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Author Topic: BFL SC / Jally first picture?  (Read 25819 times)
legolouman
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September 19, 2012, 10:24:03 PM
 #201

What do you earn BFL Josh?

Probably about tree fiddy a ______.

If you love me, you'd give me a Satoshi!
BTC - 1MSzGKh5znbrcEF2qTrtrWBm4ydH5eT49f
LTC - LYeJrmYQQvt6gRQxrDz66XTwtkdodx9udz
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September 19, 2012, 10:27:17 PM
 #202

What do you earn BFL Josh?

Probably about tree fiddy a ______.

True dat


If you're searching these lines for a point, you've probably missed it.  There was never anything there in the first place.
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September 19, 2012, 10:27:32 PM
 #203

What do you earn BFL Josh?

Probably about tree fiddy a ______.

line?

dip
legolouman
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September 19, 2012, 10:28:21 PM
 #204


I answered the question without answering it. Or did I?

If you love me, you'd give me a Satoshi!
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September 19, 2012, 10:30:23 PM
 #205

Lol, good one Smiley.

dip
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September 19, 2012, 11:03:38 PM
 #206

I love how you've turned this thread into a contest of who is the lawyeriest non-lawyer.  Nobody cares.  If you really cared and thought BFL was fraudulent, you should have just called the FBI to report them instead of trash talking people on the internet.  Did your wife not tell you that?

The key word all over your message is "care".  Check your assumptions before you make an ass of u and mptions.

My wife just wants to know why I'm hassling her with stupid legal questions.  It's her fault for being on "the fraud team". Smiley

You don't even care about the fact pirate scammed you...
How does your federal attorney wife feel about the fact that pirate is the one fingering you in the ass and not her?

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September 19, 2012, 11:17:45 PM
 #207

You don't even care about the fact pirate scammed you...
How does your federal attorney wife feel about the fact that pirate is the one fingering you in the ass and not her?

Ahhh...  That's the real question, isn't it?  Why am I not concerned about "losing" half a million dollars in fantasy debt due to a "scam"?

Email me if you figure it out.  I'm surprised it took someone so long to ask.

But I'm not surprised you're not answering.

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September 19, 2012, 11:41:48 PM
 #208


I think his sig does the community a service in that it demonstrates what a freeloader the guy is so they can better decide whether or not to do business with him or pay any attention to what he says.


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September 19, 2012, 11:52:45 PM
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Sonny Vleisides is associated with BFL and it's the same Sonny listed in the case documents.  He was involved in off shore gaming in the capacity of selling and providing software engineering to companies that did the actual offshore gaming (there is even a US patent application for the process). The industry came under attack (as we all remember) around that time, and Mr. Vleisides was caught up in the process as well as a good portion of the industry based in Costa Rica.

The description you provide here does not seem to match very well with the charges in the indictment. Vleisides plead guilty, which means that he agrees that he did the following, at least with respect to the first count/mailing.

(please excuse OCR errors)

The Grand Jury charges:
COUNTS ONE THROUGH ELEVEN [18 U.S.C. §§ 1341, 2]
A. INTRODUCTION
1. At all times relevant to this Indictment:

a. Shamrock Agency, German Swiss Group, World Expert Fund, Mutual Medical Insurance Co, Old Amsterdam Trust Co, Euro American Fax Co, European Union Commission, EU American Payment Co, Global Search Network, North American Foreign Payments Services, Worldwide Verification Service, and others (collectively, the "Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies") were companies purporting to, for a fee, enter individuals in the United States into foreign and domestic lotteries, and to set up pension accounts.

b.   Defendants SONNY VLEISIDES ("VLEISIDES"), JAMES RAY HOUSTON, aka Rex Rogers ("HOUSTON"), and DENNIS EMMETT ("EMMETT") owned and controlled portions of the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies.

c.   Defendant WILLIAM CLOUD ("CLOUD") worked for the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies, which work included handling offshore mailing addresses, creating and maintaining victim lists, and handling and directing the handling of victim funds.

d.   Defendant SCOTT HENRY WALTHER ("WALTHER") worked for the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies, which work included overseeing the finances of the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies, and controlling some of the bank accounts related to those entities.

