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2601  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Cappuccino for bitcoins - how much should I charge? on: January 09, 2018, 10:49:55 PM
Please don't compare to dollars or any other currency. How do I come to a bitcoin price? Should it be based off of the cost to mine bitcoins?

It's tough not to compare BTC price to other currencies. People naturally measure consumptive goods against purchasing power. It's a rational mechanism to keep people from going hungry. Tongue

I understand what you mean, though. From a Bitcoin holder/investor standpoint, it should be based on subjective value. For example, I like the idea of a work contract being payable in a specified amount of BTC rather than USD. Whether the price rises or falls, I don't want to be paid any less BTC than I was contracted for.

Using mining cost doesn't work. That doesn't account for market demand.

It would be so expensive if you do that,tx fee is very high and you transaction wont be confirmed fast just wait for the lightning network to be implemented surely it will change everything.

Lightning is coming. Some vendors are even accepting mainnet Lightning payments already!
2602  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Transaction Tracking with Clustering on: January 09, 2018, 10:39:41 PM
https://www.coinbureau.com/news/bitfury-unveils-technology-track-bitcoin-transactions/

While they say they are doing this in order to track crime on the blockchain, many view it as an invasion of privacy on the network which leads to mistrust in other participants. 

What are your views? Do you think that it is more indication that users should consider privacy conscious coins?

I was unpleasantly surprised a year or two ago when I realized that part of Bitfury's R&D was into blockchain analysis. It should come as no surprise that blockchain analysis is maturing as so much money continues to flow into Bitcoin and other coins.

But naturally, I no longer view Bitfury as a company to root for. They're working with the enemy now. Tongue

There are other coins for some less public transactions, Bitcoin was never meant to be, and it's fine that way.

I don't think that's entirely true. I think that the privacy implications weren't entirely clear at the outset. The norm of using change addresses (including multiple change addresses per transaction) was obviously privacy-oriented. I think the point of Bitcoin's design was transparency, but I don't think that Satoshi necessarily intended for it to degrade user privacy.
2603  Bitcoin / Press / Re: [2018-01-07] Study: 22% of Bitcoin Investors Used Borrowed Money For Trading... on: January 09, 2018, 10:29:01 PM
Study: 22% of Bitcoin Investors Used Borrowed Money For Trading, Not Recommended

The way this is framed is a bit misleading. There's no accounting for the degree of investment. Most exchanges enforce pretty low limits on credit cards due to the high likelihood of fraud. At least the authors made clear that this wasn't entirely representative of the situation.

22% of investors maybe, but that's probably not much money.

I mean, a credit card won't lend more than a few thousands to the average joe. 22% of investors who have invested a few satoshis, then.

You'd be surprised. Overstating income is common, and during the days of easy credit, I've known people that have received six-figure credit lines based on no proof of income. The real bottleneck is the low limits on credit card transactions allowed by exchanges.

I think that credit cards are more about fear of missing out than anything else. Wires can take several days or even weeks to process. I'm pretty sure you can buy instantly with credit cards.
2604  Bitcoin / Press / Re: [2018-01-08] Binance, Bitfinex, Bittrex Temporarily Say No to New Users on: January 09, 2018, 10:17:47 PM
FYI, Binance already re-enabled new user registrations by the time this article was published. Bitfinex and Bittrex still have registration disabled. So does Cryptopia.

In my opinion stopping new registrations is not a solution for the exchanges.
I think by doing this, exchanges are blocking the rise of crypto world. Instead the exchanges should increase their capacity.

They are trying, no doubt. What businesses do you know that were built to scale at this rate? Hundreds of thousands of new users a day?! This is exponential growth. No one was prepared for this, and it takes time to drastically increase engineering hires who can scale your platform safely.

I find it a little ironic that services which offer uncensorable currencies are denying people the chance to take part of them though lol.

What does closing registration have to do with censorship? Anyway, no cryptocurrency is uncensorable. At best, they are censorship-resistant.
2605  Bitcoin / Legal / Re: Will You Still Get Into Bitcoin Even if the Gov't Declared it Illegal? on: January 09, 2018, 10:07:21 PM
I'm already in. Would I leave? I don't really see why I should when it was perfectly legal when I arrived. And the coinciding announcement would wallop the price so much there wouldn't be much point in selling. I'll just nip off abroad. There'll be plenty of jurisdictions where it's fine and I can bring all my trillions with me on a piece of paper with a few words on it.

That's easy to say when Morocco or Vietnam talks about banning Bitcoin. What if the USA, Britain, Australia and others coordinated a ban? Then your options to move abroad become much less attractive.

