Nefario GLBSE

[szuetam]

I'm not going to do anything based on your word, I want to see exactly what was said. The original agreement is very important when determining if the agreement was broken, I don't see how that is difficult to understand or why I have to explain it.

Actions Nefario has taken since he admitted to this should be clear enough. He stole my assets. That is black and white.

Anyway Maged has been contacted.

Did you ever agree to what Nefario offered ? You cant just ignore the offer and later say "we had a deal" when it wasnt one.

As I see it, it wasn't an offer, it was an statement, or announce even.
Ther wasn't question mark in the end anyway.

[1714912854]

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[1714912854]

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[server]

[JoelKatz]

This'd seem to run against the shield-not-sword doctrine tho.

I presume he's trying to recover losses, not replace lost profits. If that's not true, then it's a different story.

[BadBear]

@BadBear I will talk to Maged.

But as you have seen Theymos said Nefario made that deal and Nefario said he made that deal.

It seems pretty pointless if Nefario can get away with it by just deleting some forum posts or what not... In the future we will ahve to back up the whole site every time someone who we trust makes and verbal contract...

But anyway it has gone way beyond at this point. He has stolen my assets.

I'm interested to see if you really will give Nefario the scammers tag or not, he has more than made it clear that he made an agreement with me and broke it and then stole from me.

Destroying my GLBSE account with my assets in it is theft.

I can't help you if you don't help me.

[JoelKatz]

Goat never got back to him to agree to those terms.  Goat wants to give Nefario a scammer tag because he was too fucking lazy or ignorant to conclude the deal. There is no evidence that Goat agreed to anything just that Nefario made an offer.

What "terms" are you talking about? There were never any terms for anyone to agree to. This wasn't, "If you do X, I'll do Y." this was "I'm going to do X, so you don't have to worry about Y."

[guruvan]

So "fake"/"fraudulent" GLBSE shares were listed but also still remain listed and traded?
And, the "real" shares in the GLBSE are not actually traded on the GLBSE?

They are no longer listed or tradeable on the exchange.  They can be "traded" off the exchange by using the transfer function (transfer assets from one account to another account).

This is correct.

Nefario however let the "fake" GLBSE trade for months after he said they would be converted to real GLBSE assets.

I now hold "fake" GLBSE stock and do not consent to them being sold to Nefario for .1 BTC      Nefario needs to just leave them alone as I value them more than he does.

This is my huge problem with this whole story.

Goat and nefario do not get along, and act like asshats toward each other. This is irrelevant. What is relevant is what was agreed to by both parties in the past, how the glbse shareholders have responded to the egregious overstepping of authority by nefario, and the offer (and further negotiations) on the table.

IMO, the reason that GLBSE must honor those shares, is they were allowed to trade on the open market for a very very long time. Anyone could have bought them. I almost bought some too. I would have liked to own shares in GLBSE. I am now glad I do not. I wouldn't want to be trying to dump them this week as GLBSE starts to feel the pressure of nefario's bad & arbitrary decisions.

IMO, all of the shareholders of GLBSE should be held accountable for this issue, not just nefario.

[LoupGaroux]

I wonder, why the shareholders of GLBSE Real should be held liable for the actions of a criminal in creating GLBSE Fake? There operating partner, Nefario, identified the fraud as soon as it was known, and made no indication AT THAT TIME that there would be any compensation to the victims of the fraud. It was only later, after any reasonable person had a chance to know the state of the fake asset that Nefario extended the courtesy of compensation to the holders of GLBSE Fake. That he did so without the contractual ability to do so was identified almost immediately by the balance of the shareholders of GLBSE Real, and he was stopped from going forward with this plan. His courtesy offer to the holders of those fraudulent shares became an issue now, only because of the scammish behavior of Goat in trying to sell these worthless assets for a massive profit, knowing full well that they were Fakes, and had nothing backing them up.

[JoelKatz]

I wonder, why the shareholders of GLBSE Real should be held liable for the actions of a criminal in His courtesy offer to the holders of those fraudulent shares became an issue now, only because of the scammish behavior of Goat in trying to sell these worthless assets for a massive profit, knowing full well that they were Fakes, and had nothing backing them up.

You are saying the assets were worthless even after Nefario stated he would redeem them? Why? Should Goat have known not to trust Nefario?

[Bitcoin Oz]

I wonder, why the shareholders of GLBSE Real should be held liable for the actions of a criminal in creating GLBSE Fake? There operating partner, Nefario, identified the fraud as soon as it was known, and made no indication AT THAT TIME that there would be any compensation to the victims of the fraud. It was only later, after any reasonable person had a chance to know the state of the fake asset that Nefario extended the courtesy of compensation to the holders of GLBSE Fake. That he did so without the contractual ability to do so was identified almost immediately by the balance of the shareholders of GLBSE Real, and he was stopped from going forward with this plan. His courtesy offer to the holders of those fraudulent shares became an issue now, only because of the scammish behavior of Goat in trying to sell these worthless assets for a massive profit, knowing full well that they were Fakes, and had nothing backing them up.

I think it was because Goat bought some then started whinging about it that Nefario made the offer.

[JoelKatz]

I think it was because Goat bought some then started whinging about it that Nefario made the offer.

If so, that means Nefario intended Goat to rely on the offer.

[Bitcoin Oz]

I think it was because Goat bought some then started whinging about it that Nefario made the offer.

If so, that means Nefario intended Goat to rely on the offer.

But he never replied to the offer !