B. THE SCHEME TO DEFRAUD

2. Beginning in or about 1990, and continuing to at least in or about July 2006, in Los Angeles, Orange, Ventura, San Louis Obispo, and Riverside Counties, within the Central District of California, and elsewhere, defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER, together with others known and unknown to the Grand Jury, knowingly and with intent to defraud, devised, participated in, and executed a scheme to defraud victims as to a material matter, and to obtain money and property from such victims by means of material false and fraudulent pretenses, representations, and promises, and by the concealment of material facts.

3. To execute the scheme to defraud, defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury set up and operated the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies. The scheme operated as follows:

a. Defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER, and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury created and sent over one million solicitations purportedly offering increased chances of winning foreign and domestic lotteries such as "The Australian Lottery," "The International Irish Sweepstakes," "The El Gordo," "The Bunderschmidt," "The NY Super 7," and the "Triple Crown Lottery." The solicitations claimed that the victims were purchasing "positions" in tickets to lotteries that would be grouped together or "pooled" to buy larger blocks of tickets. The solicitations contained various misrepresentations, including but not limited to the following:

i.   That money sent by participants in the pool would be used to purchase tickets in lotteries, horse races, and other such games;

ii.   That participants in the pool had a chance to win millions of dollars;

iii. That previous participants in the pool had won millions of dollars through the pool;

iv.   That the companies were backed by governmental and/or legitimate lottery entities;

v.   That the companies were well-established and had been in business for long periods of time; and

vi.   That winnings invested into the lottery's trust or pension accounts would pay monthly pension checks until the end of the victim's life, and then would pay an amount to a beneficiary as if the money were a life insurance policy.

b.   The solicitations induced the victims to send payments to the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies via the United States mail, in that along with the solicitations, defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury provided the victims with envelopes preaddressed to commercial mail receiving agencies established by defendant CLOUD and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury in the Netherlands and Ireland, among other locations.

c.   At the direction of defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, and EMMETT, defendant WALTHER and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury first deposited the victims' money into accounts defendant WALTHER and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury established at numerous banks in accounts with names that sounded like official lotteries, for example: Shamrock Agency, World Expert, Old Amsterdam, German Swiss, Global Search Newtwork, and EUC, and official pensions, for example: Mutual Medical Insurance Company ("the Deposit Accounts").

d.   After the victims' money was deposited into the Deposit Accounts, at the direction of defendants VLEISIDES,
HOUSTON, and EMMETT, defendant WALTHER and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury transferred some of the victims' money into another set of accounts, with the following names, among others: North American Payment and EU Payment Service ("the Payment Accounts").

e.   From the Payment Accounts, at the direction of defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, and EMMETT, defendant WALTHER and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury wrote checks falsely represented as lottery winnings and sent them back to the victims. The amount of the alleged "winnings" sent to each victim was far less than the amount the victim had sent in.

f.   At the direction of defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, and EMMETT, defendant WALTHER and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury transferred some of the money from the Lottery Accounts and Payment Accounts to another set of accounts, which were in names similar to Henry Walther Attorney Wire Account ("the Syphon Accounts").

g.   At the direction of defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, and EMMETT, defendant WALTHER and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury wrote checks (or transferred money by wire) from the Lottery Accounts and the Payment Accounts to the Syphon Accounts.

h.   Defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury used money from the Syphon Accounts to continue the scheme by paying scheme expenses, as well as to provide benefits to defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER.

i.   Defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury also misappropriated funds from the Lottery Accounts and Payment Accounts in the form of checks to cash, checks to themselves, or checks to the payment of personal or scheme expenses.

