Usagi: falsifying NAVs, manipulating share prices and misleading investors.

[BCB]

Usagi

You are not the victim here.  You have total control over this situation. I Aslo believe that you are enjoying all this attention.

You want this to go away. Prove us wrong.

1. You stated as fact ro your incestors that you had complete details of of your companies assets. Pleas produce them now to prove us wrong. If you cannot you Are a scammer for making false statements to your investors which they may have relied on to invest with you.

2. Please state what country you reside in.

3. Are you or are you not a scammer?

Three simple requests that do not require paragraphs upon paragraphs of sperging to respond to.

If anyone bieves I am being too harsh on usagi please post here or pm me evidence of you support of his business activities and if valid I will post in locked thread.

[usagi]

Usagi

BCB

You are not the victim here.  You have total control over this situation. I Aslo believe that you are enjoying all this attention.

You want this to go away. Prove us wrong.

Cut the crap. I'm not the victim.. but I want this to go away? Yes, I want your ridiculous campaign to tag me as a scammer to go away. because that is what it is; you've given up all pretense of allowing me a fair chance to make a response and/or repair any damage by making a payment to my shareholders.  You've made a decision that I am a scammer despite the fact the only response I've given to you so far has led to you admitting your accusation was without merit. Now you're pushing for a scammer tag before I have had a chance to respond to any of the other claims.

When you decide you are willing to either deal with the evidence you have provided in a simple, step by step fashion
OR
that you agree to arbitrate a settlement which will be paid to shareholders,

THEN

I will deal with you in this matter.

Until then, you don't seem interested in helping repair what damages you feel I have caused to shareholders, rather, you just seem intent on doing me in. So I am going to send a letter to each one of my shareholders now offering a settlement. I don't think you're doing a good job as an arbiter by refusing me the opportunity to make a proper response. I don't know who you think you are anyways -- If I have a settlement with my shareholders, THEN this will end. Not when you say so. I only agreed to let you collect all the evidence in one place so I could make a final response to it.

If anyone bieves I am being too harsh on usagi please post here or pm me evidence of you support of his business activities and if valid I will post in locked thread.

This is crap. You've had several people speak up on my behalf now including stochastic and augustocroppo. Even vampire, deprived and repentence seem interested in pursuing a cash settlement to some degree.

How about this; if anyone believes BCB is being fair and is capable of resolving this, speak up now. I mean wtf, who wouldn't jump at the chance to negotiate a cash settlement? It's clear BCB is not looking out for shareholder interests here. The companies are closing down; this would only help shareholders.

Who is BCB working for, if not the shareholders I've supposedly ripped-off?

[BCB]

Usagi

You are not the victim here.  You have total control over this situation. I Aslo believe that you are enjoying all this attention.

You want this to go away. Prove us wrong.

1. You stated as fact ro your incestors that you had complete details of of your companies assets. Pleas produce them now to prove us wrong. If you cannot you Are a scammer for making false statements to your investors which they may have relied on to invest with you.

2. Please state what country you reside in.

3. Are you or are you not a scammer?

Three simple requests that do not require paragraphs upon paragraphs of sperging to respond to.

If anyone bieves I am being too harsh on usagi please post here or pm me evidence of you support of his business activities and if valid I will post in locked thread.

usgai.  Answer the simple questions.

[usagi]

Usagi

You are not the victim here.  You have total control over this situation. I Aslo believe that you are enjoying all this attention.

You want this to go away. Prove us wrong.

1. You stated as fact ro your incestors that you had complete details of of your companies assets. Pleas produce them now to prove us wrong. If you cannot you Are a scammer for making false statements to your investors which they may have relied on to invest with you.

2. Please state what country you reside in.

3. Are you or are you not a scammer?

Three simple requests that do not require paragraphs upon paragraphs of sperging to respond to.

If anyone bieves I am being too harsh on usagi please post here or pm me evidence of you support of his business activities and if valid I will post in locked thread.

usgai.  Answer the simple questions.

Are you going to give me a chance to answer them, or are you going to request that Theymos give me a scammer tag? Stop being a hypocrite.

Are you going to be able to negotiate a cash settlement for shareholders, or do I need to cut you out of the picture and do it myself? Remove your bias and do your job as an arbiter.

Answer the simple questions.

