MATTHEW FIRED FROM BITCOIN MAGAZINE

[da2ce7]

Damn, I just hate it when the obvious sarcasm has to be explained. I was making an allegorical point about priorities. The Matthew issue is a cartoon sideshow, he punk'd the community and held up a mirror so they can see how foolish they look. Pretty smart PR work. My point being that the magazine kiddies should be focusing on the magazine, not playing executioner for the Court of Pissed-Off Bettors.

+1

[1714976128]

1714976128

[1714976128]

1714976128

[1714976128]

1714976128

[1714976128]

1714976128

[tvbcof]

... is a prize ass, and deserving of public humiliation. ... absolute pathetic lemming-like devotion to believing pure bullshit that has become the hallmark of bitcoin. ...Get a fucking clue Bitcoin Community!!! Right the fuck now. ... There is no altruistic tooth fairy that wants to make you rich, ... you are the laziest, saddest bunch of fuck-toys I have ever seen. ...

Stop thinking that bitcoin is some wunderkind techno anarchy tool that is going to change the definition of money. It is a slightly interesting alternate way to transact a very, very limited subset of transactions pretty much limited to the technically savvy. Unfortunately, it seems as if one of the first things that happens when you download the block chain is that you put your common sense on hold.

... I ordered copies of the first three issues 6 weeks ago. Bought and paid for with PayPal. Where the fuck are they? ...

For some reason I had developed a negative sense about you early on Loup, but I don't remember quite why.  In any event I've developed a respect for your work of the last few months at least and look forward to it.  This one is solid gold in my book...though it would surprise me very little if I were about the only one.

I left what I thought to be the most interesting part in the quoted text above.  I believe that it would be better for the Bitcoin project generally if more people take a more realistic view of the solution, warts and all.  The solution is, to me, a fascinating start and has the potential to be quite a powerful development as humanity marches forward.  But at this point your description is pretty accurate.  The more starry-eyed the community, the more fertile the ground for 'bad shit' to germinate and grow to maturity.

[Rassah]

he punk'd the community and held up a mirror so they can see how foolish they look. Pretty smart PR work.

Incidentally, what did you mean by looking foolish? Did you consider the community saying that BTCS&T and other similar HYIPs are either ponzis, scams, or dangerously stupid "investments" to be foolish?

[LoupGaroux]

Sorry, your "obvious sarcasm" sounded like "egotistical trolling by someone who didn't even read what the initial bet post was about."
Good luck in your Magazine investments. Did you know only 21million copies will ever be produced?

While 21 million seems to be a pretty steep hill to climb, my guess is that not many people will think to have them slabbed in nitrogen charged, hermetically sealed archival grade slabs, and stored in a secret underground vault that is impervious to anything other than a direct thermonuclear strike. So mine will be the only pristine copies left in 20 years, and I will so own that market. Just like I own the market for 1995 Hot Wheels First Editions on Euro Cards. Those babies are in similar storage right now. Yeah, my retirement is set.

Wierd to see this coming from you.  You normally take a very hard line.  Sure pirate is the bigger criminal.  I'm sure people are after him too.  But if Matthew had won, it would have been for about 1M dollars I think.  Please remember the context where Vanderoy just made a real bet 50k USD and won.  The original bet at 10k was not so out of line.

I did not bet or think he'd pay.  Regardless that does not excuse him.  We need zero tolerance for these people.  Big or small.

I want to pay suppliers in bitcoin.  How's that going to happen if they come to these forums and see this cr*p from what seems to be pivotal members of the community?

Sorry to digress from my normal perky character, but we have serious ethical issues here, and my read (and I could be wrong, it's happened once or twice...) is that Matty was thumbing his nose at the greed, stupidity and failure to pay attention to the most basic details that is the hallmark of this community. I did not bet. I don't bet on bitcoins. I bet on craps, Premier League Soccer, and College Football. Not on the integrity of a pirate with a track record that is less than sterling. And certainly not in an obvious attention-whore public mockery like Matt's OP.

I would love to see bitcoins mainstreamed. I have been working on a Fortune 300 supplier and how to integrate bitcoin into their e-commerce strategy. And every single bitcoinica, priate, bitscalper, BTC-Guy, Mr. Bitcoin and so on sets the discussion back further and further, and makes me look like I am promoting the private currency of fools and small time international drug dealing. Now with added political extortion thrown in for good measure.

My basic point is that trashing Matty for this ill-conceived value lesson is classic baby being tossed out with the bath water. We have serious issues in our little funhouse, and serious bad people stealing serious amounts of money. Pirate, the intersango gango, Zhou Tong, Notorious Relic Dealer Chen, bitscalper and the like should be strung up by their thumbs and ritually abused by angry koalas until they repay the good people they have fleeced. Matt just pointed out how stupid we all look chasing after these phantoms and then getting indignant when the inevitable embarrassment of having been ripped-off comes to light.

he punk'd the community and held up a mirror so they can see how foolish they look. Pretty smart PR work.

