor delivery company. All these would be controlled and managed autonomously yet completely observable by any citizen, where would the earning go if it is the market that controls the worth of an object? back to the shareholders of that autonomous factory the factory may only take enough to maintain itself and return the rest to everyone else. This seems like a natural progression from our current market model. We build the Factory make it self-monitoring and distribute the shares in this manner to minimize economic disruption by automation.

the article mentions Namecoin. One of the reasons that I like Namecoin is that it does provide such a thing. What if websites were decentralized as well? that the moment you stepped onto a website you liked you became a server for that website? All the content that you checked out you can now distribute, now there is no need for a  location to your website, no need for centralized hosting.  Everyone keeps a copy of the hash of each page on that website when someone does an address check they don't check the address only the information, What do you have? I have this. Do you know where I can find this? over there.   The complete obliteration of the Ip system is in order to make this type of future truly Cyberpunk style.

Welcome to the Internet, the place where Autonomous A.I systems run corporations and services, often indistinguishable to human users; People shelter and advance simple A.I constructs to maintain and automate non-profit organizations; Programmers outsource their work to A.I. assistants who cost little to nothing compared to their human counterparts and can code programs in hours instead of weeks. Different economic models arise, venus project resource based society, economic conglomerates that share their earnings, independent A.I that look after their own interests, distributed p2p conglomerates representing millions of independents as one entity... who knows what will emerge, it will truly be astonishing.

Tip whoever's writing you admire, or give it to an artist that paints, sculpts, to a open source programmer that does good work. Spread the Devcoin around to those who do not yet know about Devcoin who could best utilize it, Developers, Artists, Sculptors, Writers, Engineers, Programmers, you name it, all creative types that promote the open source culture or other cultures that you deem worthy.

Ideas propagate from the core group outwards.

so Devcoin was born from the Bitcoin community a highly technical bunch that emerged from the cryptography community back in 2008. Devcoin was introduced to those who know the cryptocurrencies best Bitcoin enthisiasts, from this group emerged the writers that populate DevTome. This form of propagation has been created by creating avenues of congregation for writers... to further spread a different model needs to be used.

We can spread our coins from Devcoin to all artists, tell them about Devcoin and it's purpose and how their participation can make a huge difference to create more art in the world. soon Devcoin will be known by everyone as a avenue to promote art in the world that all one has to do is purchase these devcoins and add value to those who hold them creating a true avenue for people to make a living doing art.

We have 9 billion Devcoins in circulation earned by the writers, the thinkers, creators from Devtome, now we spread them p2p style independent of a internet, through all available networks, facebook(spread it among your artist friends), twitter(create contests with thousands of Devcoins by publishing a private key on twitter to be won by whoever recognizes it's value), Personally(Give them to people in your life, who love to create, see how their face lights up).

From the Many the one, From the One the Source... Become the Source to the Many.

agreed more access and awareness, features is what is going to drive Devcoin, what if we paired it directly with OT and began using that infrastructure to aid adoption?

 I was thinking that we need more movement of Devcoin; It is a token currency people who believe in what it represents will accept it for what it is: A Token Currency that promotes Engineering, arts and expression.  This is the purpose of Devcoin; To give people from around the world a chance to buy these tokens or accept them for development to flourish worldwide.

 In an ideal world every artist, engineer and writer would have a Devcoin account, every purchase of Devcoins goes to support self expression and innovation within society, everyone wins. If we found a way to give that capability to everyone, but for now we are the source of all this change, every one of us that has Devcoins needs to spread it to other artists, writers and engineers by tipping people for their good work, This diffusion of developers will increase the number of people who know about Devcoin who want to contribute to the project while at the same time with the increased awareness increased price of Devcoins.

The more people we have thinking about Devcoins, Devtome the more minds we have to expand the concept of Devcoin.

This is such an amazing project! Where else do you get to invest in the arts? without a giant organization dictating where that money goes or a board of directors twiddling their thumbs, this is new, wow! a self organizing project that effectively distributes all proceeds fairly to those who truly are promoting arts and development. All we have to do is promote.

So what is our goal?

IMO: get a Devcoin address to every artist, writer, engineer, sculptor on earth to further promote Development of all those creative projects we love.
        Make it easier for people to submit their work for consideration, tag them on their website with a plug-in, make it easy to simply send finished work to be evaluated.
        Allow more people to proof read, see the works for submission to increase submission volume effectively.

By the way, how are people chosen to become part of the Devcoin shares list? It would be helpful to get more people signed up or who have different projects they would like to be part of the Devcoin community, ie complementary websites to Devtome.