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Author Topic: How is bitcoin better than litecoin?  (Read 11702 times)
QuintLeo
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August 06, 2015, 05:25:43 PM
 #181

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Money arrival time (the time at which the merchant actually receives the money and can spend it)
Bitcoin: 1-2 sec
Litecoin: 1-2 sec
Credit card: several business days
Paypal: several minutes to several weeks (depending on payment method of customer)


 Multiple errors.
 You can't spend Bitcoin or Litecoin 'till the transaction(s) that gave them to you have been confirmed - normally MULTIPLE confirmations needed. 10 mins ABSOLUTE MINIMUM for Bitcoin, 2.5 mins ABSOLUTE MINIMUM for Litecoin, commonly an hour or two for either and I've seen it take 6+ hours on either on rare occasions.
 More importantly, you don't even know *IF* the transaction is going to go through 'till at least the first confirmation. THAT is the big issue with trying to use any Cryptocoin in a retail store environment - customers do NOT want to wait around for MINUTES to see if they're going to be able to buy something, they often get irritated if it takes more than a few SECONDS on a credit card transaction.

 A credit card processor that takes DAYS to process a transaction is incompetant or a ripoff. I had a merchant account for a few years back in the 1990s, I NEVER saw it take hours much less days to recieve my payment for a transaction, unless I couldn't get into the automated system AT ALL, and on automated transactions the norm was SECONDS. Even on the weekends (I did a LOT of sales at computer shows and hamfests) I'd have the money in my account before I got packed up after the show ended and I could get to an ATM to check (hours at MOST, but couldn't tell for sure how long given time between the sale and when I was available TO check).
 The only way it would take DAYS for a credit card transaction to get the money to the seller is if they ran the transaction manually, then it took the seller days to actually SUBMIT it.

 Paypal has often had merchant money from sales "on hold" for MONTHS at a time. Go look at the class action lawsuit they settled several years back - then note that the folks currently investigating to file ANOTHER ONE are seeing this same issue DESPITE PAYPAL AGREEMENT IN THE ORIGINAL CASE SETTLEMENT TO STOP DOING THAT.

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Confirmation time (the time at which the merchant can be sure the payment won't be reversed)
Bitcoin: 10 minutes
Litecoin 2½ minutes
Credit card: 6+ months
Paypal: 3+ months


 MAJOR Error. Confirmation time is NOT chargeback limit time.
 Cryptocoins do not HAVE a chargeback mechanism at all, which is one reason merchants LIKE cryptocoin payments - they know they HAVE the money once the transaction has been processed at all, it's just a matter of time because there is no way to reverse the transaction no matter what.

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Jace
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August 06, 2015, 10:16:36 PM
 #182

Multiple errors.
 You can't spend Bitcoin or Litecoin 'till the transaction(s) that gave them to you have been confirmed - normally MULTIPLE confirmations needed.
Complete and utter nonsense.

It's perfectly fine within the Bitcoin protocol to create, sign and broadcast a new transaction, using output from an earlier transaction that was just pushed before, and has not been confirmed yet.

Here's an example: first this transaction was done, and then before the first transaction was confirmed, this second transaction (which spends an output from the first) was sent as well. At the moment I'm writing this, neither is confirmed, and I expect them to be both confirmed in the same block (either the first next block from now, or later, doesn't matter).
*edit* → right after posting this, I noticed they were both confirmed in block 368710. You tell me how that's possible, if the 2nd transaction (which spends output from the 1st) would have required the 1st to be confirmed first.

It gets even more confusing when you say "normally multiple confirmations needed" - what do you mean "normally", as if some transactions require more confirmations than others before they can be spent, or what? It's nonsense. Any transaction's output can be spent immediately, with zero confirmations.