And such coordinated state attacks against the network should take a nice bite out of the price, too. I suspect that Bitcoin would still have market demand in that case, but not the type of demand we see today, which is based on speculation of Wall Street and mainstream adoption.
2606  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Bitcoin Foundation executive director Llew Claasen said this is a bubble on: January 08, 2018, 11:07:39 PM
Bitcoin is heading towards a dot.com crash and is being driven by a “mania” and “market manipulation”, says Bitcoin Foundation executive director Llew Claasen.

“The fact that you have a 30% in value of Bitcoin in one day is dangerous,” said Claasen yesterday, commenting on the rise of the price in Bitcoin yesterday (7 December).

Speaking at Startup Grind event at Workshop 17 in Cape Town, he said there is strong evidence to suggest that some traders are using what he referred to as “tethers” — a digital representation of the US dollar — to push up the price of Bitcoin.

Tethers were created by a company affiliated with Bitfinex, to move into and out of market positions, he said.”


http://ventureburn.com/2017/12/bitcoin-market-manipulation/

If this is true, is it helping or hurting bitcoin?

These bubbles aren't exactly foreign to bitcoin folks. It's just low-supply commodity market economics playing out. There's really no question at this point whether there will be a crash. Of course there will be! There always is. The interesting part is to see how high it goes first.

It's during bear markets that the ecosystem develops and matures, and people really get to work on coding and infrastructure. It may look like a "boom and bust" but it's healthy. In fact, I don't think price discovery can really happen any other way with an asset in such limited supply.

As for Tether.... the company is suspicious but I'm not convinced that their centralized USDT and opaque banking practices are capable of keeping the market in a bullish frenzy for a year. When crypto really moves, the buying pressure usually comes from Coinbase, Bithumb or Bitflyer. Not Bitfinex or Tether.
2607  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Why China banning bitcoin mining isn't a bad thing - look at the bright side on: January 08, 2018, 10:56:50 PM
Anyone can think of more reasons why this isn't necessarily bad?

It's definitely a good thing. Concentration of mining power behind the Great Firewall has been a big concern for years, especially in the context of data propagation lag. China has had a majority of mining power for years, and it's much healthier if that hash rate is spread around the world. That way, no single government can drastically affect the mining ecosystem with official actions.

The primary concern is how smooth the transition is. I'd rather not see massive drops in hash rate if/when the hammer officially comes down. Fortunately, it seems like the larger Chinese miners have already been planning for this. Bitmain has been expanding their base overseas for years now.
2608  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Hangman of the altcoins? on: January 07, 2018, 10:36:46 PM
The news about the LN (lighting network) on main network of Bitcoin are connected with your its current high movement and with the altcoins correction?

Can be the LN the hangman for alts?

As I've said elsewhere, I think it will take significant market share from those altcoins that are nothing more than payment protocols with faster confirmations and lower on-chain fees. That's a significant sector of coins.

A well-functioning Lightning Network could make coins like Litecoin obsolete if they don't re-brand with new use cases. I suspect that many altcoin developers will re-brand and pursue features that Bitcoin lacks: governance structure, node incentives (LN rewards for typical users are likely to be very low), alternative exponential scaling mechanisms like tree chains, consensus sharding and DAGs, and other full-service use cases like blockchain anonymity and decentralized exchange.
2609  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Article: New York Stock Exchange Moves on Bitcoin ETFs on: January 07, 2018, 10:28:39 PM
They won’t be selling bitcoin, they’ll be selling futures. It’s a horse or grayhound race track. When you bet on a pony at the track you’re not buying a pony and your bet doesn’t make the horse owner any more wealthy. It just puts money in the pocket of the racetrack owner and the government where the track is located.

I'm not sure I follow. How often do you see gold and oil ETFs diverge significantly from the underlying asset? You can trade the swings just like any other swing trader in the spot markets, but the third party exchange risk is much lower. Sure, there are trading commissions, but it's customary in the regulated market to charge flat fees, so it'll be much cheaper to trade than the underlying spot markets. And yes, there are tax revenues, but what else would you expect here?

Bull Funds
The three ‘Bull Funds’ are categorized as 1.25X, 1.5X and 2X, offering 100 percent, 150 percent and 200 percent returns on the given contract.

Bear Funds
As the name suggests, the ‘Bears Funds’ allow investors the chance to leverage against a decline in the value of Bitcoin. The two funds offered are 1X and 2X, offering 100 percent and 200 percent gains should the contract meet its target on the given day of trading.

Too bad, no VelocityShares equivalent. A sweet long term 3x entry (tax deferred via retirement account) could be epic.
2610  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Money laundering on: January 07, 2018, 10:16:34 PM
Are blockchain-based transactions easy for money laundering?

