____________________________________ It was so difficult to throw us an email or a PM before going so deep in a new paranoia ? ? ? ? ? ____________________________________ Hello Guys! As extensively said before, there are lawyers who are taking care of our positions against KfC, they are professionals that we paid from our own pockets at an additional loss, as you know. We are the ones exposed in first person (as better analyzed in the previous communications), the ones who are also defending your rights and effectively taking public and REAL responsibility of this horrible situation, beyond the damage. (just to answer to somebody, we are the ones burned for first by this Forum and by the "fantastic Bitcoin mining ecosystem"...). Please, don't let us remind you that we were not obliged to "go legal" nor to accept major risks, and that we could have realized an investment at a 90% loss for everyone by simply welcoming every shitty move that KfC invents or their wonderful timing policies... probably this would have made you happier or more polite... and our life simpler. We need to have patience and to understand that we are not the only ones who are acting against KfC. As we signed an NDA, it's not possible for us to disclose informations nor to directly interact with KfC anymore. It should be obvious that the legal actions are not instant "web-applications" and have their procedures, rituals, time-frames and so on. When things will start to "officially move", the informations will go public and this situation should get the media coverage (we should eventually push it too). The lawyers are doing their excellent job along with some great strategic move and it's only a matter of time before news will become publicly available...  As well said before and as usual when talking about "legal cases", the time stretches and the informations are retained so, please, do not expect frequent updates nor any precise or detailed informations since this "kind of things" get defined only at the end by a judge and a court. Talking about what happens in the meanwhile it's only pure non-sense speculation. Use google first and please stay positive because we are doing our best to bring home the results, sooner or later! The "smarter guys" among you can take in consideration the whole context too and they have an idea of what the "real world" means and what are the concrete implication of our actions and interactions, what is possible/feasible/realistic/due/rational/reasonable and what it's only a kiddy-caprice powered by the ignorance and the stupidity of some empty mind. *** Again, ALL the machines, both kinds, are kept in hostage by KfC *** *** Again, THIS thread is the ONLY one in use to avoid info/replies dispersion, please don't post elsewhere *** Please, contact us via email or PM to catch our attention before blaming or offending us instead of KfC... it would be more "correct" than pretending a 24/7 random-paranoia-appeasement-service on the threads, don't you think? ****************************************** Have a great Holiday Season and an Happy New Year!  Cheers! -akw- ****************************************** |
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___________________________ quando è "gratis" == molto impegnati quando è "in perdita" == impegnatissimissimi quando è "per beneficenza" == completa disposizione (ma non dovreste accorgervene!) ___________________________ ___________________________ gli "ali" / "alimentatori" in inglese si chiamano anche PSUs (Power Supply Units)... forse a qualcuno di voi è sfuggito ma siete stati tutti "avvisati" così come siete stati tutti e singolarmente contattati via PM ed invitati a partecipare alla discussione... posso capire le difficoltà a tradurre dall'inglese ma dopo http://translate.google.com non dovreste avere molte scuse... si aggiorna e si considera come ufficiale il thread in inglese, sia per comodità che per semplicità, oltre che per non tradurre tutto in 5 lingue, lo trovate, come sempre, qui: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=522707.0;all assieme agli ultimi aggiornamenti. per il resto, è chiaro che "si dia per scontato" che non siamo gli unici messi in questa "spiacevole" situazione da KfC e che sarebbe molto più semplice informarsi sul contesto prima di "additare qualcuno"... di sicuro, siamo tra i pochi a prendere le contomisure atte a tutelare i nostri diritti di fronte alla legge (assumendosi ovviamente tutti i rischi, le conseguenze e le responsabilità che ne derivano), pur di trovare una soluzione positiva per questa situazione TOTALMENTE indipendente dalla nostra volontà... è chiaro anche che "si dia per scontata" la conoscenza delle caratteristiche (da sempre pubbliche) dell'hardware pre-ordinato (no PSUs). ___________________________ grazie @alexrossi per il supporto, molto gradito, in questa sezione del Forum e per la pazienza nel riassumere e chiarire la situazione agli altri ragazzi! (siamo stati avvisati da poco dell'esistenza di questo topic, ed abbiamo preferito l'aggiornamento in contemporanea, scusate per il ritardo) ___________________________ Oggi abbiamo diffuso le ultime news sul thread ufficiale (quello in inglese), le trovate qui assieme a maggiori dettagli sulla situazione: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=522707.msg9393631#msg9393631per favore, unitevi alla discussione nel thread ufficiale... ___________________________ L'opzione legale ci è sembrata, per quanto possibilmente insidiosa e rischiosa, la più ragionevole ed "utile" a tutelare i nostri diritti. Speriamo bene. A questo punto, bisogna essere razionali e lucidi nell'affrontare questa situazione, evitando dietrologie varie e processi alle variabili su azioni e decisioni prese più di sei mesi fa... insomma, bisognerebbe rimanere "positivi" e decisi. Per qualunque idea/proposta/suggerimento doveste avere, per favore non esitate a condividerla con gli altri, magari nel thread ufficiale qui: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=522707.0;all Have a good time & Cheers! -akw- P.S.: "si da per scontato" anche che non bisogni ripetere quanto già scritto in inglese...  P.S.2: per avere un'idea delle dimensioni della situazione "dal di fuori", date un'occhiata qui: http://www.kncrefund.com/ |