C. THE MISREPRESENTATIONS AND CONCEALMENT OF MATERIAL FACTS

4. In furtherance of the scheme to defraud, defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER, and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury, engaged in and willfully caused others known and unknown to the Grand Jury to engage in the following material fraudulent and deceptive acts, practices, devices, and representations, among others, and knowingly concealed and caused others known and unknown to the Grand Jury to conceal the following material facts, among others:

a.   Defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER falsely represented to victims, and caused others known and unknown to the Grand Jury to falsely represent to victims, that if the victims sent money to the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies, that money would be used to purchase tickets in lotteries and other such games. In truth and in fact, as defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and"WALTHER then well knew, the money was not used to purchase such tickets, but rather was used to send purported winnings to other victims, to otherwise further the fraudulent scheme, and to benefit defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, WALTHER and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury.

b.   Defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER falsely represented to victims, and caused others known and unknown to the Grand Jury to falsely represent to victims, that if the victims sent money to the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies, they had a chance to win millions of dollars through the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies. In truth and in fact, as defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, anc WALTHER then well knew, no participant had a chance to win millions of dollars through the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies.

c.   Defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER falsely represented to victims, and caused others known and unknown to the Grand Jury to falsely represent to victims, that previous participants in the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies had won millions of dollars. In truth and in fact, as defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER then well knew, no participant in the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies had ever won millions of dollars through the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies.

d.   Defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER falsely represented to victims, and caused others known and unknown to the Grand Jury to falsely represent to victims, that the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies were backed by governmental and/or legitimate lottery entities. In truth and ir fact, as defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER then well knew, the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies were not backed by any governmental or legitimate lottery entity.

e.   Defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER falsely represented to victims, and caused others known and unknown to the Grand Jury to falsely represent to victims, that checks sent to victims represented winnings from the victims' participation in lotteries, horse races, or other games. In truth and in fact, as defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER then well knew, the checks sent to victims were not from victims' winnings but were actually funds sent in by other victims.

f.   Defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER falsely represented to victims, and caused others known and unknown to the Grand Jury to falsely represent to victims, that winnings invested into the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies' accounts would pay monthly pension checks until the end of the victim's life, and then would pay an amount to a beneficiary as if the money were a life insurance policy. In truth and in fact, as defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER then well knew, there were no separate pension or life insurance accounts for victims, and victims would not be paid as promised.

g.   Defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER caused letters to be sent to victims falsely claiming to be from individuals with a background in and connection to legitimate foreign lotteries. In truth and in fact, as defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER then well knew, the persons from whom the letters sent by the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Company purported to be did not exist.

D. THE EFFECT OF THE SCHEME TO DEFRAUD

5. Through the above-described scheme to defraud, defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER caused tens of thousands of victims to send over $25 million to the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies. E. THE MAILINGS

6. On or about the dates listed below, in Los Angeles, Orange, Ventura, San Louis Obispo, and Riverside Counties, withii the Central District of California, and elsewhere, defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER, for the purpose of executing the above-described scheme to defraud, caused the following items to be placed in an authorized depository for mai; matter and to be sent and delivered by the U.S. Postal Service and to be deposited with and to be delivered by private and commercial interstate carriers, according to the directions thereon:

[long list of checks omitted]

COUNTS TWELVE THROUGH TWENTY-THREE [18 U.S.C. §§ 1956(a) (1) (A) (i) , 2]

7.   The Grand Jury hereby realleges and incorporates by reference paragraphs one through five of this Indictment.

8.   On or about the following dates, in Los Angeles County, within the Central District of California, and elsewhere, defendants SONNY VLEISIDES, JAMES RAY HOUSTON, DENNIS EMMETT, WILLIAM CLOUD, and SCOTT HENRY WALTHER, knowing that the property involved in each of the financial transactions represented the proceeds of some form of unlawful activity, knowingly conducted, attempted to conduct, and aided, abetted, counseled, commanded, induced, procured, and willfully caused the following financial transactions affecting interstate commerce, which transactions in fact involved the proceeds of specified unlawful activity, that is, mail fraud, in violation of Title 18, United States Code, Section 1341, with the intent to promote the carrying on of such specified unlawful activity:

[long list of checks omitted]
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September 20, 2012, 12:00:39 AM
 #210

Quote
The description you provide here does not seem to match very well with the charges in the indictment. Vleisides plead guilty, which means that he agrees that he did the following, at least with respect to the first count/mailing.

