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6121  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Rootstock (RSK) - Smart Contracts for Bitcoin on: May 14, 2018, 09:33:46 PM
Is there an official thread for RSK on Bitcointalk? I couldn't find one. Is OP from the RSK team?

I want to learn more about this project because this could be groundbreaking for all coins without smart contracts like LTC, Dash, Monero, etc. This will be one of best ICO's to invest.
6122  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Bounties (Altcoins) / Re: [BOUNTY] INVESTACO.IN 1M TOKENS $800,000 REWARDS, NEW TELEGRAM!!! on: May 14, 2018, 11:18:31 AM
Hi bounty manager,

I want to ask about the end date of the signature campaign. How long we have to wear signature after bounty end? What is the end date?
6123  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Bounties (Altcoins) / Re: [BOUNTY] Hdac - Blockchain-based IoT contracts by Hyundai. 600k$ FIX POOL 90BTC on: May 14, 2018, 11:12:51 AM
Announcement on HDAC Bounty distribution

Since TGE & Presale distributions are almost completed, and we have received final confirmation from Hdac Tech AG in Switzerland, we are to proceed with Bounty distribution.

PLEASE go through the instructions below BEFORE proceeding any further:
—---------
1. Below are links where you can download the latest version of the Hdac wallet. (If you have already downloaded the Hdac wallet through TGE or Presale, you can use the same wallet address. Even if you download again, the wallet address will be the same). Download the Hdac wallet relevant to your device and install.
Android: https://s3.eu-central-1.amazonaws.com/hdac-forward/hdac/HdacWallet.apk
Windows: https://s3.eu-central-1.amazonaws.com/hdac-forward/hdac/hdac_setup.exe
Mac: https://s3.eu-central-1.amazonaws.com/hdac-forward/hdac/HDACWallet_OSX.zip

2. Login to BitcoinTalk using your own account. (This itself is the verification process that you are yourself and that you have participated in the Hdac Bounty program).

3. Copy & paste your Hdac wallet address, together with your email address (in case we need to contact you) and send it via BitcoinTalk message to the username: HDAC.

4. We will gather all addresses together with your BitcoinTalk username and compare with the Bounty data we have. Therefore, please use your BitcoinTalk account which was used to participate in the Bounty program. (Any incorrect username will not be accepted).

5. Gathering wallet address will take place for two weeks (deadline is 28th of May, 2018) and distribution will be proceeded at once after the deadline (further schedule will be announced through Telegram Bounty channel.)

6. All notices and announcements will be made through Telegram. (Join the official Bounty Telegram channel: https://t.me/HDAC_bounty)


PRECAUTIONS!
- DO NOT provide the Hdac voucher address as for any loss of DAC due to participants’ mistake in sending the wrong wallet address cannot be restored or sent again and Hdac or Amazix are not responsible for this matter.
- Please send the correct wallet address by using ‘COPY’ and ‘PASTE’ to avoid errors.
- Send your Hdac wallet address and your email address to the Bitcointalk username: HDAC.
- For those participants who do not respond within the distribution period (28th of May, 2018), DAC cannot be sent and your participation may be cancelled.
- Use your own BitcoinTalk account which was used to participate in the Bounty program in order to verify yourself.

By sending your wallet address and your email address, we acknowledge that you agree to the below:
- I agree that I have sent the correct wallet address.
- I agree that Hdac or Amazix are not responsible for any loss of DAC due to sending the wrong address and that it cannot be restored or sent again.
- I agree that I will join the official Bounty Telegram group chat for further announcements.


Contact us on https://t.me/HDAC_bounty for inquiries.