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Confirmed. The new legal action was started, we hired another Law Firm and we have now to hope and cross our fingers for this bad story to resolve in a positive and maybe quick way at the end... Even without sufficient feedback from you, we decided to take the risks involved and we paid, we'll pay and we are paying these actions against KfC until it will be possible... No moneys were contributed by shareholders of any GB, we'll recover the spent amounts on the positive ending of this story, WE HOPE! Really a looooot of money are flowing out *thankfully* to KfC..... Nobody can tell us a precise timing for these "actions" to complete, you should be aware that, it would need months or years to see an ending or a definitive court decision about our cases and it could also turn bad and resolve in nothing if not in a major loss for us... it's useless to create false illusions, we can't be sure of nothing at this point if not that our cases "should" be "well founded" from a legal point-of-view... Anyway, that's the best strategy/way for trying to contain our losses and mitigate the damages occurred/occurring if not to finally have our consumer's rights protected against the KfC behavior... ***** On a further consideration, please note that we are literally "putting our faces" and taking in first person all the responsibilities and consequences that would/could derive from these legal actions... also on your behalf! It's really delusional to see only a few of you joining and collaborating on this discussion, or simply sharing their's ideas or support... ***** We'll remain at disposal and we'll update you as more concrete news will be available, the PM way to trigger our attention or ask for something is always a good way to use if you don't see us active for a while... (but please do not expect high-frequency updates, unforutnately, "these things" require "some time") We are sorry that everything went the wrong way since KfC decided to turn to the "dark-side" at our loss, please don't blame us for what is happening but let's go instead to "make some noise on Teh Internet" by saying what REALLY KfC is and how they "act" in respect of their's "loyal customers" who bring to them the resources for becoming "what they seems to be from the outside, now"... [...] It's shocking how they can publicly attract millions of dollars in VC investments while, at the same time, they're litterally screwing up pretty all the people and businesses who concretely supported them by giving them "a lot of advantages" by pre-paying their products... It seems that KnC is taking profits and advantages from abusing also of the fragmentation, the dispersion and the "composition" of the really small and weak "crypto-ecosystem" where a lot of personal (eg. age), regional (eg. laws) or regulatory (eg. taxes) issues adds up and too often happen on the customer side, making hard or impossible for them to protect and defend their "rights" in such complex "international" situations... On the more, people have to forcefully take as "holy law" the statements from KfC (because they wrote "Product not Refundable" on their website) and totally give up on their conditions while hoping to save at least 1/30 of what they spent... [...] KfC *seems* to be a platinum member of BTCfoundation even if there isn't any proof of payment as of today... please, read carefully all the following thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=621770.msg9374929#msg9374929That's a really awful and stressing situation as you can easily imagine, this time we'll avoid to enumerate all the implications, if you have any thought that may help, please share it! _________________________________ On a more colorful side-note, "someone" of you is legally and personally threating us as we should be responsible of KfC faults and their delays depend from us... *BIG-LAUGH* ...what to say, that's obviously "not good for the mood"... ...unfortunately, not everybody is able to use his "so-called" brain, why we should expect they to be able to use google or to get real a life?? However, people invent everyday a new and artistic way to try to profit from others with zero efforts... it's not surprising at all that "someone" have not any truly alternative way to look for a positive income in its life than to LIE.................. __________________________________ __________________________________ thanks @elviselvis for linking this http://www.kncrefund.com/ here! Real informations are slowly reaching the surface and emerging as they really are... we'd need a way lot more NOISE to be done on this! thanks @alexrossi for your support in the italian section, much appreciated! ___________ We're glad to see that "the tone" of the PMs is becoming more polite as the REAL news about KfC are starting to spread... thank you! __________________________________ __________________________________ Sorry for the late and "sparse" updates and, as usual, for the bad English... Stay positive, have a good time & Cheers! -akw-
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Close the thread?