It doesn't make sense to introduce "dirty" fiat money into the cryptocurrency ecosystem in order to clean it. There is so much friction between fiat currency and cryptocurrency, and there isn't much volume in the markets to support large scale money laundering.

There are good ways to launder cryptocurrency itself (e.g. money you receive from the DNMs). Using VPN and the TOR browser and mixing your bitcoins is one way. Strong privacy coins like Monero are another method. But it's important to note in all cases that organizations like INTERPOL and the FBI are privy to much better blockchain analysis tools than the rest of us. There may be various privacy exploits that we don't know about yet. TOR and VPNs can be compromised. You never know. As someone mentioned, if you need to launder fiat money, there are better-established, more liquid, and safer methods to do it.
2611  Economy / Service Discussion / PSA: Electrum has a critical security vulnerability on: January 07, 2018, 04:30:34 AM
Tavis Ormandy, security researcher at Google, pointed out a critical vulnerability to the Electrum team earlier today. They immediately pushed a security update. It's advisable to shut down immediately if you are running Electrum.

Quote from: Theymos
A vulnerability was found in the Electrum wallet software which potentially allows random websites to steal your wallet via JavaScript. The bug presumably also affects altcoin derivatives of Electrum such as Electron Cash. If you don't use Electrum or a derivative, then you are not affected and you can ignore this.

Action steps:

 1. If you are running Electrum, shut it down right this second.
 2. Upgrade to 3.0.4 (making sure to verify the PGP signature).

You don't necessarily need to rush to upgrade. In fact, in cases like this it can be prudent to wait a while just to make sure that everything is settled. The important thing is to not use the old versions.

It's a bit disappointing to see that the vulnerability was already an open issue from last year. I guess they didn't realize how severe it was.
2612  Bitcoin / Legal / Re: Will You Still Get Into Bitcoin Even if the Gov't Declared it Illegal? on: January 07, 2018, 04:17:43 AM
Now, if you happen to be a residing citizen of a country that is banning Bitcoin will you still discreetly involved with it in the face of some possible sanctions?

It would depend on my perception of enforcement action. Are they packet sniffing on individual citizens? Would I get thrown in jail for making a Bitcoin payment? Most governments are stretched too thin for that and are probably just interested in a blanket deterrent if they institute a ban. The use of VPN and TOR might be enough to hide your activity.

The real problem is when the governments start banning VPNs and turning TOR into a honeypot. Decentralized mesh networks can't come soon enough, but at this point, they still feel like a pipe dream. Undecided
2613  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Did anyone think about environmental issues of bitcoin? on: January 07, 2018, 03:38:19 AM
As now, the prevalence of  cryptocurrency mining consumes a large amount of energy, have anyone considered resource wastage and environmental pollution issue? Shocked Shocked

Let's keep this in perspective. Americans use more electricity to power their Christmas lights during the holiday season than the Bitcoin mining ecosystem consumes in a year. This will increase with time, but some of the environmental naysaying I've seen doesn't seem to account for scale.

Will the environmental issues attract the attention from government or environmental organizations, thereby limiting the mining activities?  Huh Huh

It'll certainly attract the ire of environmental organizations. But again, it should be a matter of perspective. If Bitcoin is to complement (or potentially replace) physical gold and paper money, we should be considering the energy consumption of those industries. It's nothing to sneeze at.

As for government, I think the use of subsidized energy for mining will become a bigger issue. Other than that, it really depends on the economic effects. Bitcoin is apparently a boon for the Japanese economy, so I don't see them discouraging mining.
2614  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Lightning Network Incoming: BTC to the MOON ? on: January 06, 2018, 11:13:56 PM
When LN will be there, will BTC go the moon and crush all altcoins on the road ??

I think that initially, public adoption of Lightning will cause a bear market in most altcoins. It will probably cause a reversal to the falling trend of "Bitcoin dominance." And in the end, I think it will crush any altcoin that has no other selling point than fast/cheap transactions.

However, it's important to note than the altcoin realm is becoming much more diverse than simple payment/messaging protocols. We are talking about decentralized exchange protocols, privacy mechanisms that could take years to implement in Bitcoin, alternative governance mechanisms, decentralized lending, and and other protocols/suites that can offer lots of new use cases that Bitcoin doesn't address right now.