Can i get the HDAC profile link

Here you are:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=2054516
6124  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Bounties (Altcoins) / Re: [BOUNTY] Hdac - Blockchain-based IoT contracts by Hyundai. 600k$ FIX POOL 90BTC on: May 14, 2018, 11:03:57 AM
Ok, all done. My email and newly downloaded Hdac wallet address sent to HDAC member account using a PM. Now I'm waiting for updates on Telegram bounty channel. This is a happy day for Hdac bounty participants.
6125  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][SALE] Hdac - Blockchain-based IoT contracts by Hyundai. 27th November on: May 14, 2018, 10:59:13 AM
I like to see that Hdac is listening to us and there are more info and updates lately. I see progress and team is developing a great product, I think. Just downloaded wallet and I have to say that everything was smooth. Installation took few minutes. I have missed this trusted survey. Never seen any announcement about this.
6126  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Bounties (Altcoins) / Re: [BOUNTY] Hdac - Blockchain-based IoT contracts by Hyundai. 600k$ FIX POOL 90BTC on: May 14, 2018, 10:26:18 AM
Announcement on HDAC Bounty distribution

Since TGE & Presale distributions are almost completed, and we have received final confirmation from Hdac Tech AG in Switzerland, we are to proceed with Bounty distribution.

PLEASE go through the instructions below BEFORE proceeding any further:
—---------
1. Below are links where you can download the latest version of the Hdac wallet. (If you have already downloaded the Hdac wallet through TGE or Presale, you can use the same wallet address. Even if you download again, the wallet address will be the same). Download the Hdac wallet relevant to your device and install.
Android: https://s3.eu-central-1.amazonaws.com/hdac-forward/hdac/HdacWallet.apk
Windows: https://s3.eu-central-1.amazonaws.com/hdac-forward/hdac/hdac_setup.exe
Mac: https://s3.eu-central-1.amazonaws.com/hdac-forward/hdac/HDACWallet_OSX.zip

2. Login to BitcoinTalk using your own account. (This itself is the verification process that you are yourself and that you have participated in the Hdac Bounty program).

3. Copy & paste your Hdac wallet address, together with your email address (in case we need to contact you) and send it via BitcoinTalk message to the username: HDAC.

4. We will gather all addresses together with your BitcoinTalk username and compare with the Bounty data we have. Therefore, please use your BitcoinTalk account which was used to participate in the Bounty program. (Any incorrect username will not be accepted).

5. Gathering wallet address will take place for two weeks (deadline is 28th of May, 2018) and distribution will be proceeded at once after the deadline (further schedule will be announced through Telegram Bounty channel.)

6. All notices and announcements will be made through Telegram. (Join the official Bounty Telegram channel: https://t.me/HDAC_bounty)


PRECAUTIONS!
- DO NOT provide the Hdac voucher address as for any loss of DAC due to participants’ mistake in sending the wrong wallet address cannot be restored or sent again and Hdac or Amazix are not responsible for this matter.
- Please send the correct wallet address by using ‘COPY’ and ‘PASTE’ to avoid errors.
- Send your Hdac wallet address and your email address to the Bitcointalk username: HDAC.
- For those participants who do not respond within the distribution period (28th of May, 2018), DAC cannot be sent and your participation may be cancelled.
- Use your own BitcoinTalk account which was used to participate in the Bounty program in order to verify yourself.

By sending your wallet address and your email address, we acknowledge that you agree to the below:
- I agree that I have sent the correct wallet address.
- I agree that Hdac or Amazix are not responsible for any loss of DAC due to sending the wrong address and that it cannot be restored or sent again.
- I agree that I will join the official Bounty Telegram group chat for further announcements.


Contact us on https://t.me/HDAC_bounty for inquiries.

Great news for all bounty hunters!!! Distribution will start soon. Amazix and Hdac are both very solid and professional. I knew that they will deliver their promises. Let's hope for great product from Hdac.
6127  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Tokens (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][ICO] «Envion» Most Profitable Self-Expanding Crypto Infrastructure on: May 14, 2018, 10:18:28 AM
$0,428315 USD (-4,94%)
0,00004596 BTC (-7,59%)
0,00062851 ETH (-8,80%)
I have already written at 70 cents that you should sell the shit. now you get even less. I sold everything at 89 cents. and now I'm waiting to see if it will be cheaper. or the team is already gone. one does not know

$0,286071 USD (-2,46%)
0,00003413 BTC (-1,57%)
0,00040841 ETH (-4,69%)


this really doesn't look good for the early investors. but now the price is cheap and you can buy even more ENVION cheap.is the team still here?   Grin Grin 