You should've opened a thread time ago to let all the fucked (by knc of course) people be updated. It's more simple for us but especially for you! How can a person prefer spend time with tons of pms when you can update with a single thread and once for all? It's nonsense for me.
I've also sent you a PM months ago and got no response.
Sorry but I'm very frustrated by the situation...
it was done for legal reasons... sorry... |
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"updates" so far:
- no replies received
- orders still showing as "Paid" and not "Processing"
- not so much of you joined this discussion
- on Monday we'll try to send an email again and we hope to finally get some consistent informations about these "fresh" legal actions
- You're welcome to share your opinion/ideas here and to try to involve other shareholders to do the same and join this discussion, we're all on the same boat...
Cheers!
-akw-
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Thanks for the update, so lets work together to resolve this: first could this, Swedish attorney Magnus Daar, be an option for us; https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/knc-titans-missed-quarter-3-deadline-refunds/if we (you) follow the guideline ? (I still do not understand the tax part: no vat when trading between eu companies, I never pay import tax when buying hardware from Germany, I am in Denmark. Nice catch! Thanks for the informations! We'll contact this lawyer in the coming days, in your opinion, how much should we offer as "bounty" if he can accept our case? Something like the 10%-20% it would be good for you? Any other suggestion? Are we sure to go that way (better to vote for a majority?)? (please continue reading) about the "tax part": at the moment of purchasing a good (EU-EU), if you pay the VAT at the moment of buying (eg. included in price), then no other "taxes" are due. Elsewhere, if you haven't paid the VAT at the moment of buying a good, it goes "suspended" and it is due later when the good is shipped/transported/received... because it wasn't included before as a component of the final price during the sale (the VAT "isn't an asset" under control of the seller nor of the buyer) If we'll be able to go for the legal way, we wouldn't need anymore the PSUs and we'll have to be ready to ship back the Titans once we'll receive them... BUT, at the same time, we'll be charged by new risks and new costs... what if the legal-way doesn't succeed or become only a waste of time? The lawyer should be paid anyway, the time lost will not come back, and the residual-value of the "investment" would become a great question mark in case the legal action for some reason wouldn't help us... Unfortunately, we have to consider the bad scenario too... Another point is that "the public faces" and the legal responsibilities for such actions will not be "technically" yours but ours... as eventually, the consequences would impact directly on us and not you... Are we sure that wouldn't be more convenient for us to wait to receive the miners and to try to sell them in some way, in order to recover as much as we can but without adding other variable costs, risks and time? We would also avoid big-volume and unjustified bank transfers and fiat amounts that would happen in case of "legal success"... that more likely would also trig unwanted red-flags, verifications and additional taxes for us...? We think that we should consider and ponder well the costs/risks/timings involved in both "ways", the legal one and the selling one... please, share your opinions here! Thanks and Cheers! -akw- |
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@alexrossi Please go collect your signature campaign bonuses elsewhere, anyone already knows that you're always ready to blame others and feel "like their master" while being always and totally pointless... thanks so much for your precious collaboration.