To mail fraud.  Can you point out where it says he plead guilty to the other counts?  Have you ever been to a criminal court, especially one where the outcome is not at all clear for the prosecuting party (as is the case here) and promises to drag along for a very long time?  

Have you ever been sued?  Why do people/companies settle out of court so often, even when they know they are right?  Because the legal system is slow and expensive... so have your life destroyed/delayed while it's dragging on and on and financial ruin set upon you through defending yourself or agree to a lesser charge and have it over and done with so you can go home?  

CubedRoot:  Why the hell would you be looking for an SEC filing for a privately held company?  That makes about as much sense as panning for gold in a bathtub, good luck with either of those.

If you're searching these lines for a point, you've probably missed it.  There was never anything there in the first place.
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September 20, 2012, 12:04:33 AM
 #211

I go free balling occasionally, does that count? 

If you're searching these lines for a point, you've probably missed it.  There was never anything there in the first place.
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September 20, 2012, 12:04:59 AM
 #212


Sonny Vleisides is associated with BFL and it's the same Sonny listed in the case documents.  He was involved in off shore gaming in the capacity of selling and providing software engineering to companies that did the actual offshore gaming (there is even a US patent application for the process). The industry came under attack (as we all remember) around that time, and Mr. Vleisides was caught up in the process as well as a good portion of the industry based in Costa Rica.

The description you provide here does not seem to match very well with the charges in the indictment. Vleisides plead guilty, which means that he agrees that he did the following, at least with respect to the first count/mailing.

(please excuse OCR errors)

The Grand Jury charges:
COUNTS ONE THROUGH ELEVEN [18 U.S.C. §§ 1341, 2]
A. INTRODUCTION
1. At all times relevant to this Indictment:

a. Shamrock Agency, German Swiss Group, World Expert Fund, Mutual Medical Insurance Co, Old Amsterdam Trust Co, Euro American Fax Co, European Union Commission, EU American Payment Co, Global Search Network, North American Foreign Payments Services, Worldwide Verification Service, and others (collectively, the "Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies") were companies purporting to, for a fee, enter individuals in the United States into foreign and domestic lotteries, and to set up pension accounts.

b.   Defendants SONNY VLEISIDES ("VLEISIDES"), JAMES RAY HOUSTON, aka Rex Rogers ("HOUSTON"), and DENNIS EMMETT ("EMMETT") owned and controlled portions of the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies.

c.   Defendant WILLIAM CLOUD ("CLOUD") worked for the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies, which work included handling offshore mailing addresses, creating and maintaining victim lists, and handling and directing the handling of victim funds.

d.   Defendant SCOTT HENRY WALTHER ("WALTHER") worked for the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies, which work included overseeing the finances of the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies, and controlling some of the bank accounts related to those entities.

B. THE SCHEME TO DEFRAUD

2. Beginning in or about 1990, and continuing to at least in or about July 2006, in Los Angeles, Orange, Ventura, San Louis Obispo, and Riverside Counties, within the Central District of California, and elsewhere, defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER, together with others known and unknown to the Grand Jury, knowingly and with intent to defraud, devised, participated in, and executed a scheme to defraud victims as to a material matter, and to obtain money and property from such victims by means of material false and fraudulent pretenses, representations, and promises, and by the concealment of material facts.