Incidentally, what did you mean by looking foolish? Did you consider the community saying that BTCS&T and other similar HYIPs are either ponzis, scams, or dangerously stupid "investments" to be foolish?

Okay, so this is an edit within and edit, and may cause the universe to collapse, if so I apologize in advance, but I absolutely loathe chain posting. It's just so declasse.

No. I think the community should be required to get up every morning and give the Pledge of I Shall Not Ever Again Be A Willing Imbecile And Believe In HYIPS, Ponzis or Obviously Stupid And Impossible To Sustain Bad Investments Allegiance to the flag of bitcoin.

What is foolish is the amount of outrage over Matt's stunt. All of y'all be honest with yourselves, and in the privacy of your own heart ask yourself... if pigs had flown and pirate had paid... were you going to willingly send your coins to Matt? Hell no, you weren't. Not a single one of the Glorious Google Spreadsheet 72 would have sent him a coin. Maybe some gratitude for guilt-tripping pirate into doing the right thing, but anyone with half a clue saw that this was a stunt. And Matt is still throwing it in our faces (that's the looking foolish part) by pointing out how blinded by greed we act, and how willing we are to be led around by any Pied Piper who will promise us crazy fuck-you money.

[Rassah]

LoupGaroux, you said, quote, "We have serious issues in our little funhouse, and serious bad people stealing serious amounts of money. Pirate, the intersango gango, Zhou Tong, Notorious Relic Dealer Chen, bitscalper and the like should be strung up by their thumbs and ritually abused by angry koalas until they repay the good people they have fleeced."

THEN you said, "Matt just pointed out how stupid we all look chasing after these phantoms"

So, which is it? Should we keep pursuing people like "Pirate, the intersango gango, Zhou Tong, Notorious Relic Dealer Chen, bitscalper and the like," and string them up by their thumbs, or at leask kick them out of the forums and maybe the Bitcoin community?
Or should we, as the intent of Matt's bet stated, shut up, stop screaming Ponzi whenever such obvious scams come up, and stop "chasing after these phantoms?"

[finkleshnorts]

LoupGaroux, you said, quote, "We have serious issues in our little funhouse, and serious bad people stealing serious amounts of money. Pirate, the intersango gango, Zhou Tong, Notorious Relic Dealer Chen, bitscalper and the like should be strung up by their thumbs and ritually abused by angry koalas until they repay the good people they have fleeced."

THEN you said, "Matt just pointed out how stupid we all look chasing after these phantoms"

So, which is it? Should we keep pursuing people like "Pirate, the intersango gango, Zhou Tong, Notorious Relic Dealer Chen, bitscalper and the like," and string them up by their thumbs, or at leask kick them out of the forums and maybe the Bitcoin community?
Or should we, as the intent of Matt's bet stated, shut up, stop screaming Ponzi whenever such obvious scams come up, and stop "chasing after these phantoms?"

He just spends most of his time here doing a poor job of trying to be a general asshole; he doesn't worry about making sense. He does like absurd metaphors, though.

[LoupGaroux]

LoupGaroux, you said, quote, "We have serious issues in our little funhouse, and serious bad people stealing serious amounts of money. Pirate, the intersango gango, Zhou Tong, Notorious Relic Dealer Chen, bitscalper and the like should be strung up by their thumbs and ritually abused by angry koalas until they repay the good people they have fleeced."

THEN you said, "Matt just pointed out how stupid we all look chasing after these phantoms"

So, which is it? Should we keep pursuing people like "Pirate, the intersango gango, Zhou Tong, Notorious Relic Dealer Chen, bitscalper and the like," and string them up by their thumbs, or at leask kick them out of the forums and maybe the Bitcoin community?
Or should we, as the intent of Matt's bet stated, shut up, stop screaming Ponzi whenever such obvious scams come up, and stop "chasing after these phantoms?"

Perhaps we see different intent. I think we all have a moral obligation to continue to cry "Ponzi" when the absurd is placed before us, and thinking people can see that no amount of super secret sauce is going to make the utterly impossible anything other than what it is. I strongly encourage everyone to continue to question, decry, and lambast the shady fucks who come here to prey on the believing.

I also think we should go after those same criminals with every resource we can bring to bear. Maybe the stringing up part is a little dramatic, but I was on a roll. I do think they should be hunted down and held accountable, be removed from the Company of good people, and make good on all amounts they have stolen. If that means Amir has to eat lousy cold oatmeal for the next 25 years, too bad. If that means Patrick loses his position of honor at the head table in London- tough beans. And if pirate get's what is coming to a $5,000,000 thief? I will not shed a tear.