Rootstock did recently launch on Bitcoin. It's in limited release right now (not public), but it's on the mainnet and could offer scalable sidechain transactions and smart contract functionality in Bitcoin. That could cause even more downside pressure on the "fast/cheap transaction" altcoin niche as well as the Ethereum and Ethereum-clone "smart contract" niche. Interesting times ahead!
2615  Bitcoin / Legal / Re: Insights into Gibraltar’s regulation on cryptocurrency exchanges and ICOs on: January 06, 2018, 11:01:44 PM
Honesty and integrity is somewhat vague with the mechanism being presented knowing that there are history of Gibraltar's reputation about taxation.

My take is that it's risky to rely on Gibraltar as a haven from outside regulatory action, or pressure from regulators. Whatever the underlying cause, Visa recently shut down WaveCrest's access to the Visa network. They were issuing cards for Xapo, Bitpay, and others. WaveCrest is licensed in Gibraltar.

It's a toss-up. Nobody knows how any of this will play out. One example that comes to mind is Antigua and Barbuda's support of online gaming, including offering services to US residents in the face of the UIGEA passed in 2006. In the end, the WTO sided with Antigua and Barbuda against the US, and Antigua continues to lobby for hundreds of millions of dollars from the US for unlawful enforcement of the UIGEA against free trade agreements.

So I am very curious to see how this plays out:

The regulation will apply to natural and legal persons that use the DLT for business activities engaged in “the transmission or storage of value belonging to others” and which are not subject to other existing legal regulations. Such business activities include, for example, centralised virtual currency (VC) administrators, VC wallet providers, trading platforms, VC exchanges, payment service providers, issuers of asset-backed tokens, pre-loaded VC, vouchers and wallets, and peer-to-peer gaming platform operators.
2616  Bitcoin / Legal / Re: Any news on how do airdrops and forks work? on: January 06, 2018, 10:45:43 PM
Sometimes you don't even know you suddenly own a bunch of new coins because someone decided to fork bitcoin while you wasn't paying attention (because keeping track of all these damn forks is near impossible).

How do taxes work with forks?

What's funny is, in some countries is considered a crime not reporting quantities higher than a certain amount, a pretty big amount like let's say $500,000

Of if you are a bitcoin whale (im not but I wish) let's say you own 1000 BTC

Suddendly someone forks bitcoin, and now you own over $500,000 in some fork, and it would be considered a crime because you didn't report that.

It's pretty stupid but that's how laws work in some countries. I was wondering what are your thoughts in this.

It's a pretty frustrating situation. Some tax consultants and CPAs have stressed that fork coins may be taxable whether or not you claim them or sell them. There was a recent thread that discussed the issue here.

As far as US taxpayers go, this seems to be the common take on fork coins: https://www.forbes.com/sites/greatspeculations/2017/08/04/how-to-report-bitcoin-cash-and-avoid-irs-trouble/#3d0f03b13066

Forks like Bitcoin Cash and Bitcoin Gold probably count as "other income" with a cost basis based on the value when markets launched. After that, normal capital gain/loss taxes apply. It's frustrating because claiming these coins comes with malware and privacy issues. And dealing with the smaller forks? The risks are even greater. So I'm curious how taxes might apply to smaller/riskier forks. I haven't seen many opinions on that.
2617  Bitcoin / Legal / Re: Has anyone sold BTC won here in sig campaigns? how does tax work? on: January 06, 2018, 10:33:47 PM
If you deposited and withdrew BTC from Mintpal, those transactions are permanently recorded on the blockchain. It doesn't matter what transactions took place on Mintpal's internal database.

You sent BTC from Address A (which you can prove control of). You received a higher amount of BTC at Address B (which you can prove control of). The difference is your BTC profit, but what matters for taxes is the USD profit. Each trade on Mintpal is taxable, and the net of those gains determines your taxes due.

The fact that Mintpal no longer exists just makes it harder to disprove the records you provide for your Mintpal trades. That's why any good faith effort to pay taxes on the gains made between Address A and Address B is probably good enough. You made 4 BTC profit, which had a USD equivalent when you bought back BTC. That's your taxable gains.

When you cash out an amount of any relevancy, you must prove the origin. There is no real way to prove that the addresses where you deposited and withdrew from, are from Mintpal or from a drug dealer or anything else, because Mintpal doesn't exist, so there's no way to link them properly into the exchange, unless you can prove me otherwise, because all we got is some addresses on the blockchain now, without the context of the website. I don't know about the US, but in other countries you MUST prove the origin is not ilicit, and if they don't like the evidence, you risk losing your money because they would confiscate it or tax it to ridiculous levels.

So again, you send 1 BTC to Mintpal.

You make 4 BTC from trading it against some altcoin.

You send back your BTC to your wallet.

You end up with 5 BTC.

Now prove these addresses belong to Mintpal. And no, you can't prove ownership of the deposit address, because you don't control the private keys of a deposit address of an exchange, so you can't sign them.

