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5041  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: This Calmed Me Down A Bit About The Blocksize Debate on: August 21, 2015, 05:32:03 AM

Although I partly disagree with what this cartoon implies, I do believe it illustrates the potential conflict of interest rather well:



Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3bpese/blocking_the_stream_the_blocksize_limit_debate_in/
...

The trouble is that it does not illustrate the potential conflict of interest almost at all.  As far as I can tell, Blockstream can only make money by acting in a consulting capacity to people who wish to make a sidechain.

A sidechain, since it is pegged to Bitcoin, cannot really make a lot of money unless the operator participates in fraud, and they would not be able to retain and share the loot with Blockstream because if Blockstream participated it would totally and instantaneously ruin their whole business model (as I understand/infer it.)

Sidechains themselves offer a new revenue stream to the Bitcoin ecosystem.  Consider the discounts that vendors will offer for use of their branded gift cards and what-not.  This demonstrates that there is money to be had there, and if the vendor could have their own currency rather than a piss-ant gift card or credit card that is much more powerful.  With a robust two-way peg, Bitcoin value becomes equal to or (and) greater than the sum total of the value of all sidechains backed by it.

Last I heard, Blockstream plans to release at least their basic implementation framework as open-source for anyone to use.  They could only remain competitive in the space if their implementation were better and/or more trusted than others.  This might be one reason that they retained many of the most productive and well respected persons from the Bitcoin development community.

The small blocksize issue is something of a cart vs. horse thing.  Since I became involved I saw the small data-rate and high latency aspects of Bitcoin as being key to it's robustness in the face of attacks (of the type we've not yet seen.)  Were I a developer in the sphere I would have been putting a lot of focus on how to scale Bitcoin without losing this key aspect (and I have even while I've not worked on development.)  I can easily see how the devs who are on 'my side' would be group under Blockstream because the focus is on security which happens to be associated with data rate.  So, the 1MB thing was the 'cause' of Blockstream and not the 'effect' I guess one could say.  I'm sure they find they, like everyone else, finds the limitation to be a regrettable nuisance.  Unlike some others, however, they understand the ramifications.  They probably just feel that the fairly cutting-edge crypto work that they are undertaking is the most productive and interesting way to deal with the reality without killing Bitcoin, and potentially lucrative as well.

---

The graphic could also be improved by making a very large spill-way with several giant fish sucking up all the flow.  They would be labeled Google, Facebook, etc.  Also their should be cops riding on top of those fish labeled 'government regulators'.

5042  Other / Off-topic / Re: The biggest XT shills and their true motives on: August 21, 2015, 04:40:23 AM
Here's my contribution culled from the epic (and now defunct) 1500 page 'gold collapsing, bitcoin up' thread:

Quote
The nice thing about allowing attackers to use a forum is that it becomes possible to pin people who have put in a lot of effort.  Looking through the now-locked thread, I identify some of the primary petites taches de merde as so:

 - cypherdoc
 - justusranvier
 - peter r
 - solex
 - erdogan
 - zarathustra
 - smooth/rocks
 - majamalu
 - stolfi (honorable mention - still as active as ever elsewhere.)

Some of them have really put in some effort over the years.  Others not mentioned are more likely to simply have been duped.  Interestingly, when I was doing a quick skim to make this list I noticed that most of these folks went dark within a stretch of hours of when cypherdoc did.

5043  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Szabo just tweeted this on: August 21, 2015, 04:33:38 AM
Good artical! Read threw it, don't skip to the end.