[BCB]

Usagi

You are not the victim here.  You have total control over this situation. I Aslo believe that you are enjoying all this attention.

You want this to go away. Prove us wrong.

1. You stated as fact ro your incestors that you had complete details of of your companies assets. Pleas produce them now to prove us wrong. If you cannot you Are a scammer for making false statements to your investors which they may have relied on to invest with you.

2. Please state what country you reside in.

3. Are you or are you not a scammer?

Three simple requests that do not require paragraphs upon paragraphs of sperging to respond to.

If anyone bieves I am being too harsh on usagi please post here or pm me evidence of you support of his business activities and if valid I will post in locked thread.

So you cannot answer these simple questions?

[usagi]

Usagi

You are not the victim here.  You have total control over this situation. I Aslo believe that you are enjoying all this attention.

You want this to go away. Prove us wrong.

1. You stated as fact ro your incestors that you had complete details of of your companies assets. Pleas produce them now to prove us wrong. If you cannot you Are a scammer for making false statements to your investors which they may have relied on to invest with you.

2. Please state what country you reside in.

3. Are you or are you not a scammer?

Three simple requests that do not require paragraphs upon paragraphs of sperging to respond to.

If anyone bieves I am being too harsh on usagi please post here or pm me evidence of you support of his business activities and if valid I will post in locked thread.

So you cannot answer these simple questions?

So you cannot work for the shareholders and arbitrate a settlement? In that case you are not worth responding to and I will deal with the shareholders myself. It's really your choice. Either you are an arbiter, or you are just another person accusing me. You have no special status or right here.

1. GLBSE fall down go boom. I do not have access to my CSV file. This does not mean I am a scammer.

2. I live in China. And for what it matters, I am the princess of the moon.

3. No I am not a scammer. I want to try and resolve this quickly now. If you are willing to work for the shareholders, why not consider a settlement? It's something I don't have to do. Think about it -- if it's clear I won't work in the community again, what's the problem with helping me do the right thing and giving money to shareholders? Either you agree that I can resolve this in principle, or you just fired yourself as arbiter.

Choose your next words to me carefully, I refuse to participate with you if you're going to give me the runaround: Are you going to help me settle this or not? I want to propose a settlement, and this is literally the fifth time I am asking for a response from you on that.

[BCB]

I have no relationship or responsibility to you or your shareholders. It is up the them to divest themselves of their shares or to pursue you by appropriate channels.

We are here to show that you broke contracts. Made promises that you did not keep. And regularly miscalculated the value of you assets.

As is you M.O.  You keep changing the topic and obsfucateing the discussion.

So as you can not Answer simple questions and produce factual documentation and have admitted to deleting material information to hide your fraud and deception I will continue to call you a scammer.

The choice is yours.

[usagi]

I have no relationship or responsibility to you or your shareholders. It is up the them to divest themselves of their shares or to pursue you by appropriate channels.

We are here to show that you broke contracts. Made promises that you did not keep. And regularly miscalculated the value of you assets.

As is you M.O.  You keep changing the topic and obsfucateing the discussion.

So as you can not Answer simple questions and produce factual documentation and have admitted to deleting material information to hide your fraud and deception I will continue to call you a scammer.

The choice is yours.

Since you stated only interested in pursuing a scammer tag and you are not interested in a resolution (for example a settlement) it's become clear that you are not actually interested in a response which would show I am innocent. Which is why you requested a scammer tag in full knowledge I was responding to your claims, and that all of the responses I have made have resulted in you admitting I was innocent.

There is really no point in discussing anything with you, but as you have agreed to be a central clearing house for complaints against me, you have provided a simple place for me to made responses. Once I deal with all of your accusations (or settle directly with shareholders) then this will finally be over.

[MPOE-PR]

Just doing my part to help this thread become longer than the ones about pirate. It'd be only fitting.

[usagi]

Just doing my part to help this thread become longer than the ones about pirate. It'd be only fitting.

Yes -- At most, even if I roll over and play dead the damages aren't worth more than a few hundred BTC here AND I am willing to settle just to avoid the time it takes to answer.

And pirate likely fled the country with five million US dollars and a suitcase full of cocaine.

The similarities are blinding.