3. To execute the scheme to defraud, defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury set up and operated the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies. The scheme operated as follows:

a. Defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER, and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury created and sent over one million solicitations purportedly offering increased chances of winning foreign and domestic lotteries such as "The Australian Lottery," "The International Irish Sweepstakes," "The El Gordo," "The Bunderschmidt," "The NY Super 7," and the "Triple Crown Lottery." The solicitations claimed that the victims were purchasing "positions" in tickets to lotteries that would be grouped together or "pooled" to buy larger blocks of tickets. The solicitations contained various misrepresentations, including but not limited to the following:

i.   That money sent by participants in the pool would be used to purchase tickets in lotteries, horse races, and other such games;

ii.   That participants in the pool had a chance to win millions of dollars;

iii. That previous participants in the pool had won millions of dollars through the pool;

iv.   That the companies were backed by governmental and/or legitimate lottery entities;

v.   That the companies were well-established and had been in business for long periods of time; and

vi.   That winnings invested into the lottery's trust or pension accounts would pay monthly pension checks until the end of the victim's life, and then would pay an amount to a beneficiary as if the money were a life insurance policy.

b.   The solicitations induced the victims to send payments to the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies via the United States mail, in that along with the solicitations, defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury provided the victims with envelopes preaddressed to commercial mail receiving agencies established by defendant CLOUD and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury in the Netherlands and Ireland, among other locations.

c.   At the direction of defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, and EMMETT, defendant WALTHER and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury first deposited the victims' money into accounts defendant WALTHER and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury established at numerous banks in accounts with names that sounded like official lotteries, for example: Shamrock Agency, World Expert, Old Amsterdam, German Swiss, Global Search Newtwork, and EUC, and official pensions, for example: Mutual Medical Insurance Company ("the Deposit Accounts").

d.   After the victims' money was deposited into the Deposit Accounts, at the direction of defendants VLEISIDES,
HOUSTON, and EMMETT, defendant WALTHER and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury transferred some of the victims' money into another set of accounts, with the following names, among others: North American Payment and EU Payment Service ("the Payment Accounts").

e.   From the Payment Accounts, at the direction of defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, and EMMETT, defendant WALTHER and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury wrote checks falsely represented as lottery winnings and sent them back to the victims. The amount of the alleged "winnings" sent to each victim was far less than the amount the victim had sent in.

f.   At the direction of defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, and EMMETT, defendant WALTHER and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury transferred some of the money from the Lottery Accounts and Payment Accounts to another set of accounts, which were in names similar to Henry Walther Attorney Wire Account ("the Syphon Accounts").

g.   At the direction of defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, and EMMETT, defendant WALTHER and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury wrote checks (or transferred money by wire) from the Lottery Accounts and the Payment Accounts to the Syphon Accounts.

h.   Defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury used money from the Syphon Accounts to continue the scheme by paying scheme expenses, as well as to provide benefits to defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER.

i.   Defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury also misappropriated funds from the Lottery Accounts and Payment Accounts in the form of checks to cash, checks to themselves, or checks to the payment of personal or scheme expenses.

C. THE MISREPRESENTATIONS AND CONCEALMENT OF MATERIAL FACTS

4. In furtherance of the scheme to defraud, defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER, and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury, engaged in and willfully caused others known and unknown to the Grand Jury to engage in the following material fraudulent and deceptive acts, practices, devices, and representations, among others, and knowingly concealed and caused others known and unknown to the Grand Jury to conceal the following material facts, among others:

a.   Defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER falsely represented to victims, and caused others known and unknown to the Grand Jury to falsely represent to victims, that if the victims sent money to the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies, that money would be used to purchase tickets in lotteries and other such games. In truth and in fact, as defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and"WALTHER then well knew, the money was not used to purchase such tickets, but rather was used to send purported winnings to other victims, to otherwise further the fraudulent scheme, and to benefit defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, WALTHER and others known and unknown to the Grand Jury.