I just don't understand Envion team. The price is falling every day and they do nothing to stop this. Just sell some news, give frequent updates, come here to talk with your investors. This will give some hope and confidence to investors and bag holders. You have to play with the market. If there will be still only one update in two months, the price will reach -95% from ICO price in next few months.
6128  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Tokens (Altcoins) / Re: 🌟🌟🚀📈[ANN-ICO]ATLANT Real Estate Platform| 📈🚀🌟🌟 on: May 13, 2018, 01:54:16 PM
i see the price of ATL rise in BTC terms now,,
because in USD terms, the value of all cryptocurrency is depends on Bitcoin price in USD and bitcoin price is down at this moment
i hope this is only a corrections  Wink
correction and whales who using this correction. do not forget about consensus. in last year btc grew up after it. even during.
Bounty hunters would miss the chance for the ALT price increase during this event because they dump right away.
I hope this will be big news ahead so we will not be stuck in this cheap price, I am not use to seeing this, I miss the old days.

Not every bounty hunter dump just after receiving. You will be surprised how many hodl atlant token. There are many addresses with all tokens in it from all rounds. This is very easy to check. Everybody knows that market conditions are bad and if Atlant delivers what they promise this can be a huge gainer. But we have to move even faster because of Brickblocks project if I pronounce the name correctly. They already launched platform before ICO but I don't see any listings which is good for us. There is still little time left to win this race. Remember only first project will benefit from being the first mover in the real estate market.
6129  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Bounties (Altcoins) / Re: 🌟🌟🚀[BOUNTY][ICO]ATLANT REAL ESTATE PLATFORM[OFFICIAL CAMPAIGN]🚀🌟🌟 on: May 13, 2018, 01:37:40 PM
snip

You are so smart and I bet you never did a single mistake in your life  Wink

Atlant team is the best and doing great as we can see from the price...  A..T...L.. is All Time Low  Cry

Thanks for supporting hackers Atlant... You will have my support all the time!


I try to support you and all other hacked members but I see there is not much we can do. I fully understand and agree with you that this matter should be resolved. A lot of us participated in countless bounties and I have never seen a problem with an address change, especially when hacked.

I also see that there is no solidarity in the ranks of bounty hunters. I see mocking comments and no support. I'm surprised by this behavior because 18 months is a long time and each of us is now the target of hackers.

I was sure that your previous posts would flash the support storm, but something completely opposite happened. It seems that the bounty hunters are the most selfish people in this forum or are afraid to support the right cause because they think that they will be exposed to the unpleasantness of the Atlant team.

Atlant pays to hackers now, from what I understand or these payments are not sent at all to this address?

Thanks for your support, I really appreciate it.  Grin

Yes, Atlant team is continuing to pay hackers! This is my hacked address: 0x2FE37Fe20A4c35FAcbf51397F5B143b18C90E199 so you can check for yourself.

Hackers are using the smart contract to take all ETH from that address so all ETH you send there is gone in a second. By doing this they are disabling me to take anything that comes to that address.

If there is some of you that know how to hack over this and take ATL tokens when they come to the address I am ready to give my private key!

The worst thing about this is that I even told Atlant team that I am ready to give all of my Atlant tokens to some charity and they don't need to send it to me, but they are refusing to change the address. My only goal is that hackers don't get any more Atlant.

And team story about automatic distribution that they are unable to change is just funny. Grin

I am sad to say that most of the bounty hunters are selfish and that is the main reason why many ICO managers and team don't give us proper respect for our work and ofter scam us.

Frogman did something even worse to me. He promised on this thread and PM to change my hacked address, and then never did:



Here's the hacked address: https://etherscan.io/address/0x02aa0204fb3a7f73ee6b140897c196895e492580#tokentxns
Within 5 minutes they steal every token.

WOOW amazing! This just proves that they can change it and won't spend 5 minutes to do that...

I really can't understand their reasons... Team members got angry on me and banned me on Telegram for criticizing them after they did not keep their promises and changed my hacked address.

This is not good way to start your project... They will do the same thing with  their investors tomorow!