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What I dont get is why aren't all the others that invested heavily into this not kicking up a fuss, I would have expected a lot more activity since the thread got re-openend
I have wrote privately to the OP many days ago, but i've never received a reply... i'm happy to have invested an irrelevant quantity of btc. @alexrossi ...it was really-really-hard to find a former "question" in your tons of writing about your life and your friends and what you like to do in your PMs... ...anyway, we obviously can't directly refund you and, if you still haven't understood what's the BIG issue here with KfC, it is that they DON'T refund us. __________________________________________________________________________ Please, don't blame us if crypto-currencies prices are falling during these last weeks... __________________________________________________________________________ About the VAT, it went SUSPENDED at the moment of buying and paying, it is now due (see European laws about it) at the moment when the goods will be sent/carrier-transferred/received... still we can't figure exactly "when" but in any case this will happen sooner or later as KfC will send the titans. We had time to organize and to cooperate to solve these issues, we can't take the responsibilities and the blames at the same time simply because we haven't the cash needed to cover this "operation" instead of all the shareholders (and it's supposed we aren't obliged to) and immediately. About the PSUs that someone keeps asking about... THE PSUs WERE NEVER BEEN INCLUDED. Titan miners NEED PSUs because they are not included by the manufacturer, you can check this pretty everywhere. To recap, we'll need the PSUs to power-on and use the titans, it's obvious... About the order status, it is still shown as "Paid" so, not really consistent news... yesterday arrived a newsletter from KfC with just public news about the miners performances, nothing more. We have to wait while submerged by the KfC's PR sandboxes until they'll ship our miners and we'll be forced to solve the few things remaining... About KfC late deliveries... ...what to say... ......... ...we're suffering from an incredible damage from KfC this year... that's obviously and absolutely not good and we prefer to not express any personal opinion about this publicly... About ebay and other selling/recovering options, it's fine for us to find together a good solution to mitigate the damage... the discussion is obviously open... About the mood... we (all) should try to cooperate and go further instead of insisting in futile and pointless polemics. Things are evolved like this as of now, it's a fact, we have to be "adult" and point forward for a positive and optimal solution that could work for all of us... we are all in the same boat, we should play together instead of against ourselves! Please, join this discussion in a positive way and help yourself and all of us to go through this nth KfC nightmare... Thanks and Cheers! -akw- P.Ss.: "last login" timestamps doesn't really matter on our Forum... with "some" conditions you can leave sessions opened pretty "indefinitely"... We always did our best to reply to "concrete" PMs received, we are sorry if sometime we miss/forgot someone... |
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Any thoughts to selling the Titans on ebay to recover what we can?
it's really risky to use ebay with such hardware but, if we manage to find a professional/expert ebay-mogul at disposal and the expenses of the "operation" still make it worth of... it wouldn't be a bad idea in our opinion! |
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TITAN GB RE-OPENED (NEW SHARES) !!! AS OF NOW: 162/162 shares available! Check below and in OP for the details! ...don't be late! UPDATES (11-09-2014) NEW SHARES:KfC announced today the incoming Titan shipping (starting from the next week), you can find the original news here: https://www.kncminer.com/news/news-106In the interest of this group buy and its success, we have to get ready to receive the miners and prepare for having them fully operational. we need to fund the buying of the necessary PSU units and to pay for the VAT that was suspended when we paid the machines (we hoped for a better btc/$ change...). Two addresses will be written below where to collect the bitcoins for these "operations" The amount of the VAT is 22% so, 2 X (9995 X 22%) = 2 X 2198.9 = 4397.8 $ total The amount for the PSUs is 260 $ each so, 4 X 260 = 1040 $ total The PSUs should cover at least 1100W per machine (4 cubes each) and let us some room for overclocking them. We thought about 2 X corsair AX860i per each machine, such PSUs, very efficient ones, have good protections against "electrical issues" and fire hazards, a lot of PCI-E connectors and will let enough room for overclocking. We are able to find each AX860i @ 198€ or 260$ shipped, new and with guarantee. Using a "fixed" exchange rate @ 480$/BTC, the above amount are: 4398 / 480 = 9.17 BTC1040 / 480 = 2.17 BTCso, in order to cover the above expenses, we are emitting 131 + 31 NEW shares @ 0.07 BTC each VAT = 9.17 = 0.07 X 131 shares PSUs = 2.17 = 0.07 X 31 shares VAT SHARES address: 12jhhmdLmaP9Lrc7TMzYPzQXDjfT2h8sG2PSUs SHARES address: 1Jhjq14BmhuofDQtvbbDfiDwmhKEHRodS2AVAILABLE VAT SHARES 131/131AVAILABLE PSUs SHARES 31/31Above there's a copy of the main thread update, please, join the rest of us and do your best in order to support the GB and un-block the situation... we don't have too much time and we don't want to see vanishing the efforts we did till now... Please help this Titan GB to go further! Thank you & Cheers! -akw- |
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Thanks AKW I appreciate the response, I did actually PM you a month or so back without response & then noticing you weren't active on the forums got me worried.