[kjj]

How about this; if anyone believes BCB is being fair and is capable of resolving this, speak up now. I mean wtf, who wouldn't jump at the chance to negotiate a cash settlement? It's clear BCB is not looking out for shareholder interests here. The companies are closing down; this would only help shareholders.

Considering how muddled this is, and your attitude, I suspect that BCB is about as fair as you are going to get.  And I really doubt that he, or anyone else, is capably of resolving this, but that is because resolution seems impossible unless you change yourself.

You seem slimy, and you get worse with nearly every post.  My opinion, which matters not at all, remains that you started out with honest intentions, and then made some mistakes, but then clung stubbornly to them.  I'm thankful that I'm not the one that has to decide if that rises to the level of "scamming".

Scammer tag or not, your reputation has taken a terrible hit from this incident.  If you are interested in salvaging something, resolve to change your ways.  Practice some humility, listen to what people have to say, develop some respect for what the rest of the world considers to be appropriate handling of fiduciary duty, make a big show of winding down your closing ventures correctly and publicly.

[usagi]

How about this; if anyone believes BCB is being fair and is capable of resolving this, speak up now. I mean wtf, who wouldn't jump at the chance to negotiate a cash settlement? It's clear BCB is not looking out for shareholder interests here. The companies are closing down; this would only help shareholders.

Considering how muddled this is, and your attitude, I suspect that BCB is about as fair as you are going to get.  And I really doubt that he, or anyone else, is capably of resolving this, but that is because resolution seems impossible unless you change yourself.

You seem slimy, and you get worse with nearly every post.  My opinion, which matters not at all, remains that you started out with honest intentions, and then made some mistakes, but then clung stubbornly to them.  I'm thankful that I'm not the one that has to decide if that rises to the level of "scamming".

Scammer tag or not, your reputation has taken a terrible hit from this incident.  If you are interested in salvaging something, resolve to change your ways.  Practice some humility, listen to what people have to say, develop some respect for what the rest of the world considers to be appropriate handling of fiduciary duty, make a big show of winding down your closing ventures correctly and publicly.

My attitude: I have a right to be angry because for months I have had to put up with insults and derogatory comments from people like vampire, whose allegations have now been proven false. You think about that for a moment before you criticize me for my attitude.

The amount of crap I have had to put up with is unbelievable. I'm sorry if you feel I am slimy. I am mad, tired, sick and broken. What this amounts to is that if I cannot work with BCB to arrive at a settlement then I will pursue a settlement on my own. As for your other comments, thank you. I am in fact winding down my companies in as open and fair a way as I can. I have this: NYAN/BMF/CPA final claims process which is currently the most open and informative closing down post ever. In comparison, MERGEDMINING for example, announced an arbitrary date (the 19th of december) that shareholders had to make a manual settlement. He ignored the GLBSE claims process. What do you think, am I doing a better job closing down my asset? That is what is really important here. And if damages are ever to be settled now is the time while I am closing down and making final payments.

Now is the time I need to make a reparation to shareholders if ever. Doesn't that make sense?

[BCB]

1. GLBSE fall down go boom. I do not have access to my CSV file. This does not mean I am a scammer.

**MANY MANY links in your threads point to YOUR personal wordpress website that you admitted to deleting not to GLBSE.  Please produce these documents.  If you do not you are a scammer.  Not once where you asked to produce GLBSE documents.  Again you try to CHANGE the question.

2. I live in China. And for what it matters, I am the princess of the moon.
**Then why did you try to imply you lived in Japan in response to Vampire's   timestamped documents to show you altered financial statments?  You continue to prove you are a lier.

3. No I am not a scammer. I want to try and resolve this quickly now. If you are willing to work for the shareholders, why not consider a settlement? It's something I don't have to do. Think about it -- if it's clear I won't work in the community again, what's the problem with helping me do the right thing and giving money to shareholders? Either you agree that I can resolve this in principle, or you just fired yourself as arbiter.


This is not about money.  This is a SCAMMER thread it is a manufactured conceit of the bitcointalk community to identify bitcointalk user who break promises and contracts and carry out other fradulent act against other community members.   All of the evidence presented has show that you:

Broke Promices
Ignored your contractes
Manipulated Asset Values
Continue to lie
can not answer simple questions
chose to obfuscate by sperging with every post you make.