This part made me sad because It's true (to me) and apparently to szabo

Quote
So with all these scary uncertainties, you may ask why hasn’t Satoshi come out to speak on the behalf of one side or the other in order to settle the dispute?  Indeed it would be akin to him coming out to act as a 3rd party mediator, such as when a parent comes in to break up a fight among siblings.  There has in fact been a post by someone claiming to be Satoshi, from a valid known Satoshi email address, claiming pretty much that the XT fork is unnecessarily dangerous, see here: Satoshi? Despite the many allegations that if this was really Satoshi, he would have signed his message with a known PGP key or perhaps moved some of his coins to prove that it was him, he has not done so.  I for one do not believe that he would.  If you read the message, (ignoring for a second who it is from) he is saying that Bitcoin’s vision is not one where it is subject to the egos of charismatic leaders, including Satoshi Nakamoto.  People who harp on the fact that Satoshi has not made a provably authenticated statement is clearly missing the whole point of this message.  If he were to do so, rest assured the whole of the community will rally with him, but that is exactly what he doesn’t want to happen, a whole community blindly following authority!  Consistently so, the author points out that if it takes a benevolent dictator to pull us out of this mess “deux ex machina” then Bitcoin, as a project in decentralized money resistant to authority, has failed.  That tautological statement, is provably true if you can wrap your head around it.  Therefore, if Satoshi wants it to succeed, he won’t use his ‘God card’ and settle disputes.  If Bitcoin continually needs Satoshi to keep us from going astray, then Bitcoin isn’t worth saving.   Considering that Satoshi has likely the most coins at risk than anyone else, and him coming forward to break the impasse would likely save us (and the value of his own coins) it is truly commendable that he has not done so.  The fact that he hasn’t tells me that he (where ever he or she is) is truly acting in an altruistic manner.  He is more willing to let Bitcoin die, than to let it continue on as a system that does not value consensus as its first and foremost priority.

Some people argue that Szabo is likely to be Satoshi.  I never paid a lot of attention to these kinds of conjectures or cared a lot about them, but this text is the strongest bit of evidence I've seen yet that the it might be true.

5044  Economy / Speculation / Re: Accumulation Phase on: August 20, 2015, 07:33:17 PM

So far in 2015 there have been excellent buying opportunities indeed.

By my estimation, there is a higher chance that 2015 accumulation will result in a payday than the late 2011 opportunity when I did my accumulation.  I judge the likelihood of losing all ones money to be pretty high in 2015 just as I did in 2011 though so it's always good advice to never sink money into anything so speculative if one cannot walk away from it with a laugh.

If sidechains come to the fore, the sum total of all sidechains will be reflected in Bitcoin.  Certainly some sidechains will fail and some will be scams and so on, but sitting on the actual value store in the form of Bitcoin will be effectively having a simultaneous bet on all of them and could potentially be a 'dynastic wealth' event.

What could also happen, however, is that a hostile takeover event (such as XT was) could succeed and could ruin Bitcoin as a viable value basis and settlement layer for a system of subordinate chains such as sidechains.  In that case it would be a simple matter for the subordinate chains system to choose something else and something better.  We (hodlers) would have to hope that whatever that something else was, it derived at least some of it's initial its value from the Bitcoin blockchain.  That is actually quite possible.

I'm personally 'out of the game' as someone who took my position in an earlier generation.  I'm mostly just trying to give an honest appraisal of how I would be reading the card deck now.  I could be wrong...I often am.

5045  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. [NooNooPol] on: August 20, 2015, 07:02:46 PM

Gold up.  Bitcoin might be recovering ever so slightly from the Hearn's XT hostile takeover attempt but it's hard to say.  Certainly some significant damage was done to the market depth.  Anyone using that as an indicator over the last month got kicked hard in the balls.

5046  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Bitcoin XT has code which downloads your IP address to facilitate blacklisting on: August 20, 2015, 02:38:08 PM
OK this really looks serious. Gavin and Mike are starting the first real attack against Bitcoin and all that it stands for.

Stop XT!

actually this could be a good test to see how strong bitcoin is, if we can sustain this giant problem caused by two influent guy, then we are done, bitcoin will prove that can defeat anything even internal disputes

all those problems will make bitcoin stronger

yes, if bitcoin can repulse the Hearn-Andresen XT PanoptiCoin FUD panic and forking social attack we'll be in good shape for the next leg up  (and hopefully well shod of those two little ratbags)

So true.  They embedded themselves at a time when Bitcoin was in need of any development effort it could get and have stuck around like cancers since that time.  Now rapidly metastasizing.  Bitcoin's most impressive achievement would be to survive through the days when these two were still around and still causing problems.

Ultimately Satoshi's most impressive design might have been that of building a social structure which could encapsulate and ultimately expel the likes of Mike and Gavin.  Thankfully the promise of the technology is such that it attracted the right kind of people as well, and many of these folks happen to have very good engineering skills.