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10 mins ABSOLUTE MINIMUM for Bitcoin, 2.5 mins ABSOLUTE MINIMUM for Litecoin, commonly an hour or two for either and I've seen it take 6+ hours on either on rare occasions.
10 mins "absolute minimum" to wait for a confirmation? (which isn't even necessary to wait for in the first place, but for argument's sake)

Bollocks, sometimes it's 10 minutes, sometimes 3, sometimes 28, it's all probability. It's 10 minutes on average, but the "absolute minimum" waiting time for a confirmation is ZERO minutes.

And "commonly an hour or two" is even more bollocks. It's all statistics you know. The probability you have to wait an hour or more for a confirmation is 0.24% for Bitcoin, and 0.0000000037% for Litecoin. Likelyhood of having to wait for two hours is 0.00061% for Bitcoin, and infeasibly small for Litecoin. So, no, it's sure as hell not "commonly".

Quote
More importantly, you don't even know *IF* the transaction is going to go through 'till at least the first confirmation. THAT is the big issue with trying to use any Cryptocoin in a retail store environment - customers do NOT want to wait around for MINUTES to see if they're going to be able to buy something, they often get irritated if it takes more than a few SECONDS on a credit card transaction.
This completely contradicts what you're writing below.
As soon as you see a transaction, and no funny business is going on (like an existing conflicting transaction in the memory pool, or tons of dust output with zero tx fee), then you're already very, very sure it will be confirmed. Maybe in the next block, maybe in 10 blocks from now, but it will be confirmed.

Quote
MAJOR Error. Confirmation time is NOT chargeback limit time.
 Cryptocoins do not HAVE a chargeback mechanism at all, which is one reason merchants LIKE cryptocoin payments - they know they HAVE the money once the transaction has been processed at all, it's just a matter of time because there is no way to reverse the transaction no matter what.
Exactly, so why the hell would any merchant ever make a customer await even a single confirmation. This is what I mean with "Bitcoin payments are instant": nobody will have to wait 10 minutes (or whatever the amount time it takes until the next confirmation). With Bitcoin, you send your payment, and you're done. In a second. Nobody waiting, nobody at risk.

And yes, obviously, there is no such thing as chargebacks with cryptocoins. I mean the concept of a transaction becoming irreversible, or permanent, or set in stone. With Bitcoin, theoretically, a transaction is not 'guaranteed' (although *extremely* unlikely to be nullified) until it's confirmed. With paypal or credit card it can be reversed (and happens quite often) until the chargeback/dispute period expires, and that's typically 3-6 months.

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August 07, 2015, 12:55:02 AM
 #183

That is kind of like asking how is Apple better than iPhone, or how is Nike better than Jordans.
Litecoin was built off Bitcoin.
I think it is different bro, you cant compare between apple and iphone, because they are the same, and litecoin bitcoin is not the same, these two different coin
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August 07, 2015, 01:02:55 AM
 #184

Bitcoin is the standard  when comparing among cryptocurrencies. Also look and compare on the size of community. It's the number of support from the community that makes it strong.
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August 07, 2015, 01:50:07 AM
 #185

Bitcoin has prospered and become generally accepted as a form of currency. Unfortunately, although Litecoin flirted with success, it has not achieved this status. I personally had a lot of hope for it.

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August 07, 2015, 02:23:46 AM
 #186

Bitcoin has more popularity over Litecoin and there is currently a greater amount of merchants who accept bitcoin in comparison to Litecoin.
Also, all major stores that are accepting Bitcoin, are not accepting Litecoin.

Andy4.4
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August 07, 2015, 04:10:09 AM
 #187

So litecoin is a type of crypto that is useful in buying coffee and pizza.
Well yes, but not just limited to coffee and pizza. Why would Litecoin not be useful to do donations, micropayments, or large expenses such as cars or real estate?
Because the market for litecoin is so much volatile that if you spend much large amounts of litecoin in an transaction and the prices went up after some hours then you will loose much money.
Bitcoin is much stable now as compared to litecoin.
ajun96
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August 07, 2015, 05:47:10 AM
 #188