But you can show the origin. It's right there on the blockchain. Even if Mintpal is gone, why can't you claim the coins are from Mintpal? Why can't you claim trading records based on that? Tax authorities are interested in taxable income. You're paying that, yes? By paying taxes on cryptocurrency trading income from a defunct non-KYC exchange, you are going far beyond what most people are doing.

You may not be able to prove that the addresses belong to Mintpal, but if they truly did, I wouldn't worry about it. It can be easily determined by blockchain analysis companies (or possibly even Walletexplorer) that they did. You can sign a message from the address that you sent 1 BTC from. You can sign an address that held 5 BTC withdrawn from them.

How can they definitively link addresses together? Personally, I am extremely careful about linking wallet addresses together, even if it means paying higher fees to consolidate outputs.

Well, if you are going to sell years worth of signature campaign earnings, they will ask where it came from and they will see the address is linked to your account where you posted at with a simple google search, then they could browse your posting history and track all of your receiving addresses for the signature campaigns.

That's why you should probably report income that is easily trackable. This makes it very important to avoid linking wallet addresses together. You should consider how you spend UTXOs and how that links your BTC holdings together on the public ledger.


2618  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: bitcoin political party that permanently backs crypto, funded by crypto on: January 05, 2018, 11:26:58 PM
A one-issue political party that most people will eithr look at with envy or enimosity?
that's going to go far.

You might be surprised. Personally, I'm not enamored with the idea since I don't see eye-to-eye with most bitcoiners, politically and socially. But one thing I've learned watching the political system in the US is that raw campaign expenditures are much more important than any other factor in deciding winners. In 9/10 cases (or more), the candidate that raises the most money wins, and the mere appearance of money in the coffers causes opponents to drop out.

If Bitcoin ends up going to $1MM, there will be a lot of pro-crypto folks sitting on unprecedented profits. I wouldn't underestimate their capability to influence politics on that basis alone.
2619  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Wave Crest (issuer of prepaid bitcoin cards) was shut down today on: January 05, 2018, 11:17:37 PM
Quote
The reasons for Visa electing to wield the banhammer are unclear, though the company has long been regarded as hostile to bitcoin.
Web-users who value their financial freedom have long been been wary of Visa. This is the company, after all, which facilitated the financial blockade of Wikileaks in 2011. That decision ultimately proved to be Wikileaks’ salvation, with Julian Assange later crowing that the switch to bitcoin caused a windfall as the cryptocurrency began to multiply in price.
https://news.bitcoin.com/visa-veto-leaves-several-european-cryptocurrency-cards-locked-out/

time to 'ban' Visa also ?  Roll Eyes

That seems unlikely. VISA and Mastercard (and to a lesser extent, Amex and Discover) are the gatekeepers.

The fundamental problem here is that debit cards funded with cryptocurrency defeats the entire purpose of cryptocurrency. What's the point of "being your own bank" if you need to convert to USD or EUR just to use the gatekeepers' payment networks?

Bitcoin was literally created to displace centralized middlemen like VISA. We don't need alternatives to WaveCrest. We need to stop using these stupid debit cards in the first place. To boot, you need to sacrifice significant privacy to use them.
2620  Bitcoin / Legal / Re: Has anyone sold BTC won here in sig campaigns? how does tax work? on: January 05, 2018, 11:05:47 PM
Can you explain how do I prove that:

1) I sent my coins to a Mintpal deposit
2) I withdrew the coisn to a Mintpal deposit

If mintpal doesn't exist?

If you deposited and withdrew BTC from Mintpal, those transactions are permanently recorded on the blockchain. It doesn't matter what transactions took place on Mintpal's internal database.

You sent BTC from Address A (which you can prove control of). You received a higher amount of BTC at Address B (which you can prove control of). The difference is your BTC profit, but what matters for taxes is the USD profit. Each trade on Mintpal is taxable, and the net of those gains determines your taxes due.

The fact that Mintpal no longer exists just makes it harder to disprove the records you provide for your Mintpal trades. That's why any good faith effort to pay taxes on the gains made between Address A and Address B is probably good enough. You made 4 BTC profit, which had a USD equivalent when you bought back BTC. That's your taxable gains.

About unreported income... if you receive an income here in exchange of working in signature campaigns, as soon as you give them one address, they could link it to an account, the look for every address ever that you used with your account and they could see how much money total you've made with your account, and then accuse you of not having reported that income when you sell a part or all of it. So im not sure how this could work out.

How can they definitively link addresses together? Personally, I am extremely careful about linking wallet addresses together, even if it means paying higher fees to consolidate outputs.
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