[Bitcoin Oz]

I think it was because Goat bought some then started whinging about it that Nefario made the offer.

If so, that means Nefario intended Goat to rely on the offer.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consideration_in_English_law

[Bitcoin Oz]

So "fake"/"fraudulent" GLBSE shares were listed but also still remain listed and traded?
And, the "real" shares in the GLBSE are not actually traded on the GLBSE?

They are no longer listed or tradeable on the exchange.  They can be "traded" off the exchange by using the transfer function (transfer assets from one account to another account).

This is correct.

Nefario however let the "fake" GLBSE trade for months after he said they would be converted to real GLBSE assets.

I now hold "fake" GLBSE stock and do not consent to them being sold to Nefario for .1 BTC      Nefario needs to just leave them alone as I value them more than he does.

This is my huge problem with this whole story.

Goat and nefario do not get along, and act like asshats toward each other. This is irrelevant. What is relevant is what was agreed to by both parties in the past, how the glbse shareholders have responded to the egregious overstepping of authority by nefario, and the offer (and further negotiations) on the table.

IMO, the reason that GLBSE must honor those shares, is they were allowed to trade on the open market for a very very long time. Anyone could have bought them. I almost bought some too. I would have liked to own shares in GLBSE. I am now glad I do not. I wouldn't want to be trying to dump them this week as GLBSE starts to feel the pressure of nefario's bad & arbitrary decisions.

IMO, all of the shareholders of GLBSE should be held accountable for this issue, not just nefario.

Yes, but 300 shares out of how many
 

[Bitcoin Oz]

I wonder, why the shareholders of GLBSE Real should be held liable for the actions of a criminal in His courtesy offer to the holders of those fraudulent shares became an issue now, only because of the scammish behavior of Goat in trying to sell these worthless assets for a massive profit, knowing full well that they were Fakes, and had nothing backing them up.

You are saying the assets were worthless even after Nefario stated he would redeem them? Why? Should Goat have known not to trust Nefario?

300 shares is going to be pretty worthless in the scheme of things. Goat is going to wish he took the generous offer he got presented.

[JoelKatz]

But he never replied to the offer !

He didn't have to. The offer didn't ask for people to reply to it. It was a statement that an action would be performed in the future conditional on others performing actions in the future. It's like, "If you bring us 100 pounds of corn, we'll give you $100 off on a car". You don't have to accept the offer, you just have to bring 100 pounds of corn to the place. Goat did what the offer required him to do -- he acquired shares of GLBSE. Nefario then reneged on his offer after Goat completed his part.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consideration_in_English_law

There doesn't need to be consideration in this case because there is detrimental reliance sufficient to establish promissory estoppel (see my other post). But there was consideration -- Goat acquired shares on GLBSE, transactions for which GLBSE receives a commission.

[DeathAndTaxes]

This'd seem to run against the shield-not-sword doctrine tho.

I presume he's trying to recover losses, not replace lost profits. If that's not true, then it's a different story.

What losses?

He has profited.

[teflone]

After witnessing the BS that is Goat for nearly 2 years, one thing is clear to me..  crystal clear..


Goat should not, and cannot be in charge of any asset, amount of bitcoin or anything remotely important, and to do business with him is identical to shooting yourself in the foot, and expecting a free ride to the hospital paid for by the people he cheats, and the money he loses of others

[teflone]

After witnessing the BS that is Goat, one thing is clear to me..  crystal clear..


Goat should not, and cannot be in charge of any asset, amount of bitcoin or anything remotely important, and to do business with him is identical to shooting yourself in the foot, and expecting a free ride to the hospital paid for by the people he cheats, and the money he loses of others

Yeah, I'm 100% scammer. Go post your evidence in the Goat is a scammer thread if you have anything other than slander.

Thanks.

Nahhh.. thanks..

I have better things to do then to fight the world..   Clearly you have it under control.. 

So..  did you sue Pirate yet ?

[DeathAndTaxes]

After witnessing the BS that is Goat, one thing is clear to me..  crystal clear..


Goat should not, and cannot be in charge of any asset, amount of bitcoin or anything remotely important, and to do business with him is identical to shooting yourself in the foot, and expecting a free ride to the hospital paid for by the people he cheats, and the money he loses of others

Yeah, I'm 100% scammer. Go post your evidence in the Goat is a scammer thread if you have anything other than slander.

Thanks.

I don't think he called you a scammer.  You are a liability (but then again so is Nefario).  You let tantrums, and games get in the way of profits and business.  You have no common sense, no ability to reach equitable solutions in a dispute, and no real ethics.  Anyone doing business with you WILL LOSE eventually.  That doesn't make you a scammer, it just makes you a liability to be avoided at all cost.

[teflone]

After witnessing the BS that is Goat, one thing is clear to me..  crystal clear..


Goat should not, and cannot be in charge of any asset, amount of bitcoin or anything remotely important, and to do business with him is identical to shooting yourself in the foot, and expecting a free ride to the hospital paid for by the people he cheats, and the money he loses of others

Yeah, I'm 100% scammer. Go post your evidence in the Goat is a scammer thread if you have anything other than slander.

Thanks.

I don't think he called you a scammer.  You are a liability (but then again so is Nefario).  You let tantrums, and games get in the way of profits and business.  You have no common sense, no ability to reach equitable solutions in a dispute, and no real ethics.  Anyone doing business with you WILL LOSE eventually.  That doesn't make you a scammer, it just makes you a liability to be avoided at all cost.

Exactly..

Thank you for putting it a little more eloquently, those are my thoughts precisely