Choose your next words to me carefully, I refuse to participate with you if you're going to give me the runaround: Are you going to help me settle this or not? I want to propose a settlement, and this is literally the fifth time I am asking for a response from you on that.

I am not here to settle the mess you made. I am here to call you a scammer.  I never once asked you for a settlement.  I don't care if you settle.  If your share holders would like you to settle that it between you and them.

I have asked you simple question.

Explain why you deleted over 1000 posts and the entire contents of your website containing material evidence if the evidence could serve to prove you are not a scammer.

Produce these deleted documents that server to prove you are not a scammer.

YOU CANNOT BECAUSE YOU ARE A SCAMMER.   AND THE ACCUSATIONS ARE TRUE.  I DEFY YOU AND AUGUSTOCROPPO TO PRESENT ANY FACT THAT WOULD HELP YOU PROVE YOU ARE NOT A SCAMMER.

When you showed that the timestamps in Vampires posts were not accurate I took those off the table.  Then in reading your deleted post I uncover more evidence that you continued to creatively value your assets to benefit you and your business and not your shareholders.

You stated in one of you deleted post in my locked thread and I quote "I have exact records for every trade done in NYAN, BMF, and CPA. I can provide and explain these records upon demand, as anyone else who did the trades would be expected to do."

Please produce this evidence if you want to defend you good name.  If you can not then you are a liar and deceived and misled your shareholders.  And if you relied solely  on the records of GLBSE to value your assets then that just provides additional proof of you incompetence and you inability to manage financial assets.
 

[augustocroppo]

I deify you present evidence that usagi is not guilty to the many actions that MANY users have accused him up.

If you or anyone else can present compelling evidence that he is not a scammer I will admit my mistake and delete this tread.

Reductio ad absurdum

You are doing a demand over the belief that Usagi was already sentenced for the supposedly crimes he committed. That is not true. You are not an arbiter because you have already confessed personal bias and willful ignorance in this case. Therefore, Usagi remains only suspicious of the accusations you made against him.

Moreover, you are not aware of the principle of in dubio pro reo (presumption of innocence). That is why this case have lasted so long. Until you present an concise summary of irrefutable evidence to prove that Usagi is guilty of attempt of fraud, you have no recourse to qualify him guilty of a supposedly crime.

And I welcome any other bitcointalk users to come to his defense.  Currently augustocroppo is the only one.

Augustocroppo, I do not care whether or not usagi gets a scammer tag.   My reputation, for what it's worth, it not at stake.  I am merely a community member how has been around long enough to know a scammer when he sees one and and glad to help call them out.

Your reputation had lost a great deal of value by now.

Just read any of my other scammer threads.

until then I will continue to call usagi a scammer regardless of whether or not he gets a tag.

That is up to you. If you like to take part in defamation campaigns, no one will stop you.

[Deprived]

My attitude: I have a right to be angry because for months I have had to put up with insults and derogatory comments from people like vampire, whose allegations have now been proven false. You think about that for a moment before you criticize me for my attitude.

You need to understand that your attitude has a LOT to with where you are.  It certainly has a LOT to do with how doggedly I've pursued the issue.

Would suggest you go back to the CPA thread and find your response to the very first post I ever made about you.  Back then I was looking into a load of companies as I'd retuend to being active after not posting here much (if at all) for the best part of year.  I posted in your thread asking about the BMF contract and why it hadn't been paid out on.  At that point I was a potential investor - with no prior interaction with you - and no preconceived ideas about you.

Your response - and the attitude you had - convinced me there was something very dubious going on.  As no way would someone accused of something who was innocent just call the accuser (and it wasn't actually an accusation - just a question of why it hadn't been paid out on)  a noob and tell them to get lost.  They'd explain WHY it hadn't been paid out on - so noone else reading the thread was left with questions over it.

Noone had raised that issue back then - so it's not like I was repeating something you'd answered loads of times before: it had never been mentioned in any thread.

So maybe next time you call someone a noob and tell them to get lost you may want to reflect on just how well that tactic worked on me.  Some people WILL go away if you just insult them and tell them they're wrong (without explaining why).  Others won't - and if you try it on them you're making a huge problem for yourself.  If you can't explain why you're right (and they're wrong) then consider that maybe you're the one who's wrong.  If you CAN explain why you're right (and they're wrong) then do so rather than insulting.  Of course if you KNOW you're wrong then maybe the only option you have IS to insult - which was my immediate thought when you insulted me rather than showed how I was wrong (I WAS wrong on one specific detail - which you pointed out, but zero explanation of why there was no claim).