Do ATLANT team realize they're illegally funding criminals? With their faces on the website? That's so smart.  Roll Eyes

I think hacked bounty hunters should try to reach established members of this forum and point them to this thread. Or even open a thread in meta or scam accusations. If they don't know about your problems they can't help. I have seen many other cases of scam and fraud in bounty campaigns dealt in this subforums in such topics. I don't say to open a scam accusation but why not to ask for help and advise from high-rank and more experienced members. They have dealt with all kind of abuse on this forum and maybe will be able to help.
6130  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][INV] INVESTA - CRYPTO BANKING PLATFORM 🌎 on: May 13, 2018, 12:13:33 PM
Op or Investa team why are you not defending your project? Answer all this questions and concerns from posts above. Everybody wants to hear an explanation. Especially members involved in your ICO.

How much funds Investa already raised to date? Any other news, updates?
6131  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: ▉ANN▉ MTNC ▉▉▉▉░ Masternodecoin ░▉▉▉ Multiple Privacy Center Platform on: May 12, 2018, 10:21:22 AM
Keep voting to add Masternodecoin to Next Exchange.

Leave comments and use all your browsers to multiply your votes.

No registration needed just click the link and vote!!!

https://nextexchange.featureupvote.com/suggestions/4561/masternodecoin
I have voted, one more vote for MTNC on nextexchange. Let's do it and give your hands to support MTNC by voting.
Please spend your time (just a couple of seconds) to vote for MTNC.
By the way, thanks for the announcement thread and link to vote, wwzsocki.

This MTNC voting event on next exchange has been added since for some months now. I don't know why we are not yet up to 1000 votes by now. It's so sad. This is free listing in a potentially great exchange that will help raise the trading volume of MTNC. I am involved in some other project that was also put up for voting around same time with MTNC and has reached 1000+ votes and is already being considered for listing when the exchange launch.

Should be added as a requirement for airdrop 4 to vote on Next Exchange for Masternodecin.

This is indeed sad that we can't bypass 350 votes mark after almost 3 months of voting. Majority of this votes are from a Facebook because was added to the bounty as a task.

We all know that Masternodecoin needs more volume and investors so Next Exchange was and still is a perfect opportunity for us. From what I know this listing on Next is free if enough people vote but this can change very fast after they jump into higher volumes. High volumes and listing fees asked by exchanges are the two major problems for Masternodecoin project to be finally listed on a big exchange.
6132  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Tokens (Altcoins) / Re: 🌟🚀 [ANN][ICO] Paytomat – Decentralized System for Cryptocurrency Payments 🚀🌟 on: May 11, 2018, 02:58:22 PM
I see 3% of tokens allocated for bounty campaign but I can't find your campaign anywhere. I have seen many questions about bounty in this thread but looks like ignored and le unanswered. This will be enough to add an announcement about bounty in the first post to avoid all these questions and off-topic reservations. A simple statement just like any other project with information about the bounty. If there is bounty and link or explanation. Period.

I don't even want to join your bounty campaign but after reading countless reservations and questions about bounty in this thread I just wonder why OP or anybody else never explained this matter. ANN Thread should have such an information. Or maybe I haven't found it? I don't think so because read every post in this thread.

I don't know what to think about this ICO. Professional web pages (really great job), very good detailed roadmap, challenging technical white paper. That was my first impression after I have seen your ICO page and read the white paper. But this thread killed this great first impression with each read post.
6133  Local / Polski / Re: Co robię gdy bitcoin spada.. on: May 11, 2018, 11:31:21 AM
Trzeba wymienić przed spadkiem na USDT lub FIAT, poczekać aż dobije do dna i kupić znowu. I tak powtarzać ten schemat aż w końcu będziesz bogaty  Grin. Kiedyś też byłem omamiony przez HODL ale mi przeszło. Nie widzę powodu dla którego miałbym stracić 70% wartości swojego portfolio. Jak jesteśmy w okresie wzrostów "bull run" to moje portfolio wygląda tak 80% krypto, 15% złoto, srebro i 5% FIAT. Jak mamy spadki to 15% krypto, 30% złoto srebro i 55% FIAT. Ta taktyka dała mi najlepsze wyniki. Trzymał bym więcej w USDT podczas spadków lub w podobnych krypto wymienianych 1:1 ale im nie ufam w najmniejszym stopniu. Dlatego tracę dużo na opłatach ale wymieniam lwią część na FIAT i jestem bezpieczny. Mogę spokojnie oglądać spadki. Powiem wiecej im bardziej spada tym bardziej się cieszę bo moge znowu kupić za grosze. Wcześniej trzymałem podczas spadków i miało to bardzo zły wpływ na mnie. Niepotrzebny stres i strata pieniędzy.
6134  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Bounties (Altcoins) / Re: 🌟🌟🚀[BOUNTY][ICO]ATLANT REAL ESTATE PLATFORM[OFFICIAL CAMPAIGN]🚀🌟🌟 on: May 11, 2018, 11:07:24 AM
snip