b.   Defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER falsely represented to victims, and caused others known and unknown to the Grand Jury to falsely represent to victims, that if the victims sent money to the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies, they had a chance to win millions of dollars through the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies. In truth and in fact, as defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, anc WALTHER then well knew, no participant had a chance to win millions of dollars through the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies.

c.   Defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER falsely represented to victims, and caused others known and unknown to the Grand Jury to falsely represent to victims, that previous participants in the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies had won millions of dollars. In truth and in fact, as defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER then well knew, no participant in the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies had ever won millions of dollars through the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies.

d.   Defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER falsely represented to victims, and caused others known and unknown to the Grand Jury to falsely represent to victims, that the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies were backed by governmental and/or legitimate lottery entities. In truth and ir fact, as defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER then well knew, the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies were not backed by any governmental or legitimate lottery entity.

e.   Defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER falsely represented to victims, and caused others known and unknown to the Grand Jury to falsely represent to victims, that checks sent to victims represented winnings from the victims' participation in lotteries, horse races, or other games. In truth and in fact, as defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER then well knew, the checks sent to victims were not from victims' winnings but were actually funds sent in by other victims.

f.   Defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER falsely represented to victims, and caused others known and unknown to the Grand Jury to falsely represent to victims, that winnings invested into the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies' accounts would pay monthly pension checks until the end of the victim's life, and then would pay an amount to a beneficiary as if the money were a life insurance policy. In truth and in fact, as defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER then well knew, there were no separate pension or life insurance accounts for victims, and victims would not be paid as promised.

g.   Defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER caused letters to be sent to victims falsely claiming to be from individuals with a background in and connection to legitimate foreign lotteries. In truth and in fact, as defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER then well knew, the persons from whom the letters sent by the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Company purported to be did not exist.

D. THE EFFECT OF THE SCHEME TO DEFRAUD

5. Through the above-described scheme to defraud, defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER caused tens of thousands of victims to send over $25 million to the Fraudulent Lottery and Pension Companies. E. THE MAILINGS

6. On or about the dates listed below, in Los Angeles, Orange, Ventura, San Louis Obispo, and Riverside Counties, withii the Central District of California, and elsewhere, defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER, for the purpose of executing the above-described scheme to defraud, caused the following items to be placed in an authorized depository for mai; matter and to be sent and delivered by the U.S. Postal Service and to be deposited with and to be delivered by private and commercial interstate carriers, according to the directions thereon:

[long list of checks omitted]

COUNTS TWELVE THROUGH TWENTY-THREE [18 U.S.C. §§ 1956(a) (1) (A) (i) , 2]

7.   The Grand Jury hereby realleges and incorporates by reference paragraphs one through five of this Indictment.

8.   On or about the following dates, in Los Angeles County, within the Central District of California, and elsewhere, defendants SONNY VLEISIDES, JAMES RAY HOUSTON, DENNIS EMMETT, WILLIAM CLOUD, and SCOTT HENRY WALTHER, knowing that the property involved in each of the financial transactions represented the proceeds of some form of unlawful activity, knowingly conducted, attempted to conduct, and aided, abetted, counseled, commanded, induced, procured, and willfully caused the following financial transactions affecting interstate commerce, which transactions in fact involved the proceeds of specified unlawful activity, that is, mail fraud, in violation of Title 18, United States Code, Section 1341, with the intent to promote the carrying on of such specified unlawful activity:

[long list of checks omitted]


Quoted for "Holy Shit."
reeses
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September 20, 2012, 12:07:15 AM
 #213

From what I understand reeses was one of the "feeder fund" people, correct?

Nope, as said before, I owe nothing.  I did not touch a PPT in any form.  Feel free to make shit up, though.  At least try to be interesting when you do it.
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September 20, 2012, 12:07:54 AM
 #214

From what I understand reeses was one of the "feeder fund" people, correct?