You're welcome! probably I didn't noticed your PM as I can't find a reply to you in my archive... you're now also on the "mnemonic" update-list ! Cheers! -akw- |
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Hello Guys and sorry for the late update! ___________________---snip---______________________ Premises: Titans thread has just been re-opened and updated, no "bad" news so far. Neptunes updates are being dispatched only via PM (since months), not publicly, also due to the complexity of the Neptunes situation and to legal reasons once at this point. Please, don't mix the two classes/kinds of machines/orders/situations, also in order to avoid confusion and misunderstandings. ANYONE who contacted us via PM got updates on a regular basis (except who wrote during our holidays). We are suffering like you from an huge damage and we are taking huge risks too since a long time... however, we're here with a positive spirit, trying to do our best to mitigate such damage and keep in balance above other user's useless madness... it's really stressing as you can easily guess... blame KfC, not us, for what is happening... Thank you for reading and Cheers! -akw- ___________________---snip---______________________ UPDATES:Titans orders are NOT refundable, we just checked for the nth time, absolutely and unfortunately there's no hope to get a refund. Titans orders are not transferable to other KfC users. At this point, GaW miners discount seems simply aa aggressive marketing operation... We expect KfC to start shipping batch1 during this month (end of Q3) and we strongly hope that they wouldn't adopt the same behavior seen during Neptunes shipping. We have to buy the PSUs for our machines!We have to be ready to pay the VAT that was suspended when buying, as the machines will be delivered (22%)!This post will be updated shortly with the directions for the funds collection. (since the huge damage occurred/occurring, this time we can't anticipate the required amounts, sorry...) Suggestions are welcome and appreciated! Thank you for reading and for your patience! Cheers! -akw- |
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Hello guys! premises: Titans thread is going to be re-opened and updated, no "bad" news so far . Neptunes updates are being dispatched only via PM (since months) also due to the complexity of the Neptunes situation and to legal reasons once at this point. Please, don't mix the two classes/kinds of machines/orders. ...ANYONE who contacted us via PM got updates on a regular basis (except who wrote during our holidays)... both of you (except monkeynutts who is in the "list") seems to have contacted pretty ANYONE on this forum except directly me/us... you are always welcome to do so, it's easier than opening a new thread and send PM to several other users... We are suffering like you from an huge damage and we are taking huge risks too since a long time... however, we're here with a positive spirit, trying to do our best to mitigate such damage and keep in balance above other user's useless madness... it's really stressing as you can easily guess... blame KfC, not us, for what is happening... Thank you for reading and Cheers! -akw- P.S.: If you could close/lock this topic, it would be easier to keep track of user's replies and to avoid confusion and misunderstandings maybe... thanks! |
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Hello guys! premises: Titans thread is going to be re-opened and updated, no "bad" news so far . Neptunes updates are being dispatched only via PM (since months) also due to the complexity of the Neptunes situation and to legal reasons once at this point. Please, don't mix the two classes/kinds of machines/orders. ...ANYONE who contacted us via PM got updates on a regular basis (except who wrote during our holidays)... both you seems to have contacted pretty ANYONE on this forum except directly me/us... you are always welcome to do so, it's easier than opening a new thread and send PM to several other users... We are suffering like you from an huge damage and we are taking huge risks too since a long time... however, we're here with a positive spirit, trying to do our best to mitigate such damage and keep in balance above other user's useless madness... it's really stressing as you can easily guess... blame KfC, not us, for what is happening... Thank you for reading and Cheers! -akw- P.S.: If you could close/lock this topic, it would be easier to keep track of user's replies and to avoid confusion and misunderstandings maybe... thanks! |