You are so smart and I bet you never did a single mistake in your life  Wink

Atlant team is the best and doing great as we can see from the price...  A..T...L.. is All Time Low  Cry

Thanks for supporting hackers Atlant... You will have my support all the time!


I try to support you and all other hacked members but I see there is not much we can do. I fully understand and agree with you that this matter should be resolved. A lot of us participated in countless bounties and I have never seen a problem with an address change, especially when hacked.

I also see that there is no solidarity in the ranks of bounty hunters. I see mocking comments and no support. I'm surprised by this behavior because 18 months is a long time and each of us is now the target of hackers.

I was sure that your previous posts would flash the support storm, but something completely opposite happened. It seems that the bounty hunters are the most selfish people in this forum or are afraid to support the right cause because they think that they will be exposed to the unpleasantness of the Atlant team.

Atlant pays to hackers now, from what I understand or these payments are not sent at all to this address?
6135  Local / Polski / Re: Czemu nie nagradzamy sie Meritami? on: May 11, 2018, 10:25:34 AM
...bo powstrzyma tysiace konkurentow przed awansem i zajeciem ich miejsca w dobrym bounty, tlumaczeniu lub innej mozliwosci zarobku...
... te setki postów to da moon byle tylko kepnac cokowiek i wbić range to tez średnie było bo forum sie czytać nie dało czasem, jak masz przelecieć forum liska i moon w co drugim poście to cie szlak trafia.
Z farmieniem merita to problem moim zdaniem jest ale ja np wole dawać go jak cos Polakom niż obcym : )

Zgadzam się, że od tego spamu na forum to aż oczy bolą. Merit jest dobry do zwalczania spamu, nie ma o czym dyskutować ale z drugiej stony zablokował w dużym stopniu możliwość awansu. Chyba my zwykli użytkownicy musimy po prostu ponieść koszty związane z rozwiązaniem problemu spamu, farmowania kont, tp.

Zacząłem zgłaszać wszystkie próby łamania regulaminu i robię to używając guzika "report to moderator". Przez kilka tygodnidni  znalazłem 850 prób łamania regulaminu a moja celność była wysoka bo aż 99%. Znajdowałem tematy, w których było dwoeście spamerskich odpowiedzi pod rząd. Jak moderator skończył sprzątać to z tematu na 13 stron zrobiły się 2. Trafiłem na wszystko, spam, scam, farmowanie kont, spam boty, plagiat, ref linki, off topic, bumpowanie, itd.

Nie robiłem tego celowo, tylko podczas przeglądania forum, kiedy zauważyłem podejrzany post po prostu raportowałem go. Z początku nie wiedziałem czy na pewno mam rację bo niektóre posty miały ponad 200 znaków a były totalnym spamem bez żadnego sensu i nie zwiazane z tematem. Spamerzy coraz bardziej próbują ukryć swoją działalność pisząc długie ale bezsensowne posty (spam) lub po prostu nie na temat (off topic).

Oczywiście wszystkich od razu wrzucam na "Ignore" i jakość czytania jest o wiele lepsza, polecam każdemu. Moderatorzy działają szybko i skutecznie bo sprawdziłem zaraporotawe przeze mnie posty i wszystkie zostały usunięte a ich autorzy odpowiednio ukarani, zależnie od przewinienia.

Po tych kilku tygodniach uświadomiłem sobie jak dużo problemów mamy na BitcoinTalk i czemu merit to zło konieczne.
6136  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: ▉ANN▉ MTNC ▉▉▉▉░ Masternodecoin ░▉▉▉ Multiple Privacy Center Platform on: May 11, 2018, 10:10:37 AM
I have not looked MTNC thread long time. When the next airdrop? Fourth or even Fifth?