So yeah - the time I've spent working out what you've done wrong wasn't because I'm a sock-puppet.  It wasn't because someone paid me to do it.  It wasn't because I was trying to manipulate your share prices.  It WAS because your attitude stank - and made no sense unless there was something you were trying to cover up.  And that attitude was BEFORE (as far as I'm aware) there were any allegations against you at all.  So, as far as my participation is concerned at least, your attitude has a hell of a lot to do with where we are now.

[BCB]

augusto,

This is not a court of law.

I am not a judge.

I am not a jury.

I'm just another guy on the internet with a very strong opinion.  

Just like assholes.  We all have one!

You can quote all the latin you like.  

You too are entitled to your opinion

We have again and again asked usagai simple questions and he can not answer.

He spurges.

He answers questions he was not asked.

Many Many community members have accused him of many many thing.

You are the only one who has come to his defense.  And to me it seems you are more interested in attacking me then defending usagi.

I respect your opinion and you too are entitled to it.   But I don't agree with it.

Please I BEG you prove usgai is not a scammer and make this all go away.

Until then I continue to hold that Usgai is a scammer.

[BCB]

My attitude

your attitude

And not shockingly, Usagi is now spreading FUD about Bakewell, as things do not appear to be going his way. Acting like a child and taking constant underhanded swipes at your clients and former clients is not the way to try to drum up support for your business.

The single largest contributing factor to losing my business was Usagi's responses to others in the forums lately.

Ian

usagi's attitude and his aggressive business practices again other bitcoin business he may perceive as competitors is not scamming.

If you have facts that show he broke promises to he users or did not honor his contracts please post it here.

Thank you.

[augustocroppo]

Please I BEG you prove usgai is not a scammer and make this all go away.

You beg me? What pity histrionic user you are...

I have no obligation to honor your demands, BCB.

If this situations is a "nightmare" for you, and you want 'this all go away', just leave. You are not being forced to accuse Usagi. It was your choice to indict Usagi, therefore is up to you to prove your claims are true. So far, Usagi have provided enough evidence which proves he did not defrauded any potential investor. Now is up to you assess the evidence and formulate a conclusion which proves the contrary.

[BCB]

Please I BEG you prove usgai is not a scammer and make this all go away.

You beg me? What pity histrionic user you are...

I have no obligation to honor your demands, BCB.

If this situations is a "nightmare" for you, and you want 'this all go away', just leave. You are not being forced to accuse Usagi. It was your choice to indict Usagi, therefore is up to you to prove your claims are true. So far, Usagi have provided enough evidence which proves he did not defrauded any potential investor. Now is up to you assess the evidence and formulate a conclusion which proves the contrary.

Ok.  That's your opinion.  I respect that.

I will continue my campaign until someone can show me that I am wrong.

Thank you.

[usagi]

You need to understand that your attitude has a LOT to with where you are.  It certainly has a LOT to do with how doggedly I've pursued the issue.

I can admit that. Maybe I'll try to make a change now.

So yeah - the time I've spent working out what you've done wrong wasn't because I'm a sock-puppet.  It wasn't because someone paid me to do it.  It wasn't because I was trying to manipulate your share prices.  It WAS because your attitude stank - and made no sense unless there was something you were trying to cover up.  And that attitude was BEFORE (as far as I'm aware) there were any allegations against you at all.  So, as far as my participation is concerned at least, your attitude has a hell of a lot to do with where we are now.

Okay so my attitude sucks. Maybe I am even an idiot or some kind of loser. But a scammer?

Hmm.

If you are admitting you are pursuing a scammer tag against me because of my attitude, and ex.

Your response - and the attitude you had - convinced me there was something very dubious going on.
...
So maybe next time you call someone a noob and tell them to get lost you may want to reflect on just how well that tactic worked on me.

...then you are admitting you have no evidence. Look, I'm sorry I called you a noob. But that does not make me a scammer. Right now I'm a little unsure of how I should proceed with this. BCB screwed this up very badly; I've asked some people I respect for some advice. I'll get back to you. Till then, what do you think of the settlement idea that has been discussed?