I don't see Matt as being in league with that level of evil. I think (here's my take on intent...) that he meant to point out how desperate it is to go chasing after more bad money when you have already lost good. The phantom is the thought of making good on our first stupid decision, by making more of the same stupid choices.

LoupGaroux, you said, quote, "We have serious issues in our little funhouse, and serious bad people stealing serious amounts of money. Pirate, the intersango gango, Zhou Tong, Notorious Relic Dealer Chen, bitscalper and the like should be strung up by their thumbs and ritually abused by angry koalas until they repay the good people they have fleeced."

THEN you said, "Matt just pointed out how stupid we all look chasing after these phantoms"

So, which is it? Should we keep pursuing people like "Pirate, the intersango gango, Zhou Tong, Notorious Relic Dealer Chen, bitscalper and the like," and string them up by their thumbs, or at leask kick them out of the forums and maybe the Bitcoin community?
Or should we, as the intent of Matt's bet stated, shut up, stop screaming Ponzi whenever such obvious scams come up, and stop "chasing after these phantoms?"

He just spends most of his time here doing a poor job of trying to be a general asshole; he doesn't worry about making sense. He does like absurd metaphors, though.

No, a very specific and carefully targeted kind of an asshole, if you please. If it doesn't make sense to you, then you probably weren't the target audience. I craft my writing to the audience I am addressing. The "absurdity" is a product of speaking 6 languages. I often corrupt metaphors, and blend bits that didn't originally go together. That, dear reader, is what makes the cookie more interesting to crumble. I have the history that proves it works for me, so let's let that sleeping dog laissez his faire shall we?

[finkleshnorts]

how neat

[Bitcoin Oz]

When one mentions "going after" the crooks people shout you down about making threats of violence. No doubt sock puppets of the same scammers. There has to be a way to seek justice or someone will create an assassination market I have no doubt.

[Rassah]

I don't see Matt as being in league with that level of evil. I think (here's my take on intent...) that he meant to point out how desperate it is to go chasing after more bad money when you have already lost good. The phantom is the thought of making good on our first stupid decision, by making more of the same stupid choices.

If that's the case, then I think you may have thoroughly misunderstood what happened here. While yes, Matthew is not, and likely can never, sink to the level of that kind of evil, Matt's intent in this bet was to teach those people who were crying "Ponzi" a lesson; to shut them up, because he believed they were hurting these ridiculously-high-interest HYIPs with their FUD, when Matt thought they were legitimate businesses. He actually believed that people crying "Ponzi" were in the wrong, and dared them that, if they believe these businesses are so wrong and such scams, to "put their money where their mouths are." The people who bet (initially) were not those who "already lost good." The bettors were those who wouldn't even think of investing with BTCS&T, and were vocally horrified to see how many others were falling for those scams. Matthew seems to have been defending pirate and HYIPs, so they bet to, I guess, prove their convictions about believing that Pirateat40 was a scammer. They also bet because they thought that Matthew was totally wrong about believing that Pirateat40 was running anything but a scam.
Things only got way worse when those who did lose money on BCTS&T decided to use Matthew's bet as a hedge. Luckily, they were the minorty of the bets apparently. Most of those who bet have not lost any money in any of these scams, and so were not "chasing after more bad money."
I never lost any money to any scams, or crashes, or hacks (luckily). I personally bet because I thought Matthew was wrong to defend Pirate, since I also believed he was running a ponzi. Matthew not paying me anything did not hurt me in any way, but I still think it was a shitty thing for him to do (the whole bet and weaseling out of it the way he did, not the not paying me, since even if he did, I'd have returned the money). ESPECIALLY since he took attention away from both Pirateat40 AND all the other HYIPs out there for three whole weeks, when people should've been putting the pressure on those bastards.

[LoupGaroux]

how neat

Thanks for noticing.

[bbit]

Dude this guy will last 5 minutes if he shows up to London. Someone is going to permanently drill that horse head into his shoulders.

Can you say dead man walking lol

[LoupGaroux]

Dude this guy will last 5 minutes if he shows up to London. Someone is going to permanently drill that horse head into his shoulders.

Can you say dead man walking lol

And yet those same outraged someones will pay a truckload of money to be entertained by the clowns behind intersango and the bitcoinica fraud? The conference itself will happily be the billboard for their sponsorship? What about pirate? He had a whole dining room full of co-conspirators and adoring fans meet with him in Vegas at DefCon and it was all just put aside as a delightful photo op.

[bitcoinBull]

I don't see Matt as being in league with that level of evil. I think (here's my take on intent...) that he meant to point out how desperate it is to go chasing after more bad money when you have already lost good. The phantom is the thought of making good on our first stupid decision, by making more of the same stupid choices.