Lately, 3rd airdrop was distributed and there should be 4th round but is postponed and Dev ask the community for help or even to take over this task.

I think we should wait with 4th round until new wallet V3.0.0.0 is released with One Key Bounty function because we could use this feature for airdrop tasks and distribution. As we all seen wallet was almost completed and O.K.Bounty was in testing phase. Let's hope for good news when dev will be back again.
6137  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][SALE] Hdac - Blockchain-based IoT contracts by Hyundai. 27th November on: May 11, 2018, 10:02:32 AM
I haven't seen this question yet so I will ask. What do you think, what the price will be of Hdac coin when hits first exchange?

More than ICO or less? How much more or less and why?

Maybe a discussion on this topic will help us to wait calmly for the distribution of the bounty.
snip
snip
snip
snip
snip
snip

I see that many of you think that we will see better price even 5 times as ICO. I am not so sure. You know why?

Because of the difference between pre-sale token prices and main token sale prices. Not only but this will be the main reason, there is also huge inflation rate and IOTA competition.

In other words; when the pre-sale token price is much cheaper than the main token sale, token prices usually fall after the ICO.
We all know that presale bonus was 1000% and BTC price changed from 1000$ at the start of ICO to 11.000$ in the end.
If you participated in the ICO, you paid around 15x the USD price paid by initial investors.

This will play out in one of two ways:

1. Token Prices Begin At $0.50/DAC On Exchanges

Pre-sale investors will see the ridiculously good returns they’ve achieved and immediately cash out.
Token prices will then crash to well below the main ICO price

2. Token Prices Begin Well Below $0.50/DAC On Exchanges

Result: Token sale investors have already lost out.
On top of this, the team has confirmed (via Telegram) that there is no lockup period for any of the early investors so there will be nothing in place to stop this from occurring either.

source http://cryptogurus.com/reviews/hdac-review/

I also follow the same line of reasoning, hdac when listed in some exchange, the value will be well below what is being discussed in ANN and others  channels.

Ok, so we have seen latest update and let's summarise what we know. There will be additional AMLA procedure with KYC which will take more time because now people have to provide additional documents (I assume minimum 2 months). Mainnet is secured by more nodes. No word about, even slightly more, accurate dates for the roadmap and development schedule. Communication should be improved together with transparency and marketing. We don't want that people forget about Hdac because there is no news or buzz in media.
6138  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Tokens (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][ICO] «Envion» Most Profitable Self-Expanding Crypto Infrastructure on: May 08, 2018, 03:45:40 PM
I am very upset by the capitalization of the Envion project today is estimated at $ 40,046,423 USD. this is a very pessimistic value, considering that at the moment ico Envion collected 100 million.

Exactly, this is disappointing to see capitalization at 50% of ICO price. I wonder how much more before they start to do something with that. I still believe that there is a chance for Envion to succeed. There is no competition from what I know.
6139  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Bounties (Altcoins) / Re: «Envion» Highest ROI crypto infrastructure | $2M Bounty available! on: May 08, 2018, 09:24:56 AM
Is this Telegram group still live? https://t.me/Envion

When I try to open this link I see a message "This group is no longer accessible". I don't think, I'm banned because I was never a member of this group. But I won't be surprised because this has already happened one time in a different project group.
6140  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Tokens (Altcoins) / Re: 🌟🌟🚀📈[ANN-ICO]ATLANT Real Estate Platform| 📈🚀🌟🌟 on: May 08, 2018, 09:14:31 AM
3rd round paid and the impact of dump on the price is slightly positive, I think. We have seen 18% fall but slowly price goes up as hunters started to hold their tokens. I see everybody learned their lesson from last 2 months and nobody wants to lose a cent from Atlant token. That was a controversial decision with 18 months long payout but as we see this is the best way to distribute such a massive bounty with little or no impact on the token price. I knew this would work because I have seen many ICO did something opposite (one-time bounty payout) and dump killed the price for months or even completely, never recovered from this lows and still struggling today.
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