So litecoin is a type of crypto that is useful in buying coffee and pizza.
Well yes, but not just limited to coffee and pizza. Why would Litecoin not be useful to do donations, micropayments, or large expenses such as cars or real estate?
Because the market for litecoin is so much volatile that if you spend much large amounts of litecoin in an transaction and the prices went up after some hours then you will loose much money.
Bitcoin is much stable now as compared to litecoin.
If you expect stability, you will not find it in cryptocurrency, but if i have to choose, i choose bitcoin
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August 07, 2015, 07:57:21 AM
 #189

maybe because bitcoin was older than litecoin.
and it was adopt first by user and it also the price is higher than litecoin..
if you will compare bitcoin and litecoin there are a lot of thing that good  about bitcoin than litecoin..
but i will not say litecoin is not that good it is more litecoin is just like following the footstep of bitcoin..

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August 07, 2015, 09:48:22 AM
 #190

litecoin is just like following the footstep of bitcoin..

And this is because the source code of bitcoin was used in making litecoin and all other altcoins.
These all altcoins are pretty scams which everyone fall for.
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August 07, 2015, 12:13:23 PM
 #191

litecoin is just like following the footstep of bitcoin..

And this is because the source code of bitcoin was used in making litecoin and all other altcoins.
These all altcoins are pretty scams which everyone fall for.
bitcoin just got adopted earlier than litecoin but its the same
all altcoin is just like bitcoin..there are just not get adopted by all the bitcoin user

QuintLeo
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August 07, 2015, 07:07:11 PM
 #192


The consequences of using scrypt mean that there has not been as much of an 'arms race' in litecoin (and other scrypt currencies), because there is (so far) no ASIC technology available for this algorithm. However, this is soon to change, thanks to companies like Alpha Technologies, which is now taking preorders.


 Alpha Technology has been "taking preorders" for a very long time - and still has yet to deliver anything. Not sure if they count actively as a scam at this point, but all the available evidence is pointing that way, though it's possible they were underfunded and just couldn't deliver.

 
 The real, abet fairly small, Scrypt arms race has been between Gridseed (now part of SFARDS), Innosilicon (Their A2 Terminator and various spinoff designs), KnC (the Titan DID eventually ship, with very high performance and junk reliability, and a subsequent withdrawl from ALL retail selling or any further interest in Scrypt), Alcheminer (which has since sold out with no indication they are going to bother with a new generation product), Zeus (dead), Silverfish (also appears to be dead), and I think I might be forgetting one.

 The ONLY folks that have done a "second generation" of Scrypt chips to date are SFARDS and the "announced" Innosilicon A4.


 Compare to the dozens of Bitcoin ASIC chips to date, and at least 5 current companies with a "new generation chip", often in the 3'd 4'th or even 5'th generation from that company, announced or delivered in 2015 alone (Sfards has released, BitMain has announced "soon", Innosilicon has announced tapeout, KnC has announced deployment, BitFury appears to be deploying but only sells to large farm groups now) - and some question as to how many OTHERS with track records are working quietly on "new generation" products with no announcement yet like Avalon.

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August 07, 2015, 07:18:35 PM
 #193

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It's perfectly fine within the Bitcoin protocol to create, sign and broadcast a new transaction, using output from an earlier transaction that was just pushed before, and has not been confirmed yet.


 Interesting in theory, but try DOING that with an actual Bitcoin client. I've yet to see one that will let you spend Bitcoin from unconfirmed transactions, and IME they generally require multiple confirmations before they allow you to then move that Bitcoin on down the line.
 It's a GOOD thing actually, as a security measure.


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And "commonly an hour or two" is even more bollocks.


 Nope, it's experience. I do grant that it's less likely to take that long on Lightcoin.


Quote

And yes, obviously, there is no such thing as chargebacks with cryptocoins. I mean the concept of a transaction becoming irreversible, or permanent, or set in stone. With Bitcoin, theoretically, a transaction is not 'guaranteed' (although *extremely* unlikely to be nullified) until it's confirmed. With paypal or credit card it can be reversed (and happens quite often) until the chargeback/dispute period expires, and that's typically 3-6 months.