I was one of the first people to publicly call out all of Mike, Gavin, and the Bitcoin Foundation here on this forum I think.  Before TBF was formed I suggested that transparency was important to me since I would need to make decisions about what to do upon a hostile fork failure mode which I was anticipating as a likely event at some point in the future.  It was not idle talk.  Concerns like these factored into the position I took in the first place and how I've dealt with that position over the years.  I would not have expected Bitcoin to survive with Mike and Gavin being where they were and doing what they do.  If it does I'll be even more in awe of Satoshi's variety of design skills.

5047  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. [NooNooPol] on: August 20, 2015, 02:25:56 AM

Before cypherdoc locked his thread and tried to blame the mods,

Using censorship to silence any individual or groups of individuals is fundamentally one of the most horrible things that can be done to a human being.

...

You are simply a horrible person, you think you are funny but you are not. Welcome to my permanent ignore list.

LOL!  You horrible person you.


You know that claim is nonsense, but join in the attack to silence others.

Actually I did strongly suspect that it was an erroneous assertion and did something I rarely do which was to fail to qualify the statement.  This was pure trolling.  It worked.  Well.

5048  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. [NooNooPol] on: August 19, 2015, 10:43:45 PM


Your old ass might have never heard of "Don't hate the player, hate the game"  did ya?

A dangerous, unwarranted and most definitely not authorized attack on the network. Yes authorized as in these two balloon blowers don't have the authority to fork under political opinions and organize a veritable PR attack, appealing to their fraudulent identity and to the system's creator vision. A weak, shameless attempt to rip apart the consensus, NOT create a new one.


That young ass never heard that anyone has the authority to code a client in an open source environment.

Yes, but never the moral authority to force it through everyone's throat with a campaign of coordinated PR hack jobs painted with all the fallacious arguments in the dictum.

that's funny.  the only force i see is the censorship.

Orwellian speak of the cheerleaders of the censors.
War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength. Censorship is liberalism.


cypherdoc already heavily leveraged theymos's platform in his Hashfast shilling operation and one supposes he didn't give theymos of dime of his 3000 btc haul.

Just like you 'Free Shit Nation' people who think that the world owes you free crypto-currency transactions, you also seem to think that the world owes you a free place to shill for whatever you want.  It is clearly you guys who think of everything as a welfare state and want your entitlements.

When you use 'bitcointalk.org' which was set up for Bitcoin but is kind enough to provide a space for alt discussions won't let you shill (indefinitely) for XT or whatever alt you like anywhere you want, the howls of rage and despair are deafening.  And pretty funny in a lulzy sort of way to say the truth.  I actually don't agree with the mods who locked the predecessor thread, but it is resulting in a barrel of laughs as you guys squeal like stuck pigs.

5049  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. [NooNooPol] on: August 19, 2015, 06:34:58 PM

Before cypherdoc locked his thread and tried to blame the mods, ...


if you're gonna flat out lie like this, you could at least try a little harder to obfuscate.  this one is so far from the truth for all to see, you're now just making an ass of yourself.  as you've always done.

cypherdoc says:  "HALP!  I'm being oppressed I dropped the soap."

5050  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. [NooNooPol] on: August 19, 2015, 06:21:58 PM
...
BTW:



Code:
R3KT


Before cypherdoc locked his thread and tried to blame the mods, I asked justusranvier when they anticipated switching the reference implementation of XT over to being from the 'btcd' codebase (written in 'go' rather than based on Satoshi's initial 'c' language.)  He didnt' respond.

Since Mike couldn't help himself and jumped the gun on inserting the basis for blacklisting into his non-fork of Satoshi/Core codebase and someone busted him, it looks like their populist propaganda campaign is going to fail and XT probably won't get even a plurality let alone a consensus.  They may as well switch to 'btcd' now and try.  I guess Gavin recognizes that.

I'd say that Mike's best strategy now would be to do a clean implementation off 'btcd' then use a combination of corporate backing and government mandates to try to steer people into his web of monitoring and control.

5051  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. [NooNooPol] on: August 19, 2015, 05:56:36 PM
Wha Happened....to the original thread?

theymos via BadBear locked the thread purportedly for being "off topic".  really it was b/c we were talking about XT.

note how this thread is similarly off topic in that no one talks about gold for the most part.  it's all about pushing the Core agenda and the mods don't have any problem with that.

Gold up.  Bitcoin collapsing.

Fixed!