If that's the case, then I think you may have thoroughly misunderstood what happened here. While yes, Matthew is not, and likely can never, sink to the level of that kind of evil, Matt's intent in this bet was to teach those people who were crying "Ponzi" a lesson; to shut them up, because he believed they were hurting these ridiculously-high-interest HYIPs with their FUD, when Matt thought they were legitimate businesses. He actually believed that people crying "Ponzi" were in the wrong, and dared them that, if they believe these businesses are so wrong and such scams, to "put their money where their mouths are." The people who bet (initially) were not those who "already lost good." The bettors were those who wouldn't even think of investing with BTCS&T, and were vocally horrified to see how many others were falling for those scams. Matthew seems to have been defending pirate and HYIPs, so they bet to, I guess, prove their convictions about believing that Pirateat40 was a scammer. They also bet because they thought that Matthew was totally wrong about believing that Pirateat40 was running anything but a scam.
Things only got way worse when those who did lose money on BCTS&T decided to use Matthew's bet as a hedge. Luckily, they were the minorty of the bets apparently. Most of those who bet have not lost any money in any of these scams, and so were not "chasing after more bad money."
I never lost any money to any scams, or crashes, or hacks (luckily). I personally bet because I thought Matthew was wrong to defend Pirate, since I also believed he was running a ponzi. Matthew not paying me anything did not hurt me in any way, but I still think it was a shitty thing for him to do (the whole bet and weaseling out of it the way he did, not the not paying me, since even if he did, I'd have returned the money). ESPECIALLY since he took attention away from both Pirateat40 AND all the other HYIPs out there for three whole weeks, when people should've been putting the pressure on those bastards.

Well said. MNW (and some others) tried to spin it like he was trying to "point out how desperate it is to go chasing after more bad money when you have already lost good". That point was at best tertiary to MNW's main point: to "teach a lesson" to people crying scam "without evidence" or using the "duck fallacy". Indeed, the scam-criers lost nothing in betting against MNW and learned nothing. It was the gullible pirate investors hedging their "investments" who lost the most and learned the most.

[Mosrite]

Oh, and Bitcoin Magazine? I ordered copies of the first three issues 6 weeks ago. Bought and paid for with PayPal. Where the fuck are they?

You ordered Bitcoin magazines 6 weeks ago, from some internet company that really doesn't have any established reputation, and have yet to receive them?
Oh Boohoo! How terrible for you! I am SOOOOO sorry for your absolute pathetic lemming-like devotion to believing pure bullshit that has become the hallmark of bitcoin. Perhaps your ego that you are so eager to slather your posts with will assist in expediting your delivery 

Damn, I just hate it when the obvious sarcasm has to be explained. I was making an allegorical point about priorities. The Matthew issue is a cartoon sideshow, he punk'd the community and held up a mirror so they can see how foolish they look. Pretty smart PR work. My point being that the magazine kiddies should be focusing on the magazine, not playing executioner for the Court of Pissed-Off Bettors.

I only want the physical magazines so that I can have them slabbed and graded because they will surely be an historical oddity 20 years from now when "What was the short-lived magazine associated with bitcoin?" is the Final Jeopardy solution. It's a long term investment play, and probably the only place to actually make an honest satoshi in this den of third rate thieves, and first rate victims.

A print magazine really is a quaint little oddity at this point, isn't it?

[repentance]

And yet those same outraged someones will pay a truckload of money to be entertained by the clowns behind intersango and the bitcoinica fraud? The conference itself will happily be the billboard for their sponsorship? What about pirate? He had a whole dining room full of co-conspirators and adoring fans meet with him in Vegas at DefCon and it was all just put aside as a delightful photo op.

Quoted for truth.

Where are the calls for pirate to be removed from GPUMax because his actions regarding BS&T reflect on that company?  Where are the people saying that they won't give any of their mining capacity or BTC to GPUMax until pirate is removed?

People are perfectly happy to continue to support other businesses and projects whose principals and shareholders have behaved badly towards this community and who still owe members of this community money.  That's certainly their right but it's utterly hypocritical of anyone who still does business with GPUMax or Intersango to claim any kind of moral high ground when it comes to Matthew.

It was the gullible pirate investors hedging their "investments" who lost the most and learned the most least.

FTFY

[Rassah]

I was under the impression that GPUMax was owned and operated solely by pirate, and thus GPUMax = BTCS&T in a way. Is that wrong?

[mc_lovin]

I was under the impression that GPUMax was owned and operated solely by pirate, and thus GPUMax = BTCS&T in a way. Is that wrong?

That's what I thought, too.

[repentance]

I was under the impression that GPUMax was owned and operated solely by pirate, and thus GPUMax = BTCS&T in a way. Is that wrong?

Corporation Wiki lists two other active members of GPUMax Technologies LLC apart from pirate.

http://www.corporationwiki.com/Unknown/Unknown/gpumax-technologies-llc/101278778.aspx

[muyuu]

Not enough determination. He could keep stake even secretly when they "announce" the opposite.  Suspect.