As for BCB.....

First, to augustocroppo, thank you. On many levels.

I'm just another guy on the internet with a very strong opinion.  

Just like assholes.  We all have one!

You can quote all the latin you like.  

You too are entitled to your opinion

No, the latin he is quoting is not technically an opinion. You are showing a lack of education. This is something I know because I went to a very good school when I was growing up in rural Canada. The latin is referring to the principles of debate. For example, the sort of stuff you might find on http://www.johntreed.com/debate.html or http://www.hebrew4christians.com/Clear_Thinking/Informal_Fallacies/Tricks/tricks.html -- not an opinion.

This is the same principle of the founding of the U.S.A. as "...a nation of laws, not men."

It is not an opinion, for example, that when you accuse me of "sperging", that you are using emotional language, which is a dishonest debate tactic.

Emotional Language
(1) The use of emotionally toned words (pp 10-25)
Approach: Translate the statement into words emotionally neutral
[urlhttp://www.johntreed.com/debate.html]http://www.johntreed.com/debate.html[/url]

I am saying this to mean, I'm constantly suprised by people. I must not get out much. Augustocroppo is suprising me greatly as are you, constantly. I feel I owe him something for educating me on critical thinking, not just for showing me there's still decent human beings out there. See, I am old -- into middle age by now for sure -- and although I know a great deal it comes at the cost of forgetting some things temporarily. One of the things I have forgotten recently is how important debate skills are and how important critical thinking is.

You see, there is ad hominem, which is what you do when you say I am delusional, and then there is pointing out that you are being dishonest in your tactics. I have so far been unwilling to do this because I've been trying to be kind. But after months, and seeing how effective augutocroppo was in getting you to admit the charge of misrepresenting how I value assets was, I'm beginning to realize; K. and D. are right. I need to change my attitude.

Can't say I didn't learn something new. That is important in our lives, I believe, to be able to learn new things without restraint.


We have again and again asked usagai simple questions and he can not answer.

He spurges.
[/quote]

See? There, is some ad hominem (another one of those latin terms!) and some emotional language. "The reason that many Latin phrases are used in the analysis of argument is because most of the work of determining how best to analyze arguments was done by medieval philosophers who wrote in Latin. The idea that the medieval period was some kind of "dark age" where nothing of intellectual value happened is just plain false. Latin phrases are not magical incantations, nor are they themselves influential in a debate. You could describe what is wrong with someone's argument in English, or you could use the Latin phrase as a kind of abbreviation. These latin phrases that still take part in our language are just used for brevity, e.g. it's easier to type 'e.g.', which stands for "exemplia gratia" and translates to "for a good example" than it is to type "for a good example". - http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090831212831AAw6X2N

I think what you are really trying to say is I provide a lot of information. Well I'm sorry if you have trouble reading it, but I am a native speaker from the country; we talk a lot and we like to express ourselves. I'm also a 20-year usenet veteran. Honestly, if you don't like it, may I suggest taking some English classes? I am not criticizing your English, I am suggesting you need to learn how native people express themselves. You know, get used to it a bit. Accusing me of sperging when it's obvious you are having issues with basic spelling and grammar, and therefore are likely not a native speaker, is a little weird. What, you want a TL; DR? Okay here it is: You have obvious problems with comprehension because your English really is that bad. I've been putting up with it for quite some time but it's actually become annoying how you jump to conclusions and demand every little detail and then turn around and show a shocking lack of respect for intellectually honest debate.

Yes, it really is that bad.

He answers questions he was not asked.

Many Many community members have accused him of many many thing.

You are the only one who has come to his defense.  And to me it seems you are more interested in attacking me then defending usagi.

You are lying. Stochastic came to my defense. As did many others which you must surely have seen. The problem is, that it's a one in five phenomenon. The trolls are interested in outshouting EVERYONE. So when the odd person speaks up -- like Luceo for example, it gets buried.

I respect your opinion and you too are entitled to it.   But I don't agree with it.

Please I BEG you prove usgai is not a scammer and make this all go away.

Until then I continue to hold that Usgai is a scammer.

Do what you want. I no longer consider you credible. That makes me sad. But, please, continue to update your locked thread. I promise I will get through it all -- at least until it becomes morbidly ridiculous to answer. I guess we will see what happens.