Nope, as said before, I owe nothing.  I did not touch a PPT in any form.  Feel free to make shit up, though.  At least try to be interesting when you do it.


Quoted for "Please follow your own advice in the future."

If you're searching these lines for a point, you've probably missed it.  There was never anything there in the first place.
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September 20, 2012, 12:09:29 AM
 #215

Are you finding out this stuff as you go along Inaba or was it made known to you when you joined BFL as staff?

dip
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September 20, 2012, 12:11:07 AM
 #216

Quote
The description you provide here does not seem to match very well with the charges in the indictment. Vleisides plead guilty, which means that he agrees that he did the following, at least with respect to the first count/mailing.

To mail fraud.  Can you point out where it says he plead guilty to the other counts?  Have you ever been to a criminal court, especially one where the outcome is not at all clear for the prosecuting party (as is the case here) and promises to drag along for a very long time?  

Have you ever been sued?  Why do people/companies settle out of court so often, even when they know they are right?  Because the legal system is slow and expensive... so have your life destroyed/delayed while it's dragging on and on and financial ruin set upon you through defending yourself or agree to a lesser charge and have it over and done with so you can go home?  

He did not plead guilty to the other counts; but they were duplicates of the first count, except for different fraudulent letters sent to different victims (counts 1-11) and different checks received from victims (counts 12-23).

He plead to the first count. Here is the text from the change of plea hearing:

"PROCEEDINGS: CHANGE OF PLEA
Court and counsel confer re the change of plea. Defendant moves to change plea to the Indictment. Defendant now enters a new and different plea of Guilty to Count One of the Indictment. The Court questions the defendant regarding the plea of Guilty and finds a factual and legal basis for the plea; waivers of constitutional rights are freely, voluntarily and intelligently made; plea is provident; plea is accepted and entered.
The Court refers the defendant to the Probation Office for the preparation of a presentence report and continues the matter to April 12, 2010 at 1:30 p.m., for sentencing.
The Court vacates the court and/or jury trial date."

I understood your first message to suggest that Mr. Vleisides has been honest and open regarding his crime, plea, and conviction. Your response above seems to suggest that Mr. Vleisides believes that he was innocent of the crimes he was charged with, but deliberately plead guilty anyway. Is that a more accurate summary of the situation?

Your original summary was: "He was involved in off shore gaming in the capacity of selling and providing software engineering to companies that did the actual offshore gaming (there is even a US patent application for the process)."

.. but according to the indictment, there was no offshore gaming, just people pretending to be associated with offshore games, when in fact they were simply taking people's money. No gambling at all was occurring, which is why the indictment/conviction was for mail fraud, not illegal gambling.

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September 20, 2012, 12:13:39 AM
 #217

...
Defendants VLEISIDES, HOUSTON, EMMETT, CLOUD, and WALTHER falsely represented
...
I really think this is all that needs to be said.

Bitcoin transactions are non-reversable. Trust, reputation, is the name of the game in the long term.

Unless we desire to be under the control of various nation-states and their enforcement regimes.

Is BFL worthy to be a linch-pin of the Bitcoin eco-system?
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September 20, 2012, 12:14:43 AM
 #218

Inaba,

Just out of curiosity has Sonny Chris Vleisides, ever communicated with his customers directly or participated in the forums. Perhaps given all the discovery that has occurred it may be time for him to do so. If, and I mean this seriously, his probation allows it. I would suggest a civil (e.g. moderated) town hall of sorts where people can ask and have answered their questions and concerns


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psilan
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September 20, 2012, 12:16:16 AM
 #219

Just out of curiosity has Sonny Chris Vleisides, ever communicated with his customers directly or participated in the forums.

Search the forums. He has directly answered customer service technical requests.

dip
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September 20, 2012, 12:16:24 AM
 #220

I go free balling occasionally, does that count?  


You've jumped out of  a plane nude before also?

It's not what you believe, It's what you know.
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