5052  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. [NooNooPol] on: August 19, 2015, 02:21:20 PM

Cypher I told you you will get #REKT...

You're the one getting rekt and don't even know it, lol.

your powers of projection are becoming insanely good, almost as good as your infomercial shilling skills.
http://www.econotimes.com/Federal-Judge-approves-fraud-claims-against-HashFast-77641

Yikes!  If I'd made a ton shilling for something which is shaping up to be very possibly a fraud in the eyes of the court, and I was the only person who did seem to make any money off it, I might be as cranky as the doc here.  Especially if the only money to be found was sitting in a 3000 BTC wallet under my control.  One suspects that he may have been instructed to not be moving them around to much.

I hope cypherdoc's hands don't quiver to much when he thinks about dropping the soap as he's operating on someone's eyeballs.  Now I understand 'smooth's avatar better...he's must have been one of cypherdoc's patients and it's a warning!

5053  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. [NooNooPol] on: August 19, 2015, 07:24:05 AM
The nice thing about allowing attackers to use a forum is that it becomes possible to pin people who have put in a lot of effort.  Looking through the now-locked thread, I identify some of the primary petites taches de merde as so:

 - cypherdoc
 - justusranvier
 - peter r
 - solex
 - erdogan
 - zarathustra
 - smooth/rocks
 - majamalu
 - stolfi (honorable mention - still as active as ever elsewhere.)

If you're suggesting smooth and rocks are the same, can you please explain why?

They just always kinda seemed the same to me.  They seemed to come into my vision at about the same time and seemed fairly reasonable then subtly shifted into being increasingly XT pumpers.  The 'suggestion' was actually a bit of a probe to see what reaction I got if any.

I have a lot of difficulty imagining anyone who's reasonably intelligent and informed not seeing XT as probably being anything other than what has seemingly turned out to be.  Certainly there was a high probability of this simply from the guy who was the driving force behind it.  I just cannot square this with anyone who had any interest in Bitcoin based on it's initial virtues.  So I am deeply suspicious of anyone who had ever supported XT, and especially those who became more vocal in this support rather than less as time went by and more information became available.

5054  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Bitcoin XT has code which downloads your IP address to facilitate blacklisting on: August 19, 2015, 06:38:01 AM

Looks like XT is a piece of shady bullshit. What will be in the next version ? Direct reporting to NSA ?

confirmed, totally shady.

I have had my suspicions about Gavin for a long time, CIA visit (no transcript), CFR talk, the CA/TLS payment protocol privacy leak but this is damning if he wants to sign off on this shit. And the way the XT panopticoin fork is being pitched reads like a bad infomercial.

Never trust an Aussie, Gavin, you just made it onto my blacklist (and it is quite short).

Seems like well past the time to get rid of Gavin's alert key.  I'll look forward to a release which does this or a patch to use next time I build from source.  I could see it being used to startle the herd at an opportune time and get them to do something which is against their interests.

5055  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Bitcoin XT has code which downloads your IP address to facilitate blacklisting on: August 19, 2015, 06:25:45 AM
On the one side, you can see why they are doing this. In the USA they need to adhere to all these KYC/AML regulations and they have to allow for those 3 letter agencies to have access to all your informations as a citizen.

What they tend to forget is, not EVERYONE live in the USA and Bitcoin is a global technology, where these "USA Rules" do not apply to everyone. They cannot infringe on sovereign countries privacy to protect their own

interest.  Angry This is why Bitcoin XT will fail in my opinion.... It's not a fork being done in the interest of a global need, but to satisfy the USA government and all it's regulations.

cypherdoc was arguing the other day that the increased block size could be used to freeze out the Chinese miners who are hamstrung by their government's network policy.  The guy is a technical nobody.  Whether he is formally shilling for and in communication with the XT crowd is unknown but seems quit possible.  He makes a good living by shilling and picked up 3000 BTC from HashFast (which failed) doing it so he must be effective and he has been non-stop XT form many months now.

One way or another, it is funny to argue out of one side of your mouth that the increased blocksize load is perfectly safe and out of the other side that it can thwart people who are operating behind even the mild form of network control exercised in by the Chinese government at this time.

5056  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Why Gavin is so desperate about his fork? Is he hiding something? on: August 19, 2015, 06:15:54 AM

It's disturbing how Gavin is not posting to the community at all, he's doing all this in silence.