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I can't be that "lucky"
You're not lucky, you're failing to measure it correctly. The chips run 300w or so each stock; how do you think you're getting from 220v AC to 0.7v DC with 220w/<15% total loss? Fairy dust and magic beans? u27 u27 is right... phoe should measure the REAL voltage on his "220v" circuit before to multiply it for 15.76?A (...) he may find something between 230v-238v if he doesn't get stoned so often...  Cheers! -akw- |
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AFox, did you file in Sweden? How long did the whole process take?
I hired a lawyer in my country (France) specialized in European law. It took two weeks. I don't know how the lawyer did it. He just asked for the invoice from KNC, my IBAN (account informations) and my identity card. The interesting thing, is that I paid in BTC, but KNC issued me an invoice in USD and paid me back by bank transfer in USD. @AFox, congrats for your success but... we'd like to make your lawyer even richer than he probably is... and it would be great! Could you please forward to me his contacts/details? It would be fantastic to have the support of a competent and already informed lawyer "against" such scam-hole that KfC became........ If you'd need my PGP pub_key, you can find it on pgp.mit.edu Looking foreard for your kind reply, thanks in advance! Cheers! -akw- |
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so is this actually a group buy at all or some kind of loitering ground/phishing hole?
the second option then, definitely, sparely backed with the first... but the second one is what would fit better for the time being! |
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...apologizes for having not answered to your PM... ...usually the queue get clered every 1-3 days KfC is considering our requests "late & silly", not us... we are keeping asking (kindly) to them for a refund at least 2 times a week without ANY success since a looooong time... they simply bounce our questions and simply keep saying that no refunds will be available because "the shipping process has started"............................................ it's an horrible way to know they're turning to Mr Hide.... at our expenses... as nothing is happening... We've personally refunded/re-acquired shares from pretty any (motivated) request received from shareholders untill the end of april (and you know we weren't obliged to)... not to say, obviously, that we're the ones screwed-up the more in this deal because of our correspondant higer quota... ...a looong way before this point we'd like to get a refund too, don't you think so...? Unfortunately, we're in a "strange" situation with KfC where it seems we have to ponder very very well our words, in order to avoid worster reactions and maybe reach the bottom of the queue or find other random "bad surprises" along the way (like already happened to somebody)... wtf... what a bad company with our btc/machines in hostage................... We'll continue to write and call periodically (& kindly) to KfC to get back our funds or our machines... we hope as soon as possible to report to you all some good news finally... Apologizes again... but we are not KfC and we can't be responsible for their actions/behaviors/business... we just can focus all our efforts (as any sane person would do) into finding a solution and trying to mitigate the damage as much as possible, once at this point... ...don't think, please, that we're sitting here watching time pass by... what an horrible situation... Cheers! -akw- |
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SCAM ALERT: PAY ATTENTION !!! .............................................. |
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I understand.. rules are the rules. the auction was not fair on newbies who are not allowed to post as often and when trying to click on post after the warning got:
An Error Has Occurred!
The last posting from your IP was less than 360 seconds ago. Please try again later.
Sent you screenshot on skype to prove my good faith of my bud up to 20 BTC
...and don't you think that someone else could have bidded more than you, if your bid was publicly displayed...? sorry, rules are rules... and membrr's accounts are on sale on out Forum, if needed! Cheers! -akw- |
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