 Which is different from a chargeback. On a chargeback, the transaction WAS confirmed, then later the CC issuer was told to reverse it due to some reason - non-delivery of goods or fraud being probably the most common issues leading to a chargeback.


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QuintLeo
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August 07, 2015, 07:20:24 PM
 #194


To get back on topic. How is bitcoin better? It has a bigger user base and that's about it.


 Bitcoin is better at this time due to acceptance. This might be in part due to the larger user base, but I'm more inclined to say that the MUCH larger user base of Bitcoin is due to it's widespread acceptance compared to all other cryptocoins combined.


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August 07, 2015, 10:03:46 PM
 #195

In one way.

But the way that matters...

...

Critical mass.

Has someone made or could make a social networking site better than Factbook? Of course.... but it doesn't matter the slightest because Facebook has critical mass.. and as long as they don't f%¤# up they will be dominant.

Was VHS better than BETA video tapes? No... in fact most experts said that BETA was technically supirior... but VHS got the critical mass...

That's it... and that's all.
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August 07, 2015, 10:07:18 PM
 #196

Interesting in theory, but try DOING that with an actual Bitcoin client. I've yet to see one that will let you spend Bitcoin from unconfirmed transactions, and IME they generally require multiple confirmations before they allow you to then move that Bitcoin on down the line.
I think you've been using old or uncommon clients or wallets apps then.

There's absolutely nothing theoretical about this. Both Mycelium and Breadwallet, the two most popular (and best, imho) wallets on Android and iOS, allow you to spend unconfirmed input immediately. I know some other clients do require a confirmation before letting you spend it, but that's purely an arbitrary limitation within that client, and has nothing to do with Bitcoin itself. Again, there's nothing theoretical about this, I do it all the time. It works fine. I receive coins, and send some of them to another address immediately, without waiting for any confirmations, and without requiring any fancy strange specialized apps or tweaking the settings or whatever.

Forcing you to even wait for multiple confirmations is totally ridiculous. Any app that does that should be ditched immediately. Why the heck would you want to use an app that imposes all sorts of unnecessary restrictions on you.

Quote
Nope, it's experience. I do grant that it's less likely to take that long on Lightcoin.
Again, I think you have been using old or uncommon wallets. If they force you to await multiple confirmations (for no apparent reason even), then yeah sure it might take longer. But that's completely unnecessary.

I did the maths for you, the probability of having to wait an hour for a confirmation is extremely small, having to wait two hours is astronomically small.

Quote
Which is different from a chargeback. On a chargeback, the transaction WAS confirmed, then later the CC issuer was told to reverse it due to some reason - non-delivery of goods or fraud being probably the most common issues leading to a chargeback.
Semantics. You get my point. With credit cards and paypal, there is no such thing as a confirmation. There is a notification of receiving a payment, which is the equivalent of receiving a Bitcoin transaction (nothing confirmed yet). This is a matter of seconds. Then there is a certain period of uncertainty, where you will probably end up receiving the money, but it might also be cancelled or nullified or reversed (no matter what you call it, you end up without the money). You don't know until it's, well, 'set in stone' so to speak. With Bitcoin, this is 10 minutes on average. With paypal and credit card, this is 3-6 months on average.

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August 07, 2015, 10:36:24 PM
 #197

[IMO]Well, Bitcoin is older than Litecoin. And Bitcoin has the higher price, and also more users. So it's mean that Bitcoin is more secure, maybe.[CMIIW] Wink

faucet used to be profitable
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August 08, 2015, 02:21:18 AM
 #198

well i think ... its just bitcoin was the first ever .. and has more popularity and has been talked about more often then any other kind of coin .. if same happened for litecoin m sure it will start rising too
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August 08, 2015, 05:00:50 AM
 #199

I choose bitcoin
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August 08, 2015, 07:46:23 AM
 #200

Well? Let's hear it.
Network power, bitcoin is secure by xxxxxxxxxxx hash power, litecoin is secure by xxx hash power Tongue
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