He probably can't even look his own image in the mirror straight in the eyes...

All this would not have been possible if he would have had to defend his proposal in front of community in direct conversation.

Honestly, I've had a mild feeling for some time that Gavin just wants out, and even has perhaps tried to subtly warn people about this stuff.  I don't get the sense that he is anywhere near the driver's seat.  I'm inclined to wonder if he is more like a guy bound up and stuffed into the trunk.

5057  Other / Off-topic / Re: What can I do now the Gold Collapsing, Bitcoin UP thread is censored by thermos on: August 19, 2015, 05:53:23 AM
For over 3 years I regularly followed the Gold Collapsing, Bitcoin UP thread, and it was a major component of my bitcoin fix.

Now that thermos locked it down because people were obviously going to discuss [REDACTED] and thermos did not like the results of the poll on [REDACTED], I am feeling lost. I need my Gold Collapsing, Bitcoin UP fix and just can't find it anywhere else.

Who says that cypherdoc himself didn't lock it.  If so, are you still going to be his tag-a-long friend?

You're joking right? Thermos has been on a tear deleting posts and banning major bitcoin supporters over in /r/bitcoin. Thermos locked the thread there is no question. If you're going to deny that then there is no point in ever responding to you again.

I'm not denying anything.  I simply don't know and personally have not seen what you are talking about vis-a-vis theymos.  It's unlike him in the 4 years I've been paying attention.  On the other hand cypherdoc locked his thread a few months ago IIRC.  This makes it a reasonable hypothesis that he did it again.

5058  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. [NooNooPol] on: August 19, 2015, 05:50:05 AM

Nobody I can think of advocated censoring or sterilizing anything.  For all we know cypherdoc himself picked up his ball and went home.

You're  still as stupid ever and willing to throw loose  allegations around like vomit.

You're still going to lose because of all your unethical tactics.

... and here comes the compromised shill to lecture others on ethics. Have you no shame?

He's always welcome on my thread even if he is the kind of pansy who messed up his own and tried to blame others for it.  Cypherdoc is his own worst enemy when he flaps his gums in the presence of people smart enough and informed enough to matter.

BTW, cypherdoc:  Gold up, Bitcoin collapsing...thanks in no small part to your own efforts.

5059  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Is There A Way To Increase Blocksize And Keep Bitcoin Core?? on: August 19, 2015, 05:37:43 AM
Sure.  Just wait until it is necessary.  Even staunch small-blockists like me have no real problem with raising the block size as long as it

 - is necessary
 - can contribute to support of a real solution for scaling
 - is safe
 - does not compromise the security and autonomy of the solution which is the most important and valuable thing about Bitcoin to me.

In no way, shape, or form is allowing nearly free purchases of frappacino worth sacrificing any of the above mentioned aspects.  If Bitcoin were going to 'take off' under near-free transaction fees it would have done so within the last decade when the infrastructure was supported by inflation alone and fees were negligible.  That it did not means that there is really no demand for native Bitcoin used in that role and other solutions are simply more competitive.

I have hope that frappacino-coin will be implemented as a sidecoin so in reality Bitcoin will be used for such purposes but in a way which is safe, scalable, flexible, and highly robust.  Best of all worlds with no tangible downsides...except that it will blow up any hopes that TPTB would have of tracking.  The fact that the pre-mature seeming thrust to do the BitcoinXT hostile takeover happened leads me to believe that sidechains will actually work quite well and there was really no choice but to try to do it as a hail Mary and hope for the best.

5060  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. [NooNooPol] on: August 19, 2015, 05:15:52 AM
You guys cheering thermos' censoring of the thread is just sad.

You do understand that just because you silence others that does not make their ideas magically go away, and it does not make you right.

But you always had a losing argument, must feel nice to have the thread censored to get you off the hook of having to continue to defend obvious nonsense.

You guys pulled the nuclear option and deleted/sanitized all discussion you disagree with from /r/bitcoin and bitcointalk.org. If you have to resort to that it always means you are on the wrong side.

So bask in your assumed victory now that there is no one left to question you. It's going to be a short lived one.

Nobody I can think of advocated censoring or sterilizing anything.  For all we know cypherdoc himself picked up his ball and went home.

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